How Concerned are We About the Titans Under Saleh?

Summary

Payne & Pendergast – Episode Summary

Episode: How Concerned are We About the Titans Under Saleh?
Date: June 30, 2026
Hosts: Sean Pendergast & Seth Payne (plus guest hosts Brian)
Theme: Evaluating the Houston Texans’ rivals—especially the resurgent Tennessee Titans with new head coach Robert Saleh—and comparing NFL defenses past and present.

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Episode Overview

This episode focuses on rising questions about the Tennessee Titans under new head coach Robert Saleh, who arrives with a reputation as an elite defensive mind. Seth and Sean break down George Kittle’s insights on Saleh, debate the level of concern Texans fans should feel about the Titans, and discuss broader themes about organizational change in the NFL. The hosts also tackle the perennial “best defense” debates, specifically comparing the 2026 Texans secondary to the famous 2015 Broncos, with pointed commentary from former NFLers T.J. Ward and Emmanuel Acho.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Astros Injury Concerns & Challenge Rule Clarification

(01:15 – 03:41)

• Brief discussion about Astros’ Jeremy Peña’s injury history and his impact on win-loss records.
  • Quote: “Has Jeremy Pena become injury prone? Yes. Yes. The answer is yes.” — Sean (01:15)
• Christian Walker challenge rule confusion: Explains that MLB’s instant challenge must be made immediately by the player, not after consulting the dugout.
  • “The rule is that it has to be an immediate challenge from the batter or the catcher or the pitcher. And they’re not allowed to consult anybody with the dugout or anything else.” — Brian (02:44)

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2. George Kittle on Robert Saleh & the Titans’ Outlook

(03:41 – 05:07)

• Sean shares a clip from George Kittle (Bussin’ With The Boys podcast) reflecting on Saleh’s influence and personality.
  • Quote: “He’s one of the boys for sure. He knows how to inspire. He has great, great messaging...just give him some time and I think he’s going to put some good games out there...The Titans are gonna be good.” — George Kittle (04:23)
• Kittle’s main message is patience: turning a roster around isn’t instant—using his own 49ers’ slow build as an example.

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3. Analyzing Titans’ Rapid Roster Overhaul

(05:07 – 07:20)

• Sean and Brian discuss key differences between Saleh’s new Titans and Kittle’s old 49ers. Main sticking point: Titans’ roster isn’t nearly as stacked as SF’s was.
• Emphasis on the high turnover: “They might have 10 brand-new guys...about 50% of their starting roster.” — Brian (06:45)
• Acknowledges how building through free agency is a mixed bag but can signal genuine culture reset with a new coach.

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4. Drawing Parallels: Titans Compared to 2025 Patriots

(07:20 – 08:13)

• Sean creates a parallel: Patriots two years prior also had a 4-13 record, spent big in free agency, hired a defensive head coach, and started a second-year QB (Mac Jones) before their Super Bowl run.

  • Quote: “Can I tell you about a team that two years ago had the same record the Titans had?...That was the New England Patriots last year.” — Sean (07:20)

• Brian stresses the importance of coaching and the right fit for QB development (points out Josh McDaniels’ value as a coordinator).

  • Quote: “Josh McDaniels is a made man when it comes to working with quarterbacks...not just Tom Brady.” — Brian (08:26)

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5. Texans’ Defensive Philosophy & Saleh’s Challenge

(09:01 – 09:19)

• Brian notes the shared defensive DNA of DeMeco Ryans (Texans) and Robert Saleh: “Their philosophy is just be a bunch of maniacal blood thirsty whack jobs on defense.” — Brian (09:03)
• Points out the difficulty for opponents when both units are healthy and “flying to the ball.”

---

6. NFL DB Debate: Are the 2026 Texans as Good as the 2015 Broncos?

(10:52 – 14:46)

• Clip from Emmanuel Acho and TJ Ward spurs a lively debate on-air: Is it fair to compare Texans DBs (Derek Stingley Jr. & Kamari Lassiter) to all-timer Bronco corners (Aqib Talib, Chris Harris Jr.)?

