ESPN SUMMER LAYOFFS, some big names on here

Summary

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Payne & Pendergast – July 22, 2026

Episode Theme: ESPN Summer Layoffs & Houston Astros and Texans Deep-Dive
[Hosts: Seth Payne & Sean Pendergast | Source: Audacy]

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Overview

In this episode, Seth Payne and Sean Pendergast tackle two main topics dominating Houston sports and national sports media:

1. Astros’ Trade Deadline Dilemma: Are the Houston Astros truly contenders or should they embrace a soft reset? The hosts break down the team’s inconsistency, potential trade pieces (with Jeremy Peña front and center), and the organizational philosophy under owner Jim Crane.
2. ESPN Summer Layoffs: Reaction to ESPN’s high-profile on-air talent layoffs, what it means for sports media, and why former athletes are less bothered these days by such moves.

The episode is loaded with both sharp baseball/football analysis and freewheeling banter—plus some sage career advice applicable beyond sports.

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Astros' Big Win & Playoff Hopes (01:30–06:00)

Baseball Recap & Playful Banter

• Astros’ recent 5-1 win thanks to Isak Paredes’ three-run homer, keyed by Yordan Alvarez’s hustle after a strikeout (“He moves faster than you expect... He’s like a Bison,” – Sean, 02:41).
• Lively chat about home run call catchphrases and local announcer traditions.

The State of the Astros: Are They Treading Water?

• Sean: “Two days ago, we're doing segments about who they're trading away, and now they win two in a row... they're kind of back in the mix right now.” (03:37)
• Seth: “My feeling is they're just going to be treading water like this the rest of the year, probably.”

Pitching Troubles & Recent Improvements

• Astros pitching staff still ranks among MLB’s worst in ERA; recent bright spots noted in Blanco’s return and Imai’s development.
• Seth: “Blanco looked very promising... Imai has looked a lot better... But the bad performances have been horrendously bad.” (03:56–04:44)

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Should the Astros Buy, Sell, or Stand Pat? (06:00–14:00)

The Looming Trade Deadline (August 3)

• Astros are 49-54. Are they buyers, sellers, or honest evaluators?
• Sean references Jeff Passan’s ESPN ranking of trade candidates: “There’s five Astros in the top 62... Jeremy Peña is 7 on this list. Josh Hader is 21st, Isak Paredes is 23rd.” (07:02)

The Peña Question

• Passan gives Peña a “35%” chance to be moved at the deadline (“That feels high,” says Seth – 08:04).
• Key issues with Peña as a trade chip:
  • Recently signed with agent Scott Boras (“That’s a big one,” – Sean, 08:24)
  • Increasing injury woes (“He’s had a lot of injuries for a guy who’s in good shape,” – Sean, 08:57)
  • Overperformance doubts (“Last year... was considered a lucky performance or aided by Minute Maid park... war was a little bit illusory,” – Seth, 09:26–09:56).

Organizational Philosophy: The Soft Reset Dilemma

• Sean argues Jim Crane’s “biggest fear” isn’t losing per se, but “a slew of empty seats” and a return to early 2010s irrelevance:
  “In 2013, Amy and I took all three of my kids to an Astros game with a buy one, get three deal... We spent $13 on tickets, but $150 at the concession stand.” (12:47)
• Attendance, not just wins, drive team decisions.
• Seth: “This is Jim Crane’s version of a reset... it was volume over quality on pitching... humming along and competitive but not major swings.” (11:36)

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Is Three Years of Losing Worth Six Years of Greatness? (17:20–22:00)

“Would you suck for three years for another six years of greatness?”

• Sean posts this question via “Pender poll.”
• Seth: “Everybody always says yes. This is the problem. Somewhere in the middle of those three years, you're gonna lose faith... In hindsight, sure, you say it was worth it... that's not how people felt [in 2013]. People were disengaged. People were just flat out disgusted...” (19:21)
• Comparison to the NFL’s Browns—tanking doesn’t guarantee a winning payoff.

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ESPN Summer Layoffs: Who Moves the Needle? (22:00–28:40)

Top Layoff Headlines

• Key names: Carl Ravich, Ryan Clark, Cam Newton, Bart Scott among others.
• Seth highlights Charles Davis (kept by CBS), but for true “needle movers,” it’s Carl Ravich (“He’s been there 33 years... as tied to one sport as any ESPN personality” – Sean, 22:45).

Generational Impact

• Older fans: Carl Ravich.
• Younger fans: Cam Newton and Ryan Clark.

Entertaining Tidbits & Hairpiece Jokes

• Sean: “Carl Ravich, all-time hairpiece Team Mount Rushmore. That’s a hairpiece. Yes, and has been since the early '90s.” (23:16, laugh-out-loud moment)

Athlete-Analyst Transitions in the Era of Self-Branding

• Cam Newton’s take, read by Sean (25:15):
  “I want you to learn one rule about the times we live in right now. If you don’t own your own platform, you’re going to get overlooked, bypassed, and be extinct. Like dinosaurs.”
• Seth: “What a schmuck. He believes in dinosaurs.” (25:31, joking)
• Modern former athletes—with podcasts, streaming deals—are less reliant on ESPN and can land soft, even lucrative, “fall-backs” (think Pat McAfee’s $60M rumored deal).
• Discussion of how “platform” now trumps network, and how the industry is shifting accordingly.

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Career Wisdom: “The Notre Dame Rule” (30:03–32:11)

Hiring/Firing and Liking Who You Work With

• Seth shares classic advice from his sales days: “The Notre Dame test—if I want to kick the bleep out of someone by the time I get to Notre Dame from Chicago, don’t hire them.” (31:35)
• For Houston, Sean dubs it “The Baytown rule”—same logic, but the drive is to Baytown or the Golden Nugget in Lake Charles.
• Practical lesson: Being likable can be the tiebreaker in job survival.

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Texans' Secret Sauce: Drafting and Developing Defensive Backs (38:01–45:15)

Are the Texans the NFL’s Best at Staffing the DB Room?

• Sean: “The only high pick in that room is Derek Stingley.”
• Seth credits not just Nick Caserio’s draft eye, but also synergy with HC DeMeco Ryans (“It’s always about the mix of your GM and your head coach and how well they work together,” – 38:28).
• Praise for position coaches (esp. Dino Vasso), and Houston’s willingness to target “distressed assets” (not Day 1/2 picks).

Secret: Buy Low from USC?

