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Papi Killed Mommy
"A Small Podcast, Notwithstanding"
01:12:08
EP10 • “Small podcast, notwithstanding” Thirty-two years after Stacy’s death, a local editor calls this show “a small podcast notwithstanding.” In this episode, we put that attitude on trial. You’ll hear the emails, my dad’s 2023...
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Hi, my name is Nikki, and I'm the daughter of a murdered woman. Welcome back to Poppy Killed Mommy. Trigger Warning. This episode discusses domestic violence, homicide, and trauma. The man discussed in this series is presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Listener discretion is advised. In the last two episodes of Poppy Killed Mommy, we explored the complicated relationship between journalism, media, and justice. In my mom's case, episode eight, the Red Rock News, was about erasure, about how the very first article, published after my mom's death in 1993, framed her murder as little more than a domestic dispute, parroting police statements and Russell Peterson's narrative. Without question, that article didn't just report, it shaped public perception. And it was done in a way that erased my mom's identity, softened the reality of her homicide, and left my family's truth outside of the story. Episode eight was about that cycle of silencing how harmful words on a page, whether in a newspaper or an email, can wound just as deeply as the original crime. Then in episode nine, media Pressure, we looked at the other side of the story, the way media, when used responsibly, has the power to change everything. Unlike the Red Rock News articles that once buried the truth, modern coverage has amplified it. Millions of people have seen my story on TikTok. Countless listeners have heard it on podcasts around the world. Shows like Voices for Justice and Morbid have given my mom's case the kind of visibility local reporting never did. And that visibility matters because media is public pressure. It's what forces institutions to answer questions they'd rather ignore. Episodes 8 and 9 paint a full picture. On one side, the damage done when journalism fails. On the other, the possibility of justice when media shines a spotlight. They are two sides of the same the silencing of a story and the fight to make it heard again. This week, I'm going to bring you into an email exchange that was forwarded to me by a listener. She and her partner reached out to the editor of the Red Rock News about my mom's case, hoping for answers, or at the very least, respect. What they received instead were responses that were condescending and dismissive, and they were written by Christopher Fox Graham, the managing editor of that paper. The words you're about to hear are not mine. They are his and after I read them to you in full, I'm going to break down exactly why his responses aren't just dismissive, they're profoundly troubling both ethically and and personally. For privacy reasons, I've changed this follower's name to Jane. Chronological email chain verbatim starting Sunday, August 10th, 2025 at 6:43pm from Jane to Christopher Fox Graham Subject Wassolichen story Do it justice Please share the Stacey Wassolichen story from the family's perspective. This is long overdue response. Sunday, August 10, 2025, 9:23pm From Christopher Fox Graham to Jane sent were two links, nothing more at the beginning of this email. Just one link to the first story, then another link to a second story. And then after that he says no updates from Sedona PD since these signed Christopher Fox Graham. He probably had about 30 minutes to think about that because then he sent another one at Sunday, August 10, 2025 at 10:04pm from Christopher Fox Graham to Jane if there is any update in the case from the Sedona PD or the Yavapai County Attorney's Office, we will report on it. Thanks for reading Christopher Fox Graham the next morning. Monday, August 11, 2025 03:21am From Jane to Christopher Fox Graham I appreciate that you've taken the time to respond. Respectfully, it often takes media pressure for police departments to reopen cases. We have contacted the PD too. There's a story now regardless, particularly the PD's lack of follow up in many areas. And there's a story in what the family is doing. And then attached is the podcast, the link to my podcast. Without media pressure, so many cases across the country would not have been reopened over the years. Thank you for your time, Jane. Monday, August 11, 2025, 10:29am From Christopher Fox Graham no, it takes public pressure, not the media. Government and police are indifferent to media, which I can tell you after 21 years as a journalist. As you'll note in our story, the case is still open, so I don't know why you wrote to reopen cases, which he put in quotation marks. A small podcast notwithstanding, Sedona PD has no updates. If there is an update in the case from the Sedona PD or the Yavapai County Attorney's Office, we will report on it. Not sure who your we is, but best of luck. Thanks for reading Christopher Fox Graham. He also put we in quotes. Monday, August 11, 2025, 8:01am From Jane to Christopher Fox Graham thanks for your reply the we is my spouse and I. I agree public pressure is critical. It appears my email response may have upset you, but that truly wasn't my intent. Christopher I very much appreciate the hard work you and other journalists do every day. Jane Monday, August 11, 2025 at noon from Christopher Fox Graham to Jane no, I am unoffended. I have been a journalist for 21 years and have very thick skin. Aside from a few emails about the case after the stories in 2020, we have had no contact or continued interest from the public other than you and one other person in the last five years. The case was reopened by Dominguez back then, hence the stories, and remains open, but there have been no new investigative developments since then, podcast notwithstanding. Words matter, so use them wisely. Christopher Fox Graham Reading through his emails, he comes across as defensive, almost angry, and I have to ask why? Why is a journalist whose role is to inform the public so upset when a member of that same public is reaching out? He insists that there's been little contact, but since I've posted his email address, I know for a fact he's heard from more than one person. That defensiveness says more about his attitude towards this case than it does about the actual level of public interest. So let's break down his email first. The phrase a small podcast notwithstanding, that's not only dismissive, it's factually wrong. I've done my best to try and stay humble, but now I'm going to bust out a ton of podcast standard industry statistics. I hope you're ready.
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B
Boom.
