Nick Caserio talks about CJ Stroud's off-seaon so far

Summary

Payne & Pendergast
Episode: Nick Caserio talks about CJ Stroud's off-season so far
Date: August 5, 2026
Hosts: Seth Payne & Sean Pendergast
Featured Guests: Nick Caserio (Houston Texans GM/executive VP), Jadeveon Clowney (Texans EDGE)

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Episode Overview

This episode delivers an in-depth discussion of Houston Texans quarterback C.J. Stroud’s progression through the offseason and the first week of training camp, featuring insights from GM Nick Caserio. The conversation expands to contract negotiations, Stroud’s chemistry with teammates, and a substantial segment on Jadeveon Clowney’s return to Houston. Key themes include player development, internal team dynamics, management philosophy, and candid reflections from both Caserio and Clowney.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. C.J. Stroud’s Training Camp Progression

• Decision-Making Maturity ([01:41])
  • Nick Caserio details improvements in Stroud’s approach:

    “It’s just making good, sound decisions with the football and not... trying to force a play. Just take what the defense gives you.” – Caserio ([01:41])

  • Highlights Stroud’s ownership of the offense, improved communication with the O-line and receivers, and proactive adjustments between plays.
• Chemistry With Receivers and Offensive Cohesion ([02:49])
  • Landry observes progress in communication and timing compared to previous camps:

    "When is an inerrant throw versus when is it a miscommunication? It’s easier to figure it out this year because I think CJ has been more accurate." – Landry ([02:49])

  • Notes Nico Collins as central to the offense and the importance of not forcing plays to him if defenses focus coverage away.
• Internal Communication as Foundation ([01:41])
  • Caserio emphasizes the importance of two-way dialogue on and off the field, with much of the learning and refinement taking place in meetings, not just practice.

2. Stroud’s Contract Situation and Team Management Philosophy

• Contractual Mindset ([05:59], [10:10])
  • Caserio outlines the Texans’ “open door” policy concerning contract negotiations, focusing on honesty, professionalism, and direct communication:

    “The most important thing is just be honest, be real, keep the lines of communication open and be respectful to the other party.” – Caserio ([05:59], [10:10])

  • Both sides—Stroud and the team—agree that ongoing talks are productive but not rushed.
• Market Dynamics & League Comparisons ([09:38], [11:49])
  • Hosts debate the timing of an extension:
    • If the Texans extend Stroud now, they risk his contract being quickly eclipsed by rising QB market values.
    • The league’s perception of Stroud has slipped in some rankings, with recency bias and playoff performance impacting outside opinion.

3. External Perception vs. Internal Evaluation of Stroud

• Rankings & Reputation ([12:10])
  • Seth points out that Stroud dropped in national QB tiers, behind names like Bo Nix and Aaron Rodgers:

    “He plummeted from... 7th after his rookie year, 9th last year. He’s 20th this year, and he’s behind Bo Nix and Aaron Rodgers.” – Seth ([12:10])

  • Hosts highlight league-wide focus on high-profile games as distorting perception of Stroud’s progress.
  • Insight that internal team evaluations, such as performance in training camp versus real games, may sharply differ from national commentary.

4. Jadeveon Clowney’s Return and New Role

• Why Sign Clowney Now? ([15:05])
  • Caserio says positional depth, especially at third EDGE spot, has long been a focus; Clowney fills a strategic need:

    “That was an area…we were just kind of looking at some players that maybe potentially could fill that role. And, you know, JD was a player who we had some conversations with…” – Caserio ([15:05])

• What Clowney Brings to the Defense ([16:42], [20:24])
  • Hosts and Caserio recall Clowney’s historical disruptiveness, even against top QBs like Tom Brady.
  • Landry exclaims about the exotic pass rush packages possible with Will Anderson, Danielle Hunter, and Clowney:

    “If it’s third and 12 and you’ve got...all out there at the same time, there’s very few offensive lines that have good answers for that.” – Landry ([18:17])

• Debunking Effort Myths ([19:53])
  • Caserio affirms Clowney’s effort and work rate:

    “He plays with good effort. I’m not really sure he runs well...So the ability to close space and close from behind...” – Caserio ([20:24])

5. Clowney’s Growth and Houston’s Cultural Shift

• Personal Maturity and Cultural Change ([21:36], [22:45], [31:29])
  • Clowney describes the Texans’ environment under D’Amico Ryans as “easier” and more “fun.”

    “It’s a lot easier, a lot relaxing...Coaching staff different. It’s fun. It’s a little bit more fun.” – Clowney ([21:42])

  • Candid about his own journey:

    “I was just taking people’s advice instead of really looking in the mirror...As I got older...just take care of yourself finally...And when I left here, that’s how I think I lasted eight more years in the league...” – Clowney ([31:29])

• Motivation for Signing Early ([23:30], [26:17])
  • For the first time in years Clowney joins a team at camp’s start, aiming to fully learn the system:

    “Let me just go to this training camp with these guys and grind with them so they know I ain’t just here for no play around. I’m here to work.” – Clowney ([26:17])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Texas QB Stroud’s Learning Curve:

  “Football, it’s a simple game sometimes that we make hard. But he’s really done a good job.” – Nick Caserio ([01:41])

• On Offseason Focus:

  “We have an open door policy around here. D’Ameco’s that way. It’s the way I operate.” – Nick Caserio ([05:59])

• On NFL Quarterback Market:

