“Epstein’s Black Book Is REAL” - Epstein’s DARK Ties To Billionaires, Elites & Intel - Nick Bryant | PBD Podcast | Ep. 638

Summary

PBD Podcast – Episode 638 “Epstein’s Black Book Is REAL” - Epstein’s DARK Ties to Billionaires, Elites & Intel - Nick Bryant | August 28, 2025

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EPISODE OVERVIEW

Main Theme:
In this episode, Patrick Bet-David (“PBD”) hosts investigative journalist and author Nick Bryant, known for his deep research into child trafficking networks and the Franklin and Epstein scandals. The discussion centers on the reality and impact of Jeffrey Epstein’s Black Book, the web of elite connections it reveals, systemic cover-ups of child sex trafficking, intelligence agency involvement, and the ongoing fight for justice and transparency. Bryant details his work exposing these networks, the obstacles he faced, how the Black Book emerged, and concrete legislative and grassroots steps for accountability.

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GUEST INTRODUCTION & BACKGROUND
[03:12–04:54]

• Nick Bryant: Author of “The Franklin Scandal” (2009/2010) and “Confessions of a DC Madam”, both investigating elite pedophile networks and government cover-ups.
• Began with Omaha’s Franklin Credit Union in the 1980s—found links between political elites, CIA assets, and child trafficking for blackmail.
• Quote: “Epstein in many ways is a carbon copy of the Franklin scandal.” — Nick Bryant [03:12]
• Bryant’s career: Spent years interviewing victims, blackmail photographers, and combing through official records; faced intense resistance from mainstream media.

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KEY DISCUSSION POINTS & INSIGHTS

1. The Franklin Scandal: The Template for Epstein’s Network

[05:08–14:39]

• Lawrence King (Omaha) + Craig Spence (DC): Ran a trafficking and blackmail operation, recruiting vulnerable youth (often from Boys Town orphanage), flying them to DC, and filming politicians for blackmail at Spence’s "party house."
• Federal and local grand juries: Used to bury allegations—victims who refused to recant were prosecuted (e.g., Alicia Owen, Paul Bonacci).
• FBI involvement: Pressured children to recant; those who did not faced extreme sentences (Alicia Owen received 9–15 years for perjury by age 20).
• Blackmail as a systemic tool: “...the special prosecutor has so much sway... there’s a famous quip that special prosecutors could get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich. And that’s what happened.” — Nick Bryant [06:11]
• CIA Ties: "Spence was a CIA asset his entire life." — Nick Bryant [05:37]
• Origins of King/Spence: Low socio-economic backgrounds with abrupt career rises after time in Southeast Asia, leading Bryant to hypothesize they were turned into assets after being caught abusing minors abroad.

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2. The Cover-up Playbook

[12:33–17:47]

• Bryant saw intense denial and cognitive dissonance in media and publishing regarding elite child trafficking/blackmail operations.
• Enormous federal firepower was deployed to quash state/city investigations — echoed in the pattern seen with Epstein.

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3. Introduction of Epstein’s Black Book

[23:00–29:59]

• Discovery: Bryant obtained the Black Book through a victim’s attorney; originally stolen by Epstein’s house manager Alfredo Rodriguez, who was imprisoned after trying to sell it as the “holy grail.”
• Black Book details: Hundreds of Epstein’s contacts (not all crimes but many implicated); under “massage” section, ~175 names, many later identified as victims.
• Notable circles: Rodriguez circled names he claimed were “in cahoots” with Epstein for trafficking, including:
  • Glenn Dubin (billionaire)
  • Alan Dershowitz
  • Leslie Wexner
  • Ghislaine Maxwell
  • Jean-Luc Brunel
  • Donald Trump
  • Ehud Barak
• Double Corroboration: Some circled names also named by survivor Virginia Giuffre in depositions.
• Quote: “Alfredo Rodriguez called it the Holy Grail, and it is... it does show all the people Epstein dealt with. ...If there’s a lot of numbers, it means Epstein dealt with them frequently.” — Nick Bryant [28:27]

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4. The Justice System’s Failure & Media Complicity

[30:18–51:32]

• Government role: DOJ and FBI impounded massive troves of Epstein evidence (hundreds/thousands of hard drives, underage material), but public release & prosecutions have been scant.
• Political blackmail: “Once you’re compromised, it’s like you’re on a big, beautiful yacht... but if you decide to get off, the people on the yacht will make sure you drown.” — Blackmail photographer, via Bryant [39:46]
• Congressional cover: 2007’s non-prosecution agreement gave Epstein and named co-conspirators (including current public figures) blanket immunity.
• Barriers to justice: Bryant urges for an independent Congressional commission—instead of "the government investigating itself”.
• Media generally covers salacious details but not substantive justice questions or exposes the scale and mechanics of cover-up.

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5. Intelligence Agencies and Blackmail Operations

[41:30–45:31]

• Epstein: CIA? Mossad? Or Both? Bryant sees most plausible that the “dark side” of CIA and Mossad co-ran operations: “I don’t see the CIA letting the Mossad compromise American politicians on American soil without getting a cut of that intelligence.”
• Acosta’s statement: “I was told Epstein was intelligence and that I had to back off.” Only Attorney General or President could give that order at Epstein’s plea-bargain time (Bush administration).
• All Epstein’s homes wired for audio-visual blackmail, as with Franklin/Spence networks.

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6. Current Legislative and Grassroots Efforts

[57:54–63:34]

• Epstein Justice: Bryant’s 501c3, focused on two goals:
  1. Demanding to know why the US government covers up child trafficking (to stop abetting crime);
  2. Prosecution of the perpetrators.
• Congressional movement: Bipartisan support for HR 581, up to 44 cosponsors (Dems and Republicans)—e.g., Thomas Massie, AOC, Tim Burchett, Nancy Pelosi, Marjorie Taylor Green.
• Bryant: “If we allow the DOJ to cover up a proven trafficking network like Epstein, that sends a message to millions... that you have no voice and no hope for justice.” [82:08]

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7. International & Historical Context

[69:51–75:39]

• Past major child trafficking/abuse cover-ups:
  • Marc Dutroux (Belgium): Life in prison, massive protests by 200,000+; Belgian officials admitted cover-up.
  • Richard Huckle (UK): Life in prison, murdered there.
  • Jimmy Savile (UK): Tied to UK intelligence; crimes only exposed after death.
• The US almost never prosecutes powerful perpetrators for sex trafficking (King, Spence, Ghislaine Maxwell sentenced, but “cushy” treatment).

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8. Systemic Impunity and the Need for Outrage

[81:23–90:32]

• The CDC estimates 25% of US girls and 5–16% of boys are molested as children—Bryant: 50 million+ victims in America.
• “If our government isn’t going to do it, then it’s up to us as Americans.” — Nick Bryant [81:23]
• Bryant calls for public protest and a US movement akin to Belgium’s “White March.”
• Multiple media downplay the scale of Epstein’s crimes and the ages of victims; youngest is often cited as 14, but compelling evidence exists for abuse of children as young as ten and flown-in 12-year-old triplets.
• “The media has sanitized Epstein...they dig up dirt but never say, ‘we need justice here.’” — Nick Bryant [66:38]

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9. Noteworthy Moments & Quotes

• On DOJ’s Stance: “[They] released...over 300 gigabytes of information...over a thousand victims...but said Epstein had no co-conspirators. That’s absolute bunk.” — Nick Bryant [53:25]
• On preventative reforms: “We need to start indicting the co-conspirators, the procurers...start with Kellen, Groff, Marcinkova, Ross...indict them, they’ll roll on the perps in a heartbeat.” [56:53]
• On Ghislaine Maxwell: “She led a lot of lambs to the slaughter and she’s a vile, evil woman. I really hope she doesn’t get a pardon.” — Nick Bryant [20:19]
• On Congressional Needs: “We need an independent congressional commission...if it’s just the government looking at itself, we’ll be subjected to the same perfidiousness.” [49:37]
• On Accountability: “If we don’t stop this now...the government is going to...allow the government to abet child trafficking. We cannot let that happen.” — Nick Bryant [62:20]

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10. Calls to Action, Resources & What’s Next

[87:18–90:32]

• Bryant: Only real solution is public outrage, direct pressure, and mass movement—this is “the best opportunity of our lifetimes” for real change.
• Visit epsteinjustice.com to join webinars, donate, sign the petition, get legislative info.
• [Press conference September 3rd, 2025: Bryant hopes for broader legislative support.]
• Final words: “We’re growing...if we don’t stop it now, we’re not going to be able to stop it, and millions more will be harmed.” — Nick Bryant [89:51]

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For Further Exploration:

• Nick Bryant’s books: The Franklin Scandal, Confessions of a DC Madam
• Gawker’s full publication of Epstein’s Black Book (archived)
• Documentary: Filthy Rich (Netflix) features Michael Ryder
• Congressional bill HR 581 (current cosponsors, status)

Memorable Closing:

• “Don’t you think that...if our government’s not going to do it, then us as Americans, we have to create a movement?... We have to come together and make sure that the children have a right not to be molested.” — Nick Bryant [81:23]
• “This is a line in the sand that should not be crossed.” — Nick Bryant [87:18]

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TIMESTAMPED HIGHLIGHTS:

• [03:12] – Nick Bryant’s background / Franklin Scandal
• [05:08] – Franklin network mechanics & cover-up
• [13:15] – King/Spence origins & CIA speculation
• [23:00] – Epstein Black Book: acquisition and contents
• [29:18] – Names circled, high-profile tie-ins
• [41:30] – Mossad/CIA blackmail structures
• [53:25] – DOJ files; systemic impunity
• [57:54] – Congressional bill, movement, and call to action
• [69:51] – International case studies (Dutroux, Huckle, Savile)
• [81:23] – US abuse stats, moral call
• [87:18] – Final movement call and resource links

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Tone:
Frank, unvarnished, combative with authorities, relentlessly focused on justice and transparency, Bryant is detailed and persistent in exposing overlooked connections and demanding action; PBD steers with both skepticism and determined curiosity, challenging logical leaps and circling back to evidence.