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A
According to Buzzsprout 2025 statistics, if your show gets 100 downloads in the first seven days, you're already in the top 50%. Hitting a thousand downloads in seven days puts you in the top 10%. So by industry definitions, the vast majority of podcasts are small. Most never break 200 downloads per episode. Now, a medium show is typically considered to be one that consistently reaches a thousand to five thousand downloads per episode within the first seven to fourteen days. These are shows that have loyal audiences, chart occasionally and are attractive to mid tier sponsors. This is where Poppy Killed Mommy sits, pulling in an easy 5,000 downloads in the first 48 hours. Podcasts with 10,000 downloads per episode are considered large. The top 1% of podcasts worldwide get around 30,000 downloads per episode. For perspective, iHeartRadio wonderly crime junkies. They're all in this range and sometimes even higher. Why Small podcast is Misleading Context matters. If a podcast charts in Apple's top 200 like this one already has Twice. That automatically puts it in the upper tier of leadership. Regardless of raw numbers, Poppy Killed Mommy is sitting at 160,000 downloads. This is far beyond what most independent podcasts ever achieve. Industry reports show most podcasters quit before ever hitting 1000 total downloads. Episode 1 of Poppy Killed the Beginning has over 20,000 downloads alone. Being compared to giants like Wonderly or IHeartRadio is like apples to skyscrapers. Independent creators aren't small. They're operating with no network machine behind them and still competing in the same charts. Boom. That's me. Reality check. Poppy Killed Mommy is not small by any measure. With 160,000 downloads, chart placement in multiple countries, and Apple Top 100 Top 50 rankings, this show sits in the top 5 to 10% of all podcasts worldwide. Yes, worldwide. Numbers don't lie. And I just got chills. If this show was small, it wouldn't even show up in Apple's rankings. Most shows never do. Media coverage plus podcast momentum equals public pressure. The fact that journalists, listeners and other podcasts are already responding proves it's already a force. Bottom line, calling Poppy Killed Mommy a small podcast isn't just dismissive, it's factually Wrong. It's outperforming 90 to 90% of podcasts worldwide. But moving on, the claim that media doesn't matter, only public pressure, that's simply false. Media is public pressure. Local newspapers, national coverage, podcasts and televisions have reopened countless cold cases in this country. To say government and police are indifferent to media is to erase decades of evidence showing how critical coverage is to accountability. Next, the statement that there's been no contact or continued interest from the public. Again, that's not true. This amazing follower herself is proof of public interest. The downloads, the social media engagement, the emails I receive daily, those are all signs of continued interest. Just because the paper hasn't been contacted directly doesn't mean the interest doesn't exist. That's just willful ignorance. There's a couple of cream puff quotes of his that I just. I have to break down, quote for quote, starting with if there's an update in the case from the Sedona PD or the Yavapai County Attorney, we'll report on it. This frames journalism as purely reactive. We'll only report if police spoon feed us something. That's not what watchdog journalism is supposed to be. Reporters should be proactive, asking why there aren't updates, not shrugging until one appears. As you'll note in our story, the case is still open, so I don't know why you wrote to reopen the case. The use of quotation marks around open comes across as snide. It feels like he's nitpicking language instead of engaging with the substance of the point. I have a few more things I want to say on the A small podcast notwithstanding quote, this is the most blatantly dismissive line. Notwithstanding here basically means irrelevant. He is explicitly saying this podcast doesn't matter, despite the fact that it has reached more people globally than his newspaper ever will. The tone is minimizing, belittling. He could have said we're aware of the podcast or even thank you for the additional awareness. Instead, he chooses words that erase its impact. Not sure who your we is, but best of luck. And also the we as in quotes. This is unnecessarily snarky. He could have just simply asked who Jane meant, but instead he uses quotes and follows with the best of luck, which reads like a brush off. The tone is hostile and dismissive. This isn't professional engagement, it's a put down. The overall themes of this it's defensive and angry instead of openness. His replies feel like he's guarding himself and his paper from criticism. Dismissive of my work. The small podcast notwithstanding line undermines the reach and impact I've proven. Condescending tone. He positions himself as the authority with 21 years as a journalist, which reads as talking down rather than talking with lack of empathy. Not once does he acknowledge the pain of my family or the frustration of decades without justice. Everything is transactual, cold and sarcastic. So when you step back and you look at all of this, the picture becomes clear. These weren't just careless words dashed off in an email. They reveal an attitude. An attitude that minimizes, deflects, and ultimately protects institutions instead of challenging them. And that's exactly the opposite of what journalism is supposed to do. A journalist should amplify truth, not silence it. They should ask hard questions, not brush off families who have already lost so much. Reading these replies, it's impossible to miss the defensiveness, the sarcasm, and the lack of empathy. But it's also impossible to ignore the larger pattern. When local media shrinks away from its responsibility, families like mine are left to carry the weight alone. And that's what I've been doing for the last three decades. But let's get back to the timeline. In February of 2023, and to my dad. While the Red Rock News was busy shutting me out, my father finally stepped in. For the first time in 32 years, he gave a proper interview. And it Revealed more than I ever expected. A quick heads up before we roll. What you're about to hear is essentially edit free. The only changes I made were for privacy, which when the investigator or my dad says my sister's name, I muted it or I edited out, I cut it out. So the sound might be a little weird in places. I tried to clean it up and I did what I could without altering content. So let's roll.
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B
I'll sit over here, answer your questions.
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C
This is just my status. So Jeanette, I thought, well, if he has any questions for me or anything, I can answer that for you.
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B
Well, one question. It's been 30 years.
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C
I know.
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B
Why now?
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C
Well, because Nikki insists that you want to talk to us. According to Nikki.
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B
That's according to Nikki, not to me.
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C
Okay, that's a really good clarification for me. Really.
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B
But don't tell her that.
- [14:51]
C
I won't.
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B
Because she can be a pest and she's on this roll. I don't understand this.
- [15:03]
C
Yeah, when I, you know, basically when I talked to them the last time, you know, I just, you know, it's like, you know, I tend to let. Let her rest, you know, let Stacy rest. And it's like we want justice. I said I absolutely understand.
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B
I know there's hanky panky going on there, but it's been 30 years and who, you know, he's already living in, he's being punished right now. He's living with mother's house. He's a disgusting alcoholic.
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C
He's Mr. Peterson.
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B
Yeah. He can't function after 2 o'.
- [15:41]
D
Clock.
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B
You know, he's living basically in his own built prison. So what's the point?
- [15:49]
C
Yeah, yeah. I mean, to me just he wets the bed.
- [15:54]
B
Stacy told me he wets the bed the whole shot. Okay, I'm ready to answer questions.
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C
Okay.
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B
So this whole thing to me is just, you know, what's the point?
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C
Yeah, so, you know, the only point is just that like I said, maybe felt that you had information of, you know, potentially new information of why this would have happened. So that, that is, that is why I'm here to, to talk to you.
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B
I did talk to her for an hour and a half on the phone. Hour and 15 minutes or something on the phone before this happened.
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C
Huh? Tell me, tell me about it. And that way, you know, well, she.
- [16:34]
B
Called me up and said she had enough of him and blah, blah, blah, blah.
- [16:38]
C
And well, the blubble is important. I don't know if you remember any of that.
- [16:43]
B
Well, she said he was disgusting and she told me she was having an affair with the pizza guy. And then there was some, you know, she was my girlfriend. So we talked, you know what I mean? So there's an intimate stuff going on there. And then she told me that he had a phone recording device on the phone to listen to phone calls because he was already suspicious of the pizza guy. And I went, what? Well, you're telling me all this stuff. And she said, I don't care. And she was on her way to my house that next morning, so. And she wasn't a gun person. I had tons of guns. I actually worked at a pawn shop, gun shops, all kinds of stuff. I know everything about guns. Sight scopes, all that stuff. And from what I hear, that was a.44 Magnum. That's not something you grab and shoot one time with your left hand. Especially if it's got a nice load in it like a new Winchester or something like that load. That's something that's going to pop out of your hand. I've seen full grown men pop out of their hand. They don't grab two hands. So that left hand shooting thing, besides that, she was scared of guts. We went out shooting. When I worked at the pawn shop, I'd take any gun I wanted, any time I wanted and take it out and shoot at the end of 7th street where they let you shoot. So I had eagles. 44. I had everything you could imagine. Anything that was interesting, I could take it out and she'd sit in the car. She had no interest whatsoever with guns. So her running after the gun and chasing him around doesn't sound right to me. I mean, I wasn't there. I'm just putting this together off the top of my head and what makes sense. And so they got. I figured they got in an argument because of the phone machine. And she charged rap. She was tough, Rock. She was big, strong. And I don't think she would even need a guy. She whipped his ass because he was a pussy kind of guy. And they got in a wrestling match, done one off. He called his uncle, which has something to do with. I heard about this from, from Nikki and it makes sense, but you know, I wasn't there. I didn't see anything, so I can't, you know, but that's what I heard. And so he told her him what to do. That's makes sense. Do this, do that, do this, do that. Make it sound like this, say that, say that. Then he called the cops.
- [19:25]
C
So you think. So the conversation that he might have had with his Cousin.
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B
Uncle. Uncle's uncle. I think it was Uncle. He had police experience. He was some kind of a police experience.
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C
Remember what his name was?
- [19:40]
B
No, I just. I just heard about it and it made sense. The whole thing was kind of pointing to me. That's my Uncle Bob.
- [19:47]
C
Hi, Uncle Bob.
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B
Lights are on your vehicle. They'll go off automatically. There'll take mine off.
