Payne and Pendergast August 4th , 2026 Full Show

Summary

Payne & Pendergast – August 4, 2026: Full Show Summary
Hosts: Seth Payne and Sean Pendergast
Guest: Nick Caserio (Texans GM)
Date: August 4, 2026

---

Episode Overview

This episode of Payne & Pendergast, live from Texans training camp, is packed with sharp analysis and candid conversation on the biggest stories in Houston sports. The hosts break down the Texans' first day of padded practices, the fallout from the MLB trade deadline—specifically the Astros’ trade for Dalton Varsho—and weigh in on the Texans’ signing of Jadeveon Clowney. Seth and Sean also welcome Texans GM Nick Caserio for a wide-ranging interview diving deep into roster construction, training camp impressions, and the ongoing contract dynamics with quarterback C.J. Stroud.

---

Key Segments & Discussion Points

Texans Training Camp: First Day in Pads

Time: 02:17–13:39

• D’Amico Ryans (Texans Head Coach) described the first padded practice as energetic and eventful, ending with a bench-clearing scuffle among third-stringers (“First day of pads was a successful day in my mind.” – D'Amico Ryans, 02:17).
• Seth describes the fight and the different approaches to on-field chippiness from his playing days, especially comparing locker room cultures in Houston and Baltimore (“Back in 2006… Weaver got pissed that the whole defense didn’t run out there.” – Seth, 07:22).
• Analysis: Evidence that the offense showed more scrap, especially from rookies like Noah Whittington. Defensive back Kalyn Bullock’s interception was highlighted as a promising play (“I was more excited about the Bullock interception than I was disappointed that C.J. threw it.” – Sean, 09:35).
• CJ Stroud’s practice: Threw an interception but also showed poise and good decision-making, with improved protection and more designed running plays.
• Offensive line and run game: Hosts note a more synchronized o-line, crediting position coach Cole Popovich. “It’s a much better picture than it’s been the last couple years.” – Seth, 11:28.

---

Astros Trade Deadline Reaction: Dalton Varsho Arrives

Time: 16:28–27:10, 38:45–44:06

• Astros’ only move was trading pitcher Spencer Arrighetti to the Blue Jays for outfielder Dalton Varsho, filling the long-needed lefty bat and centerfielder spot.
• Varsho was immediately inserted into the lineup and performed well ("He did, he did. Yeah, it was good." – Sean, 16:56), while Arrighetti, once a rotation savior, looked shocked by the trade.
• Debate on the value and control of Arrighetti versus the rental status of Varsho.
  • “You’re giving up a pitcher who you’ve got control of for three more years.” – Sean, 18:38
  • Seth notes it was a seller’s market, and that Astros leadership refused to deplete the farm system unnecessarily.
• Critical of hyperbolic internet takes about Arrighetti (“He’s been the duct tape that held the rotation together…” – quoting Ben Verlander, 24:31), with both hosts pushing back on this narrative.

---

Texans Sign Jadeveon Clowney: Implications & Fan Reaction

Time: 30:26–38:38, 58:27–62:50 (with Nick Caserio)

• Clowney signs a team-friendly deal for $5.5M, returning to Houston as a veteran edge.
• Debate on fan perceptions about Clowney’s “effort" versus reality:
  • “That has been a bogus narrative on Clowney… He’s got a ridiculously good motor. He makes plays sideline to sideline.” – Seth, 34:01
• Polling Texans fans, Clowney was a popular choice as a low-cost, high-impact rotational DE.
• Caserio later describes the process and reasoning for signing Clowney: “That was an area we were just kinda looking at… JD was a player who we had some conversations with.” – Nick Caserio, 58:41

---

Notable Quotes and Moments

• On Dalton Varsho's Welcome: “Springer basically gave Varsho a pep talk like he was going off to summer camp and he was nervous for the first time. Like, ‘Hey buddy, you’re gonna meet a bunch of new friends.’” – Seth, 04:35
• On Astros Development: “This pitching development staff… they’re just not what they used to be. The days of just, ‘hey bring in any random dude—he’ll end up being awesome’ are over.” – Seth, 26:43
• Astros Fan Reaction Humor: “That tweet [about Arrighetti as duct tape] is so dumb that it made me feel better about the trade.” – Seth, 26:04
• Texans O-Line Depth: “We feel like we could play with nine or 10 offensive linemen and be able to go out there and play competitively.” – Nick Caserio, 66:57
• On the Clowney Stereotype: “Intensity on the field is not the issue at all with Clowney.” – Seth, 34:01

---

Texans Training Camp Deep Dive with Nick Caserio

Time: 57:24–92:38

On Clowney’s Signing

• Searched for a third defensive end, kept in contact with Clowney’s agent; deal worked out due to mutual interest and positive reputation as a hard worker and disruptor (“We feel [he] still brings some positive qualities to the table.” – Caserio, 58:41).
• Emphasizes team environment: if you don’t play hard, “you're probably not going to last very long.” (Caserio, 61:08)

On Team Culture & Accountability

• Praises the impact of player-driven accountability and football culture under D’Amico Ryans (“Player accountability is the best accountability... if you don’t do it, you become an outlier.” – Caserio, 62:50)

Offensive Line/Run Game Progress

• Notes the improvement and depth in the O-line, describes a “fluid” competition for starter roles.

C.J. Stroud & QB Evolution

• Caserio still high on Stroud’s ceiling. Discusses the complexity in mastering the Texans’ offense, parallels with Tom Brady’s development timeline (“It takes time... Brady, I mean, it probably took him like three or four years until he really like had it.” – Caserio, 74:05)
• Communication and decision-making at QB are a training camp focus: “Making good, sound decisions with the football and not trying to make a play up… He’s really done a good job.” (Caserio, 72:00)
• C.J.’s contract situation described as positive, “just be honest, be real, keep the lines of communication open...” (Caserio, 82:12)

On New Faces and Depth

• David Montgomery’s versatility praised, both as a runner and receiver.
• Highlights depth and variety in the tight end room (Marlin Klein, Foster Moreau, etc.), with much evaluation left before cut-down day.

On Team “Glue Guys”

• Caserio names multiple “football junkies” and glue guys on defense: “Petrie. Kamari. Will. Aziz. Henry…” – Caserio, 89:32

---

National NFL Talk: QB Tiers and C.J. Stroud’s Ranking

Time: 48:26–55:02

• Mike Sando’s annual “QB Tiers” article places C.J. Stroud 20th, at the top of Tier 3 (down from 9th last year), with a number of insiders expressing ambivalence about his current developmental trajectory.
  • “This is a big year for him. He has it in him.” – Anonymous Defensive Coordinator, 53:42
• Discussion of Stroud’s need to avoid mistakes, holding the ball too long at times, but hosts agree on his high upside (“My thoughts about what C.J. Stroud’s ceiling theoretically is and should be are still very high.” – Seth, 54:13)

---

Quick Hits & Headlines

Time: 38:45–46:47

• Astros lose to Blue Jays; Tatsuya Imai shows promise as a reliever.
• Jalen Pitre becomes the NFL’s first “Guardian Athlete” (helmet tech sponsor), joining a safety initiative with the Guardian Cap. Hosts joke about the awkwardness and aesthetics of the infamous practice “bonnet.”
• Bijan Robinson signs a 3-year, $75M extension with the Falcons ($51M guaranteed), setting the market for elite running backs.

---

Key Timestamps

• 02:17 — D’Amico Ryans & First Day in Pads
• 09:35 — Bullock Interception / Stroud Assessment
• 16:28 — Astros Trade Varsho After Deadline
• 30:26 — Jadeveon Clowney Signing Reaction
• 38:45 — Headlines (Varsho Impact, Pitre Endorsement)
• 48:26 — National Quarterback Tiers; C.J. Stroud Outlook
• 57:24–92:38 — Nick Caserio Extended Interview

---

Notable Moments & Tone

• Classic Payne & Pendergast banter: light-hearted, direct, familiar with frequent callbacks to NFL locker room culture and Houston sports “inside jokes.”
• Humorous digressions: jokes about job replacements, Disney World, and the Madden video game rating system.
• Transparent, insider look at Texans’ team-building philosophy courtesy of Nick Caserio, who openly discusses the intricacies of depth chart battles, injury management, and the team’s cultural evolution.

---

For Listeners Who Missed the Show…

This episode delivers a thorough, no-BS breakdown of current Houston sports headlines, focusing on Texans’ camp energy, the realities of the Astros’ tight trade deadline, the return of Jadeveon Clowney, and C.J. Stroud’s critical summer. Nick Caserio’s candid 35+ minute interview brings listeners behind the scenes at NRG Park, offering honest answers on everything from position battles to contract strategy. If you want to understand the mood and trajectory of H-Town sports as the NFL and MLB seasons ramp up, this is must-listen material.

---

Transcript

[A]

Are your ad campaigns lighting up the dashboard but not the pipeline? That's bullspend and marketers are calling it out in Dashboard Confessions.

[B]

My boss asked for results so I

[C]

opened my dashboard for the only positive sounding metric I Impressions.

[A]

Cut the bull spend, See revenue, not just reach. LinkedIn delivers the highest return on ad spend of major ad NETWORKS. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com campaign terms and conditions apply.

[C]

I'm Jenna Fisher.

[B]

And I'm Angela Kinsey.

[C]

And together we have the podcast Office Ladies. Just because we finished rewatching the Office

[A]

does not mean we're going anywhere.

[C]

Every Wednesday we'll be sharing even more exclusive stories from the Office and our friendship with brand new guests. Plus, you can revisit all the Office Ladies rewatch episodes every Monday with new bonus tidbits before every episode. So follow and listen to Office Ladies

[B]

on the free Odysee app and wherever you get your podcasts

[A]

are your ad campaigns lighting up the dashboard but not the pipeline. That's bullspend and marketers are calling it out in Dashboard Confessions.

[B]

My boss asked for results so I

[C]

open my dashboard for the only positive sounding metric I had.

[A]

Impressions Cut the bull spend, See revenue, not just reach. LinkedIn delivers the highest return on ad spend of major ad NETWORKS. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com campaign terms. Apply that feeling when you check your bank account and your paycheck's days away. And of course, your calendar's all good news. With Chase Secure Banking, your direct deposit hits your bank account up to two days faster. So when your friends are like and your bills go, you have the peace your deposit brings. And the best part, there's no monthly service fee for 17 to 24 year olds. Thanks to Chase Secure Banking.

[B]

For Chase Secure Checking, only eligible direct deposits may be credited up to two business days early, depending on when the payer submits the transaction.

[C]

Member FDIC Sports Radio Radio 610 presents

[B]

Seth Payne and Sean Pendergast.

[D]

We coming to eighth time. Let's get the work in, man. Let go.

[C]

Great day, great day.

[D]

Oh, give me some juice, baby.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[D]

Let's do it.

[C]

First day of packs in training camp. It's always an exciting day. It's always an eventful day. You never know what's gonna happen. You know, one side getting the best of the other side. But overall I thought it was a really good day. Got a little tired there at the end and, you know, a little scuffle broke out. Don't see that. As I mentioned to our guys, we want to be smart in how we prepare, how we train, so we got to be smarter there. But overall, I like the way the guys push through today. First day of pads was a successful day in my mind. All right, that was head coach d' Amico Ryan's out here at Texans training camp yesterday, fifth practice yesterday, sixth practice today. Pads went on yesterday. And we're out here for you. We got Nick Casario joining us in about an hour and 15 minutes. Welcome in everybody, on a Tuesday. We are with you till 8am today. Sean Pendergast, Seth Payne will hand things at 8am of course, over to Texans training camp live. Good morning, my friend.

[D]

Good morning.

[C]

How are you?

[D]

I feel good, man. I feel good. I'm not. I don't. I'm. You know what? If anything, I'm appreciating the weirdness of trades between teams that are facing each other that evening. Honestly, I always look, I guess there's a 1 in 430 chance of it or 1 in 29 chance of it happening. I always feel like, especially when it happens at the deadline, it's like the two GMs get together and they're like, oh, you gotta do something for these people. Like, that's just like, why is it. Wait a second, you got, you got, you got, you got 28 other GMs that you could have on the horn doing some deals with. No, it doesn't ultimately turns into like, I don't know, we're both at the

[C]

bar at 2am let's go home with each other.

[D]

Yeah. Yeah. And that way, I like that it's old school. Like, maybe they did it over whiskey. But.

[C]

Well, you know who that happened with a few years years ago was Christian Vasquez.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Remember that?

[D]

Yeah. Yeah.