  “Next offseason, the market might be 70 million [per year].” – Seth ([09:38])

• On the Evolving Perception of Clowney:

  “He’s always been that guy. It’s always been three hours on game day. He plays his butt off.” – Landry ([20:55])

• Clowney on Houston's Organizational Shift:

  “It’s a lot easier, a lot relaxing, that building than it was when I first got there...That’s because of D’Amico.” – Jadeveon Clowney ([21:42])

• On Learning, Changing, and Ownership:

  “I just started taking care of my stuff and, you know, developing my game and having fun with it.” – Jadeveon Clowney ([31:29])

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Timestamped Key Segments

| Timestamp | Topic/Quote | |-------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:41 | Caserio on Stroud’s decision-making, ownership, and communication | | 02:49 | Landry on WR chemistry and Stroud’s improved accuracy | | 05:59 | Caserio on contract talks and management philosophy | | 09:38 | Seth on quarterback market trends, potential future inflation | | 11:49 | Seth/Landry on outside perceptions and national QB rankings | | 15:05 | Caserio on process and reasoning behind signing Clowney | | 16:42 | Classic playoff Clowney memory vs. Patriots and pass rush impact | | 19:53 | Caserio on Clowney’s effort, unique skill set, reputation | | 21:42 | Clowney on culture shifts in Houston, environment under D'Amico Ryans | | 23:30, 26:17| Clowney’s motivation to join camp from the outset—and insight on joining teams late | | 31:29 | Clowney reflecting on his exit from Houston and maturity after Bill O’Brien trade |

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Tone, Style & Delivery

The episode maintains a mix of sharp, experienced analysis and playful, relatable banter—characteristic of Payne & Pendergast. Caserio’s measured professionalism contrasts with the hosts’ direct, sometimes self-effacing style. Jadeveon Clowney is open, reflective, and even humorous as he shares lessons learned.

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Conclusion

A must-listen for Texans fans, this episode spotlights on-field progress, the complex realities of NFL contracts, and the personal journeys of key figures in the franchise. Caserio’s and Clowney’s candor about player development, management, and culture shifts provide smart context and optimism for the season ahead.

Subscribe for full interviews, daily analysis, and more unfiltered H-Town sports takes!

Transcript

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Texans training camp is here.

[Nick Casario]

Live from the Houston Methodist Training center,

[Sports Radio Announcer]

sports radio 6.10 presents Pain and Pendergast.

[Seth]

Steph and I had Nick Casario, Texans executive vice president and general manager, on yester for about 40 minutes. If you want to go back and find it on the Odyssey app or on the Pain and Pender Gas podcast while you're at it. If you want to subscribe or download the Pain and Pender Gas podcast, you can do that, join the millions and millions of people that do that every day somewhere around there. So Nick Casario is on with us. If you do, go find it. It was at 7:15 yesterday. Good conversation. We talked about CJ Stroud, and of course, the last time Nick was on with us in early June, he was very, very effusive in his praise for how CJ Stroud was handling the offseason. We asked Nick yesterday, has that carried over into the first week of training camp?

[Nick Casario]

Yeah, a lot of the lot of the same things. I think the big thing is that position we've talked about on the show. It's just making good, sound decisions with the football and not trying to not make a play up, but try to force a play. Just take what the defense gives you. And I think you've seen multiple examples in practice. Whether we've made an adjustment or we've gone to the first read, you know, it's just, you don't want to be too cute sometimes. I mean, football, it's a simple game sometimes that we make hard. But he's really done a good job. I think he's embraced the ownership of the offense, the communication, really the communication between the quarterback and the offensive line, going back to the earlier discussion, like that's the most critical component of offensive football. So if everybody's on the same page and everybody's kind of seeing things the same way, and to get that information out there at the perimeter of the formations that are receivers, you Know, we've had some adjustments, we've had some examples where we were hotted and we were able to execute the hot. We've had some other situations where we had a side adjust. Maybe the quarterback did the right thing and then maybe the skill player didn't. So those are things that you kind of work through and then you, hey, what did you see? Here's what I'm thinking on that play. So that kind of two way discourse is important and I think you've seen that not only on the practice field, but a lot of that takes place inside in the classroom.

[Landry]

Yeah. And I think there's, you know, I can think just off the top of my head of a couple of instances in camp where CJ's had accurate throws, but there was a miscommunication between him and Jaden Higgins or him and Nico Collins or at least like a misread on how, how the receivers are reading the coverage. And that's the kind of stuff where I, I think compared to last year when, man, during training camp there were a lot of questions about CJ after having that shoulder soreness in the OTAs didn't look that accurate during training camp. But it's always hard to figure out exactly, okay, when is an inerrant throw versus when is it a miscommunication? It's easier to figure it out this year because I think CJ has been more accurate. But they're also, there's way more, there are way more times where the communication is right. And you're seeing him get rid of the ball on time and in rhythm. And I think a lot of that has to do with the younger receivers being in their second year. Well, you know, except Noel's not out there. Nico being more comfortable in the system. But also, you know, you earlier had talked about how we haven't seen a whole lot of Nico Collins reception so far when you're going against a good defense like this. Yeah, that's the way it should be going. If you are taking the easy money. If the, if the defense is doing everything they can to be sure Nico doesn't get the ball, don't force the issue. And we've seen a couple of deep shots to Nico and it was both of the instances I'm thinking of. Nico was battling with Kamari Lasseter, he was battling with Derek Stingley. But CJ put the ball where only Nico could catch it and it didn't work out. But it wasn't, you know, on deep shots. You know, if you're 50, 50 on shots like that, you're doing all right. Yep. That like it looked right. Like sometimes you can. Sometimes you can have a successful, unsuccessful play if the process is right. So far it looks like the process is right.

