Loading summary
Transcript193 lines
- [00:00]
A
Welcome to Pablo Torre finds out. I am Pablo Torre. And today we're gonna find out what this sound is.
- [00:06]
B
There's a lot to show up to today. Who you gonna find? Pablo Torre, right after this ad. You're listening to Giraffe K. I'm rolling right here. I'm gonna make sure. Okay, this is it. We're starting now. We're talking for real. We're real boys talking.
- [00:37]
A
Ben, I, I, I thank you for coming onto a show that you know nothing about.
- [00:42]
B
I don't. I know the person who hosts it, and that much was exciting enough for me. But outside of that, I have no idea what's gonna happen. I feel like it's gonna be Survivor.
- [00:49]
A
Yep, yep, yep, yep. There is a. There is a. What is it called? At the end? You get an immunity thing. What? What happens? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You can, you can win.
- [00:58]
B
I think you and I obviously both know everything about Survivor when we're like, you get an immunity thing at the end.
- [01:22]
A
All right, so you may know of Ben Schwartz from any number of Hollywood things like the after which he starred in on Apple tv. He's also the voice of Sonic the Hedgehog in the Sonic movies. He was also obviously this moron on Parks and Rec.
- [01:36]
B
Tommy T. You just missed the craziest of crazies. Clubs, girls dancing, naked mom argument, police fleeing the scene, hiding in a dumpster, coming here, crashing on your couch for a week. Cause technically I'm homeless. Hey, mustache. I'mma hit the couch. You know where I be.
- [01:56]
A
Ben's also written for SNL and Letterman and Robot Chicken and many, many other things. But I find Ben most interesting because the thing he loves doing and does as well as anyone I've ever seen is what you might have actual nightmares about. Because Ben Schwartz loves running out onto a stage in front of thousands upon thousands of people with nothing prepared, nothing scripted. And he'll just improvise an entire hour long show with his friends, Radio City Music Hall.
- [02:28]
B
Make some noise for Ben. Show war.
- [02:36]
A
But the way I got to know Ben was in a completely different context. You and I got to know each other because in February 2021, we got really into NBA. Top shot.
- [02:50]
B
Yeah. Amir Blumenfeld, I think, who, you know is a huge top shot guy. He was from Jake and Amir from CollegeHumor and now they run Headgum, that podcast company. And he. The way that it started for me was he said, he goes, I'm having the best time on this thing. You remember collecting cards? I was like, yeah, it's like my favorite. It's like, I used to love collecting cards. I have Marvel cards, I have basketball cards. I still, like, collect. And then he's like, it's like that. But on the Internet.
- [03:16]
A
For fans who got to witness LeBron James dunk against the Houston Rockets, it.
- [03:20]
B
Might have been a price, priceless moment.
- [03:22]
A
But for NBA top shot collectors like Michael Levy, right now, that dunk is worth almost $400,000. They're called Moments.
- [03:33]
B
Think trading cards, but entirely digital. I said, amazing. He goes, you gotta buy this. You gotta buy this Miles Bridges card. It's going up like crazy. You buy it now. I go, what do you mean? He goes, it's like stocks kinda.
- [03:45]
A
Yeah.
- [03:45]
B
I was like, okay. I go, I like the idea of, like opening a pack. And so he said, no, you gotta. So I buy a Mile Bridges card for whatever and immediately lose $100 immediately. Then, like the next moment lost $100. But then I started opening packs, and I loved that. And then instead of holding on to it because who knows how, you know, you never know when things are going to lose. I would trade immediately if I got a good card. And I was always able to break even. So, like, I made maybe 100 or 200 bucks. But, like, it was so funny. The way that I got into it was Amir's like, you got to ride, like, almost like a stock. It's like, you got to get this mile Bridges. And I got it and immediately went down the next day.
- [04:21]
A
Yeah, not a great investment that one, it turned out.
- [04:24]
B
No, and I mean, listen, if you want to get Amir on this podcast, I think he has a lot of money tied up in Top Shot right now, which I don't think is going to be lucrative for him in the future.
- [04:32]
A
So part of the reason I bring this up is that big picture, I should say that there was a report that came out this month that announced that 95% of people holding NFT collections, so non fungible tokens. This is what top shots are. This is what we're describing. These digital trading cards as well as like bored apes and so forth. All that. Yes. 23 million people, that's 95% of those holding NFT collections had investments that were now worth $0.
- [05:04]
B
We gotta get a mirror on the line. I know. We gotta get a mirror on the line.
- [05:07]
A
Can you call Amir right now?
- [05:08]
B
I can pop him on there if you want. It'll take one second to get him on the phone.
- [05:12]
A
I mean, let's try.
- [05:12]
B
Do you want me to?
- [05:13]
A
Yeah, if we can put Them on Snow Cooker. Let's just see what that sounds like.
- [05:15]
B
I'll put them on speakerphone. I'm on a. There you go. Pablo's. I'm on Pablo's show. Okay.