  • Acho: “The corners aren’t a competition. It’s not a conversation. ...You got an all pro...It’s the Broncos.” (11:23)
  • Ward: “What has [Stingley] done?...He got took up top about three times last year.” (11:54)

• Brian and Sean poke holes in the “interception total” argument, looking at how even great DBs rarely get 4+ picks a season.

  • Quote: “Aqib Talib...had four plus interceptions five times in his 14 years.” — Brian (13:10)
  • Quote: “None of those three guys ever even achieved more than 50% of what’s standard in the NFL.” — Brian (13:28)

• They highlight the underlying point: Good corners are often avoided by QBs, so INT totals are a misleading metric.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Robert Saleh:

  • “He’s a big conspiracy theory guy. I’ll say that.” — George Kittle (04:07)
  • “Just give him a couple years—he’s going to turn around, he’s going to drive the bus in the right direction.” — Kittle (04:53)

• On Defensive Philosophy:

  • “Their philosophy is just be a bunch of maniacal blood thirsty whack jobs on defense.” — Brian (09:03)

• DB Debate:

  • “You’re supposed to get four picks as a corner...That’s standard easy money.”—Emmanuel Acho (12:17)
  • [On interception stats:] “I was kind of shocked to hear a defensive back using interceptions at all...because over time...it’s harder to get interceptions because people just don’t test you.” — Brian (13:51)
  • “They avoid you.” — Sean (14:36)

---

Important Timestamps

• 01:15: Astros’ Jeremy Peña injury and team impact
• 03:41: George Kittle on Robert Saleh’s coaching temperament and long-term impact
• 05:07: Is this Titans’ roster comparable to the 49ers under Saleh? Analysis by hosts
• 06:45: How much turnover the Titans’ roster has undergone
• 07:20: Patriots’ 4-13-to-Super-Bowl parallel as a possibility for the Titans
• 08:26: The value of coaching in quarterback development, especially via offensive coordinators
• 09:01: Saleh and DeMeco Ryans’ shared defensive mindset
• 10:52: Texans secondary vs. 2015 Broncos debate, reaction to Acho and TJ Ward clips
• 13:10: Realistic stats on defensive backs’ interceptions

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Tone & Style

• Friendly, fast-paced, and often humorous
• Willingness to “poke” at conventional wisdom and call out questionable logic
• Keeps insider football knowledge accessible with relatable analogies

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Final Takeaways

• Robert Saleh’s arrival in Tennessee injects major uncertainty into the division; with a new foundation and influx of talent, the Titans could surge faster than expected—even if their roster is not as established as those classic 49ers or broncos teams.
• The hosts maintain some skepticism but acknowledge that rapid turnarounds do happen in the NFL, as shown by the Patriots’ recent arc.
• Debates about defensive greatness often miss context: stats like interceptions are not always reliable when measuring elite corners.
• For Texans fans, the message is clear: Don’t panic about the Titans just yet—but keep them on the radar.

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Useful for fans who missed the episode; contains core arguments, play-by-play of primary conversations, and highlights the data-driven (and sometimes tongue-in-cheek) style that defines the show.

Transcript

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[Sean]

All right, real quick on the text page, reaction to the Astros has Jeremy Pena become injury prone? Yes. Yes. The answer is yes.

[Brian]

He's become to it. Yeah, he is. Well, Brian McTaggart earlier this month had a, when he came back from the IL this, this latest time, he had the win loss record of the team with Jeremy Pena and without him.

[Bubba Wallace]

Yeah.

[Brian]

Over the last couple seasons. And the alarming thing was that, okay, yes, they had a much better winning record with him, but they were like 33 and 42 without him. Which is a lot of games missed due to injury.

[Sean]

Absolutely. Yeah.

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[Sean]

Yeah. The sheer, it's not just the nine games under.500 or whatever, it's the sheer volume of games. Yeah, yeah, I get that this is another text. I get that you don't like the guy, but why should walking away change the challenge?

[Brian]

Because that's the rule.

[Sean]

Yeah, he's talking about.

[Brian]

That's the rule.

