“South Africa's Economic Genocide" - Entrepreneur Rob Hersov SLAMS Corrupt Gov't, Zuma & Racist Laws | PBD Podcast | Ep. 589

Summary

PBD Podcast Episode 589: “South Africa's Economic Genocide" - Entrepreneur Rob Hersov SLAMS Corrupt Gov't, Zuma & Racist Laws

Release Date: May 21, 2025

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Introduction

In Episode 589 of the PBD Podcast, host Patrick Bet-David engages in a profound and impassioned discussion with Rob Hersov, a seasoned entrepreneur from South Africa. The conversation delves deep into the economic and political turmoil plaguing South Africa, critiquing the current government’s policies and their detrimental impact on the nation’s prosperity and social fabric.

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Rob Hersov's Background

Rob Hersov provides a comprehensive overview of his illustrious background, highlighting his roots and professional journey.

• Early Life and Education: Born in 1960 in Johannesburg, South Africa, Hersov hails from a prominent family. His grandfather co-founded Angloval, one of South Africa's top five mining industrial companies during the 60s, 70s, and 80s. “I was born into a very wealthy family because my grandfather and his buddy and business partner founded Angloval,” [04:04].

• Military and Early Career: Hersov served as an infantry officer in the South African Defense Force during the apartheid era before transitioning to the United States, where he attended Harvard Business School and worked on Wall Street at Goldman Sachs. “I went to Goldman Sachs on Wall Street for two years, Harvard Business School, then worked for Rupert Murdoch as his right-hand man in New York,” [05:10].

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Experiences with Rupert Murdoch

Hersov recounts his transformative experience working with media mogul Rupert Murdoch, offering insights into Murdoch’s leadership style and business acumen.

• Interview Process and Hiring: Hersov describes a rigorous and unconventional interview process. “I did the most extraordinary interview with Stan... before you meet Rupert, you need to meet John Evans... I haven't said a word in my interview... When I got to Rupert, he asked me, 'What do you think the future of the media industry is?' I said, 'Technology.' He said, 'No, it's content,'” [07:10].

• Murdoch’s Leadership: Reflecting on Murdoch’s management, Hersov praises his ability to swiftly evaluate business opportunities and his charismatic yet grounded nature. “He was a real man of the people. He talked to the elevator guy... Charismatic, funny, decent, charming, common man,” [09:20].

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Current State of South Africa

The conversation shifts to the dire economic and political state of South Africa under the ruling African National Congress (ANC).

• State Capture and Corruption: Hersov vehemently criticizes the ANC’s systemic corruption, particularly under former President Jacob Zuma. “He instituted a thing called State capture... hundreds of billions of rand were stolen and offshored,” [20:12].

• Economic Decline: Highlighting alarming economic indicators, Hersov notes stagnant GDP growth and soaring unemployment rates. “South Africa's GDP has stagnated, averaging 0.8% annually from 2012 to 2020... Unemployment reached 33.5% in 2024 with youth unemployment at 61%,” [24:06].

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Black Economic Empowerment and Racist Laws

A focal point of the discussion is South Africa’s Black Economic Empowerment (BEE) policies and their adverse effects on the economy and societal harmony.

• BEE Policies Explained: Hersov elucidates the BEE framework, emphasizing its mandate for businesses to allocate a minimum of 30% ownership to Black individuals. “The South African government said to Elon Musk, if you want to bring Starlink to South Africa, you've got to give 30% of your business to a black person,” [25:04].

• Impact on Business and Investment: Criticizing the arbitrary selection of beneficiaries, Hersov argues that such policies deter foreign investment and favor political elites over genuine economic inclusivity. “If you're dealing with the government, you have to give 30%... They choose or that you choose that's acceptable to them,” [25:30].

• Expropriation Without Compensation: Hersov warns against new laws allowing the government to expropriate land without compensation, likening it to communist policies. “Tell me what this means to you. Expropriation without compensation... You won't invest in South Africa with a law like that,” [26:24].

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Foreign Direct Investment Trends

Hersov provides a stark analysis of declining Foreign Direct Investment (FDI) in South Africa, attributing it to overregulation and discriminatory laws.

• FDI Statistics: Highlighting a significant drop in FDI, he notes, “In 2023 it was 96.5 billion, in 2022 was 151 billion. Dropped 50% in one year,” [28:08].

• Comparison with Other Nations: Contrasting with the United States’ robust FDI inflow, Hersov underscores South Africa’s struggle to attract and retain investment. “The complete opposite is taking place in South Africa. Everyone's pulling out. Shell just announced they're pulling out,” [48:57].

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Comparison to Germany in the 1930s

Hersov draws a parallel between South Africa’s current trajectory and Germany’s descent into turmoil in the early 1930s, emphasizing the rise of extremist policies and societal division.

• Racism and Socialism: “They're pushing anti-white racism and socialism by the day... It's like Germany in the early 1930s,” [34:00].

• Economic Genocide: He warns of an economic genocide, where policies systematically dismantle the economic stability, disproportionately affecting the white minority. “There's an economic genocide taking place with black economic empowerment, with expropriation without compensation,” [35:14].

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International Relations and U.S. Stance

The discussion extends to South Africa’s strained relations with the United States and the potential for American intervention.

• Trump’s Position: Hersov anticipates that former President Donald Trump will take a firmer stance against South Africa’s policies compared to previous administrations. “Donald Trump is angry with South Africa... He is going to punish South Africa unless they repeal racist and socialist policies,” [57:10].

• Potential U.S. Actions: He advocates for leveraging U.S. influence to pressure South Africa into policy reforms. “America should say to South Africa, we are not going to help in any way. In fact, we're going to punish you unless you immediately do those three things,” [62:37].

• Role of Individuals like Marco Rubio and Ronny Jackson: Hersov mentions specific U.S. politicians who could spearhead these actions. “Marco Rubio is the one who's going to do it... Ronny Jackson has already put a bill that's going to Congress about punishing individual South Africans,” [58:46].

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The Role of the Business Community

Hersov laments the reluctance of South African businesses to stand up against the ANC’s corrupt governance, highlighting his unique position as a vocal critic.

• Lack of Corporate Opposition: “Very few South African corporates stand up and say anything. I am the only South African businessman you can even type in prominent South African businessmen standing against the ANC,” [87:46].

• Consequences of Silence: He underscores the dangers of business collusion with the state, which perpetuates systemic corruption and economic decline. “The business community either cowards, colluders or captured,” [88:27].

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Proposals for Economic and Political Reform

Rob Hersov outlines radical measures he believes are necessary to rejuvenate South Africa’s faltering economy and restore political integrity.

• Privatization and Deregulation: “I'd privatize all the state-owned enterprises, sell them off because they are just a feeding trough for corruption. I would deregulate,” [74:10].

• Government Restructuring: Advocating for a leaner government, he suggests reducing the number of ministers and eliminating redundant departments. “We have 32 ministers in the cabinet... it's ridiculous. And all the ministers have a deputy minister. There are 34 deputy ministers... It’s fixable,” [74:10].

• Economic Incentives and FDI Revival: Emphasizing the need for economic freedom, Hersov believes that restoring investor confidence through policy reforms will reverse the brain drain and stimulate growth. “Foreign direct investment would return, and there’d be a reverse diaspora of 100 to 200,000...” [91:43].

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Personal Insights and Philosophy

Beyond the economic and political discourse, Hersov shares personal anecdotes and philosophies that shape his worldview.

• Minimalism: Embracing a minimalist lifestyle, he rejects material excess, including diamonds, viewing them as symbols of unnecessary consumerism. “I'm a minimalist. I only wear blue and white. I don’t own any watches anymore, really. No vases, no jewelry,” [92:38].

• Family and Motivation: His commitment to South Africa is deeply personal, motivated by family ties and a sense of duty to his homeland. “If I could give me my 100 days as a benevolent dictator... I've never been more proud of you,” [90:40].

• Interpersonal Relationships: Despite facing threats and backlash for his outspoken stance, Hersov remains resilient, supported by his family’s encouragement. “If my wife and father hadn’t said the same thing to me, I would have given up,” [89:01].

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Conclusion

Rob Hersov’s impassioned critique of South Africa’s current economic and political state serves as a wake-up call for both national leaders and the international community. Through his firsthand experiences and unwavering commitment, he underscores the urgent need for systemic reforms to avert further economic decline and social discord. Hersov’s vision for South Africa hinges on restoring meritocracy, eliminating corruption, and fostering an environment conducive to sustainable growth and equitable prosperity.

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Notable Quotes

• On Murdoch’s Leadership: “He was a real man of the people. He talked to the elevator guy, he talked to the... In those days, we just walk down and get attacked,” [09:20].

• On BEE Policies: “If you have any dealing with the government... They choose or that you choose that's acceptable to them,” [25:30].

• On Expropriation Laws: “You wouldn't invest in South Africa with a law like that,” [26:53].

• On State Capture: “Jacob Zuma was fundamentally evil and malevolent... He’ll be way, way, way more dangerous if he does,” [22:33].

• On Minimalism: “I'm a minimalist... I can put my life into four suitcases. I only wear blue and white,” [92:38].

• On Economic Genocide: “There's an economic genocide taking place with black economic empowerment, with expropriation without compensation,” [35:14].

• On Privatization: “I'd privatize all the state-owned enterprises, sell them off because they are just a feeding trough for corruption,” [74:10].

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This comprehensive summary encapsulates the depth and breadth of the conversation between Patrick Bet-David and Rob Hersov, providing listeners and non-listeners alike with critical insights into South Africa's economic and political challenges as portrayed in this episode of the PBD Podcast.

Transcript

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[A]

Myself at risk here. By the way, we've got lunatics running the asylum.

[B]

What can you tell us about him?

[A]

President Cyril Ramaphosa. Complete gangster, rogue, villain.

[B]

So have you spent any time with Elon Musk?

[A]

The South African government said to Elon Musk, if you want to bring Starlink to South Africa, you've got to give 30% of your business to a black person. And we'll tell you who said this. Cheko Zumwa Our government says it. It's a government policy. We get poorer every year. The country is falling apart with Youth.

[B]

Unemployment at 61% highest in the world.

[A]

How South Africa is Germany in the early 1930s. They're pushing anti white racism and socialism by the day. And let me give you the worst of it.

[B]

Tell me more.

[A]

These are the things these are here saying publicly with 100,000 people in the stadium. This is Kill the Boer. One farmer, one bullet. We will slit the throat of whiteness.

[B]

It's from South Africa and we think it's a fraud what they did to diamonds.

[A]

De Beers is sitting on a mountain of unsold diamonds. The best short in the world.

[B]

You say you're a minimalist. Don't you have a 30 million dollar property like in Dubai or something? Like a vacation property or. No.

[A]

Okay, so we like three things didn't ask me.

[B]

Did you ever think you would make it? Adam? What's your point? The future looks bright.

[A]

My handshake is better than anything I ever signed right here.

[B]

You are a one of one.

[A]

I think I've ever said this.

