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Immediately after the U.S. elections in November 2024, I spoke at a panel at the STATE OF ASIA 2024 in Zurich organized by Asia Society Switzerland, alongside Wang Qing (王罄), the host of the popular Chinese podcast "The Weirdo" (不合时宜) and Adam Tooze, economic historian and professor at Columbia University and author of Chartbook. The discussion was moderated by Finbarr Birmingham, Europe correspondent for the South China Morning Post.

Asia Society Switzerland has recently published the discussion as a podcast, and I’m happily syndicating it here.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.pekingnology.com