[Sean]

Let me clarify that first part real quick here because in the textures talking about Christian Walker, if you missed it, Christian Walker had what would have been a successful challenge except he took too long to challenge and he looked at the dugout before.

[Brian]

You're not allowed to consult with anybody. Like it has to be an immediate. It has to Be an immediate challenge from the batter and the batter alone.

[Sean]

I don't not like Christian Walker. I don't like post strikeout Christian Walker. Get back to the dugout.

[Brian]

Just walk like a body language sucks. And you might say, why is Sean making such a big deal out of this all the time? And if you're his co host and you're watching last night, you're like, oh, Sean, Sean has the ultimate. I told you.

[Sean]

Twisting his mustache, his hands together.

[Brian]

The moping is what cost them. The rule is. So for those of you who don't understand, which I'm guessing the texter doesn't, that the rule is that it has to be an immediate challenge from the batter or the catcher or the pitcher. And they're not allowed to consult anybody with the dugout or anything else. They're trying to do away with the chicanery of like, I don't know, maybe somebody bangs on a garbage can or something.

[Sean]

Cameras. Yeah.

[Brian]

You can't turn your ear towards the dugout. Right when you, before you make the

[Sean]

challenge, does a Hulk Hogan.

[Brian]

That's where I do think, though. I think where some people might get confused is we have seen it relatively commonly when a guy is convinced that he got hosed a batter, he starts walking towards first base while tapping.

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[Brian]

Where it's kind of a simultaneous thing. I think, honestly, they should. They should probably crack down on that a little bit too.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Brian]

Just to make it more clear cut.

[Sean]

Got to do it.

[Brian]

But in those instances, they start tapping as soon as they started headed towards first.

[Bubba Wallace]

Yep.

[Sean]

Yep. All right. So this was. This was George Kittle on the Busing with the boys podcast. He, of course, spent some time with Robert Sala multiple times in San Francisco when Salah was the defensive coordinator. This was George Kittle talking about his experience with Salah last year and what he thinks the Titans could be this year. Do you listen to this as a Texans fan and get more concerned about the Tennessee Titans? Put me on some Robert Sala lore.

[George Kittle]

I talked to Salah more this year than I did in the four years that I was with him. I'm talking like twice a week. I'll just go sit in his office from anywhere from five to 30 minutes and we would just talk. He's a big conspiracy theory guy. I'll say that.

[Sean]

Love that.

[Bubba Wallace]

Loves conspiracy theories.

[Brian]

For the conspiracy theories.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yes, it is.

[George Kittle]

This is me giving Robert Sala smelling salt. So he's one of the boys for sure. He knows how to inspire. He has great, great messaging. I mean, he's Part of the invention of that, like, defense that he coaches. I mean, our defense was mauled by injuries. He was part of us winning 13 games. Like, just give him some time and I think he's gonna really put some good games out there. I really do. Especially, I mean, you guys, Cam Ward's a hell of a football player. Like, he's special. The Titans are gonna be good. This is my thing. Like my rookie year with Shanahan. We started the year off.09. We were one in 10 and we won what, five straight games in the season. And then the next year we had a couple injuries. We were 4 and 12. So just like, just give him a couple years. Because becoming a good team in the NFL is incredibly difficult unless you already have a stacked roster. So like, just give him a couple years. Like he's going to turn around, he's going to drive the bus in the right direction.

[Sean]

Where the analogy fell apart for me was at the end there where he's comparing this version of the Titans to the Niners teams. He was on that. Yeah, the injuries were at quarterback, you know, and they, they had a couple bad seasons. Those were really obviously very talented football teams. They went to a couple of Super Bowls. Do you, do you agree with. Are you, are you nervous at all about Robert Saleh as the Titans head coach?

[Brian]

I don't know if nervous is the right word. I mean, because ultimately it's the entire organization. I think Robert Saleh could end up being a really good NFL head coach. I think he actually did. I think he did some impressive things with the jets given the hand he was dealt with the quarterback situation.

[Sean]

Absolutely.