- [05:24]
A
Amir.
- [05:24]
B
He can hear you. Yeah, he can hear you. And we're talking about Top Shot investments, so we're just. So Pablo. The stat that Pablo said is that these NFTs have dropped so. So drastically that a lot of them have zeroed out. So the question we wanted to ask you is how is your Top Shot collection going? And do you have any. Do you want to talk about it all just for two seconds?
- [05:51]
A
I made close to eight figures in just Top Shot.
- [05:57]
B
Eight figures. You're talking about tens of millions of dollars.
- [06:00]
A
Yeah, well, I started with nine figures.
- [06:02]
B
You started with nine figures. How much did you invest? Do you want to talk about how much you've invested or. Now is not the time.
- [06:09]
A
I'm on the toilet, but I would say I cryptocurrency, so I feel sort of justified in my position. So I should say, Ben, it does look like, angle wise, he is on the toilet. Truly, just for the.
- [06:21]
B
You are on the toilet. Is this fine to. You are. We can take this out, I guess, Amir. But you. You look great.
- [06:26]
A
Oh, thank you.
- [06:27]
B
Yeah.
- [06:27]
A
I didn't know this was a live stream.
- [06:29]
B
It's not a live stream. It's not a live stream. It's not a live stream. But he may be.
- [06:34]
A
No, we're not gonna that out. He might be actually live streaming, though, into. Into his toilet.
- [06:39]
B
I didn't know you were on the toilet. It's kind of funny that you're on the toilet.
- [06:43]
A
It's sort of a metaphor for top.
- [06:45]
B
Is there anything else? Yeah, Perfect point.
- [06:48]
A
Perfect point. I love this show too. Congratulations. Good work on the new show. Thank you. See, Amir knows what it is, Ben.
- [06:54]
B
What is it? He's in my ears. What is. Explain to me what it is and explain to me what his show.
- [06:59]
A
Don't do that. That's now awkward for me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a new podcast.
- [07:04]
B
It's a new podcast. Okay. Do you want to plug Headgum while you're here? Okay. All right. Have a great.
- [07:10]
A
Thanks, Amir.
- [07:12]
B
All right. He's gone.
- [07:13]
A
Well, Amir, Amir provided an excellent segue, which is that it is a metaphor for Top Shot, the toilet he was sitting upon.
- [07:20]
B
I do remember I tried to wire transfer the money out and I tried four times. Four separate times, and every time it said it didn't work.
- [07:26]
A
Yeah.
- [07:27]
B
So I don't have Any cryptocurrency. I'm not invested in anything. The only thing NFT ish that I'm invested in is Top Shop. And I almost always, I just always stayed even. I didn't want to lose money on it. So, like, I have a little bit of money in there that I'm trying to get back and it is near impossible to get it back.
- [07:44]
A
This was a complaint about Top Shot was that it was really hard to withdraw money. So by the way, I just want to point out that as of February 2021, like, Zion Williamson, a 13 second Zion Williamson highlight did go for like $100,000.
- [07:58]
B
Whoa.
- [07:59]
A
There were people who actually were making seven figures legitimately buying and selling opening packs that contained, yeah, highlights that anybody had access to, but were presented framed as digital modern trading cards.
- [08:14]
B
And then the idea was fun, right?
- [08:16]
A
And so we, we, we were in lines together, like waiting rooms together, like digital lines. I think I went on Instagram.
- [08:23]
B
You're like me. Yes, you, you, you loved. I mean, growing up, it was one of my favorite things in the world to open up a pack of basketball cards. It was one. It was the best. And like, to try to get like, you know, a rookie card to try to get a special hologram card or something like that, it was like, it was the best. So. So I thought, oh, this could be the adult version of that. And it felt like it. For a little bit, we all would FaceTime together and open up our packs together. Like, we would zoom and share each other's screens and then we would all explain what we got and it was really fun. And then it wasn't fun anymore.
- [08:57]
A
No. Then, then if you're like me, you have an unpurchased Bismack Biyombo layup that I priced out at $50,000 that no one has purchased.
- [09:11]
B
I remember, like, when I had just. The game was then just lowering it to $1 above what it was selling for and trying to just sell my stuff. But I think I broke even. And then when all the stuff that I had was really inexpensive, I was just like, I'm just gonna keep it because there's always a chance it comes back like it's there.
- [09:27]
A
Yeah.
- [09:28]
B
Instead of making like $5 off of an entire collection, why don't I just, you know, let it sit for a couple years and see what happens? But I was trying to cash out all the stuff that I sold.
- [09:37]
A
This is mostly a show about getting Ben Schwartz his liquidity, his top shot. Liquid.
- [09:57]
B
What is. Wait, can I tell you? Wait, Pablo, I'm gonna tell you what. The first time I saw this show, I follow you on Twitter.
- [10:04]
A
Yes.