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For listeners new to the topic:
This episode is a deep-dive into systemic elite child trafficking cover-ups, drawing direct historical lines between past scandals and Epstein, mapping legal/prosecutorial failures, revealing how blackmail sustains corruption at the highest levels, and outlining what must be done to break the cycle—including direct grassroots action.

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Action Link: epsteinjustice.com – Join the movement, sign the petition, learn how to contact legislators.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

You're about to make a trade. Which u do you listen to? Is it get optioning those options.

[C]

Or.

[B]

Let'S do a little research. Learn [e-mail] TradeSmart I wrote a book.

[D]

Called the Franklin Scandal, a story of power brokers, child abuse and betrayal. And Epstein, in many ways is a carbon copy of the Franklin Scandal.

[C]

But for whatever reason, this topic makes people on both sides very uncomfortable.

[D]

In the 1980s, Lawrence King of Omaha ran a child trafficking network with Craig Spence in Washington, dc. They would get a lot of kids from the orphanage Boys Town, and then they'd fly them to D.C. and at D.C. there was Craig Spence's party house that was hired for audiovisual blind.

[C]

You're saying there was ties with the CIA to the Franklin scandal? I've heard you talk about Bush. I've heard you talk about Warren Buffett's wife. Who were some of those names he circled?

[D]

Billionaire Glenn Dubin, Alan Dershowitz, Leslie Wetzel, Wexler, Elaine Maxwell, Jean Luc Brunel. For me, Adam, what's your point?

[C]

The future looks bright.

[D]

My handshake is better than anything I ever signed.

[C]

Right, Nick. Bryan, great to have you on.

[D]

Great to be with you.

[C]

Yes. I was telling you earlier it's not as if the Epstein topic is going, you know, trending right now, as if people are interested in what's going on there. The press conference on the third you were telling me about that's coming up. But for some of the people, when you talk about Epstein, the guys that, they're the guys that follow the stories where they maybe watch a couple documentaries, they watch a couple YouTube videos, then there's those guys that know the names of, you know, Whitney Webb and all the. And then there's the guys that know who the OG is that started all of this. You kind of start a lot of this stuff. So if you don't mind taking a minute, share your background with the audience so they know who you are and what you've done.

[D]

I got a roll in. I wrote a book called the Franklin Scandal, A story of power brokers, child abuse and betrayal, and Epstein. It's about a child trafficking network. And Epstein in many ways is a carbon copy of the Franklin scandal. And I started doing research on the Franklin scandal in 2002. And then the book, I spent seven years on it. It was published 2009, 2010. And at that point I was pretty exhausted. When you go as deep into a child trafficking network as I went, I mean, I interviewed like a black male photographer and a lot of other, and, and found lots of victims and interviewed them and it was.

[C]

This is the story of Lawrence King, right? Yes, Lawrence King, which is a horrible, horrible story.

[D]

Yes. And so I spent seven years on that. And then the book came out and no one wanted to touch it. I mean, I, and I live in New York City. I live in the epicenter, the mecca of media. And I have had a lot of friends in the media and I thought, well, you know, I know so many people in the media that certainly they're going to help me. And I was only helped by one person. And which, which kind of surprised me. Malachi McCourt, he's a fairly famous author and, and Maliki and I were pretty good buddies and he was the only one that really tried to help me. And, and then it, and then it just kind of withered. And I mean, I was on some podcasts with crazy people talking about the Illuminati and shape shifting Reptilians and things like that, it was very demoralizing at that point to spend that much time.

[C]

Why do you think they didn't have interest? And by the way, for maybe the average person that doesn't know about the Franklin cover up, the Community Federal Credit Union and Lawrence King maybe share that story a little bit because it is a very controversial story.

[D]

Well, in the 1980s, Lawrence King of Omaha ran a child trafficking network with Craig spence of Washington D.C. and they would fly kids mostly from Omaha. They would get a lot of kids from the orphanage, Boys Town, and then they'd fly them to D.C. and at D.C. there was Craig Spence's party house that was hired for audiovisual blackmail. And if someone decided to partake of any illicit goods at Spence's home, they would be blackmailed. And Spence was a CIA asset all his. I wrote a second book called Confessions of a DC The Politics of Sex, Lies, and Blackmail, about a guy who ran a gay escort service, and he let. And Spence used his escorts to compromise closet politicians. So I've written two books that pertain to Craig Spence. And there was a Nebraska Senate subcommittee that tried to get to the bottom of what was happening, but they were rolled over by federal firepower, much like what we've seen with Epstein, with corrupt grand juries and the Department of Justice being corrupt. So ultimately, what happened there was these grand juries. There were two grand juries. And I don't know if your audience is familiar with how grand juries work, because this will also come up with Epstein. A special prosecutor is chosen to oversee a grand jury, and he or she presents evidence to the grand jurors that he or she deems important and also calls the witnesses. So whatever. Special and grand jurors are just citizens that have shown up for jury duty, and they've been phoned to a grand jury. When we hear the term grand jury, we think like the gods of jurisprudence have spoken for Mount Olympus. But actually, grand jurors are just citizens that have been funneled to a grand jury. And the special prosecutor has so much sway over the grand jurors that there's a famous quip from a New York Supreme Court judge that says special prosecutors could get grand jurors to indict a ham sandwich. And that's what happened with the Franklin. That's what happened with the Franklin grand juries, and that's also what happened with the Epstein grand jury, except with the Franklin grand juries. The kids that wouldn't recant. The FBI came in and got most of the kids to recant. The kids that wouldn't recant. There were two of them were indicted for perjury. Paul Benassi was indicted on three counts of perjury. He was looking at 60 years. Alicia Owen was indicted on eight counts of perjury from a state grand jury and eight counts of perjury from a federal grand jury. And she was looking at 200 years, and she still refused to recant. Actually, both of them refused to recant. And Alicia was fed to A kangaroo court. And now here's the kid that came forward. When she's 20 years old, they gave her nine to 15 years in prison for perjury. And then the authorities really tried to destroy her. They put her in solitary confinement for two years, nearly two years, to be punitive. And actually, what's amazing is Alicia is somehow survived and is flourishing in life.

[C]

Which is she's still openly talking about it or just kind of moved on and doesn't want to talk about it.

[D]

Well, actually, I started a nonprofit, 501C3, called Epstein Justice. And we're seeking. We want two simple things. We want to know why the government is covering up child abuse. If you cover up a crime, you're aiding abetting that crime. So we want to know why the government is aiding betting child abuse. And we.

[C]

She's the one right there, Alicia Owen.

[D]

That is Alicia. And we want the perpetrators to be prosecuted. And Alicia is an associate director of Epstein Justice.

[C]

So now to give a little bit of context on the Franklin cover up. So Lawrence King is coming up in a Republican party. He's a superstar. He sang at the 1984 and 88 RNC. 1984, 1984. Yeah. He's saying. So, you know, people are looking at this guy as a superstar, you know, potentially. Who knows what's going to happen with them? And then there's the. The 30, $40 million scam, which he goes away for the money, but nothing related to the events that were taking place with underage kids and, you know, the sex and all the stuff. That's that. That's the scandal that was happening with this. Right. Could you give a little bit more context about the story of Franklin coverup?

[D]

Well, Lawrence King ran the Franklin Credit Union in Omaha, Nebraska, and he used that as a front for his child trafficking network. And what happened was he was able to stave off federal audits for a number of years, I think four. And then he was audited, and he came up $40 million short. So a Nebraska subcommittee formed to look at his looting of the Franklin Credit Union because he hadn't been audited in a while. But then when they started to form, people in social services came to them and they said, King is running a nationwide pedophile network. And they'd had various reports about King running a nationwide pedophile network. So then the subcommittee started to look at those allegations too, and they had an amazing investigator. His name was Gary Caradori, and he found a number of victims. Actually, I had his records, and he had a list of 60 victims. And that was my job, was to find these victims and get them to talk when I wrote the Franklin scale. And a lot of the victims don't really use Social Security numbers. They're marginalized. They've come from lower socioeconomic dysfunctional backgrounds. They've been molested repeatedly. And drugs was always the carrot for most of them. So they were given drugs, and at a certain point, they had lost their youthful marketability. And then they were just expunged by the network. And so ultimately, what you have there is a very dysfunctional individual that's going to go on to commit crimes and thereby compromise their own credibility. And we saw a lot of that. And I was able to find a number of victims and get them to talk to me. And that was tough because some of them didn't want to talk, and some of them. It took me a while to get them to talk, and then some of them really wanted to talk. But I went deep, deep, deep into this network. Like I said, I even got to it like a blackmail photographer. And I was very, very disillusioned by what happened when the Franklin, ironically, the Franklin scale selling really well today, but it was not selling at all when it was published. And. And people thought when I would tell them there's this nationwide pedophile network that is for very powerful people, that's connected to the CIA, people just didn't want to hear that at that point. And I would be pitching editors and publishers, and I'd be looking straight at them, and then I would tell them about this story. And I could see the cognitive dissonance occur before my very eyes. They would think to themselves, this is really a horrible story.

[C]

You're saying there was ties with the CIA to the Franklin scandal. I've heard you talk about Bush. I've heard you talk about Warren. Buffett's wife was working at the credit union.

[D]

No, no. She provided money.

[C]

She provided money.

[D]

Credit union.

[C]

So what. What is the ties to CIA and. And Buffett?

