← Perpetual Traffic
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Foreign. You're listening to Perpetual Traffic.
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Hello and welcome to the Retual Traffic podcast. This is your host, Ralph burns, founder and CEO of Tier 11, alongside our amazing. Not Lauren Petrulo, the other Lauren, the actual Lauren, not LP Lauren, but Lauren Schwartz. Lauren today for part two of our series on beauty, brands and creative, which so far people are loving these episodes because it's not something we've ever really talked about before, which is really going deep on creative. And one of the coolest things I think about us working together is before tier 11 and Loft 325 came together is that we were huge fans of your socials and so much of the stuff that you do, just as Lauren Schwartz also was. The Lofts 325 is really tactical because like we always talk about here on the show, it's like you're doing this every single day. You're still involved, like you're still doing strategy. Like you were supposed to be at one of our clients today doing this.
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Yes.
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And it's not hypothetical. It's not like something that you're making up or like there's, you know, how it is, like info products, like everyone teaches it but nobody actually does it and just like makes money on that. But you're actually doing it and you're still involved and you love doing it. And obviously the beauty and wellness space is an area that we're pretty darn good at. And I think this is. But it's a hard one to really crack the code on when it comes to creative. And I think in our first episode we talked a little bit about that, just working with creatives, just in general. If you haven't listened to that episode, go back and we will leave links in the show notes over perpetualtraffic.com, of course, watch it over at YouTube today we actually are going to be doing some screen sharing and some show and tell here of how, how you're able to do this because it's not an easy thing to do. And that was one of the things that was most attractive, I think, when we joined forces is that you've got this really great knowledge of how to work with highly branded, highly stylized brands selling products through creative that really resonate. And also what's cool about today is we'll talk about how to capitalize on trends. So that's sort of the subject of today's show. What do people sort of need to know about just creative in general. And like we talked about trends a bit on the first show. What really is A trend. And how do you kind of navigate through that so that it comes across as super resonant but also authentic at the same time?
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Yeah. So I think especially with beauty brands, again, there's a lot of the influencers or even celebrities who are really focusing right now on beauty. I mean, you have the rare beauty, the road beauty art, REM from Ariana. Like there's so many beauty brands out there, I think, because everyone, they resonate with that kind of content and they resonate with those sorts of brands and celebrities are actually the ones who are kind of creating the trends. So there's as they're starting to kind of play with the makeup that they have, starting to really focus on what they can do. They continue to start these trends. I mean, for instance, one of the trends that was started recently from Hailey Bieber was this like strawberry, strawberry face trend, which was really just like putting on some blush and adding freckles, which like, was a great beauty trend which everyone then decided to kind of jump on. And it was utilizing her products to kind of get that trend. And so I think it's just capturing it in a way, especially with content creators. It needs to be something that not only can be super easy for someone to do, but then also make sure that they use the products that they're working with from these specific creators. So I think in order to make these trends, it has to be simple and it has to be something that can be done like with an everyday sort of look. Because again, I think a lot of times with beauty brands, they kind of go a little bit over the top with the trends in terms of like how much makeup they're wearing. But I think that kind of subtle beauty trend makes it look again, really authentic and very natural and more people resonate and jump on those as opposed to those higher end beauty trends.
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Yeah, it was sort of hysterical to me. It's like when you go, I've never been to like a fashion show in, in Paris, but it's like you see the Runway models and it's like nobody's ever gonna wear that stuff.
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Yeah.
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You know what I mean? So there is like, in the beauty and wellness space, like there is a certain level of that which is fine for brand. Gucci wants to do that or some high end brand, that's fine. The point is, like, most people really do want to be able to use these products on a daily basis as opposed to, or maybe like on a special occasion. Like I think we're going to be talking about here today for like A season or holiday kind of event just to kind of be have fun with it. But like, people are mostly looking for just sort of ways in which to incorporate these products and these trends into their daily lives.
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Yes. Correct me if I'm wrong. Exactly.
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Yeah.
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Not over the top. Yeah.
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So when we say trends, okay, so like Strawberry Face is a trend by Hailey Bieber. How does that relate to Performance Creative? If you see a trend and then you have a brand that you're trying to have new ideas constantly you guys are coming up with brand new ideas to be able to affect that top of funnel. Because at the end of the day, like, this is not necessarily all about branding. It's about Performance Creative. It's about ultimately them buying the products, but creating brand at the same time. So I mean, there is a subtle degree of that and it has to be on brand, which is super, super important. I know that that's one of the most critical things. I think working with beauty brands just in general is staying on brand and then also convincing the powers that be, like, all right, maybe this is a little bit outside of your comfort zone, but this is what Performance Creative actually does. How do you sor blend that all together with trends so that it comes across as not only unique, but also consistent and organic and sort of lo fi to a certain degree, but most importantly, authentic.