- [10:05]
B
Someone had posted something, and then right below the post was, you being like, my man. Why don't you give credit to where you got this information from? This was sad. There was. And there was my boy Pablo just trying to be like this. So that's literally how I was like, oh, he must have his own show.
- [10:22]
A
I have. For everybody who has blamed me for over promoting this show, this is why I promote this show.
- [10:28]
B
What was it again? What was it again?
- [10:30]
A
I was mad. This is even sadder. And now it brings us back to Hollywood, Ben, because I had my friend Steven Glover, Donald's brother, right around Atlanta, all that stuff.
- [10:38]
B
Oh, I love Steven Glover. I was on an improv team with Donald for six, seven years called Jobs at ucb. And his brother would come in and check out the show. But his brother's a genius. The writing he's done in his television show I think is one of the most incredible. I'm so blown away by it.
- [10:54]
A
And so Stephen came on. Stephen's a friend of mine for 10 years now. Stephen came on and clarified that the thing they're doing for Star wars, him and Donald.
- [11:01]
B
Oh, yes.
- [11:01]
A
Is a movie. We're not allowed to talk about it, but yes.
- [11:04]
B
But anyway, let's talk about.
- [11:05]
A
I was yelling.
- [11:06]
B
I remembered exactly.
- [11:07]
A
I was yelling at some Star wars aggregator. Meme account credit me because they had aggregated it without linking back.
- [11:15]
B
I saw you underneath me, like, come on, my man, my man, my man.
- [11:19]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [11:20]
B
And that's. I was like, oh, I think Pablo has his own show. I can't wait to, like, read more.
- [11:23]
A
You saw the equivalent of me standing outside the gates of a manor with, like, a tin can being banged with a cane, just like, sir, sir, please.
- [11:36]
B
Is there a world so like you, I feel like you are firmly established in the sports world. And are you trying. Is there. Is your goal with this to be like, you know what? Not only do I do this, I want to talk about everything.
- [11:49]
A
I think it's just about my actual curiosities. And so you've provided me a couple of segues. Ben, you doing improv with Donald. So I should say that, like, you two guys, I. I am. I've been embarrassed to say this to you, even though we've known each other now for a couple of years in this very strange way that I've been, like, watching you do improv for, like, 15 years.
- [12:12]
B
Really.
- [12:13]
A
So I would watch you at UCB Theater in Manhattan right. When were you at UCB?
- [12:18]
B
I was there from 2003 to 2009.
- [12:21]
A
Yes, exactly. So I would see you doing like Ascat, right? Yes, yes, yes.
- [12:27]
B
And I was an intern. I was an intern at ascat. I used to hand out tickets and do the garbage to afford classes.
- [12:32]
A
So I was watching you do improv then. In fact, I remember seeing Donald doing improv at UCB or NYU maybe. But the point is, I would say you and Donald are like, again, I haven't seen everybody but you, Ben Schwartz, have a superpower, and the superpower is improv. You just sold out Radio City doing it. And I'm glad to now tell you that, like, I have many questions about the superpower that you have. So just to explain to people what improv even is, I feel like long form improv. Exactly. So explain for people who maybe are kind of aware, maybe they've seen like Whose Line Is It Anyway? What it is that you do.
- [13:14]
B
Sure. So Whose Line is It Anyway? Is a show that I watch coming up and I love so much. It's a short form improv show which you do a series of games. And those guys are brilliant, like Colin Mochrie and like Wayne Brady. All those guys I remember watching when I was a kid and loving. When I was in college, I did short form. And then when I was in. When I graduated college, I started taking classes at the Upright Citizens Brigade theater, which is a long form improv. Long form improv theater. So what that means is you get a suggestion up top and then we make up an entire show. So if you're talking about Ben Schwartz and Friends, which is my current show, I talk to someone in the audience, me and three of my friends, and then we make up an entire hour long show based off the conversation that we have with the audience member. There are no quick games. And if we're doing it well, if you're doing it well, then it feels like it's written and it feels like almost like a play.
- [14:04]
A
Yes.
- [14:04]
B
Like, how are they doing this? It feels like magic when it's great because you can't believe that. That we're making it up. We'll have a scene that ends, but that scene will somehow connect into all the other scenes and all these characters kind of converge and all that stuff. So that's what I do. And it's always been at 99 person theaters they call black box theaters, which are all the walls are painted black, Upright Citizens Brigade underneath gris and stuff like that. And so it's like it's done for 100. And what Thomas and I wanted to do when we were touring Middle and Schwartz. Mm. We wanted to show people that it doesn't have to be there. So we started doing Largo. Then we started touring, doing bigger venues. And then after that I did with Ben Schwartz and friends, I started doing more venues and bigger venues. There was never the goal to do Radio City because it didn't seem possible. I'm even quoted on Pete Holmes podcast as to say, like, he goes, you can do Radio City one day. This is years ago. And I go, no, I'm not John Mulaney. I can't sell out Radio City. And then, you know, cut to literally a week and a half ago, we sold that Radio City, the first ever long form improv group, or improv group to headline that theater ever. So 6,000 people and every seat was taken up. So it kind of blows my mind. It feels too surreal to even compute. But what I'm starting to learn now is that by doing these shows for so many people, I'm introducing long form to thousands and thousands of people for the first time. It's crazy. It's been a very crazy and fun ride and it's always kind of been on the side for my writing and acting like this is the thing I do for fun. Yeah, you're my thing that I love.