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D
Yeah.
- [19:56]
B
Don't shut them off. They don't.
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C
I don't think we're gonna be that long, though.
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B
Yeah, they should go off by themselves.
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C
We probably won't be that long, Uncle.
- [20:08]
D
Bob, but thank you.
- [20:12]
C
Yeah. So, yeah, you know, I know it's been 30 years. I know that. I wasn't even in police work when. When all of this happened. No. But nonetheless, I understand the need for this family to find some closure in this. And. And, you know, we have Niki and I and Wendy and her daughter Stephanie and Detective White. We all sat together and we talked. Here. Yeah. I don't know, maybe a couple, three weeks ago. Because I heard all about it. Oh, I thought we had. We had, you know, an okay conversation.
- [20:48]
B
She said it started out rough, but then got smooth.
- [20:51]
D
Yeah.
- [20:52]
C
Yeah. And, you know, I expected as much, but she was pretty adamant that, that, you know, that you. That you had. Had. Not that you were the last person to talk to her mom, so. No doubt, you know, there was new information that you probably have questions. I. I am ready to go when you are.
- [21:12]
B
I'm ready for questions.
- [21:14]
C
Okay. So I went back and I read the. The information that they typed up from your interview over the phone. And basically I went through here and it says, and I'll help you. Hopefully this will, you know, remind you of that day that. It says that it was on the, you know, the 9th. July 9th was the day that. That all of this happened. Okay. And it was about 1:40 in the morning when the call came to her.
- [21:47]
B
I forget. 10 o', clock, 9 o', clock, something like that.
- [21:49]
C
Okay. Okay.
- [21:50]
B
I can't remember. It was a long time. She was happy, good spirits. Yeah. Certainly didn't sound like any person that was going to be in a conflict anytime too soon. At least knew about it and she was coming back. And at that time, I didn't have a girlfriend, so I was going, okay, yeah, you know, come on back.
- [22:09]
C
Okay.
- [22:10]
B
And, yeah, that phone recorder thing that. She told me that on the phone, I didn't know that because she told me. She said she didn't care.
- [22:19]
C
Yeah.
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B
So I figured. That's what I figured. It probably sounds right to you guys too. I mean, you know, he'd come home, he listen to that phone recorder and he found out several things that he probably would piss off anybody. Sure. Especially if you're a boyfriend and you find out about your girlfriend. See, I didn't know nothing about no pizza delivery guy, but she volunteered that information to me.
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C
Yeah. Did she? Do you remember a name that she might have mentioned of the pizza delivery guy?
- [22:54]
B
No, I have no idea. I'm not even sure if it's a pizza delivery guy. It could have been some kind of guy that comes and fixes the house or something that was delivering something or doing something like that.
- [23:05]
D
Okay.
- [23:06]
B
But she did mention that to me, so I did.
- [23:09]
C
That she was having an affair with.
- [23:10]
B
Somebody else and she had learned some new things and she was willing to show me some. She wanted to show me these new things that she. And that would piss me off if I was on the other side of the wagon there.
- [23:23]
C
Yeah, so, so I understand. Okay.
- [23:26]
B
So that would, you know, seem to be a big motive to be pissed off.
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C
Yeah, no, I agree. The biggest thing is, you know, when we talk about the motive aspect of it, the thing about it is, is, you know, how do we prove this? That's where, that's where there were two people in there. And you know, as far as, as we know, the child, his, his, their child. Not Nikki, but. I'm sorry. Yeah, not Nikki, but they're, they're, they're.
- [23:57]
D
They.
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C
She may have been woken up by the first or the second gunshot, we don't know. But in the, in the recording she talks about, you know, my dad shot my mom, which would, wouldn't necessarily be mean that she saw him pull the trigger or what have you, but rather, you know, a three, four year old child sees him standing there and her on the ground with blood. It's a logical conclusion that this, that, you know, that, that that's how, how it would end. No different than if it would have been him on the ground. She would have said, mommy. But there's with it only being Stacy. Do you call her Stacy or do you call her Stephanie?
- [24:34]
B
Stacy.
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C
So with just Stacy and Peterson in that room, it, it's, there's. With, you know, with him telling us, yeah, I did it. That would, that would seal the deal. Right, but.
- [24:47]
B
Well, he's not going to do that.
- [24:48]
C
Exactly, Exactly. That's right. That's right where I'm at.
- [24:52]
B
Do that and her running and getting his gun. How does that sound to you?
- [24:57]
C
Yeah, I, you know, I know. I mean, I know how it sounds.
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B
And a.44 Magnum?
- [25:03]
C
Yeah.
- [25:03]
B
With her left hand.
- [25:05]
C
Yeah.
- [25:07]
B
You ever shot a.44 Magnum?
- [25:08]
C
Yeah. And it's in it. It's got a tremendous kick.
- [25:11]
B
Double action or single action? Either one of them is going to fly out of your hand if you put a new Winchester shell in. And if you're not grabbing a hold of this. So left hand swinging around with a.44 mag. And, you know, those guys didn't have reloads. They don't know nothing about reloads.
- [25:24]
C
I'm, you know, I have no doubt, just based on the information that you provided, that they were struggling over that gun. It could have been, you know, exactly what you're saying.
- [25:34]
D
He got it.
- [25:34]
C
He got it.
- [25:35]
B
He threatened her with it. And she, macho girl that she was, was going to take it away from him, and it went off and hit. It hit her.
- [25:43]
C
Yeah. But you under. You. You seem very reasonable. And you can also see the flip side of. Of that, which is what I have to think of that if she was even partnering mad at him, I'm leaving you and you have the gun.
- [25:56]
B
I don't see the flip side because I'm pretty sure I can't prove nothing.
- [26:00]
C
I can't prove it either. I just have to see.
- [26:01]
B
But his gun, he went and got it. The own recorder.
- [26:07]
C
Yeah.
- [26:08]
B
Oh, you know, it's A, B, C, D. Right on down the road there.
- [26:12]
C
So these are the questions that I had, and I just wrote them beforehand. So we talked a little bit. We might already have the answer to them or have talked about it, but how much time had passed from July 9, the night of the incident, from the last time he had seen her? Because I know you guys were exchanging Nikki.
- [26:31]
B
It was back and forth like, I have no idea.
- [26:34]
C
Every couple weeks. No idea.
- [26:36]
B
Couple months.
- [26:37]
C
Okay.
- [26:39]
B
But, you know, I have no idea. That was 30 years ago. I have no idea.
- [26:42]
C
Sure. And then how often would you exchange Nikki with her?
- [26:46]
B
Well, whenever we had the chance.
- [26:49]
C
Okay.
- [26:50]
B
Which once again, I can't give you any times or dates. 30 years ago.
- [26:54]
C
Okay. No worries.
- [26:55]
B
When she kicked the bucket, I, you know, I took Nikki and raised her up and all that stuff.
- [27:03]
C
Okay.
- [27:04]
B
Did my responsibility duty.
- [27:06]
C
Yeah.
- [27:08]
B
You know.
- [27:08]
C
Absolutely. When you guys would exchange her, where would that be?
- [27:13]
B
Well, she come to my house on Pony First Avenue.
- [27:15]
C
Okay. All right. And how much time would you spend together at the exchanges? I mean, would it be just like, here you go, nice to see you, talk to you later, and back and forth? That's it? Or would it be like, let's go eat or hang out sometimes.
- [27:28]
B
Sometimes that would be. Sometimes it would be just. That's it. She called me several times telling me she was coming back from someplace back east where she was. And, well, she had enough this, that and the other. And then. And then she changed your mind.