• Houston’s drafted at least five USC players in the last three years, mostly day-three picks:
  “And yet they draft all these USC guys and they never brag about the program. They’re buying low on those guys.” (42:25)
• Humor in how teams love “coachable programs” but secretly loot underperforming programs for hidden gems.

Notable Development Track Record

• Most low-drafted Texans DBs never flourish elsewhere after leaving; indicates Houston squeezes value from marginal talent.
• A rare miss: Roy Lopez, who made a name elsewhere, but not many others.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “He moves faster than you expect… like a Bison.” – Sean (02:41)
• “Don’t ruin this with analytics, Sean! … You’re sucking out all the Dana Brown right now—the mystique of the game.” – Seth, playfully (03:30)
• “It’s just a matter of actually getting to that point… if he gets to the third inning, he’s going to make it to the sixth.” – Sean (04:47, on Astros pitching)
• “This is Jim Crane’s version of a reset.” – Seth (11:36)
• “Three years of pain, six years of glory? Everyone says yes, but somewhere in the middle, you lose faith.” – Seth (19:21)
• “If you don’t own your own platform, you’re going to get overlooked, bypassed, and be extinct. Like dinosaurs.” – Cam Newton via Sean (25:15)
• “Carl Ravich—hairpiece Team Mount Rushmore.” – Sean (23:16)
• “The Notre Dame test—if you want to kick the bleep out of them by the time you get to Notre Dame, don’t hire them.” – Seth (31:35)
• “The Baytown rule—if you want to beat the snot out of the person by Buc-ee’s, don’t hire them.” – Patrick Creighton through Sean (35:12)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:30–06:00: Astros win recap, pitching analysis, depth on Imai’s improvements
• 06:00–14:00: Astros’ trade-deadline philosophy, Peña trade rumors, club philosophy on resets
• 17:20–22:00: Would fans accept a tank for a longer title window?
• 22:00–28:40: ESPN firings, platform vs. network debate, athlete reactions, and industry changes
• 30:03–32:11: “Notre Dame/Baytown Rule”—wisdom on hiring & workplace harmony
• 38:01–45:15: Texans’ DB room construction, success with “distressed assets,” why Houston drafts USC players

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Final Takeaways

• Astros: The next two weeks will dictate the franchise’s future—heavy on internal debates about whether to reload, retool, or risk a sell-off, all with the specter of business/in-game attendance looming for owner Jim Crane.
• ESPN Layoffs: The sports media landscape is shifting rapidly; name-brand talent, especially athletes with existing platforms, are insulated from the old fear of layoffs.
• Texans: Houston’s roster-building prowess—especially in the secondary—is a product of good scouting, coaching, and finding market inefficiencies (e.g., under-coached programs like USC).
• Career/Life Advice: Talent matters, but being likable and easy to travel with can be the real job security.

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For Houston fans and beyond, this episode is a masterclass in sports talk—fun, sharp, and packed with insight on not only teams, but how to navigate success in any industry.

Transcript

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[Sean Pendergast]

Home Sports Radio 610 presents Payne and

[Pain]

Pendergast gives Paredes a chance for an RBI here with two outs, first and third. Two outs and he hits the ball high in the air, deep to left field and that hustle's gonna pay off. A three run homer and the Astros lead it five to one. Little bit of hustle guy behind you just esox one out of here.

[Sean Pendergast]

Love it.

[Pain]

Isoc Paredes a three run bomb off the community leaderboard and the Astros have a four run lead.

[Sean Pendergast]

Okay, that was Todd Blum and Jeff. Todd Blum. Todd Callis. Jeff Blum on the call Space City Home Network. I got to admit, when cause we know Blum likes to do the, the, you know the, the home run calls with the little jokes and things like that. I thought that when he they were talking about the hustle. Obviously they were talking about if you missed it, Jordan Alvarez the at bat before Paredes hit that Home run, struck out. But the ball got away from the catcher. And Jordan really did hustle down to first base.

[Pain]

It took him a second to realize it, but he did realize it and hustled. And as we all know, he can move fast. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

When he wants to, for sure. He's like a Bison, you know?

[Pain]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He moves faster than you expect you.

[Sean Pendergast]

Not all the time, but when it's. When he's motivated, he moves fast. So. So Jordan gets on base. I admit I thought Blum was going to go. We had some of that hustle and then comes Isak with the muscle. I thought we were going to get

[Pain]

a rhyme, but we made a good one.

[Sean Pendergast]

Ye.

[Shannon Maldonado]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

You would have liked that one. Yeah, maybe I need to write his material.

[Pain]

I like all of them. As long as I don't like the. Like every time. Yeah, I like it. Kind of save them for special time. Yeah, yeah. Like every now and then.

[Sean Pendergast]

Because Mark Vandermeer doesn't say rock and roll after.

[Pain]

Yeah. I don't know if he says it anymore.

[Sean Pendergast]

No, he does, he does.

[Pain]

Okay. I didn't remember one from the last year.

[Sean Pendergast]

He's probably listening. Vandy, if you're listening. And I don't know if Vandy. I've never asked him this, if he's got a criteria for it. It's got to be a certain distance of touchdown.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

A certain time of game.

[Pain]

Knows in the moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Or maybe it's just a fee.

[Pain]

Don't ruin this with analytics, Sean. Y.

[Sean Pendergast]

Well, yeah, it is.

[Pain]

You're sucking out all the Dana Brown right now. The mystique of the game.

[Sean Pendergast]

Gut feel, man. You nerd. All right, so the Astros win last night. So they've won two in a row. So two days ago we're doing segments about who they're trading away and now they win two in a row and they're kind of back in the mix right now. I don't know what to make of this team. My feeling is they're just going to be treading water like this the rest of the year. Probably.

[Pain]

Well, okay. This is where as I tend to do, and I know that I was going to do it after they got swept coming out of the All Star break. I couldn't have been any lower. And yet the biggest thing that we've talked about and why I shifted from wanting a left handed outfielder to just wanting a starting pitcher is because there's just so many times this year where it doesn't matter what the offense does. If you're if you're, if your pitching staff has a 6.0 ERA Blanco looked very promising in his return. Imai has looked a lot better. You know, other than his really, really bad performances.

[Sean Pendergast]

I'll say this, there's been way more good than bad since he seem to start to turn it around.

[Pain]

You know what? There have been more good than bad. The trouble is that the bad performances have been bad. Performances have been horrendously bad.

[Sean Pendergast]

They tremendously short too, which kills your bullpen.