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[Seth]

Yeah. And I guess Nico. Nico would be that, you know, like Belichick always talked about taking away the best thing that the other team does, I guess is Nico probably the head of the Snake on this offense.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

Yeah.

[Landry]

And it has been. I mean, that's the. I mean, ultimately and especially when you've got a team that been able to pass protect all that well, you know, certainly not in an above average level. Maybe they got to average last year. Yeah. It's just, it's too easy when you only have to take away one thing and the offense can't take like they've taken away Nico. And the Texans haven't been able to do the simple things like run the ball when teams are playing high shell coverages.

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[Landry]

Run the football. Oh, turns out we can't do that. I don't know what your answers are after that.

[Seth]

Yep. We asked Nick Casario yesterday about the. The contract situation with C.J. both Nick and C.J. spoke about it a little bit in their media availabilities early in camp. Nick saying that there have been productive conversations. CJ Stroud was asked about it, gave a pretty brief answer where he said it's going great. So, you know, we don't know how frequent those conversations are, how intense they are right now. But we asked Nick how key is keeping the lines of communication open when it comes to just keeping your house in order and making sure that CJ is comfortable in handling things the right way.

[Nick Casario]

I mean, look, we have an open door policy around here. D' Ameco's that way. It's the way I operate. So you're never going to be close minded in whichever way is the wind blowing. So I mean, we're going to treat it like professionals, treat it like adults. Understand there's a business component of what we do on both sides. So we're certainly sensitive to the players in that respect effect. And you know, they understand, like we're trying to do the best we can as a team. If we're trying to, like, in the end, we're trying to keep as many good players around here for as long as we can, as long as possible. Sometimes it works the way you want it. Sometimes maybe it takes a little bit more work or the timetable doesn't necessarily match up the way everybody else wants it to. But Again, the most important thing is just be honest, be real, keep the lines of communication open and be respectful to the other party. And if you get a resolution, great. If you don't, it doesn't necessarily mean that it's not going to work itself out. It just means it's going to maybe take place at a later point.

[Landry]

I do wonder from the organization standpoint, you know, and they've mentioned Multiple times how CJ's been so good in the off season with, you know, doing all the things that they want to see him doing. And part of that is just doing all the things you have to do to really learn and get comfortable in this system. If they've, if the team has been a little bit of a wait and see mode and wanted to just see how everything looks in camp and look, it's the preseason. You haven't played against a team with a different uniform yet. But there are things you can tell out here that are substantially better on offense than they were in training camp last year. So if you want to make an apples to apples comparison, like last year, boy, it was, it was a hackneyed operation going against a really good defense and it looked like they were just completely outclassed. So far, as Aziz Elshire said yesterday, it's been way more competitive and it doesn't look, the offense has never looked out there in my opinion. Other, like they're completely outclassed. They've had some bad periods and the defense is going to get theirs and they're going to make their plays. But they haven't looked outclassed. They've looked like they've, they've had guys that have gotten beat and which happens when you're going against Will Anderson and Daniel Hunter.

[Seth]

Yeah.

[Landry]

And all the rest of them.

[Seth]

I agree with you. I said that earlier in the offseason. Is it. It may very well be. They're just waiting like training camp may be the proving ground for C.J. stroud. And the fact of the matter is that, and I know it's not a real game with a real crowd and things like that, the atmosphere is different. But in terms of the personnel that you're going against, he's not going to go against a better group of defenders than the one he's facing out here every day. You know, it's not like he's going against the 29th ranked defense and we got to see how he's, you know, is he wrapping his brain around the system? All right, let's go. Let's go do team period. Number one and he's going against a bunch of scrubs. He's going against like six guys that were at the Pro bowl last year, you know. Well, it's a good proving ground for him.

[Landry]

And then the other, you know, and look, I'm very much of the Mind O's. I'm very cool with the Texans saying, hey look, there's a nice carrot on a stick. We'll wait until after this season and we'll see what happens. You do have to think about the fact that these are the quarterbacks entering their third year that would be eligible for an extension after this season. Caleb Williams, Jayden Daniels, Drake May, Bo Nix, J.J. mcCarthy and Michael Pennix. Kind of power rank those a little bit. Yeah. So I don't. Who know? I mean J.J. mcCarthy. Who knows if.

[Seth]

Yeah, who knows? Just those. Forget about McCarthy and Penix. Four like that and Lamar.

[Landry]

And Lamar Jackson's probably right.

[Seth]

Right.

[Landry]

Next year too.

[Seth]

Right. There's going to be a couple, it's

[Landry]

going to get bumped up. So if they are feeling way more comfortable about them and they want to hedge their bets, it might make sense to lock it in right now. But then you got to hope like in like CJ's no Idiot and Mulligetta is no idiot. They know that if they sign a deal right now it's probably going to get blown out of the water.

[Seth]

Next off the market might be 70 million next year. Yeah.

[Nick Casario]

Yeah.

