NFL Draft With Daniel Jeremiah, Timberwolves HC Chris Finch, Playoffs Are Here And We Have A Thunder Fan Refusing To Wear The Shirt

Summary

Pardon My Take Episode Summary
Episode Title: NFL Draft With Daniel Jeremiah, Timberwolves HC Chris Finch, Playoffs Are Here And We Have A Thunder Fan Refusing To Wear The Shirt
Release Date: April 21, 2025

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1. Introduction to the Episode

In this episode of "Pardon My Take," hosts Big Cat and PFT Commenter delve into the excitement of the NFL Draft, the ongoing NBA and NHL playoffs, and address a unique fan story involving a Thunder supporter refusing to wear the team shirt. The episode features insightful interviews with NFL analyst Daniel Jeremiah and Minnesota Timberwolves head coach Chris Finch, providing listeners with expert perspectives on current sports events.

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2. NFL Draft Analysis with Daniel Jeremiah

Timestamp: 75:34 - 85:00

The episode kicks off with Daniel Jeremiah from the NFL Network joining the hosts to discuss the nuances of this year's NFL Draft. Jeremiah observes that the draft lacks the buzz of previous years, particularly highlighting a focus on "starters, not stars." He notes the prominence of quarterbacks like Cam Ward and Travis Hunter, emphasizing their critical roles despite the limited number of top-tier quarterbacks available.

Notable Quotes:

• Daniel Jeremiah [78:09]: "Defensive line overall, like just numbers. You're going to see a ton of D linemen, edge rushers, DTs. That's probably the largest collection."
• Big Cat [78:35]: "So you just go out and do things that your personnel is not capable of delivering? Or just be that radical and change everything."
• Jeremiah [80:07]: "I think for the Bears, they've invested in that offensive line. They have the quarterback in place, they have all the key positions in defense."

Jeremiah also highlights the depth at running back and tight end positions, suggesting that teams hungry for talent in these areas may find remarkable value in the later rounds. He underscores the strategic importance of arm length for offensive tackles, using examples like Rashawn Slater to illustrate how physical attributes can influence a player's success.

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3. NBA Playoffs Overview and Team Performances

Timestamp: 04:00 - 74:43

Big Cat and PFT Commenter engage in an extensive discussion about the current NBA playoffs, analyzing team performances, key players, and memorable moments. They express enthusiasm for the Timberwolves' recent victory over the Lakers and discuss the challenges faced by the Milwaukee Bucks, particularly focusing on Giannis Antetokounmpo's dominance and the team's need for supporting talent.

Key Topics:

• Milwaukee Bucks' Struggles: Despite Giannis's exceptional performance, the team lacks depth, leading to concerns about their playoff run.
• Russell Westbrook's Impact: The hosts admire Westbrook's relentless energy and ability to make game-changing plays, despite his inconsistency.
• Luka Doncic vs. Cody Rhodes: A humorous segment where Big Cat suggests strategies to mentally challenge Luka Doncic by referencing his past with the Dallas Mavericks.
• Minnesota Timberwolves' Strategy: Insights into Coach Chris Finch's approach to the playoffs, emphasizing defense and adaptability.

Notable Quotes:

• Big Cat [08:11]: "Pascal Siakam needs more respect. He's so good."
• PFT Commenter [15:22]: "What I truly admire about Russell Westbrook is that he has never lost confidence in himself."
• Hank [08:23]: "I feel like the Bucks are just kind of a bummer now because I, I, I like Giannis."

The conversation also touches on the emotional aspects of playoff sports, team rivalries, and the high-stakes environment that defines postseason competitions.

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4. Interview with Minnesota Timberwolves Head Coach Chris Finch

Timestamp: 116:33 - 143:54

In a prerecorded interview, Coach Chris Finch shares his insights on the Timberwolves' journey into the playoffs. He discusses the team's slow start, the challenges of integrating new players like Julius Randle, and the adjustments made to improve offensive performance. Finch emphasizes the importance of defense, player development, and maintaining focus amidst the pressures of the postseason.

Key Discussion Points:

• Team Adjustments: Addressing turnovers and offensive struggles by recalibrating team strategies and player roles.
• Player Contributions: Highlighting the pivotal roles of Rudy Gobert, Mike Conley, Jaden McDaniels, and Nikola Vucevic in the team's success.
• Psychological Aspects: Managing player emotions, maintaining discipline, and fostering a resilient team mentality.
• Matchup Strategies: Specifically dealing with formidable opponents like Giannis Antetokounmpo and LeBron James, focusing on defensive efficiency and tactical adaptations.

Notable Quotes:

• Chris Finch [117:59]: "We've had so many guys with great seasons. Nikola Alexander Walker has been in many ways our most consistent guy."
• Chris Finch [123:11]: "Players have confidence in that."
• Chris Finch [126:02]: "There's a play we might have to execute, and we're fortunate enough to have players who can handle that."

Finch also addresses the team's preparation for high-pressure scenarios, emphasizing the balance between strategic planning and in-game adaptability.

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5. Unique Fan Story: Thunder Fan Refusing to Wear the Shirt

Timestamp: 38:38 - 49:43

A humorous and relatable segment features a story about Juan Guerra, a passionate Oklahoma City Thunder fan who refuses to wear the team shirt during playoff games. Despite purchasing season tickets and supporting the team fervently, Guerra chooses to stand out by wearing alternative attire, leading to playful banter among the hosts about fan expression and team culture.

Discussion Highlights:

• Fan Individuality vs. Team Pride: Exploring the balance between expressing personal style and showing support through traditional team apparel.
• Hosts' Perspective: Big Cat and Hank express both frustration and admiration for Guerra's commitment to his unique way of supporting the Thunder.
• Community Reaction: The segment includes interactions on social media, highlighting different fan opinions and the challenges of featuring non-conforming fans on mainstream platforms.

Notable Quotes:

• Big Cat [38:38]: "There's one thing about this show. We would never have the back of a guy who just sits front row at sporting events trying to stick out so people notice him on the camera."
• Hank [39:27]: "He should wear whatever he wants. That's what our founding fathers fought for."
• Big Cat [41:12]: "He thinks that this guy's shirt doesn't matter, and I do. There's the difference."

The story serves as a lighthearted exploration of fan culture, individuality, and the diverse ways supporters choose to engage with their favorite teams.

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6. Playoffs Are Here: Strategies, Predictions, and Highlights

Timestamp: 49:43 - 115:55

The hosts transition into discussing their "Who's Back of the Week" segment, celebrating the return of playoffs across various sports. They share personal anecdotes, team analyses, and engage in playful debates about game strategies, player performances, and upcoming matchups.

Key Topics:

• Celtics vs. Magic Series: Analyzing the Celtics' dominant performance, Derrick White's standout game, and strategic advantages over the Magic.
• Warriors vs. Rockets Playoffs: Discussing the Warriors' recent win, the Rockets' resilience, and expectations for the series.
• Softball Team Formation: A humorous exchange about joining softball leagues, reflecting the camaraderie and playful competition among the hosts.
• NBA Draft Predictions: Continuing the discussion with Daniel Jeremiah, focusing on running backs, wide receivers, and quarterback evaluations for the upcoming NFL season.
• Fan Engagement: Encouraging listener participation through segments like "Who's Back of the Week" and teasing future content based on listener feedback and social media interactions.

Notable Quotes:

• Hank [67:00]: "I think that Hank just hates the Thunder."
• Big Cat [74:43]: "You got to put on the shirt."
• Daniel Jeremiah [85:00]: "I think the biggest thing was really our offense."

The segment is marked by energetic discussions, strategic insights, and the hosts' characteristic humor, making complex sports topics accessible and entertaining for listeners.

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7. Sponsors and Advertisements

Throughout the episode, various sponsors are featured, including DraftKings, KFC's Dunk It Bucket, Chevy's Silverado Trail Boss, and Truly Unruly Lemonade. These segments are seamlessly integrated into the conversation, providing listeners with information on special promotions and new products without disrupting the flow of content.

Notable Advertisements:

• DraftKings: Promoted as the official sportsbook partner of the NBA, offering bonus bets and special codes for new customers.
• KFC Dunk It Bucket: Introduced as a customizable flavor experience for ultimate dip and dunking.
• Chevy Silverado Trail Boss: Highlighted for its capability and versatility, perfect for weekend adventures.
• Truly Unruly Lemonade: Marketed as the official hard seltzer of the podcast, available in various flavors.

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8. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, Big Cat and PFT Commenter reflect on the day's discussions, reiterating key insights from their interviews and analyses. They encourage listeners to stay engaged with ongoing sports events, participate in upcoming segments, and interact with the podcast's community through social media. The hosts leave listeners with a sense of anticipation for future episodes, promising continued coverage of major sports happenings and entertaining discussions.

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Overall, this episode of "Pardon My Take" offers a comprehensive and engaging exploration of the NFL Draft, NBA playoffs, and unique fan stories, enriched by expert interviews and the hosts' trademark humor. Whether you're a seasoned sports enthusiast or a casual fan, this episode provides valuable insights and entertainment that cater to a wide audience.

Transcript

[Big Cat]

Hey, pardon my take listeners. You can find every episode on Apple podcasts, Spotify or YouTube Prime. Members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. You know that one sandwich you always crave? The one that just hits every single time? For me, it's a simple yet perfect combination. Boar's Head Oven Gold turkey sliced thin, piled high on fresh sourdough with sharp cheddar, crisp lettuce, tomato, a little honey mustard and just a touch of mayo. Simple but the flavors unreal.

[PFT Commenter]

And that's the thing, when you start.

[Big Cat]

With quality ingredients, you don't need to do much. Boar's Head is my go to because every bite tastes like it was made just for me. Premium cuts, incredible flavor and that perfect balance of freshness. So next time you're at the deli.

[PFT Commenter]

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[Big Cat]

Head and build your ultimate sandwich.

[PFT Commenter]

Trust me, you'll taste the difference.

[Big Cat]

Head to your local Boar's Head Deli and experience the craftsmanship behind every bite. On today's part of my take we have two great interviews for the people. We have Daniel Jeremiah, it is draft week. We always have DJ on. We're have McShay on later this week breaking down the draft, who he thinks is going to go in the top 10, some late picks that could be good overall thoughts on the draft A.

[Hank]

Crazy, crazy take that now I'm actually coming around on Travis Hunter.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So yeah, yeah. Shocking one. So really good stuff there. And then we also have Minnesota Timberwolves head coach Chris Finch. We taped it on Friday so we knew there was going to be a game one in between. We told him hey Coach, try to win game one so this is not awkward. And guess what? He went out and won game one for us. We're going to talk about the playoffs. We've got them. We finally kicked off all the playoffs in the NBA and the NHL. We're gonna do who's back of the week Lottery ball. And it's all brought to you by our friends at DraftKings. The NBA 82 game grind is done and now the real fun begins. The NBA Playoffs are here and it's time for all the high stakes drama, clutch moments and jaw dropping plays. If you're looking to make the playoffs Even more exciting, DraftKings sportsbook has you covered as an official sports betting partner of the NBA. From the playing games all the way through to the finals, now's the time to back your favorite players and teams as they chase glory. All season long, DraftKings has been the go to spot for NBA Player props. And that doesn't stop now. Want to make your playoff experience even more intense? Try placing a bet on your favorite player's performance. Will they drop 30 points? 40 or more? It's your call. Ready to place your first bet? Download the DraftKings sportsbook app. Now lock in your bets and let's make the playoff run unforgettable. Here's something special for first timers. New DraftKings customers bet $5. Get 200 in bonus bets instantly. Make it a playoff run to remember with DraftKings. Download the DraftKings sportsbook app and use code TAKE. That's code TAKE for new customers. Get $200 in bonus bets when you bet just five bucks only on DraftKings. The crown is yours. Gambling problem.

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[Chris Finch]

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[Big Cat]

Okay, let's go.

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

Welcome to Pardon My take presented by DraftKings. Make it a playoff run to remember with DraftKings. Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app and use code Take. That's code Take for new customers to get $200 in bonus bets when you bet just five bucks only on DraftKings. The crown is yours. Today is Monday, April 21st, and it is playoff season. PFT. It's playoff season. The Caps didn't have a game, which was.

[Hank]

Yeah, that's tonight. Very excited to watch the Caps in the playoffs.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Nothing like having a team in playoff hockey. It's. It's a lot of fun to look forward to. And then every single second that you watch it, if you don't have at least a two goal lead, you're just yourself. Yeah, I'm pumped to see maybe Wi Fi versus Willie chucking some knucks.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, that's.

[Hank]

That should be a good matchup.

[Big Cat]

I was pissed, though, for you because the first. I don't know why the NHL did it this. This way this year. Maybe it was last year too, but I always love the first weekend of playoffs because it's like, all right, we got eight hockey games on Saturday or eight hockey and basketball games Saturday, eight hockey. Basketball games. Sunday, it's going to be wall to wall. It felt great to have just, you know, noon comes around on Saturday. Yeah. I'm going to watch some playoff basketball.

[Hank]

This truly is sports season. Yeah, this is sports season. Like NFL season is football season because it's got NFL college football. It's great. Your weekends are pretty booked, but this is just sports.

[Big Cat]

It's sports everywhere. My favorite week of the year.

[Hank]

Meaningful sports all the time.

[Big Cat]

It is your favorite week of the year. We also have WrestleMania going on right now that we're gonna comment on at the end. We have it live in the studio. So we're watching Cody Rhodes versus John Cena. I know that a lot of people come to this podcast for our wrestling takes. Yep.

[Hank]

Well, I mean, I'm gonna comment on it if Cody Rhodes wins.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. And if he doesn't. It was rigged.

[Hank]

Yeah. Some.

[Big Cat]

I can't see the screw job scripted.

[Hank]

Where is this one?

[Big Cat]

It's in Vegas.

[Hank]

Okay. The Vegas screw job.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Max, can we make sure the TV's set up? Because I'm sure at some point we're gonna need a clip from you or something and maybe also we're gonna have to. To sim the lottery.

[Hank]

We're gonna just send.

[Big Cat]

We're have to send the draft at some point.

[Hank]

Yeah, no, I'm pumped to watch the Caps and playoffs. I. I do think that this might be our year. And the issue is we don't really have a goaltender. We've got two goaltenders and neither one. You have to pick which one is going to get hot at the right time.

[Big Cat]

And you thought about playing them both the same time?

[Hank]

Well, I, I think that we should employ. If we get a one goal lead employee.

[Big Cat]

The.

[Hank]

The pile.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

The stack where you just. You lay on top of everybody else. In. In the crease.

[Big Cat]

Memes is coming in. Memes has a memes. Two looks are either Luka Doncic or I'm going to break and enter your home.

[Hank]

This is Wet Bandit Memes.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. He really like. I don't know what, what's. What's with what? Are you trying to look like someone who's going to come rob us?

[Hank]

He's got the one pant leg up.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

He's got drugs on him.

[Big Cat]

That could be a gang thing.

[Hank]

It could be. Are you wearing a Bulls jersey?

[Big Cat]

Are you part of Ms. 13? Okay. All right. Let's talk some playoffs. Let's talk some ball. Let's just go through it chronologically because we had eight NBA games, five hockey games, six hockey games. I can't remember how many hockey games we had, but let's start with we had the Pacers and Bucks first tip off on Saturday. I had a take that I wanted to just rip off right away. I think that you shouldn't wear your alternate jerseys, especially like, I think those are the city version for the Pacers in the playoffs. Because someday you will look back and if, like, the Pacers go to the NBA Finals and they have a historic run in 20 years from now, you'd be like, man, I wish they were wearing the old school, like, pinstripes or looking like the Pacers, not whatever the hell they looked like on Saturday with the paint splatter too, at the baseline. It was weird.

[Hank]

If Reggie Miller had been wearing those when he scored all those points against the Knicks, nobody would even think was that impressive.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Be like, what is this, an exhibition game? Yeah, that is perfect for the play in tournament.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, exactly. It's playing tournament.

[Hank]

Wear it for that. Maybe wear it for the in season tournament, too. Yeah, the NBA Cup.

[Big Cat]

Not.

[Hank]

Not a playoff uniform. I agree.

[Big Cat]

I don't want to overreact to game ones. I think the Bucks are in a lot of trouble. I think the Pacers are really good and I'm going to throw out games.

[Max]

Come back, though.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, game is coming back. He got in a little. He actually is wearing a great sweater. He got into a jawing match with Tyrese Halliburton towards the end of the game. Pascal Siakam needs more respect.

[Hank]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

He's so good.

[Hank]

All right.

[Big Cat]

And he's also, like, consistently good. Yeah, yeah, I know. Like, he's consistently so good, but he's not flashy. He's not. He's not flashy. He's kind of a little bit of a throwback. And he's also not a number.

[Max]

He's not a number one of a pretty game.

[Big Cat]

Right. But he's so good.

[Max]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

And he's so efficient, effective. And I feel like the reason why the, the. The Bucks could be in a lot of trouble is Giannis still got all his stats. Hal Burton was not good shooting, and they still blew him out. And it was never really close. And Halberton obviously does more than shooting because he had a bunch of assists and he can control the games in other ways. But I think that's probably a bad sign for the Bucks going forward.

[Hank]

I gotta put my hand up and say, I don't. I don't, at least during the regular season, pay that much attention to what Tyrese Halliburton has going on. But Every time he does pop up, it's because somebody's clowning him.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Does he. Does he lead the league in getting clowned in terms of, like, the upper echelon players?

[Big Cat]

He. I think he is one of those guys that maybe gets picked on a little bit. He also. He likes to talk shit when he's.

[Hank]

Up, and he doesn't really play defense.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. And. But he's. I mean, he's a very, very good player. And like I said, he. He didn't shoot well. He's not a bad shooter. He's not known for, like, being an incredible shooter, but once he, like, if you win a game by 20 plus and. Or I think it was 19 and Tyrese Halberton shoots 3 for 13, it feels like the Pacers might have more to go up. I know Dame's coming back.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

I just. This Bucks team kind of bums me out because Giannis is so good. And did you guys see Kyle Kuzma? He dropped 22 minutes, 0.0 rebounds, 0 assists, 2 fouls. That is so hard to do in a playoff game. In a regular season game. I could see it happening in a playoff game. That is really, really hard to not have a single statistic like a rebound bounce your way. You happen to pass to someone and.

[Hank]

They score, especially a guy like Kuzma.

[Big Cat]

Did you see.

[Hank]

Who has no problem just chucking it dank.

[Big Cat]

Did you see. There was. There was a meme going around. I guess it was from Laker fan account. They had a draft grade after the table. Draft.

[Max]

Yes. Yes.

[Big Cat]

And it had, like, espn, I think. Oh, it was.

[PFT Commenter]

Yes.

[Max]

This is on espn.

[Big Cat]

And it was, like, upside and like, everything. Everything was either Kyle Kuzma tied with Tatum or Kyle Kuzma beating Tatum.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

It was crazy.

[Hank]

Think about it.

[Big Cat]

I'm gonna. I'm gonna try to find it right now, but yeah. 22 minutes, 0.0, rebound, zero sis. That's really hard to do.

[Hank]

I might.

[Big Cat]

I could do it.

[Hank]

I might be able to get an assist.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. I mean, I would probably have more than two fouls.

[Hank]

I would just pass the ball to Giannis.

[Big Cat]

Right.

[Hank]

It's pretty simple.

[Big Cat]

Pass the ball Giannis when he's got a full head of steam.

[Hank]

Yeah. Just throw the ball up in there, let Yanis catch it in the paint.

[Big Cat]

It was. It wasn't his Fans. Lakers Insider. 16. But it was. But this guy.

[Max]

This gets. This gets. This goes around all the time.

[Big Cat]

It was shooting about it. All right, so shooting. Kuzma was better than Tatum.

[Hank]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

Passing. They were the same defense. Kuza was better potential.