[B]

Okay, so there's a lot of news about South Africa today. And so happens we have a very special guest here with us. Robert Herzog from South Africa. Three fun facts before we get started. Number one, he's had three hole in ones in golf. Number two, he was the first director on Fiji Water. Okay, first director. When Fiji Water came out, he was on the board. And number three, the movie. Fantastic. Mr. Fox, he is the helicopter pilot. It's great to have you on a podcast.

[A]

Well, a start.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can you do this every time? Thank you.

[B]

Well, hopefully Katie's going to watch and say, oh my God, I'm married to freaking stud.

[A]

I wish she'd realize that.

[B]

Well, she's going to have to this podcast. So. Okay, so for the average person, when you think about countries, you know, we all know a little bit about China, we all know a little bit about, you know, India, what's going on. Okay, we know a little bit about Germany, maybe more. We know something about. Everybody knows a lot about America, South Africa, I don't know. While we're doing this, you know, everything that's going on. You're seeing Elon Musk on a show, a couple of his tweets. He's saying, you know, we got to stop racism in South Africa, but it's racism against whites and all this stuff. And then with the 58, we got a lot of things I will talk about there. But before doing that, do you mind taking a minute and just kind of share with the audience your background so they know who you are and what you've done?

[A]

Sure. I'm. I was born in 1960 in Johannesburg, South Africa. I'm a fifth generation South African. My mother's side came from England and Scotland and the relative that came to South Africa was in the British army and he finished the Indian rebellion and came to South Africa to retire. And my father's family escaped Eastern Europe and Russia and ended up in Cape Town. And I was born into a very wealthy family because my grandfather and his buddy and business partner founded a company called Angloval which in the 60s, 70s and 80s was one of the top five mining industrial companies in South Africa. And I've had every privilege known to man, but I believe that I've taken advantage of every opportunity given to me. And I'll give you a quick potted bio. I can do this really quickly so it isn't boring. So I was at school in university in South Africa and then I spent two years as an infantry officer in the South African Defense Force in the apartheid era. And I left when this is what, this is 90s? 83, 84.

[B]

83, 84.

[A]

By the way, South Africa did a major invasion of Angola in 85.

[B]

And you were in at that time?

[A]

Well, no, I'd finished by then. I'd done my two years and I was an infantry officer.

[B]

Got it.

[A]

And then I came to America, went to Goldman Sachs on Wall street for two years, Harvard Business School, then worked for Rupert Murdoch as his right hand man in New York.

[B]

Literally.

[A]

Literally. I carried his bag. I went to every meeting, I helped write speeches.

[B]

How did you get introduced to him by your family?

[A]

Know that story?

[B]

Yeah, I do.

[A]

I was dating a gorgeous redhead and I hadn't got a job lined up for, you know, everyone had done these interviews.

[B]

American redhead or South African American redhead.

[A]

American Reddit, New York redhead. Yeah, gorgeous.

[B]

Good. And they're crazy though. But that's a different conversation.

[A]

This is good crazy. And she said, what are you going to do after business school? I said, I don't know, I'd like to get into the media business. And she said, oh, you should meet Stan Schumann. He runs, he's one of the Allen & Company heads. This is, remember, this is 1989. I had the most extraordinary interview with Stan. Wait. I went to see Stan Schuman, Allen Company. Stan said, you're Rob. You want to be in the media business? I'm a media investment banker. So you're in the wrong place. You need to actually consider News Corp. And I'm on the board of News Corp. He was at the time. And I'm going to introduce you. Before you meet Rupert, you need to meet John Evans, he's the visionary. I haven't said a word, by the way. I've said hello. I haven't said a word. So he calls the secretary, says, call John Evans said, tell her, you know, tell John I'm sending Rob herself. South African to see him. Gave me the address. I shook his hand, left, haven't said a word. Walked down to Harper's and Harper Collins, which owned by News Corp. As I walk in, there's a stringy head, gray older guy who goes, before you say anything, let me tell you, I'm a reformed alcoholic and drug addict and I'm marrying a girl half my age. I was dropped on my knees and said, I'm your man, but I still haven't said hello yet. And he starts telling me about the future of the media business. He goes, you know, in super.

[B]

What year is this?

[A]

1889.

[B]

So in supermarkets I'm following at Harvard Business School.

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So he says, in supermarkets, the fish need to be near the chips. And he's talking about these weird things for 20 minutes. He talks. I still haven't said a word. And he said, well, if you want to work for News Corp, you've got to beat Rupert. So, hold on. Calls Rupert, says, I've got this guy Rob. Rob from South Africa, Harvard mba. Yeah, sorry about that. Yeah, he can come and see you right now. Gives me Rupert's address, 1211 Sixth Avenue sends me. I still haven't said a word in my interview. Get to Rupert, walk in, he goes, you must be Rob. I go, yeah, please sit down, Rob. What do you think the future of the media industry is? And I go, technology. And he goes, no, it's content. And then he spoke for 15 minutes about why content, which was correct. And then he said, okay, you're hired. What are you going to do for me? I've said one word in three interviews.

[B]

I've got a job just because of Stan, because of the redhead. So this redhead, why is this redhead so trusted?

[A]

Because her father and Stan were best friends. So she. She got me the interview. He assumed I went to Harvard Business School.

[B]

Goldman.

[A]

Goldman.

[B]

Military, Infantry, South Africa. So that. So when you work with Rupert, what was he like to work with and how much time did you spend with him every day? How was it like to work with? So what I thought right now, what I just did is 1989 network. Rupert Murdoch at the time was 725. So he's. He's known, he's a power player, but Fox News hasn't yet started. Right? Right.

[A]

So I spent two and a half years with him, and he'd hand me. Everybody wanted to get in front of Rupert Murdoch. So they'd all be going, rupert, could you look at this opportunity, this deal? He'd have a pile of decks and things on his desk with a little note of who gave it to him. And then every Monday morning, he'd kind of have a look and he'd say, ah, this guy's an idiot. Throw them in the bin. And then he'd go, okay, this guy's important. Read that. And he'd give me three business plans every Monday, and I'd have to come back and on Friday have to present them to him. He'd ask me three to five questions on each one and immediately know the value, how it would fit into his empire, if he was interested.

[B]

This is about buying those companies, investing in those companies.

[A]

So in those days, Christian Music was taking off, but country music was barely known. And this guy, Jim Garcia, I can't remember, I believe I remember the name from Nashville had sent this buy into Country Music tv. I did the analysis, presented to Rupert. He asked me five questions and he went. He used to rub his forehead and he said, offer them $30 million, not a cent more. If they don't take it, move on, it's now worth many billions. And he could analyze things that quickly. He was also a real man of the people. He talked to, the elevator guy, he talked to the. In those days, we just walk down and get attacked.

[B]

Was he charismatic?

[A]

Charismatic, funny, decent, charming, common man. Charming, but not interested in. Not interested in money, not interested in, you know, important people. He was interested in humor and being successful and building his business.

[B]

What were three to five questions he would ask?

[A]

I wish I'd written them down. Oh, genius. I wish I'd written them down. And so I spent two and a half years with him. And then he said to me, when he ran into trouble, he tried to buy Time magazine. Remember they did the merger with Warner. He was running into big financial troubles then. And he said to me, okay, you need to go with Barry Diller to LA and work with him on setting up the Fox network.

[B]

So you were there when that whole deal was being done, the Time Warner mess, the bitters. Were you ever around Roger Ailes?

[A]

I didn't meet Roger.

[B]

Never met Roger.

[A]

He was after me because he kind of came in from left.

[B]

Were you around Rupert's kids, the boys?

[A]

Not as much. They were pretty young.

[B]

Got it.

[A]

Yeah. You know, when you were with him, you're the most important person in the world. He'd concentrate, listen. And I remember one story told me, can we go off peace?

[B]

Sure.

[A]

Of course we went to. And I can't remember who. Somebody's 80th birthday and this expensive 60th, you know, 66 6th Avenue, 5th Avenue apartment. We walk in and Rupert says, I'm going to give you a life lesson. See those people walking towards me as quickly as I can? They're the guys who want to sell me something. But if you look in the corner, there are two guys talking to the host's children. They're the people you need to talk to. They've made it in life. Isn't that interesting?

[B]

Wow. The people that are running to come.

[A]

To me are trying to sell me something.

[B]

Trying to sell me something. But the people that are talking to.

[A]

They'Re interested in what the host's kids.

[B]

Kids are doing. Those are the ones that have made it in life.

[A]

Yeah, talk to them. That'll be the most interesting one.

[B]

Very interesting, very interesting.

[A]

He was nice to the common man, you know, if the queen had offered him a lighted, he would have turned it down. He wasn't interested in that stuff. He and Elon Musk, I'm a libertarian conservative, Judeo Christian. He and Elon Musk, we are an eternal debt of gratitude to because Rupert came in with, you know, Sky Television, Sky News, Fox tv, the New York Post and he captured the center, center right, free market, capitalist, Judeo Christian, part of Americans media. And Elon did the same thing when he bought Twitter and turned it into X.

[B]

And one is from Australia, one is from South Africa.

[A]

There we go.

[B]

So have you spent any time with Elon Musk?

[A]

I met him once at SpaceX, a 20 minute meeting. It was extraordinary because his assistant said, look, your South African will give you the lunch slot, but it's only 20 minutes, 20 minute meetings. He arrived on the 2nd and I said, well, we better order lunch. He said, I've ordered already turned up. And then he spoke about Tesla and the problems he was having. And it was 15 years ago and with two minutes to go, I knew it was 20 minutes and he leaves. I said, elon, how can I help you? And he looked at me in this weird way and he went, no one's ever asked me that question. And he said, okay, if you hear or hear or see me do anything stupid, let me know because I get no feedback.

[B]

If you hear or see me do anything stupid, I get no feedback.

[A]

Tell me because I get no feedback from you.

[B]

It's funny because one kid who's a YouTuber, brilliant kid, goes and visits his SpaceX, gives him one feedback on things. Have you heard about the story or no? One kid goes, gives him one small feedback on what to do. Elon invites him down, takes him and shows him and says, look at the change that we made based on a feedback that you gave. Because he saw a video of this guy. It's a very. Rob, do you know the story or no? No, I'm looking for it now. Yeah, there's there. It's a very fascinating story of.

[A]

Elon's attention to detail. He cares, is extraordinary. And I just say, thank you, Rupert, thank you, Elon.

[B]

YouTuber's question made Elon Musk completely rethink SpaceX rocket. The YouTuber, Everyday Astronaut, was on a tour of the SpaceX Starbase facility. He asked a very intelligent question, certainly gave Elamas pause for thought. An opportunity to fix this vital error. This is a year ago, year and a half ago. What's the question, Rob? Let's see if we can find it. I realized in Made of the intelligent everything I was thinking of. Tim was asked at exactly right time for the billionaire to realize that his errand, crucially, correctly. You don't even need a cold gas thruster system. You already have hot gas, says Musk. But this is only for the booster, right? Tim ask, go a little bit lower. And appearing deep in thought, the SpaceX founder and Seal replies, arguably, now you mention it, it might be wise to do this for the ship too. We're going to fix that. And it's not the first time Musk has taken on project feedback. Tim was visiting SpaceX Starbase in 2021. However, upon being invited back more than six months later, it was revealed, SpaceX chief Elon Musk that his question led to vital changes. Wow. I mean, this is, this is extraordinary guy. Yeah. There's a story about Sam Walton. It's a great book called Made in America where Sam is going all over the world looking at all the markets that are being made and he pays close attention. And one day he's at this place in Europe and the lady comes in and says, you know, what are you looking for? I'd like to find this. Let me get one of my associates to help you. What did you call your co worker? Associates. Great. We're going to call our employees associates. Then there's these two business partners from Brazil who are in the same business as he is. They come to visit Sam Walton. He picks them up on a truck all day. They spent time with Sam Walton. He says the entire time Sam kept asking us questions of what we were doing in Brazil. That was working on. By the time it was done, us spending time with him, we didn't learn anything about Walmart, but he learned everything about what we were doing. And we went back to Brazil.