[Landry]

It's been hovering for so long in that this is the year where it just, it's, it's all lined up that this really especially you've got Drake May, you've got a runner up to the MVP who just probably isn't going to be as good this year because he has to face actual football teams in the regular season. But still if he has anything close to the season he had last year. Yeah, he's going to get a new deal.

[Seth]

Yep. Here's Nick Kasario yesterday with Seth and myself talking about how CJ's been handling the contract situation.

[Nick Casario]

Yeah, that's the most important thing. Look, we understand there's a lot of eyeballs on our sport and there's a lot of contracts that big name, big time players that I mean, I think again, I mean I read this morning like Gibbs, you know, they reached an agreement on his contract. Excuse me, but there's always eyeballs on I would say players and you want to be respectful but in the end the more you just keep the communication amongst yourself like we're respectful of the fans and we're fortunate that there's interest, but in the end, the best way to communicate is directly to one another. And if you have an issue or have a question about something, let's just come and sit and talk like an adult. So I think the more professional everybody handles it, the better off in the end. In the long run, everybody wins as a result.

[Seth]

I'm really anxious to see if he were to get a deal. And let's pretend that it's in the neighborhood of where that the market is kind of stagnated a little bit right now. You know, it's kind of. It's kind of stuck at 55 million. I know Dax making 60, and I know Mahomes signed some new money for 64 or whatever. I think Mahomes is just different. I think Dak made out real well on the market because the Cowboys are really bad at playing poker. The fact of the matter is that the crux of the market has settled in at 55. Josh Allen on his extension, his third contract. Joe Burrows at 55. Trevor Lawrence is at 55. Jordan loves at 55. All of those guys are right there. The reaction would be very interesting to me, not just among Texan fans, but around the league, because. And I know these are imperfect things, but they are a subset of where reactions come from around the league. And the fact of the matter is, it was just released this week, it turns out they gave the next 10 guys outside the NFL top 100.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

CJ will finish 103rd.

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Yeah.

[Seth]

So he's just outside. So the. Here's what the. And I know it's imperfect, but here's what the players think. Then you got the Jeremy Fowler. Then you got the Jeremy. Then you got the Jeremy Fowler thing, where he's surveying all these executives and coaches. Got one vote. Yeah, got one.

[Landry]

That one is the.

[Nick Casario]

More.

[Landry]

The. The val. Some of these ESPN polls of executives, that. Those are more.

[Seth]

It's their job. Yeah. They evaluate guys. But then you got the Mike Sando thing, which is very similar to the Jeremy Fowler. Mike Sando did his qb, if you missed it yesterday. He dropped his annual tiers of quarterbacks. C.J. plummeted in this thing, and that's a really big cross section of GMs, former GMs, coaches, scouts, things like that. He plummeted from. He was seventh after his rookie year, ninth last year. He's 20th this year, and he's behind Bo Nix and Aaron Rodgers. So there's. There is not a corner of the universe right now, Seth, in the world that can Say, like we would react positively to CJ getting 55 million a year.

[Landry]

The biggest thing about that, though, too, even though I take the. There's more credibility with those executives and coaches and everything, is that they also succumb to which games have they watched on national television. Recency bias, all of that stuff, because most of the guys in the league, you're kind of in a tunnel, you know, and like, I know a lot of coaches and executives that talk to the smart X's and O's types of media. They like talking to those guys because they can have discussions about what else is going on.

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[Landry]

You're kind of narrowed in and focused on the 13 teams that you're going to face that year. And maybe one of them is a divisional, you know, a non conference opponent, and you forget about them after the. So you're not really paying attention to the grand scale. And by and large, most of those people on that poll are thinking of C.J. the first thing that comes to mind is that Patriots game.

[State Farm Ad Voice]

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[Landry]

They all watch that Patriots game. They look at the stats and the numbers, and I think they don't, they don't understand necessarily the nuance of the situation.

[Seth]

Well, taking it a step further, if indeed, you know, and you and I are just speculating that training camp may have a big thing to a big part of the evaluation of C.J. stroud for a contract extension, this is the exact opposite of that. This is stuff that only largely, only we are seeing out here. It's not a game that he played on Sunday Night Football.

[Landry]

We have to take that all with a grain of salt, too, because at the end of the day, this is the tough thing. It's that man, no matter what he does in training camp, no matter what he does in the regular season, there's going to be perception that he crumbled under the pressure of the playoffs. And that, that, that's going to weigh heavy in people's minds until they see it again. Even though he's had good performances in the playoffs before, it's the most recent thing they've seen. And in terms of outside perception, and maybe internally, too, they just, they want to be sure that they've actually, they've got something they can trust.

[Seth]

Yep.

[Landry]

All right.

[Seth]

Pain and Pendergast. So that was, that was Nick Casario on CJ Stroud yesterday. You can get the whole interview up on the Odyssey app, the free Odyssey app, and the Payne and Pendergast portion of that. A little more from Kasario, but let's shift gears to Clowney. Jadevion Clowney was great. Yesterday at the podium, we'll get to some of what Clowney had to say. But we asked Nick yesterday, why now to bring Jadevion Clowney back to Houston.