[D]

I. I didn't find any ties to CIA and Buffett, but there's definitely CIAs to Craig Spence, and he was definitely a CIA asset, and he was the. The second pimp who was in Washington, D.C. and I managed to acquire like 200 flight logs, like with Epstein, with. With the Franklin scout. And most of them went to Washington, D.C. and that's where the party house was.

[C]

And Craig Spence was a powerhouse lobbyist, D.C. somebody that a lot of the folks in D.C. respected. So it wasn't like he was a lightweight guy. Yeah, right there. Spence registered with a US State Department as a foreign agent for Japan and began lobbying for Japanese interests. So he's got a very interesting background.

[D]

With both King and Spence. Now this is my surmise, both King and Spence came from relatively lower socioeconomic backgrounds. And King was sent to Thailand during the Vietnam War and given top security clearances. And Spence was also in Southeast Asia reporting as an ABC reporter. And now they both had kind of mediocre careers prior to Southeast Asia, but after Southeast Asia, it's like they come back to the US and like they're their careers just racket. And my surmise on this is that King and Spence were. I mean, they're inveterate pedophiles. That King and Spence were probably busted molesting kids in Southeast Asia. And then at that point they were turned by some dark, malignant corner of our government that deployed perpetrates things like Franklin also perpetrates things like Epstein. Yeah.

[C]

And he was apparently giving late night White House tours to boys and taking him in there and some very dark stuff. And I think this guy ended up dying from suicide of the. I don't know whether it was alcohol or drug. He committed suicide in the wake of Washington Times expose on his involvement with a prostitution ring and blackmail. Yeah. So dark guy on what he ended up doing.

[D]

Well, his suicide was kind of interesting. He was at the Ritz Carlton dressed up in a tuxedo and he took an overdose, I believe of nortripoline, the antidepressant. But he had a number of notes that were scrawled out. And then he had a newspaper article that was found right next to him. It was about CIA assets or agents that were forced to testify. And because there was a grand jury that was gunning for him at that point. I don't know. That grand jury is very corrupt. I don't know. But I think that we. With Craig Spence. Craig Spence was a lot like Jeffrey Epstein.

[C]

Was Craig Spence more like Jeffrey Epstein or Lawrence King?

[D]

I would say that Craig Spence was.

[C]

In what ways?

[D]

He had the connections, he had the power. I would say that King was. Or Ghislaine Maxwell was analogous to Larry King as far as Ghislaine Maxwell built the machine that enabled Jeffrey Epstein to get kids and Lawrence King built the machine that enabled Craig Spence to get kids.

[C]

Is there a link between Craig Spence and Epstein? Did they ever meet each other or no?

[D]

No. What's interesting about. There's one link that I know of. William Barr was the Attorney General under Bush, one that covered up Franklin. And then he was also the Attorney General under Trump first administration and he covered up Epstein. So William Barr is a cover up guy and he's been with the CIA forever. And it's even on his Wikipedia page that he was in the CIA at a very young age.

[C]

No, I mean, you see, didn't he and Epstein actually go to school together or they were at a summer camp together. There was some kind of a picture from them when they were kids.

[D]

Okay. So I was given a picture of Jeffrey Epstein at Interlaken Summer camp.

[C]

Right.

[D]

And I was given a picture of someone that looked exactly like Donald Barr, who was also attending Interlochen summer camp.

[C]

Did it end up being him or.

[D]

No, my source said it was, but then Interlockin said it wasn't.

[C]

This picture right here.

[D]

Yes, that's the picture now that looks a lot like William Barr. But my source says it was and Interlockin says it wasn't, so that's a wash.

[C]

Okay, so outside of the fact that the COVID up is tied to one name, which is Barr, that kind of worked on both cases together, there is no other direct affiliation or connection with. Not even Ghislaine to her father, Robert Maxwell that's tied to Craig Spence? There's no ties.

[D]

I haven't found any now.

[C]

Okay. All right, so let's bring it up to today with Epstein. You know, these stories have become more and more. You have the Diddy scandal that just got finalized. You got the Epstein one that's going up, that they have a press conference on September 3rd. You have the recording that was dropped, the six hours of recording that was dropped, the interview that they did with as a Todd Blanche, I'm going to say his name correctly, Todd Blanche spent six hours with Ghislaine Maxwell. And this is July 24th or 25th. That was just dropped a few days ago. Have you had a chance to listen to the recording and see what was said? Was there any new things you heard in there that you hadn't known before?

[D]

Well, this is kind of interesting because someone called me before it came out and said, we're gonna get it and we want you to read it. But the Department of Justice reneged. And so I had to read it when it came out with that.

[C]

The person that called you, I don't need names, but the person that called you, are they in right now? Are they working for the government right now? Are they an outsider?

[D]

They're an outsider with a lot of Jews.

[C]

Somebody we would know or not somebody. Yes, we would know this person yeah, you would know. Okay, so this person has a connection with the insider that they wanted to give that to you, but they didn't.

[D]

Well, they, the transcripts were going to be given to him and he wanted me to read it to see because he knows about my expertise in this area, so. But they reneged. The Department of Justice. It's like with everything the Department of Justice does, what Jeffrey Epstein, it reneges on this.

[C]

Why do you think they did that? What's your speculation?

[D]

I have no idea. I have no idea why they reneged in this particular instance. I don't know.

[C]

Did you have a chance to go through it and hear what things she had to say?

[D]

Well, I did. I mean, there wasn't really a lot.

[C]

Yeah, I don't hear anything.

[D]

I mean, she exonerated Donald Trump and actually she had told a former CBS 60 Minutes producer that Epstein had blackmail material on both Clinton and Trump. But in this, I mean, it wouldn't be difficult. There would be a lot of. It would be very advantageous for her. Now, I'm not saying Donald Trump is. I'm not saying he isn't, but it would be very advantageous for her to exonerate Donald Trump because she gets moved to a Kush prison and hopefully she doesn't get a pardon. I mean, I'm really hoping that she does not get a pardon.

[C]

You think she will?

[D]

I hope not. She led a lot of lambs to the slaughter and she's a vile, evil woman. So I really hope she doesn't get a pardon.

[C]

Got it. Okay. So how did you start, even from the beginning with Epstein? I got the Franklin cover up story. So now you're seven years there. They don't want to do anything with your book. You meet this fellow who is the only one you said, what's his name? Malachi McCork.

[D]

Maliki McCork.

[C]

Maliki McCork. Who's the one that's willing to entertain it? And then later on, you know, you, your interest into Epstein, how did that Epstein story fall on your lap?

[D]

Well, with the Franklin scandal, when I was meeting with editors and publishers trying to get something done, I'd had. I was represented by a fairly big agency. And then I gave them the Franklin book proposal and they dropped me. And then I had another very good agent, James Fitzgerald, try to sell the book and he couldn't. But I would be meeting with editors and publishers and I would tell them about the Franklin scandal. And I could see, as I said earlier, the cognitive dissonance in their eyes. They would say to themselves, this is a horrible story. I need to help Nick Bryant. Or I can just write Nick Bryan off as crazy right now and have a nice meal with my family tonight. So they all went that way. And I was surprised because I had some, as I said earlier, some really good friends in the media. So when this book came out and we could get no traction, I was talking to crazy people on podcasts. I went through a deep period of despondency. And then these reports about Epstein started coming up. And this is like 2012. And I saw that a grand jury, I mean, it was very obvious that he'd been molesting underage girls. But then I saw that a grand jury had exonerated him of molesting underage girls. And that's exactly what happened with the Franklin scandal. So I just felt, you know, I know a lot about this and, and I've. I've kind of thrown myself into this area. I've spoken at a lot of big anti child trafficking conferences or anti trafficking conferences, and, and actually I contributed a peer reviewed chapter about trafficking with a number of people that work with trafficking victims that are psychiatrists and psychologists. So I'm, I've been received in that world pretty well. But I felt like I should, I should go check this out, see what, you know, what's going on.

[C]

What did you learn?

[D]

Well, I went to Fort Lauderdale, Florida. Beautiful Fort Lauderdale, Florida. It was my first time in beautiful Fort Lauderdale, Florida. And then I just started knocking on doors, the thing that I do. And, and I ultimately got the Black.

[C]

Book, Epstein's black book, which Ghislaine says does not exist.

[D]

Well, I've got it and it's on the Internet. So, you know, I mean, the Black Book has all of Epstein's contacts. I mean, a lot of them are pedophiles and a lot of them aren't. But I got the Black Book.

[C]

I don't know if you've ever revealed how you got the Black Book.

[D]

I got it from an attorney who was representing some of the victims. It's kind of interesting how the Black book came into my possession. Alfredo Rodriguez was the house manager of Jeffrey Epstein, and he ripped it off. And his grand plan was to sell it to attorneys that were launching civil suits at Jeffrey Epstein. And he contacted an attorney and said he had the holy grail to Epstein and that he would. All he wanted was $50,000. So the attorney called the FBI, the FBI did a sting, and then ultimately they impounded the Black Book and Alfredo Rodriguez, who was given 18 months for that. And so I ended up getting the Black book. And in the Black Book, under massage, there's a number of names. There's like 175 names. And I started calling those girls. Most of them are girls, and a lot of them were the victims. And they told me about being flown around to different places, and they also told me about being flown around to an island. And at that point, I realized I'm dealing with a network that's very much like Franklin, that it was covered up, and also it's flying underage kids around. And I just. I went back to New York with the black book. And now the pool of editors and publishers that I could pitch it to was significantly reduced at this point because of pitching the Franklin scandal. But I pitched it, and nobody would touch it. Nobody would touch it. And I sat on it for three years. And then finally, Gawker, I met John Cook, who is the editor in chief of Gawker, and they published it. And then at that point, I had flight logs, too. So we published the flight logs, and we published the Black book. And it's kind of funny. We redacted the names of the adult or the numbers of the adults, and then we redacted the names of the last names of the victims, and then also their phone numbers. There it is.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

So with the black book, we published it, and then the floodgates opened on the black book. I mean, it was kind of funny. Someone was waiting for someone to take the chance with the black book. And then at that point, the floodgates just opened. I mean, tons of ink have been dumped on articles about the black book since I published the black book.