[A]

That's Rupert Murdoch.

[B]

Got it. Makes sense to me.

[A]

So we'd be riding in a cab. Cause we hop in a cab now and again in those days. And he'd ask the cab driver, what newspaper do you read? Which page do you turn to first? He absolutely ask for curious. Ask curious.

[B]

So South Africa.

[A]

Well, I'll give you quickly my bio.

[B]

Please go for it.

[A]

And I'll do this really, really fast.

[B]

So you're, are you. You're a billionaire, you, you're, you've made.

[A]

A lot in Rand. In Rand.

[B]

In Rand, yeah.

[A]

Which is how the Rand's depreciating, which.

[B]

Is how much NRS.

[A]

Oh, it used to be 1 to 1 in the 70s, but now it's 20 to 1.

[B]

20 to 1.

[A]

The government is.

[B]

So you've made money, You've made money, You've done okay for yourself.

[A]

I was. I founded Marquee Jet in Europe. I built a big business, Sportal, the biggest sports media, Internet business in Europe, which failed. So I had a lot of learnings there. I sold Marketjet Europe to NetJets, was vice chairman of NetJets. I'm still a senior advisor to VistaJets. I love the aviation business. And then I've done some very big deals. I owned a third of Air Berlin and I just won a very big license this morning to do a betting exchange in South Africa.

[B]

You're the first.

[A]

I'm the first.

[B]

Get out of here.

[A]

Yeah. So Betfair in Australia is the most profitable business in Australia. We have just won the license to the.

[B]

Fantastic. That's a big deal.

[A]

Yeah. And I've done a whole lot of other things.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I see you've got a lot of sports teams here. I love rugby, so I'm going to have to get you a Springbok shirt. But I owned Vicenza Culture in Italy. I'm the first foreigner to buy a football team in Italy. I owned it for two years.

[B]

How was that?

[A]

It was. Well, it was one of those businesses that had a tiny profit, a tiny club. And Vicenza, if you're driving in Italy from Milan to Venice, you passed Verona and there's one little turn off to Vicenza which no one notices, you go straight on to Venice. I own Vicenza Culture, Vicenza Football Club. And the only piece of silver where they ever won was a month after I bought it, they won the Italian cup, beating Napoli 1 nil.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

But now, today, every restaurant I go to in London, Italian restaurant, they go, Mr. Presidente, so what do you know.

[B]

About the Tranmere Rovers?

[A]

Not much. I don't follow football.

[B]

I was trying to be selfish, you know, trying to get a little bit of business counsel to see if you know any. Anything about them.

[A]

But a final quick thing. So I've done lots of entrepreneurial things, investors. And after 31 years of living in America, Europe and mainly the UK, I decided to go back to South Africa in 2017.

[B]

I read that.

[A]

Yeah. 31 years of sea.

[B]

Why did you go back?

[A]

And people are going the other way. They're leaving in droves. Yeah.

[B]

There's Brain Drain that's taking place over there. Yeah.

[A]

I Went back because I looked at my wife in the eyes and said my parents are still alive. My father's 99 this year, mother 91.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

We're still, our name is still reasonably well known in South Africa, being industrial family. And I want to go home, I'm homesick. But we'll only go home for two to three years because Jacob Zuma, the president at the time, is destroying the country. Let's go back, show our kids, see South Africa and then leave. And what I'm not going to do is get involved in politics or invest in anything in South Africa that has any long term horizon or involves the government.

[B]

That makes a lot of sense. So you said.

[A]

So what did I do?

[B]

No, but wait a minute. You just said the President of South Africa is destroying the country. And that's why I'm going back for two to three years but I'm not going to get involved in politics. That makes a lot of sense, Robert.

[A]

Yeah, I really stuck to that makes.

[B]

A lot of sense. So why is he destroying the country and how is he destroying it?

[A]

So I'll give you a quick potted history. In 1994, apartheid ended and the country and government was handed over peacefully to the majority, the black majority. And for 12, 14 years South Africa was actually a success story. It was the miracle democracy, the miracle story. The west said we've won, we've saved South Africa, there's democracy. And the country grew at 3, 4, 5% a year. There was meritocracy, there were black, white, colored, Indian people in all the jobs and everything was going well. In 2008 the rot began. So there was Mandela, Mbeki and then President Jacob Zuma. Complete gangster, rogue, villain.

[B]

He's a gangster, Jacob Zuma, he's the gangster.

[A]

And he instituted a thing called State capture all our state owned enterprises, railways, electricity supply, South African airways. He put loyalists in place whose only job was to steal. And hundreds of billions of rand were stolen and offshored. And that was when the country began its descent into potential economic collapse. This is an 08, this is 0809 till 2017.

[B]

So state captures type of systemic political corruption in which private interests significantly influence a state's decision making processes to their own advantage. The term was first used in World bank in 2000 describing certain central Asian countries making the transition from Soviet communism where small corrupt groups use their influence over government officials to appropriate government decision making in order to strengthen their economic positions. Okay, so 2008, 2009, he's doing this.

[A]

He begins it. He begins it and they remove all the middle class, small town, big city employees who for decades have been handling maintenance of the local sewage plant, all those jobs that the smaller people in smaller jobs do day to day to keep the economy going. And they put anc, their government loyalists in place who had no competence and who ended up stealing and breaking every one of our state owned enterprises, either bankrupt or stolen to death as of today. But in 2017, the ANC elected a new president because they had over 50% of the votes. President Cyril Ramaphosa, who everyone believed would save the country. He's been just as bad as Zuma. And he arrives tomorrow to meet President Donald Trump.

[B]

He arrives tomorrow to me.

[A]

President Ramaphosa.

[B]

Yeah, he said he was negotiating with the President.

[A]

So tomorrow might, if it's recorded tomorrow, might be in the past.

[B]

That's right, yeah. So, so now how do you feel about him versus Jacob Zuma?

[A]

Jacob Zuma was fundamentally evil and malevolent. He's like a populist clown, dangerous. And he's trying to come back into power and he'll be way, way, way more dangerous if he does. Cyril Ramaphosa is now head of the anc and he was a trade unionist. He was one of the first South African black billionaires. He has the McDonald's franchises in South Africa. He understands the mining industry. He's the kind of guy you would actually like having a meal with, like talking to. But he's like a pillow. He takes the shape of the last person that sat on him. He'll tell you what you want to hear, then he'll meet trade unionists, tell them they want to hear, and so on and so on.

[B]

Have you met him before?

[A]

I've met him, but I refused. He's trying to meet me.

[B]

I refuse to meet him, Zuma or the existing president.

[A]

I've spoken to Zuma and I've met Ramaphosa. They're both equally bad because what they've done over the last 14 years is institute racism. Anti white, anti colored, anti Indian racism, socialism. And their government has been kleptocratic and ineptocratic. So on one hand stealing, on the other hand, completely incompetent. They have de industrialized our country and we are growing at 1% economic growth and our population growth is 2%. What does that mean? We get poorer every year. The country is falling apart because of the anc.

[B]

Yeah, I'm looking at some data here Saying South Africa's GDP has stagnated, averaging 0.8% annually from 2012 to 2020. 2 Again. 2008, 2009. Jacob Zoua gets in compared to 4.8% the previous decade. 94 to. 04. Unemployment reached 33.5% in 2024 with youth unemployment at 61%.

[A]

Highest in the world. Highest in the world.

[B]

How?

[A]

By complete incompetence and malevolence. Evil. They're pushing anti white racism and socialism by the day. And let me give you the worst of it. We have a policy called Black Economic Empowerment. Bee. The reason Starlink isn't in South Africa yet is because the South African government said to Elon Musk, if you want to bring Starlink to South Africa, you've got to give 30% of your business to a black person. And we'll tell you who.

[B]

Who said this. Jacob Zuma.

[A]

Our government says this. It's a government policy.

[B]

So whatever business you're running, I'm doing $100 million a year. I built this thing myself. I have to give it to a black person. 30% of it. And they pick and choose who it is.

[A]

If you're dealing with. If you have any dealing with the government. If you have any dealing with the South African government.

[B]

So if I have a government contract and I'm doing business with them, 30% of the ownership of the company needs to go to a black person that.

[A]

They choose or that you choose that's acceptable to them.

[B]

Or that you choose that is acceptable to them.

[A]

But in most cases, Rob is a.

[B]

Black person in South Africa, let's just say. And you say no, Rob is not good. Then I say Humberto and Humberto's a black person. You say, I will approve that one. Yeah, that's how it works.

[A]

And they don't have to put any money up. You effectively have to fund it.

[B]

Is this a law?

[A]

It's a law.

[B]

It's like if he searches it, he'll find it.

[A]

Type in B E E or broad based Black Economic Empowerment. Bbbe. Have a look. South Africa. And it's getting worse. They're trying to institute a law of any private company of 50 or more employees has to have be whether you work with the government or not. So like a real estate agent. This is currently on the table. But I'll give you one worse law than this.

[B]

What's that?

[A]

You ready for these three words?

[B]

I do.

[A]

Tell me what this means to you. And it's been signed in January. Expropriation without compensation.

[B]

Unpack.

[A]

Would you invest in this country that says we can expropriate not just your land, not just your mines? The watch of your arm and your house without compensation. If it's in the public interest, what's.

[B]

The interest incentive for me?

[A]

Well, you'll never invest in South Africa with a law.

[B]

No. Why would I do that?

[A]

You wouldn't. Why would I invest anymore in South Africa? I won't. Foreign direct investment has dried up and our government, our moronic ANC government continues to institute. Donald Trump is angry with South Africa. I mean it's amazing we've even made his priority list because he calls South Africa DEI as a country. It is racist and socialist and destructive and everybody's suffering.

[B]

Now let me ask you to stay on this because there's this we can go into.

[A]

Getting me fired up here.

[B]

No, I love this because I'm looking at foreign direct. Rob, can you pull up foreign direct investment in South Africa? History of foreign direct investment in South Africa year over year. I want to take a look at this. Foreign direct investment in South Africa.

[A]

Did you find bee on that?

[B]

I'm going to go back to that as well. The one thing that I saw that in 2023 it was 96.5 billion, in 2022 was 151 billion. So. Dropped 50% in one year is what it is. What is foreign direct investment South Africa in 2024. FDI South Africa 2024.

[A]

I need a rob.

[B]

Rob is very good at what he does.

[A]

Has he acted in Game of Thrones, Lord of the Rings? You should give him a double headed ax and a white horse. I mean that's how I see him.