- [15:31]
A
Voice, actor, actor, writer, all of you of a truly, like, unrelenting resume. There are many, many, like Hollywood stars, like, huge names that have come through the craft, right? Like Bill Murray, of course, Tina Fey, Mike Myers. They were all improvisers. So you're in a lineage, but you're kind of, you're kind of introducing it to people. The genre itself.
- [15:55]
B
Yeah, we're, it's, it's. You're right. Like Amy Poehler is the person who created the Upright Citizen Brigade Theater with Matt Besser and Matt Walsh and Ian Roberts. And so like, those people to me are like icons. And they learned from a guy named Del Close in Chicago who taught Bill Murray and all the guys that you named. So it's like, you're right. It's been around, but it's now, it's never been toured to audiences of this size.
- [16:15]
A
So part of the reason why I love it is because it is the very thing that I think lots of people, including some comedians, I would imagine identify as like an active nightmare. Like you're on a stage, A lot.
- [16:25]
B
Of stand ups make fun of it.
- [16:26]
A
Well, the stand up improv dynamic. Please explain that.
- [16:30]
B
I find stand up to be Hard, really hard. I tried it for, like, I did like 10 or 12 times, and I found it to be so hard and so isolating. And, like, when I failed, I really failed.
- [16:41]
A
I love the idea of what was failure, like, as a stand up for you. How vividly do you remember that?
- [16:46]
B
So long. Really vividly, because it's the beginning. It's before I knew how to be on stage. So I was doing a show at Boston Comedy Club and I did the Bringer show twice. And then they said, you know what? You can come and you don't have to bring people for the next one. I was like, oh, my God, this is gonna be amazing. And I got on stage. I was so tired from work. I was a page at Letterman at the time. And I came right from work and I hadn't slept because in the morning I write jokes for Letterman too. And so I was like, I. I got to stage and my first two jokes bombed. Not one person left. And I was like. And my whole body, like, I felt like. I felt like. I felt hollow. I felt like bones. I was just like. I just felt terrible. I felt terrible. To fail by yourself was really sad. Also, to succeed by yourself was not as exciting as I'm. I'm. I love playing basketball. I love being a part of a team. And, like, so to write sketches or to improvise with all of us together, we build something. And it's not just what I'm thinking, but this person's gonna make it better. And I don't know what's gonna happen. I loved it and my mind really went towards it.
- [17:40]
A
But that part is the part that reminds me of sports. Like, there is, I think, unlike anything else in entertainment. Like, the argument I want to make to you, and I wonder if it resonates, is that improv has qualities that remind me of sports in ways that nothing else in comedy does.
- [17:58]
B
I think that's exactly correct. And the way that I pick my teams when I go out is exactly that. I'm looking for a point guard. I'm looking for a power forward. I'm looking for. So, like, if I bring different people, I know they have different skill sets. So it's like. And I know where I can fit and how I can adjust my skills to better help the team. In improv, I'm always trying to make the person opposite me look better. That's like, my goal. And, like, so if I can make Drew Tarver look better or like, you know, Mary Holland, anything. But I also know what these people are really, really good at. And I was like, oh, if I mix these, this little, you know, like, if I use this person, this person, we're going to get a totally different show than if I get three people who are really heavy on characters, who love coming out as crazy characters. So I got to make sure that I play with my teams correctly, I think.
- [18:39]
A
Yeah, well, look, there's. There's legitimately unscripted, completely unscripted live action. There is this team dynamic that you've just described. But the idea of you trying to figure out, okay, to make the analogy to a basketball team, we need people who can move the ball. We need people who can, who can finish an alley oop, right. Like what you're really doing there.
- [19:02]
B
Absolutely.
- [19:03]
A
What you're doing there, which I love, is also, like, you're, you're being very sensitive to ego. Right. Like on some level, ego, to me is the thing in sports that is so complicated. Look at any locker room dynamic. That's. That's what ruins dynasties as well as creates them. Right. But for you, how. How does confidence and ego fit into how you do the job of professional long form improviser?
- [19:27]
B
The best improvisers, the ones that I love the most are the ones that can share the ball. Exactly. Everybody on stage with me is undeniably funny. Everybody on stage could be the leader of their own sitcom. Anybody, you know, like all those, they're all incredible, but they, for me, they have to be really good at Exactly. Finishing alley oop. Or if this scene means for them to be the straight man, then they have to be the straight man in that scene. But like, if I take three people who are like, exactly what I say, like, if you have. So someone can be really funny, but not the best person to play with because all they want to do is score. All they want to do is get every single laugh.