- [27:43]
C
Okay, so it wasn't just on that day that you talked to her on the night that. That she had said that she was coming back to you, and she said.
- [27:52]
B
That half a dozen times.
- [27:53]
C
Yeah, it's over. Over a week, over a month. Over the years.
- [27:57]
B
Over the years.
- [27:57]
C
Over the years. Okay. And so where were you? Let's see, were you. Yeah, that was a good question. So were you guys having an affair during that period of time of exchanges?
- [28:13]
B
Sure.
- [28:13]
C
As in, like sexual encounters and.
- [28:16]
B
Sure.
- [28:16]
C
Okay. Even after you guys had separated.
- [28:20]
B
Sure.
- [28:20]
C
And she was already with.
- [28:21]
B
She'd come visit me once in a while because Peterson. She told me that Peterson couldn't do it because he was drunk all the time.
- [28:29]
C
Okay.
- [28:30]
B
She said he was incoherent every day. They even. She told me that they even had to put blankets on the couch because he falls asleep on the couch at noon, one o' clock, and he pee on the couch. So she had to put blankets on the couch.
- [28:43]
C
Okay. Did you have. Did you guys have any plans of actually, like, getting back together after that phone call? Yeah, yeah. With that one. Okay.
- [28:51]
B
Yeah, she was coming. She was on her way back.
- [28:53]
C
Okay.
- [28:54]
B
She was packing. She was coming.
- [28:56]
C
Okay.
- [28:56]
B
And at that time, I didn't have a girlfriend, so I was going. Okay, come on back. Yeah.
- [29:02]
C
And.
- [29:03]
B
And Nikki was 8 years old at that time.
- [29:05]
C
Yeah.
- [29:06]
B
So at that time it was fun to hang around with her.
- [29:09]
C
What about what about what? Did she ever talk about what would happen?
- [29:13]
B
Well, that she was coming too.
- [29:14]
C
Yeah. Yeah. Did she think there would be any problem with Peterson about that or.
- [29:19]
B
Well, sure, there probably would have been, but I didn't give a crap about him. You know, it's. She's the mom, she's the boss.
- [29:26]
C
Yeah.
- [29:26]
B
When it comes to the kid. So she brings that kid. Fine.
- [29:30]
C
Okay.
- [29:31]
B
And I. I owned a house on 21st Avenue and plenty of room and. Yeah, bring it on.
- [29:37]
C
Very kind of you. How often would you guys talk on the phone?
- [29:42]
B
Kind of often. Once every couple of weeks, I guess.
- [29:45]
C
Okay. And you said I was. My next question was about what? You said that sometimes you guys would talk about, you know, things, intimate things between you guys.
- [29:53]
B
Yeah. She was like a buddy, you know, vivid. She was a buddy. And she was a tough, bra I liked her because she was macho. Pretty sucker, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She hit my. My buddy playing. And my buddy was a varsity football player. And she hit him in the arm, playing around, goofing off. And I was looking, and my buddy. I could see him straining not to go. God damn. You know that, huh? You know, I could see him stranger not to do that. I thought that was funny. I said, I told you, she. She bossed all her friends around. They didn't mess with her. So that's what. That's another part of it, too. She could have grabbed him and threw him on the ground because she was tough. I mean, she stalked me around a few times playing, of course. And she had unusual strengths for a female.
- [30:53]
C
Okay, and so in your interview originally, when you got. When they spoke to you, you said that you guys broke up because you didn't see eye to eye. What did that. What does that mean?
- [31:07]
B
Well, my original interview, we didn't see eye to eye.
- [31:11]
C
Yeah.
- [31:12]
B
You said, no, we broke up because she found Peterson. That's why we broke up.
- [31:16]
C
Oh, is that okay?
- [31:17]
B
Yeah, Yeah. I think she was working at some restaurant, the Freeway and Dunlap. And she'd leave that Nikki with me, and I'd babysit, and she'd be with that Peterson guy, and she met him in the kitchen where they worked making food.
- [31:37]
C
Okay. Yeah. Because on your. It says. He states the reason they broke up was that they did not see eye to eye. And I just wondered what that meant, and now I know. So that's why I was.
- [31:48]
B
Well, I. I said Peterson got in the way, Mikey. I guess he has a pretty face because after her, he got another girlfriend which didn't last very long. You know, pretty face goes so far that your actual way you are goes lots farther. And he was a dickweed, you know, of the. The highest order. So that's the one. You gotta find that. The second girlfriend he had because supposedly he got all drunken up and told her the whole story, the real truth, which is probably what I'm telling you right now. But I can't say, you know, I wasn't there. I don't know. Photobox, hearsay. But that's the way, you know, the cookie crumbles to me. And I'm. I like to think I'm a logical kind of guy, you know, square plague, square whole. You know, my whole life has been reason, logic, don't hurt yourself, stick your finger in the pan, so on and so forth. So A, B and C go A, B and C. And I knew her, she was tough enough to throw him on the ground. She didn't need no gun. And this guy, you know. You know what I'm saying?
- [32:53]
C
Yeah. Perfect. So my next question was, tell me about your guns and the times you went shooting with her. You already did her. You said that her. In your interview, you said that her temperament was average. What? You know, what do you, what, how do you see that? As it says. I then asked daily about her temperament. He stated it was an average.
- [33:16]
B
Is this going off the interview that the cop called me from Sedona?
- [33:21]
C
Yeah.
- [33:21]
B
Well, I just, he wasn't nice to me and he wasn't listening to a thing I said.
- [33:25]
C
Okay.
- [33:25]
B
And he didn't want to hear anything I said. And he tongue lashed me on the phone for giving my opinion of the whole thing. And it was one sided, his side.
- [33:38]
C
Okay. Yeah, I, that's why I'm here, because I want, I want to hear it from you. I want clarity.
- [33:43]
B
He wasn't listening to a word I said. He was all circumstantial, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, you know?
- [33:50]
C
Yeah.
- [33:50]
B
And now, 30 years later, I'm a lot more smarter than I was back then. Plus, I've had lots of time to think about this and I've had lots of time spent so much spending with guns. I mean, worked in a pawn shop, hundreds of guns, take anyone I wanted. And which I did it. She wasn't interested in guns whatsoever. She'd sit in the truck and that's it.
- [34:14]
C
Okay, what was her temperament like overall?
- [34:17]
B
I mean, Sweet.
- [34:19]
C
Okay.
- [34:19]
B
Except for you don't push her in the corner, you know, because she was big and strong and she knew it. So. But she. No.
- [34:29]
C
Was she always sweet or was, you know, she, you know, stubborn? I don't know stubborn or easily angered or.
- [34:37]
B
No, she was average in pretty much every way you could. But she was very strong, very large. Now if you come at her with a pistol, she's going to exercise that.
- [34:53]
C
Strength.
- [34:54]
B
Yes. And her, she boss all her friends around. She tried to boss me around. She tried to boss my friends around. Sometimes she'd get away with it. So she looked awesome. But if you came at her with a pistol, she's gonna, you know, take it away from you. Especially if she knows you can. And she probably figured she could because he was a wimp.
- [35:15]
C
Yeah. When you guys were together, did you guys ever argue? But who don't? Yeah, I just wondered, you know, but nothing serious. Yeah. No fighting? No, nothing like that. And you guys, like you said, you guys broke up because of Peterson and their. And them getting to know each other.
- [35:34]
B
Right.