[B]

Okay, so Q1 for example FTR 24 billion and Q2 was 16 billion. Q3, did they show you what it is in 2024? I'm looking at the same thing you're looking at right now. Be curious to know what the numbers. So okay, sometimes we're talking about some flows of 7 and a half billion rand which is found in Q4 making a turnaround from $3.2 billion. Okay. Money's not coming in in 2024 and people are leaving. Yeah.

[A]

And the economy's half is growing at half the rate that population growth growing. We have the highest, one of the highest murder rates in the world, one of the highest rape rates in the world. And remember, most rapes aren't reported. So the reported rapes are one of the highest in the world. We have load shedding, which means you have intermittent electricity, sometimes six hours a day of no electricity. How do you run a country on that? And it's because the ANC has broken and stolen all of our state owned enterprises, they're destroying the country.

[B]

The ANC is. Okay, so Rob, can you type this in on Google? Type in BBE South Africa, 30%. Just type in 30%. There you go. Percentage. So if you zoom in a little bit, you're going to see what it says right there in South Africa. Broad based Black Economic empowerment framework. A 30% target is commonly used for black ownership in specific sectors for certain compliance requirements. This target is particularly prominent in sectors like telecommunication, broadcast and post. It also applies to large companies aiming. But does this mean. Go look. The ownership target is the one I'm looking at. In many cases, the 30% target refers to black equity ownership in a company. This means that at least 30% of the company's shares or equity must be held by Black individuals. The 30% target is often seen in sectors like telecommunication, broadcast. Okay, so they announced this. How many businesses had to give up 30%? Or is it just for startups?

[A]

No, it's most of the big corporates.

[B]

They went to the big corporates and you got to give 30% of it to one black person or a group.

[A]

Of black people or a SPV of black people.

[B]

What did that cause? People? And this is Jacob Zuma.

[A]

Well, it actually began even earlier and it was seen as an element of transformation of the economy. And all the corporates accepted it at that time. Like we've got to transform our economy, we've got to bring the broader black population in. But all they did was benefit 1000, 2000 elites. What would have been smarter would have been to give 30% of your business to your employees and empower them. And that never happened. So you've got these black billionaires. They're all listed if you want to hear their names. Cyril Ramaphosa is one of them who were handed billions of dollars on day one to just participate in these businesses. Have a look at him, what he owns. Cyril, Dreadful, dreadful. President Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this.

[B]

But anyone can get the same Premium.

[A]

Wireless for $15 a month.

[B]

I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have.

[A]

One of your assistant's assistants switch you.

[B]

To Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to do. @mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month Required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full [e-mail] this episode is Brought to you by Amazon Business.

[A]

How can you free up your team.

[B]

From time consuming office tasks? Amazon empowers leaders to not only streamline purchasing, but better support their teams so.

[A]

They can focus on strategy and growth.

[B]

Free up your teams and focus on your future. Learn more about the technology, insights and Support [e-mail] Just tapped in. Black billionaires in South Africa. Patrice.

[A]

And he's Cyril Ramaphaza's brother in law.

[B]

He is Cyril's brother in law and.

[A]

His mining company was our family mining company.

[B]

And they took it away or they bought it.

[A]

We sold it.

[B]

You sold it to him?

[A]

Yeah. And then in the mid-90s, we moved out of mining.

[B]

And who is he? Is he somebody that's respected? Patrice Motsepe.

[A]

I like him. To his credit, he was the first African to join the giving Pledge. Buffett's, you know, give away a third of your wealth when you die to charity. He was the first African to do it. To his credit, he's a nice, charming man, but he's Cyril's brother in law and he's never stood up like most South African corporates have never stood up against the anc.

[B]

Let's stay on Jacob Zuma a little bit. What is this story I hear about Jacob Zuma? Did he have an accusation of having AIDS and he raped someone? And then he says, he says, after I raped him, it was unprotected, but I showered, so I should be clean.

[A]

There's a cartoonist.

[B]

Is this a joke or is this.

[A]

No, it's real. There's a cartoonist in South Africa. Those did cartoons of Jacob Zuma with a shower head coming out of his head. These are the people running our country.

[B]

This guy right here. This one.

[A]

This guy. Yeah, there we go.

[B]

So he had. He raped someone and then he says, don't worry, she didn't. So he's got aids, he's got hiv.

[A]

Who knows? I mean, he seems pretty fit.

[B]

No, but what is the story about him having hiv? Is there a truth to it or.

[A]

No, that I don't know.

[B]

Can you zoom in and see what it says? So during the trial, Zuma admitted to having unprotected sex with his accuser, whom he knew to be. Oh, the accuser had HIV positive. Correct, but memorably claimed that he took a shower afterwards to reduce the risk of contracting hiv.

[A]

This is the level of intellect that we have running the country.

[B]

And all Bill Clinton did.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, was this like a cigar?

[B]

Bill Clinton, dude.

[A]

Yeah, I know. We've got. We've got Lunatics running the asylum. But here's the interesting thing. Until Donald J. Trump became president, no one said a thing. Europe and the uk. Pathetic. Soft diplomacy. Soft diplomacy does not work with these people. And you know, Obama and Biden, I mean, they'd never say boo to a black African president. But Donald Trump looks at it and says, this country's going down the plug. And if I can give a terrifying analogy, South Africa is Germany in the early 1930s. The white minority are being boiled like frogs. There's an economic genocide taking place with black economic empowerment, with expropriation without compensation, with the destruction of the economy. The potential potential hasn't begun yet. Disarming of the population.

[B]

Tell me more.

[A]

Donald J. Trump offered refugee status to white Afrikaner farmers and then he expanded it, I think in the last few days to mean any minorities in South Africa being persecuted. And the persecution is definitely in place economically and it's beginning culturally. Our government have flown over here to try and tell Donald Trump there is no genocide. Let me talk about farm murders in South Africa. Our commercial farming population is 30,000 farmers. The American commercial farming population is 3 million. It is three times more dangerous being a farmer in South Africa than a policeman and twice as dangerous being a policeman than an average citizen. Farm attacks are not only attack and then 30 to 40% are murders, but it's torture of the most horrific kind and rapes. Not just white farmers, but mainly white farmers. And the South African government police has done nothing to protect these farmers. Cyril Ramaphosa claims the problem doesn't exist. South Africa is a violent society, but how come so many farmers have been attacked, murdered, raped in South Africa? And if you extrapolate, if you take a pro rata number of South African farmers attacked and murdered and killed to the American population over the last 20 years, 233,000American farmers would have been murdered. And you don't think that's some form of genocide? It's horrific. So look at Germany in the 1930s. Look at what's happening in South Africa. No wonder so many people are leaving. No wonder Donald Trump has said they get refugee status.

[B]

Why do you think the reaction to the 58 refugee that was given being white? Why do you think the reaction has been the way that it's been with the media?

[A]

Because the left wing media want to see brown faces from Sudan escaping camps, ducking border guards. But the persecution is much the same. If you're a white South African, you're having 30 years of anti white racist laws being put in place. What future do you have? South African businesses are now being told who they can hire and who they can't fire. I had a senior politician three days ago say it is immoral that 98% of top executives are white. I went, no, it's not 98%, it's 62%. Because I had a rob in the audience, I said, google it. He went 62%. But they're already starting to say the racial breakdown of South Africa needs to equate to the corporate breakdown, to the everything else breakdown. 7% of the population are white. So we only have 7% of the corporates being white. It's racist, it's destructive, and our economy is falling apart.

[B]

7% of the population is white.

[A]

And it used to be 20.

[B]

When was it 20%?

[A]

In 1980s.

[B]

So in the 80s it was 20%. So you've lost 2/3?

[A]

Well, firstly, the white population is not growing because a million people have left in the last 20 years. A million. The two richest people in Los Angeles are South African number one and number two, Elon Musk. Patrick Soon Chong owns the Lakers. There are, I think, $22 billionaires born in South Africa, living in America and 35 internationally. And they're not living in South Africa. So there's been a mass exodus of people. And the black population is obviously having more babies than the white population. And of the 60 million population, I'd say about 8 million are illegal immigrants. We're from Zambia, Zimbabwe, Congo, Malawi. 8 million of 60 million.

[B]

60 million illegal.

[A]

We have no borders anymore.

[B]

So how well is the economy doing? Where? What is causing these other business owners that are still there to want to stay there?

[A]

A lot can't leave. I was on a plane flying over to D.C. yesterday with a South African, must have been 40 years old, and he said he'd left the country because he thought he'd sold his cosmetics business. But the deal never went through, so he's had to go back to South Africa re engage to try and keep building his business under terrible circumstances or try and sell it, which he can't do because no one's buying anything. So a lot of South Africans can't leave. They're not wealthy enough, they don't have the opportunity and they don't have another passport.

[B]

But the brain drain is happening. You're saying since 1980s, the population, white population, went from 20 to 7%. A million have left. When I look at the current farms in South Africa, I saw number 62% are owned by the 7%.

[A]

Not true.

[B]

What's the percentage, okay?

[A]

So these numbers have been thrown around by the left of the arable land in South Africa. If you take the total land area, it's higher than 50%. But the Western and Northern Cape is mostly desert, so you have massive land holdings. But if you look at arable land, 20% is owned by white farmers, 20%.

[B]

Is owned by white Farmers.

[A]

You have 7% of the population.

[B]

So the other 80% is owned by non whites. Non whites, whatever it could be.

[A]

Yeah, mostly black farmers. But the government, when they bought the land or it was transferred to the black owners, the government has not given most of them the title deeds. If that isn't communism in motion. Subtle, evil, malevolent communism.

[B]

Give me your land. I'm gonna give it to this black family. But I hang on to it. I don't even give it to them. I let them live there, but I control it.

[A]

I still, the government, have the title deed, okay? And nobody's raising that. Nobody's talking about it.

[B]

Nowadays, more than ever, the brand you wear reflects and represent who you are. So for us, if you wear a Future looks bright hat or a valuetainment gear, you're telling the world, I'm optimistic, I'm excited about what's going to be happening. But you're a free thinker. You question things, you like, debate. And by the way, last year, 120,000 people got a piece of Future Looks Bright geared with valuetainment. We have so many new things. The cufflinks are here. New Future looks Bright. This is my favorite, the green one. Just yesterday, somebody placed an order for a hundred of these. If you watch the PBD podcast, you got a bunch to choose from. White ones, black ones. If you, if you, if you smoke cigars and you come to our cigar lounge, we have this high quality lighter cutter and a holder for the cigars. We got sweaters with the valuetainment logo on it, we got mugs, we got a bunch of different things. But if you believe the future looks bright, if you follow our content and what we represent with valuetainment with PVD podcast, go to vtmerch.com and by the way, if you order right now, there's going to be a special VT gift insight just for you. So again, go to vtmerch.com, place your order, tell the world that you believe the future looks bright. Can you go back to the history of it, even prior to apartheid? Okay, go.

[A]

Previous to that, 1652.

[B]

Okay, give me any history there. And you know, others come taking advantage.