[Brian]

I mean, they were an almost.500 team while playing four different non NFL starting quarterbacks. The year that Aaron Rodgers got injured and his defense. Well, Robert, while Salah was there, the defense was impressive. The weird thing about the year Salah got fired was usually if a guy is at least taking care of his own business on his side of the ball, like if a head coach is a defensive minded coach and like it, but the offense is struggling, like the offense is struggling, you understand there's going to be that. But if his defense was no good, then that's when you really got to get rid of the guy. Yeah, they got rid of him even though defense was performing well that year. And then after he left, the defense fell off a cliff, of course. So I. Okay, how do you evaluate the Titans? Because there's a really good chance that at least of their 22 starters, I would say 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10. They might have 10 brand new guys by virtue of the drafts or free agency.

[Bubba Wallace]

Yeah.

[Brian]

And they spent heavily in free agency on the defensive side of the ball. They drafted Carnell Tate, you know, who'll likely start obviously in the first round on the offensive side of the ball. But they were super aggressive where they've, they flipped over already before the season even begins. About 50% of their starting roster. Almost 50% of their starting roster. So I think that like, usually when you have that much change, it's not as simple as, okay, hey, now we're good, you know, building through free agency. But with a new coach where you're just resetting the foundation, they could end up being a lot better this year than people.

[Sean]

Can I tell you about a team that two years ago had the same record the Titans had? 4 and 13. They had that record two years ago. The Titans were 4 and 13 last year. That splurged in free agency on the defensive side, that hired an experienced defensive head coach and had a second year quarterback who struggled his rookie year. The New England Patriots went to the super bowl last year. Yeah, they, they, that's, you know, and I'm not saying that it's exactly the same, but I'm saying we did see like the things you just said. New coach splurged in free agency. I'm adding the quarterback part of it in here. That was the New England Patriots last year.

[Brian]

This is the thing is that, look, we know Josh McDaniels as a head coach probably should never get a chance again, but Josh McDaniels as a coordinator has done some really impressive things. And it's easy to say, well, yeah, with Tom Brady. No, he just, he got the best out of Mac Jones his rookie season.

[Bubba Wallace]

Yeah.

[Brian]

And then he was gone. You know, remember, he went Mac. It was Mac Jones went from working with Josh McDaniels to all of a sudden working with a couple, a former special teams coach and a former defensive coordinator. It was a disaster.

[Sean]

Yes.

[Brian]

And he's done it with Drake, maybe. So like Josh McDaniels is a made man when it comes to working with quarterbacks, not just Tom Brady, when he's a coordinator and not a head coach. Kyle Shanahan, largely regarded as one of the best three play callers and offensive coordinators in the league that I don't, I don't put Brian Dabel on that same status.

[Sean]

Fair.

[Brian]

So it's. But will Cam or be better with Brian Dabel this year than he was last year, given that they improved the improve the offense around him, etc. Etc. Yeah, I think there's a. They're definitely there's elements to watch and not take too late.

[Sean]

Yeah there. There's elements there.

[Brian]

And because they're defense look they play Demiko Ryan's and Robert Saleh are they have their own versions of their same philosophy which is just be a bunch of maniacal blood thirsty whack jobs on defense.

[Sean]

Absolutely.

[Brian]

And it's hard to play against when everybody's healthy.

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[Sean]

Here was former Broncos safety TJ Ward when asked about the comparing the 2026 Houston Texans defense to the super bowl defense that he played on with the Broncos, widely considered one of the best super bowl winning defenses of all time. In 2015, here was TJ Ward, former safety for the Broncos. Is this disrespectful to Derek Stingley Jr. And Kamari Lasseter?

[Emmanuel Acho]

I love what the Texans do on defense. I talked about them all last season. Them in the Broncos.

[TJ Ward]

The corners aren't a competition. It's not a conversation. Correct?

[Emmanuel Acho]

What are you talking about? In which way? No, it's not a conversation.

[TJ Ward]

Right? You got a, you got a, you know, you got an all pro. You know what I mean? You got another four pick guy. You got another nickel. That's basically an all pros not a conversation.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's the Broncos. That's what you're talking about, right? You cannot be extingley. And what has he done? He. He got. He got. Took up top about three times last year. Like at least three times.