- [20:00]
A
This is what I was going to ask you, Ben. Can there be in your mind as GM and, and player on the team, can there be a Kobe Bryant in improv, can there be an ISO, like, clear out. I got this like that mentality of I'm the star, I need the ball, get out of the way. Does that, how does that work?
- [20:22]
B
I think it would be hard. It's easier to have that in sketch. I think it would be hard. Listen, if someone's undeniably funny, you could always do a show with them and I could just always set them up, you know what I mean? Like, I'll always, like, I'll give Kobe the ball every time, but the Magic in the show itself wouldn't be as exciting because we're not all doing it together. It's just like, you know, something like that. But I think that's a good question. I think people could get in the way of the show when they're just looking out for themselves. I love sports and basketball and improv so much and there's no place that combines the two. Like, I've been doing this for 22 years and this is the first time ever that I'm talking to someone that like, like really wants to learn about it and also loves sports and can see. I love being on a team and completing something together. Because when I'm writing, I'm riding by myself and when I'm acting, I think one of the things that I bring to the table is I love playing in a scene. I love trying to make the person opposite me look better. Whatever the scene needs I can kind of help with, hopefully. But also I like scoring too. So like, if I see a place where I could stand out or steal a scene where it doesn't get in the way of anything and it helps the movie, I'll see. You know, I'll try to find that stuff too. My God, I can't wait to see which place rips you off and you being like, what the hell is going on? Don't rip this video off.
- [21:34]
A
Ben Schwartz says that Kobe Bryant never would have made it in comedy. That's me.
- [21:49]
B
I do a show called Ben Schwartz and Friends and it used to be called Snow Pants and I used to bring people who've never done it before. The best performer in Snow Pants was Blake Griffin. He did it three times and he was unbelievable at long form improv.
- [22:02]
A
Wait, so follow up question because I've heard that Blake Griffin is like the funniest athlete, but I've always assumed that were grading on a curve, right? It's like, ah, he's funny for an athlete, right?
- [22:12]
B
But you're telling me we did a show and Zach woods was there, who I think is one of the best improvisers ever. We did a show and it was others first or second time ever doing improv. And this is when I was hanging out with him a bunch and he's like, I find him to be so funny. And so backstage Zach woods looks at him and goes, pulls me aside and goes, it's not fair. It's not fair that he can like be so good at basketball. But our do our nerdy thing too. He's like also handsome and tall and he could do our nerdy thing. He's sincerely very good at it. He did it twice in a group of six and then one of my shows canceled on me and I had nobody and I texted him and he came to the theater and was me, him and one other person. We did a three person show for an hour and he crushed. He was. It's. He's so. He was amazing. Like, I know he does stand up, but he's. Man, was he good at improv. I was so impressed.
- [23:00]
A
It does feel unfair when the person can literally finish an alley. Oops.
- [23:06]
B
Like, you should be able to do.
- [23:07]
A
Both figuratively and literally.
- [23:09]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I agree with that.
- [23:12]
A
Give me, though, what it's like to listen while you're doing this. Because to me, I'm trying to like. The other reason I'm fascinated by you and improv is because I think anybody who communicates professionally in any way, if they're curious or want to get better. Watching you work is such an interesting thing because what I watch you do is actively listen. Like, I want to make this kind of more specific because you're generally describing, like, okay, how do I create architecture out of utter chaos, such that by the end of this thing, there is some sort of through line or narrative or callback or breadcrumb that I've dropped that I then pick up later. What that tells me is that Ben Schwartz is listening with, like, bat ears all of the time.
- [23:54]
B
Listening is the biggest thing. You have to listen and you have to be okay with. What happens sometimes is it's called initiation when I start a scene. So let's say with me and you, one of the scenes that I'm starting, I. I have no idea. Let's say it's, we're about to play basketball together, or I'm drafting my basketball team and you want to be picked or something like that. And I'm like, okay, who do I want to pick? Me starting it being like, okay, so, all right, so there's only one. We can only pick one more person. And then you're on the line, like, trying to be picked or whatever. Like, and I'm trying to figure out who it should be, you know, so that's initiation. Me starting the scene. Someone else can come in with initiation as well. And all this happens all the time. Because when two people come on stage, they both have ideas. One of them has to just shut up and let their thing go.
- [24:38]
A
Exactly.
- [24:38]
B
Because whoever. Whoever talks first wins. So if I have the best initiation in the world, I'll Let it go because this person started, and I want to say yes to whatever they're saying. I want to show them I got their back. Whatever they say, I'm going to jump on. I'm not going to make it this. If that makes sense. So what I'm doing is I'm listening always. And also, if I have initiation in my head and it goes somewhere else, I let it go wherever it goes, wherever it feels like. But also on the back line, I'm thinking when I'm interviewing the person in the beginning, I'm listening and I'm trying to take nuggets that I can use, like characters or. Or, like, places like. Or just, you know, like, feelings or them just, like, understanding what the audience is laughing at. But I also do it in my real life. I love when I'm sitting down with someone, I will listen 80% of the time. I never have to talk about myself. I. If they ask questions, I will. But I. I'm. I love learning about people. I was a psychology anthropology major. I think that's why you and I like, we like talking to people because we like to learn.