[A]

Of resources Mayflower 1620.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Okay. I checked when I came in here because I thought. Hang on. So Mayflower, 1620.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

The first settlers, Dutch settlers in the Cape, 1650.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

When they got to the Cape, there were no black tribes. None in the Western Cape, all the way up to this place called the Fish River, 600 km away. The Black tribes had migrated down over a thousand years from Eastern Africa into South Africa. So they're settlers too. If they call us settlers, they're settlers. And they met and there was peace. Working together and fighting. The usual story, fast forward. The British then arrive in 1820. And then the late 1800s, gold is discovered and everyone piles in. And then the British have their first. Sorry, they have the Zulu wars, then we've been fighting all our career. Then they have the first Boer War, English Afrikaner, and then the second Boer War, English Afrikananer. And in 1910, South Africa, which was made up of a whole lot of different republics and provinces, was formed into this union of South Africa. So South Africa as a country is only 114 years old. It's new, but it's big. It's twice the size of France. It's a very big country. And the Western Cape has nothing in common with KwaZulu. Natal has nothing in common with the North Pamlonga. There are 26 different languages. The white tribe is made up of the Afrikaners of Dutch and German origin, but they really are white Africans. And the Anglos like myself, also more English heritage. So they're two different white tribes. Then there's the coloreds who are mix of white and black. The Indians, Indian South Africans, and then the blacks and the black population of South Africa. I think they're 20 something tribes. Zulu, Ghosa, Sotho, Venda, Suwane, all in different areas. It's a patchwork of individual communities. And therein lies the solution. I'll get to it quickly. We have to decentralize. We have to create autonomous regions, autonomous areas based around culture and ethnicity and take decision making from the top and urgently push it down. That's my solution. We can speak to that later. So we then had the First World War where South Africa fought with the British and allies. Second World War where we fought with America and the UK. My father was South African Air Force, the Second World War. He's 99 this year.

[B]

You were saying that. That's unbelievable.

[A]

Sharp as attack. You'll be watching this and saying, weldon, Robbie didn't swear. And then we get to 1948.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And in 1948, the Afrikaner National Party gets elected. And from 1948 to 1960, they begin the process of apartheid. And what apartheid the word stands for is separateness. You translated directly apartheid separateness. And the intention was to have people develop separately so that the black South Africans would have their areas, the whites theirs. But, you know, it did migrate into something that was patently unfair. You know, more money was spent on white kids and black kids. You know, white people got the better areas there. Black people had to carry passes. Apartheid became dysfunctional and evil in its latter stages. And in 1985, no one knows this, FW de Klerk and the Afrikaners in power decided internally apartheid was unsustainable. And between then and 1994, they put a process in place to remove apartheid. And he was a Nobel Prize winner, and he worked with Mandela to create a great constitution and a peaceful transition of power.

[B]

In your opinion today, Mandela good guy or bad guy?

[A]

Good guy in a very bad party. Because the ANC always had as its original tenant a national democratic revolution. They're all trained by the Russians. They all believe in socialism or communism. Mandela managed to sit on top of that and say, I see a better way forward. But the ANC always had its evil within it, which is manifesting now.

[B]

Is it almost like they were waiting for Mandela to die and get out the way so they can do it the way they always wanted to do it?

[A]

Correct. People always go, where's the brain trust of the anc? I said, well, there's not much brain and there is no trust, but there's this fundamental Soviet trained philosophy that is manifesting itself and it's a very slow burn, like cultural Marxism in the West. You know, it took time that captured our universities here. They captured the left, they captured cnn, msnbc. They do it over time and slowly, but it's a policy and it's showing its face now in South Africa. But Donald Trump has noticed.

[B]

Yeah. So, you know, when I'm looking at South Africa and you're going through the history and you're looking at all this stuff and you have different papers that come up, so you'll read this one paper that says, well, you know, South Africa is a great place for resources, natural resources, go there. Mine make your money great. But outside of that, for capitalism and commerce and building and ports and import and all that stuff, it's complicated. It's not built in the most best way.

[A]

In 1994 it was. We had some of the best ports, best airports, best railway system. We had More rail lines in South Africa than the rest of Africa put together. We were number one or number two gold producer in the world.

[B]

That's known all of.

[A]

We're now number 22nd.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

The ANC has chased away so much foreign direct investment. It's. I don't know how you can be that stupid, but they are.

[B]

And I think that's a very good measure to see how the administration is doing to attract people and. Because right now, if we look at FDI with us, what do you notice? 1.4 trillion.

[A]

And that was last week.

[B]

Then you got. Yeah, exactly 1 trillion. Then you got 600 billion from MBS, from Saudi. You got. Apple is saying a half a trillion dollars. So all this, all this money, of course, Apple is here, but all these other countries are saying, I want to go and invest in the US that is the biggest compliment to say, I want to do business here. The complete opposite is taking place in South Africa.

[A]

Everyone's pulling out. Shell just announced they're pulling out. Exxon's pulled out. And they find it just too hard. South Africa's over regulated. They've got racist laws. I don't know how anyone actually keeps doing business in South Africa.

[B]

I want to ask you about the president, but before I do so, I want to give you some fun facts that I pulled up. So one. The only country in the world that has three capitals. Is that true? That's what I say. So Pretoria, Executive, Cape town Legislative, and Blo. Fontaine Judicial.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Then you have. It has 11 languages. You said it's 26, but it says it's got 11 languages. Okay.

[A]

Okay. I think it's more than. Yeah, let's go.

[B]

Is it?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay, so that's the languages. How many languages South Africa have. Can you pull it up? How many languages does south africa. It says 12. Okay, so 12.

[A]

12 official.

[B]

12 official.

[A]

Lots more.

[B]

Oh, got it. And recognizes at least 35 in total. Got it.

[A]

Okay, so my 26 is kind of.

[B]

You're there. So maybe, maybe slang will be the 36.

[A]

Rob. Putting me under pressure.

[B]

So first, this is a crazy one. And I want you to speak on this one here. First. Is it true that it's the first country to voluntarily dismantle nuclear weapons in the early 90s? Why? And who agreed to that?

[A]

It was a discussion between the Africana government and Mandela. You know, when. In the 70s, when I was at school, Africa was turning hardcore. You know, colonies were leaving, but it was turning hardcore Soviet. You know, the Cubans and the Russians were in Angola. The threat was moving south. Rhodesia was the last bastion of kind of, you know, the old world. And they fought on their own for a long time and then they felt they went and South Africa was left. And our government said, we're up against it. We need nuclear weapons. In 1972, there was a power, a nuclear power plant built 40 minutes drive from Cape Town. Kuburg Power Plant in 1972, still fully operational till today. I drove past it last week. Fully operational. South Africa was the first country to do a heart transplant. I mean, South Africa's done it punches, has punched so far above its weight in history, if you look at the statesmen, the tech developments, the people it's.

[B]

Produced, the only country that's held the World cup in cricket, rugby and soccer, we haven't had.

[A]

We've held it in our country. We haven't held the cup.

[B]

No, no, not the cup. Holding it in your country.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

I mean, and those three sports, I mean, you pretty much get 90% of the world.

[A]

South Africa used to be a world leader in a whole lot of areas. And that's not the case anymore.

[B]

Okay. You don't put that on Mandela. You put it on Zuma.

[A]

I put it on Zuma. And Ramaphosa. Ramaphosa and the ANC itself.

[B]

Okay, so Ramaphosa was talking about Elon Musk the other day. I don't know if you've seen this clip or not. Have you seen it?

[A]

No.

[B]

Okay, Rob, can you pull up this clip? Here's Ramasoma talking about, is it the Starlink one or this is the one right here. Go ahead and play this clip, Rob. Go for it. Having to do with starting. So I know about it and have even. Yes, I know about it. Do you like Elon Musk? Let me say to you, I have had. Elon Musk is South African, born American. Now. I have had discussions with him and have said, elon, you become so successful and you are investing in a variety of countries, I want you to come home and invest here. So he and I are going to have a further discussion about a variety of things. Whatever one may think about him, he is a hugely successful businessperson. And having had those discussions with him to advance the interest of South Africans and he runs widespread businesses and in many ways, he's already invested in South Africa through his X online process, which.

[A]

Used to be Twitter.

[B]

So he's already present in our lives as South Africans. So I will be taking further discussions about what's the likelihood of that.00.

[A]

Elon Musk and Donald J. Trump know that it is absolutely pointless investing in South Africa. All you're doing is rewarding the ANC for their socialist and racist policies. The three fundamental bases need to be tomorrow need to be we will not do trade with you, we will not help you. In fact we're going to punish you unless you repeal black economic empowerment laws, expropriation without compensation and you withdraw the Iran funded ICJ case against Israel. Iran funded the ancient to put that case against Israel. Iran funded Iran funded the anc. They sent money to the ANC and part of that money allowed the ANC on behalf of Iran to file the ICJ genocide case against Israel.

[B]

And this is when so the acronym IGCA refers to the International Court of Justice South Africa against Israel formally titled Application of the Convention of the Prevention and Punishment of Crime Genocide in Gaza. Here's a breakdown of the key aspects of it Allegations South Africa accuses Israel of committing genocide against Palestinians in Gaza, violating the 1948 Genocide Convention. The application points to actions like killing Palestinians, causing serious harm, deliberately creating conditions to destroy the group and preventing words.

[A]

Why would South Africa, of all the countries in the world out of the blue accuse Israel of genocide through icj?

[B]

Are they the first one that did it?

[A]

They're the only ones that did it. And you know why they did it? Iran paid them to do it. Just type in Iran funding ICJ case.

[B]

See yes it says Iran did fund support. The US government knows the National Congress during the anti apartheid struggle, particularly in the 80s, although the support was relatively limited compared to other international backers like the Soviet Union, Cuban, Scandinavian countries. But it did. After 1977 Islamic Revolution, Iran began supporting liberation movements that opposed Western backed regimes. Of course. And the Yank fighting apartheid and white minority rule in South Africa fit this narrative. Interesting.

[A]

Do you know South Africa is one of the top 10 countries in the world that votes against America in all UN resolutions. South Africa pokes America in the eye, allies with Russia, China and Iran, openly supports Hamas, files a case against Israel through the icj, creates racist and socialist laws at home to persecute white, Indian and colored minorities and for 20 years the pathetic European UK have said nothing. And America's never had a foreign policy in Africa until Donald J. Trump arrived in January this year and he knows exactly what's going on and he's had enough. He is not sending any more money to South Africa and he's going to punish South Africa, hopefully individuals, not the country for this anti American and anti Semitic and anti white policies.

[B]

And how do you Think he's going to react to it? Cyril, how do you think he's going to react to it?

[A]

He's a sock puppet. Okay. Cyril is a jellyfish with no spine. He, he's charming, he comes across well. And that's why he fools a lot of the big South African corporates. And I'm not going to name one of the big ones he's taken in by Cyril. And he's I think flying to Washington today to be with Cyril to meet Donald Trump. Cyril is intention is to explain to Donald Trump and the administration the reality of South Africa. But Donald Trump, Elon Musk and the administration are no fools. They know exactly what's going on. So I am hoping Cyril Ramaphosa gets The Zelensky times 10 treatment. I'm hoping. But I think Marco Rubio is the one who's going to do it.

[B]

Why?

