Podcast Summary: "Chuck Klosterman Isn't Even Here Right Now"

Pablo Torre Finds Out — The Athletic
Host: Pablo Torre
Guest: Chuck Klosterman
Date: January 22, 2026

Episode Overview

In this episode, Pablo Torre sits down with renowned author and cultural critic Chuck Klosterman to explore the enduring influence, paradoxes, and future of American football. Drawing on themes from Klosterman's latest book, their conversation weaves nostalgia for the golden age of magazines, the intricacies of sports podcasting, anxieties about cultural change, and a philosophical inquiry into what football reveals about American society. The discussion is both reflective and sharp, with both Torre and Klosterman interrogating their own biases, the audience’s tastes, and how the past shapes their perspectives on writing, fandom, and cultural meaning.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Sports Podcasting, Identity & Nostalgia in Media

• Podcasting vs. Writing:
  • Klosterman comments on how appearances on popular podcasts (notably Bill Simmons’s) have often overshadowed the impact of his books in how fans relate to him (03:21).
  • "The response I get from going on his podcast is about the same as releasing a book... I do sometimes wonder if I'm remembered... the way certain Carson guests are remembered." – Chuck Klosterman (03:21)
• Evolving Media Landscape:
  • Both reflect on the "golden era" of New York magazine culture, lamenting the loss of editorial discretion and the rise of metrics-driven content (07:29–09:41).
  • "What I'm nostalgic for is the separation that I had from the pressures of metrics and audience." – Pablo Torre (09:41)
• Editing & Artistic Control:
  • Klosterman discusses his evolution as a writer, from being combative with editors as a young journalist to valuing collaboration more with experience (12:12–12:58).

2. Football, Nostalgia, and Change

• Writing as a Time Capsule:
  • Klosterman talks about how books freeze the author's self in time—readers of old work know a past self better than the author now (13:03–14:25).
  • "When you write that book, you are frozen in time. And for the person who only reads that book, they're reading about who I was when I was 28." – Chuck Klosterman (13:03)
• Football as an Evolving Institution:
  • The pair recall a 2010 panel with Malcolm Gladwell predicting the decline of football due to violence and health concerns—a decline that never came to pass (22:37–25:21).
  • "Fast forward 15 years and the decline of football as we stand today could not have been more inaccurately prophesied." – Pablo Torre (25:00)
• The CTE Conversation:
  • Klosterman observes the public’s diminishing focus on concussion crises despite little evidence that the game’s inherent danger has changed (25:21–26:32).

3. Why Football ‘Works’ on Television & in Culture

• Football’s Televised Dominance:
  • The structure of football—brief bursts of action separated by downtime—makes it perfectly suited for modern televised consumption and multitasking (27:32–30:15).
  • "What we consciously say we want from entertainment and what we unconsciously want, I believe, are very different things... football works so well on television, better than any other product..." – Chuck Klosterman (28:30)
• Violence and Meaning:
  • The knowledge that catastrophic injury is possible (though not desired) imbues football with higher stakes and meaning (30:15–31:43).
  • Memorable moment: the episode’s title echoes Klosterman's line, "I'm not even here right now," as he describes living perpetually in the past and future (15:05–16:10).

4. The Future and Possible Collapse of Football

• Economic Drivers:
  • Both agree that any decline in football’s dominance will likely be economically, not culturally, driven—media rights, advertising, and the unsustainable need for perpetual profit growth (35:01–39:44).
  • "If football recedes from the culture or kind of becomes this niche thing... it's going to be for economic reasons, because that's really what creates social change." – Chuck Klosterman (35:01)
• Fracking the Sports Economy:
  • Torre warns the relentless extraction of money from sports (via gambling, private equity, etc.) may undermine the fundamental reasons fans care about the games (39:44–41:08).
  • "It feels like we're entering a post-winning phase of sports." – Pablo Torre (43:23)

5. Post-Maximum Competition and Authenticity in Sports

• Motivation & Meaning:
  • They discuss how load management, gambling, and professionalization have diluted the purity of competition—NBA's in-season tournament is cited as an example of incentivized intensity (44:15–46:49).
  • "Isn't it kind of strange? Shouldn't the reality that which they live in be enough motivation to play hard all the time?" – Chuck Klosterman (45:10)
• Football’s Unique Stakes:
  • The inherent risk of injury means coasting is impossible in football, which may preserve higher effort and intensity compared to other sports (46:27–46:49).