[C]

Trade deadline in 2022, and then playing the Red Sox and then Vasquez. I would say of the two, Dalton Varsho, and if people missed it, didn't see it yesterday, Dalton Varsho, outfielder, goes to the Astros. Spencer Arrogetti goes to the Blue Jays. Who would have predicted that back when he was winning pitcher of the month two months ago, in the month of May, I would say of the two, Varsho looked to be a little more excited about his new environment. He was. Did you see him? Jim Crane in the dugout with him, shaking his hand and, and then you looked at Spencer Arrighetti, who looked like a. Looked like he was being held hostage during the game.

[D]

Well, just, you know, they come and grab you and be like, hey, grab your things. It feels like something that would happen at training camp. You know, they bring your playbook. Varsho got a little bit of a pep talk from Springer. He said, you're gonna love the. Hey, buddy, you're gonna love the like. Springer basically gave Varshow a pep talk. Like he was going off to summer camp and he was nervous for the first time. Like, hey, buddy, you're gonna meet a bunch of new friends. You're gonna learn some arts and crafts, and it's gonna be all right. All right. And he tussles his hair and sends him off onto the bus to go to summer camp.

[C]

If I was Marshaw, I would have been like, aren't there only like two guys left that you played with?

[D]

Yeah, yeah, I know. They're gonna love the clubhouse.

[C]

Yeah, you were there six years ago.

[D]

You're gonna hate the front office, but you're gonna love the clubhouse. That's probably what Springer said.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Listen, I don't appreciate the way they do business. I never liked the fact that they mess with my service time. But you're gonna love the guys you're

[C]

been messed with already. You're good.

[D]

Isn't Sanchez over there? Oh, no, no, no. He's with us. That's right. He's with us.

[C]

So. So we'll. Yeah, we'll get to the trade deadline here in. In just a minute. But we had the first day of pass. You heard d'. Amico. D' Amico say it was an eventful day. He talked. There was a little. Got a little chippy at the end.

[D]

Yeah, there was the. The chippiness of the fight came with. I. I think there's a little bit of a theme of more chippiness on offense. Now, Noah Whittington was not the guy who started the fight.

[B]

He got.

[C]

Is he the one that got thrown to the ground?

[D]

He got thrown. Noah Whittington was trying to kind of bulldoze his way through, through the. Wade Wood as and down at like the three yard line. And Wood, as, you know, there's no tackling, but Wood as was getting pushed backwards a little bit and finally decided to just kind of power slam him to the ground. Yeah. And it was funny because I still like, you know, eyewitness accounts are sketchy, so you got to try to get everybody in. From my vantage point, Wade Wood as just kind of walks away and is completely uninvolved. And uninvolved. And I was kind of watching him. But meanwhile, the. The bench is emptied, and there's a mass of people out on the field. And with Wood as not involved at all in it. And Whittington, but. So. But Whittington's kind of chippiness and scrappiness and driving wood, as I would say, is what sparked it. Rutledge is out there kind of, you know, mixing it up at times and causing scrums and piles. He shoved it up, shoved the. Neil Hunter a little bit, and it was like.

[C]

It was like training camp two years ago, the year that Diggs was here. And remember, somebody on defense hit Diggs in practice as he was going to the ground, and it ended up being a fight between Derek Stingley Jr. And Dalton Schultz.

[D]

That's right. Stingley came out of nowhere. This is two years ago.

[C]

And, like, kind of shoved him from behind. It was very unstingly like. Yeah, so that was fun. Getting a little chippiness at the end of the day yesterday.

[B]

It was.

[D]

Tamiko didn't like it. Tamiko also said that he didn't like that. You know, you had other people entering the fight area, and Aziz was running

[C]

out there, I think, to break things up.

[D]

I don't know. You know, back in 2006, six, as we. As we olds call it, when Anthony Weaver came onto the team, the first fight we had in training camp, Weaver got pissed that the whole. That everybody from the defense didn't run out there. And I was like, I don't know. Look, I've been on a couple different teams, different coaches. That's never been the rule said in Baltimore, that's the rule. Want to be, you know, one die, all die. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So many would tell stories about Baltimore, like, do you remember Kelly Gregg, the nose tackle?

[C]

I do.

[D]

The little white dude that pulled his pants way up high. And you might be inclined to make fun of him. No, bad idea. Because he was a national champion wrestler, and he was a national champion wrestler, and then he got into, like, MMA training in the off season. So Weaver said he would just go out there and just go to town on people. Oh, really? They get in fights, and Kelly. Greg would be out there and just all of a sudden have somebody down on the ground throwing elbows and everything. So it's different cultures, different time, different era. I kind of like seeing. I kind of like seeing the benches clear. I know d' Amico can't like it.

[C]

It was at the very Very end too. It was, it was the third stringers that, that was my reaction. I forget who I was standing next to, but I'm like nothing like a bunch of guys on the third string going out risking everybody's health by getting into a bench clearing brawl.

[D]

I thought for yesterday. So look, I go into these training camp practices with the attitude that the defense is going to get theirs no matter what. It could be that it could be a combined practice with the LA Rams and the defense is going to get theirs, they're going to make some big plays. So I just look for competence and ability to make plays at all by the offense and try not to think too hard about, you know, the negative plays because I think there has been a lot of positive of the offense. But, you know, I think most people came out of yesterday feeling like, wow, the defense really got the better of the offense. And I, I didn't feel quite that way. And if you look at like the second series, David Montgomery had a nice run of about 5 yards. CJ Stroud hit Nico Collins for 6 yards, Stroud to Schultz for 7 yards. And then Kalyn Bullock gets an interception. Okay, cool. Happens. You know, like I'm not going to, I'm not going to freak out over quarterback interceptions and training camp. It's really, that's, that's what you should be doing when you're not game planning and you're just letting it fly.

[C]

I was more excited about the Bullock interception than I was disappointed that C.J. threw it.

[D]

Well, the other thing too is I didn't get to, I didn't get to see what coverage they were in, but where on the, for the area on the field. I'm guessing, I'm guessing John Harris will give a specific answer for this, that it was the, that Bullock was disguised and then ended up lurking, you know, and C.J. thought Bullock was going to be high, but he actually came down kind of like the Tua Tunga Violoa one from now. The difference with Tua was that the Texans set him up for that and Tua just cannot read coverages at all. Whereas CJ Stroud's very good at reading coverage.

[C]

Yep, yep, yep.

[D]

So I think that, so I look at it as a positive from the defense because they've been doing some kind of fun and funky stuff out here. And I think you're going to see more wrinkles and you're going to see more disguises out of the defense.

[C]

How do you think C.J. did yesterday?

[D]

I thought, I thought like the completions were Good. I thought that when he. There was at least one coverage sack, which is nice, because a lot of times in training camp last year, there would never have been time for a coverage sack.

[C]

And there were a couple of those, too.

[D]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, yeah, there were some conventional sacks. Neil Hunter and Will Anderson both got theirs. That'll happen. But there were a couple times where CJ had to pull it down, and it was because. It wasn't because one of those camp scenarios where. Well, K probably would have been a sack. But he ran. I think when he pulled it down and ran for a touchdown, from my vantage point, it looked like there was good protection. There was just nobody open, and he ran it and there you go.

[C]

There you go. So the. Yeah, you're right. The defense is absolutely going to get there. I thought that. I thought the offense ran the ball well at times yesterday.

[D]

Right. And that's the other thing, too, is the. When they have good runs. I've really been encouraged this year in that it looks like it's a good run as designed. It's not Joe Mixon dodging somebody in the backfield and then turning nothing into something.

[C]

Running to the sideline and then just trying to. Trying to beat somebody to the corner.

[D]

There's really. I mean, like, you really don't even have to know anything about offensive line play other than that. If you watch and you just kind of look at the uniformity in the way the offensive line moves, it's just a. It's a much better picture. And I'll include the tight ends in that. It's a much better picture than it's been the last couple years. I mean, they just. They flat out look like they know what they're doing. And I think Cole Popovich, who made a lot of improvements throughout the season and during the season last year, I think this. With a full year of him as the guy, I think they've. They've started to figure it out, and it's just become more. More routine and more. More automatic.

[C]

I'm anxious to ask Nick when he joins us. He's going to join us in about an hour. Nick Casario, about this evaluation of the offensive line, because they. We have fairly strict orders. They're kind of funny. Strict orders. Because especially the fans out here now.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, there's 2,000 other people that can just go on Twitter and tweet things that they see.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

That don't get handed a set of rules when they walk in.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

But we're under fairly strict orders about depth Chart. And these guys running with the ones, especially on the offensive line, that's a big topic. I don't even know other than Ariante Ursula at left tackle. I don't even know that there's anything to report on because they're just shuffling everybody right now.

[B]

It feels like.

[C]

Yeah, they're just running with the ones and twos.

[D]

Right.

[C]

He's been playing guard and center like.

[D]

Yeah, well, they're all doing everything. They've been open about that. And I think Nick's talked about that with the O line, is that they just. They're going to try the young guys out and see how they do. I've come around on that. I used to. I used to very much be of the mindset that, man, come on, you got to let an offensive lineman as a rookie get really comfortable in his one position and get good at that and then maybe work on the versatility. Something in the NFL that's just shifted and changed is O lineman get. O lineman get held out within. I don't know if they get injured any more than they used to, but they get diagnosed with the concussions, used to just play through it, you know, and then make a bunch of mental errors and get cut because of it. Like, so like o lineman get concussions. It's a 17 game season. You're gonna play with 8, 9, 10 guys, 10 different offensive linemen over the course of a season. And that. That versatility probably matters more than being a specialist at just one season. Yep.

[C]

All right, you brought up the MLB trade deadline. We'll get to. In the next segment, we'll get to. Demico Ryan's talked about Jadevion Clowney. Clowney was not out here for practice yesterday. He was in the building. I do know that because I saw video of him signing his contract. I think he was getting his medicals done and things.

[D]

We're gonna call it a hold in. Is he.

[C]

No, no.

[D]

He signed a contract, but now he's holding in.

[C]

Nope. He's just an old guy that needs a physical. I know how that feels.

[D]

Well, yeah, Mario Edwards wasn't out here either. Yeah, they're just gonna. They're gonna bring them along as they need to.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Hopefully today we'll see.

[D]

I do.

[C]

I did hear. I think. I think Clowney's meeting with the media today.

[A]

I think.

[C]

I think so. We'll see.

[B]

There are moments that define who you

[D]

are and who you're becoming. And when those moments arrive, what you drive should rise to meet them. The Range Rover sport commands attention from the very first glance. Every line, every detail engineered for impact. Inside refinement takes over with sculpted 22

[B]

way heated seating with available massage and a 13.1 inch touchscreen that puts everything within easy reach. But the Range Rover Sport isn't just about luxury.

[D]

It's about uncompromised performance, too. Delivering a powerful, agile drive that feels

[B]

as confident as it looks.

[D]

And with nearly endless ways to personalize,

[B]

from interior finishes to wheels to unique

[D]

colors and accessories, your Range Rover Sport becomes unmistakably yours.

[B]

For those who expect more from every moment, there's a vehicle designed to meet it. The Range Rover Sport Exclusive offers available now.

[D]

Explore further@range rover.com Sometimes it feels like the news is full of things that have never happened before. And that is not exactly true.

[C]

In fact, it may have happened this

[D]

very week, hundreds or thousands of years ago. I'm Sally Helm, host of the podcast

[C]

History this Week from the History Channel.

[D]

Trade embargoes.

[B]

Thomas Jefferson tried them Rent too high.

[D]

We've been arguing about that for for a while. Each episode is proof the past isn't that far away. Listen to History this Week, available now on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Hear that? That's now crispy and McCrispy strips meeting creamy Caesar sauce Sounds extra crispy caesar sauce at McDonald's for a limited time.

[A]

Flowing ad budget on metrics that look great til the CFO sees them. That's bull spend and marketers are calling in dashboard confessions.

[C]

I remember telling my boss it'll be good for the brand when leads were slow.

[D]

Yeah, it it wasn't Cut the bull spend.

[A]

LinkedIn lets you target by company job title and More. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com campaign terms and conditions apply.

[C]

But we'll we'll get to Clowney in the next segment. I do want to get to the trade deadline because we've got a lot of Astro fans I'm sure listening. Curious. Our thoughts on that. The only trade the Astros made yesterday after sitting by the phone waiting, waiting, waiting, I would say as far as like the magnitude of trades, this one was fairly far down the list of Jim Crane era deadline trades. No disrespect to Varsho, the outfielder they got from Toronto, who they immediately stuck right in there at cleanup in the lineup last night.