[C]

So no one's interested? No one's calling you? Has anybody done a. Have you gone to one of these JSA or Heritage auctions to find out, to authenticate that this is the actual black book? Has anybody authenticated it?

[D]

Well, I authenticated. The provenance is through the FBI. The FBI got it from Alfredo Rodriguez.

[C]

And then you got it from the FBI?

[D]

No, and then the FBI gave it to an attorney who I got it from.

[C]

So. So the Alfredo gave it to the FBI? No.

[D]

No, the FBI impounded it. He did not give it to them.

[C]

So. So FBI impounded it. FBI then gave it to the attorney, and then you got it from the attorney, and it's the same exact one.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

So why would the FBI give it to that attorney in the first place?

[D]

What's interesting, I found. I don't know the exact mechanisms involved in that, but the Department of Justice was really gung ho on covering up Epstein at all. And I think that there were some people in the FBI that had some very strong misgivings about it. I don't know exactly why the FBI gave it to the attorney, but that's my surmise on that.

[C]

Got it. Okay, so. So has any unique person. I talked to Michael Wolf the other day. He's got 100 hours of conversations with Epstein at his place at his private residence in New York. Steve Bannon has about 15, 16 hours when he was prepping him for how to recreate his brand in a media limelight. And, you know, originally I thought it was Bannon's, but apparently Epstein's estate owns that recording, so Bannon does not. Based on what Michael Wolff told me when I had him on. Has anybody knocked on your door? Anybody interesting knocked on your door to actually see the black book that you have?

[D]

I mean, we put it up on the Internet, and it's.

[C]

No. To actually physically see it?

[D]

No.

[C]

Would you sell the black book?

[D]

I mean, the thing about the black book is it's all over the Internet at this point, and there's an unredacted. There are multiple unredacted versions of it. So it's all over the Internet. And when I say black book, I'm not saying the people that are in there are exclusively perps, of course, but. But a lot of them are. A lot of them aren't. It is. Alfredo Rodriguez called it the Holy Grail, and it is the Holy Grail to a certain degree, because it does show all the people that Epstein dealt with. And a telltale. I want to say this categorically, but a telltale sign is if there's a lot of numbers, it means that Epstein dealt with him quite frequently. And Alfredo Rodriguez circled people that he said were in cahoots with Epstein. As far as the child trap.

[C]

And who were some of those names?

[D]

He circled their billionaire Glenn Dubin, Alan Dershowitz, Leslie Wexler, Ghislaine Maxwell, Jean Luc Vernell. Actually, Donald Trump's name is circled, too. And Ahud. Barack, the former Prime Minister of Israel. So there's a lot of powerful people.

[C]

And these are friends of his. Is Alfredo saying these are friends of his?

[D]

They're saying. What he's saying when they're circled is that Epstein was in cahoots with them. As far as child pandering.

[C]

Got it. Okay. Ehud Barak, which I asked Michael Wolf, you know, he's estimated 36 times he visited Epstein's private residence in New York. What else did you learn about him and some of the others as you're investigating this a little bit deeper?

[D]

Well, you can get double corroboration in the respect that the ones that are circled. And then Virginia Giuffre litigated with Ghislaine Maxwell, and during those depositions, she named a number of her perpetrators. And Ahud Barak's name is circled by Alfredo Rodriguez. And Virginia Giuffri named Ahud Barak as a perpetrator. Actually, a very nasty individual. Ghislaine Maxwell's name is circled, and Virginia named her as a perpetrator. Leslie Wexler's name is circled in. Virginia named him as a perpetrator. John Luke Brunel's name is circled, and Virginia named him as a perpetrator. Alan Dershowitz name is circled, and Virginia named him as a perpetrator. And William Bill Richardson, he was the former governor of Mexico or New Mexico, and also Clinton's energy czar, and his name is circled, and Virginia named him as a perpetrator. So you can get double corroboration between Rodriguez and Virginia. Goofy. I mean, it's not airtight and solid, but it's double corroboration.

[C]

Yeah. And he passed away in 2014. 2015. Alfredo Rodriguez.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

Did you ever have a conversation with him?

[D]

I did not, no.

[C]

Okay. And. And who did he tell that the ones that were circled were corroborated?

[D]

He said that the ones that were circled. He told that the FBI that the ones that were circled were people that he felt were in cahoots.

[C]

And who from FBI told you that Alfredo said that?

[D]

The attorney.

[C]

And is that documented or is it just you're speculating that the attorney told you that?

[D]

I would say it's the same provenance, but I wouldn't go 100% on it. No.

[C]

Okay, so we're assuming that this is fourth person. Alfredo told the FBI. FBI told the lawyer. The lawyer is telling you. So we have to believe what the FBI is saying, that what the. What the lawyer is saying is true.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

Okay. So the credibility there is not really that high for me, because that goes three tiers.

[D]

I understand that. I mean, I think the credibility. The provenance on the Black Book, I think, is 100%, because it's been released since I released it.

[C]

Of the book. Of the book being real.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Okay. Have you showed it to anybody? Have you. Do you. Did you bring it with you today or. No?

[D]

No. I mean, Gawker published it in its entirety.

[C]

Who owns the Black Book today?

[D]

It's. It's out there. Anybody can own it. I mean, it's been downloaded.

[C]

No, I get that. The actual physical, real black.

[D]

I. Okay, so what I got was copies of the black book.

[C]

Got it. So you don't have the original.

[D]

No, I do not have the original black book.

[C]

Who owns the original black book?

[D]

It was Epstein.

[C]

I know. So where is the original one? Now?

[D]

That I do not know.

[C]

Okay, so. So in this story, we have not the original black book. We have the copy of the copy of the copy. And we're taking feedback from Alfredo Rodriguez that told the FBI, that told the lawyer, that the lawyer told us. And so that, again, loses a lot of credibility. Have you ever spoken to the FBI agent that spoke directly to the lawyer? Have you spoke to that person?

[D]

I have not. Because it was an ongoing investigation. The FBI has not given me any information whatsoever. But as I said, I've got no doubts that what. Ralph, the. The copy of the black book that Alfredo Rodriguez got was exactly what he had ripped off from Epstein.

[C]

How do you know that? You have to realize I'm a guy that's very skeptical.

[D]

Actually, there's an FBI report on. I can. I can send you the FBI.

[C]

Okay, so the FBI report shows the exact copies that match what you have.

[D]

The FBI said that what they have was acquired from Alfredo Rodriguez, who acquired it from Epstein.

[C]

Okay, so what were. You know, with all the movement that's going on today with Epstein, I think the second judge just prevented it from. You see that one, Rob? I'm sure you saw it as well, Nick. Judge denies request to unseal the Epstein files. Now, this is a second one.

[D]

That's for the grand jury.

[C]

Okay, so you do from the looks.

[D]

Which is very different. Okay, so Epstein was arrested in 2019, and there was a grand jury prior to that that indicted him on one count of child trafficking. I believe it was. So that information wouldn't really give us a lot of the news or the. The documentation from that grand jury would not give us a lot of information because it was very limited in its scope if it only indicted Jeffrey Epstein. One count of child trafficking.

[C]

Are you. Are you from the school of thought that the current administration does not want to release this? And if they don't, what are you speculating are the reasons why they don't want to.

[D]

My thoughts on this are. Well, you had Pam Bondi. Let's walk it back a little bit. You had Pam Bondi in February say that she was going to release the Epstein files. It was called the Epstein list or the Epstein list and the Epstein files are kind of synonymous. She said that she was going to release it, and then she released a nothing sandwich. Now, the black book that she released was the black book that I released, except the black book that she released had everybody's name redacted. We only redacted the numbers of the people, the adults in the black book, and then the people that were potentially victims who redacted their last names and also their numbers. So she said that she'd been burned by the FBI field office in New York City, and that's why she. And that's why she served us a nothing sandwich. And then she, you know, she keeps on putting herself in a bigger and bigger hole, because then she says that she's going to release everything and that the only matters related to national security will be redacted. So now she has to tell us why a bunch of child molesters have anything to do with national security. So she keeps digging herself into a deeper hole. And then she said that there's a truckload of evidence that's being vetted. And here's what. Shortly after Epstein was arrested in 2019, the FBI sought open his safe. And they pulled out, according to the New York Times, hundreds, if not thousands of discs and images of underage girls. And Business Insider reported that they also pulled out hard drives. So there were FBI agents or whatever dark, malignant corner of the government that deploys people like Epson. They were looking at that stuff that night. I mean, I'm willing to, you know, put a lot of money on it that they were looking at that stuff. So for her to basically insinuate that they were. They just started looking at this stuff in. In 2025 is, you know, I mean, that's utter bunk. That stuff was. It's like. So they impounded it, all these disks and hard drives from Epstein's safe, and then it was in the corner of the FBI where it was collecting dust. I mean, that's completely ridiculous. The FBI or whoever vetted that stuff knows exactly what was on it long before Pam Bondi became Attorney General of the United States.

[C]

So then why are they playing this game?

