Podcast Summary: Passion Struck with John R. Miles

Episode 674: Dr. Bobby Parmar on Why Great Leaders Embrace Radical Doubt
Date: October 9, 2025
Guest: Dr. Bobby Parmar (Professor of Business Administration at UVA’s Darden School)

Episode Overview

This episode explores why embracing radical doubt is not a weakness, but a vital leadership skill and personal superpower. Host John R. Miles sits down with Dr. Bobby Parmar—author, researcher, and business school professor—to discuss how leaders (and all individuals) can harness uncertainty as a catalyst for better decisions, personal growth, and organizational resilience. Together, they unpack Dr. Parmar’s latest book, Radical Doubt: Turning Uncertainty into Surefire Success, highlight practical neuroscientific frameworks for decision-making, and examine real-world dilemmas from the C-suite to everyday life.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Dr. Parmar’s Journey with Doubt

• Non-linear Path & Identity:

  • Dr. Parmar shares how his personal and professional journey was shaped not by certainty, but “living in-between things,” from being a first-generation American to shifting careers away from medicine.
  • Quote: "When I was in college I was to be a doctor... I think throughout my life, being a first generation American, I've always felt in between things, in between communities, in between ideas. And I've always had this fascination with how people deal with being in between and the doubt that can foster..." (06:09)

• Martial Arts Example:

  • Leaving a long-established martial arts community forced him to re-evaluate his identity and relationship with uncertainty—an experience that became the seed for his research into leadership and doubt.

The Nature of Doubt in Decision-Making

• Doubt as a Superpower:

  • Dr. Parmar argues doubt isn’t paralyzing if we train ourselves to “pause and piece things together,” much like how physical discomfort signals growing muscles, mental discomfort signals opportunity for learning.
  • Quote: "Doubt is like that signal, but for your mind, it's saying, this is the part where I'm about to get smarter or more capable or learn something new." (12:45)

• The Three Brain Systems:

  • Pursue System: Motivates action toward rewards.
  • Protect System: Motivates avoidance of risks or threats.
  • Pause and Piece Together System: Engaged by uncertainty, facilitates deeper learning and adaptation.
  • Quote: "There are times where there are conflicting signals... And this third aspect of the brain... I call that our pause and piece together system. And this is the part of the brain that notices uncertainty, and it says, wait a second..." (11:10)

• The Danger of Being a ‘Right Answer Getter’:

  • Many leaders and teams default to seeking the “right answer,” missing real growth opportunities that exist in experimentation. Successful leadership requires becoming a “better answer maker.”
  • Quote: "When we're better answer makers, we stumble. We learn to pick ourselves back up again, and we try again. And we try again." (27:06)

Real-World Application: Case Studies

Business Innovation Paralysis

• Catalina Marketing Case:
  • John discusses a missed innovation opportunity at his company where organizational doubt led to decision paralysis—even though incremental, low-cost experiments were proposed.
  • Dr. Parmar’s diagnosis:
    • Doubt, plus fear = paralysis.
    • Doubt, plus motivation = curiosity—and the environment must be cultivated to convert doubt into learning, not avoidance. (16:14)
    • Effective leaders help others work through (not around) self-doubt.

Performance vs. Culture: The “Jerk Star” Dilemma

• Scenario:
  • How should leaders handle high-performing but toxic team members?
  • Dr. Parmar’s advice:
    • Novices reduce complex situations to one simple criterion and make impulsive decisions.
    • Experts treat intuition as a hypothesis, actively seek disconfirming evidence, and explore mitigation strategies.
    • Quote: "Novice decision makers have this intuition... and they use that intuition as their decision. What we notice from more experienced decision makers is they use that intuition as a hypothesis." (33:01)

Frameworks and Practical Tools

Information vs. Application

• Dr. Parmar emphasizes that information alone rarely changes behavior—application, practice, and feedback are essential. He advocates for:
  • Experiential Learning: “It’s not just that we lecture... You have to put that information into practice.” (24:05)
  • Community Accountability: Peer support and shared action keep intentions from languishing.