[D]

Got on base a couple times.

[C]

He did, he did. Yeah, it was good. And they traded him for Spencer Arighetti again. Something I would not have foreseen a couple months ago when Ericetti was kind of holding the pitching staff together. But this was Joe Espada on the trade yesterday. It's been busy the last couple of days. The last hour has been super busy. Excited to have at bar show to our, to our lineup. Not only, you know, he feel, you know, he fits a hole that we've, we've had here for a while. But I'm excited to Adam, you know, he brings a different dynamic to our offense. Can really play center field, lefty bat.

[D]

This guy was in the World Series

[C]

not that long ago. So he knows what it takes, he knows what it feels like. I just had a conversation with him really like the energy he brought in. Teammates were really excited to have him. We lose a really good arm. Spencer Abergetti, obviously very talented, done a lot of great things here for us. But I'm also excited for him to go and get his career started over there in Toronto. All right, so. So that was, that was Joe Espada. The reaction to this was interesting yesterday because Varsho is in the last year of his deal. So this is a rental. He's going to be on this team, you know, unless they, you know, unless he plays well and they bring him back, whatever. But for now this is a two month rental at a high position in need. And he's a lefty bat. We've been saying all season long they need a lefty, a competent lefty bat in the outfield. He's a Gold Glove caliber outfielder. So defense is not a problem with him. In fact, it's a plus with Varshow. He won a Gold Glove two years ago. I saw a lot of reaction to this Seth of you're giving up a pitcher who you've got control of for three more years.

[D]

Control.

[C]

And again, the control is arbitration. So it's a little more expensive control than the minimum salary araged he's been getting the last year.

[D]

Although Erichetti's not doing a whole lot to jack up those arbitrations.

[C]

Should be very reasonable. Yeah, yeah, good point.

[D]

We could have kept him cheap because he sucks. How are you letting guy a guy you got control and he sucks.

[C]

It really is interesting, man. Like how some people just fall in love with guys based on very small pockets of good performance.

[D]

Well, I think with Eric Eddy, I mean there's that part of me, whether it's rational or irrational, it feels like yeah, backpack back when the Astros were the supreme leaders in pitcher development. Yeah, Eric Eddy is exactly the type of guy that I think this organization would figure out how to harness and rein everything in. And there you go, Cy Young contender. And I just don't know if they're. I don't know if they're that team anymore. So I don't evaluate guys that way. And the part for me that's. I think where people are really going to fall on either side of it is I respect that they didn't want to touch their farm system. It's. You know, it might be kind of. It could be Dana Brown falling on his sword. He might lose his job for not being aggressive enough, but while still preserving the future of the organization. This was an extreme seller's market. You know, There are probably 10 sellers and 20 buyers, and it was just. It's. It's tough to get anything of note done. And I get that. It's just we don't really have an appetite for that, given the litany of issues this team has had, including all of the moves that Dana Brown made to try to bolster the pitching staff in the offseason, which have all cataclysmically failed.

[C]

Yep. Yeah, they have. And now you're at the same spot you were last year. The only big move they made last year at the deadline was bringing back Carlos Correa. And the thought was, well, we got all these guys coming back from injury and these. This is almost like getting trade deadline guys to. None of. I got to point this out again. None of these guys that have come back from Tommy John over the last few years have really helped this baseball team. I know Javier has been a little up and down, but I'll go back to Erkiti and Luis Garcia. You know, I know Wisneski did some promising things his first start back, but it wasn't great. Renel Blanco's not been great, and this is what they're counting on. Now. Probably the best thing to happen to him in the last 24 hours, pitching wise, is Imai came out and dominated in three innings of release last night,

[D]

throwing just his two favorite pitches instead of adding in that change up nine.

[C]

Up nine down with five strikeouts. If you missed it, that's been one

[D]

of the eight different storylines surrounding why Imai's uncomfortable, and that's been that the organization wants him to mix in his change up more.

[C]

He.

[D]

He doesn't want to do that. He wants to rely on his and his two favorites. And maybe as a reliever, that's perfect for him for right now. You can. You don't have to have as big of a Repertoire. I don't. Cool. I don't know. Cool.

[B]

Great.

[D]

Imai might be a reliever. He's either gonna be. This is what Imai is. He's either gonna continue to be volatile and relatively worthless, but you still have to pay him next year because he won't exercise his option, or he's gonna be a complete and total revelation, and he's gonna exercise his option and he won't be here next year.

[C]

He's gonna start again for this team in the next two months. That's just. I just say. And that's not even like inside information or anything. It's just math. They're gonna run into a spot where one of these guys is gonna have to miss a turn through the rotation or somebody's gonna get hurt. Or Wisneski and Blanco are gonna turn out to be just like all the other Tommy John guys that have come back.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And Imai's gonna have pitched well in the bullpen, and they're gonna say, we're paying him 18 million bucks. Get back at your fourth in the rotation.

[D]

You know what the trade deadline felt like? Felt like I was on trial for something. And I've watched a lot of Netflix, so I'm kind of waiting for that moment when. Wait a second. Isn't there gonna be some surprise evidence? There's gonna be some surprise evidence. I'm totally guilty, by the way. And. And I'm kind of like looking towards the back. Then I look over towards my. My. My court appointed attorney who's the lowest dude on the totem pole. Horrible. Yeah, he just. He bought his suit at Kmart and it doesn't even fit right. And I'm like, oh, wait, there is no. There is no surprise evidence. It's gonna show up at the last month.

[C]

This is it.

[D]

And Dana Brown is guilty.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, it's like, no, we really just haven't. We haven't really done a whole lot. Hey, what do you have to say for yourself, though? The last couple years Help Cam Smith, you know.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

There's some good times.

[C]

The evidence is not walking through that door. This is it. This is who they're rolling with. Baseball Talk on Sports Radio 610 presented by Xfinity. Score. The most reliable Wi Fi 1 price, five years guaranteed. Xfinity. Imagine that.

[D]

All right.

[C]

Jadevion Clowney's a Houston Texan. Demiko Ryan's thoughts on that. And I went back and looked the Pender poll on who you guys wanted to bring in as a reserve edge guy. Did the Texan fans get what they wanted with this signing.

[B]

We'll get to all that.

[C]

We got a lot more to get to. Nick Casario joins us in a little under an hour. 7:15 here live out at Texans 22 22.

[D]

Texans training camp is here live from the Houston Methodist Training Center. Sports Radio 610 presents Payne and Pendergast.

[C]

All right, just to. To put a bow on the. The Astros trade deadline, I want to read the dumbest tweet that I saw yesterday regarding the trade of Spencer Arrogant.

[D]

This is a pretty dumb tweet. It's pretty dumb from multiple levels, too. You didn't even see the other level that was dumb about this.

[C]

No. Okay, so this is Ben Verlander, brother of Justin Verlander, who.

[D]

He's not even a baseball player. No.

[C]

But he's found his way into the meeting eventually. Yeah, Right, right. I'm sure he played at some point.

[D]

No. I mean, no. Justin Verlander.

[C]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Barely. So Ben Verlander tweeted this yesterday about the Dalton Varsho Spencer Arrighetti trade. What an interesting move here for both sides. Astros get Varshaw, which I like. Varshow, which I like a lot. For them. Araghetti is a big price to pay. Been a huge reason the Astros have been in contention the last couple of years. He's been the duct tape that held the rotation together.

[D]

All right, all right, all right, all right, all right. Okay, the first part. The first word was. You raise your eyebrows. Now, wait a second. Eric Gettys, the duct tape that holds

[C]

the rotation together, it got progressively worse. And then.

[D]

And then at the very end, he's the reason they've been in contention. For what? What are you talking about? It's contention.

[C]

It's like it got progressively dumber because he's got three sentences in the last paragraph. The first one is, eric Eddy is a big price to pay. And my first thought is, I mean, 15 and 23 over three years of era of nearly five.

[D]

Okay.

[C]

You know, he's done some good things. And I like. And he's from here.

[B]

No.

[D]

And I've been very like, yeah, I like Arrogetti. I feel like there's upside there.

[C]

I do, too. I do, too. But big price to pay. I'm like, all right, that might be a little hyperbole. Next sentence. Been a huge reason the Astros have been in contention the last couple of years.

[D]

He pitched 35 innings last year. What? What? To your point?

[C]

To your point. Contention for what?

[D]

Like, making the play he's Using couple casually. Yeah, maybe he's only like, last couple years. He means, like, oh, the two years prior to this one.

[C]

Well, I mean, like, like, they did win the division two ago and they came down to the last day last year, but.

[D]

And he was still in ar. Well, Ericetta got better in that year as it went along. And. But he.

[C]

We're debating the word contention.

[D]

Right, Right, right, right. Yeah. They have not been in contention the last couple years for anything but maybe making the playoffs. Yeah, yeah.

[C]

And then, as if it could get any dumber, he's been the duct tape that held the rotation together.

[D]

No, that's.

[C]

What the hell. 15 and 23 with a 4. 6. 6 era over three years.

[D]

This tweet is so dumb that it made me feel better about the trade. You know, I just felt like, okay, well, if this is your standard and how you're judging it, I don't know what the hell.

[C]

It actually made me feel a little worse because the sentence right before all that was Astros getting Varshah, which I like a lot for them. You know, I'm like, I saw that at first. I'm like, okay, good. He agrees that this is good for the Astros. And then I read this paragraph, like, Eric, it's making Eric Getty out. You know what that and what even is what's even worse. And we'll get to Clowny here, I promise. His brother is Justin Verlander. He knows what the clue or the duct tape of a rotation looks like. It's your brother, Spencer Arighetti. If I was Justin, I'm texting him, like, what the hell.

[D]

I think for me, this is. If anything, this is just kind of the cherry on top of the Sunday of realizing, okay, this. This pitching development staff that they used to have in terms of the entire organization. I'm not just singling out Josh Miller or anything. Yeah. They're just not what they used to be. The days of just, hey, bring in any random dude. With Squarespace, you can do more than

[A]

just build a website.

[B]

You can build a business.

[A]

Squarespace helps restaurants and hotels showcase signature offerings and experiences. And with Squarespace, consultants and photographers can

[B]

create invoices to collect well earned payments.

[D]

You can even send email newsletters to

[B]

keep in touch with your loyal customers.

[C]

Done. So grow your [e-mail].

[D]

get started with offer code.

[B]

Make it real for 10% off your website or domain.

[A]

Are your ad campaigns lighting up the dashboard but not the pipeline that's bullspend and marketers are calling it out in dashboard confessions.

[B]

My boss asked for results so I

[C]

opened my dashboard for the only positive sounding metric I had impression Cut the bull.

[A]

Spend. See revenue not just reach. LinkedIn delivers the highest return on ad spend of major ad NETWORKS. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com campaign terms and conditions apply. That feeling when you check your bank account and your paycheck's days away. And of course your calendar's all good news. With Chase Secure Banking, your direct deposit hits your bank account up to two days faster. So when your friends are like and your bills go, you have the peace your deposit brings. And the best part, there's no monthly Service fee for 17 to 24 year olds thanks to Chase Secure Banking.

[B]

For Chase Secure Checking, only eligible direct

[D]

deposits may be credited up to two

[B]

business days early depending on when the payer submits the transaction.

[C]

Member FDIC Are you looking for the best deal on a new home? Discover the Dr. Horton home of the Week. With new construction homes now selling in ellensburg from the mid-3002, Dr. Horton has the right home at the best value for you, offering one and two story homes near near Central Washington University. Your new home is within reach. So what are you waiting for? Learn more about the Dr. Horton Home of the Week. Tap your screen now or visit Dr. Horton.com and schedule a tour. Today. Dr. Horton, America's builder and equal housing opportunity builder.

[B]

I'm Anna Garcia, host of True Crime News, the podcast.

[C]

Every week we bring you in depth

[B]

coverage on cases making headlines as well as those that go under the radar.

[A]

Tune in for murders that defy explanation,

[C]

mystery seeking exploration and shocking secrets that

[B]

will leave you breathless. Each week we honor the victims by going beyond the salacious in our search for justice. Crime never stops. And neither do we. Listen to True Crime News, available now on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[D]

And he's going to be the best version of himself. Bring in Charlie Morton. Yeah, cool. He'll end up being awesome. What did I just.

[C]

What did Andy Bernard say? I wish I knew I was living in the good old days. Or you know, he said something about the good old days on the office.

[D]

That was beautiful, Sean.