[A]

Because I think Donald Trump wants to keep his position open to see how it goes. But Marco Rubio is going to read the riot act to the delegation that's flown over. And so he should. America should say to South Africa, we are not going to help in any way. In fact, we're going to punish you unless you immediately do those three things that I mentioned. Remove EWC, expropriation without compensation, repeal black empowerment laws, get rid of them. And American companies should refuse to obey them and withdraw the case from the icj. You do those three things, we can.

[B]

Talk likelihood of that happening because those are big, big asks.

[A]

But they, I mean I think it's 50, 60% if you go to Polymarket.

[B]

And ask and if they don't, I.

[A]

Think America should kick them back to say leave, go, go home. And then I'm putting myself at risk here, by the way. And then America should. And they've already done it. Ronny Jackson, Congressman Ronny Jackson has already put a bill that's going to Congress about punishing individual South Africans using Magnitsky sdn. Just do Ronny Jackson here. There he is. And Ronny Jackson South African bill or something.

[B]

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[A]

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[A]

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[A]

There we go. There we go.

[B]

This was a month ago. South Africa has brazenly abandoned its relationship with the United States to align with China, Russia, Iran and terrorist organizations. A betrayal that demands serious consequences. The legislation ensures we conduct a comprehensive review of the supposed ally while also holding accountable any corrupt officials. The Arab governments undermining American interest without repercussions. Ends now. Interesting.

[A]

Okay, so that's moving forward.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So Ramaphosa knows this is underway. He's on the list. He needs to kiss the ring. He needs to give up on these racist and socialist policies and start to put South Africa first and not the anc.

[B]

Who does he fear more? Trump or Zuma?

[A]

That's a very, very good question. This is a very good question. In May 2024, the first election in 30 years, the ANC got less than 50%. They've been ruling with impunity since then.

[B]

Who got who?

[A]

They got 41%. They collapsed. 41%. They and the Democratic alliance, which is the Center Party, the Capitalist Free Market Pro West Party, formed a government and National Unity. Gnu. Gnu. But then they added a whole lot of other smaller parties. And that's our current government. Under the guise of the gnu, the ANC is still pushing forward its racist and socialist policies. So your question has hit the nail on the head. How do we take this forward without punishing South Africa, but by only punishing the people who are responsible for the 30 years of destruction. That's the key. This is a real finesse by America.

[B]

Yeah. So this is the challenge I see last night. I'm watching Godfather 2.

[A]

How many times?

[B]

I can't even tell you. It's not about me. So I'm watching Godfather 2. You know what scene it is where Vito Corleone, his dad, gets killed by the boss in Italy. Then Veto finds out who the son is, oldest son kills the son. Then the mom decides to plea and go plead to him and go and say, please don't kill my youngest son. And she says, he's not that smart. He's not that this. Let him work for you. He won't do anything. Please forgive him. Let him live his life. All this stuff, he's thinking about it for a couple minutes, and he says, nope, I can't do that. Then she takes a knife out to try to kill him, and then they shoot her. She dies right in front of Vito Corleone. Vito runs off and they try to go get him with a shotgun. They don't. Eventually, he comes to the States and obviously he becomes the Godfather, Becomes Veto Corleone in the movie Godfather. Right. And can you get vengeance out of him? I don't know. Can you get vengeance out of his heart to forget the family or anybody related to the family that killed the father, killed the mother, and killed his brother? Can you do that? In South Africa, when you go and look at the story and you go all the way back and now, you know the animosity, the level of animosity that's there. Right. It's also similar to some parts of Middle East. I'm from Iran. I lived there 11 years. This is my question for you. How do you. How do you manage the animosities while still moving forward? Go ahead and tell the guy. I know those guys killed your dad and your mom and they raped your sister. But guess what? You got to move on. How do you.

[A]

South Africa.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Another first. In 1994, South Africa created the Truth and Reconciliation Committee. And the Truth and Reconciliation Committee was created that if you were. If you did something under apartheid, if you were a police officer that killed someone in prison or you beat someone to death on a farm, you had one opportunity to tell the truth in court, in front of the families, and admit to what you did, and you would be forgiven. But you had to tell the truth and all the truth. And it was the only way to lift the bloodletting that had taken place and the horror and the anger. And in many cases, people reconciled and they hugged the families and they were forgiven. Yes.

[B]

And who came? Is this what Mandela came up with?

[A]

Well, it was a combination of Mandela and de Clerk. It was a unity, rainbow, coalition government. In Rwanda in 1994, same year, funnily enough.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

For three months, the two tribes created by the Belgians, by the way, these are non existent tribes, Hutus and Tutsis. Basically, hutus killed Tutsis 10,000 people a day while the United nations did nothing. President Paul Kagame who's president today? A Rwandan invaded his own country from Uganda, stopped the bloodshed, took over the control of the country, and he's still president today. He got everybody in the same way. Every village and every town got together and a murderer had to admit to the family that he murdered your brother and your sister and your cousin. And for a year, for a year, they had to wear a pink overall and do jobs like cleaning and building and things like that. One year, you as a killer who admitted your crimes would be forgiven. You spend a year in a pink.

[B]

Is that to allow the other family to see that there's a little bit of retaliation and a price being paid?

[A]

Right. And how do you prosecute 50% of a country? You're finished. You have to find a way to move on. South Africa did, Rwanda did. It's terrible. But still today, still today, there are people in South Africa that could say you benefited under apartheid. You. There's still a lot of underlying.

[B]

Oh, for sure. I'm looking at this right now. Testimonies. Over 21,000 victims provided statements with approximately 2,000 hearings and public hearings. Amnesty applications. Out of 7,111 applications, 849 were granted amnesty. Final report. The TRC released its comprehensive report in 1998 with supplemented volumes in O3 on what happened.

[A]

That is.

[B]

That is big. Very big.

[A]

I mean, very good to do that. It's extraordinary.

[B]

That is extraordinary. And I think you need something like that to get over, you know, when you have somebody like two brothers, you know, one of the brothers dates the other, the other's girlfriend, and they don't talk to each other for five years, they want to kill each other. What do you do as a father? You have to come in and try to find a way to bring them together. It's not easy to do, but this is times, this betrayal is even higher than that to get it out. So now President Trump, he's in the Middle east, he's doing what he's doing with uae, you know, Qatar, Saudi meets with the president of Syria and Saudi and trying to tell Khamenei, hey, let's negotiate. Khamenei says, death upon America, I will never trust you. And he's saying what he's saying. He is the second term, the way he's playing the second role. He's trying to be the PeaceMaker, has a two hour call with Putin and Ukraine, you know, has these meetings that he's having with everybody. You think this approach tomorrow is going to be a public one where the world's going to be watching. You think cameras are going to be on or things going to be a private meeting?

[A]

No, public. For sure, public.

[B]

And same way, try to put him in his place.

[A]

He's got to.

[B]

And Elon will be there as well. Because Elon's tied to South Africa.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Do you think Elon will be saying anything tomorrow? It'll be him and Marco Rubio speaking most of the time. And Marco, you don't think Musk will say anything?

[A]

Not much.

[B]

Why do you think I don't think.

[A]

Musk believes South Africa stands a chance? A friend of mine asked him three months ago in a private moment, elon, do you still believe in South Africa? Do you still think there's hope? And Elon, kind of. He gets thoughtful. He think he said three words. Demographics don't lie. The voting population, democracy is grinding forward in a glacial pace. But our economy won't survive. And with 60% youth unemployment, you'd expect civil unrest, wouldn't you, at some point? It's a tinderbox.

[B]

Or an exodus.

[A]

Well, the exodus is already happening.

[B]

Yeah. Million.

[A]

And I'm a lucky guy. I can be the last chopper out of Saigon. Talk about helicopter. Of course. Yeah. Where's Anderson Fox? I've been a helicopter pilot on a movie.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

So I can be the last guy out. But most South Africans, you know, black, white, colored, Indian, whatever.

[B]

You're not afraid of going back? Living there for two to three years.

[A]

I'm never gonna leave. My wife's from New Zealand. And New Zealand. Have you watched Lord of the Rings?

[B]

Of course.

[A]

So you know the story. So the Lord New Zealand is the hobbits. They have no neighbors, they have no threats, they have no pollution, they have nothing. It's like it's the most happy, sensible, boring country on the planet.

[B]

They got the all Blacks, though.

[A]

They got the old blacks. Respect.

[B]

Respect, yeah.

[A]

And they're the hobbits. We live in Mordor. We're on the edge of Mordor, where we are. I mean, every day, anything can happen.

[B]

So you're not worried about going back, living there for two?

[A]

So my wife said to me, four years ago, my New Zealand wife, we'd only been back two years, and she was reading something and she looked at me and she said, can I swear?

[B]

Sure.

[A]

She said, I fucking love this place.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

It's worth fighting for.

[B]

Get out of here.

[A]

And I said, okay, then I will.

[B]

Why does she love the place?

[A]

South Africa. You gotta come. It is magical. It's got all the madness, all the craziest Stupidest, worst things on the planet. And it's got the most beautiful, magical. It's the most incredible country. I can't get it under my skin. And all the million South Africans that have left badmouth South Africa because it's the only way they can justify leaving. Everybody misses that country. It is just magical.

[B]

Did you hear about Cyril calling the people that love cowards?

[A]

I know. He's the coward. How dare he?

[B]

Well, he called everybody that left a coward.

[A]

He is disgusting and a disgrace for doing that.

[B]

You didn't see this clip.

[A]

I did. It made me so angry.

[B]

Rob, can you pull up that clip where he's calling anybody that left the country a coward?

[A]

He's the coward because he does nothing about South African suffering. Go back to that meme. Go to that meme. Cowardice parlor parlor. Corruption. Economic parlor parlor. Cyril Ramaphosa was found with millions of dollars he hidden in his sofa and it's unaccounted for. I would not be surprised if that came from Iran. This our president. Corruption, poverty.

[B]

Yeah, he called everybody. He's a coward. Rob, can you see if it's the clip I sent you? There's a clip of him calling South Africans who leave.

[A]

I believe this is it at the npo. Agricultural.

[B]

You're a coward, and that's a real cowardly act.

[A]

You want to be angry? This gets me angry. He's the coward.

[B]

Why is he the coward?

[A]

He doesn't solve any of the problems in South Africa that are easy to fix. He lets the farmers hang out to dry, get murdered, get raped, get tortured. He lets our economy fall apart. He lets 60% unemployment take place. He doesn't face up to what's going on and he doesn't deal with the issues. He's the coward. And if people are being persecuted or have no economic opportunity, how can you call them cowards for going to another country to try and improve their lives?

[B]

Okay, so are you feisty here? Are you familiar with Thomas Soul?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Extraordinary man. Extraordinary libertarian.

[B]

Libertarian, yeah. He was good friends with Milton Friedman. That whole.

[A]

I'd love to meet him.

[B]

I'd love to meet him as well. Trust me, I'd love to meet him as well. He's somebody that's a brilliant mind. I think he's in his mid-90s and he's still sharp as hell.

[A]

Sharp.

[B]

He said, talk about South Africa in one of his books. And he said, is South Africa a management problem or a geography problem? Can you pull up South Africa map.