- [35:36]
C
Did you guys break up many times, or were you. I mean, maybe not even dealing with Peterson, just in the relationship stuff, you know?
- [35:44]
B
No.
- [35:46]
C
Were you guys together the whole time, or did she ever pack up and leave? And I'm never coming back, and then. Okay, we're gonna get back together. No. Okay. And the reason I was asking you because. Is because in the thing, it talks.
- [35:58]
D
About how.
- [36:02]
C
She had come over one time with Wendy and they'd been drinking all night, I guess, and you guys were broke up then she was getting her clothes and she was over here pretty early in the morning, and I guess the cops got called and they ended up arresting Stacy.
- [36:22]
B
That thing. I don't remember that.
- [36:24]
C
You want me to read it? It's. Sometimes you hear it said. It says he stated that they had. Oh, wait. I asked if she had ever threatened him, and he said no. He did say that a couple of years ago that Stacy and Wendy showed up at his home early in the morning to get some of Nicole's clothes. He stated that he had been. That they had been drinking all night, and he called the cop. And when the police contacted Stacy and Wendy that Stacey was arrested, you think she was arrested because she had been drinking? So I don't think he remembers a reason she got arrested, but that she had come over.
- [36:59]
B
I don't remember any of that.
- [37:00]
C
Okay. All right.
- [37:02]
B
None of that. I would have remembered that too.
- [37:05]
C
Yeah.
- [37:05]
B
Because that's kind of a bidding.
- [37:06]
C
Yeah. Do you remember. I mean, was she ever arrested?
- [37:10]
B
Not that I know of.
- [37:11]
C
Okay. About the incident stuff and, you know, from before and that kind of stuff. Would that be right?
- [37:18]
B
That is correct. It was intimate stuff. We could talk like you're talking to your buddy in some bar somewhere and they've had a few drinks and you're letting the tongue fly. You know, that's the way we talk normal with that with her, me and her, because she. I think we got hooked up when I was 21 years old or something like that. So you're pretty loose up here when you're 21 years old.
- [37:44]
C
Okay. And in the interview, you talked about her having told you that Peterson had roughed her up. What. What does that mean to. To you? I mean, what did.
- [37:52]
B
I don't think Peterson could rough her up.
- [37:54]
C
Okay, let's see. And then I talked about you guys in the interview. And I mean, I'm sorry, I keep going back to the interview, and I do understand you're saying that it was One sided. But there were a couple of things that stood out to me. I'll tell you. It says on here that the officer asked. I asked. It says I asked him that. He asked you if she spoke to him about. About you guys getting back together. You stated that he did not think that. Think of that. That was not an option.
- [38:34]
B
He's full of it, okay? Full of, you know what? That's. She was coming, she was on her way. And that's what I told him. I told him a bunch of stuff that's not right on that paper because it was a one sided deal and he didn't want nothing to do with it.
- [38:50]
C
Yeah. And I appreciate you filling it in because you know, I have questions, Jimmy. I wasn't there, so I have.
- [38:56]
B
Whoever this guy is that took that interview on the phone is probably old and dead by now. But I don't know what the deal is, but it sure didn't sound like a non biased interview to me. I mean, and I was on the end of the bias part of it.
- [39:08]
C
I understand.
- [39:09]
B
Of course, I was only 22 or something like that, you know.
- [39:13]
C
Yeah. And then the last thing was it said I asked him if he, if she ever threatened to commit suicide. He stated that she never did talk of suicide. Daily described her as a very strong willed girl. Which is exactly what, you know, what you said. There was one thing that it said. I asked Daily if Stacy ever threatened him. He stated that she would say things like I'm going to kill you. But he always knew she was just joking or did not mean it.
- [39:41]
B
Exactly right there. She was joking. She, she said, she say I'm going to kill you. And I. It was fun. It was all in fun, you know. Then she walk up, sock me in the arm, like ding. Because she could hit her.
- [39:55]
C
Yeah.
- [39:56]
B
So. But it was all in fun. It was. We never had any knockdown, drag out, call the cop incidents, anything like that.
- [40:04]
C
I'm curious. Not for any other reason other than, you know, the I'm going to kill you comes up in Peterson's interview. Those words, was it just an expression that she had regularly at that time, like I'm going to kill you. I'm gonna kill you, but I'm gonna.
- [40:21]
B
Kick your ass or your ass's grass. Any one of those common cliches, you.
- [40:27]
C
Know, that, you know, so it was a cliche. Pretty much. Just something that.
- [40:31]
B
Yeah, she'd say that all the time. And everybody knew it was in fun.
- [40:35]
C
Yeah.
- [40:35]
B
Because that's the way she was. She bossed all her Friends around.
- [40:38]
C
Were you guys about the same age when you guys got together?
- [40:41]
B
No, I was a couple years older.
- [40:43]
D
Okay.
- [40:45]
C
All right. Well, those are all the questions that I had, just for clarification, you know, purposes. And I want to document it, and I will. I'll be writing a supplemental. Do you have any. I mean, I want to hear from you if, you know, what. Did I. Did I miss asking you something that you thought I should have asked you about and didn't? Is there anything you would like to tell me that you think it's important to tell me that I.
- [41:11]
B
No. It's 30 years ago, and I think you pretty much got the drift of what really happened. Your hands are tied. That's what it looks like to me.
- [41:22]
C
I just want to turn every stone over.
- [41:26]
A
Hearing that conversation was wild. It's almost the same story. My dad told me Stacy called him that night, planned to leave. There was a rumor of the pizza guy, the.44 Magnum. That never made sense. But his tone is different. When I'm not in the room, he's confident, unhesitating, and at one point, he calls me a pest. That stings. But here's the part that really floored me. I learned on this tape that my mom and my dad were still sleeping together while she was with Russell. My dad has never told me that in my entire life. To hear him say it so casually to the detective is fucking surreal. It reframes motive, jealousy, and a danger in a way I wasn't prepared for. But to Sergeant Leon's credit, she was measured here. And she finally gets my dad's account on the record, in person. But the bigger picture doesn't change. It took a daughter yelling loud enough on the Internet to make the basic step happen. This interview doesn't solve my mom's case, but it changes the stakes. It confirms a plan to leave, hints at surveillance, and likely a fight. And most shockingly to me, reveals an affair my dad never shared. It also proves something I hate admitting. After 30 years, the only reason anyone sat down with him was because I refused to shut up. If justice means being a pest, I'll own it. Because sometimes it takes a pest to make the system squirm. In the meantime, while the system stalled, I threw myself at the only thing I could control other than being a pest, and that was a camera. I lived on TikTok, posting daily, learning the hooks, forcing my mom's name into the FYP. And by spring of 2023, it started to work. Views climbed, DMs, stacked, and the podcast Invites hit so hard, I had to buy a day planner just to breathe. That spring of 2023 was. I know I've said wild already, but it was fucking wild. My mom's case was featured on the Visitation, Twisted and Uncorked, the Backstory with Rainey Robinson, the Crime Solver with Danny Minor Surviving Podcast True Crime Exposed, Sipping on Some Crime the Crime Diner World's True Crime, Morbid Matters, Making a True Crimer and more. Media wise, 2023 finally felt like a liftoff. Investigation wise, I told myself nothing had happened or nothing had changed. But as it turns out, I was proved wrong. Two and a half years after my meeting at the Sedona pd, I was scrubbing audio for this show, going through everything, making sure I had attached every audio file the Sedona PD had sent when I opened a folder, I swear I'd never seen Calls with Sergeant Leon. Two voicemails and one recorded call. Not to me, not to my dad, not to my aunt, to my little sister. Hearing her voice for the first time in five years was like a door slamming open inside my chest. Then I heard what she said and the air left the room. She wasn't careful and she wasn't polite. She was fucking furious.