6. Football as America’s Paradoxical Mirror

• The "What We Want" Paragraph & Cultural Values:
  • Torre reads an arresting passage from Klosterman’s book cataloguing football’s contradictions: it embodies values supposedly out of step with modern enlightened society, yet remains beloved (48:38–49:54).
  • "Nothing about the culture of football is what we want... and it's a beautifully written paragraph, but when I read it now I'm like, I think we want all that stuff more than we realize." – Pablo Torre (49:54)
• Tolerance and Projection:
  • Klosterman notes that what we say we want and what we’re drawn to unconsciously can be quite different—perhaps football persists precisely because it is the outlet for otherwise disapproved impulses (50:55–54:04).
  • "If it becomes the one place where those ideas cannot just exist but flourish and be an acceptable thing to care about... that's why football is what it is." – Chuck Klosterman (52:49)

7. Football, Politics, and American Community

• Football as Social Language:
  • Being conversant in football is akin to a “passport”—it’s a necessary language for participation in American life (53:26–54:20).
  • "It's our language... a passport to talk to the largest number of people available in our country." – Pablo Torre (53:26)
• Unthinkable to Disavow Football:
  • Klosterman asserts that openly disliking football is the most dangerous political position one could have in America (54:31–54:48).

8. Melancholy, Agreement, and the Call to Protect Football

• Two Perspectives, Shared Concern:
  • The conversation closes with both men recognizing their differences—Torre looks outward to systemic threats, Klosterman inward to personal meanings—yet both agree football must be protected despite (or because of) its paradoxes (55:37–56:40).
  • "These two diametrically opposed ways of looking at it and still come to the same conclusion—which is that somehow this thing with all these problems must be protected. Like, we must protect this thing." – Chuck Klosterman (56:40)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Podcast Fame vs. Book Fame:
  "The response I get from going on [Bill Simmons's] podcast is about the same as releasing a book. And I'm not exaggerating..."
  —Chuck Klosterman (03:21)

• On Nostalgia for Magazine Media Culture:
  "What I'm nostalgic for is the separation that I had from the pressures of metrics and audience..."
  —Pablo Torre (09:41)

• On Writing as a Frozen Self:
  "When you write that book, you are frozen in time ... They're reading about who I was when I was 28. And they understand me better than I do at that age."
  —Chuck Klosterman (13:03)

• On Football’s Cultural Contradictions:
  "Nothing about the culture of football is what we want or what we are told to want, or what we are supposed to want..."
  —Pablo Torre (reading Klosterman, 48:38–49:54)

• On Unconscious Desires and Football’s Appeal:
  "There's the conscious desire and then there's the unconscious desire, and that's the one that matters... Everything that is sort of central to its aesthetics and ethos is so against what you're supposed to feel or want."
  —Chuck Klosterman (50:55)

• On the Enduring Power of Football as Community:
  "I think people in a way cannot escape football. In a way they can escape religion. Now it's become very difficult to escape politics ... football and politics are these things and that has its own kind of meaning."
  —Chuck Klosterman (54:04)

Important Timestamps

• 03:21: Klosterman on being defined by podcast vs. written work.
• 09:41: Torre on nostalgia for old-school magazine culture.
• 13:03: Freezing oneself in time through writing.
• 15:05–16:10: Klosterman on not living in the present (“I’m not even here right now.”)
• 25:00: The failed prophecy of football’s decline.
• 28:30: Football's dominance as a TV product explained.
• 35:01: Why football's future will be determined by economics, not culture wars.
• 43:23: Torre posits a "post-winning" phase for sports.
• 48:38–49:54: Reading of the book’s key "what we want/what we don’t want" passage.
• 52:49: On football as the culturally sanctioned outlet for traits otherwise frowned upon.
• 54:31: Openly disavowing football as an unthinkable political stance.
• 56:40: The mutual recognition that, however flawed, football must be protected.

Tone & Style

• The conversation is sharp, humorous, and unvarnished—full of philosophical asides, cultural references, and rueful jokes about generational change. Both Torre and Klosterman are self-aware and openly critical of their own shortcomings and biases.
• Klosterman’s wit and willingness to self-interrogate mesh with Torre’s curiosity and nostalgia, creating a dynamic and engaging exchange that’s both rigorous and accessible.

This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in sports as a cultural mirror, the transformation of media, and the paradoxes at the heart of American tastes and identity. Football, for both men, remains indispensable not because it is pure, but precisely because it is not.