[Hank]

Kuzma was better potential. Yeah, I like that. When you, when you think about it, Jason Tatum is the Jalen Hurts of Kyle Kuzma's.

[Big Cat]

Wait, break that down for me. That hurt my brain.

[Hank]

Jason Tatum.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Is the Jalen Hurts of Kyle.

[Max]

I don't get it.

[Hank]

Like, just a little bit more put together.

[Big Cat]

Jalen hurts. Okay. I think I get it.

[Hank]

He's like a cleaned up.

[Big Cat]

Well, no, he's way more than a cleaned up. Kyle Kuzville.

[Hank]

Yeah. Cleaned up.

[Memes]

Jalen hurts plays way better in championships.

[Hank]

Oh, that's a good point for them. Yeah, that's a good point, Max.

[Max]

Jason Tatum had great stats. Did he beat Patrick's finals last year?

[Big Cat]

It's, it's crazy. He didn't beat Patrick Mahomes. He did not beat Patrick Mahomes.

[Max]

He did not.

[Hank]

So I don't think, I don't think he could.

[Big Cat]

Just like, just like Shohei doesn't have a Heisman until Jason Tatum beats Patrick Mahomes. Can you actually say he's good?

[Hank]

Did you see Shohei, what he was doing this weekend?

[Big Cat]

He had a baby, right?

[Hank]

Oh, not that the more impressive thing. Oh, he filled up cups of water for all his teammates.

[Big Cat]

Oh, I did see.

[Hank]

He went over to the water cooler. He poured like 8 cups of water and took him to all his teammates. None for him.

[Big Cat]

Great dude.

[Hank]

Great guy.

[Big Cat]

Great dude. Yeah. I, I feel like the Bucks are just kind of a bummer now because I, I, I like Giannis. I've never not liked Giannis, and it's just, I, he doesn't really seem to have much help at all.

[Hank]

We'll see what happens when Dame gets back. But it does feel like this is, it's the last gasp of the Dame experiment.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. And, and maybe Giannis in, in Milwaukee.

[Hank]

Yeah, probably.

[Big Cat]

He might, he might ask out. I don't know. I don't want him to. I, I also do feel bad. I don't, I don't like the Bucks, but I, I feel bad for Bucks fans having to deal with the, the minute Giannis got good. It's literally the, the prevailing conversation has been when is he going to ask out.

[Hank]

Yeah, he wants.

[Big Cat]

Bullshit.

[Hank]

He wants to play in Miami. Right.

[Big Cat]

Right.

[Hank]

Yeah. Let, let Milwaukee enjoy Giannis.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. All right. My favorite game, I think, of the weekend, you guys would agree. Nuggets, Clippers. There has never been a more Russell Westbrook game. It was the most Russell Westbrook game possible.

[Hank]

The end of that game, the play that Russell Westbrook made Which one? Absolutely. With like 10 seconds left.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. But he. All of them leading up to it.

[Hank]

It was insane. He was actually playing like an insane person. He almost gave away the game. Then the announcer was like, yeah, you know, I got to take the good with the bad. With Westbrook, they didn't spend enough time talking about how insane he went on the court.

[PFT Commenter]

He.

[Big Cat]

So there was a perfect tweet from Kofi, who I think he's a. Is he NBA guy or a streamer? He's. He's very talented, but he. He had the perfect tweet. He said, russell Westbrook truly is the item box for Mario Kart.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

And it's so perfect because this Russell, the best way I could describe it, if you missed this game, if you watch the last three minutes of Russell Westbrook, Russell Westbrook, haters and lovers could both say, I told you so. They literally could. They could literally just point each other, be like, told you so. This is. This is what Russell Westbrook did to end the game. This is like 3 minutes left. This is a back and forth game. He went off offensive rebound in a put back. Then he missed a layup where he was forcing it on a fast break. Then he made a layup. Then he bricked an open three. Then he made a three with 24 seconds left to take a two point lead. And then he had last shot and he didn't get a shot off. Yeah. It was literally back and forth. Awesome play, Bad play. Awesome play, bad play. And also Russell Westbrook, I. I know that he frustrates people. I love watching Russell Westbrook because he basically is the. If you ever ask, like, what if someone tried just the absolute hardest and, like, what would happen? That's Russell Westbrook because he's like his offensive rebound. He got. He was getting offensive rebounds. He was out hustling the entire team. But then he was also trying so hard to make plays that weren't there. And then he would actually make a play that was there. And it was just so much fun.

[Hank]

What I truly admire about Russell Westbrook is that he has never lost confidence in himself.

[Big Cat]

No.

[Hank]

And he's been given every opportunity to lose confidence in himself to just say this, I quit. It's not going to work out for me. People are changing my name to Westbrook.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

And he still thinks at any given time he can. He can go nuclear on any given occasion. Like the play at the end where he got the ball, I think there were like 10, 13 seconds left. All I had to do was just pass the Ball out. Or dribble the ball back out.

[Big Cat]

Yokich passed it to him. It was like maybe. Yeah. Like seven seconds left. He could have just passed it back to Yoke. Yeah.

[Hank]

Or just dribbled away from the basket.

[Big Cat]

Correct.

[Hank]

Killed some clock. And he was like, you know what? I'm gonna jump over three guys and dunk.

[Big Cat]

Oh, wait, you're talking about the end of overtime.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

Oh. Because end of. End of regulation when he just didn't get a shot off.

[Hank]

Yeah, that was.

[Big Cat]

He jumped up and threw it off.

[Hank]

I think that he actually meant to do that too. I think that in his head he.

[Big Cat]

Was like, well, he got caught jumping off.

[Hank]

I think there's a chance that Russell Westbrook thought, you know what the best pump fake is? When you actually leave your feet.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

And then you throw it off the guy's back. Then you get it and shoot it immediately.

[Big Cat]

Yes.

[Hank]

There's a chance that he thought he could pull that off. But in overtime.

[Big Cat]

Yes.

[Hank]

When he got the ball and all he had to do was just dribble like five feet backwards, maybe make a pass back to the three point line, and the game was going to be over. And he was like, I'm gonna dunk on everyone right now and I'm gonna show them. And then he did not dunk on anyone. And it was. Yes. But he's so entertaining to watch.

[Big Cat]

He was just. It was pure Russell Westbrook and Yokoscher's great. James Harden was great. I don't know why Kawhi felt like he was like he had that. He. I think in the second quarter, he scored like 12 points in a few minutes. And then I feel like he just kind of disappeared for a little bit. This series is going to rock, though. Yeah, it's going to be great. The Max just pulled up. Russell Westbrook now has the most clutch shots made by a point guard in NBA history. He definitely has the most missed clutch shots, too. That's why, like, think about it. What other. What other athlete right now can both lovers and haters say, I told you so? And you can say, you're both right. You're both 100% right. That's it.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

He really is so perfect. Because whatever side you pick, you're going to be right. You just got to wait a couple seconds.

[Hank]

I love watching him play, and I'm so glad that I don't have to root for him on my team.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. I mean, he made that three to.

[Hank]

Go up to anymore.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Yeah. He made that three to go up two and. And it was like, this is the Russ. Like, he's the hero, and then he doesn't get a shot off at the end of regulation.

[Hank]

They should. They should pass him around. I mean, Jameis Winston might be in that same conversation.

[Big Cat]

Definitely in that conversation.

[Hank]

Every team should have the. Every fan base should have the. It's not even, like, the privilege of rooting for Russell Westbrook. It's just taking him away from the last team that had to root for him.

[Big Cat]

I. I think it's a lot more fun to watch Russell Westbrook if you do not have. Yes. If you're not rooting for him on your team or even rooting against him.

[Hank]

Yeah. But bad news for the rest of the NBA is Kawhi looks back.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

But he's fully back.

[Big Cat]

I feel like he. He could have asserted himself a little bit more. I mean, this. They kind of. The Clippers should have won this game. They absolutely should have won this game. But I think this series could go long.

[Hank]

It is fun to watch Kawhi when you know that he cares and that he's trying so hard.

[Big Cat]

Oh, yeah.

[Hank]

He is a great, dominant player.

[Big Cat]

Yes. He had 22 points. I feel like I might be wrong, but I feel like he had 12 of them in the second quarter. And I don't know. I mean, James Harden. This was almost a heroic James Harden game, and it is a game one.

[Hank]

Yeah, I was real good. That was game one, not game six.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, it was game one, and Jokers is still the best. Did you guys see that video of Jokic with the little kid? Yeah, that. That. That made me cry. Yeah. Ben Simmons on the Clippers is so funny because he's just nothing. He had a couple rebounds.

[Hank]

Well, he is out there in part, to, like, try to frustrate Jokic if he can.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Just like, push this guy. But that video with the kid in. Jokic was absolutely horrible. The kid giving the money straight to his mom.

[Big Cat]

His mom saying, remember money? What? No, no. It was like.

[Hank]

It was like a shoe dealer.

[Big Cat]

It's like a shoe deal. The guy gave the kid money. He was like, my. It was like a little chubby kid with. With Rex backs. He's like my favorite players. Jokic. I've always wanted to meet him. Guy gives him new Yokich shoes, gives him money. He gives it right to his mom. His mom's like, we're gonna. I'm gonna spend this on you, and what do I always tell you? And he's like, be kind to everyone. And I just started getting a little A Little teary eyed. Then he went to a game and he was like. And Jokic was like, you kind of look like me. Which was very funny. And asked Jokic for a hug. And Yokich, like, Jokic looked happier than he did with the kid. Than he did when he won the title. Yeah, it was awesome. Can you find the kid? Can you find it, Max? So Hank could see it and get a little teary eyed.

[Hank]

That kid is so.

[Big Cat]

Tweeted it out.

[Hank]

He's so pure, so cool. I hope that kid never logs onto the Internet.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, yeah. And. And anyone who's like, oh, this was staged. Come on, guys, we gotta. We gotta be able to. To believe in something. Did WrestleMania end without us realizing it? Who won Cena?

[Hank]

Oh, never mind.

[Big Cat]

God damn it.

[Max]

Yogic and Van Gundy fighting for the ball is very funny too.

[Big Cat]

Oh, my God. I mean, Van Gundy being jacked. Van Gundy being. Whatever it is. Thirty years later and he still. I mean, because obviously everyone was tweeting out him on Alonzo Morning's leg.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

Thirty years later, he's still fighting. Yeah, he. He held onto that ball.

[Hank]

That was one of my favorite highlights of all time, is when he just grabbed onto Zo's leg and was like, stop. Stop fighting. And so was just walking around like nothing was attached to him like a pair of heavy shoes.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. But yeah, Jokic. Jokic and JVG just going @ it, trying to. I feel like the Nuggets or the Clippers, he had a couple people helping them. I feel like Jokic gets into these like once a playoff.

[Hank]

I mean, it was the best when he got into it with the Sun's owner. Yeah, yeah. Ishbia flopped.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, Ishpi did flop. It was. It was like it was maybe on Thursday. Max, it's okay. Hank will find it. Hank will probably think it's fake. Hank will probably think it's rigged and it's not real. And he'll. He'll have some. I mean, what you said about Lee Corso was disgusting. Seeing it in.

[Hank]

Good riddance.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, good riddance.

[Max]

I mean, the Rizzler goes to lots of games. What's the difference?

[Big Cat]

Happy birthday. The Rizzler, by the way, he is risen. He's. Yeah. Nine years old on Easter Saturday was maybe. Clearly don't keep up with your wrist.

[Hank]

I don't keep up. I don't have the birthday in my calendar.

[Big Cat]

Ever had one of those days when it's just too cold to keep working? Nah. Neither has Ariat. Ariat work jackets and boots. Are packed with all the cold stopping waterproof protection you need to get the job done under any conditions. So you can take any job out there and always deliver. Check out Ariat in your local workwear retailer or visit ariat.com work to get 10% off your first order when you sign up for email and weather whatever in Ariat work year. Okay.

[Hank]

Get a knock on your door for that sort of thing.

[Big Cat]

Next day or next game. Knicks versus Pistons. This is. This was so. I know. And I'm not even going to fight the fight because I understand it's a very small minority of like the NBA playoffs suck. Why would you watch that? Listen, any playoffs I'm watching, I just am. But having going from Russell Westbrook to Campaign was so entertaining because this was, this was basically the Pistons first try at the playoffs as it's young core and they were really good for 3/4 and as soon as it got to crunch time, it was like, oh yeah, this is what a hardened team looks like. And Campaign and Jalen Brunson going for 17 consecutive points between the two of them. 21:0 run was so awesome. And Campaign, Max. What? Can you believe that just a year ago, like, think about how many Knicks fans had to delete their tweets because Campaign was the Jalen Brunson agitator last year. And now he and Jalen Brunson are teamed up. You know, being a Knicks legend on his first game as a Knicks legend on the, you know, in a playoff game.

[Memes]

That's all you need from Campaign is just give you one of these games in a playoff and for him to do it on his first, he's. He's ahead of schedule.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

So is he going off too fast? You already burned the Campaign game.

[Memes]

You may have already burned I don't know how many campaigns he won a series.

[Hank]

Yeah, yeah.

[Big Cat]

And his shot looks so bad, but it goes in. And you. Yeah, Max, this was a bizarro Sixers game because it was Campaign going off and then Tobias Harris having 25 points for the Pistons.

[Memes]

Yeah, no, Tobias Harris had his has best playoff game ever.

[Hank]

Were you like, where did that come from?

[Memes]

It's not easy to play in Philly, I guess. I don't know.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, there was so I read an article this morning on the Athletic written by Fred Katz. No. No relation. And he was talking about Campaign and it was like when he got first got to the Knicks, Jalen Brunson literally went up to him, was like, I fucking hate you, but now you're my teammate. And it was Very awkward. And then he. He dropped an anecdote that is so campaign and just so funny. So the anecdote goes this. As a rookie, Campaign didn't appreciate his overall rating in the video game. NBA 2K16, a 72 grade, ranked 242nd in the NBA. So Payne solved the problem himself. He created a new player named the new player Cameron Payne, moved all the sliders up to 99, the highest rating, and played a season that technically had two campaigns, refusing to acknowledge the lesser avatar. And he said, I gotta give myself some love.

[Hank]

I love that.

[Big Cat]

It's great. I.

[Hank]

That that is exactly what I would do if I was in a sports video game.

[Big Cat]

Slider.

[Hank]

Max all your stats out. That's the reason, like, I would absolutely get pissed off if I. I felt that 2K, like, gave me the short end of the stick on my speed.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Like, I would go balls to. I'll be like this. I'm gonna make my own version myself. The one that I'm delusional enough to see. The one that thinks that I'm better at baseball than Hank, and I'll just max out my stats and play with myself.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, yeah. You love playing with yourself.

[Hank]

I do.

[Big Cat]

OG Was awesome. He put Cade Cunningham in a torture chamber and shout, cat played some defense in the fourth. Pistons collapsed. They did. But the Knicks also kind of ramped up the pressure. And I mean, campaign. When Campaign gets going, you can't stop him. When Campaign is. He said his mind went blank.

[Hank]

It was just all of a sudden. Yeah, it just. The game just completely flipped. It looks like. It looked like the Knicks were out of it.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, yeah. They were down eight with, like nine minutes left. Then Campaign showed up. Are you worried about the Campaign game next round?

[PFT Commenter]

No, no.

[Hank]

Hank's not worried about anything. Let me tell you something about Hank. He is cockier than ever right now. Hank has reached his peak level of. I don't give a. About any other team.

[Max]

Why should I.

[Hank]

The. Well, we can get to the Thunder in a little bit.

[Max]

I'm sure we will.

[Hank]

Let's get to Thunder in a little bit.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, we'll get to the Thunder a little bit. We had the. So. So we have Chris Finch, Minnesota Timberwolves head coach, coming up. Interview. Great interview. We taped it on Friday. We gave him some tips for this series, which he might have actually taken.

[Hank]

I think so. Yeah.

[Big Cat]

Because the Timberwolves destroyed the Lakers. Absolutely destroyed them. And really good interview. I. I enjoyed watching this game. Jaden McDaniels, I feel like he does this in the playoffs where he just goes up a level. He was awesome and like Anthony Edwards didn't even shoot well. He was. He did a good job reading their defense. I don't know what the Lakers don't have. I'm not going to overreact. They don't know what I'm not gonna over.

[Hank]

They don't have an answer for Nas Reed. You can have LeBron, you can have Luca, but you don't have Nas.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. What was the. What was the. What was the Jamal Hill tweet where like they figured something out. The lake, like the Lakers figured something out in. At the end of the game here.

[Hank]

Was that against the Nuggets maybe?

[Big Cat]

Because you could make the argument Bronnie, getting into this game, they figured out the Lakers might have figured something out.

[Hank]

They had no matchup. Anthony Edwards, after the game, he was kind of talking about la.

[Big Cat]

Oh, here, wait, here it is. A win is a win. But if I'm Denver, I treat this like a loss. Lakers really figured something out. Putting Hachimura on yic. That's one of those somewhat small adjustments that can win a series. That was when the Lakers got swept.

[Hank]

And I think after that was like just.

[Max]

No, I think it was.

[Big Cat]

No. Last year was 4. 1.

[Max]

Oh, this is too.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. And also just saying the sentence. Rui Hachimura on Jokic.

[Hank]

That'll shut him down. But did you see what. What Ant said after the game?

[Big Cat]

No.

[Hank]

He was like, playing in front of the crowd in LA is fun. It's not hard like in Denver. Like, I've played in some tough environments before. Like in Denver. That's hard. So I don't know la, are you good sports town? You're just going to take this dude.

[Big Cat]

The Timber, the Timberls are deep. They.

[Max]

They roll.

[Big Cat]

Guys out there, they play with so much defensive intensity. They had them like Luca. And we're going to talk. We actually said this to Chris Finch, like, what do you do when, you know Luke is going to go for 30 plus every game and he's like, you know, we just got to make sure it's not efficient. He had 37. They just don't have anyone. Besides, like once It's Luca and LeBron, like, their role players have to step up and I don't know. I'm not going to overreact though, because I did see a stat. I'll throw the stat out there. I'm not going to overreact. So this is fifth. This is LeBron James, 55th playoff series and he's 31 and 24 in game ones, which obviously you're like, oh, that's. Yeah, that's good. He's over 500. It's still LeBron James. Been on some really good teams. He's lost 24 game ones, but he's 41 and 13 in. In series overall. So.

[Hank]

Yeah, so what. What he has done in the past is like he uses the first game to like probe the defense.

[Big Cat]

Yes.

[Hank]

Figure out what he wants to do and then he turns it on a game too. That happens.

[Big Cat]

I'm not going to overreact.

[Hank]

Don't overreact. I am going to agree to disagree.

[Big Cat]

Okay.

[Hank]

With Jay Billis.

[Big Cat]

Oh, yeah. Calling this game, which was such a bummer, turning it on and hearing him.

[Hank]

I didn't know that Jay Billis was going to do NBA games. That's something that there should be like a TV rating that pops up.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Like just Billis's face at the top left hand corner of the screen before the game starts. Letting all the kids know at home, you're gonna.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, just with a warning. You know, it's like warning the jackass. Warning. It should just be a warning. J. Billis is calling this game. You're gonna get a stern talking to.

[Hank]

Yes. Do not attempt this at home. And Jay billis, when. When LeBron started complaining about a missed call. And then Jay Billis goes, Now LeBron's really getting into with the referee. And this is interesting because LeBron's not much of a complainer. Agree to disagree, Jay.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, you're being disingenuous.

[Hank]

That was dis.

[Big Cat]

That was disingenuous of him.

[Hank]

Either that. Jay, you got two options. One, you were being disingenuous. Two, you've never ever watched LeBron James play basketball. Which one is it?

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Because it has to be one or the other. I hope it's not the SEC because you're calling his games. I would think that ESPN would make sure that you've seen LeBron James play basketball. So it sounds like ipso facto you were being disingenuous.