[Pain]

Which is one of the weird graphic they were showing last night was that if he does manage to make it late into the game or with a higher pitch count, he gets better as the pitch count gets higher. It's just a matter of actually getting to that point.

[Sean Pendergast]

He's one of those guys like if he gets to the third inning, he's going to make it to the sixth inning.

[Pain]

Well, you know what we saw yesterday was okay. He started to add the change up in, in the second and third time through the order.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

So like he's got that incredible slider, he's got that fastball and you go through the first time through the order and you beat him with your, your go to stuff. But then just by then adding that element in as the is the game went along, you can see why that's what they were hoping to get out of him was a guy that could, that could go deep into games. And I know, look, six, I know six games is like the, this era's version of the complete game.

[Sean Pendergast]

Six innings.

[Pain]

Six innings. What did I say?

[Sean Pendergast]

Six games.

[Pain]

Yeah. That's a big mistake. So six innings, like that was a, that was a very promising performance out of E. Min Absolutely. Well and the other thing too is like that a lot of the turnaround in the reset of the season, it coincides with return of Josh Hater and like so on the pitching side of things, they're still one of the worst teams in the league and in terms of ERA and everything. But it's been the, the trajectory on the relief side has been way better. And then on the starting pitching side you can see maybe a light at the end of the tunnel. If a few ifs come true, give

[Sean Pendergast]

a few ifs come true. Now look, they're, they're going to have to come to grips with what they are over the next really the NET less than two weeks. August 3rd is the trade deadline. Trade deadline actually on the calendar is a few days later than it's normally been. It's on August 3rd. That's a Monday at 5 o'. Clock. So the Astros need to have sort of a clear picture, at least in their minds as to what they are, because the. I know there's people nervous out there about them buying and what they might give up and that maybe Jim Crane, who is. Has a way more of a history of swinging big than standing pat or at least green lighting his GM swinging big. I mean, hell, James Click might have gotten fired because he didn't swing big enough. Yeah. When he was the GM here. So we, we know which way Jim Crane kind of leans in terms of buyer or seller. The problem is, if they're not honest with themselves, if they truly are a seller, and there's more evidence this season so far that they should be selling them, buying their 49 and 54, then they might miss out on an opportunity with a market that could be a seller's market. If there's a lot of teams thinking we can make a playoff run. Jeff Passon of ESPN.com did his top 100 trade candidates. There's five Astros in the top 62. There's three in the top 23. Jeremy Pena is seven on this list. Josh Hader is 21st on the list, and Isak Paredes is 23rd on this list. You actually texted me this article yesterday, and your text me was, man. And he gives a percentage chance of each of these guys getting moved. Of the top 25, top 25 guys getting moved the next 26 to 100. He just lists names, but he does deep dive analysis on the top 25 guys. 35%. Basically a one in three chance he thinks that Jeremy Pena gets moved at the trade deadline.

[Pain]

Yeah, that feels high.

[Sean Pendergast]

I, I agree with you.

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I.

[Sean Pendergast]

When you text me that, I'm like, I agree, that feels high. Not because there wouldn't be a great market for Jeremy Pena, but because that just doesn't feel like something the Astros would do. They've never done that in season.

[Pain]

I mean, the biggest thing that's changed with Jeremy Pena over the last year or so is that he hired Scott Boris as his agent. And that's when.

[Sean Pendergast]

That's a big one.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

And he's become injury prone.

[Pain]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

That's another big one, too.

[Pain]

Yeah. If you start thinking about, boy, if the Astros are going to break their trend of not giving out long term deals, is it going to be to a guy that's not. Not just injuries, but a bunch of soft tissue stuff all the time?

[Sean Pendergast]

Swings the bat and all of a sudden he's out of the game the next inning? You know, so that's. And I'm thinking more through the lens of do. Does that affect his trade value? You know, do our teams looking at Pena and, you know, obviously other teams know this. You know, they're. They look. Are they looking at Pena going. And the guy's missed.

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He.

[Sean Pendergast]

He's been on the injured list a couple times this year already, and he's missed time while still on the roster with a couple of other little bumps and bruises as well. And he missed the last week of last season with an oblique injury also, like, he's had a lot of. He's had a lot of injuries for a guy who's in good shape, man, he's. He's had a lot of injuries. I'm with you. 35% sounds high. The negatives on Pena would be that he's going to drive a hard bargain to get a contract extension done. He's been injury prone. The one benefit is he does have one year of team control.

[Pain]

Yeah. The one thing that getting him for a year and a half, like every team in the league, you know, thinks about this stuff way more analytically these days. Last year's performance, it was. It was considered a lucky performance or aided by Minute Maid park, that it's probably more in line with like, his value as a player. Last year by. By wins above replacement and everything was, you might say, a little bit illusory that.

[Sean Pendergast]

That there's almost six. Yeah.

[Pain]

It was almost 5.7 or 5.7 war.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

Where he's usually been about a 2.5 guy.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yep.

[Pain]

So, like, I don't know, maybe his value is. Is his perceived value is higher than what other teams think of him.

[Sean Pendergast]

Passing says the downside with Pena is there aren't many contenders in need of a shortstop.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

And he's a shortstop. Like, he's not a third baseman or a second base. Like he is a shortstop. Pendy says that's what passion says. Pendy, me says you only need two teams to create a bidding war.

[Pain]

Right.

[Sean Pendergast]

I don't need all. What do we count, like nine teams in the American League alone that are. That are buyers? That's just in the American League. You know, we could go look at the National League and add probably five or six more teams. I just need two of them to be in desperate need of a shortstop and have really good minor league prospects. Yeah, I don't need all of them. Not a vote.

[Pain]

I feel like, you know, we don't ever expect Jim Crane to go through an out, an outright hard reset, or at Least I've, I've. We're, we're, you know, we suspect that he never would. I. Is there part of maybe their long term strategy where we're actually in the middle of the reset? That he wants to stay competitive as possible and that. Look, the. I like in baseball, attendance is a big deal. More so than in the NFL. You know, like the Bengals. The Bengals can make money because of revenue sharing. The Cincinnati Bengals in football can make money if nobody shows up to the stadium money. Baseball, it's a lot different. And attendance really, really matters. Plus I saw on a list the Houston Astros fan base are among the league leaders in amounts spent on games, on food and beer.

[Sean Pendergast]

Hell yeah.

[Pain]

Or at least in calories consumed. I didn't see the monetary break.

[Sean Pendergast]

We are fat and we like to party. Yeah.

[Pain]

Like they're making a lot of money off the people showing up at the park.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes.