[Nick Casario]

We kind of worked through the spring in there a little bit. You know, that kind of third and spot was an area that we probably felt we were going to add at some point. You know, Derek did a good job for us in that role. Had conversations with him. So just kind of keeping track of the market. Who are the players that are in that category. Feel pretty fortunate, you know, with Will and Daniil. And then I would say Dylan has had a good role for us. And then we signed Dominique Robinson. He's had a pretty good training camp here. So it kind of brings a little bit different element, but that was an area. We're just kind of looking at some players that maybe potentially could fill that role. And, you know, JD Was a player who we had some conversations with initially, maybe it was a little bit later in the spring, slash, summer. And then we kind of kind of kept in contact with his agent over the course of the summer. And then there, at some point, there was some level of mutual interest. He obviously had a lot of interest from some other teams. I think there's some other teams that were involved, but it kind of worked out. I mean, it says a lot about Jadevion, the fact that he wanted to be here, wanted to be around some of the things that we're doing. We didn't overlap. I mean, I wasn't here when Jadevion was here previously. Haven't played against him multiple times. Know how big of a pain in the ass that he was. And he's still shown the ability, whether it's in Dallas, Baltimore, Carolina, these different stops. He still brings some positive qualities to the table. So we'll get started with him today. He'll be out here practicing. We'll kind of see how it goes.

[Landry]

So as soon as Nick said that, I thought of the Patriots game, the playoff game, where Jadevion was a nightmare in the first three quarters of that game. He was lining up in the over the center, over the guard, and Brady was getting that pressure right up the middle. I mean, that became a talking point. That entire off season, even though the Texans didn't win that game was, man, this pressure up the gut, boy, you get a quarterback off his spot and it's really hard to operate.

[Seth]

It was a little like the Texans this past year losing, like, because Brock Osweiler was The quarterback in that game. Like, boy, the Texans just quarterback play.

[Landry]

Yeah, that game, too. That was the one where that. Brady basically. No, look, heaved it up over his. He did a sky hook over his head and it was completely.

[Seth]

Well, that was one Will Fuller. Will Fuller dropped a walk in touchdown in that game, too.

[Landry]

And for the kids that might be thinking, it sounds like it was an amazing pass. No, it was a Duck. Yeah, it was a Duck. It was a pick six waiting to happen. But nobody was there to get it.

[Seth]

No.

[Landry]

Except Brady was smart enough to probably know that nobody's there to get it. That was a safe. I'm gonna lob it up.

[Seth]

Yes.

[Landry]

But it's safe to do it. Yeah. Bastard.

[Seth]

Yep.

[Landry]

Yeah, that part of it, though. But so Clowney being out there for one, he's gonna rotate in. You're gonna be able to give. You're gonna be able to give Danielle Hunter and Will Anderson a blow. Keep him fresh the entire game long. But when it comes to the fourth quarter especially or in specific situations. Yeah, that old, you know, Clowney kind of roaming around the line of scrimmage as a bat, and you don't know if they're gonna. The other thing too is him. He's so strong and powerful that when he does rush down inside, even if he aligns on the outside, he just blows up guard still to this day. And when you start running games without having to blitz, but running games with your defensive tackles and all that, and if you get all three of those guys out there on the field at the same time, it is. It's a Nightmare. If it's third and 12. If it's third and 12 and you've got. You've got Will Anderson, Daniel Hunter, and Jedevion Clowney all out there at the same time, there's very few offensive lines that have good answers for that.

[Seth]

Right? Right. It's awesome. You asked.

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[Landry]

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[Seth]

Nick, about this. The narrative on Clowney, that the reaction from people sometimes is that Clowney does not play hard, which couldn't be further from the truth.

[Nick Casario]

Nick talked about that he's always played hard and he's disruptive with his snaps. And even when we were playing against the Texans when I was in New England, you know, their front, you know. Yeah, jj, you know, you had had. JD Was a part of it. Merciless. And they'd move JD around some different spots and put him over to guard. I mean, he was really difficult to block. So he's got a unique skill set. His length, he's got real good straight line speed. He does have toughness. And to your point, Seth, he plays with good effort. I'm not really sure he runs well.

[Sports Radio Announcer]

Yeah.

[Nick Casario]

So the ability to close space and close from behind. So the reality is whoever walks in the building, whoever walks in that defensive meeting room, if you don't play hard and compete, you're probably not going to last very long.

[Landry]

So the. The swarminess of Clowney and I.

[Seth]

What am I about to say?

[Landry]

I'm gonna play this clip that I sent to Clint yesterday. I put up a compilation of swarmy plays by Jedevion Clowney. There's one where the packers where he gets knocked down. There's another one where he bites. He bites on the play action on an end around, but then chases Xavier Worthy 20 yards down.

[Seth]

He's fast.

[Landry]

Xavier Worthy? Yeah, he's really fast. There's just multiple examples of Clowney being on the ground because he got blocked, but then getting up and running. There's a. There's a goal line sequence where he basically saves a touchdown because Travis Kelce quits blocking. And he keeps going all the way across like he is a sideline to sideline player. He chases receivers downfield. He's always been that guy. It's always been three hours on game day. He plays his butt off. I think o' Brien's issue then was what is he doing with the other 165 hours in the week?

[True Crime News Host]

Yeah.

[Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Landry]

And does that add up? Right? I think it's 168 hours in a week. And like, Indian Clowney talked about that yesterday when he got traded. He realized he had to grow up. That was his quote. Grow up, Clowney.

[Seth]

Yeah. So let's get to that. Here is Jadevion Clowney yesterday saying, what's changed from then to now?