[Big Cat]

Yes, he was.

[Hank]

I don't appreciate being lied to. As a viewer.

[Big Cat]

I'd agree. I 100 agree. Will the timberwolf shoot 50 from 3 every game? Probably not.

[Hank]

Nope.

[Big Cat]

Probably not. That would be your takeaway if you're a Lakers fan.

[Hank]

Yep.

[Big Cat]

That's probably not going to happen again. But on the other side, I always like to early, early playoffs, I like to look for team of destiny stuff. You know, getting, you know, watching all these games, figuring out, you know, what the fan base Feels like. Here's something I love from the Timberwolves fan base. There's a guy on Twitter called Ball of the Wild.

[Hank]

Yep.

[Big Cat]

Who I think is the Timberwolves. Maybe he's, like, runs the Reddit. The Timberwolves Reddit. He does an edit after every win. That's Warren Zevon, Werewolves from London. And it's awesome.

[Hank]

Werewolves of London. Yeah.

[Big Cat]

And he's. And it's. It's just him saying a woo for like, 40 seconds while it's like Anthony Edwards popping up and, like, all this stuff. I don't. Can you find it? It's. He's Ball of the Wild. I don't know if we can play it. You could play it without the sound, and I'll just. I'll just do the AWU so you can see it.

[Hank]

I mean, Warren Zon is like, my favorite.

[Big Cat]

All right, here it is. Ready? Watch. See that edit?

[Hank]

Does he add in, like, different lyrics?

[Big Cat]

No, it's just the whole time. Oh, that's a woo going the whole time. And it's just got cool Timberwolf stuff. Guys dancing and everything.

[Hank]

Love that.

[Big Cat]

And it just says zero day. Yeah. So when they've won a game, it's zero days since last the woo.

[Hank]

I love that so much.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So that's pretty cool.

[Hank]

That is cool. Again, shout out. Will they shoot 50%? Probably not. Will they get another Nas Reed. Nas Reed game? Maybe.

[Big Cat]

Yes. Yes.

[Hank]

I love watching them play. He's one of my favorite players for some reason. You know, you watch. You watch enough sports and you just develop fixations on guys and you're like, I just like that guy for some reason.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Nas Reed is that guy for me.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Yeah. I'm not gonna overreact because I think the Lakers will still be in this series because they have Luca and they have LeBron James. But Nico Harrison was happy watching this.

[Hank]

He definitely was. He said, defense wins championships.

[Big Cat]

That was so funny. On Friday night, he should not be.

[Hank]

Allowed to take a victory lap.

[Big Cat]

I'm.

[Hank]

I'm banning Nico from taking victory laps.

[Big Cat]

Oh, yeah. No, he can't. He knows he can't. But that the. The camera work got. Shout out. Jake Bar. Shout out the guys in the truck. The camera work to zoom in on Nico Harrison when Anthony Davis was limping to the bench was so perfect. And Nico Harrison having the court vision to realize the camera was on him and giving a side eye to it. What a moment.

[Hank]

It was good. Good television.

[Big Cat]

That was a beautiful, beautiful moment. Great television. Nico Harrison, you're. He's you know what? He's off the hook or he. He's been let off the hook by the Mavs not making it. We just need to bring him up once a week. Just put a reminder that he's a and an idiot. And we'll do that for Mavs fans.

[Hank]

I agree.

[Big Cat]

Just once a week throughout the entire playoffs. Be like, hey, remember Nico Harrison what a that guy is? Yeah. The side eye. So good. All right. You want to talk about the Thunder, Hank? Sure. They look pretty damn good.

[Hank]

Hank does not respect the Thunder.

[Max]

Not going to overreact. Right. That's the theme of this segment.

[Hank]

Is that what we do on this show. We don't overreact.

[Big Cat]

We don't overreact.

[Hank]

Correct the Thunder.

[Max]

So we're not going to overreact to wins or loss.

[PFT Commenter]

Okay.

[Hank]

I'll just say a couple facts. Fact number one, this was the biggest beat down in the history of game one.

[Big Cat]

Did you like my new Mike Greenberg?

[Max]

We also.

[Hank]

What's your new rule?

[Big Cat]

If you win a game won by 50 points, the series should be over. Because when this game was such a blowout, it was like 30 points at half. How much more exciting would it be in the second half if the Grizzlies were literally fighting to keep the series alive and the. And the. And the Thunder were like, no, we're going to finish this series in one game.

[Hank]

I feel like a lot of teams would try to win by 50 points.

[Big Cat]

It would be awesome.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

To just. That's it's only game one. It's got to be exactly 50 or more. Or 50 or more. If you win the game one by 50. Series over. We've seen enough.

[Max]

I like that.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Just be done with it and just have that be like something in the back of your head every game one.

[Hank]

And the way they. They did this was they won by more than 50 points and they had their starters out like they. They took their foot off the gas big time.

[Big Cat]

If you told me before the game that Marvin bagley would go 8 for 8 from the field and score 17 points and SGA would go 4 for 13 from the field and score 15 points, I'd be like, probably thunder still one because they're just better. But man, that was a close game.

[Hank]

Yeah. They didn't even get a SGA game.

[Big Cat]

He was 4 for 13 and they won by 50. And it was never. Wasn't close. I mean, the first quarter was a little. No, the first. No, the first five minutes maybe was close. After that, it was just an absolute beatdown. And Guess what? The Thunder have played the Grizzlies four times this year. They've beaten them like not 50 points, but they've beaten them soundly every time. This series I will overreact. Overdone. See ya.

[Hank]

See ya.

[Big Cat]

Next one.

[Hank]

Yeah, this series, I agree with that. 51 points. Game 1. Ja said that there's only one way to go and that's up. It won't get worse is what John Moran said.

[Big Cat]

Oh, it could get worse.

[Hank]

I think it could get worse because they, they again took their foot off the gas for much of the second half after that first run, it was over.

[Big Cat]

There was a moment in the game where our good friend, friend of the program, Alex Caruso had zero points and I think his plus minus was 27.

[Hank]

Yeah. How many points did he end up with? Because it. He didn't score much, if at all.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Can you scroll down? It was just such an ass kicking. Yeah. Zero points. Finished with zero points, plus 30.

[Hank]

That's awesome.

[Memes]

Desmond Bain with a minus 50. That's an insane plus minus.

[Big Cat]

So that is insane.

[Hank]

Would you like another set?

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Because we're not going to overreact. We're just going to talk stats.

[Max]

If you're asking me if I want it, I don't.

[Big Cat]

You don't want to start.

[Max]

I'm sure you're going to say it.

[Big Cat]

You don't want to talk ball with the boys. We're not going to over.

[Hank]

Okay, I'll just ask you. Let's. We'll change the subject. Maybe you can give a stat. What was the Celtics record against the Thunder this year?

[Max]

Oh, and two.

[Hank]

That's a set.

[Max]

Good set.

[Hank]

Yeah, good set. But you're not worried at all. In fact, you're, you're. Some would argue that you're slightly disrespectful of the Thunder.

[Max]

No, it's not that. Pft. I just, I know the playoffs. Like there's. There's a lot of basketball to be played. They're in a separate conference. I think once we get to the Western Conference finals, then I'll, you know, tune in on the two teams and depending on how they're playing in the Western Conference finals, I'll determine whether or not I'm worried. But first round, game one, A lot of basketball to be played, a lot of good teams in the West. We'll see what.

[Big Cat]

See it happens.

[Hank]

So Chet Holmgren said, at the end of the day, we can't control what people say, what narratives y'all come up with. That's Yalls job. So That's. That's your job, Hank. Chad said it's your job to come up with the narrative.

[Max]

That's Yalls job. Will come up with a narrative like you did last year with the Timberwolves and the Nuggets, who didn't even end up making it to the final.

[Big Cat]

That's true. That's a good point. We were wrong.

[Max]

Hey, guess what?

[Big Cat]

We were wrong.

[Max]

The Thunder, when we were wrong. They have to make it there first.

[Hank]

But you were. You were worried about the Nuggets last year.

[Memes]

You, too, have to make it there first.

[Hank]

Good point, Max.

[Max]

Yeah, that's true. And that's what I'm focused on. I'm not worrying about other teams. I'm worrying about my team, the Boston Celtics.

[Memes]

That's not what you're focused on.

[Max]

Yes, it is. Do you know we're focused on the next game.

[Big Cat]

The lottery. Pull it up. Yeah. One point. Bulls went up to 1.7%.

[Hank]

That's huge.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Doubled it.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, because the Heat got in.

[Hank]

All right. Simmet.

[Big Cat]

Sim. That. Brooklyn boom. We'll do it till one of the three gets it. Philly.

[Hank]

Philly.

[Big Cat]

Philly's winning this too much.

[Hank]

I know. I don't like it with the 10.

[Memes]

Now, there's no way they let Philly win. I just hope they. They let us keep our pick.

[Hank]

The NBA should step in and be like, you guys made a mockery of the load management this year. A mockery? He's spitting Adam Silver's face.

[Memes]

Injuries or injuries.

[Hank]

I don't know.

[Memes]

You want me to say?

[Big Cat]

Should we? So I've made you guys aware of this. As a journalist, I was doing some work on Friday night. Really awesome life I have. Super exciting. There's a guy who has season tickets to the Thunder who sits front row, I think has actually been to every Thunder game since their existence. Who refuses to wear the shirt.

[Hank]

Mm.

[Big Cat]

So this guy, Juan Guerra, I actually reached out to him, trying to get him on the show. He's gone radio silent on me. I think I might have tweeted too much about how he needs to wear the shirt.

[Hank]

He realized it was not going to be a friendly interview.

[Big Cat]

It was probably not going to be. It was going to be a contentious interview because I also had Thunder fans being like, don't give this guy any shine. I was like, dude, we're going to have him on. Listen, there's one thing about this show. We would never have the back of a guy who just sits front row at sporting events trying to stick out so people notice him on the camera.

[Hank]

Absolutely not.

[Big Cat]

We would never have that guy's back.

[Hank]

But. So we can do good cop, bad cop.

[Big Cat]

I.

[Hank]

We just.

[Big Cat]

I still want him on.

[Hank]

Yeah, we could make it. Make a personal clip for me out of this, and I will send it to this guy. I think he has the right to wear whatever he wants. He pays for the tickets courtside, right?

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

So he pays just like anybody else to get in. And he's not a fucking conformist. He thinks for himself. He's a good guy. We need more of that in today's society. We should all be free to wear whatever we want to wear and sit courtside. And he's still a fan of the team.

[Big Cat]

You gotta wear the shirt.

[Hank]

Let this. No, no, no, Big Cat.

[Big Cat]

You gotta wear the shirt.

[Hank]

He should wear whatever he wants. That's what our founding fathers fought for. If every. If everyone in America in 1776 was like, yeah, we'll just put on the red coats, you know what? We'd all be speaking British right now. We'd be talking English instead of American.

[Big Cat]

You gotta wear the shirt.

[Max]

Football.

[Big Cat]

You gotta wear the shirt. The. So this. I was made aware of this by our good friend Ryan Rosillo on Friday night. This was the tweet that he sent out. Yeah, that's the guy. He doesn't wear the shirt. He doesn't wear the shirt. Look at that. He's just wearing a different shirt, trying to stick out. And that's his friend. He takes the game. Who at least wears the right color, but he doesn't wear the shirt either. Juan Guerrero wrote on Friday night. I think he might have deleted this. I'm gonna say this in the most respectful way possible. Mention to another grown man what he should be wearing at any point in his life will get you immediately blocked.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

That means even a Thunder playoff shirt, you may as well just block me first. Versaille then got blocked within, like, five minutes. And I was like, I'm gonna try to get this guy on. But, yeah, I. I did. I did reach out to him as a big J journalist, and he. He initially agreed, and since then, he's. He has not responded. So, yeah, I think I. I'm a big. You got to wear the shirt guy.

[Hank]

I'm going to take this guy's side just because it's working so far.

[Big Cat]

I'll tell you what, the Thunder are going to lose a playoff game at home in this run, and it's because this guy's not wearing the shirt.

[Hank]

They might not, though. That good.

[Big Cat]

That's why it's going to be. It's going to be. You got like, you look out, there's this intimidating crowd. Everyone's wearing the shirt and that guy's not wearing the shirt.

[Hank]

There's a reason why it might be.

[Max]

The first team to ever go undefeated the playoffs.

[Big Cat]

Not with this guy not wearing a shirt.

[Hank]

There's a reason why they were the first team that was put on Wendy's Cities when he was buying the hotel rooms. Very. The Oklahoma City Thunder were number 1A on Windler's list.

[Big Cat]

Was that true?

[Hank]

I think that was the first one.

[Big Cat]

They said to us, okay, he might have. I don't know if he put Boston on first.

[Hank]

I mean, they had. They had a historic regular season.

[Big Cat]

They did. They were very, very good. But this guy's shirt, him trying to be. You're not gonna lose a game at home, Hank. They are no.

[Max]

Pft.

[Big Cat]

Well, he thinks that this guy's shirt doesn't matter, and I do. There's the difference. Do you know that they let you exchange a shirt if they give you the wrong size?

[Hank]

No.

[Big Cat]

That's how good they are with the shirts in Oklahoma City.

[Max]

Any other place always bothers me.

[Big Cat]

What?

[Max]

When you're just like. You're like, oh, it's a cool shirt. Oh, it's a small.

[Big Cat]

They have. They have a kiosk that you can go. And you'd be like, you gave me a small. I need an xl. Boom, there you go. There's the shirt. Any other city, I'd be like, listen, some people wear the shirt, some people don't wear the shirt. Oklahoma City does one thing. They wear the shirt.

[Hank]

What is their shirt budget per game?

[Big Cat]

It's got to be insane.

[Hank]

It's got to be tens of thousands of dollars.

[Big Cat]

It's got to be fucking.

[Hank]

And then somebody, some poor person's job is to just put those shirts on every single seat.

[Big Cat]

You know what? Not some poor person. I bet you that guy or girl is essentially royalty in Oklahoma City. She's got you walk in, you. You. I guarantee you there's. There's some kid in. In middle school right now in Oklahoma City listening to this podcast, Shout out this kid. And he's like, yeah, my mom is friends with a guy who puts out the shirt.

[Hank]

Do you think that the guy that doesn't wear the shirt, does he get on his. Well, first of all, do they even in between quarters have like the T shirt cannon to fire out more shirts?

[Big Cat]

They probably do.

[Hank]

Or somebody that throws out an extra shirt.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

And if so, does this guy Stand up and try to catch the shirts.

[Big Cat]

No, he doesn't. He refuses to wear the shirt.

[Hank]

I know, but does he try to take away shir. He might wear that. That I would have a problem with.

[Big Cat]

I just. You got to put on the shirt. It's crazy. Hank.

[Max]

This is your pft.

[Big Cat]

You don't think he should wear the shirt?

[Max]

Why conform? Do what he wants to do.

[Big Cat]

This is Oklahoma City, dude.

[Max]

It's a free country.

[Big Cat]

They are known for their shirts. You got to put on the shirt.

[Max]

Where has it gotten them?

[Big Cat]

I mean, the best. No, no.

[Max]

Where's it gotten.

[Big Cat]

Where's it gotten him? He's gone to every single game.

[Max]

He paid for those tickets.

[Big Cat]

But I'm saying what you said. Where's it gotten him? You don't know how high the Oklahoma City Thunder can go if he puts on the shirt. They literally have never won anything with him.

[Hank]

Might be the missing piece.

[Max]

Be a real shame if this guy.

[Big Cat]

He's peacocking out there and what if he puts on the shirt and they win it all?

[Max]

I don't think he should put on the shirt.

[Big Cat]

Why?

[Hank]

Hank? Hank is just. You were. You were going line by line. You were like ever to a man. The Thunder don't have a single guy that's better than anyone on the Boston Celtics. Literally. What you said the biggest Max. Is that not what he said?

[Max]

Let's go guy for guy. I did not say that. Not even close.

[Big Cat]

You went guy for guy.

[Hank]

He said, let's go. Yes, Hank did.

[Max]

I didn't. But I did not say the words.

[Big Cat]

The.

[Max]

The Thunder don't have a single person. But I just said, let's go guy for guy. I was just trying to.

[Big Cat]

You guys.

[Max]

Max was like.

[Hank]

You said guy for guy. Everyone on the Celtics beats everyone.

[Big Cat]

You just said.

[Max]

Did I say that?

[Memes]

Team is healthy. There's no way they lose.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Memes]

And then I said, you're not worried about the Thunder? And you said, absolutely not.

[Big Cat]

Are you going to go guy for guy?

[Max]

We did go guy for guy.

[Big Cat]

I would like to judge.

[Memes]

It was closer than you thought.

[Big Cat]

Do you have Dave Portnoy in the Guy you won't put on the shirt?

[Max]

No.

[Big Cat]

Okay, well, you should put that in the guy for guy off. All right, Go.

[Max]

I'm not. I don't want to do this again.

[Big Cat]

You don't want to go for stat.

[Max]

Guy for guy.

[Big Cat]

Just go guy for guy.

[Max]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

Pft. Would you like to start?

[Hank]

Yeah, let's go guy for guy. I'll start with. I don't know. I'll say Hartenstein against Al Horford.

[Max]

I'll take Al Horford. Way better playoff experience. Veteran player, big time player, clutch.

[Hank]

What are the stats? Who's got better stats again?

[Max]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

Okay, big cat. Who.

[Max]

Who wins?

[Big Cat]

I mean, I would take heart and sign right now.

[Hank]

Right now.

[Big Cat]

Al Horford's pretty old. Al Horford is a better player overall in his career.

[Hank]

Correct.

[Max]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

By far.

[Max]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

Okay.

[Hank]

Chris Staps and Chet.

[Big Cat]

I would go. Chris Saps.

[Hank]

I would lean Chat. Lou Dort, Peyton Pritchard, Ludor, Derek White.

[Big Cat]

I'm a deutsche chamber guy. So you know that the answer to that.

[Hank]

Listen, I love.

[Big Cat]

I love Lou Dor.

[Hank]

The Celtics have a great team. I'm not even saying that I would doubt the Celtics. I'm just saying you should respect the Thunder.

[Max]

I respect them.

[Hank]

You always see the thunder before you hear it.

[Max]

I respect the thunder.

[Big Cat]

Good point. You know, if the Thunder won't get. Don't get the lightning.

[Max]

Will the Thunder win the Western Conference? I will start to think you were.

[Memes]

Not respecting the thumb.

[Hank]

You're not.

[Memes]

The way this.

[Max]

You're not into my conference.

[Memes]

But the way this conversation started was you were like, there's no way this Celtics team is losing if they are healthy. That was like, you're not worried about anyone.

[Max]

That's a fact.

[Memes]

You said no, And I was like, you're not worried about the Thunder? And you said, no, I'm not worried about it.

[PFT Commenter]

That is.

[Memes]

That is zero respect.

[Hank]

It's an easy way to get.

[Max]

No.

[Big Cat]

That's.

[Hank]

That's.

[Max]

That's incorrect. That's.

[Memes]

You said there is no way that.

[Max]

Tremendous respect for the Celtics and supreme confidence in my team. That doesn't mean I don't respect the Thunder. I just believe in our guys.

[Hank]

I think that Hank just hates the Thunder. You guys don't understand. You hate the Thunder because it's the only thing that can get you to stop playing golf.

[Big Cat]

Sounds like you're in the torture chamber right now.

[Max]

No, the.

[Big Cat]

It's the.

[Max]

It's round one of the Western Conference finals. There's a lot of good teams in the West. It's not just Thunder. Have not this. This iteration of thunder haven't done it.

[Big Cat]

Jack. Sh.

[Hank]

It is round one, and it is game one.

[Memes]

No team has done jack until they do jack. Last year, the Celtics did not do jack.