- [25:34]
A
I like.
- [25:34]
B
I like human beings. I like being around people. So it's like I'm always. I'm always ready to listen and only talk when it feels, you know, necessary that I can add something.
- [25:45]
A
But the idea of always saying yes, the whole yes and concept. Could you explain that for people, again, who aren't, like, familiar with. With going to, you know, improv shows?
- [25:55]
B
Sure. So let's say, Pablo, it doesn't have to be good. There's no pressure. Just start any scene in the world, and I'll tell you the incorrect way of handling it. So start anything. Don't be nervous. I know that you've come to a bunch of shows, but it doesn't matter. Anything you say is fine. Just don't ask a question.
- [26:07]
A
Okay. Oh, my God. I cannot believe that I left the stove on.
- [26:12]
B
You didn't leave the stove on. So if I say no to you, I've taken your idea and it's got. The scene is gone, the energy's gone. Now you have to pretend like, oh, I guess I didn't. But if you say do the same thing. Ready? Yeah, go.
- [26:23]
A
Yeah. Yeah. I cannot believe I left the stove on.
- [26:26]
B
Oh, my God, I had pasta on there. How long has the stove been on? Like, so now it's like, I take your idea and I'm. I'm explaining like a pasta on there. Now, slowly, we're going to find out why? Maybe we have a big date tonight or something like that. But now we're building. We're slowly building a scene together. And, you know, as we keep adding. You would say something. We're adding it, and now we can play with something. We find. We find what is called. And I think this is what you're referring to. We find the game of the scene. Yes.
- [26:50]
A
Yes.
- [26:50]
B
So within the scene, we find the game of the scene. So the game of the scene may be. If we keep going, oh, my God, I pasta tonight. And you're like, oh, it's gonna be. You'll be fine, dude. It'll be fine. It's totally burnt. Like, you can make it into blank. So now it's like, how do we turn this bad thing into a good thing type thing.
- [27:03]
A
Yep.
- [27:04]
B
But saying yes to it and adding to it gives us a place to go and build the scene together. Saying no to an idea stops it and makes you. Makes your partner feel stupid for offering an idea. So it's like, I'm sure it's the same, by the way. You have to be so good at that when you're doing your talking heads in the room for all of your sports stuff. Like, you have to be listening.
- [27:25]
A
I was gonna say that I think about improv a lot. Not because I'm trying to do comedy when I give takes on sports, but because I'm always thinking about a. The other person who I'm ostensibly choosing. Okay. Am I arguing, saying no to them, or am I saying yes and going off on, hopefully, a riff with them that gets us to a place that feels, by the way, like, to me, there's this fork in the road. Every time you do a sports debate on television, it's am I going to say no? And we're going to now hash it out and we're going to make this a thing that jeopardizes either of our egos. Or is this going to be a thing in which we're going to find the game of the scene in which, like. But now we're building on this mutually. And part of me feels like, again, Stephen A. Smith says no a lot. Right in his seats.
- [28:15]
B
Yes.
- [28:16]
A
And he's the greatest. So I don't want to say that's how you do it. Wrong. But I always love when there's the waterfall cascade of just like. And now we're just making jokes that build on each other. And that part.
- [28:29]
B
That's the best.
- [28:30]
A
There is a but you're describing, I think, a generosity that I think of that I aspire to in conversation as a human. Like, I'm not here to just be a yes man. Although we are literally being that in this, in this context. I think about it being sensitive to how this can be really fun for every person in this room.
- [28:52]
B
So, like, what do you, what, what was your, like, what was your statement, your mission statement, your Jerry Maguire mission statement when you started this?
- [29:00]
A
Yeah, I wanted to have fun with people that I like and people that I find interesting. And so the reason I'm having you on is not. You don't need to be a psychoanalyst to realize why I'm particularly interested in how you do what you do. Because that's the version that's like the spiritual sort of North Star that I have is like, oh, I want to spontaneously do stuff that feels to people like, wow, that's a high level version of me with my friends, you know, just like talking friends. Or in Mere's case, literally.
- [29:33]
B
Literally. Honestly?
- [29:35]
A
Yeah.
- [29:35]
B
Yes, yes, yes. I can't imagine he won't text me and tell me, please don't put that on the air.
- [29:41]
A
But give me, give me the sense of what it feels like when improv is going well because there's no net. Right. This is the other thing about improv, why I'm obsessed with it kind of is that there is danger. There is great danger. You don't have a script even if you do a play. Right. Plays are very scary for actors because they're live performances, but they're literally scripted performances. In this case, there is no net. And so when it's going well, what does that feel like inside of your brain that is processing quite a bit that people are not necessarily hearing.