[C]

There was. People know what I'm talking about.

[D]

You wish there was a way to know that the that you're in the

[C]

good old days when you're living in them.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. We develop pictures.

[D]

No, I think I feel like we all knew that. If you're a sports fan long enough look, we're not Boston. We're not like a 25 year old Boston sports fan who thinks that you just come out of the womb and all your teams are vying for championship.

[C]

I was starting to get kind of greedy.

[D]

We've seen the highs and the lows and you knew at some point the golden era wasn't going to be quite so golden no more. Yep. We're smack dab in the middle of that.

[C]

Yep. All right.

[D]

I appreciated it at the time, Sean. Maybe I wasn't out there burning hundred dollar bills the way you were.

[C]

I know. I just don't, I don't, I don't. I, I'm a little crazy that way. All right, so Jadevion Clowney is a Houston Texan. This was d' Amico Ryan's yesterday asked about the newest acquisition on the defensive line. I didn't hear about that.

[D]

We'll see.

[C]

See what he brings. Even though everybody knows Clowney was, you know, first pick overall here in Houston and he's been a successful player, had a successful career, you know, he brings physical aspect to the football game right to our defense. A guy who can get after the passer as well. So we'll try to get him in, get him acclimated to what we're doing, and he'll be up to speed, off and running. He was in the building yesterday. For those that don't go way back with the Texans, the two of them, d' Ameco and Clowney, missed each other by a few years. D' Ameco's gone by 2012. Clowney came in in 14.

[D]

They didn't get the audio of it. But before he left, d' Ameco said, I wish there was a way to know you're in the good old days before you've actually left.

[C]

Oh, so I knew d' Amico would get it right.

[D]

Yeah. He was talking about how clown he was underappreciated when he was here.

[B]

Right.

[D]

No, I, it's, it's so strange with Clowney because I feel like there's a certain, there's a certain group of fans who still can't get over the fact that he wasn't worth a number one overall pick. Like, okay, great, he wasn't. He didn't give you a Will Anderson or Miles Garrett type of return on your, on your investment. But like, if he had been drafted 27th overall, you'd say, wow, that's a, that's a really good football player.

[C]

Whitney Merciless was drafted 26th overall and

[D]

nobody thought that that was a bad pick. Clown. He's been a better player than Whitney Merciless. Like, he's. He's still. And he's still churning out really impressive season after season after season. He's just oddly doing it with a different team every single year. This will be the fifth team in his fifth year. The one you put up your poll that you talked about. Explain the poll and I'll tell you the one. The one reply to your poll that kind of annoyed me.

[C]

Okay. Okay. So this is all the way back on June 2nd.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So this is when, according to. I said, according to Texans cap. The Texans have 30 million in cap space. They could use it to sign one of the following defensive ends. And I had estimated average contracts by spot rack next to each of their names. They did a pretty good job with Clowney. Yeah, they estimated 5.7 million. Clowney's getting a base of 5.5. So they were pretty spot on with that. The four names that I asked Texan fans, who do you want at these prices? Joey Bosa, Cam Jordan, Von Miller, Jadevian Clowney. It was a very, very close poll all four ways. Cam Jordan won the poll by less than 1 percentage point over Jadevian Clowney. Clowney was number two. Yeah.

[D]

And those 28.6%, you know, cam Jordan ends up resigning. Can't begrudge him for that on a team that actually might has a pulse again.

[C]

And he's been there after being right.

[D]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Von Miller just didn't make a whole lot of sense just because he's not. He's not a great scheme fit. And except if you're gonna bring him in on third downs and they have the guys they want in there on third down. Yeah. So Clowney makes a whole lot of sense. The. The reply that I. That annoyed me was somebody who's a listener to our show, so I won't say his name.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

But he said Clowney is the opposite of swarm. People have short memory. No, I have a long memory. It's not always all that precise, but it's long.

[C]

It's long.

[D]

And honestly, that has been a bogus narrative on Clowney in terms of the way he plays the game. I don't know if Bill o' Brien might have had some issues with a young Clowney and how mature he was in terms of meetings and practice and all that stuff, but when it comes to the way he plays the game of football, he's incredibly swarming. He's got a ridiculously good motor. He makes. Plays sideline to sideline, he chases wide receivers 20 and 30 yards downfield. Like still to this day. Intensity on the field is not the issue at all with Clowney. It's a part of it. I blame Steve Spurrier for just always having to make it about a nice little quip when they asked him about Clowney's work ethic and he said he's not as. Like he's. No. Who's a South Carolina player that he compared.

[C]

Oh, I forget. I know what you're talking about. Spurrier was his coaching colleague, right?

[D]

Yeah. No, and Clowney. Clowney, I think has matured over the years and was a guy who was young and he. Look, he didn't have the drive or the focus or the passion of Will Anderson when it came to just doing everything you can to make yourself better. Will Anderson the prototype for that. But he's, he's an, he's an older guy now who's matured and he's also. You're giving him a base of five and a half million dollars. I mean, this is, this is a little bit better than EJ Speed's contract from last year when they brought him in. Yeah.

[C]

And here's the thing, Seth, here's the thing, because I think this is a good contract.

[D]

I mean, it's like a little bit more lucrative and Clowny makes a much larger impact.

[C]

Yeah. And I think, you know, and they, and they sign Logan hall to a nice, you know, to a team friendly deal. When you pay will Anderson 50 million and you pay Daniel Hunter 40 million, you've got to find some guys along the margins like that that can play at a fairly high level at a fairly low wage. This is a great signing for the ucs.

[D]

No, it really is. And I think for. Honestly, this is where like if Derek Barnett maybe was in the mix and they were talking to him. I can't remember what Barnett made last year, but it's like around Clowney's. Right?

[A]

Right.

[C]

Like five million bucks.

[D]

Clowney's still a really good football player. He's still really good. And the sack totals do not tell the whole story whatsoever about his impact on a game. He's really good against the run. He makes plays in the backfield. It healed. You know, he's had, he's never had double digit sacks, but that's kind of, I think, where he doesn't have the bling. And that's, that's real like over the course of a career when like sacks in any given season don't necessarily matter, but over the Course of a career. Yeah, he's not a high sack total guy, but he makes such an impact both in pressuring the quarterback and in making tackles for a loss that this is a, it's a really good game.

[C]

And I think it's very telling. If you went and read the article in the Chronicle that of the, of the signing of Clowney, I'm guessing it was Jonathan Alexander that had a lot of quotes in it that had to do with. I'm more mature now. I'm looking to help lead some of the young guys on the team. You know, he talked about how he's focused on winning and wanting to get to a Super Bowl. I think that's probably very. And this is after he had signed. I think that's probably very telling about the type of conversation he had with d'. Ameco. Ryan's. Yeah. About what the Texans are looking for in a guy like that, a 33 year old guy that's a backup on the defensive line.

[D]

And then he also said that thing which you always, you know, you're always skeptical of. He said it wasn't about the money. Yes. Sometimes in, I would say about 5% of cases, I actually take that with some element of believability.

[C]

The other 95, you think they're full of crap.

[D]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think with Clowney, I mean, it's, for one, you get up there, you got kids there, he lives in Houston. There is an element of just, it's nice to not have to move and either figure out whether you're bringing your kids with you, you're gonna live remotely for a year.

[C]

And oh, by the way, they're good at football.

[D]

Right, right. That part. Well, yeah, that's. The other part is that it's a really good situation and they have another guy, Danil, who lives in Houston and is on kind of a pay as you go plan. And that's, that's appealing. As you get older, when you're never quite sure, you don't know how you're gonna feel at the end of next year season, you know, you get to be clowning. He's 33 years old and you don't know if you have a major injury or something, this might be the year that you want to pack it in. And it's nice to just kind of be unencumbered, but that if you play really well that the Texans have a precedent over. Yeah, we'll go ahead and we'll, we'll do like we did with Daniel and add Another year to your content.

[C]

Yeah, we'll bring it back. Yeah, absolutely. All right. Payne and Pendergast with you on a, on a what's today? Tuesday. On a Tuesday 6 practice of training camp out here today, presumably in pads. We'll talk to Nick Casario about that and a whole lot more at 7:15 on the show today. Up next, headlines. A Texan got himself an endorsement, an unlikely endorsement. Well, that. We've got Astros news. We'll get to all that coming up next in headlines.

[D]

22 Pain and Pendergast with today's headlines.

[C]

All right, let's get to headlines. Let's start. We'll start with the Astros. They lose last night to the Toronto Blue Jays after consummating a trade with them earlier in the day. Dalton Varsho, outfielder, is now a Houston Astro. It sounds like he's going to be their starting center fielder moving forward. They gave up Spencer Arrighetti to get him a straight up trade. Just those two guys. So they each just swapped, maybe even just swapped lockers yesterday. Seth and yeah. Varsho, inserted immediately as the cleanup hitter in the lineup for the Astros.

[D]

Felt bad for Araghetti. Arigetti didn't. He looked shocked and not, not like pleasantly shocked and surprised. Like a, like, not like a surprise party.

[C]

Well, think about it, too. Think about Eric Getty's side of this thing when he was, when he was pitching the way he was in May. Like we, you know, we gotta, if they go on to win the division, we do need to give Spencer Getty credit for being the pitcher that kept this thing from completely plundering in, in May for sure. He was 7 and 1 at one point.

[D]

He'll have earned his World Series ring. Yes.

[C]

Yes. And his playoff share. But he was very, very, he was a pitcher of the month for the month of May. The last thing Spencer arrighetti thought on June 1 was that he was going to be tossed into a trade for a veteran outfielder.

[D]

Right.

[C]

Trade deadline.

[D]

You might have like at that point, you think like he might be a part of a blockbuster trade or something. Not just something that two GMs do to make their fan bases look like they're working.

[C]

They happen to be the same building.

[B]

Hey, look.

[D]

Hey. Did you do anything yet? No. You didn't. Okay, cool. How about. How about Eric Eddie for Varsho? Sounds good. That'll. That'll keep the idiots happy.

[C]

That'll throw them off the scent.

[D]

That's why they, they called you idiots.

[C]

Yep. Yep.

[D]

In my hypothetical scenario.

[C]

Right, right.

[A]

Right.

[C]

So The. So that trade got made yesterday. Astros lose 3 to 1 last night, so that was disappointing.

[D]

Imai was electric.

[C]

Yeah. If we're.

[D]

If we're. I know that's what everybody's looking for. Well, if you're.

[C]

I mean, if you're trying to draw positives from a loss, I mean, they're still in first place.

[D]

You've won eight of your last 10 games. Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. No, no. I'm not saying the sky is falling, but that was nice to see last night. Tatsuya Imai, if you missed it, came in first appearance coming out of the bullpen. If you had asked me, based on how he's adapted to change thus far in his major league career, yeah, I would have said I expected him to come in and give up five runs in an inning. He came in instead and made a case for him being a long reliever. If anything, he retired all nine guys, five of them via strikeout. He was dominant last night.

[D]

His ex act expected adapt. Adaptability to change is really low. It matches his actual performance right now.

[A]

Right.

[D]

I think. Yeah.

[C]

Last night. So encouraging.

[D]

I think with every. All of your best lead plans with your pitching staff have been completely shot to hell, including the things that have gone, well, you know, Lambert, whatever, dfa, he comes back and he's your best guy. Imai. Okay, disaster. But maybe we got a reliever out of this. Maybe we're gonna be paying way too much when he exercises or when he. Well, when he doesn't exercise.

[C]

When they get to game three of a wild card round series, it's good to know that Imai can come in and give you three innings of a bullpen.

[D]

It's good. You know what? I'm glad you pointed out that they have one above of baseball games lately, because there is. There's a tendency to just. There's a letdown. Feels a little bit like it feels like it's not that the day after Christmas is always kind of a depressing. When you're a kid, you know, you get a little bit of dopamine withdrawal or crash.

[B]

It's.

[D]

Imagine the day after Christmas when you also got just no presents or a crappy present. That's what it would feel like.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[D]

Credit to the lady that had a var show sign in the baseball park last night.

[C]

She did?

[D]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, oh, that's how you ended Dalton Varsho? And I was like, oh, I didn't know that's how you spelled Dalton.

[C]

I don't know. You did.

[D]

She. I wonder if she heard the news on her way in, and she stopped at the drugstore to grab a placard and a marker or something. Yeah, it wasn't a huge poster, but it was definitely something she didn't have in her purse.

[C]

The Astros are still two and a half games up in the division over the Rangers.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So they don't lose any ground last night.