The Five Steps for Meeting Moments of Doubt

1. Define who you want to be
2. Zoom out (take a broader perspective)
3. Generate and refine ideas
4. Prepare to offer justifications
5. Assemble a recommendation

• Zooming Out: Changing perspective exposes blind spots and uncovers risks/benefits invisible from one vantage point.
  • Quote: "Looking at that choice from different angles ... illuminates some aspect of the decision that maybe wasn't visible from a certain vantage point." (39:19)

How Experts Decide Under Uncertainty

• Don’t Use Intuition as a Decision:

  • Treat gut feeling as a starting hypothesis, not a conclusion.
  • Continuously look for contrary evidence and adjust.
  • Decision-making is a learning process, not a one-shot answer.
  • Quote: “Experts don't treat their intuition as their decision. Many novices have an intuition… and then they twist the world so that answer A is the right one.” (41:22)

• Harness Groups—but the Right Kind:

  • Assemble a team willing to challenge each other and share uncomfortable truths.
  • Groups should increase, not eliminate, perspective diversity and constructive friction.

Applying Radical Doubt Beyond the Boardroom

Navigating Global and Personal Uncertainties

• Macro Level (Society):
  • Don’t get overwhelmed by all uncertainty at once; pick issues to focus on with actionable steps and leverage expertise and community.
• Micro Level (Young Professionals/Students):
  • No single “right path”; focus on experimenting, skill-building, and adaptability rather than perfect long-term prediction.
  • Reframe career anxiety by recognizing that pivots are natural in uncertain times.

Rapid-Fire Wisdom from Dr. Parmar (50:39–52:59)

• #1 Sign a Team is Faking Certainty:
  “Speed.” (50:52)
• Great Decisions Start With:
  “Humility.” (50:54)
• Intuition—Trust it or Test it?:
  “Test it.” (51:06)
• Leaders Should Ask More Often:
  “What did we learn today?” (51:13)
• One Meeting Ritual to Ban:
  “Trust falls.” (51:22)
• Best Metric for Measuring Uncertainty:
  “Ambivalence—do people have things they’re excited about and concerned about at the same time?” (51:41)
• Recommended Book (not his own):
  “The Social Psychology of Organizations” by Karl Weick. (52:32)
• Historical Figure Modeling Radical Doubt:
  John Dewey (with a nod to host's suggestion of General Patton) (52:47)
• Parting Message:
  “Doubt doesn't mean that there's something wrong with you or that you're not smart enough. Doubt is actually the part of decision making where you're getting stronger.” (53:10)

Notable Quotes

• On Embracing Doubt’s Signals:
  “By embracing doubt and seeing it as a signal for learning, we’re able to pay attention to these multiple aspects of a decision... because if I keep going down this path, I'm going to wake up and regret that life that I've led.” — Dr. Bobby Parmar (00:02, 35:05)

• On Decision-Making:
  “Experts don’t treat their intuition as their decision... They treat their intuition as if it’s a hypothesis.” — Dr. Bobby Parmar (41:22)

• On Doubt and Leadership Growth:
  “Doubt isn’t a dead end. It’s an invitation to pause, to piece things together, to build better answers rather than chase the illusion of the right one.” — John R. Miles (53:39)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [06:09] Dr. Parmar’s journey with doubt and identity
• [12:45] The physical metaphor of “doubt is muscle growth for the mind”
• [16:14–22:08] Real world corporate doubt and innovation blockade
• [24:05] Why information alone doesn’t change behavior
• [27:06–28:31] Right answer getters vs. better answer makers
• [33:01] Navigating toxic high performers
• [35:05] Multi-criteria problems and personal values
• [39:19] The importance of zooming out and perspective shifting
• [41:22] Expert vs. novice decision-making patterns
• [50:39–52:59] Rapid-fire leadership questions
• [53:10] Dr. Parmar’s parting message

Final Takeaways

• Doubt is not a weakness, but a leadership muscle. It’s essential for innovation, values-based action, and resilient decision-making across life and business.
• Leaders must cultivate environments where doubt can be shared, tested, and leveraged. Both solo reflection and collaborative feedback are key.
• There is freedom and power in seeing ourselves as ‘better answer makers’—willing to run experiments, learn, and adapt—rather than chasing perfection or false certainty.

Learn More

• Dr. Parmar’s new book, Radical Doubt, and further resources are available at [radicaldoubt.com] and via his LinkedIn.
• Download the workbook for actionable steps on the episode’s themes at the host’s Substack: theignitedlife.net.