[Pain]

And then in some ways, I mean, if you look at Dana Brown's strategy for the pitching this offseason, it was, it was volume over quant quality, it was quantity over quality. And it was a lot of like the things you would do when you're kind of figuring, ok, our farm system at the low, lower levels is starting to be promising. We don't have major league ready guys yet, but if we can maybe find a diamond in the rough with some budget pickups on the pitching side of things and, and keep humming along and be competitive, but not take these major swings, that, that's. This is Jim Crane's version of a reset.

[Sean Pendergast]

I, I'm glad you brought this up. Cause I actually had this conversation with somebody at the game. I was at the game last Friday, the first game out of the All Star break, and was talking to somebody and I. The conclusion I arrived at, I think the thing that scares Jim Crane the most about doing a harder reset, doing something closer to a rebuild, like trading Jeremy Pena would signal to me, you know, that, that, that we're, we're, we're starting to get into a tear it down mode.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

I mean, Jeremy Pena is an iconic player here. He's an MVP of a World Series. I think the thing that scares him the most is a slew of empty seats.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

The vision of what that ballpark looked like from 2011 to 2013. I tell this story all the time. In 2013, Amy and I took all three of my kids to an Astros game. They were in town visiting. My kids were. And they had a deal going on with something like where it was buy one ticket, get three for kids free. And so we bought a $13 ticket in the outfield for Amy. I got in with my media pass and we brought all three of my kids. Now, we did end up spending like 150 bucks at the concession stands.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Beers, helmet Sundays, things like that. But I, I, I think that's the thing that's, I don't think it's the losing that scares Jim Crane. I think losing would anger him because he's a competitive person. I think that as a business person, the thing that scares him would be the, the irrelevance again.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

The.

[Pain]

Well, the 0.0. It's never going to be, it's not going to be 0.0 TV ratings.

[Sean Pendergast]

No.

[Pain]

Like it was. But like, yeah, that's probably burned into him somewhat.

[Sean Pendergast]

You tray. If you, if they turn into a seller at the trade deadline and I, and look, everybody who's arguing that they should. I'm not going to argue against you that functionally, in a vacuum, if these games were just played in empty stadiums and there was nothing to do with revenue of getting butts in seats, that the right thing to do with this team is to tear it down. Like, like empirically and pragmatically, the right thing to do with this team is probably to take a step back for a few years and accumulate some minor league prospects, some good ones. That's probably the right thing to do, but that's not the world we live in. And, and I think that's the scary thing for Jim Crane. The fact of the matter is, if they. Jeff Passon has Pena 7, Hater 21, Paredes 23. He's also got Walker and Abreu a little further down the list. They go trading all these guys. They are certainly, I will blindly say they are way better off in their minor league system with whatever they get for those guys. It also turns into a situation where the only reason you're going to the ballpark is one of two reasons. You just like to go to baseball games.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Or you're watching Jordan Alvarez try to win the mvp.

[Pain]

Right. That's it. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

There's no other reason to go to the ball.

[Pain]

The other, I mean, like, pitchers put butts in seats and you got Hunter Brown. And I think they were hoping that Emi would be a, put a buttons and seats type of guy. The, the, the other part of the organization as a whole. And if you're trying to recapture some of the greatness of the golden era, they had a, they, they were just much better with their Latin American prospects. They they went full bore into Cuba when a lot of other teams were hesitant to and didn't know exactly how to evaluate Cuban prospects. The Astros would end up with the most Cubans in their system of any other Major League Baseball team. And this year, they've turned their sights towards Asia. And they, you know, they, they said in the off season they want to just spend more time over there, explore that more that I think they hope to figure out some kind of competitive edge there. So far, the sum total of the results with Imai have not been great.

[Sean Pendergast]

Not been great. But are we at a stage now with Emi, with the performance that you and I have just cited over the last six weeks or so, where. Okay, I feel better about them dipping over.

[Pain]

No. And if anything, look, if you look at his contract, you know, my biggest fear was that Imai was going to suck in the first half of the season, then the second half of the season was going to play well enough that he could exercise his option and get a bigger deal somewhere else. If you look at that as all right, getting their toe in the water and figuring out they now know all right, at least with this one Japanese player that we brought over, we weren't prepared for how to handle the, how the drastic changes, all of these drastic changes are going to affect them. I feel like the Dodgers probably have a pretty good plan for what the transition is like for Japanese pitchers. The Astros did not. Yep. And like that. But getting, getting those reps and maybe creating opportunities where they get more guys and onboard them more quickly in the future might be something that they could have an edge.

[Sean Pendergast]

All right, Pain and Pendergast with you again, a reminder. Big announcement coming up at the station. A huge announcement coming up. You'll want to be here right at 10am here listening to the toss between myself and Seth and the guys on in the Loop. So be here, be here, just stick around is the easiest thing to do. Coming up next, espn. Boy, they let a lot of big names go yesterday. Who are the names that move the needle for the most for you? And do former athletes, they get let go from these gigs? Does it. Does it bother them anymore? Especially the two, two of the ones that got let go yesterday. I'll explain why I'm asking that question. Come on.

[Pain]

And West Point Lincoln of Sugarland Studios.

[Sean Pendergast]

Here's Pain and Pender Gas. John, do a Pender poll. This is on the text page. Would you suck for three years, for another six years of greatness for the Astros a thousand times.

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[Podcast or Oregon Lottery Announcer]

Every week on the Moth podcast, you'll hear true stories that will intrigue you, inspire you and make you laugh.

[Pain]

He said, is there anything in your

[Sean Pendergast]

diet that might be spiking your blood sugar? I said, sometimes I eat pizza until I'm unconscious. He said, I think that might be it for real.

[Kendra Adachi]

Stories live on stage from comedians, astronauts,

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accountants, farmers and people just like you. Follow and listen to the Moth wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Pain]

everybody always says yes. I would totally take that. This is the problem. Somewhere in the middle of those three years, you're gonna lose faith. This is why tanking. This is one of the biggest obstacles to tanking and this is where I give Jim Crane a lot of credit. At some point, ownership loses faith. They get so many angry emails, they people are calling them bums at the grocery store because, you know, the way billionaires shop at grocery stores.