[Big Cat]

Okay?

[Max]

What the Thunder do last year?

[Memes]

What going to last year, the Celtics haven't done jack.

[Max]

They made it to the finals.

[Memes]

What are you talking about? What the does that mean?

[Max]

It means you won the Eastern Conference.

[Big Cat]

That's Pretty.

[Memes]

Which is a lot easier to do than the Western Conference.

[Big Cat]

So you scared? Okay. How the Philadelphia 76ers done?

[Hank]

He asked you a fact. We're not talking about the Philadelphia in the fact.

[Max]

If the Easter conference is.

[Memes]

How are we talking about the Philadelphia seven?

[Max]

How come the Sixers can't even make it to the finals of the Eastern Conference? Because you said the Easter conference is so easy.

[Big Cat]

I think we can all agree that this guy has to put on the shirt because the minute this argument happened was because we started talking about the shirt. That's where the. That's where the anger came out in this podcast.

[Hank]

Listen.

[Big Cat]

Because this guy won't put on a shirt.

[Hank]

We're divided enough as a nation right now. We can't have another debate like this. We can't.

[Big Cat]

And Hank, does that feel good, boys?

[Hank]

Hank gets too wound up. Look at you. Emotional.

[Big Cat]

Well, you did you. We're all trying to find the guy who w. No, I'm not wound up.

[Max]

It's just like you guys this.

[Hank]

I was shocked.

[Max]

I was on this show. I was taking it over and over and over and over again when it's.

[Big Cat]

Like, you guys, are you worried? Are you worried? Are you worried? Are you worried?

[Max]

Oh, they lost the Celtics.

[Memes]

Like they're this five time dynasty. They've won one finals.

[Big Cat]

Which.

[Max]

When was that Finals? Oh, the most recent one. Always defending champions.

[Memes]

But like, you know how hard it is to repeat.

[Max]

Yeah, I do.

[Memes]

So, like this isn't.

[Big Cat]

You're.

[Memes]

You're looking at this like it's a foregone conclusion.

[Max]

I'm happy that we have confidence.

[Big Cat]

I'm happy we have Max. Max has just entered the NBA playoffs.

[Memes]

I did my whole NBA playoffs is anti Celtics. That is my NBA player.

[Big Cat]

Welcome to the NBA playoffs, man.

[Hank]

I just care so much about Hank that I'm trying to warn him against the. The thunder, the dangers of hubris right now.

[Max]

Again, if they were in our conference, I would be like, you know, it'd be a different story.

[Hank]

But like, you're flying too close to the sun. You got to respect your thunder.

[Max]

It's not going to be till June. Why would I be concerning myself?

[Hank]

Because they're going to remember this. That's Yalls job to do the narrative. That's what Chet Holmgren said. And Yalls have done quite a job.

[Big Cat]

Why are you hitting with the y'alls?

[Hank]

Well, that's what Chad said. So that's what. That's Yalls job. Yalls.

[Big Cat]

Hank, you're getting hit with some.

[Hank]

Y'alls have have put up quite the. Quite the bulletin board material. I hope that they see this in oklahom.

[Max]

Okay, me too.

[Big Cat]

I do too. Because I hope that everyone sees this and says, put the shirt on, dude. Yeah, put it on. Put it on.

[Max]

You guys are now making me root against the Thunder.

[Memes]

You should want to root against the Thunder.

[Hank]

Yes.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, you should.

[Hank]

They're good.

[Big Cat]

They're really good.

[Hank]

You weren't previously rooting. Who, who are you most afraid of in the West?

[Big Cat]

Clippers.

[Hank]

He said Clippers 1. Thunder 2.

[Max]

Thunder 2. I mean personally just like, although not really, it's not really statistical based, but LeBron. LeBron.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Max]

Scare me. Yeah, that would scare me.

[Big Cat]

You want to talk about the Celtics game? Yeah. Celtics 103, Magic 86. This is why the Celtics are really fucking good. Because their fourth option is Derrick White and he had 30 points.

[Hank]

Derrick White was awesome to that.

[Big Cat]

Listen, you could say, you can, you can say anything you want about the Thunder. If you go after Lou Dort, I will fight you.

[Max]

Okay?

[Big Cat]

I love Lou Dort. The guy brings energy. He hits threes. Big threes.

[Hank]

Defense, defense.

[Big Cat]

He's got fat ass. He's Canadian.

[Max]

I understand, I understand. It's hard to repeat. I do believe truly from the bottom of my heart. And I'm probably going to say this statement over and over and over again when this debate keeps coming up every show and it's like, are you worried about this team because they won one game? What Celtics maybe lose one game? Are you worried answer is going to be no. This team is better than the team last year that won the championship. And if they stay healthy, they will repeat. That is my wholehearted belief.

[Hank]

Porzingis does look fully healthy. Yeah, he's making great plays on defense. And Derek White's defense is obviously incredible.

[Big Cat]

Did you.

[Hank]

He's hitting threes. What, what do you shoot from three today? Because I feel like he made every single one four out of his first six or something when he was shooting like that. And then they put Pritchard in the game and Pritchard just goes out there and starts toying with the defense. It. Listen, the Magic's team defense is very good and I feel like they can be competitive. But at times it did feel like the Celtics were like with them a little bit.

[Big Cat]

The Magic just have. They have two guys really good. Wagner and, and Paolo are really, really good. And the rest of their team, I mean think about it. Their. I think their third leading scorer was Jonathan Isaac was seven points. You can't, you can't beat a Celtics team that has Derrick White is. Again, Derrick White is not like saying. It's not disrespect to say he's their fourth option, because that's just what he is. He scored 30 points and he was awesome. And Tatum and Jalen Brown did not shoot well. And it does not matter because they have so many guys.

[Max]

So many guys any given night.

[Big Cat]

Are you worried about Jason Tatum's wrist?

[Max]

No. He got X rays. He said they came back negative.

[Big Cat]

Are you worried that his mom's gonna try to fight a team? No.

[Max]

It's a good thing.

[Big Cat]

That was very funny. His mom said, you want me to go in that locker room?

[Hank]

It's a good mom.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Really good mom.

[Max]

I'm excited.

[Big Cat]

How many tweets did you get being like, panic button at halftime?

[Max]

I got a few. A decent amount.

[Big Cat]

That's. That's premature. Guys, you gotta listen. We're gonna get to the panic button stuff. When, like, the Cavs win a couple games against the Celtics or maybe when the Knicks are one and one. If the Knicks win one one of the first two games. So you can't do it. Halftime against the Magic.

[Hank]

Going back into my old Hank knows ball files. You pretty accurately predicted the playoffs last year in terms of how many losses you were going to have this year. What do you say it's going to be prior to the NBA Finals? How many losses total will you have?

[Big Cat]

Good question. Three. Three. One in the second round, two in the four. Third round.

[Max]

I would say two and a half. I mean, I would take the under. I would set the line at two.

[Big Cat]

And a half, and you take the under.

[Hank]

Do you think the Cavs are going to take two off you?

[Max]

I don't know. I don't think the Cavs are even going to make it.

[Big Cat]

Oh. Should we talk? I mean, they. They beat the shit out of the Heat.

[Max]

Yeah, the Heat.

[Big Cat]

This is why the play. I mean, the Heat are. The Heat are just not like, what are we doing? Heat were not a good team during the regular season. They won the play in. I mean, I guess the Heat were the best of the other plan. They proved that on Friday night. Trey Young is just. I don't know how Hawks fans do it. His. His just standing around, last few possessions having guys get rebounds over him. It was. It was brutal to watch. And it was. I just don't know how you do that. I don't know how you root for that guy. And Davion Mitchell basically out hustled him. And the end of that game was unbelievable.

[Hank]

It was Just a win for Heat culture.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. But then they had to play the Cavs today, and guess what? A Cavs team that won, what, 60 plus games versus a Heat team that is under six games, under.500. Yeah. The Cavs are better than the Heat.

[Max]

There's also got to be something to be said that the Grizzlies and Heat getting blown out has something to do with the fact that they had to.

[Big Cat]

Play all week on Friday. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Hank]

I'd say probably.

[Big Cat]

That's probably fair. But still, I don't think the Cavs are so much better than the Heat.

[Hank]

I don't think it's going to be a sweep, though. I think that the Heat are going to win one, maybe two.

[Big Cat]

The Cavs are so much better than the Heat. I would take the under on two. I think the Cavs are a lot better than the Heat, and they've been very good all year. And the Heat or not, I mean, there's not a very good team. They're under.500.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

I don't know what else to say. Like you. When you're under.500, you're. We've proven over 82 games. You're not that good of a team. Yeah.

[Hank]

And SPO has to be going out there understanding that he's probably going to lose every night.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. And Donovan Mitchell was awesome. Scored 30. Yeah. I think the Cavs are a very good team. And then we have. We're watching right now. The warriors kind of welcome the Rockets to the NBA playoffs.

[Hank]

Are the warriors officially back? Yeah, I think they might. They might be back. Like. Oh, okay.

[Big Cat]

Oh, okay.

[Max]

I'm just saying.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Max]

Third quarter.

[Big Cat]

I think.

[Hank]

I think what Wendy said was completely accurate about the West. Just, like, pretend that they don't have the little numbers next to their names.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, this is a Warriors team that I don't. Their depth is. It could be an issue because obviously Jimmy and Steph have to carry a big scoring load every single night. But, yeah, I did. See, I wouldn't go against Steph Curry.

[Hank]

Dylan Brooks tried to tackle somebody. I don't know who he hit. It definitely wasn't Draymond, because there would be.

[Big Cat]

He's already doing that.

[Hank]

Yeah, there was. The nice thing, though, is he's got Steven Adams to back him up.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Which is a great guy to have behind you if you pick a fight with somebody.

[Big Cat]

That's a fact. That's a fact. Should talk a little puck. We had two games on. On Saturday. I've. I've made my Future bet because Whitney told me that he thought maybe the abs. I took abs plus 750. I've also told PFT not that he cares that I would cash out if they played the Caps in the finals because I would rather you win.

[Hank]

You are free to do whatever you want with your bet. But I would and I will not hold it against you if you don't cash out. But I will be a lot of money.

[Big Cat]

I'd want to root for you.

[Hank]

I'm locked in all year.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, I'd want to root for you. But the that first game the Jets Blues was awesome. And I don't know if you guys saw but the. The one timer goal to win the game with like a minute and 30 left by Kyle Conner was so sick Cross ice just fucking buried it. And there's something about playoff games in Canada that are just incredible.

[Hank]

I do like it. And the. The Leaf Senator series is going to be great because there's a lot of bad blood and just both two Canadian teams. One has to go on for. I would like to see Canadian team make it to the Stanley cup finals. Yeah, I think that'd be fun.

[Big Cat]

The so the Aves beat the fuck out of the Stars. Speaking of famous fans, I remembered that glass banger is in jail.

[Hank]

Oh, he is.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Locked up.

[Big Cat]

He's in jail till the end of May. Now I don't know what to believe on. On Twitter because anyone could say anything but there was a question of like, where is he? And everyone's like, he's in jail. Oh, Hank might be right. The. The. The Rockets just cut it to nine. And someone replied he's in jail because his old lawyer died and he missed a court date for a dui. He got insane circumstances. Only could happen to a fucker like that. I choose to believe these circumstances. Apparently he's in mid. He's in jail for until like the end of May. So we will not get glass banger at Dallas Stars home.

[Hank]

But he is like. That's the irony of being in jail and visiting with people. You do get to bang on the glass there.

[Big Cat]

That's true. That's facts. Do you think he's doing that?

[Hank]

I think probably someone shows up, somebody just shows up and plays the game for him on like a like on their phone. Yeah, he just gets to hit the cell we had.

[Big Cat]

And then the Devils got killed by the Hurricanes, which I when we had Whitney on last week previewing the NHL playoffs, I based solely on Frank the Tank Sweets. I had no idea the Devils were even the Playoffs. They also got a bunch of injuries. There was that one clip of like both their guys coming off. Guess what? I know that there's people who were in prime season of dick measuring between the two sports. There were some blowouts in hockey, too.

[Hank]

A lot of blowouts.

[Big Cat]

There were some blowouts in hockey. I think also the Sunday, because we had three games to start Sunday in the NBA where there were 12 and a half or more favorites. And they all covered. And it was like, yeah, I guess this sucks because it was the one seeds and then the two seed. So defending champs.

[Hank]

I've got a small bone to pick with the Winnipeg Jets.

[Big Cat]

Okay.

[Hank]

Very minor. And also they did win the President's Trophy, Right? And I think that the last team to win the Stanley cup was the Blackhawks, I believe that won the President's Trophy. And that was a long time. What was that? 2012.

[Big Cat]

I think in 2015 we might have. No, 2013. 13. What was the shortened year?

[Hank]

The shortened year? I don't know.

[Big Cat]

I think the shortened year was 2011. No, no, there was the year where we the. They started the season. I'm gonna look it up. I want to say it was 2015 was the shortened year. Nope, that was not a shortened year. All right. But keep going.

[Hank]

Yeah. My small, very minor bone to pick with the Winnipeg jets. It has to do with their logo. Okay. It's a jet with a maple leaf. I searched for what jet is in the logo for the Winnipeg Jets. The AI overview says that it's an F15 Eagle. That's not an F15 Eagle.

[Big Cat]

Oh, that's.

[Hank]

That's either a Hornet or maybe a Viper, but I think it's a Hornet. Canada's got a lot of F18 Hornets. That is not. That is absolutely not an F15.

[Big Cat]

So we're saying. Wait, so there might.

[Hank]

They might have up the design.

[Max]

Blackhawks 2012, 2013.

[Big Cat]

That was a short year. They would. They had the best record because I remember they started and they. They won like 20 in a row or. Or didn't lose for forever. So wait, so explain it to me again.

[Hank]

It's a big deal to me, but probably to no other person in the world, they say that it's an F15 eagle. That's. That, buddy. That's not an F15.

[Big Cat]

What is it?

[Hank]

That's either a Hornet. I think it's a.

[Big Cat]

But they're Jets.

[Hank]

They are Jets. They're both Jets.

[Big Cat]

So does it matter?

[Hank]

Well, yeah, because that's not the outline of an F15. If that's. If they're claiming that's an F15. That's not an F15, but it's a.

[Big Cat]

Jet in their logo.

[Hank]

It is a jet in their logo, yes.

[Memes]

Also, who told you that it was an F15?

[Hank]

The AI overview. I'm looking at it right now. The Winnipeg jets logo features a fighter jet, an F15 Eagle.

[Memes]

I think your problem was with the AI.

[Hank]

Is it. Did I get AI'd?

[Memes]

Yeah, like, right. This is the. I. I've had some issues with the AI recently asking a question.

[Hank]

So what did you see?

[Memes]

No, I. I've seen nothing. But I've asked the AI, like the Google AI questions and I've gone to other people telling them that that is the answer.

[Big Cat]

Okay.

[Memes]

And being.

[Big Cat]

Being made. Looked. Looked a fool.

[Hank]

I found it. I found another source. Shouldn't.

[Max]

I thought this was your thing.

[Hank]

Well, no, I'm telling you, if they're claiming that's an F15, it's not a 15, but I just saw, like.

[Max]

Shouldn't you be able to verify that?

[Hank]

That's what I'm doing right now is that I read a source on the Internet that said that that was an F15. And I am telling you that is not an F15. But then I just found a different source that says, indeed it is a Hornet. As I suspected. Yes. Because.

[Big Cat]

Straw man question. It's still a jet, right?

[Hank]

Yep, it's still a jet.

[Big Cat]

So that part. They're right.

[Hank]

They are right.

[Big Cat]

They are. The jet.

[Hank]

That is jet.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

From my second source that I'm looking at, it does appear that it's an F18.

[Memes]

So it was the AI that was wrong.

[Hank]

The AI was.

[Big Cat]

The AI was wrong.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Memes]

That AI.

[Hank]

Yeah. I. I'm stronger than the machine. Do you know my jet knowledge is better than Google?

[Big Cat]

Do you know who was never wrong about this? Who? Me. Because I always thought it was a jet.

[Hank]

It's confirmed a jet, but yeah, Winnipeg. Good job having a properly sourced logo.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Wait. Hey, Memes, what'd you think about the Knicks? You're a Knicks fan? We just passed over. Yeah. It was a campaign game.

[Hank]

I was very nervous when they went down eight.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. And campaign popped off. Do you think maybe you take that guy Nixon?

[Hank]

Six.

[Big Cat]

Oh. Oh. Bing bong. Jerry was in Chicago this weekend. We just didn't see him sucked. He was here for a volleyball tournament.

[Memes]

I also looked it up. According to DraftKings, the Thunder have a better chance to win the west than the Celtics do to win the East.

[Hank]

Interesting.

[Big Cat]

Shout out. Traffickings.

[Memes]

Just saying.

[Hank]

I'm just saying that's yalls narrative.

[Big Cat]

Max, that is.

[Memes]

No, that's traffic.

[Big Cat]

That's your narrative. Okay. Do we want to do who's back of the Week? And then we'll get to our interviews.

[Hank]

Great interviews.

[Big Cat]

Who's back of the week? Brought to you by our friends at Truly Truly Unruly Lemonade combines a high alk of truly unruly with everyone's favorite lemonade. Level up your lemonade. 8% ABV, 100% delicious. Four supercharged lemonade flavors bumping Blue Raz OG original lemonade punched up pineapple wild pink. It's the official hard seltzer. Pardon my take. Find truly unruly lemonade at a store near you or Visit truly hard seltzer.com I am a big fan of the wild pink. Go check them out right now. 8% ABV, 100% delicious. Level up your lemonade. Four supercharged lemonade flavors pumping blue Razz OG original lemonade punched up pineapple wild pink, the official hard seltzer. Pardon my take. Find truly unruly lemonade at a store near you. Visit truly hard seltzer.com Henry.

[Max]

Yeah, man. Who's back of the week is playoffs.

[Hank]

Playoffs.

[Max]

It's that time of year.

[Big Cat]

Should we break down the games?

[Max]

Also in golf, though, Justin Thomas for the first time in three years.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Max]

Won his first tournament in a playoff, the RBC Heritage. So Justin Thomas is back.

[Big Cat]

Playoffs are back.

[Hank]

When I saw RBC Heritage, I thought it was being played in Europe somewhere.

[Max]

I thought it was played in Canada.

[Hank]

That's a big time. Yeah. One of the.

[Max]

I don't know why it feels like.

[Hank]

It'S in Scotland, Right? The RBC Heritage. Yeah.

[Big Cat]

But then they showed the. The.

[Max]

Well, I think.

[Big Cat]

And it was prime South Carolina, right? Yeah, prime South Carolina.

[Max]

But the winner. I always thought it was Canada because the winner gets that jacket. The red jacket. Oh, the.

[Big Cat]

The fifth major first win in three years. Yeah, that's. That's major for him. We like jt. Yeah.

[Max]

Big one.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Tough for our guy. Siwu Kim Tracker. That was. Siwu Kim started the day in first, right? Yeah.

[Max]

He was lights out until today.

[Big Cat]

That was brutal. I felt bad for our boy. I saw him tweet something like, I'm with my family. They're all happy, and I'm just in hell. It's like, that's the way.

[Hank]

Listen, I appreciate that he's committed to it. Yeah. Like, if you're a tracker, the losses should affect you.

[Big Cat]

Right. And listen, we all choose a path.

[Max]

I mean, the Brooks Tracker is like gone he's got. He's been gone rogue.

[Hank]

He goes off the map.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, but. But our guy, Siwu Kim tracker, we love him. And he. You don't choose this life. It chooses you. And it happened to choose him to track Si Wu Kim. And he was brutal today, and that was tough. Yeah. Family all happy, laughing. And here I am molding about the Woo. Actually can't imagine not being a sports fan. You all must be so happy. It's very funny just to like, be like being a sports fan when it's like you're actually just talking about Siwu Kim.