[D]

No, that part of it. And there's that part of me, too. The rational side of me. It's kind of like, okay, if you're. If you're a teenager and your dad says we can't go to Disney World, but it's because we got to pay for college, you're like, ah, yeah. All right.

[C]

Gotta do what you got to do.

[D]

You know, you're one of those teenagers that's super into Disney. I don't judge you.

[C]

I'm an adult who's into Disney. I like going to Disney World.

[D]

You would be one of those good guys who. You'd be one of those. The people that's. A tour operator. You retire and then go work at Disney Retirement.

[C]

Amy would do that in a second.

[D]

You'd be really good at that.

[C]

Thanks, man. Yeah.

[D]

Oh, you'd be all. You'd be a superstar.

[B]

You think?

[D]

Yes.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

You should do that.

[C]

Oh, yeah. Not anytime soon.

[D]

Let me get my list of replacements for Sean. I was gonna say you should really do that.

[C]

Feels like you're.

[D]

I think that would be awesome.

[C]

It really feels like you're pushing hard on this.

[D]

Be a transformative experience for you.

[C]

Speaking of transformative, Jordan Alvarez, Player of the month again. Player of the month for July. He is so far out in front for the MVP right now.

[D]

I know, man.

[C]

And he's way out in front for the batting title, of all things.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

He's like 30 points out in front of the next closest guy.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yandy Diaz was leading, like, two weeks.

[D]

Like if Ichiro had taken a boatload of creatine and steroids.

[C]

Yes. And was it from Cuba?

[D]

That's a comp I often make for him. He's. He's like Ichiro, except with way, way, way, way, way more power.

[C]

Yes. So that was good news. Texans, the deviant clowney in the building yesterday. First padded practice out here yesterday. We'll talk more about that with Nick Castario at 7:15 on the show today. So in about about 25 minutes or so, Nick will join us out here live at training camp. Did you see Jalen Petrie got himself an endorsement yesterday?

[D]

I saw this because you and Landry sent It to me.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Jalen Petrie headline, Jalen Petrie named first NFL Guardian athlete supports community with cat donation. Okay, so this is, this is a press release donating to the salary cap. He kind of is. With his contract, it's a pretty reasonable deal. But no. Guardian Sports, the Atlanta based sports safety equipment company behind the mandate, the NFL mandated guardian cap, the Bonnet. The Bonnet today announced the partnership with Jalen Petrie, who will support efforts as the first NFL Guardian athlete. The collaboration aims to further promote athlete safety awareness across all levels of play. Good for you, Jalen Petrie.

[D]

Good for you. Take that check.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

For something you're doing already. There's no. You don't have to wonder whether he's just only talking about this because they're paying him money. He's. He's one of the brave few that are willing to don the cap.

[C]

You know, my, my theory on this, I think the Rasheed Rice hit single handedly made the Guardian cap cool.

[B]

Hell yeah.

[C]

Like, before that, they're like, look, I mean, look at this guy running around with this, this big gigantic bonnet on and then he murders Rashid Rice in

[D]

cold blood on the field. They're like, oh, that cap is cool. He's done the same thing for the Guardian cap that movie stars have done for stupid haircuts.

[B]

Yes.

[D]

You know, like, well, that looks a ridiculously stupid haircut, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

100,000 Travolta running around. Yeah.

[C]

Yep.

[D]

I think that John Travolta, when he used to have hair, you know, back in the day, back in the Saturday Night Fever type stuff. Yeah. I think that the. Nico was asked this the other day again. He was asked during OTAS whether he would wear the Guardian cap. He said no. He was asked in the tent the other day on Saturday whether he would wear it. And it was funny because he looked. He looked towards his helmet. Whoever had asked the question must have pointed his helmet because they all wear them in practice. And he looked towards it with such disgust and disdain and he said, nah, I ain't wearing that.

[C]

Oh, yeah, because he's wearing a Guardian cap in practice.

[D]

They all wear Guardian caps in practice. So, yeah, like, he pointed at the pro. The. His helmet.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And he's looking. It looked like he was looking at his helmet. He said, no, I ain't wearing that because, yeah, it sounds like it's harder to track the ball, etc. Etc.

[C]

Yeah. He sounded more like it was a functional thing than an aesthetic thing.

[D]

And then he said, you know, I'm doing All the other things. I'm strengthening my neck and doing all these things to, you know, to try to avoid concussion.

[C]

Is that real?

[D]

I think that. Well, it's always this.

[C]

Help.

[D]

Sean, this is a tough thing about concussion prevention stories. As of right now, these wimpy doctors say it's air quotes, unethical to take a bunch of people and put them into two separate groups and bash some of them in the head with a bat. And hard to do a double blind, placebo controlled study. But yeah, in theory, wearing a mouth guard, strengthening your neck. Yeah, all these things in theory, help avoid concussion. And then there's, you know, they find correlation a lot of things.

[C]

If it gets too bulked up in the neck, that's gonna hurt tracking the ball.

[D]

Also, I want him to look like that meme from a couple years ago. Remember that guy that, like, if you were to survive a car accident.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

The. The ideal body type. And it was just this big, freakish looking wide neck guy with a.

[C]

Or Ted Johnson.

[D]

Yeah. Problem with strengthening your neck, though, is it can also increase your. It's a. It doesn't have to be just you got a big fat neck. If you got a big muscular neck, you can get sleep apnea.

[C]

Oh, really?

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

That's why I.

[C]

That would explain why I had sleep ap.

[D]

That's why you and I don't hit the neck flexion machine.

[C]

All right. That's exactly why. All right, coming up next, CJ Stroud, we talked about the disrespect possibly coming from three different corners of the universe the last few days. There's a fourth one, Sandoz qb. Tears for the athletic are out.

[D]

Hell yeah. Anonymous quotes on the up right before we talk. You know, Casterio loves the anonymous quotes.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[D]

There ain't a GM in the NFL who ain't a fan of anonymous quotes.

[C]

Yep, we'll get to that. We'll do that.

[D]

Texans training camp is here. Live from the Houston Methodist Training Center, Sports Radio 610 presents Payne and Pendergast.

[C]

All right, Nick Nicerio joins us in about a little over 10 minutes. And we'll talk to the Texans GM for the remainder of the program today, all the way up till 7:55, so. Or 754.

[D]

Is that. That's entered the lecture program. Program, yeah.

[C]

McAfee.

[D]

McAfee's. McAfee's big enough to have entered the. The way people pronounce.

[C]

Yeah. It might wind up in Webster's. Who knows, man, you never know. Quick, quick. Breaking news. Bijan Robinson. We Know we got a lot of Longhorns listening out there. Three years, 75 million dollar extension. He just signed this morning with the Atlanta Falcons.

[D]

That's kind of where the league is settled in on, is like, listen, running backs, we'll pay a good, respectable money, but it's going to be on short term deals.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And the running backs have kind of grudgingly said, all right, I get it.

[C]

AAV. Pretty good, though. 25.

[D]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

That's really good.

[C]

Yeah. And so 51 million guaranteed. So congrats to Bijan Robinson. And now at that position, all eyes shift to Jameer Gibbs, who's in a hold in right now up in Detroit.

[D]

The hold in. You and I were talking about this during a break. The hold in doesn't seem to be quite the scourge that it looked like it was becoming. So for those of you who don't know, a hold in is when a player shows up and he's not practicing. He's got a nondescript injury. Think Jonathan Taylor a couple years ago. And, and. And he's also agitated about his contract.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

And the team, the team is saying they're in a position where they say, well, we could fine you for contract detrimental, but that's probably not the best way to move forward with this. And it's. It's uncomfortable as a fan to watch this. It feels like. It feels like, to me, as a former player, it feels like dirty pool. Like, I'm not a fan of the Holden. I'm a former player. I stand for the rights of players and everything, but it's kind of. I feel like it's dirty pool.

[C]

We got to get to the CJ thing, but could you imagine if Tank Dell's whole thing is. He's actually holding in right now.

[D]

He's holding in. He's actually been fully recovered for six months. Everybody else can. These extensions. What the hell?

[C]

Your leg's been shattered twice already and shot at.

[D]

You gave Will Anderson a contract. I'm sitting out here.

[C]

That'd be hilarious.

[D]

The. No, I think so. The other one, real quick. I'm sorry. I do think, like, the Major League Baseball Players association, one of the reasons that they are so powerful, for one, is that they uniformly. They don't pull this crap.

[C]

No.

[D]

They don't demand trades. It's very, very rare for a player to try to agitate his way out of a situation. They say, oh, cool, we get these huge, lucrative contracts, but we're gonna hold up and we're gonna play out our contracts even if we're in a miserable situation and it's like, I don't know how they do it with that many players, but they, they stick to it well. So there's a level of certain. So GMs can give out that money knowing, like, okay, I don't have to worry about this guy agitating for a new deal because every time there's a

[C]

work stoppage, the players in baseball win.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, they win. So. So, yeah. Bijan Robinson, very rich man. All right, so the Mike Sando. I wish we had more than five minutes to get into this, but I'll. We'll happily take Nick Casario as a guest here. But Mike Sando's quarterback tears Annual article is out. It's one of my favorite ones. He's got a bunch of 50 people from around the NFL voting on what tier each quarterback is in. And then he blends it all together into one ranking. So just to give you the high points here, there's four quarterbacks in tier one. These are the franchise. Franchise guys. And it's the names you would think. It's Patrick Mahomes, it's Josh Allen, it's Matthew Stafford, it's Joe Burrow. Those are the four. Lamar Jackson is at the very top of Tier 2, and there's about 10 or 12 guys in Tier 2. Tier 2 is described as someone who carries his team, sometimes handles pure passing situations in doses, has other dimensions that elevate him above tier 3, but has a hole or two in his game. Not going to go through all the names, but I will say as I page down tier 2 and I get into the early teens of overall quarterbacks here.

[D]

Well, and I think when you get into the golfs and the loves, you know where, okay, this is right around where CJ was. That was the conversation around that, that him and. Him and Jordan Love were almost in QB rankings, always right next to each other.

[C]

C.J. was ninth in this exercise last year. Yeah, this very exercise. A year ago he was ninth.

[D]

Jordan Love is tenth.

[C]

This year Jordan Love is tenth. And CJ's not shown up yet as we scroll down. Brock Purdy, Caleb Williams. Jaden Daniels is 13. Keep going. Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, haven't got a CJ yet.

[D]

There's a Trevor Lawrence.

[C]

Lawrence at 16.

[D]

I like Jaden Daniels being where he is given that so far his trajectory has been very similar to CJ's in terms of incredible rookie year, underwhelming second year. But I think people are making the excuses of the. It's Weird. Just like with CJ they're making excuses of an offensive coordinator that might not have been the right guy, even though it's the same offensive coordinator that delivered that rookie year.

[C]

Well. And his issues are injuries now too.

[D]

And injuries. Yeah. C.J. didn't have the injuries.

[C]

Yeah. Yeah. Which, which makes it curious. Jalen hurts. 17. Ah, now we get to tier 3. CJ must be showing up at the top of tier 3, where in that tier you're a legit starter, but you need a running game or defense to win.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Lower volume, drop back passing offense suits him best. That feels like the direction things are going with C.J. right now. That description. So he must be near the top of that. 18th Bo Nix. 19th. Aaron Rodgers.

[D]

Rodgers.

[C]

Rodgers. 20th. CJ Stroud.

[D]

Rogers was as bad in the playoffs as CJ Stroud was in the playoffs.

[C]

20th. Yeah, on the very same field. 20th. CJ Stroud, the one. The headline quote, they have a headline quote for each of these guys. Seth, from a anonymous person. The headline quote for CJ is from a defensive coordinator coordinator. This is a big year for him. He has it in him. End quote. Does CJ have it in him to get back into Tier 2 this season?

[D]

I think he, 100% he has it in him. Yes. Yeah.

[C]

I, by the way, the voting for him.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

13 votes in tier two, 37 votes in tier three.

[D]

My, my, my thoughts about what C.J. stroud ceiling theoretically is and should be are still very high. And it's going to be a huge disappointment if he doesn't get somewhere close or at least, you know, substantially better than he was last year. Because I do think, I do think he made some improvements last year in operating as an actual veteran NFL quarterback. It's just, it's, you got to see him with a competent supporting cast and start to give a feel for just. Exactly. All right. Now he doesn't have these excuses or. All right. He's got these things and wow, look at how much better the performance is. Just a solid rushing attack. Not even an awesome rushing attack. A common, competent rushing attack for one. That's the biggest thing.

[C]

Do you want some anonymous quotes?