- [30:12]
B
It's amazing. The biggest thing is, and I think it's something that you, you do incredible with is you have to be in the moment. You. You cannot be thinking of anything else than what is happening in that very moment because you'd lose track of the whole show and there's too much to juggle. So it's like when it's going well, it's just the best feeling. It's like you're getting. Our laughter when we have shows is non stop. It's every, you know, couple seconds, every five, six seconds. It's like if we're doing it right, they're just rolling and we're just, we're just rolling. It's. It's a crazy feeling. But when I did Radio City, Josh Groban has done a singer, great singer, has done Radio City a bunch of times and he's like. He goes, I can't believe you're going up there with nothing. Like, you're going up there with nothing.
- [30:57]
A
What's throwing up a brick in improv?
- [30:59]
B
Like, oh, my God, it's terrifying. I feel fortunate that it hasn't happened in a long time, but if you have a scene that's going poorly and you can't get out of it, like, it's just. There's nobody's really. Like, back in the day, man, it would happen all the time. We'd be in a scene, the audience isn't laughing. It just feels like work. Feels like hard work. You're just, like, trying to find anything to make anybody laugh or care. And then you're trying to. Also, if a scene's going poorly, you're trying to find any button to get out of it. But I have such skilled improvisers with me that someone always makes it hilarious. That's where having, like, Kobe skills helps. Someone is just so funny that they can make that scene, have enough comedy to keep it alive or to give me a place to get the hell out of the scene. Do you know what I mean?
- [31:42]
A
Yeah. I was thinking of a quote from the NFL this past weekend. So the Bengals are terrible, and their star wide receiver ja' Marr Chase is being interviewed after the game, and he's like, is it frustrated to not be as open this year? And his response is, he's always open. Nah, I'm open.
- [31:58]
B
I'm always open.
- [32:00]
A
I'm always open. And the idea of, like. So I should retract my previous statement, Right? Like, there is a safety net, and it's your teammates. It's having a guy who you should theoretically be able to just throw it to, even if he's super covered, like, wildly, seemingly inaccessible, you just know you can throw it in his direction generally.
- [32:20]
B
That's right. Help me. That's exactly correct. It's like, help, help. And also, I'm that person that helps somebody. So it's like, it's. It always switches. It's like, okay, what are we doing here? Let's figure something out. You know what I mean? I'm sure you're live editing all the time. Do you remember. Can you remember a response that you did that quote unquote, bombed or put you in a terrible position where you're like, I hate that I'm talking about this still. How do I get the hell out of here? Yeah, specifically.
- [32:42]
A
Oh, my God. The first one of the first time they did around the horn. So, like, one of ESPN's most popular television huge shows. And so literally one of the first episodes I ever did around the Horn, the topic was the 49ers quarterback controversy. And it was. This was.
- [32:55]
B
This is. This is a real thing for you.
- [32:56]
A
You're feeling that this is here. Oh, so already I'm palpably just sort of reliving the awkwardness of. And this was pre Colin Kaepernick being revelatory, like, race relations figure. This is just him as a quarterback with the Niners. And so it's. Who should start, Alex Smith or Colin Kaepernick. And I just remember being so nervous on around the Horn that when it came back to me, the only thing I could say was, everybody's ganging up on you. Boom.
- [33:24]
B
Alex Smith, man.
- [33:26]
A
That's it. Alex Smith, man. Alex Smith, man. And then I just shook my head. I was assuming. I was assuming one of my teammates was gonna come in. And just like, I thought I was out of time. I thought the horn was. Was already sounding. But I stopped short, which is like a sin to stop short and leave silence and to have nothing but Alex Smith.
- [33:50]
B
How did they respond? How did they respond?
- [33:51]
A
Everybody laughed in a way that has haunted me for over a decade. And all I had to respond to someone else was Alex Smith, comma, man. Hard period. How do you deal with a public failure then?
- [34:19]
B
I remember one time, Sarah Silverman came up to me after a show and someone said, ben, you had a great show. And I was like, oh, thanks, man. I felt off. I just don't know why I didn't feel like a great show. And she come up to me, she goes, why'd you do that? I said, what? He goes, that person thought you had a great show. Now you're making them feel like they're wrong. Like they like what you. They loved the show. Now you're telling them that you thought it was a bad show. It's like I really. That connected with me because it's like they're not doing improv every day for this long. I would think about it for days. I would be sad for days.
- [34:51]
A
Same. But what you said, days, what you said that I really relate to is that sometimes we're not good at self scouting in the moment. Is that our standard sometimes is so uncompromising. I have such a standard for what I'm doing that I will notice something that is off and I will let it infect everything, such that the entire experience was poisoned. I think it's insecurity, I guess, or something like insecurity masquerading as, as just being, you know, mamba mentality. Like, if I don't think this is good, it's not good in reality. You're probably too mean to yourself.