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Yeah. So we have, so we work with content creators who really are specific in that niche of beauty brands. So we, the brands that we work with, again we kind of work with supplements, hair care, makeup, and it's really finding those content creators who can really show the product and actually share the trend with those specific products and make it look very natural and organic. So again, that's really what we want to do is we want to one, and obviously performance Creative, we want to highlight the product that we're utilizing. So whether it's a blow dryer, a hair oil, or if it's a makeup brush or whatever it is that we're trying to focus on, we need to make sure that we are hopping on that trend, whatever that trend is in that beauty space. Make sure that the content obviously is going to look very natural, how you can utilize this trend within your everyday life. And then three, like making sure that you're also focusing on something that looks very organic, where it's not so posed, not so stylized. And working with these content creators to make sure that they're, you know, really feeding into that sort of aesthetic of raw, organic looking content that again, like resonates with everyone. So you look at it as like it's an ad, but it also doesn't look like an ad. It looks like it's just kind of popped up in your feed and someone's kind of sharing the journey with you or sharing this trend with you. So, like combining all of those things, but making sure that you're utilizing the products that you are working with and utilizing the products that your clients are giving to you to make sure that you have this sort of like full circle kind of approach when it comes to like the trend, the product and the beauty space.
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Got it. So do you have an example? Maybe we can do a screen share of like what you're a good example of a brand that you've worked with in the past. It doesn't necessarily need to be strawberry face, but you know, something that's. That did work and also produced results. Like, how do you. Like that's really the question is how do you blend sort of that trend with performance but also staying on brand, not going too far off base. Like, this is a real balance here, which involves, I would imagine, a fair amount of communication.
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Yes.
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And convincing.
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Yeah. So we have. So one of the clients we work with is a Lash company, Lily lashes. And one of the trends that we had focused on was, or really what we kind of focused on was how to make a simple, a simple look for going out for Halloween. So not everyone wants to go super glamorous when it's for Halloween. They just kind of want to have like, some people want to dress up, but they don't need to go like full dress up. So it was something of how can we utilize these lashes and make a look that's easy, effective, and still kind of gives you on trend in terms of that Halloween esthetic. So this is one of our content creators. Again, she is great with eyelash extensions and so making sure that again, like, especially with the Lash company, it's very important that you focus on the application, how it looks. Again, like there's different ways of how to do it. We've kind of gone through several creators where a lot of people don't know how to put on lashes. And so making sure again that we're utilizing content creators who know how to use the product and then can make a look that obviously can sell. So here's one of the ones that we did.
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And in case you're listening to this or walking the dog or on the treadmill or on your phone, head on over to perpetualtraffic.com YouTube. We're actually doing screen share Here, we're going to show you exactly what we're talking about here. How to blend brand with performance with also trends for this particular lash product.
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Because we have to obviously sell the lashes. So it's a simple Halloween look, but then you can also utilize them 20 times over, and then you can use them in your everyday life. And so it's like, again, she looks very natural. It looks very raw and organic. Like, she's in her bathroom, she's applying the lashes. And so it's kind of taking that cross between, we need to sell the product. You can also do this on your everyday life, but then you can also use this as a Halloween look as well. So it's like kind of combining all of those things into a different set of creative.
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Yeah, that's a great. It's a great combination of a lot of different things that we had talked about here. And obviously it's that the creator themselves. I mean, this is somebody who's obviously worked with this brand. Brand in the past. Certainly sounds like. Yeah.
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Yes. Yeah. She is one of our creators who, again, we work specifically with her because she knows how to utilize this look and knows how to utilize the lashes.
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Right. Let me ask you this question. Just on, like, ads like this, this is always something that I tend to get a lot of questions on. I don't really know how to answer it because it's like, I see content creators, they're obviously being compensated by a company, and I see it in my news feed, and how do I know what they're really saying is true versus I know the fact that they're actually being paid to do it? Like, we obviously pay her to represent this particular brand. Like, how do you sort of explain that? And you know, it. Cause it isn't necessarily. I mean, obviously, I mean, you see, like, the rock pitching something, or it's like, I know he's being caught. Like, there's no way. I mean, I just was at that beauty conference where there was Serena Williams, like, the guy, you know is pitching this product for this company. I'm like, there's no way. You just sent it to her and she said yes. I mean, you're compensating her some way.
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Right?