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

A defensive coordinator said, quote, prior to last year, I would have thought he's going to be on the fringe of being in the upper echelon. I want to say he's a three based on the last couple years, but he's a two if I'm being fair. So kind of what you're saying, like he's right now sits in three, but he's got the potential. Obviously he's got the potential. He's done it before. Yeah.

[D]

They said ambivalence was a theme with a lot of these voters on C.J.

[C]

yep. And here's a couple quotes to that end. He's starting to fall into that category of a quarterback who's hard to protect. This is an executive saying this. He doesn't beat you at the line and get the ball out. He holds the football. And then when he holds the football, he makes mistakes. End quote.

[D]

Yeah. And I think that's. That's honestly one of the things that he made improvement on last year. It's just with everything being shuffled around and with still not being able to truly trust the pass protection. But more than anything, I think the receivers play a part in that, too. I think not getting the ball out fast or especially when he's under duress. I think there were just. There were too many times where the quarterback and the O line weren't necessarily always on the same page. There were times when young receivers who maybe should have been the hot receiver didn't have their eyes on C.J. there was. There were a lot of things that were above and beyond just CJ Himself when it comes to that. And it came in. I think one of the tough things about CJ Last year was that some of the. Some of the higher. Some of the nationally televised games are the ones where these issues showed up and people, by and large didn't see a lot of the good things he was doing in the same category.

[C]

Yep.

[D]

All right.

[C]

Nick Casario, Texans executive vice president and general manager, is going to join us out here live at training camp. Coming up next, we will talk about CJ Stroud with Nick Casario. How's this offensive line evaluation going and the. The reunion with Jadevion Clowney? We'll get some of the details on that, hopefully from Nick Casario as well. Stay there. You're listening.

[D]

Are you Ready? Sports Radio 610 presents Pain and Pendergast.

[C]

Hi. There we go. We know when that music plays and it's in the 7 o' clock hour. I'm Payne and Pendergast and we're here at the sixth practice of Texans training camp. Sweating, steamy.

[D]

Do you call it? Do you call it?

[B]

I call it.

[D]

Day. Day seven.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

You like going by practice?

[C]

I like going by practice number. You know what?

[D]

How do you guys do it?

[C]

Let's let Nick Casario, Texans Executive Vice President, General manager, break the tie is today, day six of camp because it's the Sixth practice, or is it practice six and day seven, it's practice two

[B]

because the second one in pass, no tie broken.

[C]

But he's the authority. His vote counts the most.

[B]

Great to be here.

[D]

Good morning. Question like a pro.

[A]

All right.

[C]

Yeah. Good morning. Good morning. It's great to see you, Nick, as always. Me personally, I wanted to make sure we got you after SummerSlam so I could get just one gut reaction to SummerSlam before we get into all the football stuff.

[B]

Probably Randy Horton coming out of nowhere.

[C]

Is he another close personal friend of yours?

[B]

Not sure he's quite in triple H category, but we're, we're, we're bridging the gap.

[C]

You met combine? Yes. You met, you met him at the combine. And my first reaction was, is Nick really small or is Randy Orton as big as.

[B]

He's really big. I mean, I'm not very big, but he's a monster. He's a big dude.

[D]

It's like that picture of yao Ming and JJ. Yeah, JJ looks like a 12 year old. That's what it was. Yeah.

[C]

You're a good company, jj.

[B]

Y.

[C]

It's great to see. As always, Nick. So let's get into it here before we get into all the stuff we've seen on the field. Big news for Texan fans. The last day or so has been Jadevian Clowney coming back. Take us through that. What made this the right time for JD to return to the Houston Texans?

[B]

Yeah, we kind of worked through the spring in there a little bit. You know, that kind of third end spot was an area that we probably felt we were going to add at some point. You know, Derek did a good job for us in that role. Had conversations with him. So just kind of keeping track of the market. Who are the players that are in that category. Feel pretty fortunate, you know, with Will and Danil. And then I would say Dylan has had a good role for us. And then we signed Dominique Robinson who's had a pretty good training camp here. So it kind of brings a little bit different element. But that was an area we're just kind of looking at some players that maybe potentially could fill that role. And you know, JD Was a player who we had some conversations with initially, maybe it was a little bit later in the spring slash, summer. And then we kind of, kind of, kind of kept in contact with his agent over the course course this summer. And that there at some point there was some level of mutual interest. He obviously had a lot of interest from some other teams. I think there's some other teams that Were involved, but it kind of worked out. I mean, it says a lot about Jadevion, the fact that he wanted to be here, wanted to be around some of the things that we're doing. We didn't overlap. I mean, I wasn't here when Jadevion was here previously. Haven't played against him multiple times. Know how big of a pain in the ass that he was, but. And he's still shown the ability, whether it's in Dallas, Baltimore, Carolina, these different stops, he still brings some positive qualities to the table. So we'll get started with him today. He'll be out here practicing. We'll kind of see how it goes.

[D]

I think the thing with Javion Clowney that going back to when he was here is I get frustrated on his behalf, partly because at least part of the narrative about him is I like. And I still get people saying to me now, like, well, he doesn't play hard. I'm like, he plays hard. And he has since he's a rookie. And I don't know why people haven't picked up on that other than they're just looking at stat lines or whatever. But he's. He's got a swarmy element to his play.

[B]

He's always played hard and he's disruptive with his snaps. And even when we were playing against the Texans when I was in New England, you know, their front, you know. Yeah. Jj, you know, you had. JD Was a part of it. Merciless. And they'd move JD around some different, different spots and put him over to guard. I mean, he was really difficult to block. So he's got a unique skill set. His length, he's got real good straight line speed. He does have toughness. And to your point, Seth, he plays with good effort. I'm not really sure because he runs well.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

So the ability to close space and close from behind. So we feel. And the reality is whoever walks in the building, whoever walks in that defensive meeting room, if you don't play hard and compete, you're probably not going to last very long.

[D]

Oh, yeah, that's one thing about, you know, I said this offseason, if I were a free agent defensive lineman who wasn't happy with the offers that I was getting, I would, I would fly to Houston and park myself in front of d' Ameco's office and just say, I want to play here. And like, I think Rod Wright does an incredible job as a defensive line coach. I think Burke and d' Ameco do an awesome job in just Creating an environment where you come here and you guys have this tendency to get the best out of defensive lineman. Are you, are you starting to get the feel for this being a destination where a guy like Dominique Robinson perhaps can look at multiple places and say, man, people go to Houston and they tend to, they tend to do pretty well.

[B]

Well, I think we're fortunate that people want to come here and be a part of our program. And it really starts with the players because ultimately we can message it. And obviously there's a standard of performance that's expected day to day. It starts with d' Ameco and then defensively trickles down to Matt, Rod Wright, you know, Billy Davis, Dino, Steven, even Frank Oakham, too. Frank works the defensive line. So. But ultimately the players are the ones that hold themselves accountable. So in the end, player accountability is the best accountability. Like you can do only so much as a coach and try to message, but if the players don't go out there and perform that to that level and do the things that you want to do, ultimately it's not going to work. So it's really, it's a credit to the players. And they see, I mean, you watch practice, I mean, there's a play d' Amico showed yesterday was a small thing, but talk about finishing, closing of the ball. I mean, Aziz must have run like 40 yards to track the ball. He was in the line of scrimmage and that was the end of the play and he was sprinting to finish on the ball. So when you see a player like Aziz do that and then Kamari shows up around the ball, so there's a trickle down effect. So you really don't have a choice. And if you don't do it, you become an outlier.

[D]

Yeah, you're. Yeah, you're a black sheep.

[C]

Texans executive vice president and general manager Nick Casario joining us here live at Texans training camp. To that end, how much is Keelan Rutledge shown up finishing plays in the, in the tape, in the offensive line room? Because we've seen a lot of that out here.

[B]

He shows up every day and you saw that at Georgia Tech. That was one of the things that was appealing about him. He has a certain mentality and a certain playing style and it's reflective of how we want to play. And it showed up well, I think honestly the first or second day of practice, even when we were in shorts. When you're in shorts, there's only so much you can do, but you're trying to get. It's more assignment Football, but, you know, there's going to be some contact to some degree, and I think. I can't remember what happened. It was the end of a play, him and Aziz, and then Kamari got in there. So, you know, and Kaitlan wasn't backing down, and he's not going to back down, which is what you want to see. So you want to toe the line because you're. We're going to play clean, hard football. You just don't want to go over the line. But that notion of finishing plays is something that we want to be able to do as a football team. And that message, I would say each day is emphasized, and then when you see it show up on tape and on the field, it kind of reinforces the decision that you made.

[C]

Does it. Does it even augment the message to the rest of the room a little bit that this is a guy who's in his sixth practice today, you know, and he's the guy we're showing up here finishing these plays?

[B]

Well, this is the standard and this is behavior. So this is what we're going to reinforce, good or bad. Hey, here are some things that are the positives. I mean, d' Ameco does a great job of going through practice and highlighting, hey, here are some of the things that we did well. Here's some areas that we can improve, but we're not going to coach like we shouldn't have to coach. Effort and toughness and physicality. Our job is to find players that have those qualities. And then when you get on the football field, like, there's your opportunity to play physical.

[D]

When I'm watching the offense, I'm trying to, you know, I did I always remind myself, okay, look, if this is a combined practice versus the LA Rams, the Texans defense is going to get theirs. They're going to make some plays and that you can't judge. Like yesterday, you know, the offense had some bad plays, but they also had some good plays. And so I try to compare the offense to where they were in training camp last year. It feels like with the offensive line and the tight ends, it just feels like it's a cleaner operation. And it's hard to judge sometimes, you know, in camp how far a run would have gone. But I know that it. It just looks better and it looks more uniform and it looks like guys are moving in lockstep better than they were last year. Has that been your impression?

[B]

Yeah, I think what you want to see in practice, there's going to be give and take. The defense is going to make some plays. The offense is going to make some plays. Hopefully you're learning from one another. I would say there's a lot of communication. You can see we want to encourage the communication because really, what you're trying to do offensively on the front, you're just trying to get the blockers distributed appropriately. So make sure we're. We talk about this hat on the hat on a hat. And it's just simple as just, okay, I have to block, Sean. Make sure everybody knows that we're working too. Sean.

[A]

All right.

[D]

Are you going to find a block, Sean? It's a difficult question. A lot of people on social media have done it. I think what we've been able to

[B]

do, there's multiple examples of being able to get plays started, and ultimately the running back is going to have, have to deal with a free player, whether it's a perimeter player at the corner or even a second level player. So there's going to be a free player at some point, knowing who the free player is, and so the back understands that. So overall, the group has worked really hard. There's a lot of communication, and we're just trying to string positive plays together and try to eliminate the negative plays and just kind of get plays started. And if we do that, then hopefully we can just move the ball down the field.

[C]

I know you've been asked about the offensive line, about, you know, is there a certain point where you want to find the five, you know, five best guys? All those things. This, this is about as fluid a group as I can remember in terms of how you guys are mixing and matching in training camp to the point where, you know, we joke about how, you know, he's the media. We got to kind of stay buttoned up as to who's on the depth chart and things like that. It's almost impossible to report anything because you guys are doing so much shuffling around. Do you and d' Amico after each practice, is there some element of like, okay, if we had to play a game on Sunday, this would be our fight? I'm not asking you to say who they are, but how does that evaluation evolve over the course of training camp?

[B]

Sure, you talk about it every day. Look at what's going on in practice. Okay, are we getting the players the right reps in the appropriate spots? Or, you know what, maybe we need to see a little bit more of this player in this spot. I mean, I think if we had to play a game today, like, we feel we could play with nine or 10 offensive linemen and be able to go out there and play competitively. So sometimes you don't really notice the difference between the groups. We're shuffling a lot of people in there. So, okay, here's the first group that goes on on the field. Okay. Then here's the next group that comes on the field. Sometimes you don't see a market difference, and sometimes there's plays where maybe the second group looks a little bit better in the first group. So in the end, we're just trying to figure out, all right, who are the five best guys. We're certainly not there yet, but we feel pretty comfortable that there's nine or ten players that we have to put on the field and play a game tomorrow. We feel like we could at least be competitive as an overall group.

[D]

With Marlon Klein, I think, Sean, you're an old man. Tell me if I'm using this term correctly, because I feel like this is what I want to say.

[C]

Yeah, Yeah.

[D]

I feel like with Marlon Klein, there's an element of seeing him on the hoof like that. When you see him in person, it's different than maybe what you saw, is that.