- [44:23]
C
Raw.
- [44:24]
A
Clear. She talked about her dad and about the case and about the years we lost to silence. And she did it with the sharpness I've never heard from her. The anger makes sense. I just can't believe she's never said any of this to me. The call is filled with redaction beeps, which I've had to edit out. The interview might feel chunky because of all the private information like names, telephone numbers, dates, addresses that my sister provided to the Sedona PD that I had to cut out. I'm going to play the call next. You've asked to hear from my sister, and honestly, so have I. This is her unfiltered listen to what she offers, what she's asking for, and what she's willing to do. This is another door cracking open, so let's walk through it together.
- [45:08]
D
This is Sergeant Leon at the Sedona Police Department. How are you? I am doing all right. How are you? I'm well, thank you. What can I help you with? So I'm just kind of wondering if there's been any progress on my mother's case. We've done a few things. Actually, several things. I met with your. With your Aunt Wendy and Nikki, and I believe her daughter is Stephanie. Is that right? That's correct. Okay. Yeah, we met at the beginning of the year. As far as trying to track down Peterson and not hard down. You're losing time. He's about to die. He's got. He's got. Just sitting there, about to do another. You guys were losing time. Okay, how do you. How do you know that I would love to know how to get a hold of him because we've been. We've been. I can give you a cell phone number. I can give you a cell phone number. I can give you his address. I can give you the hospital that he's been. He's got enough scheduled. Has now moved. I am not in contact with him. I get my information through my little sister. That's his last most recent daughter. She's 20. She's about to be 21 in September. So that is how I get my information. They're close. Okay. Yeah, that would be wonderful help. I mean, it would be good to, you know, have information on this guy. We. Well, I won't. I'll spare you the details of, you know, the different ways we tracked him down. Called him, emailed him a whole bunch of different stuff. Staked his. Oh, yeah, he's going to be evasive. You know what I mean? He doesn't want to talk to you guys. He doesn't talk about this out all whatsoever. It's something that he's very good about just staying quiet about. Oh, understandably, understandably. But, you know, the information that you have is really helpful. I'm ready to write stuff down if you can help me with that. Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So cell phone number. Hold on, let me double check. Let me look at my contacts real quick.
- [47:04]
C
Sure.
- [47:09]
D
Okay. And that's Peterson's cell. Yeah, that's. That's my. My dad's cell phone. Correct. Okay. All right. And you said he has. That's right. In his. But it's now moved to his. Even a heavy smoker. But yeah, it's moved to his. They did on the took like that went successful. That was just a couple days ago. And now he's scheduled to go in another two weeks to do the other. That's hospital of Osborne and like Scottsdale Road. You don't know the name of the hospital. I can find out. I will have that for you. My sister's actually on her way here right now. She lives in Tucson. So I'll get his. I'll confirm his address because he lives with his mother. How ironic. Is it up? Yes. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Off of Bethany home in like a 21st Avenue right there, right by the hospital yeah, so, so here's, here's a couple of things, you know, that, that I, you know, I'd like to share with you is, you know, of course I can, I can call him, I can ask him for another interview. You know, he's probably going to tell me no, but I happily do it anyway. The other thing is, you know, like we spoke before doing a confrontation call to where you're like, listen, you're getting ready to, you know, potentially die. And I just need, you know, I just need to, you know, know what happened or whatever. And you know, you and I can sit together and do this phone call and, and I mean, that's coming from him. If he was to tell you, you know, what happened, I think that would be closure a little bit for you, but it would also be a huge, you know, benefit to, to finding out, you know, what happened that night. And it's just really one of those things where I would love to, to do that with you if we could, you know, we can, we can, you know, get together and do it. But I know that that's a hard thing for you to do, but you're, you're the key here in that, in that regard because he's not going to talk to Nikki, he's not going to talk to Wendy, but he would likely, you know, talk to you to try to give you closure and potentially give you a confession of, of what happened. What do you think? Yeah, you know, that that might be, or he might just take it to, I mean, he's gone this long and every time I've confronted him about it, he's, he's very good about just keeping very quiet. Uhhuh. Because I don't understand here is how did, how did this even happen? Like how, how, how, how. Please just understand. This upsets me just so very much. How is it that he was never prosecuted to begin with? How the, can there be lack of evidence to prosecute? I mean, I, I, I'm obsessed with these, these stupid shows, the 24 hour crime scene and all that. I watch them constantly because this has been, you know, some, this is my life. And it's, it just, it amazes me that what, what kind of police work is. This is like a joke, you know what I mean? I mean, there's 22 adults in the house. Look at the police reports. You know, you read through the reports. Obviously he did it. Obviously she didn't shoot herself. Well, how the did he get away with it? That's what I don't understand. I don't I. I just. Can you just help me understand that? Sure, Sure. G. Just one. One second. Yeah, so. So here's the thing, you know, with the only people that were. That were actually there were you and both of them. Right. Well, my sister was asleep, but she was. She was there, but she's asleep. She didn't. She. Nothing. Right. It was only me. It was only me, but I was too young, you know. I mean. Yeah, I totally do.
- [51:06]
C
So here's.