[Sean Pendergast]

That time I ran into Crane in

[Pain]

the produce aisle, I was talking to Crane, I was like, I cannot pick an avocado that isn't spoiled by the time I get home. He gave me some tips, but the there's like people lose their nerve and like Crane, to his credit, kept his nerve through a really, really hard tank. I don't think you can really, because it's one of these things where people love to say like, oh, no, because I would totally understand the strategy and everything. There are a lot of people who out there right now, because I see them who lie about how they were feeling in 2013, 2014. There was. Yeah. In hindsight. Oh, yeah. It made perfect sense. Look, they're winning all these Triple A championships. That's not how people felt. Like people were disengaged. People were just flat out disgusted. They weren't watching on television. Half the city couldn't watch. That was another thing that added to the misery of it. They didn't even have the TV channel. But that's the hard part. It's like, yeah, you say, hypothetically, sure, I'll suffer for three years if you're going to give me another six year window. The vast majority of time, that's not what happens. So somewhere in the middle of those three years, you convince yourself that the process sucks and everybody's a bum in that realistically that most times teams do it. Look at the Brown. The Browns are on their second round. So different sport. The Browns are on their second round of tanking. Yes, they, they tanked hardcore by football standards. And it didn't work out. Right now they're trading away Miles Garrett. They're tanking.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

And like, do you think people in Cleveland are like, well, yeah, this is the process. This is the way. No, this is how you get it. They're not.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah, they're, they're, they're not, they're not, they are not ready for another process.

[Pain]

And the other thing that kind of happened was that like, for multiple reasons, tanking didn't become as effective. Partly because just more teams caught on to it and started trying to do it them. So all of a sudden you're competing with other teams that are trying to suck too. And it's a, it's a road to nowhere. But I, There are, there's more often these days it's a, it's not, it's a soft reset. You know, you gotta, you got to kind of. It's like, it's like just, you know, tightening up your own personal budget for a couple of years because. But you know, there's a payoff at the end. I think that's, that's what most teams approach it like.

[Sean Pendergast]

Now, which, which firing by ESPN yesterday, because they let at least about a dozen or so front facing on air, people.

[Pain]

Yeah, go.

[Sean Pendergast]

Which one move the needle the most for you?

[Pain]

Okay, this one didn't move the needle in terms of it being a big name or anything, but I just really liked Charles Davis. I liked it when he did Texans games. I've just felt like he just. He really studied the opponents and knew a lot about it.

[Sean Pendergast]

Still going to be working for cbs.

[Pain]

Oh, that's right. Oh, so I don't have to worry about that.

[Kendra Adachi]

No.

[Pain]

Okay. No. But I never watch ESPN anymore, so. Okay. I don't watch really much of that other than the clips I see. Okay, cool. As long as he's still doing color.

[Sean Pendergast]

Okay.

[Pain]

That makes sense.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yep.

[Pain]

I should have thought of that. I think the biggest needle mover. It's probably Carl Ravitch. Just because he's been there forever.

[Sean Pendergast]

I think it depends on age. I think Carl Ravich for guys in our age bracket because he's been there 33 years. He's been as tied to one sport.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

As any ESPN personality. Baseball, obviously. I'm guessing the younger people might say Cam Newton or Ryan Clark.

[Pain]

The only thing about Carl Ravitch is that I feel like he shoehorns the being better than everybody else scandal in sometimes into conversations about the shows when he doesn't need to.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah. See, I don't want to say, well, good. I'm glad they fired him.

[Pain]

That's. That's bad, bad karma for you.

[Sean Pendergast]

I don't want to do that. I will say this about Carl Ravich. All time hairpiece Team Mount Rushmore. That's a hairpiece. Yes.

[Pain]

Really?

[Sean Pendergast]

And has been since the early 90s.

[Pain]

He passes the test there. I had no idea he had a hairpiece.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah. And has been since the early 90s.

[Pain]

Does he wear it in nature or just on television?

[Sean Pendergast]

I think. Well, I've never seen him out in the wild before, so I. So I'm not sure. I would assume he's been wearing it for like over 30 years.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

So that would feel to me. Which means he was a young man back then. That feels to me like someone who's wearing it everywhere he goes.

[Pain]

They do pretty much as much as people. You know, the toupees get a bad rap. I feel like it's all a matter of just how. It's kind of like with clothes. Yeah. If you wear crappy clothes. Clothes are dumb. Yep. No, there's a lot of guys that have toupees. Like. Well, Ted Danson.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

You would never guess that he was a toupee guy growing up, right?

[Sean Pendergast]

No, I would not have. I would not have the. So Ryan Clark and Cam Newton are the two. And Bart Scott got let go too. But I think the two former Players that move the needle the most for people. Ryan Clark and Cam Newton. And I know I. Look, I know there's people that like both those guys. I know there's people out there that Ryan Clark particularly may not be their cup of tea. Cam Newton's just kind of entertaining to me. He's got a vibe to him.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

I think he says some silly things

[Pain]

sometimes, but he also has, like, he's a performer. So there's times where even if you disagree with him, he's saying it, he's saying it in an entertaining way.

[Sean Pendergast]

This is what's interesting nowadays. And this is where I give both of these guys credit, the Kelsey's credit, other guys credit is that, yeah, I got fired from espn. Okay. I got this other platform. I'm making plenty of money over here. I can focus more time on that, whatever it may be. Cam Newton said this yesterday. The video is too long for us to play it. But I'm just going to read the money quote from this. He's talking about getting fired alongside Ryan Clark getting fired. Saying that Cam Newton said he viewed his time at the network as an internship and holds no resentment towards the company.

[Pain]

Quote.

[Sean Pendergast]

I want you to learn one rule about the times we live in right now. If you don't own your own platform, you're going to get overlooked, bypassed, and be extinct. Like dinosaurs.

[Pain]

Like dinosaurs.

[Sean Pendergast]

Dinosaurs. So you gotta have your own platform. According to Cam Newton, it is.

[Pain]

What a schmuck. He believes in dinosaurs.

[Sean Pendergast]

It does give these guys a soft landing when you let go. Yeah. You know, get let go by. By espn, right?

[Pain]

Yeah, no, that's what. Well, it used to be. I used to really enjoy watching people who had these massive inflated egos who are at espn who got let go by ESPN and they had to realize all of a sudden, like, oh, oh, it was more about the platform than it was about me.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes.

[Pain]

Because they would be so bitter for so long.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

And I do think that part of it has changed where people do understand and realize, okay, look, you got to have your. Make it on your own with your podcast simultaneously while you're at espn. And it can be a good launching board to notoriety.

[Sean Pendergast]

I do, I do think, I think Cam is a little dismissive of the platform that ESPN gives you to cross promote all that other stuff.