[D]

I think there's a couple of reasons. I think that we have a political system that's rife with blackmail. And I firmly believe that the people that hold the pictures are pretty powerful people that have a lot of juice. And there was a Tennessee. A federal Tennessee congressman that came out about a year and a half ago. His name is Tim Burchette. And he actually said My colleagues are being blackmailed in honey traps. So a sitting US Congressman said that my colleagues are being blackmailed in honey traps, which I think is kind of amazing. And I wrote a book called confessions of a D.C. madam, the politics of Sex, Lies, and Blackmail. And it was from the perspective of Henry Vincent. And he ran a gay escort service, and Craig Spence would use his gay escorts to compromise politicians. And we also saw that in the Franklin scandal. So I got to a blackmail photographer, and I was trying to get my mind around this, because this is something that you really don't read about in books. Now you can, because I wrote a book called the Franklin Scandal, but you really don't read about it in books. And I got to this blackmail photographer who was unctuous. But I think that it's kind of funny with. With people that you cultivate as sources. Some of them are unctuous. They're not the paragon of morality. But. And this has happened to me a few times where early on, they're pretty honest to you, and then later on, something switches. And then there. And I had this. With this blackmail driver. But I'll give you the metaphor that he used. He said, once you're compromised, it's like you're on a big, beautiful yacht, and you can have anything you want on that big, beautiful yacht, and it's a beautiful day, and there's nothing but good times on the yacht. But if you decide to get off the yacht, the people on the yacht are going to make sure that you drown. And I think that that's a very good metaphor for how blackmail works in our political system.

[C]

Okay, so you're. Again, Nick. I'm trying to go as specific for the audience to get it. So you're saying there's a blackmail operation going here. That's your claim. Is that fair to say? Okay, so you're saying there's a blackmail operation going here? When I sat with Michael, Michael claims that if Jeffrey Epstein was a Mossad agent working for Israel, he would have been terrible because he had such a big mouth and he couldn't stop talking. And he would always tell everyone's business to everybody. He was always talking, talking, talking, talking, talking. Right. So maybe Israel could have used them, but in what ways? Who knows? And by the way, I haven't even asked you, is your speculation that the blackmail was tied to an intel agency where I'm sending assets information over back to Israel? Is. Is that where you're at as well, or. No, because I know where.

[D]

Let's take a look. At that. People ask me this all the time, yeah, was Jeffrey Epstein connected the Mossad? And I say Jeffrey Epstein very well might have been connected to the Mossad, but I don't really see the dark side of the CIA that does this type of thing, allowing the dark side of the Mossad to compromise American politicians on American soil without getting a cut of that intelligence. So I think that actually there's a dark side of the Mossad, there's a dark side of the CIA, and I think that they were working together and the, the amount of power that was used. So Alexander Acosta was the U.S. attorney and he was asked, I mean, he gave Jeffrey Epstein a sweetheart deal and he gave all the co conspirators blanket immunity and he was getting vetted to be Trump's Labor Secretary. And he was asked, why did you go so light on Epstein? And he said, I was told that Epstein was intelligence and that I had to back off. Now, there's only two people, I've talked to, a number of legal scholars about this. There's only two people in the government that can tell a US Attorney to stand down. One is the Attorney General and one is the president. A U.S. attorney isn't going to go out on a limb and cover up a bunch of child molesters unless he's told to. And the Attorney General isn't going to go out on a limb and cover up a bunch of child molesters unless he's told to. And the sweetheart deal was in 2007. So George Bush too, and Alberto Gonzalez. George Bush II was the President. Alberto Gonzalez was his Attorney General. And that really shows how much power was deployed. I mean, that came from the top. That came from Mount Olympus to cover this up.

[C]

Okay, so. Came from Mount Olympus to cover this up.

[D]

Hi, I'm Nick Bryant. And if you want to connect with me, connect with me on minec, you can ask me about Epstein, justice and also all things Epstein.

[C]

One, he's given assets. Two wiles could be the reason why they're protecting this guy Epstein.

[D]

Because. And you talk about Epstein, Michael Wolfe talking about Epstein. Talking. There was a article, I believe it came out in 2001. It was from the Evening Standard, the UK and it was, I think, probably the best article that's been written about Epstein. And it was talking about Epstein being a spook and it was saying that Epstein had said that he was CIA, but he no longer says that. So that's a. It was written by Nigel. I can't think of his last name, but it's. It's a Daily Standard article and. Or a Nightly Standard article. And it's. It's a very good article.

[C]

It's a Nigel Farage award.

[D]

Nigel. I want to say Ross, but I think I can't remember his last name.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

Evening Standard from the UK 2001. And all his homes were wired for audiovisual blackmail, according to two victims. His New York home there was a secret. And this is exactly like with Spencer's home. There was a secret room and it had monitors of the bedrooms and the bathrooms. And according to one victim, there were men, as in plural, sitting in this room monitoring everything. And then another victim said that she had been in the room, but she didn't talk about various individuals monitoring anything. And his. I mean, every residence that he had had clandestine cameras. So to say that he wasn't in the business of blackmail, I think is very naive.

[C]

I think he was. I actually think he was. I'm just trying to see what. Okay, so maybe let's talk about stuff that is currently happening. Rob, do you have a. The link from cnn? This is what CNN just posted today. Okay. And it's not normal for CNN to share a clip like this. If you don't have it, Rob, I'll just text it to you. So cnn, some would say pretty friendly to the Clintons. They don't normally go after the Clintons. And just out of nowhere, while everybody is kind of trying to move on with linking Epstein and Clinton, especially on the left. This is a video that they post on their Instagram account, I think just earlier today, if not yesterday, talking about an event that the Clintons recognized Jelaine Maxwell in 2013 after Epstein scandal. So if you can play this clip, rope, go for it has uncovered photos.

[E]

And videos showing Ghislaine Maxwell being honored at a prestigious Clinton Global initiative conference in 2013, years after he was publicly accused of helping Jeffrey Epstein groom and abuse minors.

[C]

May I have all of you who.

[D]

We are honoring today, please stand up so that you can be recognized.

[E]

Maxwell was at the 2013 conference representing a non profit she founded, the Terramar Project for Ocean Conservation. Information reviewed by CNN shows Maxwell was on a list of people who were approved for complimentary access to the conference. And that access would have been personally recommended by either Bill or Hillary Clinton, according to a source familiar with the event. In response, a representative of the Clinton foundation told CNN that 600 comp tickets were given out that year and Maxwell's access was made at the staff level, which included former President Clinton's office at the time. That Maxwell was honored. British and American newspapers and tabloids had been covering Maxwell's involvement in the Epstein scandal for years, starting with a publicized lawsuit that mentioned her in 2009. In fact, she had been served a subpoena for that lawsuit while leaving a different Clinton foundation event that year, which was reported at the time by the New York Post. The allegations surrounding Maxwell gained international attention in 2011 when Virginia Giuffre told the UK's Daily Mail that Maxwell had recruited her as a teenager for Epstein and had been involved in the abuse herself, which Maxwell denied at the time. But in 2021, she was convicted of five sex trafficking related charges and sentenced to 20 years in prison. Clinton's staff had barred Maxwell from events by 2011, according to a source and information that we reviewed, which makes her appearance at the Clinton Global Initiative two years later even more striking. But a representative of the Clinton foundation told cnn, if that happened, it wasn't widely communicated. Maxwell was in Clinton's orbit for years, attending a reception for donors at the White House in 1993 and even co hosting a fundraiser for Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign in 2007. A spokesperson for Bill Clinton told CNN, this is about someone working on ocean conservation attending a charitable conference 12 years ago, along with thousands of other people and nothing more. As we have consistently said, the Clinton.

[C]

What do you think about this?

[D]

What they missed was Ghislaine Maxwell was at Chelsea Clinton's wedding.

[C]

That was in 11 or 2010 when she was at that wedding.

[D]

So I mean, obviously the Clintons felt enough about Ghislaine Maxwell to invite her to their daughter's wedding, which was the hottest ticket in town. So Ghislaine Maxwell is been hooked up with the Clintons on an, on a number of occasions. What's happening now is, and Trump had come out and said, and I'm not a Republican, I'm not a Democrat, I've got no dog in that fight. But Trump came out and said that the Epstein thing is a Democratic hoax and a number of people are getting subpoenaed, Alberto Gonzalez is getting subpoenaed, the Clintons are getting subpoenaed, James Comey is getting subpoenaed, and actually Alexander Acosta, his name wasn't among the people that were getting subpoenaed, but now he is going to, I guess, volunteer to testify. So I thought that that was kind of telling. I don't really know if we're going to get a lot of information from that. What we need, as far as Epstein goes, is an Independent Congressional commission to look into it. I think that as long as it's just the government looking at itself, we're gonna be subjected to the same perfidiousness regarding Epstein as we've already been subjected to.

[C]

What are the right questions we should be asking today? Today, with everything that's going on? Because, you know, the more and more you get of a story, people get to burnout mode. It's kind of like, okay, I'm burned out at this point. I really don't want to talk about this anymore. I already have an op on it. What I think is going on. Are you going to drop the story? You're not going to be dropping a story. Am I going to see anything with this? Are we going to have anybody getting arrested for what they did to these innocent children? When I'm watching a documentary the other night with my oldest son and you see one of the girls comes over to the house in Palm beach, eventually cops find out that there's too many young kids going from West Palm beach over the bridge to this guy's house. So they start wanted monitoring, getting consistency with stories. One girl goes there to give a massage. She takes his clothes off and she says, I don't want to do this. And he says, well, can you at least go find a girl? Every girl you bring, I'm going to give you $200. So she starts bringing a bunch of girls. She brought 24 girls and she got paid $200 each time. The youngest girl she brought.

[D]

You're talking about Haley Robson?

[C]

Yeah. The youngest girl she brought was 14 years old. So she made a few thousand dollars. Then she goes and talks to the cops. Then they say, you know you're guilty because you're involved in this. And she's like, I didn't know I was guilty. How about all the other girls? So at this point, we are very much on information overload. With what? There's documentaries on Ghislaine, there's documentaries on Epstein. But what should we be asking today that maybe hasn't been asked? What are those questions?