[Jadevion Clowney]

Yeah, the building changed a lot. In a good way. Very, very good way. It's a lot easier, a lot relaxing, that building than it was when I first got there. Coaching staff different. It's fun. It's a little bit more fun. And the group of guys in that building is great. It's just been easier to go back up in there than I expected when I got. When I signed back. But like I said, that's because of d', Amico, the guy that's running the show. He put a lot of great guys around him. Coaches, and you can feel the energy, and all the other guys can feel it. So I know great things gonna happen here for me and the team. So I'm just looking forward to the opportunity.

[Seth]

Okay, so that was more on the changes in the building.

[Landry]

More so the changes labeled a little differently than I thought, because Landry asked him, how are you different now than when you. Than you were here the first time? And he just flat out said, you know, he basically said he was an immature player when he was young. He didn't really know exactly how to operate and everything. And that changed a lot over the course of the last 12 years.

[Seth]

Yeah. Well, here's one example of maybe not even just changing from back in 2019 to now, but even at the places. And he talked about this. We'll get to this. The places that he's been over the last few years, most of the time, he's gotten there right as the season is starting. Yeah, he hasn't been there for training camp, so. Oh, yeah.

[Landry]

Yesterday I saw somebody say I was surprised that Clowney was still out there. Look, what are you talking. This is somebody in the national media. I was like, what are you talking about? He signs. He waits as long as possible to sign. That's his deal. This is the first time in a long time that he's been right there at the beginning of, like, almost the beginning of training camp. Yeah.

[Seth]

And he talked about that because this. I think Landry asked this, too, about the heat. How's the heat? How, you know, how you're re acclimating to the heat. And Clowny brought up the fact that, yeah, it's hot, but I wanted to be here to get into the system thing.

[Jadevion Clowney]

Is I've been training here for the last 12 years, but it still hit different. I did three plays today. I told him it felt like six or seven, but let's just get back into football shape. All that running. I'm gonna text my trainer today and say, man, we did all that running for me to get tired today and, like, four plays. But, nah, that's football shape, man. I just got to work. That's what training camp for, you know. As y' all know, I've been missing training camp for some, so I was excited to get out here in training camp and knock the rust off earlier this season than I did in the previous year. So I was looking forward to this. Getting to know the guys early instead of walking in week one. Hey, man. Learning the scheme on the fly. You know how many times I did that? I did it in Baltimore, Seattle, Dallas, Cleveland. No training camp. Walk out there and just play week one. And I look across the line, somebody telling me. You know what I'm saying? But it's gonna be a lot different this year. Cause I'm gonna learn a playbook before the season start, man. It's gonna be a lot smoother season for me.

[Seth]

He can't take the blame for Seattle and him showing up the first week. Bill o' Brien had him on a franchise tender hostage situation.

[Landry]

Yeah, yeah, that was. And he tried to ambush him. He tried to set up an ambush, but then Clowney, in Braveheart fashion, sniffed out the ambush.

[Seth]

He did.

[Landry]

And he didn't come in. Remember, o' Brien was saying, we just. He went all Southern Bell. He went Southern Belleville, o'. Brien, he's like, we just need. All we need is for Jedevian to come in and sign the franchise tag. I don't know what the issue is. And it turns out, yeah, you guys had a deal ready to trade him immediately to Miami as soon as he signed that franchise tag. But Clowney sniffed it out.

[Seth]

He did.

[Landry]

He knew what you're up to, Longshanks.

[Seth]

Yeah, Clowney's the one, the William Wallace of the NFL.

[Landry]

But no, that part, the visual of that was really good because he was doing. He was acting out. You know, when you look across the line of scrimmage for somebody to tell him what to do, that is. That's a very real dynamic. The smart offensive lineman will pick up on that, that you're coming. They're seeing what you're being told to do. And you can't. Like you said, you can't play fast when you're not really comfortable in the system. He's also, he's played in this wide nine defensive system before. I couldn't, I couldn't remember the timelines. I talked to him real briefly before he went in. Cleveland and Seattle were both wide nine systems when he was there. And like, there's a lot of common DNA with Matt Burke and what he did there, what he's learned between the guys that were running those defenses. Yeah, that's good. So I think, and plus Tomiko keeps it relatively simple, as simple as possible for these guys. So I think that by, yeah, by week one, there's not going to be any issues at all about him being comfortable in the system.

[Seth]

Clowney expounded on the desire to get here early and learn the scheme.

[Jadevion Clowney]

Like I said, I made the decision because I wanted to learn a scheme. I didn't walk, like I said, I walked into too many teams the first week and you know how hard it is to play when you don't know the scheme. You play a lot slower than you normally want to because you got to look across the field. Somebody got to tell you what to do, you know what I'm saying? I done been doing that for so many years, throughout my career. I just said, let me just go to this training camp with these guys and grind with them so they know I ain't just here for no play around. I'm here to work with these guys and get to know them, build a relationship so they can have a great season.

[Seth]

Yeah. Again, one of the things I was most enthusiastic about with Clowney yesterday, Seth, it seems like he's got a real genuine respect for what Demico Ryan's is all about.

[Sports Radio Announcer]

Yeah.