[Pain]

Yeah, but he's already. He's different because he's already a superstar in his own right. And like, and he does. He's an entertainer personality. Like, he's got a panache to him. It's. It's more difficult for, like, Carl Ravich isn't going to be able to go and all of a sudden have a podcast that's worth $100 million within a couple of years. Most likely the way that Cam or somebody else like that, because he's already. He is. Cam Newton was a star before he went to espn, but he said he

[Sean Pendergast]

regarded it like already doing this before he went to ESPN streaming. Yeah, well.

[Pain]

And he said he looked at it like a good. Like an internship. Right, that. Which is true. You learn a lot of just the, the, the fundamentals of being on camera and acting in a certain role. And you get a lot of reps.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah, yeah, you do get a lot of reps. And you're around a lot of people who've been in broadcasting. If you can be a bit of

[Pain]

a sponge, that's what, that's what McAfee, when he joined up with ESPN, the way he was framing it, I could. I think it was very much almost like, you know, we'll see how it goes. But like, this isn't. This is going to be really good for visibility. He had said, hey, espn. Despite the changing landscape and everything, you go to an airport, you go to a doctor's office, you're sitting getting your oil changed. There's a good chance ESPN is on.

[Sean Pendergast]

That's.

[Pain]

And all of a sudden Pat McAfee, who was already really successful with his YouTube and podcast like that. Many more people are now thinking about Pat McAfee. So even if it didn't work out, and that's why I think he's. He feels very. He doesn't. He's very brazen about calling people out at espn everything, because he just really. It's not that he doesn't care, but if he had to. If he had to cut ties with espn, he's just right back to doing what he was already doing.

[Sean Pendergast]

Crazy.

[Pain]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Crazy money. McAfee he's about to make. That was the other funny thing to see, too, yesterday. Pat McAfee, if you believe the reports that are out there, is on the verge of signing a deal with ESPN that's worth upwards of $60 million.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

So you've got that story out there, which kind of. Kind of got out there last week. So it's been sitting out there, and then all of a sudden this week, at the beginning of the week, there's this bloodletting of people, $2 million, guys being let go. It was so funny. I saw somebody tweet yesterday because Stephen A. Smith also makes. And he's very public about this. A ton of money. Stephen a. Makes like 20 million a year. McAfee is about to make 60 from ESPN. And somebody said ESPN's acting like they're trying to get under the second apron so they can fit McAfee and Stephen A. Smith under salad. Actually.

[Pain]

Yeah, that does make sense.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

Well, it's like, it's a good lesson for any business. Like, anybody that's. Any young people are just starting your first real job. Just never, ever, ever forget that. The, like, the way your management is looking at you is, are they making this company money? Sometimes people lose sight of that. Like, we see that in our industry sometimes where there will be guys that have, like, big egos or whatever, and they might be very, very talented, but they. They don't fundamentally understand that, dude, you're not making the company any money.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

You're expendable. Like, when they go to fire you if what they. If they have to say, wait a second. Like, there's. There's 10 advertisers that really are only with us because of this guy. We can't fire this guy.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

You know, where there's a lot of other guys who might be more talented or what have you, but, like, they just. They're not bringing money to the table.

[Sean Pendergast]

At the very least, it's a huge risk to fire.

[Pain]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marketing Professional]

It's a big risk.

[Pain]

You got to replace all that.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah. Or hope that somebody picks up the slack.

[Pain]

No, it's the same way. I mean, it's like, it will. Like. Like in some companies, it's easy. Like, if you're in sales. All right. You can show exactly how much money I'm bringing to the table.

[Sean Pendergast]

Right.

[Pain]

You know, if you're doing other jobs, it's not always quite so clear.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes, yes.

[Pain]

Remember, you're in constant competition with your co workers.

[Sean Pendergast]

Absolutely.

[Pain]

Stab them in the back every chance you get.

[Sean Pendergast]

That's right.

[Pain]

That's what they like.

[Sean Pendergast]

That's right.

[Pain]

You hear me, Byron? You're taking notes.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

No, don't do that. That's. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

You know how many times Seth and I have stabbed each other in the back? At least 20 times a piece.

[Pain]

Okay. I was joking about the stabbing in the back.

[Sean Pendergast]

And that's another.

[Pain]

Another little life lesson is, like. That's. The other part is, like, people.

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They.

[Pain]

You're less likely to get fired if people like you. There's times where people. I've been in these meetings where, like, all right, you're having a conversation about a few people, and they're like, this guy's just kind of a pain in the ass.

[Sean Pendergast]

It's a tiebreaker.

[Pain]

It's a tiebreaker.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah. It's a tiebreaker.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

The funniest. The funniest thing I was ever advice I was ever given. I'll make this quick, is when I first got into management in my old job when I was. I was promoted from being a sales guy to being area sales director. And I was on a. I was having a conversation with the CEO of our company, who is a career sales guy. His name was Pat Martucci. And he's telling me, he's like, hiring is going to be. 80% of your job is going to be how well you hire and fire people. 80% of your success is going to be based on how well you do that. So his piece of advice was something. And when it came to hiring somebody, this is sort of the tiebreaker thing we're talking about. About liking people. He said, I have this little thing called the Notre Dame test. You'll like this, Sean. And our company was in Chicago. He was from Cleveland. He goes the Notre Dame test. He's like, how far into a trip from Chicago to Cleveland? Like, when I drive to go see my mom, it's what, about 90 minutes to Notre Dame? And I said, it's about 90 minutes. He said, the Notre Dame test is this. If I'm interviewing somebody and I'm thinking of hiring them, but I'm not quite sure, I think to myself, if they were riding shotgun with me on a trip to Cleveland to see my mom, do I want to kick the bleep out of them by the time I get to Notre Dame? If the answer is yes, I do not hire them person.

[Pain]

It's a good. It's a good role to live. It's a good.

[Sean Pendergast]

If you're hiring and firing, that's a good rule.

[Pain]

What would that. Why it's always important to shower before you go to an interview.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

So the rule here, if I were to equate that to people hiring and firing in Houston, I'll call it the Golden Nugget rule. If I'm driving to New Orleans.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

And I want to beat the crap out of this person by the time I get to the Golden Nugget in Lake Charles, I might even call it the Beaumont rule.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Then I do not hire that I did.

[Pain]

You know what I should have called the Beaumont. I wish I would have talked to you about 17 years ago.

[Sean Pendergast]

Why?

[Pain]

Because I did. I went into business with somebody who, like, was really, really talented and good at what they did. But he annoyed the hell out of me.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes.