[D]

Well, it's really important that we ask. And 89%, according to a CBS poll, 89% of Americans want everything on Jeffrey Epskin. The question that we really need to ask, and this is why we need an independent commission, is why is the federal government covering up child trafficking? When you cover up a crime, you're aiding and abetting that crime. So why is the federal government aiding and abetting child trafficking? That should be the first question. And I think once that question is answered, then we can get to the bottom of Jeffrey Epstein.

[C]

Okay, so why do you think they're hiding it? Because to me, when I'm looking at this, this is what I see. Yesterday, President Trump announced that moving forward, if you burn the flag, you're facing up to one year of jail time. Okay? Now, some people don't like that. I support it. I've been asking for this for years to say that we have to. I don't think it's okay for people to burn the American flag in a country that gave them freedom. I don't think it's okay to do that. I'm uncomfortable with that myself. That can be debated and go back and forth. Yeah, okay. Yes, no, maybe. Great. Guess what. Blanket statement. You like it, you don't like it, you burn the flag, you're going to jail. I think we're one of the only countries that you don't go to jail for burning the flag. All right, cool. That's out there. So to me, now, if we had the Diddy, if we had the Epstein, if we had the Craig Spence, if we had the Lawrence King, if we have all these stories, if we have even the Roy Cohen who was, you know, he was more doing the male escorts at his place and getting all this blackmail model. And this goes back. This has been going for many, many years, right? What do you do to prevent the next Epstein, the next Diddy? What should be the crime to protect those innocent children? If the crime and the punishment isn't big enough, this is gonna continue happening.

[D]

Well, that's the thing. I mean, with the government now, they released that very strange document on July 6 that said that there were 300, over 300 gigabytes of information taken from Jeff. Jeffrey Epstein's possessions are safe. And that over a thousand victims had been abused. Now, I agree with that 100%. But it said that Epstein had no co conspirators. I mean, that's absolute bunk, that Epstein didn't engage in blackmail. You can definitely prove that there were co conspirators for sure. I mean, without a doubt. I mean, the New York Times wrote an article about six co conspirators. Ghislaine Maxwell, Sarah Kellen, Leslie Groff, Adriana Ross, Nadia Marcinkova, and Haley Robinson, who you were talking about. And then Politico named three or four of them also. So. And actually, Kellen, if you look at the Palm Beach Police Department notes on the investigation, Kellen comes up all the time as far as leading lambs to slaughter. So if we really wanted to go about this. How the, how the Department of Justice is taking down the Mafia is they get little fish and then they indict them on multiple RICO predicates and then they're looking at the rest of their life in prison and they roll over on the big fish. We know about, we know about Kellen, we know about Groff, we know about Marcinkova, we know about Ross. They knew how big this was and they knew who, exactly who a lot of the perpetrators were. But they've been unscathed. And actually they were named in the non prosecution agreement as there was. The non prosecution agreement gave everyone, all the co conspirators blanket immunity. But they were specifically named in the non prosecution agreement. So that would be the place to start is we get them, excuse me, we get them into a. Indict them on multiple accounts of child trafficking, which wouldn't be that difficult. And nobody's listened to the victims in this. That's what's really horrible about it. The government obviously had all that child abuse material that was impounded from Jeffrey Epstein and I'm willing to bet that they didn't even look for any of, any of the victims. So there's a lot of victims. And when the Epstein victims compensation program was started, which I'd like to get into a little bit, 200, only 225 of the victims came forward. So. And the government is stating over a thousand and Epstein trafficked underage girls for probably 25 years. So over a thousand is definitely a reasonable extrapolation. So what we need to do is start indicting the co conspirators, the procurers. And if they're looking. Child trafficking in the federal system is a heavy sentence. It's 15 to life. And if they're looking at seven life sentences or five life sentences, I mean, however many we want to throw at them, they would roll over on the perps in a heartbeat. So what we need is the Department of Justice to do its job. We need the FBI to do its job. And I started an organization. It's called Epstein Justice. Your audience, go to epstein justice.com and we have webinars every month on how we can put. Basically what we're trying to do is form a congressional commission. And we're going to need a majority in the House, we're going to need a majority in the Senate, an independent congressional commission that will incorporate.

[C]

You're not going to get that.

[D]

Well, we're going to try for it.

[C]

No, I'm glad you're Trying it. You're just not going to get that.

[D]

Well, I'm, you know, I might be deluded, but I'm optimistic.

[C]

And, you know, you know, why I would. There. There aren't many people more than me that would love to see that. But for whatever reason, this topic makes people on both sides very uncomfortable. What is Thomas Massie's involvement right now with you? Because I think he wants to see something like this come out, right?

[D]

Yes.

[C]

So credit to him. Who else like Thomas Massie are coming out saying, hey, we have to find out what happened here.

[D]

That bill has, I believe, over 34 co sponsors at this point, both from the right and from left. You've got very conservative guys like Tim Burchette, and then you've got very liberal types like aoc. They're coming together on this. So there's a number of Coke sponsors out there for that bill. And there's going to be a. AOC.

[C]

Is on that list as well.

[D]

Aoc.

[C]

Can you zoom in on that list to see who it is? So these are the names.

[D]

How many do we have now? I mean, they keep adding.

[C]

So we got Messi. Okay. Ilhan Omar on that list. Interesting. Brad Sherman. That's California. That was my congressman in the area. I was in Pelosi. Keep going lower, Keep going lower. Who else do you see there? I don't see AOC on that list.

[D]

I saw. How many do we have at this point? 23, it says here. Oh, 23. 22 Democrats and one Republican.

[C]

So you have. And what is the bill? What is the bill?

[D]

Is that the latest? Look for the latest one. It's 851. Try 851. It wants an investigation into Epstein. Or if it's not 851, it's 581 HR 581. Yeah.

[C]

An act concerning judgment. I don't think this is it.

[D]

No. Try 851.

[B]

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[C]

No, neither one of them. It's not 581 or 851. But you're saying AOC's on the list? It looks like majority. What we just looked at with Thomas Massie was Democrats with only one being a Republican.

[D]

House Resolution 581 here.

[C]

Okay, there we go. Can you see who's on the list?

[D]

Co sponsors. 44.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

Okay, 44.

[C]

Zoom in a little bit. And it's 33 Democrat, 11 Republican. Marjorie Taylor Green's on it. Rona's on it. Timber. Chet's on it. So Lauren Bobert's on it. Corey Mills is on it. Tom Barrett is on it. Rashid Talib is on it. AOC is on it. Nancy Ma is on it. Jamie Raskin's on it. Nancy Pelosi is on it. What else you got? What else you got? You're going through it fast. I'm trying to see Brad Sherman. Same name. Okay, you got a few names there. So 44 names that are on there.

[D]

Now, but AOC should be on there.

[C]

I thought she is. I said her name. She is on there.

[D]

Okay, good.

[C]

She is on there.

[D]

So what we need to do is make sure that the government doesn't cover up child trafficking anymore. Don't you think that that's what we need to do?

[C]

To me, I'm sick of it. I just want accountability. I want to know, okay, what's going to happen for these guys to be held accountable?

[D]

Okay, so what we need is an independent congressional commission, okay, to look into this. That's what Epstein justice is all about.

[C]

In order for that to happen, you need a major support from the top to push for it.

[D]

Well, you need a majority in the House and a majority in the Senate. But if we don't stop this, think about it. Our government and I love the United States of America. I love the United States of America. Our government and the United States of America is different than its government. Our government is aiding and abetting child trafficking. We have to stop it. The political machine is unwilling to stop it. So it's up to us to stop it. And this is our opportunity right now. This is going to be the best opportunity in our lifetimes to stop this. And that's why we need people to come to Epstein Justice. We've got a petition that you can sign. You can get involved with us. We have webinars we do need donations. But we're growing. We keep growing and it's a, it's a very good feeling that we keep growing. But if this doesn't happen, then the government is going to. We're going to allow the government to a bad child trafficking. We cannot let, as Americans, we just can't let that happen.

[C]

I got you. So what else can you do to prevent the next Epstein Diddy? You know, we have to.

[D]

Okay, so Epstein justice has two objectives. We want the government to tell us why it's embedding child trafficking and we want the perpetrators to be prosecuted. Very simple baseline morality. But we need the first question. Why are you covering up child trafficking? We have to know that as Americans we need to know why our government is covering up child trafficking. And until we have that answer and we can stop the mechanisms that are involved in it, then it's going to continue and we have to stop it. It happened with the Franklin scale, it's happening with Epstein. I'm been approached by many people over the years that talk about other networks that are active and, and Epstein was really ominous. There was a lawsuit from the Virgin Islands against Epstein's estate. And the Virgin islands ultimately got $105 million and then they'll get half the. The sale of Little St. James. And there was a very good Melbourne Daily that reported that Epstein was trafficking girls that were as young as 11 or 12 at. In the Virgin Islands. And I know a couple of therapists, one's a very eminent psychologist and both believe that they have represented girls that were molested by Jeffrey Epstein when they were under the age of 10 or by Epstein at all. Under the age of 10 and.

[C]

Wait, under the age of 10?

[D]

10? Yes.

[C]

This is Epstein.

[D]

Epstein, yes. And I think that that's one of the ways in which, you know, the media has called for justice at all. And, and I think if there was a real investigation. These guys are psychopaths. I mean these guys are psychopaths. If, if you want a 10 year old, they'll get you a 10 year old. But anyway, both these service who are very. One of them is very eminent, tried to get settlements from the Epstein victims compensation program and they were denied. And both of them feel. Because the COVID story that the media has embraced is that the youngest Epstein victim was 14 years old. So although we have evidence of Epstein trafficking girls younger than that, according to the Melbourne Daily, the age. And then we have these two therapists who are very, very solid therapists saying that they have clients that they believe were Trafficked under the age of 10. So the media has done everything it possibly can to sanitize Jeffrey Epstein. I'm not aware of a media outlet that has said hey, we need justice here. Have you ever seen an article from mainstream media that said we need justice here? I mean they're very good at digging up salacious dirt but no one said we need justice here. I haven't seen it. I've read a lot of Epstein articles. I haven't seen it.