[A]

Just to see what's great?

[B]

Question is South Africa. Does South Africa have a geography problem or a management problem? Because zoom out a little bit so we can see where South Africa is. Keep zooming out. Zoom out, zoom out, zoom out, zoom out. Okay. Obviously got nothing south.

[A]

You know, airplanes fly down and then they turn around and fly back. It's like New Zealand.

[B]

Yeah. So I mean, that. That location right there is just looking at that, you. You're a long ways from everybody. Okay. It's like living on a cul de sac, which in a way, it could be good.

[A]

That's my home.

[B]

Yeah, I understand that. Well, what do you think the problem is? You think Thomas Soul is right? Because Thomas Soul is saying that, you know, you may have a location problem, you may have a geography problem. What do you think?

[A]

Look, it's fixable. This economy. I could give me 100 days as a benevolent dictator.

[B]

I can turn this country as a benevolent dictator.

[A]

Well, you've got to do it because you've got to make some tough decisions.

[B]

What would be the tough decisions you'd make?

[A]

I'd privatize all the state owned enterprises, okay? Sell them off because they are just a feeding trough for corruption. I would deregulate. I'd bring in a doge as quickly as possible. We have 32 ministers in the cabinet. 32. Norway has 18, Argentina has nine. We have a ministry for women. What does that person do? It's ridiculous. And all the ministers have a deputy minister. There are 34 deputy ministers. So we have 76 ministers that all have blue light brigades. Security, flying business in first class. The waste is. We have 1.4 million state employees. The waste is off the charts. It's fixable. You just cut the cost. Hive off divisions like any turnaround situation in a business that you've had to deal with. You know, go to the debt holders and say you're not paying interest for three years. Go to the equity holders and say you got 5 cents on the dollar, pal. Take it or leave it. You cut out management, you cut costs, you hive off divisions that aren't working. You can only do that if you're a benevolent dictator and you do it quickly. You close the borders, you kick out illegal foreigners, you do what Trump's done. But we're in much more tragic situation.

[B]

You have any plans of running? You have any plans of doing politics? No, no plans of running.

[A]

I'm 65 this year.

[B]

The president's 79 years old. The previous guy behind, 82 years old.

[A]

Patrick, don't do this to me.

[B]

No, but do you have any interest like if the opportunity arose, would you entertain it?

[A]

No. Here's the problem. Do you have adult ADHD as an individual?

[B]

I have a lot of issues.

[A]

I have a lot of issues, too.

[B]

Maybe one of them.

[A]

Yes, One of them is I can't sit still for half an hour.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

In a meeting with people who haven't done their homework or I know what they're going to say and I finish their sentences. Can you imagine being in a cabinet with half of the people are stupid, haven't done their homework. Some still believe in comedy.

[B]

What do you think Trump is doing?

[A]

Yeah, but he's got very good people around him. And look at Marco Rubio.

[B]

You can't find good people using South Africa. This magical place doesn't have good people.

[A]

No, it has. I know, but I'd have to replace the whole cabinet. You'd have to give me complete power to get it.

[B]

What did Trump do? He did it as well.

[A]

He can.

[B]

We can't.

[A]

We'd have to change the system. No. The answer is no. I'm happy doing what I'm doing.

[B]

Don't forget what Katie said to you.

[A]

She doesn't want me in politics.

[B]

Katie said I love this place.

[A]

True.

[B]

All right, so maybe do it for her. Hey, for Katie. Come on, Katie.

[A]

So does it have a geography problem? It does.

[B]

And if you keep going south, you're screwed.

[A]

Well, I went to the Antarctic for dinner in December.

[B]

Are you being sarcastic?

[A]

No. We flew down.

[B]

What was it like?

[A]

Unbelievable. Six hour flight from Cape Town.

[B]

What's everything you ate frozen? Like, Is it just frozen?

[A]

No, they had a six star meal for us. We slept in cabins, very comfortable and had. I recommend it. But really, one night?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Six hour flight.

[B]

Were you swimming outside in the pool?

[A]

No. No.

[B]

Were you tanning? Like laying out?

[A]

But it was sun, the whole, you know, sun.

[B]

24 hours here. How long did you guys stay?

[A]

We flew in midday and flew out the next morning.

[B]

How bad was turbulence?

[A]

None.

[B]

Seriously.

[A]

And we landed what's called deep field. So we didn't land on the edge with all the penguins.

[B]

Are.

[A]

We went deep field.

[B]

How many people live there?

[A]

There are. I can give you the stats, like 4,500. No, the American base alone, which is McMurdo, which you get to from Australia, New Zealand, that has about 4,000 people 12 months a year. That's the biggest base in the antarctic, I think. 12 countries. You can check the stats, Rob. Here we go. McMurdo. I think that 12 countries are part of the Antarctic 1500 Residents Association.

[B]

The station is the Largest community in Antarctica, capable of supporting up to 1500 residents.

[A]

I'm getting some of my stats right, but there are three places to visit Antarctica. The one is from McMurdo, which is very difficult to get to. The other's from Cape Town, and I think there are 500 visitors a year. And then the other ones from South America, and I think they're 250,000 visitors that go into cruise ships. So we went deep field. It was unbelievable. But it's like a white desert. Everywhere you look, there are no features. It's just.

[B]

Do you have any opinions on Antarctica or. No. A lot of people have been interested in that market.

[A]

24 hours was about right.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So that's what I figured you were going to say, 24 hours about right. Did your. Your family. Did you guys.

[A]

I took our kids, little kids, 10 and 13 years old.

[B]

What did they say?

[A]

They said, are we the first 10 and 13 year olds ever to feed, darling. We found out some kids had actually been. Before them being born.

[B]

There was a freezing cold.

[A]

No.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

All right.

[B]

Growing up South Africa, you hear things about Earl Musk and minds and all that stuff. Was he famous? Was. Did your family have a relationship with him or.

[A]

No, no, but Elon Musk's dad, Errol Musk, worked at our mining business.

[B]

Get out of here.

[A]

I only found that out four months ago when I met El Musk. He said, I worked for your father's mining business.

[B]

But you didn't know him. You just.

[A]

I only met him four months ago.

[B]

Got it.

[A]

Errol, his dad.

[B]

How old was. Unluck.

[A]

How old was.

[B]

What was that like, growing up in South Africa? No, what was he like?

[A]

Errol's. He's. He's got a crazy angle to him. He'll say stuff you and I would never dare to say. Never dare to say. He really tells it like it is. He's a bit of a loose cannon when it comes to opinions.

[B]

Yeah, he's, you know.

[A]

Well, he's a nice guy. He's a fun guy. He's not stupid. He's a smart guy, but he's. He'll shoot from the hip.

[B]

Yeah, well, I mean, the. Maybe the trolling gene comes from Pops because Musk knows how to troll like no other.

[A]

It's amazing how he thinks, you know.

[B]

Trump, Elon or Errol.

[A]

Well, Trump weaves. He'll start here.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then he'll go completely off pissed, and I'll go, oh, no, he's got to answer the question, please. And he winds his way back and answers the question. Elon goes deep, thinking he's gifted.

[B]

Yeah, he's gifted. So I got a couple other questions for you before we wrap up here. So what. What could you say about. Is this the one we have not come from? Now?

[A]

There he is.

[B]

Yeah, he's the one. But what can you say about this? Rob, can you play this clip? So the EFF leader in South Africa.

[A]

Let's talk about that.

[B]

Yeah, can you tell me a little bit more about him? So here's a clip, Rob, if you can play this. So before we play it, what can you tell us about him?

[A]

Julius Malema is a dangerous, very dangerous populist. The hope you're going to show the clip where he has a hundred thousand people in a stadium jumping up and down saying, kill the Boer and we need to cut the throat of whiteness. These are the things Jesus, he is saying publicly. Here we go.

[B]

What's he saying?

[A]

Shoot to kill, to kill.

[B]

Kill the poor.

[A]

Kill the poor. Kill the farmer.

[B]

Kill the poor, the farmer.

[A]

Nice country. And you think white people aren't feeling persecuted when a man like this with 100,000 people in a stadium says, kill the boa. One farmer, one bullet we must slit. We will slit the throat of whiteness. Not yet. He says these things publicly.

[B]

He's got 4.4 million followers on Twitter.

[A]

And he was taken to the hate speech court and it was turned down. Turned down. So that's eff, the Economic Freedom Fighters. Nothing about economic or freedom in that life. But the next party is Jacob Zuma's party called mk, the Spear of the Nation.

[B]

I want to see this clip here. I don't know what's going to happen in the future. I'm saying to you, we've not called for the killing of white people, at least for now. I can't guarantee the future.

[A]

Yeah, but I mean, you'd understand somebody watching that, especially as it gets shared on Twitter.

[B]

They freak out.

[A]

It sounds like a genocidal.

[B]

Crybabies, cry babies.

[A]

I'm not calling for the slaughter of white people, at least for now.

[B]

I can't give you a guarantee of the future, Especially when things are going the way they are.

[A]

Subtext.

[B]

Especially things. If things are going the way they are, there will be a revolution in this country. I can tell you now, I don't know what's going to happen. How influential is he?

[A]

He will never get more than 10% of the vote because the vast majority of South Africans. 88% of South Africans are Christians, are conservative, are very. Move slowly. Are Deserting the anc. But it's taking time because this was the liberation group. But they're moving economies. The voters are not stupid. They know he's dangerous, they know he's a threat to the economy. They don't want him in. But he's still got up to 10% of the vote.

[B]

10% is a lot, a lot. I mean, Bobby Kennedy only had 7%, you know, 7.2%. I don't know what the number was. But 10% is a big influence.

[A]

And listen to what he's saying.

[B]

Yeah, not for now, I don't know in the future. But I can promise you for now.

[A]

But have a quick look at this political party.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

MK just put in MK and Zuma. They've got 15%. And this is Zuma who destroyed the country and now he wants to be president again. These guys, they're much more of a threat. This is much more of a threat. And you asked me a question. Is Cyril brave enough to accept the terms, three terms that Trump should ask of him? The answer is this is what he fears. And our new GNU coalition party that was pulled together by the ANC Democratic alliance and the others has about 60% of the vote. Their main priority is to keep Zuma out and it seems to be their only priority because they're not talking about economic growth, safety and security service delivery. They are trying to keep him out.

[B]

How is Zuma's relationship with Malema?

[A]

They hate each other.

[B]

Oh, they do?

[A]

Fortunately.

[B]

How is Zuma's relationship with Cyril?

[A]

They hate each other.

[B]

How is Cyril's relationship with Malema?

[A]

They hate each other.

[B]

So all three hate each other?

[A]

Yes. Thank goodness.

[B]

Have they ever been in the same room together?

[A]

Oh yeah. Malema was head of the ANC Youth League. Zuma was head of the anc. They've each got their own political party.

[B]

They left, so they became different factions. Different factions knew or joined a different group?

[A]

No. Julius Malema left 15 years ago and set up the EFF. Jacob Zuma stepped down as president and then about a year and a half ago founded MK and got 15% of the country. He's the real threat. Zuma, but he's 80 something and he can't live forever.