- [51:06]
D
Here's the thing, okay. With they. We've actually submitted the case again just a few years ago, but because there. There is. There's no eyewitness. Both of them were the ones that know exactly what happened. I understand, you know, that. That you're saying, you know, there's no way she would have shot herself. And I believe you, okay? But I have to be able to prove. Cancel evidence, circumstantial evidence. Look at her autopsy report. You know, just look at. Look at what's available. And I agree with you. And we turned on all of that in. And the county attorney, not the police department, not Sedona pd, The county attorney for Yavapai county reviewed all of that. Everything. They reviewed all of it, and they just didn't feel that they had enough to prosecute, which, you know, is absolutely out of my control. I mean, if. Who reviews these things? I mean, how. It's. How is it possible that. That you can't. You know what I mean? I mean, how. How is it in this day and age, you know, I watch the TV all the time, that they get cold cases that. That are. That are solved all the time. You know, it's a one in a million. But that does happen. Yeah, I understand. And I mean, I would love to have an answer for you. How is it that they don't. Everybody would, you know, would be happy with me and, and not upset with me because I can't make them prosecute it. If you. I mean, you guys could. You guys could interview his ex wives, family members, people that have spoken with him. I mean, he's cracked jokes to my daughter's dad about killing my mother. Yeah. I tried to track down the. The ex wife and also an. And his mother. I mean, we've. We've. And they just dodge us and they're not going to cooperate with you. That it's a secret that they've buried. To. To your point? To your point. It is a secret that. That they all keep to themselves. How. I can't make them tell me, but I still keep trying. You know but there are slip ups have you talking to ex wives. I mean he's even said to his ex wives. I mean why what go. Why hasn't that happened? Well I. I've tried. I've tracked her. I've tried tracking her down and I can give number. I can get the number to his most recent ex wife. He's. He's said. He said comments about my mother's death to her. That would be wonderful that this is. This, this would be great if you have a name and number because the name that, that I've gotten are. Are either bad numbers. Nobody answers. I leave a message. Nobody returns a call. I track down the number to a place and then nobody's. Nobody's there. It's a wrong address. I mean the, the. I keep trying. I don't want you to think I don't but I'm picking this up after you know, almost 30 years and I'm not giving up. So yeah can. What was the name of your aunt Wendy? Because I don't have my notes in front of me. Had said at one point that he had had a conversation with his ex wife. Has he had more than one ex wife since? Oh yeah. He's got a couple. He's got a couple ex wives. He's got two to be exact. Yeah. What are their names which you. That. That was his first ex wife and that ended quite abruptly because she bought him a restaurant for their wedding and he started the waitress and got the waitress pregnant. So that was all a bad thing. But he ended up marrying the waitress. That's his second wife. Second ex wife. You know what's her name? Her name is. She's now remarried so now it is. She actually lives in Michigan now. But I have, I can get her information and yeah, she. She would probably talk to you guys. I don't think she would have any issues with that. But I mean he said. He has said things to her. Things that made her even tell you know he did it. You know. Okay. Okay. Do you have a new contact number for. I can get it. I can. I'll. I'll confirm when my sister gets here and I'll have to dig for that one a little bit. But I can get that for you. Yeah, I will, I will get that for you. You know and, and what we can do, I mean basically with that, you know I can certainly interview are our bat. You. You are our best hope in a confrontation call with him. I'll be honest with you and everybody wants you know a confession out of him and you, you are my best hope. You are everybody's best hope. And if, you know, if we could do that, you know, I could line out some questions for you, things that you can practice and read with me, and they make the phone call, you know, we can, we can do a number of things to, to, you know, see if, if he'll tell you. What kind of a relationship do you have with him? We haven't talked in years and years, you know, since he refused to go to my wedding. That just kind of confirmed that. I mean, he's never been there for me. He's, I've just been a dirty fucking secret that he's just wanted to go away, really. And so we, I mean, we don't have a relationship as of right now. No. I haven't talked to him in years. Do you think that for the sake of maybe trying to get a, you know, a confession out of him that you'd be willing to, you know, make that phone call with me? And, I mean, I would, it would, he wouldn't know I'm there with you, but we could make the phone call and, you know, you can be nice to him, you know, and say, listen, I know you've been really sick. I just need closure with this. I mean, we can, I can, you know, work with you and writing out all of the conversation pieces to help him tell you, you know, what happened. I mean, if he's on his last leg, sadly, then he may want to clear his conscience, you know, maybe it's been this long. Yeah. I mean, what do you think? I mean, it's all in your hands, really. I, I, I, I think, I think we can do that. I think we can do that. I don't know if it'll be a good thing to do it over the phone. Maybe he'll want to see me in person. I don't know you, but I'll go wired. I mean, I would do that, or wired or whatever. However you guys want to want to play it out, I think I'm ready to, to make it happen. Because my mother deserves justice. You know, I, I've been struggling with this for my entire existence. Yeah, no, I totally get it. I totally get it. And, and I am more than happy to, to, you know, to work with you on, on trying to get justice for her if he'll, you know, if he can just tell us, you know what I mean? So I know I have been. He's just very adamant that, you know, she, she killed herself and yada, yada, yada. I Mean, I know. I know the story that he tells me, and it's just a load of horseshit, you know? Yeah. And that's just the thing. I think that with him being this close to death, if you will. Right. That. Right. I say, listen, this is between you and me. I mean, in the end, you're gonna meet your maker and whatever, but please, give me some. Give me some closure. Let me understand. Just tell me what happened that night. Once and for all, tell me the truth. I know what you told me, but I need to know what. What you haven't told me and. And we go, you know, down that path. That would. That would be good. Yeah. Yeah, we're gonna have to do that. Where do you live now? I live. I'm remarried, actually. I married my best friend, and I live off of. Okay. Yeah. Because I even interviewed daily, you know, and I went down there, talked to him, did all the interviews that I possibly could, but, you know, it's. It's not. He doesn't know. Yeah. Craig, you don't know nothing. I know, but Nikki was adamant that her dad had new information, and I was more. He don't have nobody, has nothing. It's all. The key is. Is Peterson telling you. I hate to put that back on you, but I'm here for you, support you through that conversation for sure. So just. Yeah, definitely write out. Write whatever questions you want me to. To pointed questions you want me to ask, and, you know, I'll memorize it and do the damn thing, you know? Yeah, I'll. I'll wait. I'm working now. I'm working nights now, so I work from 6 to 6 in the morning. Yeah. So if you could work the next couple of days at getting information and just think about what we talked about today. I'm gonna. I. I have a thing that I'm supposed to be doing down there on the 24th of July, maybe. Maybe the day before that or something. We can actually, you know, make this happen, you know?
- [60:06]
B
Okay.
- [60:07]
D
Okay. Yeah. All right. So I. I don't think. I don't think I want to do it over the phone. It needs to be an in person kind of thing, you know? Sure. Yeah. Okay. Well, let me. Let me see what I can work with with my detectives. They have stuff, and, you know, we can. We can talk in the next couple of days. Just give me a call back. Okay? All right. Okay, I will do that. Is that. Is the. The number that you called, the best contact for you? Yeah, that goes right to my cell, to my cell phone. To my desk number. Okay. And I want to make sure that you understand. I work four days and then I'm off three days. And then I work three days and I'm four days. That's all of us. But, oh, to you is that. I worked. I'm working. I mean, I'm sorry. Thursday, Wednesday, Thursday. Oh, no, no, wait a minute. Thursday, Friday, Saturday. No, Wednesday, Thursday. We just started. Literally, like, today's my second day. It's Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Okay. And so if you don't catch me in the next couple of days, the next best day is going to be Thursday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday. So just Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Yeah, this week. And then next week it's Thursday, Friday, Saturday. And then. So is it always changing up on you? It's always four days. Three days. Four days. Three days. Okay. You just don't know which four days. I always know which four days. Yes. This week is four days. Next week is three days. The following. The following is three days. So, okay, I get it. Always Thursday, Friday, Saturday. For sure. Okay. For sure, for sure. Got it, got it. And your PM, so you come in at 6? Yeah. Right. Okay. Yeah. All right. Okay. All right, cool. So I'll wait for your call then. Okay. All right, wonderful. Thank you for speaking with me. And I'll be in contact with you in the next couple days. Awesome. Thanks. Bye.