[Pain]

And they're like. And I was kind of like, I was, I remember thinking like, you know, my gut tells me no, but all the other boxes are checked. And it was two days into the relationship. I was like, oh, Oh, I made a huge mistake. Oh, I made an incredible mistake.

[Sean Pendergast]

I always had a fun team. Yeah. I always had a fun team.

[Pain]

Yeah. All right.

[Sean Pendergast]

Coming up next is Nick Casario and the Texans and Demo Ryan. Are they the best in the NFL at this wheel? Things big announcement 10am today. Be here for that. 9am we'll circle back to one of the big stories today. The Miami Heat accidentally air quotes leaking a link to a YouTube. A YouTube link for a press conference to introduce Lebron James on.

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[Pain]

In Dashboard Confessions, I remember telling my

[Marketing Professional]

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[Sean Pendergast]

Posted it last night. Took it down quickly. Downplayed it. Said, we were just doing it just in case. We'll talk about that.

[Pain]

Yeah. What are they having a fire drill or something? Like, hey, just gonna go through this Is. This is what we'll do, what it's

[Sean Pendergast]

like to put a YouTube link up.

[Pain]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

It takes so long.

[Pain]

Oh, God. What if it was that? What if it was just, like, somebody onboarding a new social media person, like, and just having fun, like, okay, so this is what you do. Let's say we're gonna. We're gonna introduce LeBron James. And then they went through it, and they're into the eager young intern. Hit. Hit enter.

[Sean Pendergast]

Like this.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

All right. By the way, Patrick Creighton, colleague and friend here at Sports Radio 610, said his rule would be the Baytown rule

[Pain]

of, oh, if you can't make it to Baytown without getting annoyed with a guy that you're interviewing, boot him out.

[Sean Pendergast]

He said, if you get to that BUC EE's right there, it exits, what, 791 or something like that out. And for those wondering what we're talking about, I told a story about how if you're looking to hire people and you're not sure if you should hire them, then we call it the. We'll call it here. We'll call it, you know, Patrick, we'll call it the Baytown rule. Pretend that you're driving to New Orleans from Houston, and if you want to beat the snot out of the person by the time you get to Baytown, do not hire that person.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Do not surround yourself with people that fail the Baytown rule.

[Pain]

Hey, speaking of BUC EE's, by the way.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

So I was driving. I was driving towards Texarkana on Interstate 30, you know, from up northeast, and I saw Buc EE's sign, and I got excited, and then it's. It's like Bucky's 137 miles.

[Sean Pendergast]

Oh, they do that all the time.

[Pain]

I know, but I don't. I don't like it. No, I don't either. I hate it. I was, I was looking at, you know, I. I like going to truck stops more. So they tend to be cleaner, have more options, usually better restaurants, like fast food and everything.

[Sean Pendergast]

Impulse buys.

[Pain]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I totally need this Dickies Jack and. Or a fluorescent vest. Yeah, I need this fluorescent vest. And I need one of those trucker. Trucker headsets.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes.

[Pain]

That only cover one ear.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yep.

[Pain]

No, I didn't like it. But right around the same time, one of the most impressively, impressively jerk drivers I've ever seen. A guy driving aggressively while pulling a travel trailer with a big jacked up Ram pickup truck. That was all it was. It was, it was, it was adjusted to be able to roll coal. So, like, no, he was. This guy must have. I wanted to go. I wanted to pull this guy over and interview him because he's. He's willing. A pretty big travel trailer and like dodging in and out of traffic and every time he's jamming on the gas, it's blowing black smoke up. It was the most dangerous thing I've ever seen in my entire life. And yet I have like a grudging respect for just the, the amount of testosterone and idiocy courses.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah. That's hilarious.

[Pain]

This guy has definitely been married six times. Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yes. And smoke seven packs a day. Okay, question. Are the Texans the best in the NFL at finding defensive backs, at staffing a defensive backs room? This front looks.

[Pain]

This coach has kind of been the, the word or the narrative or the belief around Casario since he's been here is like, man, he's really hit it out of the park with defensive backs.

[Sean Pendergast]

And the only high pick in that room is Derek Stingley.

[Pain]

Right, right, right. I think that's where it's a combo deal. And you know, I always like to look at like, I think there's so many times. And I go back to, you know, Charlie Casserly and Don Dom Capers with our first team here. I think both of those guys were awesome at their jobs. I don't know if they were the right fit for each other. And it's not. Because if anything it was because, like, neither one of them was an a hole. Like, which that's. It doesn't have to be that way, but I think that it's always about the mix of your GM and your head coach and how well they work together. And I think that d' Ameco and Nick work really well together. So, like, I don't know. I don't know. How good Kalen Bullock would have been if he'd gone to other teams. I don't know how good Jalen Petrie would be if he'd gone to other teams and had different coaches. You know, he had a very promising rookie year, but there was a lot of stuff that he had to work on.

[Sean Pendergast]

What about Lassiter?

[Pain]

Lassiter, likewise. I think that Lassiter. There's a. There's really, really good coaching. Like, Dino Vasso does an incredible job coaching those guys. D' Amico and Matt Burke have done a great job putting together that defense. And one thing that it does annoy me when I hear from people outside of Houston say, well, they just line up and play because they've got such good players. Like, all right, look, they've got. And they'll. They'll start reeling off Kalen Bullock, Kamari Lasseter, Jalen Petrie. Well, where were you guys pre draft talking about these guys.

[Sean Pendergast]

Exactly.

[Pain]

You know, wait a second. Aren't you the guy that said that Kamari Lasseter was too slow to go in the first round?

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

So it's a combination of identifying the right kinds of guys that fit d' Amico's system, but then also Dino Vasso coaching those guys up and getting the most out of group effort. Yeah, yeah. Like, it's like to have, to have, like this is plenty. Like you don't want to get too married to draft status or anything, but to have that many guys who aren't first round picks so don't have those, those high level physical traits coming out of college to be performing as they are as well as they are individually. Yeah, that's a lot of. It's on. It's Kasario finding the right guys for the system. It's. It's the coaching that goes on and then it's the players themselves just kind of. They're like having the right attitude and mindset to play this defense, which involves a whole lot more physicality than what they want out of defensive backs elsewhere.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah. Casario has drafted eight defensive backs since he got here as the gm. Most of them have been. While Demico Ryan's has been here. The two that were not were Derek Stingley Jr. Who's the third overall pick in the draft, and then Jalen Petrie was the second round pick. The others are. Brandon Hill was a seventh round pick. He's, you know, he seventh round pick. Kamari Lassiter, Pro Bowler, Kalyn Bullock, Pro Bowler. And I know they're alternates and they may, but they're good players. Yeah, Jalen Smith is a really interesting one to me. Drafted in the third round last year by the consensus boards, maybe overdrafted a little bit. He was seen more as a day three guy than a third round pick. Their guys, his teammates this off season have been gushing about him. Yeah, he's had a good off season.