[B]

I don't even know what that means. That's like this vernacular that people use

[D]

where it sounds very sexy, but it doesn't really get on the hook.

[B]

What are we talking about?

[D]

Horses? I looked it up, to be sure.

[C]

Anonymous executive.

[D]

I knew Sean wouldn't know to view something live in person or it's natural, unedited, and living state.

[B]

Are we going to the Kentucky Derby or something?

[D]

Well, you saw him in his natural condition at Michigan. I like when I saw Marlon Klein. You watch film of all these guys that you draft and everything. And then when I saw him in person and watched him move around a little bit, I thought, oh, okay. There's something more to him than necessarily what you might see on film. He's a big. He looks like a retired offensive lineman. Like, he's got a big frame. He's got a catch radius, and he moves. I don't like. I hate to use the term deceptively fast, but I think there's a little bit of that element to it. That he's deceptively fast.

[B]

No, I think you articulated well. Those are some of the things that we felt we saw on his tape. He'd been in Michigan for four years. They've had a lot of good tight ends come through that program. He didn't play as much, but the size component, I mean, six. Six. I don't know what his measurables are. Six, five and a half, six six, 255. I mean he's a big human being. He's got good length, he's got good thickness. A year from now he's probably going to look a little bit different. Hopefully he looks even better. But I think the thing that stands out, at least for the first couple weeks, like his willingness, his toughness on a line of scrimmage, like, like you're going to have to block. I mean we're working against some of the best players, their respective positions in the league and Will Danil and you know, so far he hadn't really backed down, which is what you want to see. So he's going to have some good plays. He's going to have some plays and I'm sure he's going to want back, but hopefully he's learning and can improve. But you know the things that you're seeing, Seth, I mean we felt those are some of the things that we saw in Michigan and hopefully we continue to grow and develop him.

[C]

That's an interesting. That's the room I'm most interested in, Nick, is the tight end room because of the depth that you guys are have created there with drafting Marlin, bringing in Foster Moreau and you've got guys there already with Dalton Schultz and Kate Stover and Brevin Jordan who've done good things for this franchise. So that's a lot of names in that room. When you're, when you're looking, you know you're getting down to a 53 man roster there with that room in particular with a diverse set of skills. How much do other positions maybe factor into who you end up keeping in the tight end room?

[B]

No, I think these are some of the discussions we're probably going to have. There's some positions where numbers wise, maybe it's a little bit more than we've had in years past. So then something else is going to have to give. So we're not there yet, but you kind of have to start to look ahead a little bit and plan. So if you're heavier at one spot, it means you're going to be a little bit lighter. Another spot you might have to carry depth at that position off the roster. So that's part of the puzzle. We're trying to piece the puzzle together here a little bit with the information that we have. To your point, Shawn, that room you have a varied, varied skill sets amongst the different players and various levels of experience. So you know, it's a good group. They got a good attitude. You know they're all available right now, which, that's always the one thing you can never really bank on. But right now, like, it's a good group to have on the field and give yourself hopefully some flexibility offensively.

[D]

I think one thing that d' Amico said the other day that was interesting, he talked about the veteran offensive lineman having to learn different techniques or newer techniques, basically operating the way that Cole Popovich wants him to operate. Is it, is that anything that's drastically different or is it little nuances and learning the scheme and all that.

[B]

It's probably a little bit more nuanced. When a player is further along in his career development 6, 7, 8, 9 years, and if he's been with one particular coach or one particular system, there's going to be some things that carry over. Maybe there's some techniques that are going to be new to that player. But I mean, that's a challenge. So I think each year you're going to of see a little bit of that take place, but it's no different for us than it is for probably for other teams.

[C]

Nick Casario, Texans executive vice president and general manager, joining us here on Payne and Pendergast on Sports Radio 610. Okay, so last time, last time we spoke with you, it was in early June and you were, you were very complimentary of CJ's spring that he was having. You know, we asked generally about the offense and you brought up how CJ was kind of the linchpin of how things were were going offensively a week or so into training camp. What are you seeing from CJ so far?

[B]

Yeah, a lot of the, a lot of the same things. I think the big thing is that position we've talked about on the show. It's just making good, sound decisions with the football and not trying to not make a play up, but try to force a play. Just take what the defense gives you. And I think you've seen multiple examples in practice. Whether we've made an adjustment or we've gone to the first read, you know, it's just, you don't want to be too cute sometimes. I mean, football, it's a simple game, sometimes that we make hard. But he's really done a good job. I think he's embraced the ownership of the offense, the communication, really, the communication, being a quarterback and the offensive line, going back to the earlier discussion, like that's the most critical component of offensive football. So if everybody's on the same page and everybody's kind of seeing things the same way and then to get that information out to the perimeter of the formations that are receivers. You know, we've had some adjustments, we've had some examples where we were hotted and we were able to execute the hot. We've had some other situations where we had a side adjust. Maybe the quarterback did the right thing and then maybe the skill player didn't. So those are things that you kind of work through and then you, hey, what did you see? Here's what I'm thinking on that play. So that kind of two way discourse is important. And I think you've seen that not only on the practice field, but a lot of that takes place inside in the classroom.

[D]

I can't remember if we talked about this with you before or not, but back when Ryan Fitzpatrick was here, he got benched during a portion of the season for Ryan Mallett. Ryan Mallet came in and, you know, Fitzpatrick went to Harvard, 50 on the Wonderlic, all of that. Veteran NFL quarterback Mallett sat on the sideline and watched, or excuse me, Fitzpatrick sat and watched Mallett operate for a couple games. And when Fitzpatrick came back, he said that he learned a lot from watching Ryan Mallet because Mallett had been in New England, he knew what Bill o' Brien wanted and how the system was supposed to operate. And I've always felt that was really interesting because Fitzpatrick was a super smart dude, but there was something about this system and understanding the way it's supposed to look that he just, he quite wasn't quite getting it until he saw Ryan Mallet do it. Is that, is there some of that with CJ where, man, it takes, it takes time in this system to really figure out all of the moving parts and how it's supposed to look and like what kind of urgency you have to have.

[B]

It takes time. I mean, even going back to Brady, I mean, it probably took him like three or four years until he really like had it. And then essentially over the course of the rest of his career, you're kind of making some tweaks and adjustments. So it takes time, but it's nothing that you can't accomplish without, you know, intentional work and just communication. And there has to be a constant dialogue and discourse between offensive coordinator, quarterback, coach, the players because in the end, when you're on the field, you're just, you want to be able to rely on each other to do the right thing. So it takes work and you never. It's not going to get mastered overnight. It's constant evolution. It takes time. And sometimes it takes, I'd say multiple years. So we're in the second year of this offensive system. So there's definitely been growth and development from kind of where we started a year ago to where we are currently.

[C]

It had to be nice winning three Super Bowls while your quarterback's figuring it out.

[D]

Well, yeah, Brady will tell you that, like, that he wasn't well, people, I saw somebody on. Somebody had this. This montage of, like, he said, babe, quarterbacks don't operate young. Quarterbacks don't operate like this anymore. And it was a bunch of clips of Brady from, like, year 10 and beyond. Yeah, that's not a young quarterback. Brady didn't operate that way when he was a young quarterback.

[B]

There was. I mean, he said this, too. There was multiple iterations of his career.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

So kind of that 01 to 04 period. All right. The offense was kind of evolving and taking shape, and he was. Was working on some things as well. But then he got to the point, you know, where, okay, once 04 to call it 05 to really 05 and 06, 07 was like, kind of like, whoa, we just kind of changed some things. But look, this is, I would say, offensive football and quarterback play in general. Every year you have to go back. And even. I don't care how long you've been in the system, you go back to ground zero and you start with the basic foundation play call terminology, mic identification, everything that goes into it, and you got to go out there and practice it, and the defense is going to give you something maybe you haven't seen before. I would say our defense has done a pretty good job of. We've made some tweaks and adjustments to. Relative to what we're seeing. So it forces you go to back. How are we going to handle this? This is a different look. Hey, that's okay. Those are the things that are continually evolving and are always going to take place.

[D]

I think Sean and I, at the end of the season, we're kind of doing, like, okay, how do you. How do you fix some of these issues that they've had on offense or with C.J. and like, how do you make it better for C.J. and what's the. What's the biggest thing that you could do to make the biggest impact? The old 8020 principle. Am I using that right, Sean?

[C]

I think so, yeah.

[D]

He's a business guy.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And it felt. It felt like. It felt like, all right, if we look at the biggest thing that could help out a quarterback that hasn't been there the last couple years, it would be a consistent rushing attack. And it felt like almost every move you guys made this offseason on the offensive side of the ball was through a lens of how do we fix this rushing attack? Is that, is that, is that fair to say that was the theme?

[B]

Well, I mean, look, offensive football, be able to run the ball is always going to be important when you look at, I mean, I think Buffalo had the first or second ranked rushing offense in the league and they also have like an MVP quarterback. Yeah. So like your ability to run the football and control the game and play the game on your terms is always going to be important. So what is that going to look like? All right, who's on your team? What are some things that you can accentuate or maybe this player does well or, you know, the offensive line. Okay. You want to be able to play a certain way. So we try to look at. All right, we're starting looking at the 26 season. We're trying to build the best team possible. So we're always trying to improve in whatever area that we can. Now, we haven't played a game yet, so we're not really sure exactly what it's going to look like. But you're look across the league like even Seattle. I mean, I think Walker, the MVP of the Super Bowl. Yep. I mean, so, I mean, how many times the running back been the MVP of a Super Bowl? So in the end, your ability to run the football is ultimately there's a correlation between winning and losing because in the end you're going to have to get tough yards and when you get into a red area, the space is confined. So how are you going to score? Well, you got to be able to run it in or you got to be able to throw it in from the fringe. So, you know, I'd say this year isn't any different than previous years. So we're trying to build a good team and we're trying to be as balanced in offense as possible. Understanding some games might have to run it more. Some games you might have to throw it more. Who's the opponent? What do they do? Well, I mean, that's all part of the calculus.

[D]

Yeah, that was a part of it was that it's not even just, I don't care where you finish in the rushing rankings at the end of the year, it's that when you get down into the red zone. Exactly what you were talking about. All right, let's take it. Let's look at what the offense is production was last year. And if you Just are a better red zone offense, which has helped out a lot by being able to run the ball, then, man, it's a. It's a much different appearance.

[B]

This game is about points. So where are points? Points are in a red area. So like, how do you get the ball into the end zone? So really our situational execution, third down, a red area. If we can improve those areas as a team, because even defensively, you know, there were times where maybe we didn't play as well as we needed to in a red area and on third down. So if those are a couple areas that we can improve as a team, then maybe that's going to help our performance, you know, on a week to week basis.

[A]

How.

[C]

How much did David Montgomery's proficiency and short yardage factor into him being the right guy for you guys?

[B]

Well, I think it's just part of his profile that wouldn't say, Sean, is anything that one specific quality. But short yardage, I mean, those third and one, third and two, fourth and one, you got to be able to get a tough yard. So some backs may be a little bit better than others. The big thing is you're trying to go forward, you're trying to move the pile. It's going to be condensed space, it's going to be physical. You got to play strong. You're going to have to break tackles. There's going to be a free defender. Kind of what we talked a little bit earlier. But overall, I mean, David's been a pretty versatile player who's been able to get yards and he's been a pretty, I would say probably underrated player in a passing game as well. He's got really good hands.

[D]

They love him in Detroit, the fans, I mean, just like, ever. I've never had so many people show up like from another fan base in my mentions and be so nice. They're like, it's not, they're not. They're not. Usually a guy comes in and a bunch of other fans will say like, ah, he's a bum. Anyway, it's the, like, these Lions fans love David Montgomery, right?

[B]

So, I mean, he's the epitome. He's the ultimate professional. He doesn't really say much. He lets his actions do the talking, works very, very hard. He plays tough, he plays physical. He was a great representation of the Detroit Lions program, what Coach Campbell and Brad Holm have built. I mean, in some respects our two programs are pretty similar. So I think there was an appreciation. I don't want to speak for those fans, but there was an appreciation for what David brought to the table and what he provided and kind of his selflessness and being able to go out there and just play with toughness and physicality on a week to week basis.

[D]

I don't think I've ever heard a guy in his introductory press conference say one of the things that he liked about this team was I saw the way that they practiced when we had the combined practice. Like that's. And especially for an old, like I say air quotes, aging, running back, like that's a, like that was really cool because that's, I mean, that's what d' Amico wants. Obviously, these guys who care about practicing players talk.