[C]

I saw a story about, you know, one time 12 year old triplets were flown to Epstein.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

For his birthday. Is that true?

[D]

They were bought in eastern Europe. Yeah.

[C]

12 year old triplets?

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

I mean who brought him in is the question.

[D]

According to Virginia Goofy, Epstein and Brunel had some kind of connection in the government where they could get these girls visas, which wouldn't surprise me given everything that they got away with for all those years.

[C]

Yeah. This is the one that Vice reported on unsealed documents from 2015 civil action by Jeffrey which included her deposition recounting this claim. Additional investigative reporting such as the mine site News corroborated the details, noting that court documents record that details from the investigation include allegation of thirteen twelve year old triplets were flown in from France for Epstein's birthday and flown back the following day after being sexually abused.

[D]

Virginia describes an orgy and which were 12 year olds there. So. Yes. And we've got the Melbourne newspaper, daily newspaper saying 11 and 12 and then we've got these therapists saying under 10. So if the media really want. Why am I able to get this information and the media, the mainstream media with its seemingly infinite resources cannot get this information. What is up with that?

[C]

Yeah, wasn't there a movie with what's his name, Liam Neeson and Maggie Grace called Taken.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

Where she gets taken and goes to a, you know, sex trafficking place where she's on the. He finally finds him on the girls are coming out dancing and he's behind the glass and they're watching and they're bidding 10 grand, 20 grand, 30 grand, 40 grand, 50 grand. So you know that, that movie and then at the end of the movie I think he goes up and kills the person, whatever it is. So it's not like this stuff doesn't exist and it doesn't happen. This has been going around for a long time. The question is what is the crime? Who is the a comparable person like an Epstein or a Diddy or a Craig Spence that was caught. What is the worst punishment that a country that is a westernized country that's given to people like that, that we can go back and see a pattern there. Who have we punished for somebody that did this? See somebody else ran something like this? Is there another Epstein or Diddy that did this, that got the death penalty, that went to jail for God knows how many years? Do those stories exist? Case studies exist.

[D]

Okay, the FBI. When the Department of Justice was going to engage, what happened was there was a 14 year old girl who told her stepmother that she'd been molested by Jeffrey Epstein. And her mother brought her to the Palm Beach Police Department. And she was from a lower socioeconomic part of Palm beach, if there is such a thing in Palm Beach. But anyway, she was from a lower socioeconomic part of Palm beach and she was able to describe Epstein's, the interior of his home and also his anatomy. And that's what started their investigation. And by the time. And now there's numbers that are conflicting here. They had five, the statements of five victims, but then there were 17 corroborating statements. And from what I understand, this number has fluctuated. But they had at least, they knew of at least 17 victims. And they were ready to indict Jeffrey Epstein on four unlawful counts of sexual activity with a minor and one count of lewd and lascivious molestation, which would have put him in jail for a very long time. And then it was given to this grand jury by. And the special prosecutor was Lana Belvik. And she called two of the victims. She could have called many more, but she called two. And one was 16 years old and she'd been molested by Epstein when she was 14 and one was 18. She'd been molested by Jeffrey Epstein multiple times when she was 16 and she was calling one of the girls a prostitute. I mean, she skewered these girls.

[C]

Wow.

[D]

Skewered them. And I mean, the transcripts. DeSantis has released the transcript. So the transcripts are out there. And that's the grand jury that said Jeffrey Epstein hadn't molested a single child. So Michael Ryder, he is a hero in this. He was the chief of the Palm Beach Police Department. He became, he said, this is the worst failure, something, I'm going to paraphrase, the worst failure in modern judicial history. And he went to the Department of Justice, he said, you have to do something about this. Now, the Department of Justice had a list of 34 Epstein victims. I've got that list. But then it knew of 40 more, but yet it covered it all up. So that's where we need to start is the Department of Justice and why it had 30 or 40 victims, underage victims of Jeffrey Epstein's. And why didn't it do anything? Why did. Why was nothing adjudicated other than Jeffrey Epstein Getting 18 months in county jail and serving 13?

[C]

Yeah. So I just asked the question, who was the most notorious case similar to Jeffrey Epstein that got the death penalty or went to jail for life?

[D]

Right.

[C]

First one that comes up is Lawrence King, which we talked about earlier. The Franklin cover up the scandal. And he was accused of running child trafficking rings involving politicians and elites. Convicted for fraud but never convicted of the abuse. Not life or death, not a perfect parent, nothing. Right. So then there's Marc Dutroux from Belgium.

[D]

Belgium, yeah.

[C]

Mark Dutroux from Belgium. Wealthy contractor, serial child abuser. Kidnapped in prison and sexually abused multiple girls. Two dived of starvation in his hidden dungeon. That's the guy right there. Okay. That's 1990s. He had alleged ties to elite sex networks. Many Belgiums believe there was a cover up protecting higher ups. He was sentenced to life in prison.

[D]

What's interesting about that is actually there were law enforcement people that came forward and said there was a cover up. And there's footage of I think around 200,000 Belgians hitting the streets. They're all dressed in white and they're protesting the COVID up that happened.

[C]

Can you pull that up? After protesting Mark Dutroux, protest, protest white. There's a video of that? Yeah. If you pull it up, you should be able to see it.

[D]

I see a picture of you.

[C]

I typed in Mark Dutroux, Belgium, white march. No, it's a bigger one than this. If you go on Google, you'll see the picture. It's massive. It's not huge.

[D]

Yeah, it's huge.

[C]

It's massive. It's not a small thing that happened. So this is a 25 year anniversary. There it is.

[D]

There it is.

[C]

Right? There it is. So that's a legit march of people.

[D]

Saying, hey, that's more than a legit march.

[C]

What I'm saying is, I mean if it needs to get to that to get the attention of what happened here, maybe that's a good case study. All I'm trying to do is get case studies.

[D]

Okay, so that's what we need. I mean, if the Belgians are willing to hit the streets to protest pedophile network being covered up, Americans have to. Don't you think that Americans need to do that?

[C]

If this to me. Would you be willing to do that to me? If if this is. Everybody has their own issues. When. When the Trump administration put up what their 20 issues were in the 47 campaign, 20, 24, this wasn't necessarily a top 20 issue for them, the Epstein, but it was for a lot of people that supported, that drove for this to become a reality. A lot of people were pushing for this. And I do think, as somebody who's got a family, I think people want to know what the hell happened here. I definitely do, or else I wouldn't be doing all these interviews. Why am I talking to you? Why am I talking to Michael Wolfe? Why am I talking to Whitney Webb multiple times? Why are we talking to these? We shouldn't be doing it because it's more constant stories of it coming up, but we're interested in it. Let me give you another one here.

[D]

We have to keep it alive. I mean, it's happened in Portugal, it's happened in France. It's happened. I mean, there are multiple. And it happened in Mexico.

[C]

There are multiple case to be a real punishment. There's a guy in UK, his name was Richard Huckle.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

He abused 200 children, sentenced to life in prison, later murdered in prison, 2016. Okay. Richard Huckle. H U C K L E. And.

[D]

Then you have Jimmy Seville.

[C]

Jimmy Seville is another one who was part of that.

[D]

And that was hooked up to UK intelligence through the pedophile information exchange.

[C]

But. But did anything that Epstein did to the. The victims. Did. Did anyone get killed by Epstein or his people?

[D]

I do know this, that some of those. And I saw this with the Franklin scandal, some of those pedophiles were vicious to some of these girls. I can say that Epstein.

[C]

You're saying Epstein was not.

[D]

I'm saying that there were some victims of Jeffrey Epstein's that were pandered to some very vicious individuals.

[C]

Such as?

[D]

There's a woman that told me that she was pandered to a very powerful guy, a former prime minister, who was pretty vicious to her.

[C]

Do we know the name?

[D]

I mean, I could say the name, but then the woman. I would rather, you know, for her sake, not say it.

[C]

She hasn't said it?

[D]

Not publicly. No, not. Not publicly and not what she told me.

[C]

Is this a living pm?

[D]

Yes. Yeah.

[C]

And somebody got killed?

[D]

No, but he was. He was very violent to her.

[C]

He was violent to her. He was aggressive.

[D]

She said that he put her in the hospital. And you see that with the Franklin scandal and other situations, like with Dutroux, he started killing girls. And you see unbelievable sadism in the Franklin scandal with with the victims.

[C]

Yeah. So to me that. Because when you look at these cases, what gets the attention is if that's taking place. You have the story of Luis Gravito, Colombia, serial child killer, convicted of murdering over 100 children. Sentenced to 1853 years. Reduced to under Colombian law, no death penalty, died in 2023. That's the guy right there. But he killed 100 children. Then you have another one called John Wayne Gacy, serial killer who raped and murdered at least 33 young men executed by lethal injection.

[D]

He was more into boys. Well, older. I think a lot of his victims were older than 18 years old.

[C]

So his was older than 18 years old?

[D]

He might have.

[C]

So you're saying at least he followed the laws, what you're saying?

[D]

No, I'm not.

[C]

Come on.

[D]

No, no. What I'm saying. If you're talking about. If you're talking about pedophilic perpetrators.

[C]

So he would ID them before he did anything to them.

[D]

Yeah, I think he ID them.

[C]

What a responsible killer you are, buddy.

[D]

So we see these in multiple cultures, but Lawrence King did no time for molesting children. Craig Spence did no time for molesting children. Ghis Maxwell, the deal that she got is mind boggling. And now, I mean, she was put into a dormitory very early on, which is pretty cush. I mean, people that have served a lot of time or have done a lot of their sentence and inmates that have exhibited exemplary behavior are generally put a number of times and they're getting close to the end of their bed. They're put into dormitory style living. And she was put into dormitory style living very quickly. And now she's in a even Kush prison in Texas, which is really, really horrific.