- [35:27]
B
I think the biggest thing you said, which I'm sure people that are listening can relate, is I will let a small thing get in the way of me enjoying the entire thing. I think that's really smart of you to say. And it's so bad to do that.
- [35:40]
A
There's like a post coital joy to like a long form improv show going really well. I guess it's a, it's a post coital orgy sort of sensation of like we all, we all got our shots off and it was. Yeah, beautiful.
- [35:55]
B
When everybody has a great show, it's my favorite thing.
- [35:57]
A
What, what's. Where does this go, Ben? I mean, so there's. I should say that there's something that you can't say, which is that, and I am free to say it, which is that you produced a Netflix special, which has never existed before in the genre of long form improv. And that is unprecedented in this genre. What do you want to do next within the world of improv, specifically? Like, where does this go?
- [36:24]
B
It's crazy because the thing I do for fun, it's like the fun things, there's no end game because also there's never been. The stuff that I'm doing with this tour hasn't really happened before. People don't do long form improv in 3000 person venues and stuff like that. So it's always going to kind of be the thing that I do for fun on the side. So like my writing and my acting takes precedence. Writing, acting, you know, my real life stuff takes precedence. And then if I have time, I want to make people laugh as much as I can. I want to get on stage as much I can. It brings me such joy and I feel like it keeps me sharp, but there isn't a thing. Maybe I'll do some. Maybe I'll record some more. Ben Schwartz and friends. I've been slowly recording all the audio of all my tour shows. That's kind of a secret, but it's like. So I have it. So I could release it as like a Patreon thing or as a podcast. I could do that. So I own my stuff, which is great, but I don't have any video. I don't have an end game yet. I have some ideas, but I don't have an end game. And I just want to. I was Talking to someone the other day, being like, how old can I be till it's not cool for me to be, like, a wizard jerking off a dragon on stage?
- [37:27]
A
That was my last.
- [37:28]
B
I mean, that's not gonna happen.
- [37:29]
A
That was gonna be my last question for you.
- [37:31]
B
That's a great one.
- [37:32]
A
Literally, that one.
- [37:32]
B
It's like. Yeah, it's like, I don't know how long. Also, I don't know how long people are gonna keep. People are selling these venues out. Like, I'm selling these out. How long is that gonna go on for? I have no idea. Wait. What you are.
- [37:46]
A
What you are concerned about at the very end here, Ben Schwartz, is that your improv career is a lot like NBA Top Shot. You did it. You brought it all back together.
- [37:56]
B
You crushed it. You belong on stage. You belong on stage. Is there going to be a moment when I'm on stage when my. When my Jalen Brunson reverse layup is worth zero cents?
- [38:09]
A
Well, I should say that the very end of the show, we go around the room and we say what we found out today.
- [38:15]
B
Great.
- [38:16]
A
So, Ben Schwartz, what did you find out on Pablo Torre finds out?
- [38:19]
B
Wow. What a great question. I found out kind of. First of all, I found out that you're a fan of comedy and improv that I had no idea about. That you're really here to, like, show people what you can do. As a intelligent Filipino gentleman who loves sports and also comedy, you want to express your passion in the way that you want to express your passion. You don't want it. You want it. You want it to see what it feels like when you have total control. Yeah. What did you learn today, Pablo?
- [38:45]
A
I learned today.
- [38:46]
B
Oh, also, we learned what Amir's toilet looks like. We did.
- [38:50]
A
We learned that Amir Blumenfeld will let us record him while he's taking a.
- [38:55]
B
We got it. When. When we stop recording, we got to call him and see if he's okay with sharing that, because, I mean, that's obviously going to be the clip you put.
- [39:01]
A
I'm going to say we're going to. We're going to circulate that widely. Yeah. What I also learned is that, I don't know, I feel like I kind of want to put a quarter into the Ben Schwartz improv monkey machine and just, like, sing our theme song. Ben, sing us out. Can you do that for us?
- [39:19]
B
Absolutely. What's the name of the show?
- [39:21]
A
Oh, God, it's Pablo Torre finds out. I hate you. I deserve that, but I hate you.
- [39:32]
B
Okay. Too many.
- [39:33]
A
Yep.
- [39:33]
B
Go ahead, Pablo. Will you join me?
- [39:36]
A
Perhaps we'll find out.
- [39:39]
B
There you go. That makes sense. There's a lot to find out in the world. Who you're gonna call? Who knows the answers. There's a lot to show up to today. Who you gonna find? Pablo Torre. What do you think about that?
- [39:58]
A
You are somebody that I greatly admire so sincerely. Thank you for plugging in a microphone and doing this with me, man. Thank you, man.
- [40:05]
B
Bye, buddy.
- [40:12]
A
This has been Pablo Torre Finds Out A Meadowlark Media Production and I'll talk to you next time.