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

He can't live forever. He's 80 something. I'm watching him. So Trevor Noah, not a fan of Zuma and he's gone after him and what? Yeah, I'm looking at a bunch of his clips here.

[A]

So Jacob Zuma allowed everybody else to steal under his watch this time around. If he gets into power, he will take the expropriation without compensation law and he will implement it on day one. He's made it very clear. And so Cyril Ramaphosa is scared of Zuma and scared of Malema. But is he scared enough to go back to his party and say we need to change, we need to be more pro west, we need to not be anti Semitic, not be anti American, we need to cut costs, we need to focus on free markets. Does he have that courage? I don't think he does.

[B]

Well, we're about to find out on what's going to happen with that. And in South Africa, who is the most influential person right now that's non political? Is that the person that's going to be joining him? The business owner you were talking about? The CEO of one of the head of companies?

[A]

No, he says nothing. Very few South African corporates stand up and say anything. I am the only South African businessman you can even type in. Prominent South African businessmen standing against the ANC and no one will come up. I'm the only guy.

[B]

Bob Van Driel.

[A]

I've had more death threats than any non politician in South Africa.

[B]

Bob Van Driel, does he say anything?

[A]

Who's he?

[B]

He's the guy that runs naspers. Do you know Alan? No.

[A]

He's a Dutchman, he lives in Amsterdam. He's not even South Africa.

[B]

Do you know Alan Pollinger?

[A]

He did. Alan Pollinger did. Michelle Larue did Gareth Ackerman and Neil Froneman. Four names. I can't even get to a fifth. Who have said things, who've stood up and talked. Alan Pollinger's resigned.

[B]

How influential is Alan Pollinger?

[A]

Great guy, but not anymore. He was running a bank.

[B]

Who is the biggest in. Who are the most biggest influencers in South Africa that still live there? Right here.

[A]

That's it. I'm here. There's a man called Ernst Roots who appeared on Tucker Tucker's show and Ben Shapiro's show. He's an Africana. There are people from civic society, there are people from media, there are people from law who have been journalists, who have been very, very, very brave. But when it comes to the business community, the business community either cowards, colluders or captured. 3 C's.

[B]

Cowards, colluders or captured, or they've been.

[A]

Captured by the state.

[B]

You feel safe in South Africa having the positions that you get?

[A]

Yes, I do. Or maybe it's a form of, you know. My father said to me, when I began, accidentally, I made a speech, went viral, and I was thrown into this maelstrom of political activism or capitalist activism. And I would have given up early on. I got attacked, I got cut off. People wouldn't take my calls. I was threatened. If my wife and father hadn't said the same thing to me, I would have given up. And they said. My father said, rob, I've never been more proud of you for doing and saying what other people can't afford to do and say. And, you know, there's a poem called the man in the Glass, and it's about, you can fool everyone but the man in the Glass, yourself. And everything in life for me has come. I felt easy. Born wealthy, had every opportunity, went to Harvard Business School, got the jobs I wanted, worked for Rupert Murloc. You know, just things came. I mean, I made an effort, but they came easy. This is the first time in my life I'm doing something I don't need to do at great financial cost, at great personal risk, when my wife and kids are worried, are scared, my friends are scared, but I feel I'm doing something because I have a calling and a duty on behalf of other South Africans. And I do love my country.

[B]

I respect it. You said your Grant, your father's 95? 99.

[A]

99, yeah.

[B]

When does he turn 100?

[A]

August next year, 2026.

[B]

He turns 100 next year. Got it.

[A]

Do you know you've caught the last 14 months of the Second World War South African Air Force pilot, and somebody said, he must be one of the last remaining South African Air Force pilots from the Second World War. Does he still have his logbook? I called him, I said, dad, do you still have your logbook? He said, I have all three of my logbooks. So you can imagine how many hours he's flown.

[B]

Where is his pride at with the country?

[A]

He loves South Africa. He'd never have left. He's Concerned, you know, my two older sons, one lives in America, one lives in London. My sister lives in North Carolina. My brother and sister live in London. Everybody, every South African families, next generation or next two generations have left or are leaving. Everybody's gone. If we could fix South Africa.

[B]

It's tough to bring people back, though.

[A]

If I could give me my 100 days as a benevolent dictator, foreign direct investment would return, and there'd be a reverse diaspora of 100 to 200,000 extraordinary young South Africans who would take South Africa to 5% growth.

[B]

So you are running. You just said it now three, four, five times. You are running. Listen, I remember when Vive came here first time, and he's speaking. I'm like, this guy's speaking like he's about to run for office. Month later, I'm now running for office. I'm like, oh, okay. Well, I had it right. I got a good feeling on him. But the beers, selfishly, I did a video one time on the beer's diamond. What can you say about them? There's a lot of stuff you hear about, you know, how they're the ones that made it. You know, diamonds are not really as big as they're supposed to do. They control 80 to 85% of the diamond distribution. And it was concerned that they had a monopoly. What do you guys in South Africa think about them?

[A]

So, personally, I'm a minimalist. I only wear blue and white. I don't own any watches anymore, really. No vases, no jewelry. I collect anything. When I proposed to my wife, I was in a German forest hunting wild boar in a tree with snow. She was next to me, covered up, pointing out the ball. And I said, will you marry me?

[B]

Get out of here.

[A]

Loaded rifle. She goes, I thought you'd never ask. I'll marry you, but if you ever give me a diamond ring, engagement ring, anything, I'll sell them on ebay. And I said, well, why would you do that? She said, why should de bears tell me this shiny stone's worth anything? Why should Hallmark cards tell me tomorrow's Mother's Day? It's marketing. And from that day on, she minimalized me. I can put my life into four suitcases. I only wear blue and white. Have a look at all my videos. I'm minimalist. It's liberating.

[B]

How long have you been a minimalist?

[A]

Since. Since 2010. Got rid of everything.

[B]

And that's when you guys started dating?

[A]

No, we. We've been dating for a thousand years.

[B]

We've been dating for a thousand Years.

[A]

She's my soulmate. It's the rarest thing.

[B]

Thousand years. A long time. You look pretty good as a thousand year old man.

[A]

That's real hair. So. So that's. How did we get onto minimalism?

[B]

No, you said diamonds. When she said, if you ever give me a diamond, I'm going to sell it on ebay.

[A]

De Beer's a genius monopoly and a complete farce. What is a diamond? It's a shiny stone. It's worthless.

[B]

So it's from South Africa. And you think it's a fraud what they did to diamonds?

[A]

Well, it's genius. It's not a fraud. It's complete genius.

[B]

To make they hang on to it. Makes it seem like it's worth more shiny stone.

[A]

But are we insane? As humans, we prize a shiny stone. It's insane. I'd rather have bitcoin. Rather have bitcoin and lots of them.

[B]

Really?

[A]

So you can also make diamonds in labs now? De Beers is sitting on a mountain of unsold diamonds. It's the best short in the world.

[B]

It's the best short in the world.

[A]

Oh, in addition to Cadbury's, McDonald's. Because of Ozempic, everyone's going to be slim. Everyone's going to be slim. So why would you ever buy Cadbury's, Round Trees, Burger King? And why would you ever buy diamonds? Because they can be made in factories. Get out of those. And this is financial advice?

[B]

That's the quote, Rob. Short diamonds.

[A]

Yeah, short. All of those things. I mean, I'm a minimalist.

[B]

What do you drive?

[A]

So you would ask me that, wouldn't you? I drive an FJ Cruiser. Toyota FJ Cruiser, completely pimped. I've got the big tires, I got a wrap. I've got everything. It's the only kind of position I enjoy.

[B]

You say you're a minimalist. Maybe I gotta have a car. Do you. Don't you have a $30 million property like in Dubai or something? Like a vacation property or. No.

[A]

Okay, so we like three things. You didn't ask me. So here it goes. Ready? We like Katie and I like three things. Big houses, lots of money in the bank.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And great experiences.

[B]

Cool. I respect.

[A]

We like memories for the rocking chair. So any fun, crazy thing we do.

[B]

It's like I. I'm not cheap when it comes down to experiences. That's the one thing.

[A]

Wouldn't you rather go walk, Hiking with the gorillas or go to Antarctica for dinner? It's much more fun hiking with gorillas. Some shiny damn.

[B]

Watch yeah, well, listen, I think this podcast out of business walking. So all those. We're going to have millions of people shorting diamonds. It's. It's begun.

[A]

The Big short. Come on, baby.

[B]

The big short.

[A]

It ain't Drill, baby, drill.

[B]

Did you watch a movie? The Big Short. What a great movie. You know who's the one guy I've been wanting to interview and he never does interviews? Who?

[A]

Michael.

[B]

Michael Burry doesn't do interviews. Do you know him?

[A]

No. I would love to interview him, too.

[B]

Yeah. Well, listen, Michael, bur.

[A]

Patrick, can I thank you for everything you're doing.

[B]

Oh, no, thank you.

[A]

You got a hell of a business here. I love the fact you're sitting on an airport and I've always wanted to meet you. And here I've met you in your own show. What a treat.

[B]

Yeah. This has been a fascinating conversation and the audience needs to know this. You showed up an hour before fully prepared. You entertained Adam or Adam entertained you.

[A]

Can I do a shout out for Sauce?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm going to say something.

[B]

We're never going to hear the end of it. He's going to use us to pick up girls.

[A]

No, it's better than that.

[B]

Let's hear this.

[A]

I did a video of me and Sauce to Katie saying, look who I'm with. I'm going to meet Patrick. And now meet Sauce. Know the message sent back. He hasn't heard this. He's hot. Stop it, Kate.

[B]

She said he's hot.

[A]

He's hot. I'm keeping those.

[B]

Tell Kate. Tell Kate. Adam is the biggest MAGA guy you'll meet in your life. Okay? This guy went from telling me four years ago I would never vote for Trump to now saying, you know, he should go be his campaign manager. He should be his. What do you call it? Ron the press secretary. Is that what it is like? Adam should be doing that. He would do a very good job. And anyways, brother, this has been great. Appreciate you for coming out. I really enjoy talking to you. I look forward to it when you run for office. I will definitely do part two when you do that. Take care, everybody. Bye, bye. Bye. Bye. Nowadays, more than ever, the brand you wear, reflects and represent who you are. So for us, if you wear a future looks, bright hat or a valuetainment gear, you're telling the world. I'm optimistic. I'm excited about what's going to be happening. But you're a free thinker. You question things. You like debate. And by the way, last year, 120,000 people got a piece of Future Looks Bright geared with valuetainment. We have so many new things. The cufflinks are here. New Future Looks Bright. This is my favorite, the green one. Just yesterday somebody placed an order for a hundred of these. If you watch the PBD podcast you got a bunch to choose from. White ones, black ones if you, if you, if you smoke cigars and you come to our cigar lounge, we have this high quality lighter cutter and a holder for the cigars. We got sweaters with the valuetainment logo on it. We got mugs, we got a bunch of different things. But if you believe the future Looks bright, if you follow our content and what we represent with valuetainment with PVD podcast, go to vtmerch.com and by the way, if you order right now there's going to be a special VT gift insight just for you. So again, go to vtmerch.com, place your order, tell the world that you believe the future looks bright.