[TJ Ward]

The first team all pro Dexter thing you're talking about that you're talking about.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I'm talking about interception touchdowns.

[TJ Ward]

He thought I was senior.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Are you talking about a keep to leave second interception for touchdowns?

[Brian]

A.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Are you talking about that? AEB. Are you talking about.

[Brian]

Both have first team all pro.

[Emmanuel Acho]

First team all pro. Chris Harris Jr. Strong Harris.

[TJ Ward]

On the other side though.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Are you talking about Kamari Lasseter? Four picks.

[Brian]

On the other side, four picks.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You're supposed to get four picks as a corner.

[Tyler Reddick]

That's.

[Emmanuel Acho]

That's standard easy money. That's standard easy money. You're supposed to get four picks. Especially with the quarterbacks in the league today. They're giving them to you.

[Sean]

Okay, okay.

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[Brian]

Okay.

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[Brian]

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[Sean]

You know what I was hoping just real quick. Sorry. Emmanuel Acho is the other voice that you're hearing in that cut right there. Just so people wonder where that's coming from.

[Brian]

I hate trying to take the side of Emmanuel Acho and all this but. But look, don't worry.

[Sean]

We got a good one for the Petty cast that you will not.

[Brian]

Okay, so I think I was interested to see where he's going to like look. Yeah, those Broncos defensive backs were awesome.

[Tyler Reddick]

Yeah.

[Brian]

As soon as you say one quarterbacks these days, like is all of a sudden quarterbacks are throwing a bunch of interceptions or something. Two these days. Yeah, two. Oh, it's standard. You're supposed to have four picks. That's really interesting because Akeem Talib, look, he played 14 years.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah.

[Brian]

He had four plus interceptions five times in his four. 14 years.

[Sean]

That's really good.

[Brian]

It's pretty impressive.

[Sean]

Except I was told that that's just normal.

[Brian]

That's just normal. Even though he achieved it less than 50% of the time.

[Sean]

I thought that was really good. And then I listened to T.J. ward.

[Brian]

T.J. ward himself never had more than two interceptions in a season.

[Sean]

So he sucked.

[Brian]

Chris Harris himself never had more than two interceptions in a season. He sucked. Bradley Roby never had more than the standard. No, he never had more than two interceptions in a season. So none, none of those three guys ever even achieved more than 50% of what's standard in the NFL.

[Sean]

Oh my God. This is almost take a mania worthy. Wow.

[Brian]

That's where I like I don't know why he went down that road and tried to just pluck that stat out of the ether because. No, but the other, the biggest thing is I was kind of shocked to hear a defensive back using interceptions at all, especially when it comes to cover corners as, as a, as as how you know is how you decide whether they're good or they're bad. Because we all know over time, you know, like Akeep Talib, three of those interceptions, three of those years we had four plus interceptions came in his first four seasons. Right then he wasn't tested nearly as much after that. Derek Stingley's got three four plus interceptions seasons in his first four years. You know, just like a keep Talib over time it's harder to get interceptions because people just don't test you.

[Sean]

They avoid you. Yeah, they avoid you.

[Brian]

They also when that extended out a little further, TJ Ward up brought up the, the booty touchdown from the Patriots game.

[Sean]

Oh, where that one.

[Brian]

I'm like, man, that was a brilliant throw by Drake May. Yeah, that was just, that was an incredible throw.

[TJ Ward]

It was.

[Brian]

Booty was covered. It was just. That was. I put that on Drake May being such an incredible quarterback.

[Sean]

All right, pain and pender gas with you here on a, on a Tuesday.

[Brian]

Let's get rewatch it though maybe my memory has been a little biased.

[Sean]

Let's, let's get to headlines brought to you by the men's tea clinic. Coming up next, we'll circle back to the Astros. An amazing day of World cup soccer yester and then one. I was surprised by this move by this NFL team based on what happened in the courtrooms yesterday. But this was a big story in the NFL that we'll get to as well. In headlines coming up next, Tyler redick

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