[C]

And by the way, when Craig Spence died, he wrote a note, if I'm not mistaken, Rob, didn't Craig Spence write a note in the hotel? And he says, take this as my former resignation or something like that. Hey, Chief, consider this my resignation. Effective immediately. As you always said, you can't ask others to make a sacrifice if you are not ready to do the same. Life is a duty. God bless America. This is after he killed himself, taking all those seven Xanax, small packets of Xanax.

[D]

Well, I've heard of different pills that he took to overdose, but yes, he. And he was in a tuxedo and he was at the Ritz Carlton in Boston.

[C]

What a way to go.

[D]

So that's how.

[C]

What a way to go. So he wanted to have a black.

[D]

Tie event when he killed, but he was never arrested. Indicted for molesting.

[C]

So no job. So. So to me, there's a difference between, you know, when you're put on that. What is that list that you go to any city you're on a list. What is that list?

[D]

Sex offender registry.

[C]

Sex offender registry. Which, by the way, it's a very effect thing because, you know, and you can't even go and see how many sex offenders live around you. I mean, that, that is a public humiliation, old school type of way of doing things. Right. So that's one. But when you're talking about a guy like Epstein, Ghislaine, you know, if just Lane, if she is given a pardon and she's released, how do you think the market's gonna react if that happens?

[D]

Well, I hope that there's tremendous outrage, but we need outrage now. I mean, Glenn Maxwell, I mean, Jeffrey Epstein didn't even have to register as a perpetrator in New Mexico because he'd pandered underage girls to both Bill Richardson and Bruce King, who were the governors of New Mexico.

[C]

He bought the property from the governor, the 8,000 acre.

[D]

So we need something now. Yeah, that's why Epstein. Justice is really important. I mean, don't you think that if our government's not going to do it, that us as Americans, we have to create a movement? Now, movements aren't. Interests are difficult. There was the labor's rights movement, and at one point, people that wanted unions were considered far left radicals. There was a civil rights movement. There was the women's rights movement. Now we have to come together and make sure that the children have a right not to be molested. Now if you look at the numbers of kids that are molested in the United States, it's pretty mind boggling. Now this is from the CDC. According to the Centers for Disease Control, 25% of underage girls have been molested. And people in the field think that that's conservative. And 5% of underage boys, now there are studies that go as high as 16% on underage boys. But if we just stick with the CDC numbers, there are 50 million Americans that have been molested as children. 50 million. We need to stop this, and we have to. And this is what's really important about Epstein. If we allow the Department of Justice to cover up a proven trafficking network like Epstein, that sends a message to millions of Americans that you have no voice and no hope for justice. That's another reason why we have to put our foot down and say no more.

[C]

Yeah, I don't disagree. By the way. There's another list when I had this guy named Anthony Weiner on. I don't know if you're familiar with him, I asked him a bunch of different questions. But there's another article that just came out talking about the number of names tied to Epstein that have died from murky circumstances, suicide or different things. Rob, do you have that list?

[D]

I do.

[C]

If you have that list, if you want to pull it up. I don't know if it can be zoomed in or not. If it's blurry.

[D]

This guy is pretty savvy tech wise. Oh, he's got a good guy.

[C]

Yeah, he's very savvy. Zoom in a little bit more, Rob. So Jeffrey Epstein, obviously he was found hung and the last text message he sent when Michael Wolf asked him, how are you doing? He says, I'm just hanging in there. That was his last text from his lawyer to Michael Wolff. I'm just hanging in there. And then it was fan hung, obviously dead. Steve Hoffenberg, 77, believe natural causes found at home. Efren Reyes after speaking investigators he died.

[D]

From.

[C]

What was this? He died.

[D]

COVID 19.

[C]

COVID 19. Jeffrey obviously alleged.

[D]

I wrote an article on her. It's on my blog. Nick Bryan NYC and I knew Virginia and I. There was so much apocrypha that came out after her suicide that the Mossad had killed her, that she was alive and living with Jeffrey Epstein. I wrote an article to kind of set all that straight.

[C]

So if you think she died from a suicide or.

[D]

Yes, yes.

[C]

You think she really did die? Yeah, really. Okay. Any of these other names before I go through, was there anything that was.

[D]

Well, Alfredo Rodriguez had cancer. Joe Rickari died of a heart attack, I believe. I mean, Roy Black, I mean he was 80. Marvin Minsky was 88, a little bit lower up. Ronald Eppinger, he's kind of an interesting case because he was, he. He was busted for child trafficking.

[C]

He's a first pimp with Virginia.

[D]

Yeah, yeah. So he's kind of an interesting case that. And then he ultimately gave her to another guy that molested her. And the FBI got onto Eppinger and then it got on to this guy and then Virginia was in bed with him and the FBI did a pre dawn raid and kicked the door open.

[C]

What's the other guy's name?

[D]

I can't think of it. There's. There's a lot of Epstein stuff on my ram, but look into it. Yeah, this guy will tell us.

[C]

That is interesting, sir. Ronald Eppinger. And what was he known for?

[D]

He was busted by the FBI for trafficking.

[C]

He was humans.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So what ended up happening to him?

[D]

He spent the, I think the rest of his life in jail. But don't quote me Mint is still 15amonth for premium wireless. And if you haven't made the switch yet, here are 15 reasons why you should.

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[C]

Interesting. Well, any final words, Nick, before we wrap up? Anything else that the audience should know or look into or any final thoughts you want to share? I know September 3rd press conference is coming up. What are you expecting from that?

[D]

I'm expecting that the legislators, that there's other legislators there that are going to support this. But if we go to our justice system and expect our justice system to fix this, it's not going to happen. It's. It's just not going to happen. It's like a dog chasing its tail. That's why Epstein, justice is very, very important. We need a movement of people like what happened in Belgium to say that's it, we've had enough, we have to do something about this and be short of that. This is going to continue and there's going to be more children molested. And as I said earlier, According to the CDC, there's over 50 million Americans that have been sexually abused as when they were underage. So we have to put our foot down on this and just say no more if we're not going to fix that huge endemic problem until we fix our justice system. And our justice system actually prosecutes people that molested children. And that has to be a preeminent concern of ours. I mean for. I understand the government crossing certain lines. But this is a line in the sand that should not be crossed. American children should not be trafficked in America and their molesters shouldn't be molesting them with impunity because the Department of Justice refuses to prosecute them. I mean, that's what's really important here. And Epstein justice, we're taking a big step and I'm really heartened by the way that we're growing. We're really going. There's a lot of people like you that are outraged. I've been outraged forever. I was outraged when I got the Black Book and I started calling these victims and they started telling me about being flown around and I was outraged about the Franklin scandal, that no one, none of, none of the perps.

[C]

Has Elon Musk at all been involved? Has he done anything with you guys or Mass you or. No, because I know Elon has got a relationship with Massey.

[D]

Massie has pledged his support to Epstein justice, which is, which is great.

[C]

Elon has not yet.

[D]

Elon is not. No.

[C]

Okay. Got it. Sounds good. Well, Nick, where can people find you? I know we gave the epsteinjustice.com anything else you want to share before we wrap up?

[D]

Epsteinjustice.com there's also a petition there, a change.org petition that you can sign. You can join us in our webinars. We have webinars every month on how you can put pressure on your legislators to get them to support what we're doing and to seek justice on behalf of the victims. And as I said, if we don't, this is going to be our best opportunity to stop this. And if we don't stop it now, we're not going to be able to stop it. It's going to, it's going to keep growing. And 89% of Americans want to see the government with transparency on this. We're with. It's not like it's. I mean, we're talking 89% of Americans.

[C]

Who is the 11% that doesn't. That's who I want to.

[D]

They attacked me quite often on the Internet and in social media. I've met them.

[C]

Nick, appreciate your work. Keep at it. And I hope more people look into it and get more curious about this topic because we just want to find out what happened. It was one of the things that some of the administration promised, not necessarily Trump. I don't put this on Trump because even when Campos interviewed him on Fox News, Campos, Duffy interviewed him, he specifically said, I don't know about Epstein. He said yes to 9 11. He said yes to JFK, but he didn't say yes to 9 11, yes to Epstein. Cash Patel did. Bongino spoke about it a lot as well as Pam Bondi, and we got nothing so far. So hopefully the leadership team who fumbled this will come through and reveal and release something they're telling us.

[D]

Do you think that's going to happen?

[C]

I don't know if it's going to happen. I think everything happens, Nick, with pressure.

[D]

And that's why Epstein justice is so important.

[C]

If there's pressure of this in the right way and it becomes more and more and more and doesn't go away, then eventually, yes. If not, it'll go away and then we'll wait another five years for another story to come out. And in the interim, the next Epstein is plotting his moves and he's doing what he's doing.

[D]

The only reason why the Epstein story came out, I firmly believe this is Michael Ryder, the chief of the Palm Beach Police Department. He would not back down. And if it wasn't for him, this wouldn't have come out. If it wasn't for the, the Franklin, the Nebraska Senate subcommittee that looked into the Franklin scandal, this never would have come out.

[C]

Him.

[D]

Yes, he's a hero.

[C]

Has he been interviewed as he was.

[D]

Interviewed on a Netflix called Filthy Rich.

[C]

Oh, okay. That's a documentary.

[D]

But he, he is a hero. Michael. Writer is a hero.

[C]

Well, Michael, wherever you are, kudos to you, buddy. Nick, thank you for coming. I appreciate your time. Thank you so much. Take care, everybody. Bye bye. Bye, bye.

[D]

Hi, I'm Nick Bryant, and if you want to connect with me, connect with me on Manect, you can ask me about Epstein justice and also all things Epstein.