[Seth]

For what you as a player have to like the non negotiable things that you need to sign up for as a player.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

To be part of this, to be part of this defense and being out here at training camp, I'm Anna Garcia,

[True Crime News Host]

host of True Crime News, the podcast. Every week we bring you in depth coverage on cases making headlines as well as those that go under the radar. Tune in for murders that defy explanation, mystery seeking, exploration and shocking secrets that will leave you breathless. Each week we honor the victims by going beyond the salacious in our search for justice. Crime never stops and neither do we. Listen to True Crime News, available now on the Odysee app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Landry]

Life can feel overwhelming, but on my podcast, from the Heart with Rachel Braan, we're in it together. Every Friday brings you a new story. Listen to from the Heart with Rachel Braythen. Wherever you get your podcasts, it's one of those things. I also wonder too, where Derek Barnett hangs in the balance of all this. Or was hanging in the balance of all this.

[Seth]

Nick mentioned he had talked to him in that cut we played.

[Landry]

Yeah, you know, Derek Barnett was probably kind of, you know, doing what Clowney's done the last few years is kind of sit, wait and see what, what offers emerge, what's the right situation.

[Seth]

And I'd still bring Barnett back.

[Landry]

I would too. Yeah. Shouldn't change, but is one of the things Clowney said is that he when he had to learn that, hey, you're not the number one overall pick, you got to go and improve yourself. He said. That's what I've been doing. I come in and I steal people's jobs.

[Seth]

Yeah, I heard that too.

[Landry]

It's like, man, yeah, you're the other guys on the roster and this is good. It's good competition to have. But man, for Solomon Bird and Derek Horton and Robinson, like those guys, it's tougher to crack that starting rotation right now or that too deep rotation that they play with.

[Seth]

And Nick said In that cut we played a little bit earlier is that this is something that goes back to the spring, that they took a look at their roster. He saw the same thing that you'd been talking about throughout the spring, which is one of the few weaknesses on this defense, on this team, is depth at that defensive end position. So this is something that they've been looking at since the spring. And if I'm Solomon Bird or I'm Dominic Robinson or I'm Dylan Horton or any of those guys, Yes. I look at the signing of Clowney as a message from management that I haven't done enough yet to prove that I can be that DM3. You know, that's how you have to internalize it. I don't know if they have any of them have the ceiling to where they're gonna get to it. But, yeah, like, Clowney coming in and saying that should light a fire under some folks.

[Landry]

Why am I still saying Derek Horton? And in my mind, every time I correct myself before I say it, you're

[Seth]

combining him with Derek Barnett. That's my guess.

[Landry]

I guess that's what it is. But in my mind, I'm like, no, it's not Dylan. It's Derek. Yeah, it's a really stupid thing I do. Apologies to Dylan Horton and his family.

[Seth]

They'll be okay. Here was the one I thought this was the. This is the cut from Clowney that got most. The most attention and the one that made me sit up because he mentions Bill o' Brien by name. Was there any bitterness when you left the team or when you got traded away in 2019?

[Jadevion Clowney]

I don't take nothing personal, man. I always say to my. They pick me on the moon to play football. I can do that. You know what I'm saying? I can play football. So I ain't had no hard feelings. It was just o' Brien at the time. Ah, me and him bumped heads, and I couldn't really understand because I was an easygoing guy. I was like, all right, whatever you want from me type of guy. At this point, especially when I'm 21 years old, 22 years old, I was just taking people's advice instead of really looking in the mirror, trying to figure myself out, I was listening to other people. As I got older, I started saying, just take care of yourself finally, and, you know, and it's gonna work out for you. And I started doing that. And when I left here, that's how I think I lasted eight more years in the league where I just started taking care of my Stuff and, you know, developing my game and having fun with it.

[Landry]

The. Yeah, he's just a much different person than he was back then. But I do wonder, like, I don't. I don't think he would willingly go play for Bill o' Brien again. I felt like it was like it was such an oil and water situation. Clowney was this kind of just goofy free spirit. Bill o' Brien is, whatever the hell he is. He's a, he's a very, he's a very complicated human being, but he has

[Seth]

his way of doing things and it's his way or the highway.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Jadevion Clowney]

Yeah.

[Landry]

And those two were just not gonna mesh no matter what. So Clowny was kind of doing that thing where he acknowledges that he had to grow up and that he was immature and everything, but I feel like there's still a little bit of extra. Of like. Yeah, but. But o' Brien didn't have to be that way about it. He didn't, you know.

[Seth]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, what it probably tells you is that the way, the way Jadevion lays that out is that that trade, and I'm paraphrasing here, but that trade might have been one of the best things that happened to him as a person.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

Is that it was a, you know, maybe some wake up call might be too strong. Not like he's a bad guy. He was just sort of flat out

[Landry]

said, I mean, he said, grow up, Clowny. That's what he told himself, grow up, Clown.

[Seth]

And it. To me, that's a sign that o' Brien may have been minimizing actually how mature clown he was at the time, or could be at the time that, that he wasn't bitter about it or anything.

[Landry]

Yeah. I mean, sometimes though, that is like, and I know I've said this before already, but like the Kyle Lowry trade to the, to the Toronto. I mean, that's what Lowry said afterwards was. No, it was a smart thing to do by Houston. I wasn't going to become the player I did if I hadn't gotten traded away because people would look at that and be like, how do you trade him away? Look at him now. And I pulled up one of the

[Seth]

Leesler Rockets, got a first round pick for Lowry and then used it to get James Harden.

[Landry]

One of the things, Bill o' Brien

[Seth]

got a third round pick for Clowney and used it to get Gary and Connolly.

[Landry]

Oh, yeah, that was a good move. I like the upside on there.

[Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Seth]

What were you going to say?