[Hank]

He's probably gonna.

[Max]

And like someone like an uncle at Easter being like, what's wrong, James? He's like.

[Big Cat]

Oh, you got. You got money on the grizzlies? Nope. I just track Siwoo Kim and that's my life and I love. I respect him for it.

[Hank]

There should be a Seaweed Kim tracker. Tracker that updates us on what Siwu Kim track.

[Big Cat]

I think we are going through. Yeah, that's that segment. Yeah, we're trying what's up with Siwu Kim track.

[Hank]

I would like to see an account, though. That does it. So I can read it.

[Big Cat]

Okay. PFT year. Who's back? So, Hank, you just went with playoffs.

[Max]

Playoffs are back.

[Big Cat]

Got it.

[Max]

You didn't like. That was good.

[Hank]

It was good. You know, you didn't want to say golf.

[Big Cat]

It was really good.

[Max]

Yeah, well, no, it was. It was playoffs.

[Hank]

Yeah. Playoffs are back. Were you happy?

[Max]

Was I happy?

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

See JT win.

[Max]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Not really.

[Big Cat]

I was happy to see Justin Thomas win.

[Max]

Yeah, same.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Max]

It's a good story.

[Hank]

Agreed.

[Max]

Good guy.

[Big Cat]

Him.

[Hank]

Good golfer. My. Who's back of the week is the rivalry. The rivalry is back on. I have joined a softball team.

[Big Cat]

Oh, yeah.

[Hank]

I'm officially on cadic softball team. And man, the group chat is buzzing. Great vibes in the group chat. These are. These are my boys. Can't wait to have a couple beers with them, play some softball. It's gonna be great. I'm. I'm pumped. I'm ready to go pump for you.

[Max]

Yeah, same.

[Big Cat]

Also, people should be blaming Max for not inviting pft.

[Hank]

I. I'll. Yeah, I'll go with that.

[Big Cat]

People were blaming me. It's like, dude, I. I invited myself onto a team. I wasn't.

[Memes]

I mean, you.

[Big Cat]

You are kind of the leader of the team.

[Memes]

I am not the leader.

[Max]

Yeah, he is the leader of the pugs.

[Big Cat]

He is kind of the leader of the pugs. You are. You're pugs, boss.

[Memes]

I both joined this team.

[Big Cat]

You're the best player.

[Hank]

You're the down.

[Memes]

I'm not the best player.

[Big Cat]

I might join K team, dude. Yeah.

[Hank]

Let me tell you. Let me tell.

[Big Cat]

I might join K this team.

[Hank]

I can tell just.

[Big Cat]

You need a pitcher.

[Hank]

I can tell just from the group chat what kind of guys I'm dealing with. And these are some loyal dudes. I'm pumped to play some.

[Big Cat]

I'm committed to the Pugs. Pugs. Pugs.

[Max]

Listen, what position do you want to play?

[Hank]

Whatever position.

[Max]

No, in a perfect world, though, like, let's say you're. You're, you know, setting the lineup, you're putting yourself.

[Big Cat]

How can you excel?

[Hank]

I got to meet the boys. I got to see. I got to see. I got to get in. Where.

[Max]

In a world where there's.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

I got to start fitting in and not fitting out, but, like, in a vacuum, I would say pretty strong left field.

[Memes]

Would you accept a D8 spot?

[Hank]

Yeah, wherever they need me.

[Big Cat]

Okay.

[Hank]

That's. That's what kind of team guy I am.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Listen, I'm committed to the pugs. We're 1 0. We've. We've had some early season adversity, and we fought through, and we're ready to go.

[PFT Commenter]

So.

[Big Cat]

Ready to go find. I find myself. I did feel clubhouse cancer.

[Hank]

Fine. A small bit emasculated when the group chat started going, and we're talking about getting jerseys together. This team is really rattling around each other, which I. I love. I love being a group of guys like that. What's the team name? We are Fat pitches only.

[Big Cat]

Nice.

[Hank]

Yeah. Yeah. Classic, right? So we were getting the. The jersey order stuff going on, and they're like, okay, we're gonna put in the jersey order. I'm just gonna write the sizes out and just, like, whichever one you'll be. So it's like medium large, extra large, double xl, triple xl. And I was the only one that liked me, so it's a bunch of big boys, which I'm. I'm down with.

[Big Cat]

You're like. When that happens on the burner. Verse always makes you laugh when a guy's like, y'all, you all cool if I have a day? And he posts, like, a picture of his fit pick, and it's like a Peter Millar medium.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

Everyone's like, dude, you probably weigh 130 pounds. You. You obviously are. You're. You're as sturdy of a medium as they come.

[Hank]

Sturdy boy. I'm a little thick.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, you're not a. You're not a true medium.

[Hank]

No, I'm. I've gone from being a medium to now I'm a Marge. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Big Cat]

You got to get a march.

[Hank]

When I. When I rock the medium, it's like you're wearing a medium. No, that's a march.

[Big Cat]

That's a march, baby. Well, I'm excited. I mean, I'm happy you found a home. Yeah. Are you guys gonna do a home run derby, just pump to play softball or some kind of competition?

[Memes]

Good question.

[Hank]

I mean, I was down to do one with Hank, but Hank seemed like he. He didn't want the smoke on on Friday, so. No, hey, Hank is a better baseball player than me. I will admit that.

[Memes]

Do you want. We could go to a field and.

[Big Cat]

We go to a field.

[Memes]

Go to a field.

[Hank]

Okay, let's go.

[Max]

I'm down again. I don't know where that I didn't want the smoke came from, but I'm. I would love to.

[Big Cat]

Let's do a 16 inch home run derby.

[Hank]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Memes]

We gotta find a field with a fence.

[Big Cat]

I have one.

[Memes]

Okay, great.

[Big Cat]

They might not hit any home runs, though.

[Hank]

How many pitches?

[Big Cat]

I think it's like first to five home runs.

[Memes]

That might take a while.

[Big Cat]

It might take a while.

[Hank]

How.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

How far are these fences?

[Big Cat]

Well, there's. There's a softball field that we could play ON that's like 220, kind of.

[Hank]

Like a Jose Altuve guy.

[Memes]

220.

[Hank]

I do have the power.

[Big Cat]

16 inches.

[Memes]

Yeah, 16.

[Big Cat]

It's tough to hit out. Like, it's not for people who don't know what we're talking about. 16 inch softball. The ball is like this big and it's softer. And you don't. In Chicago, you don't play with gloves, so there's no gloves on the field. And the ball gets a little softer as the game goes. And it's like, it's a very fun game because as you get older, you don't really want to be playing 12 inch where someone like Max gets up to the plate, you're playing first base, and he hits a rocket 100 miles an hour down the line right in your face. This is a game that's a little bit more skilled and speed and yeah, the ball, the ball gets a little softer, so you can't really hit it. You can't hit like 300 foot bombs with 16 inch softball.

[Hank]

Okay.

[Memes]

The circumference is 16 inches.

[Big Cat]

Yes.

[Memes]

For our podcast.

[Hank]

For our podcast, maybe, maybe we. We set up our own outfield fence with just like a rope.

[Big Cat]

We could do that.

[Hank]

Okay. Where I'm kind of there. Wouldn't like halfway between.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Oh, oh, you just played a Little League. We just played a little League field. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we can find a little League field.

[Chris Finch]

All right.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, we'll do that. That'll be good pmtv. We'll do it right after Max actually does his Dingers Only league video.

[Hank]

Yeah, we're about to have the draft for Dingers only.

[PFT Commenter]

We have that.

[Big Cat]

We have to do it before we play Dingers Only again.

[Memes]

But that team doesn't play. Yeah, actually, no, that'll work. That'll work. That'll work.

[Big Cat]

The Cubs are playing right now. You can do it.

[Memes]

Would you want me to pitch against Cubs?

[Hank]

Yeah. Oh, my God, the wind's blowing out.

[Big Cat]

Oh, that'd be so awesome. Okay. My who's back of the week is Big Dom. Not to be a trigger to you Max, but Big Dom. Because Howie Roseman said Big Dom is the best in the NFL at finding out about players. Red flags said he's the best. I don't know how he does, but he does finds it out.

[Hank]

And he stops problems.

[Big Cat]

He stops problems before they start.

[Hank]

Never been in arrest.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Also my who's back is how did Matt Fitzpatrick do today or this weekend? Did he play?

[Hank]

He did, I think, but not great.

[Big Cat]

I didn't know this story until I saw it, but he played an entire season with a four ounce weight in his driver without realizing it. How's that possible?

[Max]

I don't know. Because he's like quite literally the biggest stats data guy.

[Big Cat]

Right. Like we did a whole exists. We did a whole full swing thing about him keeping track of every shot ever. And then he forgot to take a four ounce weight out of his club. And he's tied.

[Max]

He tied for 38th. He is ranked 116th FedEx cup rankings. 75th in the world.

[Big Cat]

Damn.

[Hank]

So is there. Is there going to be any punishment?

[Big Cat]

No, I think no, it's not a punishment.

[Max]

You can have weights. Yeah, but he just thought he was like he cares so much about the data and you know, knows all the shafts and weights and lofts and stuff.

[Big Cat]

He put it.

[Hank]

He was playing like it's a leaded donut. Like a batting donut. Okay. It's not. It doesn't add.

[Max]

Like he chose a 38 ounce bat.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Max]

But thought in his head that he was hitting a 34 ounce.

[Hank]

Oh, okay. I thought it meant like the head of the driver.

[Max]

No, he didn't cork. He didn't.

[Hank]

What?

[Big Cat]

He doesn't think. You know baseball. I know both down to you with. With ounces and bats.

[Hank]

No, I. I understand the concept of the leaded donut.

[Big Cat]

Dude, this guy's on a softball team now.

[Hank]

True fat pitches only.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, that. You don't have to talk to him like that. He was really talking down to you.

[Hank]

Hank is talking down to me. I can't wait. I can't wait to settle this on the diamond.

[Big Cat]

Hank.

[Max]

Same. I'm scared. I'm ducking Smoke.

[Hank]

You don't. You don't respect me. You don't respect the Thunder. Two all time greats.

[Big Cat]

Hank. Good call on this Warriors Rockets game. Fuck. Do we have to. We'll get to our interviews. Maybe we'll give an update right before the lottery ball and who. Who wins this game. But yeah, don't. Don't talk. Pft.

[Hank]

Okay.

[Big Cat]

You got this. All right, let's get to our interviews. We've got Minnesota Timberwolves. We're start with Daniel Jeremiah talking draft. And then we got Minnesota Timberwolves head coach Chris Finch. Okay, before we get to Daniel Jeremiah talking draft. Kfc, the future of dunking is here. The Dunk It Bucket is no ordinary release. It's a first of its kind customizable flavor experience. KFC is introducing the first ever bucket built for dunking. It's an interactive, crave worthy food experience designed for ultimate dipping, dunking, sharing and devouring. Now with the new Dunk It Bucket, KFC is inviting everyone to get on all the delicious possibilities and dunk it their way. Because dunking isn't just for basketball legends anymore. It's for everyone. Hank, you can finally dunk.

[Max]

I've been dunking all month long. I love these Dunkin Buckets.

[Big Cat]

The Dunkin Bucket is awesome. It is awesome. So go check it out now. KFC Dunk it challenge may be over, but you can still dunk, dip and devour with the KFC Dunk It Bucket. Go check it out now. Dunk like Hank with the KFC Dunk It Bucket. It's no ordinary release. It's a first of its kind customizable flavor experience from kfc. The Dunk It Bucket Daniel Jeremiah is also brought to you by our friends at Chevy. Chevy has packed more capability into the Silverado Trail Boss so that you can pack more fun into your weekend. Have yourself a Friday, Saturday and Sunday with the truck that says no to nothing. Tailgates, spontaneous camping trips, DIY projects, Bring it on. What about a cross country road trip? Silverado was the perfect ride for last year's Grit Week out west. They helped us give fullbacks the recognition they deserve with the Low man award. Well, Silverado Trail Boss is built like a fullback. We're talking 495 pounds of foot of torque. Hold on to your sodas, max. Plus, the Trail Boss gives you an extra 2 inch lift. So maybe Hank can finally dunk. Silverado brings the grit. Then pairs it with all the latest truck tech, inside and out. The result? A truck that can do it all. Then show up on Monday with a story to tell. So learn more about the Silverado trail [e-mail] Chevrolet together. Let's drive. Okay, here he is, Daniel Jeremiah talking NFL draft. Okay. We now welcome on recurring guests very special guest. It's a yearly tradition. It is Daniel Jeremiah from the NFL Network Move the Sticks podcast Chargers radio. You can find him on Twitter at Move the Sticks. He is one of our draft experts and it's always great. It's draft week, so let's start with this. Dj, Great to talk to you. Thanks for coming on. Is it wrong to say that this draft does not have a lot of buzz? Because I feel like maybe especially compared to last year, we're in draft week and it just feels like there's not a lot, not a lot of movement, not a lot of talk. Is that a fair assessment?

[PFT Commenter]

I think it's fair. You know, it doesn't mean it's not a, like a quality draft. It's, I just been saying it's starters, not stars. Like last year we had six quarterbacks. Like that's so rare when you have that many quarterbacks. And quarterbacks provide the juice and the intrigue. And this year when you've got, you know, Cam Ward seems locked in at one, Travis Hunter seems locked in at two. So, you know, it, you know, there's not really that juice there at the top because we, we kind of feel like we know what's going on there. And then it begins at three.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So you, you just said starters, not stars. And that's what I've, I've been reading about how it's, well, you tell me how many blue chippers, projected pro bowlers. And obviously this is all hard to do because it's the draft. Are there in this draft or where, you know, where would you say if you're picking in this range, you're going to get a guy who has potential to be a bona fide star versus this is where the fall off is to me.

[PFT Commenter]

And I think everybody's somewhat in this range. Some have a few more. But I think like Cam Ward in his own category As a quarterback. And I think there's six, like, premier players. Some drafts you might have, you know, 13, 14 this year, there's six. Now the difference is I'm at like. Doesn't mean like the seventh, eighth, ninth guy aren't really good. But to me, that group is huge. Like Quin, Sean Judkins is in the early 30s for me, and grade wise is not going to be much different than who I would have going with the ninth or tenth pick.

[Big Cat]

Right.

[Hank]

So if we're looking at this year's draft, where would. If you were to put Cam Ward in last year's draft, where would you see him going?

[PFT Commenter]

I gave him the same grade as I gave Bo Nix. So they would literally be right there with him. And Bo, you know, look, he was the last of that first group to go, but outside Jaden Daniels, you'd say probably played the second best of all those guys. So I think, I think Cam's not quite as polished as Bo it was coming out. But I think their skill set wise very similar.

[Big Cat]

And what were the six players that you would say are like, hey, these are the blue chip guys. These are the guys that if you have one of these top picks, you're going to probably get someone who might be a perennial pro bowler.

[PFT Commenter]

I start like the little tier there at the very top. It's Abdul Carter, Travis Hunter, whatever order you want to put them in, gave him the same grade. It's just whatever you need. Those two guys, I have the two tight ends in that mix, so Tyler, Warren, Colson, Loveland. I've got Ashton Genti up there. I think he's my third player. And then I've got Mason Graham in there. So does that get me to the six?

[Big Cat]

Yeah, I think that gets you to the six. Yeah. I mean, I love Mason Graham. I think he's going to be awesome. I'm hoping he falls to 10, but I, I very highly doubt it. Okay, so that's a good big picture of, of the draft. What about in terms of strongest positions and weakest positions? Just so people know going into this.

[PFT Commenter]

Week, I think, I think defensive line overall, like just numbers. You're going to see a ton of D linemen, edge rushers, dts. That's probably the largest collection, the largest number of players. If you're going to look at guys that can have, you know, starter potential, I think that group's probably the deepest. But like, from comparing a group to what they are historically, the tight ends and the running backs are really, really good. And it's A really, really strong group of those guys, you know, compared to what we'd normally get. Not premier positions. But that's why, like I've argued, you know, there's some years where it's like, hey, bang the table. You know, tackles, edge rushers, corners, receivers, like the premium positions, they get elevated. But this year, to me, like some of these running backs and tight ends are so good and there's such a gap as players with them and these other premier positions, like, I think you almost got to throw that out the window.

[Hank]

Yeah, yeah. What about at the quarterback position with Shador? So some people are having Shador going, some in the top 10. I've seen a couple people like that. And then some have them falling more towards the end of the first round. I feel like this is, I have a kind of. Maybe it's a prediction, but it feels like one of those years where we'll get through part of the first round and there will be a team that, that drafts in the top 10 that did not take Shador, that needs a quarterback. And then they come in back later for a second first round pick and they're like, okay, now we can take shadow or later on in the first round, where do you have them going? And then two. Do you see that happening?

[PFT Commenter]

I, I think it's very, very possible. Like to me, I think there's a little bit of a game of chicken with three teams. So Pittsburgh, you know, they're in that market. They're picking 21. To me, there's like a, there's like a bullseye on them. Of like, yeah, okay. If you want to, if you're the comeback up team, then you know, Sean Payton, Denver at 20 is, is probably going to be a hot spot where you're trying to get. And the Browns and the Giants say if they both were in on whether it's Shador, whether it's Dart, they're competing against each other to see who wants to be most aggressive to go up and get the quarterback after already having secured, you know, we assume will be Hunter and Carter and the cost isn't that much. So you're looking at. It would be the second round pick, let's say for the Giants 34. It would be their. One of their thirds, they have 2 thirds would be 65 and then a 5th round pick which is 164. So I would think if you're the Giants or you're a fan of the Giants and you come out of it and you've got Abdul Carter and then you come out and you end up with Shador or Dart. Whoever your choice is there, you still got a third round pick. So that's a, that's a pretty nice haul there. You've got a quarterback of the future, but you also have a big time premier player.

[Big Cat]

Right.

[Hank]

I was thinking it would make a ton of sense for the Giants because you got a coach who's in save my job mode and you need a quarterback. You don't have an answer at the quarterback position and so you take that premium player at the top and then you also double dip and, and come back in for Shador. So you mentioned Jackson Dart too. He's that guy that like the closer we get to the draft, the better he becomes. Like the further away we get from watching him play football, he becomes better at football. But I've got some teams saying that like they might, you could see him as maybe your first round draft pick. So who do you have him above Shador, or should wear above him?

[PFT Commenter]

I have on my list I have Shador. You know, he's like right around 1820, like in that range from my list and darts in the mid-30s. But you know, I get to me Dart. My comp on him was kind of off the walls a little different, but he reminded me of Hertz just from the standpoint of kind of built similarly. They're like strong, sturdy, tough guys. They got better each and every year in college. Not arriving as like a finished product, but guys that, you know, I think you're kind of buying into the kid and the competitiveness of the kid and the toughness of the kid that he's going to eventually get there. And I mean I look, I was at Hertz like one of his first training camp practices and it was not good. You know, like there was, there was like, oh gosh, what did we do? Type vibe there. But he just proved he's just going to outwork everybody and he's going to figure it out. And he did. So I think that's the comparison there with those, like the trajectory of those two guys.

[Big Cat]

So I know I would be a terrible scout or someone in the front office because I would overreact to a specific game more than every other game. Yeah, so that was good. Now it's helped me sometimes. I was, I was first on the bandwagon of Paxton lynch is not good because I lost a lot of money in his bowl game, but I was.

[PFT Commenter]

At his bowl game. Can I tell you the story about his bowl?

[Big Cat]

Yes, please.