[B]

Yeah, they kind of know, all right, what a program. They don't know what a program is about. But you know, when you see some things, you can make an extrapolation about what you think that program is about. So again, we have a tremendous amount of respect for the Lions and the way they run their program. And you know, our practice with them last year were very, very productive. So, you know, the fact the players ultimately, like, they want to go somewhere where that kind of fits their profile of what they're looking for. And, you know, we're fortunate that, you know, going back to earlier players want to be here and be a part of what we're doing. But in the end, you know, we want to play tough, hard, physical football with consistent effort and physicality.

[C]

I want to circle back to, to CJ for a second. Nick, something you said, something CJ said the same day out here at training camp. You talked about productive conversations that have taken place with CJ's camp. CJ himself was asked about it and he was, you know, he was, he seemed upbeat about it as well. I'm not asking for a status on where things are with that. I'm just curious, from a GM's perspective, how important is that communication? How constant is that communication, even when a deal's not getting done, to kind of just keep. I think CJ's handled the whole thing really, really well and very mature. How important is that communication with both sides in kind of keeping, keeping the house in order, if you will?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, look, we have an open door policy around here. D'Amico's that way. It's the way I operate. So you're never going to be closed minded in whichever way is the wind blowing. So I mean, you're going to treat it like professionals treat it like adults. Understand there's a business component of what we do on both sides. So we're certainly sensitive to the players in that respect. And you know, they understand, like, we're trying to do the best we can as a team. We're trying to look, in the end, we're trying to keep as many good players around here for as long as we can, as long as possible. Sometimes it works the way you want it, sometimes maybe it takes a little bit more work or the timetable doesn't necessarily match up the way everybody else wants it to. But again, the most important thing is just be honest, be real, keep the lines of communication open and be respectful to the other party. And if you get a resolution, great. If you don't, it doesn't necessarily mean that it's not going to work itself out. It just means it's going to maybe take place at a later point.

[D]

I don't, I get the feeling like we're probably not going to see C.J. up at the podium at any point this training camp whining about the offers that you've made him. I feel like he's, I think he's handled it really well and keeping it quiet and just, you know, saying, I'm letting my agent handle that stuff. Is that, do you guys ever, is that just something you, do you even have that discussion with players about like, let's keep this quiet, let's keep this in house, or is it just something that's generally, if you've got a good relationship with the agent, it doesn't, doesn't concern you.

[B]

Yeah, that's the most important thing. Look, we understand there's a lot of eyeballs on our sport and there's a lot of contracts that big name, big time players that, I mean, I think again, I mean, I read this morning, like Gibbs, you know, they reached an agreement on his contract. Excuse me, but there's all always eyeballs on, I would say, players and you want to be respectful, but in the end, the more you just keep the communication amongst yourself, like we're respectful of the fans and we're fortunate as there's interest, but in the end, the best way to communicate is directly to one another. And if you have an issue or have a question about something, let's just come and sit and talk like an adult. So I think the more professional everybody handles it, the better off in the end, in the long run, everybody wins as a result.

[C]

You've been, you've been pretty forthcoming both on this show and I think in press conferences about Tank and his saga and where he's been at with that and, and last week when you did your press availability, you talked. You kind of clarified things. Not on the PUP list, but it's so he can do certain things out here, and we're going to see where things are week to week, I guess. So I guess now that we've got you sitting here, where are we at with Tank?

[B]

Right. Yeah, he's getting a little bit closer, making progress. We've done some things, sort of like after practice, after, individually, you know, ramp up wise. At some point, he'll graduate to going into more drills in practice. At some point, whenever that takes place, we're probably going to at least need to see him go out there in a game in some capacity so that the first time he's playing isn't potentially in a regular season game. So we're just trying to be very measured, very smart, and we've talked about this. Each player is kind of their own entry, so we probably. We try to do what we think is best for each individual player. So Tanks work really hard. You know, he's certainly made progress, and I think he's getting a little bit closer to whatever that next step is going to be.

[C]

Do you feel like he's going to play in a preseason game at some point here?

[B]

We'll see. Yeah, it might be more of. So you can go through the mechanics of going back on the field, warming up, getting in the huddle. Not necessarily have to go out there and play 50 plays in. In a game sometimes. And I want to speak for a player, there's just a little bit of maybe a mental block that you want to. Okay. There's an. You're graduating to the next step. So you go from rehab. Okay. Then you get from rehab to practice. Then you go from practice to call it a real game or, you know, a real situation.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So there's steps that players have to go through. And, you know, there's a mental component as well that we're certainly sensitive to. So the physical is the physical, the mental is the mental. We can't extrapolate necessarily what a player, how he's feeling or thinking, you know, but we try to just make sure that we support them and put them in a position where they can go out there and feel comfortable and confident as possible.

[C]

People are anxious, and I know Tank is the most anxious of all to get out there, Nick, but I know you. I don't know if you're out here. He got the stone cold Steve Austin pop the other day when he walked out here. Crowd was cheering loud for Tank Dell.

[B]

Did they break the glass today, they should have.

[C]

That's what we need.

[A]

We need.

[D]

He looked at me like, I know what the hell that means. I know. What's he doing?

[B]

His introduction.

[D]

I've seen a little bit. I do the beer stuff.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He. This. The glass breaks and he walks out and the crowd goes crazy. That's all I would say.

[D]

Glass breaks.

[C]

There's a glass.

[A]

There's.

[C]

They had like at some. At WrestleMania, they like a glass door and it just shatters and he walks out.

[D]

You know, he's got the biggest. The best badass high school intro I've ever seen. Did you ever see Will Anderson's high school? I have not actually introduced or at least in this one game, they've got the. They've got a gigantic. A cage. And the team is in a cage. And then like, they introduce the team and they. Will Anders and everybody bust out of this cage and run out of the

[B]

field and he walks around the building with a scowl sometimes.

[C]

Very scary. Nick Casario joining us here. Texans executive vice president, that is.

[D]

Oh, sorry. No, no, go ahead, finish that. People know he's the general manager. No, is. You're talking about making that like that step by step progression. I'm almost thinking about a tank, like if he was a rookie. Because there's a big jump from the speed and intensity of a preseason game on into the regular season. So, yeah, getting that one step in of, okay, you're out here at practice, but then you go into a one up, one level intensity up into preseason instead of going straight into a regular season.

[B]

And the reality is some players may need that, other players may not. So it's case by case. And just trying to figure out, like, what makes the most sense.

[D]

Sean, let me tell you about the first time I ever dropped into coverage in an NFL game. Like, I don't know what's going on here. However fast they were moving in practice,

[C]

Tracer bolts, your Madness score is 87.

[D]

No, you know what? The biggest bad, the biggest insult. Yeah, I never knew that was good. I didn't know that was good until he told me. No, the funniest thing about the biggest insult when they have you drop back as a nose tackle is that they don't even coach you up on it. They're like, like, listen, yeah, you're genuinely just a mound of flesh out there, okay? I'm like, yeah, but I got to be looking for number three, right? Like, don't bother yourself with the simple arithmetic, idiot. Just get back in there in the. In the. In the hook spot. Yeah.

[C]

Do you have anything to scouting a fort about Seth's backpedal back?

[B]

No, we didn't have that.

[D]

They gave me an 11 on the vertical.

[C]

His hip flex.

[D]

Mad people did an 11 out of

[C]

a hundred out of 100. Then he got 41. The next year they saw his hops.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Do you pay attention any of The Madden score? NFL top 100, anything you knew? 87 was good, though.

[B]

Well, I'm like using off of a academic scale.

[C]

Oh, okay.

[B]

88, 90 plus.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Who was my comp? Your comp was the or the same score?

[C]

The player this year who has the same score you did is Zach Allen.

[D]

Yeah. Races that. Oh, yeah. No, I'm talking about Madden.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Nick Kucerio joining us here. I'm curious this, because I think you guys make a habit of bringing in football junkies. You know, the guys that just love every aspect of football. Who is the biggest and you can name multiple names if you want to. Who's the biggest football junkie on the team?

[B]

On the team.

[C]

On the team.

[B]

Oh, my gosh.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[D]

So like when it comes to like just wanting to know every aspect of

[C]

it, just whatever mixed definition of a

[B]

junkie, I would say petrified. Kamari, Will, Aziz, Henry. I mean those guys are Henry's.

[D]

And Henry's an interesting one because like Henry Toa. Toa is a guy that I think like the worry where he's. Where he is now compared to what I thought he could be as a rookie. You can see that a lot of it has been like, he did transform his body, but then also like a big part of his game has to be just. Just the recognizing routes, taking the right leverage, all of that. And you can tell he's really worked on that.

[B]

He's worked really hard. So this is what, year four for him. So from where he was as a rookie to where he is now, he's made as much progress as anybody. He works really hard, very instinctive. We've challenged him some areas. Hey, here are the things that we want you to improve. And he's responded accordingly. But he just has a certain mindset and demeanor and overall mentality. Again, like going back to kind of your question. Yeah, I mean, we're fortunate. We have a lot of players with that type of mentality and mindset, you know, which is that's what works and that's who d' Ameco is. That's how he was as a player. And you know, that hasn't necessarily changed between how many Years ago. That was to. To where we are now.

[C]

Well, on this defense, too, there's a lot of guys that get a lot of attention on this defense at the All Pro and Pro bowl level, things like that. But just, I mean, Henry's a guy, you know, Reed Blankenship, bringing him in. Tommy Togi is a guy.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Like, Tommy's a good example. I feel like it's. Yeah, you guys have a nice top layer of really elite talent there, but, boy, on this defense, it's that. To me, I guess I think I'm just me saying this subjectively, that next tier of players is like almost the glue that holds the whole thing together.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Well, I mean, you know, not to use this phrase, but the notion of glue guys or. I mean, it's actually. It's pretty good. It's a pretty good podcast actually, as well. I mean, it's Alex Smith, Shane Battier, I mean, it's. But anyways, you need guys who like him just embrace their role. I mean, Tommy, I don't think he said like two words, like, since the offseason started to where he is now. He just lets his performance kind of do the talking for him. So who just embrace their role and who take the coaching and who improved and gotten better. Like, Tommy's another example. Example of a guy brought him in like October of 24. And from where he was to where he was to where he is now, I mean, you've seen. I mean, d' Amico's talked about him. I don't know. I don't know. Almost every day at the podium, but it's almost every day.

[C]

He did this week. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So it's. Yeah. 40 minutes flies by.

[B]

Man, that's already 40 minutes.

[C]

Yeah, we're 40. We got like 30 seconds left. Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Oh.

[D]

Undrafted rookie free agent to adopt last year. Casey Osai and Jackson Woodard. One of those guys is back in the fold this year.

[C]

Oh, side.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

Right now, my leader in the clubhouse is Noah Whittington.

[B]

Yeah, Noah's done a pretty good job. Yeah, Nobody's limited in there. Limited spring, he kind of was coming off a little bit of a toe. We're just trying to get him ready for training camp, but I mean, he's. He's gone out there and, you know, he's done a pretty job. Good toughness, got good straight line speed. Yeah. I mean, we'll see how it goes. Probably going to get a bunch of opportunities here in the preseason to carry the ball.

[C]

No doubt. Texans executive vice president and General Manager, Nick Casario. Nick, we always enjoy it, man.

[B]

Appreciate it. Always good to visit with you guys.

[C]

Yeah, you too. You too. Appreciate the time. Nick Kasario joined Understanding power requires more than headlines.

[D]

I'm Peter Hamby, host of the Powers

[C]

that Be, a podcast from Puck examining politics, economics and media to provide context, analysis and clarity without sensationalism. We ask how power operates, who benefits, and what's at stake. If you want to move beyond breaking

[D]

news to deeper understanding, join us on the Powers that Be. New episodes every weekday. Follow the Powers that Be wherever you get your podcasts.

[A]

Blowing ad budget on metrics that look great til the CFO sees them. That's bullspend and marketers are calling it out in dashboard confessions.

[C]

I remember telling my boss it'll be good for the brand when leads were slow.

[D]

Yeah, it wasn't.

[A]

Cut the bull. Spend LinkedIn lets you target by company, job title and More. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com campaign terms and conditions apply.

[D]

Hear that? That's now crispy and McCrispy strips meeting creamy Caesar sauce Sounds extra crispy. Caesar sauce at McDonald's for a limited time. Ba da ba ba ba.

[B]

Gone south has been a podcast about crime in the American South.

[D]

But for our new season, we're widening the lens.

[B]

Follow and listen to gone South Season

[D]

5, wherever you get your shows.