[Landry]

Well, no, in one of the clips, Clowney had said, you know, he was kind of laughing about how he had a good time when he was here as a young player and he had a. Had a bunch of. Had a bunch of great friends. And I'm thinking about. I pulled up the first. This is a report from March 10, 2015.

[Seth]

Okay.

[Landry]

Report Jadevion Clowney, bitten by teammates. Pitbull. That was Swearinger's pit bull. Yeah. Yeah. And then that was right around when the KC3. When was the case?

[Seth]

That was 2013.

[Landry]

That was 13.

[Seth]

That was 2013.

[Landry]

Were all three of those guys released, though?

[Seth]

Yeah, yeah.

[Landry]

Smoking a.

[Seth]

They said it was a black and mild.

[Landry]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Seth]

Dark and mild one. It was Willie Jefferson, Sierra Wood and oh, Montgomery. Sam Montgomery.

[Landry]

Yeah, that's right.

[Seth]

Good trivia question. Who are the KC3? So, yeah, Clowney was great yesterday and it's. I am really excited to see, man. I'm. Dude, I'm excited for the opener. I mean, Josh Allen was already struggling with a defense that had Will Anderson and Daniel Hunter with no Clowney.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

You know, now, now Clowney is that guy that may be on those passing downs or the downs were where Josh Allen might hurt you with a scramble.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

You got Clowney, who is Nick Casario said and as you showed me in those videos right there, pretty good straight line speed to chase guys down.

[Landry]

He gets from the. The center of the field to the sideline with ridiculous speed.

[State Farm Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Landry]

And chasing down guys like Jalen Hurts and others that. It's just. Yeah. When you start some of the. Either like the exotic things you could do or the wrinkles that you could do, including, man, sometimes when. And you either force the quarterback to flush the pocket, but you got Clowney coming around on the edge to chase him. Like there's. There's some really fun stuff they could do.

[Seth]

Oh, yeah. It's going to be a good time, man. It'll be a good time watching this defense. By the way, I don't know if you saw this story, but as long as we're talking about Bill o'. Brien. Bill o' Brien apparently is only the second biggest psycho among coaches at bc. Now that Bill Murray's son is. Did you build. Bill Murray's son was on the UConn staff.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

Actor Bill Murray, comedian Bill Murray. Old man Bill Murray. His name's. His name is Luke Murray and he's now the new BC head coach. He fired or had fired the play by play and color guy for the basketball team there.

[Landry]

Yeah.

[Seth]

Who have been there forever and are alums of the school because they're associated with the old regime.

[Landry]

Tough luck, tough cookies. I don't know. I see all the people all over media like, oh, oh, the poor play by play announcement. It's a little weird life, all right. Oh, the guys who comment on all the coaches who get fired all the time are now being subjected to the same. These guys. These guys are just the humanity.

[Seth]

These guys are just the game commentary suck.

[Landry]

I don't know. I haven't listened to the home broadcast of a beast.

[Seth]

Will you at least admit that that's very rare for new coaches to come in and do. And fire the broadcast team because they're associated with the old regime?

[Landry]

I like Brett Dolan.

[Seth]

It's a little.

[Landry]

Dolan and Brett Dolan got let go and kind of an unceremonious dump. That's it.

[State Farm Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Landry]

Astros were done. Remember when the Astros were firing anybody and everybody?

[Seth]

Yeah.

[Landry]

Oh, little Peggy. She's been here for 40 years as the receptionist. Get your ass out of here, Peggy.

[Seth]

Sounds to me like you felt zero sympathy for Brett Dolan at the time. You don't feel any sympathy for these guys?

[Landry]

No, I had sympathy for Brett Dolan.

[Seth]

Because you knew him.

[Landry]

I just don't know. I. Yeah, because I know him. I don't know anything about these guys.

[State Farm Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Landry]

I don't know if they suck. I don't know if they're good.

[Seth]

I'm just saying it's a little strange.

[Landry]

That's strange, but whatever. Yeah, Go get another job. We all. They come for us all, Sean. That's the industry. I say, if anything, I'm due.

[Seth]

I'm about to have him come get you right now.

[Landry]

No. If and when I get fired, I don't want anybody shedding any tears over me.

[Seth]

Don't worry.

[Landry]

That's the. That's the business. I've had a conversation with coaches about this before because coaches will always say, I don't like that people have this, you know, hot seat power ranking about coaches and everything. And I'm like, bro, you fired 10 people this morning. What the hell are you talking about? Like, oh.

[Sports Radio Announcer]

Oh.

[Landry]

But, no, we can't talk about you guys getting fired. Yeah. All right.

[Seth]

Coming up next, a little more from Kasario. We promised the Tank Dell update.

[Ad Voice]

How.

[Seth]

How will you feel when you hear what Nick Casario has to say about where Tank Dell's at relative to preseason games? We asked Nick about that yesterday.

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[Landry]

I'm Susie Welch, the host of Becoming youg a podcast where I help you

[True Crime News Host]

stop living by default and start living by design.

[Landry]

Listen to Becoming you wherever you get your podcasts.

[State Farm Ad Voice]

Having the right people in your corner for life's biggest milestones makes all the difference. Like a friend who's there when you're house hunting or checking out a new ride, stay State Farm is there too, helping you choose the coverage you need. With a State Farm agent, you know someone is there to help you along the way. And with so many coverage options, it's nice knowing you have help choosing a plan that fits your needs so you can continue celebrating all of life's milestones. Head to statefarm.com to get a quote. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.