- [61:59]
A
Now that you've heard the interview, I need to be honest with you. I really struggled with the decision to release this. On one hand, there is still an investigation. There is still a confrontation in the works. Part of me worried that putting this out there could interfere with all of that. But here's the truth. This audio was given to me through public records. That means anyone, a journalist, a stranger, anyone with a few dollars could request it and get the exact same file. So if it's already out there, I feel that it's better that it comes from me, from the family, with context. I've also struggled with it for another reason. Since I've taken my mom's case public, my sister has gone further underground. She wants nothing to do with me. And sharing this conversation will come as a complete surprise to her. That's part of why I've held it back. But after everything you just heard, I believe it's the right time. And let me tell you, when I first pressed Play, I hadn't heard my sister's voice in five years. My first impression, Anger, passion, determination. She wants answers and she's demanding them. That shocked me, because whenever we'd spoke in the Past, she mostly avoided these conversations. Hearing her this forceful, this raw, was something I had never expected from her. You heard the urgency in her voice when she talked about Russell's health, about how little time is left, I guess. He has pancreatic cancer. She was handing over phone numbers, addresses, even hospital information. Things police should already have. And instead of being treated like someone providing evidence, it almost sounded like she was doing their work for them. You also heard how often the investigator turns it back on her, suggesting confrontation calls, suggesting she wear a wire telling her she's the key. This isn't just unfair, it's fucking dangerous. My sister isn't law enforcement. She's the victim's daughter. And yet the burden of solving the case is now being put on her shoulders. And then there was the moment that floored me. I had no idea that Russell's first wife bought him a restaurant and he repaid her by sleeping with the waitress, getting her pregnant and marrying her. What a fucking winner. And then eventually, the second wife leaves him, too. This was all brand new information for me and made me stop and wonder. Did those women ever talk to the police? Did they ever ask them? Did anyone ever ask to see what they knew? So I want to make a direct plea right now. If you're listening and you knew Russell Peterson in any context, if you were married to him, dated him, worked with him, if he ever said anything to you about my mom on that night, please reach out to the Sedona Police Department. They would love to talk to you. Your opinion matters. Your voice matters. My sister also made an important point. Russell has confessed before. Not to police, but to people around him. Partners, ex wives, even her daughter's dad. Third party confessions like that can be powerful, especially when multiple people are saying the same thing. Jailhouse confessions get treated seriously all the time. Why hasn't this been pursued? Why isn't anyone chasing these leads? You also heard her heartbreak. Her voice cracked when she asked the most basic questions. How was he never prosecuted? She knows the reports. She knows the autopsy. She knows our mother didn't shoot herself. And still the answer she's given is not enough evidence. Imagine hearing that for 30 years. The investigator and my sister dismissed my dad's interview. My sister saying, Craig doesn't know shit. That's not true. My dad provided context police didn't have. Like the fact that my mom was planning to leave. That matters. Even Sergeant Laura Leon admitted in 2022, the Fox 10 interview, that she didn't know what caused the fight that night. My dad gave them that missing piece, dismissing him was not only inaccurate, it was insulting. Now, to give Sergeant Leon some credit, she does sound like she wants to help, but not enough. What she's really waiting for is a deathbed confession. That's not investigating, honey. That's hoping the suspect clears his conscience for you. So my overall impression. I came away blown away by my sister's anger and her clarity. She sees what I see. There is more to be done. More interviews, More psychological analysis of Russell's statements, more testing on the gun, more chasing of leads. Instead, the focus has been put back on her. That isn't justice. It's passing the buck. And that's why I chose to share this with you. Because my mom and my sister, they deserve better. Our family deserves better. And you, the listeners, you deserve to know exactly what's happening behind the scenes. And I know what you're probably thinking. Did my sister ever go through with it? Did she make the confrontation call? And the truth is, I don't know. I wish I had that answer. What I do know is that the interviews leave you with more questions than they do answers. Questions I've asked myself a thousand. Did the police ever follow up on the name she gave them? Did anyone ever track down those ex wives? Or did it all just end up here? Another conversation buried in a file? Those are gaps we're left staring at. And they matter. But if he truly is dying, if Russell Bennett Peterson is dying of pancreatic cancer, if time is running out, then I would hope he chooses to do the right thing, to finally admit what he's done. To give the girls who have carried this fight for decades the one thing they've never been given. Peace. Do it for us. Do it for the daughters who have never stopped saying their mother's name. There's one more thing I want to go over with you. The day after the morbid episode aired, I got a message from someone who recognized Russell Peterson right away. They worked at the same company where he was employed, and when they heard his name on Morbid, they cross checked photos online. Their reaction was instant. That is 100% the same man. He's aged a lot, but it's him. And what they described about him in the workplace was chilling. Staff had long complained that he made younger women uncomfortable with flirtatious comments. Servers, some barely in their 20s, felt uneasy around him, and those concerns were raised more than once. He had what they called a snap temper and a habit of snide remarks and a refusal of being corrected, especially by younger women. But the Part that made my stomach drop was this. According to them, he regularly told people in the kitchen that his girlfriend shot herself. Not once, not twice, over and over again throughout his years that he worked there. They described it as a total deflection, the kind of story you repeat when you're trying to rewrite history in your favor. So if you know Russell Peterson, if you worked with him, saw him around town, heard him say anything about my mom's case, or have any tiny scrap of context, please reach out. Your memory matters. Even one line, one date, one offhand comment could help investigators build the picture they need. I put the Sedona PD contact info in the show notes for this episode, but if you don't want to talk to the police directly, send it to me@poppykilledmommymail.com p a p I killed mommymail.com I'll pass it along. All confidential if you prefer. Do not post names or private info in public comments. Contact the Sedona pd please. At the end of the day, this isn't about just one person's memory or one unforgettable workplace story. It's about a pattern. It's about the way Russell Peterson carried himself for decades, repeating the same deflections and leaving the same unease in his wake. And that's why I'm asking if you've crossed paths with him, if you've heard him talk about my mother, please come forward. Your voice might be the piece that finally connects the dots. Silence is what has kept this case cold for 32 years, and silence is exactly what we can't afford anymore. Next episode, we'll walk through the turning point. The viral spark, the rumors, the found sibling, and the moment I realized I had to build my own platform if I wanted to tell my mom's story. And for the first time, if all goes well with my first virtual interview, you'll also hear from Texas attorney Mike Hanson, the very first lawyer on social media who took notice of my mom's case, dissected it piece by piece on his own time, and even built a miniseries about it for his TikTok audience. He'll join me to talk about what he saw in the files and why this case caught his attention. Next up, call to action time. Here's how you can help. First, sign the petition. The link is in the show notes, and it only takes 60 seconds, and it tells the decision makers that Stacy's life matters and the public is watching. Second, call or email the Sedona Police Department and the Yavapai County's attorney's office. Again, the numbers and the emails are in the show notes. Be respectful, but be firm. Ask them to prioritize my mother's case, reinterview key witnesses and pursue every remaining lead. Third, contact the Red Rock News by phone or email. Details are in the show notes and urge them to cover the story from the family's POV There is a community story here about accountability, courage, and a daughter who refuses to let her mom be forgotten. None of this costs much time and it means everything to us, the family. The editor has said he doesn't believe media is public pressure and even brushes off this show as a small podcast. Let him know our show ranks in the top 5% of podcasts and that community coverage is accountability. So from the Red Rock News, dismissing this platform as a small podcast notwithstanding, to my dad finally sitting down with law enforcement after 32 years years, to my sister's voice surfacing in a call I didn't even know existed, this episode has been a crash course in what happens when truth lives outside the headlines. Every piece revealed something different the defensiveness of a local paper, the candidness of a father who never thought I'd hear his doubts, and the fury of a sister who carried disbelief for her entire life. None of it fits neatly together. But maybe that's the point, because what these conversations show, side by side, is that the system hasn't carried this case. We have the family, the daughters, the aunt, the listeners who refuse to look away. Every reevaluation, every interview, every scrap of memory exists because someone refused to let it stay buried. And that's the only reason you're hearing any of this now. So if there's one thing to take away from this episode, it's this. The weight of silence doesn't crush us unless we let it. And in my mother's case, we won't. Thank you for listening.
- [72:31]
B
Whatever team Phi is on has a.
- [72:33]
C
Chance to win a championship.
- [72:34]
D
I'm Christina Williams, host of the podcast in case you Missed it with Christina Williams. The WNBA playoffs are here and I've got the inside scoop on everything from key matchups and standout players to the behind the scenes moments you won't find anywhere else.
- [72:49]
C
It's really, really hard to be the champions, but we have to remember how it feels and embrace the new challenge that we have.
- [72:55]
D
So listen to in case youe Missed it with Christina Williams, an iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and entertainment on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.