[Pain]

No, and he, you know, he had a hamstring injury last year that basically just wiped out anything that you might have seen out of him. But yeah, they seem, they seem to like him a lot and I think he's another one that when you watch him in college, okay, there's a lot of elements to where you see, okay, he's not afraid of contact whatsoever. Makes a lot of plays behind the line of scrimmage. The, the high level physical traits aren't there. But we've seen, we've seen the Texans get the absolute most out of guys physical ability by, by coaching them up real well. And then Jalen Reed and Kamari Rams Jalen Reed last year and Kamari Ramsey.

[Sean Pendergast]

Jalen Reed got on the field last year, six round pick, but he, and

[Pain]

he had injuries, you know, that he was dealing with too as a rookie.

[Shannon Maldonado]

Yep.

[Pain]

Kara Ramsey is another interesting one. Kamari Ramsey, the latest of the Texans, liking some college programs because they seem to be coached really well, but then liking USC because I think they don't get enough out of, get this guy

[Sean Pendergast]

three rounds later in his talent.

[Pain]

They get guys cheap because USC hasn't developed them as well as they should

[Sean Pendergast]

pay attention to defense there.

[Pain]

I think if they drafted more USC players than any other college in the last couple of years, there's at least

[Sean Pendergast]

four or five USC guys on the team. Yeah.

[Pain]

So the, because you know, Nick and d' Ameco have both said like, okay, well we know they love Matt Campbell and he does such a great job with the Iowa State guys. They like what's his name up there in Minnesota. They'll talk, they'll, they'll draft some of these guys and they'll gush about the program that they come up, come out of. And yet they draft all these USC guys and they never brag about the program. They're buying low on those guys.

[Sean Pendergast]

Who's the best player that Nick has drafted. That didn't work out here, you know what I mean? And I'm not saying defensive backs, I'm

[Pain]

saying just in general the best player that they haven't. That Nick is drafted. I think it's Roy Lopez probably so Roy Lopez, the defensive tackle who is his Knicks last Pick in his first draft.

[Sean Pendergast]

Draft, yeah.

[Pain]

Sixth or seventh round pick. He's gone on to do some good things. I was going through and I didn't find a lot of other guys who were drafted here, left and then became consistent starters elsewhere. Thomas Booker did start 13 games for the Raiders last year.

[Sean Pendergast]

Okay.

[Pain]

Like, Garrett Wallow and Austin Deculas have had a few starts here and there, but they're just largely backups.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yep.

[Pain]

And, yeah, it's. It's been like they're. They're. Yeah, a lot of those. It's not like, okay, the Texans didn't get the most out of these guys, and then they go somewhere else and they're. They look awesome.

[Sean Pendergast]

2. The two that I'll keep an eye on this year, the big one I'll keep an eye on is Christian Harris.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

Because two years ago it was Chris. After the 2023 postseason, Christian Harris was viewed like a guy who could be in line to get a second contract from the Texans. He was arguably the best player on the field defensively for them in those playoff games that year. D' Amico's first year here. And then the calf injury hit, and then the calf injury healed, but he just never got back on the field again. Christian Harris. That'll be the one. I'll be way. He's in Atlanta now, if I'm not mistaken.

[Pain]

Yeah.

[Sean Pendergast]

And. And look, it may just very well be Christian Harris isn't going to be a good NFL football.

[Pain]

Well, I think with him, it would. That that calf injury just ended up being some kind of lingering, weird thing that happens with these lower leg injuries sometimes where just the. The nerves don't come back the right way. I don't know, like, it just whatever the hell Joe Mixon had last year.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah.

[Pain]

Yeah. The USC in the last few years has been really.

[Sean Pendergast]

Can I name. Can I try to name them real quick here?

[Pain]

Yeah, you have to name them chronologically.

[Sean Pendergast]

You got them in front of you here. Okay. Okay, so I'm going to say you're

[Pain]

going to miss the one real obvious one.

[Sean Pendergast]

Does it start in 2024?

[Pain]

It starts in 2024.

[Sean Pendergast]

Okay, so that would be Kalyn Bullock and Solomon Byrd.

[Pain]

Okay, you got that? Good.

[Sean Pendergast]

O. Then the next year would be Woody Marks and Jalen Smith.

[Pain]

Yep, you got that.

[Sean Pendergast]

And then Kamari Ramsey last year.

[Pain]

Five guys from USC in the last three years and not a word about how great the USC program.

[Sean Pendergast]

No, they're all day three guys, too. They're all day three. And, like, three of them probably should have been Day two.

[Pain]

At least this is where we go

[Sean Pendergast]

to find Bullock was a third rounder, so he used day two.

[Squarespace Announcer]

Right.

[Pain]

But this is where we go to find undeveloped talent.

[Sean Pendergast]

Yeah, man, yeah. Treasure trove of distressed assets.

[Pain]

I don't know. Like Woody Mark. Woody Marks wouldn't fit that category because they used him a lot, both at Mississippi State and at us.

[Sean Pendergast]

He was on offense. Yeah. All right.

[Pain]

But yeah, the defensive guys, into the

[Sean Pendergast]

9 o' clock hour we go. All right, we mentioned it a little bit earlier. Is there an intern getting fired in Miami today over this mistake? Air quotes that happened with the Miami Heat and LeBron James last night? If you haven't heard the story, we'll give you our take on that.

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[Kendra Adachi]

I'm Jenna Fisher. And I'm Angela Kinsey and together we have the podcast Office Ladies. Just because we finished rewatching the Office does not mean we're going anywhere. Every Wednesday we'll be sharing even more exclusive stories from the Office and our friendship with brand new guests. Plus, you can revisit all the Office Ladies rewatch episodes every Monday with new bonus tidbits before every episode. So follow and listen to Office Ladies on the free Odysee app and wherever you get your podcasts.

[Pain]

On the under $3 menu at McDonald's, a sausage burrito is $2, so dip, drizzle or douse to your heart's desire. Cause no matter how you sauce your sausage burrito, it's still just $2. Limited time only.

[Sean Pendergast]

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