Podcast Summary: Pablo Torre Finds Out

Episode: We Helped Scatter the Ashes of a Die-Hard Fan (PTFO Vault)
Date: July 29, 2025
Host: Pablo Torre
Guests/Correspondents: Dave Fleming, Dr. Shannon Lee Dawdy, Wayne Estes, Edna Smith

Episode Overview

This episode of Pablo Torre Finds Out is a deep-dive "talkumentary" into the rituals of fandom, grief, and the surprising surge in sports fans wanting their earthly remains scattered at their beloved venues. Investigating a viral Colorado Avalanche story as well as broader trends, Pablo, joined by Dave Fleming and others, confronts death, celebration, friendship, and our desire to remain part of something larger than ourselves—even after we've gone.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Tale of Ryan Clark & Kyle Stark (03:00 – 11:00)

• Background: Ryan Clark and Kyle Stark, lifelong best friends and Colorado Avalanche superfans, shared their unwavering devotion over a decade, going so far as to share season tickets and attend games together.

• Kyle’s Passing: Kyle dies suddenly at just 32. Ryan feels compelled to create a tribute that matches Kyle’s lifelong obsession: scattering Kyle’s ashes on the Avalanche’s home ice.

• The Act: In January 2022, during an intermission at Ball Arena, Ryan covertly deposits Kyle’s ashes onto the ice while supported precariously by family.

  • Quote:
    "If you have the choice whether to breathe air or watch the Avalanche play hockey, he's gonna suffocate... He's gonna watch the game." — Ryan Clark (04:34)

• Aftermath: Arena staff notice immediately, and Ryan is escorted out and banned for the remainder of the season. Yet, he feels no regrets.

  • Quote:
    "Every time I turn that TV on to watch a game, there he is." — Ryan Clark (10:10)

• Reflection: The act is seen as rebellious and deeply meaningful—a wildcat form of grief and fandom.

2. The Secret Boom in Sports-Fan Ashes & Industry Response (11:00 – 24:00)

• Cottage Industry: With cremation rates soaring and personalization on the rise, services now offer painted coffins, team-themed urns, and even golf balls made with ashes that explode on the fairway.

  • Quote:
    "You can get your face painted onto a Jets custom painted coffin... they'll take your ashes and make them into a golf ball." — Dave Fleming (11:53)

• Statistical Wave: A Mutual Choice 2024 survey finds sports venues top the dream list in 11 states for final resting places.

• Sports Venue Fears: While ashes are harmless to humans, they can damage turf. The bigger worry is the PR and uncontrolled "wildcat" scattering, with venues fearing viral moments (e.g., "a puff of grandpa's ashes" during a touchdown). Many teams have gone silent or refuse to comment.

  • Quote:
    "We don’t want a line of hearses lined up outside of our stadium on Sundays." — (Cowboys PR, via Dave Fleming, 17:51)

• Legal Details: There’s no federal or state law directly prohibiting the spreading of ashes, but private venues can—and do—deny permission.

3. Academic Perspective: Changing American Death Rituals (19:39 – 23:00)

• Dr. Shannon Lee Dawdy's Analysis: Specializing in death rituals, Dawdy traces the acceleration to 9/11, which triggered increased cremation, personalization, and nontraditional ad hoc rituals.

  • Quote:
    "911 acted like... an accelerant to these trends, where things just rapidly changed... particularly a move towards cremation and very personalized kind of ad hoc rituals and memorials." — Dr. Dawdy (20:14)

• "Wildcat Scattering": Dawdy coins this term for the illicit, often transgressive, ritual of spreading ashes where not permitted.

  • Quote:
    "There's something that attracts people to it precisely because it may not be allowed." — Dr. Dawdy (21:02)

• Collective Effervescence: Sports venues, much like places of worship, foster communal ecstasy and belonging, becoming secular cathedrals where people wish to remain forever.

4. A Rare Embrace: Sebring International Speedway (24:26 – 33:30)

• The Exception: Sebring International Speedway in Florida openly welcomes fans' requests to spread ashes, seeing it as an immense compliment.

  • Quote:
    "It's a tremendous compliment that a place [inspires] that kind of passion... The first time, I didn’t ask anybody, I just said, 'Yeah, we’ll make that work.'" — Wayne Estes, Sebring GM (26:27)

• Edna & Ron's Story: Fleming accompanies Edna Smith at Sebring as she scatters her late husband Ron's ashes on the racetrack—a moving, joyous procession in a convertible with ashes swirling in the air, turning grief into celebration.

  • Quote:
    "I took Ron’s ashes up skydiving. And I was really, really nervous... I was just covered with his ashes all over me because the wind blew the wrong way. And I was like, oh my heavens. But it was, yeah, it was awesome. Really awesome." — Edna Smith (29:35)
  • Quote:
    "When she got out of the car, she patted her pants and just poofs of smoke... It’s funny how quickly you get connected to somebody like that when they share a moment like this." — Dave Fleming (32:34)

5. Resolution: The Return and Legacy (35:37 – End)

• Full Circle for Ryan: After a magical playoff run (with Kyle’s ashes now a part of the ice), the Avalanche win the Stanley Cup, and Ryan is eventually allowed back to Ball Arena.

  • Quote:
    "That’s my boy helping them out... it was awesome to know that he was there during that whole time frame." — Ryan Clark (37:21)

• The Ultimate Tribute: The episode touches on the sacredness and silliness of these new rituals, ultimately framing the spreading of ashes at a beloved venue as the highest form of both fandom and friendship.

  • Quote:
    "I went ahead and volunteered right here, Ryan. I got you. I got media credentials. I’ll put you wherever you want to go... and I gotta tell you, I’m 100% serious." — Dave Fleming (40:48)

Notable & Memorable Quotes

• "There are die hard fans and then there are die hard fans."
  — Pablo Torre (08:14)

• "It proves that this isn’t a theory. This is happening. It’s happened."
  — Dr. Dawdy (21:52)

• "When was the last time you were at a traditional funeral or a cemetery and people were giggling and laughing and talking to the deceased... That’s what people want. They want a celebration of life."
  — Dave Fleming (33:59)

Important Timestamps

• 03:00: Ryan & Kyle’s friendship and the extraordinary tribute
• 06:58: The act of scattering ashes at Ball Arena
• 13:09: The booming market for personalized fan burials
• 17:51: Venues’ fears ("line of hearses lined up outside")
• 19:39: Academic take—how and why this is happening now
• 26:27: The open-armed policy at Sebring Speedway
• 29:35: Edna’s stories of honoring Ron with skydiving and Sebring
• 32:34: The celebration and joy found in the new rituals
• 35:37: How Ryan’s ban ended and the Avalanche’s championship run
• 40:48: Fleming volunteering to be Ryan’s eventual “ash spreader”

Tone & Takeaway

At once irreverent and deeply sincere, the episode weaves absurdity, grief, humor, and community into a profoundly human portrait of loss and longing. It casts modern American sports arenas as “secular cathedrals,” where our greatest fandoms outlast life itself. As the trend of “wildcat scattering” rises, the episode asks: Where and how do we want to be remembered? What is the ultimate tribute in an increasingly secular age? And—most of all—what would you do for your best friend?

“I have never doubted your sincerity on these assignments. And I already, whenever it, whenever it needs to be long into the future, I am ready.”
— Pablo Torre (41:03)