[PFT Commenter]

I was at his bowl game and I Wanted to see him. So I went. I don't think I've ever told this, but I went, I went down on the field. I was working with NFL Network, but I didn't want to. I didn't want anybody to kind of recognize me. I don't think they would have anyways. I probably could have worn an NFL shield and a Rob Low hat. Nobody would have known who I was. But I went down there, right by the fence, along the sideline, because I wanted to see, like, how he interacted with everybody. I knew he was big and strong and athletic and all that stuff. The play on the field. He didn't play great in that game, but to me, I went down on the sideline. I did not see him interact with anybody. He come off the sideline. He wasn't talking to coaches. He was around teammates. So that's when I kind of jumped ship.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[PFT Commenter]

On him at that bowl game.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, that was so, so, so sometimes it works in my favor, sometimes it doesn't. But the Florida game for Jackson dart was horrendous. And yeah, when you're sitting in that meeting, is there like, do you say, hey, look, there's one game, guys, we can't, we can't react to a bad game just like we can't react to a really good game? Or is it like, no, this might be a sign of something else that we got to be worried about long term?

[PFT Commenter]

Well, I mean, I. Look, there's always going to be outliers and clunkers. You know, Lamar Jackson, I want to say they played LSU and their bowl game and it was not, it was not good for his final send off there. But, you know, this is the same thing I've. And I, I don't have the medical information, so I can't, you know, stamp this as 100. But in talking to some people around the league, and maybe they're just apologists or they have big grades on these guys, but like, you hear Will Howard might have been concussed in the, in the Michigan game. You hear Jackson dart might have been concussed in the Florida game. I'm not, I don't have that documented. I'm just saying that there's. That, that stuff floats around out there when you're talking to people, but.

[Big Cat]

Right.

[PFT Commenter]

It's not the first time somebody's had a stinker. Remember Josh Allen and who was playing with a junior high team when they went and played that Iowa game but like had the interceptions and people just, just hung on to that one moment on him and punished him for that. And it's like, dude, that's, you know, he wasn't even fighting a fair fight with what he had in that game. But you're going to have a game like that every now and then, right?

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

How do you weigh that? Like, I, I guess the real question I'm asking is how do you weigh traits like the, if a guy has a big arm, very accurate, et cetera, et cetera, against the games that you've seen him play most recently?

[PFT Commenter]

Well, I think big games are important, you know, how you play in that. But I like, to me there's a lesson in scouting and obviously I had to learn it the hard way. But with Josh and with Mahomes where it was like, okay, there's some rawness to them, there's some, some, some issues that pop up, there's some development that needs to take place. But when you have like combination of, of size, you know, ridiculous arm talent and then incredible like competitiveness and then you go through the. Later on the process, you find out, oh yeah, by the way, they're unbelievable dudes who are incredibly smart. Like, these guys are going to figure it out. Like I, I'll, I'll take my chances on those guys who maybe a little rough around the edges. So it, you know, to get to your point there, I'm chasing ceiling with quarterbacks maybe more than I'm looking at the floor. You know, when you just look around the AFC and you look at the quarterbacks you have to go through, it's like to me, okay, if I, if I take a guy who has like a mid level ceiling, but I know he's going to hit it. Like, I'm confident he's going to hit it. And I have another guy with a wide range but a higher ceiling. Well, either way, if I take the high range guy and he, and he busts, I got to go get another quarterback. If I take the guy with the mid ceiling two years, three years from now, I'm like, well, he's not good enough either. Like, I got to go back and get another quarterback, so you might as well just take your swing.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, no, it's a good way to think about it. And I think that as fans, we, we probably criticize too much on the swings because it's like you can't, you don't want to be stuck in that mediocre, you know, having a starting quarterback who's just good enough to get paid, but not good enough to win a Super Bowl.

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah, just list. I mean, when you look at the AFC and off the top of my head you're talking about Mahomes, Allen, lamar, Jackson, Burrow, C.J. stroud, Herbert. Like you got to navigate through that gauntlet and you're going to go out there with kind of a, you know, a middling, middling quarterback. Like you're never going to survive.

[Hank]

Yeah, yeah. Speaking. Speaking of Josh, you were talking about, you know, some of the bad games he had in college. Who's one guy in this draft that is from, you know, that next level, maybe group of five school that you think might be a sleeper, A guy that you're going to get an excellent player. Maybe you haven't seen him play that much, but who's one guy that stands out?

[PFT Commenter]

Well, I just go immediately to Gray Zable from North Dakota State. You know, first of all, they've put offensive lineman in the NFL. They know how to coach them, they know how to identify them, they know how to develop them and then take guys from these non, you know, traditional, you know, power four type programs and they go to the Senior bowl and they not only hold their own, they're like pretty dominant down there. That's a high batting average with those guys, man. And he can play all five positions. So yeah, he's, he's like that immediate name that just pops right into my head.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, the running backs in this draft is very interesting because it's Ashton, Jenny obviously is at the top and he's going to go in whatever the first six, seven picks. But you said, you know, there's a lot of depth at running back. Who's your favorite of the next group? And it does it. Is it fair to say that like there's going to be probably five or six teams that are come away from this draft being like, hey, we feel like we've got a guy who on his rookie contract is going to be really good contributor to this team.

[PFT Commenter]

Dude, there's a boatload of them. But like Travion Henderson for me from, from Ohio State just because you got home run hitter, which I love. But then you've got somebody who's, he's arguably and I have to go back through my notes like from way back in like the early 2000s. I don't recall off top of my head a better pass protecting back coming out of college, like he's unbelievable at it. So you've got that, which is a hard thing to find and he possesses it. Then you've got someone who you know is not, he's not a smallish back like he's put together, he doesn't have a ton of tread on his tires because they've spread the rock around at, at Ohio State. So now he's one that I would think. And it like, I know, you know, the Bears and, and people will look at that and say, gosh, that would be insane if they did that with pick number 10. But then you kind of step back and look at it and you're like, okay, the biggest issue is, you guys know, like, they didn't protect last year. So we revamped the offensive line and now we've got a running back who can not only, you know, hit a home run. I can get him involved in the past game. But come, you know, look, you come against some of those big time fronts. I got an extra. It's like having an extra lineman back there to help protect Caleb. So that would, that would be maybe a little shock if that happened when he got picked, but I could easily explain it.

[Big Cat]

So, like, in terms of draft trends, it is a copycat league. Do you feel like the tide shifting in the running backs or even linebackers, where it's like, you saw what the Lions did a couple years ago and everyone's like, this is crazy. Why would they do this? They took, they take a running back and a linebacker early. Our team starting to open their eyes a little bit more, being like, hey, this isn't, this isn't as crazy as we thought it was, you know, five, six years ago.

[PFT Commenter]

I just think it's the order of operation. I don't think that I have an issue with taking a running back and I don't think most teams do. I think the mistakes are when you're a terrible team and you take a running back.

[Big Cat]

Yep.

[PFT Commenter]

Knowing he's got like a six year, seven year shelf life, and you're going to waste two or three years of those carries on a terrible team. What's the point? Like, you're better off building up your team. And then the second I start the clock on the running back, like it matters. All of his carries, like Detroit had the offensive line. They'd already taken care of the marquee positions on defense. They had Aiden Hutchinson. So you drop Jameer Gibbs in and he hits the ground running and off you go. But to me, if you're a bad team, bad offensive line, you can disguise a good running back, you know, with a bad supporting cast. Yeah, that's where the mistake is for me.

[Big Cat]

And it's a really good point. It's the, it's why I feel Bad for Giants fans who get made fun of for the sake. One deal and it's like. But Saquon would like the Giants wouldn't have been good with Saquon this year. Saquon was added to a Super bowl ready team and that's why he flourished. He always has been a good running back. It's just that he was on a really bad team and it makes no sense to pay a running back on a really bad team.

[PFT Commenter]

100%. Yeah, it's to me, it's just that it's one of the final pieces there. Everybody talked about, you know, I think Seattle was the reason for this was kind of like you build up your roster, then you drop in the quarterback. I, I almost more believe. So it's the running back in terms of once you have everything built up, okay, drop him in there and off you go. And there's teams in this draft where you look at it and that's why like, normally the teams picking the top 10 aren't, don't have those key bases covered. And so that's why you see some of these running backs that go up there maybe don't pop as much. But the Bears are a different, they're different. Like if somehow Genti were to get there, they've, they've invested in that offensive line. They have the quarterback in place, they have all the key positions in defense. They're in pretty good spot there. So that's why it's kind of a unique opportunity for them. And even if, if Genti was gone, I would, you know, I'd be doing my homework on Hampton, who's a stud out of North Carolina. Like, I would love to see the Bears come away with a dynamic back. I think they're ready for him.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, yeah.

[Hank]

We, we have to dive into maybe the biggest controversy of all time, him in the NFL draft. What's been going on with Will Campbell and his arm length measurement. So I know you're, you're a big arm length guy. Probably he measured in at 32 and 5, 8 inches at the combine. And that's just below the magic number of 33 inches, which is what you say you have to have to be an offensive tackle. Then was it at his pro day or was that the senior? Yes, he measured in at 33 inches. So he got up there, his arm length increased. Are his arms, Is that three eighths of an inch good enough? Is that enough to make Will Campbell an elite tackle?

[PFT Commenter]

Well, the, the arm Lake controversy goes like, well beyond Campbell because there were guys at The Senior bowl who got their arms measured. And Bo, the tackle from Purdue is one off top of my head, whose arms magically shrunk an inch from the Senior bowl to the combine. So, like all the combine numbers this year were low. So I don't know if they've have different people doing it that, you know, used to be you had the same guy would do it at the senior Bowls, the same guy would do it at the combines. I'm gonna go on a limb and say they have different people doing this who are doing it differently. So all the numbers are kind of jacked this year. And you see the pro day numbers match more what the all Star game numbers were. So it kind of looks like the Senior bowl is an outlier. But to me, the, you know, I've never been in a, in a draft room where it was like he's 30, 32 and 7/8 not touching him. Oh, he's 33 or we're in on him. I think a little bit more of that gets made. To me, it's just more about how do you play with your length. Like the, the, on the, on the need length side of the argument. Go watch the super bowl and go watch Joe Tooney, who's not long and who, who the Philadelphia Eagles got into his chest and just beat the crud out of him in that game. And that was their plan coming into that game. He's a short arm tackle. We're gonna rush long, meaning we're just going to get to his chest. We're going to get extended and get to his chest. And he struggled like that. That there is a reason why people care about arm length. There is something to that. But I watch Rashawn Slater every week with the chargers, who's got 33 inch arms, but who's built like a wrestler. He's got unbelievable core strength and even if you get to his chest before he can get on you, he can drop his weight with incredible strength and base. And the arm length doesn't even, it's not even an issue.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[PFT Commenter]

So I think that's, it's kind of, that's a long way to get to it. But I do think arm length matters, but I think you have to put it in a context.

[Big Cat]

It's kind of like all these measurements where it's like the hand size. We joke about it, but if you had a preference, you would rather have your quarterback have bigger hands than smaller hands. Because it's proven that yes, there are quarterbacks with smaller hands who are good, but when it comes to elements, when it comes to, you know, holding onto the football. Yeah, you'd probably want to have a 10 inch hand. Like that would help.

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah, I mean, I think it's across the board. I think that's not just in football. I think in basketball, if you had a good basketball player at 6 foot 5 with a normal wingspan and a player that was 6 foot 4 with freakishly long arms. Yeah, I like the guy with a lot of length because that clogs up lanes and that helps you close out and defend like this. You're always going to prefer it. But you get in trouble when you discard good play and punish them for, for a trait. And you get in trouble when you elevate somebody because they have traits and they can't play.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

So in conclusion, Will Campbell, you're not, you're not worried about him at all being attacked?

[Chris Finch]

Michael?

[PFT Commenter]

No, I, I look, he's not as. He doesn't have the same core strength that Rashawn Slater has. I didn't give him as high of a grade as I gave Rashawn Slater, but with him I think he can hold up. I think he's really good at recovering. He's got great feet. But to me there are times where he's more so than his arm length. Rashawn's broad, he's narrow like Will. More the wingspan probably bothers me than the arm length. He's just kind of narrow shouldered and guys can kind of get on his edges a little bit. But I. He's such a great kid. He's so smart, he's so tough. I think the absolute worst case scenario is he fails outside and he's a Pro bowl caliber guard. So I think from that standpoint he has a higher floor.

[Big Cat]

Another reason why this draft maybe doesn't have as much buzz is it's not just the quarterbacks, but the wide receivers. We, I feel like we had a stretch here where the wide receivers were phenomenal and there was every year be five or six guys going in the first round. It was like, holy. And it doesn't feel that way. Talk to me about the wide receiver class and Then specifically Ted McMillan because I feel like I've heard just everything like people saying he's a stud and then people ripping him apart. Where do you land on Tet? And then as the wide receivers in total, sure.

[PFT Commenter]

Big picture, I don't think we have the, again the stars like the big time, like top 10 caliber receiver that we've had in some of these previous years. But I think it's a really good group. I think there's a lot of twos and, you know, a good number of threes. I don't know that we have like a number one whiteout in this class. To McMillan specifically. Like, this is an example of kind of maybe the polarizing nature with him. I call one team and. And. Hey, what'd you guys think of him? Well, he's super smooth. He's ultra athletic. He's got agility. He makes it look easy, you know, with his range and he. Go get it, you know. He has a volleyball background. I love, you know, know, love him, you know, really, really love the kid. Talk to somebody else. There's no urgency to what he does. I don't see him really compete. It doesn't look like he strains much to try and make things happen, you know, and he's a volleyball player, you know, I mean, come on, he's a ball. So I'm like, literally, they said the exact same things. And one likes him and one doesn't like him. It's just kind of all how you. How you view it.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, yeah. And then wide receivers is a total. Like, is there another one that you like or maybe farther down the line where you're like, hey, this guy's probably not gonna go to the second or third round, but he's gonna be a solid pro.

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah, I like the day two group. Like, there's two kids from Iowa State I think are really, really good. You've got Noel, who is kind of a, you know, a power slot. Like, he's a strong, sturdy slot who can really, really run, who can give you run after the catch. He's just, to me, he's like, ready made. Like, drop him in and he's going to be super productive right away. And then you've got Higgins on the outside, who's like more of that power forward type, you know. One of the things that I was talking to Purdy about this, I'm like, one thing I never understood. I don't know if you guys have ever tackled the subject, but why don't we include pass interference yards on totals for receivers and quarterbacks?

[Big Cat]

Yeah, yeah.

[Hank]

I mean, Joe Flacco would be even more elite. Yeah. Throw that deep ball.

[PFT Commenter]

But I mean, like, Higgins draws so many penalties. So, like, if you just looked at his numbers on paper, like, yeah, he's got good numbers. But if you added in all the yards and the first downs that he accumulated because he's so physical and fights for the ball and draws flags like, that's a skill, and it's a more valuable skill in the NFL than it is in college. So, like, those are a couple day two guys. Jack Besh probably goes in the third round from tcu, who's another, like, ultra, ultra competitive kid. So those are a few I like.

[Hank]

I do think that there should also be an end one for wide receivers. If they get a pass interference called against them and they catch the ball, there should be an additional five yards on there.

[PFT Commenter]

I like that.

[Hank]

Yeah. What about Travis Hunter? What do we think about. Are some teams looking at him and saying, yeah, you're only going to play cornerback, or is every team that's picking up at the top, are they going to draft him with the understanding that he's going to play both sides?

[PFT Commenter]

I think everybody I've talked to has a plan to major in minor. You know, like, you got to major on one side, minor on the other. And to me, look, we can debate all these other teams that they're going to do. Cleveland's going to take him. He's going to major in offense, he's going to minor on defense.

[Big Cat]

Really?

[PFT Commenter]

Oh, yeah. Oh, I think so, yeah.

[Big Cat]

I always assumed it was the other way around.

[Hank]

You haven't graded higher as a. As a wide receiver.

[PFT Commenter]

I think he's ready. He's more impactful as a receiver right now. And so to me, I think that's where you start him, especially in a team in Cleveland who doesn't have the premier quarterback. And maybe they, you know, I do think they try and come away with one and, and get back in to take one. But to me, yeah, I think that's. I think he'll be on the opposite side of Jerry Judy and, And they'll. They'll get the ball in his hands as much as possible.

[Hank]

So why do you have him? Like, why are you seeing him more as a wide receiver than a cornerback? Because everybody else that we've talked to has said cornerback first to put them in on packages on offense.

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah. I mean, first of all, on an. As an aside, he wants to play wide receiver. I think he says he wants to play everything. But if you told him, he would say he's a wide receiver, slash corner and not the other way around.

[Big Cat]

Okay.

[PFT Commenter]

He touches the football more on offense. And this is not the old days. Like, he's not. He's not a press man. Corner. Put him on one side of the field and forget about it. Leave him alone. He's at his best where he can use his instincts and eyes, play off Coverage, see things, set traps, drive on the ball and make some plays. So I, you know, I don't think he's not like a pat certain like coming out of college as a corner, whereas I think he is right now ready to go. There's a ton of ways we can get the ball in his hands and I just think he impacts the game more on offense at this point in time and it's never really been done. Everybody that's had this two way ability, it's always been major on defense, package of plays on offense. So I realized in saying that look, this is new, this is a new unchartered waters, so to speak. But to me that's what makes the most sense for him.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, I got a question about not this year's draft, but overall the way college football is going and that has it pertains to the NFL. Obviously you followed the Nico saga at Tennessee. How's that going to impact how teams evaluate these guys going forward? When it's like, hey, I, you know, loyalty is kind of a stupid thing because you know, there is no loyalty in, in these high level sports. But you know, jumping around from team to team, having a situation like this where it's like he, you know, sits out not, I don't want to say quit on his team, but like there's that, that storyline goes. So how do teams kind of judge something like this? Because it probably is going to happen a lot more going forward.

[PFT Commenter]

The teams who don't need a quarterback or aren't picking high enough to take one are going to be very vocal about how upsetting this is. And the team, the teams that are picking up high and need quarterbacks are not going to give two cents about it. Like nobody's going to care. It's talent over everything. Right. So it's going to have zero impact on guys and where they go. And we're already used to this last year. I mean, shoot, the last, I don't know, maybe five years, you're more the rarity is the guy who's been at one stop. Yeah, all these guys have bounced all over the place. Now what the motivation is for that, people can get upset about it if they want, but you know, from a scouting standpoint with, with Nico specifically, I haven't seen a ton of them, but I've seen a ton of the Tennessee offense and it's kind of like that old Baylor Art Briles offense where they're literally could touch the hand of the coach on the sideline. It's hard to translate that to the next level from an evaluation standpoint. You know, I don't know what exactly UCLA's offense is going to look like, but I'm kind of excited to see him from an evaluator standpoint in a different offense.

[Big Cat]

It's a really good point because we get tricked by it. So like going forward, we just got to remember that we're going to hear a lot of criticism of a guy like Nico or someone who has the same situation. It's just going to come from guys that would never have to pick him anyway.

[PFT Commenter]

Exactly, man, what does it matter, right? I mean, that's, that's my whole, my whole point. I mean, I just think there's, there's, there's teams every year that need upgrades and are desperate and they are not going to give a crap about any of this stuff.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

And if one of those players falls to the team that's complaining, they'll change their tune and draft that guy anyways.

[PFT Commenter]

I've been in a draft room where we had a player with some character issues that we viewed as like a third round pick and we had a black dot on him which meant he was undraftable. And then all of a sudden in the sixth round, our director said, print up a new card, take the black dot off. He's been punished enough.

[Hank]

How do you work out?

[Big Cat]

That's perfect.

[PFT Commenter]

He hung around for a few years. He wasn't a great player, but for a six round pick he was, he was functional.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

So what about, what about a surprise team? Are we going to get a team that we don't think needs a quarterback that is going to try to make a move? And it'd be very funny if the Falcons did it again this year. I know they won't, but is there a team like the Falcons from last year that you're going to be like, what the hell?

[PFT Commenter]

I mean that would, that would probably kill the surprise. I don't, I can't think of one. There's none like that. I'm looking at as like a sneaky quarterback team. I mean, the Rams have been mentioned, you know, but I don't know. I mean, I don't think they would do it early, but Matthew's older and you know, maybe they take one on day two or something like that, but you know, two has been hurt. Maybe that could be, you know, a surprise there. But they've paid him. It seems like that wouldn't, that would catch me off guard. So if there is one, I'm, I'll be as caught off guard as anybody.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

What about some of the tweener guys? I don't know if we still call them tweeners. I feel like I haven't heard that. Okay, good, good. Because I haven't heard that, that term a lot recently. Normally it's like been changed to like a chess piece. If you have somebody on defense.

[PFT Commenter]

Versatile.

[Hank]

Yeah, versatile. You move them around a lot. Is there, Are there any tweeners that we should have our eyes on and then follow up question. Who are, who are the guys that have been undersized that are labeled as tweeners that in your opinion have actually worked out?

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah, tweeners that have worked out well. I mean, like, Brandon Graham is like kind of my classic tweener. He was kind of in between body type of a defensive tackle and an edge rusher. And, you know, it's like, how, where do we use him best? I was there in Philadelphia when he was there and was like, well, his. It's better to have his power advantage over a tackle than his quickness advantage over a guard. But he's like, you know, kind of a classic example of a, of a tweener. When I'm looking at guys in this draft, you know, this draft, we have a lot of these DTS are all over 300 pounds. Normally we get some of these 275, 280 pound guys. We don't have as many of those this year. Like Elijah Roberts from smu, probably like a third round pick, but he's one that you kind of go, okay, does he play inside? Does he play outside? Savion Jones from LSU is another one kind of a tweener there. So there's a few of them sprinkled in throughout here, but not. It's not a huge. It's not a huge tweener year. Maybe. The other one I would say is Nick Scorton from a mic. Nick Scorton is fascinating because he is someone. When I watched him, like, gosh, I didn't see like big time juice and takeoff at A. M last year. And then I found out after the fact, well, they bulked him up to 280. They wanted to be bigger. So he got up to 280 pounds. Well, he shows up at his pro days 257, and he's moving around good. He looks great. And that was, you know, teams like, you got to go back and watch him when he was at Purdue the year before because he was lighter and he looks like a different guy. So he's one that's just Kind of weird that you're going to see the guy when he gets picked and be like, that doesn't even look like the same human being as the guy that you saw last year.

[Big Cat]

All right, this is unfair question, but I'm going to ask you anyway. Outside of the top, let's say eight, give me a team and player that you're like, I know this is what's going to end up happening because I think there are teams like the packers or the Ravens. It's almost like if you, if you follow any of their beat writers, you can basically telegraph what their pick is. So do you have. I'll give you two shots in it, and if you get one of them right, we'll just be like, D.J. was right. He got. He nailed it. So I'll give you two shots in a. A team player that you're like, I think this is going to happen. It's like you can almost write it down right now.

[PFT Commenter]

Well, how you guys. I know Dan, you talked to Harbaugh, so I don't know if. See if he's into manifestation, but it just feels like I think every night he's going to bed with Colston Loveland's picture, like on the wall and he just stares at it like, this is going to happen. I believe it. He will be here year. So that's one. Okay, I would say. And then I will say with the Houston Texans, this one, I'll go with Booker. I'll go with Tyler Booker from. From Alabama. When you have the connection with Nico Ryan's to Alabama. And then when I talk to the guys at Alabama about Tyler Booker, they say he was the offensive Will Anderson, who also was with the Houston Texans. So I'm like, there's a lot of. There's a lot of stuff working together there.

[Big Cat]

Okay. So if you get either of those right, we're gonna. We'll make a graphic and be like. As first reported by Daniel Jeremiah, seven days before the draft. He nailed this.

[Hank]

DJ knows.

[PFT Commenter]

Save their time on that graphic, though. Don't, don't, don't do that. Unless it actually happens, which the odds are very low.

[Big Cat]

No, we got. You got one of those. You got one of those, too.

[Hank]

And I know as a scout, you fall in love with guys. I'm sure that you. You've experienced it where you're scouting somebody. You're like, this guy is going to go way too late. I would personally have him way higher. Is there somebody that's going to be picked in. In the third, fourth round this year? That you have fallen in love with.

[PFT Commenter]

Oh, that's a great question.

[Big Cat]

Great question.

[PFT Commenter]

Thank you. So I'll give you like an example of someone. He might even go beyond that. But there's a safety, Woodson, Craig Woodson from Cal, who's. I'm like one of those guys, right? Don't kind of. I don't know what I'm missing. Like, he's. He's got enough size. He takes the ball away. He ran the mid four fours. I talked to the guys at Cal. Like, super smart, great leader. Cal's been like a sneaky good secondary factory over the years. There's certain schools that you kind of are surprised when you dig into it and you're like, gosh, there's a lot of guys playing in the NFL at this position from this school. So he's one. I think to me, I have him like in the, like early mid third round and maybe he goes in like the fifth, fifth round, you know, when it's all said and done. But I think you'll look up and he'll be starting next year.

[Big Cat]

Okay, I got one last question. This has been awesome. Thank you so much. D.J. you gotta go, D. Obviously everyone's gonna be watching on NFL Network on draft night. Move the Sticks podcast. The last question is Roback. Question. You're wearing your Roback right now. Roback.com promo code, take 20% off your first purchase. Q, zips, polos, hoodies, joggers, shorts, everything. Roback.com promo code? Take. All right, give us. I want to do a new thing where we're just going to call it Mr. PMT, because there's obviously the Mr. Irrelevant. Give us a sixth or seventh round quarterback that you're like, hey, this guy could. Who knows? Just so we can then say, yeah, actually we had it first before anyone else. Not saying, give us the next Tom Brady, but a quarterback you know is going to go in the last couple rounds that you're like, there's at least something there. So when his name gets called, all of our fans could be like, yep, that's Mr. PMT. He's going to be the guy. And we're just going to take. We're going to do this every year for the next decade until we get one right. And then we're going to be like, we were the first to say it.

[PFT Commenter]

Now this one's interesting because if he were to go in like the third or fourth round, I wouldn't be shocked because his play's really good. But because of some other factors, mainly his size, I could see him falling into the sixth or seventh round. So it's not like I'm creating a quarterback out of thin air here. You guys all know him. You've all seen him play a bunch. But I would go with Dylan Gabriel.

[Big Cat]

Okay, that's Mr. PMT.

[Hank]

So he. Yeah, I saw a picture of him wearing jets gear the other day.

[PFT Commenter]

Oh, there you go.

[Hank]

Yeah, he was very.

[PFT Commenter]

He's got a strong arm, man. He is not. He is. You know, he's. He's 5, 11. He's older, but he's got a. He's got a really strong arm. I've kind of advocated if you're the Dolphins, and I know they brought over Zach Wilson, but that'd be a. I mean, shoot, Just bring him in there if you can get him in the third, fourth round. No. 12 is more than likely to miss some games. Like, I think he could do everything that, you know, Tua can do.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

And are you going up to Green Bay?

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah, yeah. Yep. I'm out there all week.

[Hank]

What can we expect from Green Bay in this draft? Are they doing anything different?

[PFT Commenter]

I don't know, man. The only thing that I know is they have. We do the. The puppy thing. Like, we bring in the rescue puppies, and the one peed on me two years ago. So that's like, the only thing I'm prepared for is just bring an extra shirt and try and work on my technique. It's like all the ball security stuff that they teach you in football.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[PFT Commenter]

Puppy security is like, opposite. You got to throw all. There's no point. You want zero point of pressure. You got to keep that thing out extended.

[Hank]

So that's.

[PFT Commenter]

That's all I'm really focused on, to be honest.

[Big Cat]

Oh, it's a great point. All right, well, we can't wait to watch you on draft night. Thank you so much, dj. We appreciate you and having you on every year. And let's hope that Dylan Gabriel goes and, you know, wins the super bowl. And we can be like, yeah, actually, that was Mr. PMT.

[PFT Commenter]

Oh, man, you kidding me? And then you gotta do a whole weekend. Like the. Like, they do the thing in Newport Beach. I don't know where you guys want to. Want to take the guy if there's a cost involved there. I don't know if you want to be cost conscious, but you'd have to put together a whole weekend for the player like they do for Mr.

[Big Cat]

Irrelevant.

[Hank]

Yeah, yeah, we. We drive them around the basketball court using Max's wheelchair. Yeah, it'd be fantastic.

[Big Cat]

And they get. And they can get as much lasagna as they want. Yeah. See.

[PFT Commenter]

Sounds like a heck of a weekend.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. All right. Thanks so much.

[PFT Commenter]

See you, buddy.

[Hank]

Chris Finch is going to be brought to you by our great friends, our fantastic friends over at game time. It's live event season right now. Hank, can you look up tickets for. Let's look up Cubs, Phillies tickets. Cubs Phillies tickets, Wrigley Field. There's going to be a lot of out of control Philly trash there. Anybody in particular?

[Memes]

I'll be there. I don't know about other Philly trash.

[Hank]

No, let's talk about you. Oh, Max will be there. He's probably worth the price of admission on his own. Just go buy Max a beer.

[Big Cat]

That's.

[Hank]

That's the day. Buy Max beer Friday at Wrigley Field.

[Big Cat]

He'll.

[Max]

He'll chug it.

[Hank]

He'll chug it. Yeah, that's, that's a guaranteed fact. Especially if it's one of those bats. One of the bats that's filled the beer.

[Big Cat]

Yep.

[Hank]

He'll drink a million of those. So at Wrigley Field on Friday, Phillies, Cubs, what are we looking at?

[Max]

You can get in the building for $14.

[Hank]

14 bucks.

[Max]

14 bucks.

[Memes]

That can't be true.

[Hank]

That is going to leave you.

[Max]

I'm looking at it right now on game time.

[Hank]

A lot of beer. Cash in the wallet for Max. Get your drinking pants on, buddy. And guess what else is here. NBA playoffs are here. The only place to buy the hard to get playoff tickets is game Time. The official ticketing partner of Barstool Sports. They've got the best last minute deals, all in prices, views from your seat, and the lowest price guarantee. Game Time takes the guesswork out of buying NBA playoff tickets. Prices on the app actually go down the closer it gets to tip off. You can save up to 60% when buying last minute tickets. Plus on April 22 for Earth Day, when you select and purchase a super deal, Game Time will plant a tree with the proceeds. If you're looking at those Cubs tickets or. Hank, tell you what, look up, look up the Celtics tickets. What are the Celtics tickets like in this series? It's gonna be a long, hard fought series against the Magic. I'm sure that you're convinced it's probably going to go the distance, right, Hank?

[Max]

No, I'm just going to look at. Game two is on Wednesday. That's probably the last game of the series that you can go to in Boston. At least you can get in the building for 150.

[Hank]

Okay. That's good for Celtics tickets.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Proud basketball, actually.

[Max]

138. Take it back.

[Big Cat]

Fire.

[Max]

Deal.

[Hank]

And guess what? It's going to be less than that, too. If it's your first time with game time, you download the app, create account, use code PMT, and you can take 20 bucks off your first purchase terms. Apply again, create an account, redeem code PMT, get 20 bucks off, download the game Time app today. What time is it? Game time. And now, here's Chris Finch.

[Big Cat]

Okay. We now welcome on a very special guest, it is Minnesota Timberwolves head coach Chris Finch ahead of the playoffs. Just so that everyone knows we're taping this on Friday, they have game one Saturday night against the Lakers. We just told coach he's got to try to really win this game. So that. So. So that on Monday when we run the interview, everyone's like, man, Chris Finch, what a genius. Here's actually what you need to do. Don't tear your knee on Saturday night again. Okay. Because then. Then this would be an awkward interview to run. How is your knee feeling? And are you excited to actually be able to. To walk around this playoffs?

[Chris Finch]

Knees feeling good?

[Big Cat]

Thanks.

[Chris Finch]

It's been almost a year, so it should be good after this long, but, yeah, no, excited to get started. Be fun to be back up on. On both legs for the playoffs again.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So. So your knee, like, do you have a different strategy now going into this postseason? Think it's. It's similar to, like being at a dog park where you got to keep a little bend in your knee because a Labrador might jump and, you know, cut you from behind. Are you. Do you have any new strategy on how you're going to be standing in the box in the playoffs?

[Chris Finch]

Well, I mean, I don't necessarily. Well, I don't necessarily have a new strategy, but what I have. I have noticed is how many times, you know, people actually start coming your direction. You just, You, You. Your radar is. Is, you know, much better now when you realize that you could be taken out at any moment in time.

[Hank]

So I actually thought there was a benefit to that where you'd be less likely to get teed up by a ref if you're, you know, you got a big thing on your leg. You're like, oh, it's just me. Like, you're less of a threat that way.

[Big Cat]

True.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah. Well, sitting in the second row, I could yell a little bit louder, so I'm not. They could. They couldn't really tell where it was coming from. Sometimes yeah.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So. All right, so we're getting ready for the playoffs. Your season has been an interesting one because you guys started off slow, you came on strong at the end. What was the, the big adjustment that you were able to make? Or was it just the guys fighting through things to get to a point where you're back to where you want to be in terms of a real contender in the West?

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, I think much, much, much of the credit goes to the guys, you know, just figuring it out over time, you know, understanding what they had to do, sacrifices, roll rotations, you know, being ready to kind of change and adapt as the season was going along. The biggest thing was, was really our offense. Our offense was struggling out of the gate. We had a lot of turnovers, ball was sticky, spacing issues, the normal stuff. But you gotta remember we made that trade literally 48 hours before we opened up training camp. And Julius came into training camp still nursing the very last, you know, kind of remnants of his shoulder off season, shoulder surgery. So we really didn't have him for much of preseason anyway. So it took us a while to kind of figure out, you know, how to best play with him and around him. And once we started to do that early to mid December, you know, I could feel like the team getting better, the momentum building, you know, maybe we wouldn't. Weren't always getting the results, but it just. Just felt a lot more like the team that I knew we could become.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Yeah. And you got a, A big matchup in the first round here. And, you know, obviously JJ is somebody that, you know, you went on his podcast. Do you, do you look back at that and be like, I feel like JJ just asked me on his podcast so that he could get info on me, so that if he played in the playoffs, he'd be able to use that against me.

[Chris Finch]

Well, I mean, it was fun being on JJ's podcast, but I don't remember talking about much other than jj.

[Big Cat]

Is there any element, like in a pregame speech before the series starts where you do like a little like, hey, I'm Chris Finch, you know, I was, I was a lower level player. I play, I grinded it out. I played in Europe. And then you got the pretty boy JJ Redick, who we're friends with Duke, and all the accolades in a first, you know, a first round pick, like, you gotta, you gotta beef up that narrative and be like, hey, we're the dogs here. Yeah.

[Chris Finch]

No, I mean, we might play, we might play up on the underdog story, but it won't involve me. I assure you that one thing that, you know, in the NBA, nobody cares where you've come from. No one cares what you've done before. We all got here through different channels. You know, all that matters is, you know, what the heck you're doing and, you know, you're fighting for your teammates and, and, and you know, guys have confidence in that.

[Hank]

So, yeah, you guys are a very fun team to watch. You're a very gritty team, which I, I appreciate. Obviously Ant gets a lot of the accolades, but is there somebody that you would say, you know, taking him out, who's the most important player? Maybe not the best, but the most important player for you?

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, I mean, I mean, Rudy Gobert is just so impactful on both sides of the ball. I think, you know, Rudy is a very polarizing player in the league, but, you know, having been with him now for three years, like, he just, his, his value cannot be overestimated. It's just so important to everything that we do. You know, he brings it every single night. You know, and it, it takes a, takes a while for, for guys to learn to play with Rudy where you can really maximize him and he can help you. So he would certainly be up there. I mean, we have so many guys that are just so important to our success. You got Mike Conley. I mean, he's just kind of humming away in the background all the time. Time just super steady. When we need him to step up and do more, you know, more of scoring, he does it easy, seamlessly. Jaden McDaniels just kind of just took another big step forward for us this year. I think his growth and becoming a legitimate two way player has been very, very important. Yeah, it's, it's really hard to just single out a single one guy. We've had so many guys with great seasons. Nikhil Alexander Walker has been in many ways our most consistent guy. From day one this season. Both sides of the ball just really settled into his role. It's fun to watch him kind of become the player that he's become, you know, after some early struggles in the league, which is not unusual for a lot of guys who come in the league with a lot of expectation and, and put a lot of pressure on themselves. Takes them a minute to figure it out. But since he's been with us, it's just been such a joy to watch. And he's, he's been so important.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. All right, so I, I, I saw some of social media which you, you've had comments on saying that using Joe Ingles as your Luca, you know, model in practice is not going to work. What is he able to do, though, to replicate it? Cause it does. Maybe he's not. He's not luca, but he also has a lot of smarts and, and you're able to maybe give you looks. So how does that work when you're. When you're trying to mimic a player like Luca and how you're going to defend him in a series?

[Chris Finch]

Well, of course, it's, you know, if we had an exact Luca replica, we'd probably be a 70 win team.

[Big Cat]

Right.

[Chris Finch]

So nobody can go out and replicate these players in practice. But Joe is extremely intelligent, is an unbelievable pick a role player. You know, he understands, like, all the different coverages that a team would try to employ, and he can understand how to try to manipulate that or take advantage of it. So, you know, it's, It's. It's what we've, you know, we're fortunate enough to have him in a lot of ways. His leadership has been great for us and our young players this year. He hasn't been on court as much as we thought when we did sign him, but that was before the trade happened and we got Dante and we got a little deeper as a result. But all that being said, Joe has a incredible amount of experience and he can bring that to, you know, our preparation.

[Big Cat]

I got a free tip for you. You don't have to take it, but have you thought about. We saw Luka go back to Dallas. He was very emotional when he saw the video. Have you thought about maybe playing into that? Maybe playing the same video when he comes to Minnesota? Maybe we get a couple fans wearing Luka Mavs jerseys in the front row, maybe changing some of your play calls to just be like Dallas Mavericks, like, over and over, just to keep reminding him about the Mavs and get in his head a little bit.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah. I think we're gonna leave Luca alone.

[Big Cat]

Okay. All right. Hey, listen, I said free tip. You didn't have to take it, but just something to think about.

[Hank]

Maybe you pencil in a little unibrow on Rudy. That might be a good. Yeah, get inside his head a little bit.

[Big Cat]

Just have him constantly be thinking about Dallas instead of thinking about the Minnesota Timberwolf Wolves.

[Chris Finch]

All right, we'll do.

[Hank]

Are you guys, like, what's it. What's the difference for. For a casual fan watching in the regular season as opposed to the playoffs in terms of how you approach it as a head coach? Are there anything. Is there anything that you're going to be doing differently for game one as opposed to if you were to play the Lakers in, I don't know, early February.

[Chris Finch]

Well, I think, you know, yeah, there's certainly you're dialed into another level of game plan preparation. I think sometimes in the league you play a game might be a back to back, you're playing on a turnaround, you have your base defense, you know what you're trying to do, and you make the adjustments. Might be small, you know, might be nothing super radical. And I don't think you go into the, into the playoffs being radical either. But you do have a week's worth of game planning preparation, and you can go through a lot of different scenarios, whether it be plan B, plan C, you know, that kind of stuff. You, you become a lot more matchup focused, I would think. And also, you just, you know, you try to take things away and you put a lot of time and energy and effort into that. So there are some pretty big differences. I would say that is one of the huge advantages of, you know, avoiding the playing is that you have a week to kind of maybe reinvent yourself along certain lines.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, so. So in a game to game, because I, I love watching the play because it feels like every game you see, you know, adjustments and counter adjustments. From a coach's perspective, you go into a series, is it just a total feel of like, okay, now it's time to adjust after say, game one? Or is it Sometimes you're like, hey, we got to just trust what we came in here with and maybe not adjust till it's elimination time. Or how does that really work where you're weighing like, hey, let's do something totally different after game one, because we got to change it, otherwise we're going to be in trouble quickly.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, that's a great question. I think that's, that, that strikes at the heart of what playoff coaching really is. It's certainly you got to be ready to make adjustments, willing to make adjustments, but sometimes, you know, you got to just do it better. And so that's a feel thing. You, it's kind of like you'll know it when you see it sometimes. And you. There's a lot, you know, in the playoffs, there's a lot of outside noise. Everybody's talking about, you know, game one and what's going to happen with game two. And there's so many extremes and, you know, everyone thinks what's just happened is always what's going to happen again. It's just not the case. You know, I think One thing that kind of stands out when you see a lot of the playoffs in the modern era is you'll see a lot of blowouts in the playoffs. You never used to see blowouts in the playoffs 25, 30 years ago unless it was a 18 series, you know, but, you know, now you'll see. You'll see a team that's favored, they might get dumped by 20 plus points one night, you know, so. So I do think that, you know, the. There's a course of a reaction, overreaction cycle that goes on here, and the last thing I'd say about adjustments is that you got to be able to make them because, you know, you got to be able to execute them. You have to have it in your arsenal. Like, the obvious thing might be to, let's say, switch everything or not switch something or go zone. You have to still be able to do it. Like, your personnel has to lend itself to be able to do these things. So it's not like you can just go out and do things that your personnel is not capable of delivering or. Or. Or systematically. You can't be that radical and change everything. So. Or you're not going to be very good at it either. So it's kind of a balancing act there.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Yeah.

[Big Cat]

I also am curious the, like, going up against a guy like Luke and obviously LeBron is LeBron, but the mentality of a player that you're coaching and trying to explain to them that, like, hey, he's probably going to get 30. Like, we got to make it harder for him to get 30, but he's going to probably get 30. And how. How you get someone to, like, mentally be locked in where it's like, if someone puts 30 up, naturally you're going to be like, man, I didn't do well tonight, but Luke is such an incredible offensive player. And you could say the same for Ant, where it's like, hey, it doesn't matter. We know he's going to do that. It's just trying to make it as difficult as possible with him and keeping everyone, like, knocked down on themselves when he does go for 35.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, that's, you know, that's the. That's the choice we make coming into a lot of these games, whether it be playoffs or regular season, it's really hard to stop star players, you know, it's hard to take them out of the game completely. And if you do so, of course you're leaving other things wide open. So you're daring other people to beat you. And some of that is, you know, that I think that goes to a different level in the playoffs. I think there's, you'll see a lot of that just guys who are quote unquote unguarded to, to so we can, you know, put more time and attention to the star player or take away something that team really is trying to do. But we also have the benefit of like measuring efficiency. Now it's in game and we can. If you're going to give 30 points on 27 shots, you know that generally that's a good, that's a win for the defense as long as you're not fouling at a high rate too. So, you know, it takes a mental toughness. I have a great admiration for a lot of these players like Jaden McDaniels types who gets that matchup every single night. You know, who's got to go out there and battle and it doesn't look like he might win. You know, we played Denver this year and you know, of course Jokic had 61 on U.S. 1 time. The time before that he had 36. But you know, in the 36 point game we felt we had done a really good job on him. So. And that was largely Rudy's matchup that night. And we didn't do a lot of doubling and we didn't do a lot of gimmicky stuff. So it was just him and Rudy and you know, sometimes it's just about a war of attrition. Can you wear them down and hopefully they miss one of the shots at the end?

[Hank]

Yeah, yeah. You guys have had some, some incredible comebacks too. I'm thinking to last year against the Nuggets is one. I think Oklahoma City this year you might have been down by even more against Oklahoma City when you came back. Have you considered not getting down by 25 points and just playing with the lead the entire game?

[Chris Finch]

No, I haven't actually. We. We actually say let's get down big and race back into fourth and it'll be exciting for everyone.

[Hank]

Yeah, no, I mean, as a coach, that must be like. It's got to be a great feeling when your team executes. You're never out of it. You're able to come back. But also the first three quarters have to be excruciating to be like we're. I can't believe we're losing by 20 right now. Yeah.

[Chris Finch]

Well, I would tell you this. We just lost a game to the Milwaukee Bucks where we're up 24 to start the fourth and we lost in the fourth. Quarter, and that was far more excruciating than being down for three quarters of winning. So that's the league today, though. You know, these massive swings, I think that's what makes the league super exciting right now. Not just the style of play, the pace of play, the three point shot. I love the fact that the league has let more defense come back in. I think that's also aided in a lot of these runs and these big swings. So, yeah, I think it's. It starts with defense. You know, of course, you never want to be down, but it starts with your defense. And if you can play defense and get stops, you can turn any game around now with the pace of play and the three point shooting.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Would you say that you have better blobs or slobs?

[Chris Finch]

That's a good question. I would say we're probably better blobs. Okay.

[Big Cat]

Okay. Do you have, like two or three blobs that you're like. These are. Do you have a blob that you. You have, like, break in case of emergency?

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, we have a few of those.

[Big Cat]

I love that. I love that. Do you have a couple that you're like? I. I would. If I were a coach, I would just have one blob that's like, I'm not gonna break this out until, like, game seven of the finals. Like, this is my. This is the best blob I've ever come up with.

[Chris Finch]

Well, you know, it's funny you say that, because every year we do this, you know, we. We have plays that we hold back for special situations, and then maybe you never get to those special situations, and they're really, really good plays. So you'll go the whole season and maybe never run it but one time. So we've started rethinking some of that. We figure, like, we might as well run this stuff just at any old time, because if we feel it's good, it's. You know, you might as well try it.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

Yeah. If I had a blob that I was in love with, I. I could tell myself that I'm. I'm saving it for the NBA Finals, but then I'm coaching the All Star Game. I'm like, we really need a bucket right now. I would not. I would not have the discipline to be able to hold on to my blob for that long, so. So credit to you.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Chris Finch]

Have you seen the All Star game? It's pretty easy to get a bucket.

[Hank]

It is, it is.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

But actually, my two blobs, I think, would be the alley oop off the blob, and then the throw the ball off the guy's back when he's looking away.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

And then catch that. Those are the only two I would ever run. I'd be very easily, easily defeated. You were talking about efficiency earlier. Do you believe in long twos? Because when, When I'm watching NBA games, my favorite two things to say are, you don't need a three here when you're down big late, and then that's an inefficient shot. If somebody takes a long two, what's your philosophy on those?

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, I think there's. Yeah, of course. I believe in the long, too. It's part of the game for sure. I think there's definitely a time and a place to use it. You know, when we talk about shot selection with our guys, we have built in kind of that shot in certain contexts. What I would say is that, like, you know, you got to make a lot of them to be really good. And with the number of threes that are shot in the league right now, it's just hard to keep pace sometimes if you're just going to live with the twos, which a lot of teams are willing to do defensively. So I always tell our guys, when it comes to hard shots or whatever, like, you know, it's, it's. You can make that shot. No one's denying that you can't. Might be at 45%, which is pretty good. It might be at 50, which is great. But most likely it's in the low 40s. You. It's just really hard to make a living on that shot. So, you know, you just gotta be so, so good at it and such high volume that just to counter what's going on at the other end of the floor more than anything else.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So Anthony Edwards, who's a phenom, and last year was kind of his, like, coming out party in the playoffs, Obviously he was good before that, but that was like the national coming out party. When you're, when you're coaching him, are there games where you're like, you see it in his eyes or he tells you something and it's like, we can just, just let Ant do what he wants to do because he's got it right now. Like, is that a, is that a field thing or does he actually say it to you like, hey, coach, I got this tonight. Like, I'm, I'm feeling great?

[Chris Finch]

I mean, it's, it's more of a feel thing. It's a look thing. You can tell since, since I've got, since I got here, which was in the midst of ants rookie year. You know, you could tell. I remember his first 40 point game, which was against Phoenix shortly after the All Star break. It was kind of an awakening for him. He has incredible confidence in himself and his ability to, to, to go out and do his thing. Always has, even before he had figured out how to do it largely. But once he started to kind of figure it out, you know, he's, he's always had this incredible sense for the moment within a game of like knowing when to take over and it could be defensively too. And then he gets on these mini runs and he could turn a quarter or turn a game around in a heartbeat. And it's, it's pretty cool to watch, you know, kind of know when it's coming because you can feel it. He makes a few momentum plays for himself or his teammates and that's one of the things I think, you know, he's learned a lot in this, in these few the early years. He's, you know, he's way more thinking the game than he had early on. I do think one thing that I've always let him do is I've coached him hard, we've held him accountable, coached him hard, but we give him incredible amount of freedom to figure it out. And I think that was the only way he was going to learn. You know, if he went into a super, you know, overly structured kind of patterned environment, I'm not sure that that would have benefited him early on. If he went into a system where there was a ton of like off ball movement and cutting and reading and all that kind of stuff. I'm not sure that would have benefited him early on. Now he understands that, but just kind of giving him a big platform to do his thing and what was most comfortable for him allowed these moments that you're talking about to come about.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Do you ever catch yourself like watching the Jumbotron a little too much when they're replaying a dunk or something that a big moment from him?

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, no doubt. It's been some of those dunks that have a front row seat for. I think most of them happen. Has, have happened right in front of the bench too, which has been kind of cool.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Hank]

What's he like in practice? Has he done things in practice that just amaze you?

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, like in practice he, he'll. He'll just take over part of practice. One thing we preached to him when he was, you know, early on was like, you know, if you want to be the best player on a team, like, you gotta. You gotta prove it to your teammates in practice. That's where. If you can dominate a practice, you just take over. You know, he's not dunking on everybody in practice, but he'll. You know, we go live and we're playing, and the competitiveness is there in practice, you know, which is. We don't often go live in NBA practice once we get out of preseason. But during preseason, he'll definitely have. These days, you know, in a row where he's setting the tone and he's letting everybody know how good he is.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. So we talked about Lucas play from a coaching perspective. Are you. Do you have a game plan? Are you maybe, like, getting yourself hyped up before the game, being like, I can't let Luca out, complain me to the refs? Like, I have to be ready for his complaining to the refs. I have to match that. Like, are you saying looking in the mirror and being like, hey, you're the coach. You can't let him get to the rest before I get to the refs?

[Chris Finch]

No, that. No, that's. That's kind of a losing battle. I'm not sure you're gonna. You're gonna. That one. I think what's important for us this series is for us to stay super focused on the game. Leave the officials alone. That's the coaches and the players included.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Yeah. That might be the good strategy. Just be like, never say anything to him and let Luca kind of out complain himself and just let them burn out the refs. You know, you can go. Silence. Give the silent treatment to the rest.

[Hank]

You could also learn Slovenian and then translate what Luca is saying so that the. You're like, hey, he just cussed at you.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, that's right.

[Hank]

You couldn't understand it.

[Chris Finch]

I'll just make up Slovenian.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Chris Finch]

And then I don't have to learn it, and then I can say what I want to say.

[Hank]

And that's also. It's also very smart. Are there any words that'll get you teed up that. That maybe we don't know about?

[Chris Finch]

Well, the word bozo got me thrown out of the game.

[Big Cat]

What was the context that.

[Chris Finch]

Offensive. But.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Yeah. What was the context in that?

[Chris Finch]

Oh, God, it was. I just. I was actually having a sidebar conversation with Bradley Beal, and, you know, the official kind of overheard it, so I.

[Hank]

Do feel like, bozo. That one stings. Like, it's, you know, calling somebody a clown. The ref is going to have rabbit ears for that. Was that the only word that you said?

[Chris Finch]

Well, after he threw me out, I think I had a few more words for him. But yeah, but that was, that was kind of it, you know. But yeah, you know, these things are. They all happen in context. And sometimes what I always find after the, after the fact, you always think like, what, you know, what were you so angry about? You know, how did it get to that point? You have these kind of reflective moments where you, you're a little ashamed of yourself. So.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Is there though in your head like a strategic tech that you can take? Because we saw it in like the national championship game where the second half started and it was the refereeing was going one way and then Todd Golden, Florida's coach, got a tech and it then flipped and it was like, I don't know if he did it on purpose, but is there in your head, like, hey, there's a time when I should take a tech here to try to maybe bring a little bit more, you know, balance to the game.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, I think we all, you know, reserve that. Right. And we've all done that. You know, I'll probably, probably use that less about the flow of the game, more about protecting the players.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Chris Finch]

You know, so they don't, so they don't get one or they don't get super frustrated or they know that somebody else is fighting the fight with them.

[Big Cat]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[Hank]

Have you. What was the first meeting between you and a Rod like when he was like, hey, I'm going to come in here. Might own the team.

[Chris Finch]

Trying to think back. So it was cool, pretty cool. He and Mark Lori came in, they talked to us before practice one day, just trying to think. That was way back in, kind of the COVID still the COVID period after, you know, and so is just kind of limited. People were around the team at that point in time anyway. But yeah, they've been great. You know, they've. They've had a really positive impact on the energy of the team, I think. You know, one thing I really like about Alex is, you know, having played high level sports, he, you know, he understands what like a winning environment looks and feels like and those cultures. But yet, you know, he's not a basketball guy. So he doesn't walk around, pretend to know basketball, but he's super inquisitive. He'll ask a lot of questions, asks a lot of really good questions. And it wants to be educated. Very, very appropriate. You know, Mark's similar, Mark's the same, like Mark's really, really smart. He's. He loves the numbers. He's in, into analytics. He builds his own models on whether, you know, trades or draft, you know, all that stuff. But he's not questioning us about pick and roll coverages and substitutions and rotations and all that. So they've been really, really pleasure. Pleasure to have around and, you know, look forward to the. The future with them.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. All right. So, coach, I got one last question. It's been so much fun. We appreciate you joining us. Roback question. R H O-B-A-K.com promo code, take 20. Your first purchase. Q, zips, polos, hoodies, joggers, shorts. Roback.com promo code, take. You had a. You had a. A comment to the, to the media the other day where you're like, hey, I could just go on Twitter. Everyone knows how to coach better than me. I found this guy named ball lover6969 said, Chris Finch is a fucking idiot. I could do the rotations better than him. Do you. Do you want to maybe take his criticism? Should we connect you with him?

[Chris Finch]

No, man. I think he's probably right. You know, it's. This is pretty easy. We just, you know, we just throw up any old person that we think so can do the job out there, and, you know, we just kind of go from there.

[Big Cat]

I also made up that one, but I did. I. You actually, I looked. I looked for Chris Finch, idiot. And it wasn't as much as you'd think, so I think you're doing an okay job. Like, it wasn't. It wasn't that bad. Oh, you gotta wear the throwback jerseys. Are. Is that the plan? The white throwback jerseys say Wolves on them?

[Chris Finch]

No, that was last year's.

[Big Cat]

That. Those are the cleanest jerseys. I think those might be the best jerseys in that. In the NBA right now. You gotta. You gotta. You gotta bring them back.

[Chris Finch]

Yeah, I was disappointed that we didn't have those in the. In the rotation this year, so. But hey, if you want to hear a good one, so. Chris Finch, idiot. I'm sure it's out there. You just probably didn't look hard enough. When I was living in England, I live. Lived in England for about 10 years, and that was at the height of the Office, the British version of the Office. And the one of the characters there who was Todd Packer, like Todd Packer's equivalent, the outside sales guy. Yep, his name was Chris Finch. So that was some fun years because he was basically like the village idiot in that show. And so everybody kind of, you know, latched onto that and tried to, you know, rope my name into it.

[Big Cat]

Oh, that's funny.

[Hank]

That's a tough one.

[Big Cat]

Yeah.

[Hank]

If you look up Chris Finch bozo on Twitter, you will find a couple comments that's. That's way worse than calling you an idiot.

[PFT Commenter]

Yeah.

[Hank]

These guys should all be blocked.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. All right, well, coach, best of luck in the playoffs and great having you on.

[Chris Finch]

Okay. Appreciate it, guys. Thanks, man.

[Hank]

Part of my take is sponsored by Better Help. Let's talk numbers. Traditional in person therapy can cost anywhere from 100 to 250 doll dollars per session. That adds up fast. But with better help online therapy, you can save on average up to 50% per session. And this month, BetterHelp is giving you the biggest discount on starting therapy that I've ever offered on the show. 90 off your first week, guys. Don't miss this. Therapy should feel accessible, not like luxury. With online therapy, you get quality care at a price that makes sense and can help you with anything from anxiety to everyday stress. I've gone to therapy in the past. I've benefited from it tremendously. With over 30, 000 therapists, BetterHelp is the world's largest online therapy platform, having served over 5 million people globally. It's convenient too. You can join a session with a click of a button. Helping you fit therapy into your busy life. Your well being is worth it. Visit betterhelp.com pmt today. Get 10 off your first month. That's betterhelp help.com pmt okay, let's do numbers.

[Big Cat]

The warriors have won game one. Welcome to the playoffs, Rockets.

[Hank]

Listen, everybody wants to crown the Oklahoma City Thunder. The warriors look really good.

[Big Cat]

They do.

[Hank]

Everybody out there is putting so much respect on them. Feels a little bit disrespectful to the one time champs, the warriors.

[Big Cat]

The. The one time champs?

[Hank]

Yeah. Well, I mean at one point, yeah.

[Big Cat]

Former champs the. I give credit to the Rockets for fighting. I thought that game was over. Yeah, they fought back. Made it like a four point game. But yeah, warriors different. I think this would be a good series, but little. Welcome to the. To the NBA. Plus all the young teams. The Rockets what?

[Max]

Continue.

[Big Cat]

All the young teams that are welcoming themselves to playoffs. The Rockets, the Pistons, the Magic were in the playoffs last year, but tough.

[Max]

Any other young teams?

[Big Cat]

Well, the Thunder were in the playoffs last year.

[Max]

Oh, just this year.

[Big Cat]

I'm saying the Rockets, like they haven't. They had a really good season, but they're very young. Same with the Pistons.

[Hank]

Might be a year too early for them.

[Big Cat]

And that kind of went the same way where it's like, fourth quarter. The older team, the veteran team, like, hey, this is winning time.

[Max]

I agree.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. Okay. Numbers three.

[Max]

19.

[Big Cat]

Oh, memes didn't have his. I have to adjust the camera. Did you want three now? I'll go 17. Take three now. For what?

[PFT Commenter]

Three.

[Big Cat]

Okay, I'll keep three.

[Hank]

What are you going 17 for? That guy who won WrestleMania number 17.

[Big Cat]

Oh, we don't say his name.

[Hank]

Yeah, we don't say his name. Travis Scott. Travis Scott.

[Max]

Champ.

[Big Cat]

I think people were upset about WrestleMania. You know what put me in that. In that camp.

[Hank]

I'm pissed.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. One, two. I wanted Cody Rhodes to win.

[Max]

This is the Rock's fault.

[Big Cat]

Yeah. 99. Pug. Sure. What did you say PFT was?

[Hank]

93.

[Big Cat]

Memes. I see. By the way. All right, we'll do the number. So I'm probably gonna get it. I'm probably gonna get three.

[Hank]

So close.

[Big Cat]

Memes. I see that you're running with this. I'm never gonna get the 5050 lottery. You're never gonna get it? Yeah. Never. The. The thing that it's, like, I do probably 20 times a year, and it's a one in, like, 20,000 chance versus the thing you do three times a week. One in 100 chance.

[Hank]

Yours is technically 50.

[Big Cat]

50. That's a good counterpart. All right, let's do one more. Three. Damn it.

[Max]

19.

[Hank]

17. 60. Just 61.

[Big Cat]

99.

[Hank]

Po.

[Big Cat]

32. 34.

[Max]

I feel like 34 has been hot.

[Big Cat]

That's double 17 memes.

[Hank]

Love you guys.

[Big Cat]

It's.