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You know what I mean? Like, how do you kind of balance that with authenticity, plus the fact that people kind of know it's an ad. Where's that fine line?
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I mean, I think, unfortunately, we just live in a time now where it's really hard to tell what's it is, what it is. Yeah. I mean, but at the same time, like, the creators that we do work with, we do actually reach out to them before we even shoot content and ask them, like, hey, is this a product that you're willing to work with? Is this a product that you're willing to kind of willing to endorse? I mean, again, we work with a lot of different content creators, and I think the thing that makes it look authentic is that if they're interested in the product, they're going to want to showcase it, they're going to want to talk about it in an authentic way. And I mean, this has come with, like, a lot of trial and error, too. So especially with the creators that we work with, there are some just. They're. If they're given a product and they know they're just like, okay, I got to shoot another piece of content and I get paid for this and, like, move on, like, to the next one, it doesn't come off as authentic as someone who actually genuinely wants to use the product, genuinely likes the product. So I think it's just a different take, really. So just finding those creators who actually enjoy using that product, I think is going to make your content more authentic.
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Yeah. Right. So for that content creator, like, for. I mean, you obviously probably have a stable of maybe two or three individual content creators for that brand, or it's almost like she's exclusively sort of the spokesperson for the ads. Like, how do you rotate in other personalities? Is it usually one? Like, how is that all sort of work?
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Yeah, so we, I mean, we have a pretty large content creator pool that we can pull from. And I would say for this specific brand, we have about 10 creators who we know we can pull from. That way it's. We can inner interswap people. We can. We have older content creators who. This is something that it's still kind of new for, but again, it resonates because they want that content. And then we have that sort of, like, younger demographic where, again, they can kind of showcase the trends a little bit more. So we try to get a larger pool of creators that we can use that we can pull from to create different sorts of content.
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Yeah, no, that's. And I think that comes back to. I think this is one of the frustrations when we talk to brands. Like, all right, well, you can. There are marketplaces where you can go find creators for your brand. However, there's going to be a lot. You're going to have to kiss a lot of frogs.
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Yes.
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We were first doing this without your help. We were finding that as a huge frustration. And then we do a round of like 10 or 12, and they're like, I hate all of them. This is like two, three years ago because this was a huge trend and we were trying to capitalize on it. And then we started using a white label partner and then obviously we partnered up with you guys. But the point is, like, that's the key to it. And I think you can't just go out and just say, all right, I'm going to get this person. That's it. One and done. Like, you really have to know them and have the relationship with them and understand, like, what their tendencies are, as well as them being authentic. Like, they're actually really excited about the brand itself.
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Yeah. And I think that's what's hard for a lot of brands is because they, they don't necessarily want to do the legwork of finding those creators. And again, this is like, I mean, this is almost five years of pulling all these content creators. A lot of it was really like searching through socials, seeing, you know, who looks authentic when they're shooting the content, and really just starting to work with them and train them. So the content creators that we work with, I mean, we've trained a lot of them. It's a lot of working with them, helping them get the shots that we need. So again, like, they're really good on the acting side and, or quote unquote, acting side, but it's those different creators that work well with different brands and then coaching them on, okay, this is great, but maybe we get this shot or this angle or whatever. So it is definitely hard to find those specific creators. But once you start to find them, they understand the content, they understand what needs to be shot, and then they just start building from there. And after a while, it's just easy to say, okay, we're going to work with this brand, we're going to give it to this creator, because we know that they're going to either do a really good job and they're just, again, they're really good. Their authenticity is really good. I think that's one of the biggest compliments that we get from all of our clients, is that all of the creators that they work with, they all say to us, like, your creators are very authentic and they resonate really well with our audience. And so we want to continue working with you.
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You can so tell when somebody doesn't like you. Just immediately, I don't know what it is. It's like, it's. I don't know, it's eye contact. It's something in the voice. It sounds scripted. There's just something about it. It's like the one that you just showed is great because, I mean, obviously, I know it's an ad, but it just felt authentic. It felt legit.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And if you don't get that right, then the ad just won't resonate. And I'm sure you've seen, like, from a production, like from a productivity standpoint, from a really. From a performance standpoint, the difference between one that is really genuine and resonates and is authentic versus ones that are sort of borderline scripted. Like, I really love this. I mean, obviously it's never going to be that bad, of course, but I mean, yeah, I mean, the whole scripted part of it. So one of the other cool things is that, I mean, there's just capitalizing on trends just in general. And I think before we hit record today, you were going through sort of another trend, which is sort of hot, I think it's right now. And how beauty brands work with. What is it? Food. So once again, over on our YouTube channel, perpetualtraffic.com YouTube, if you haven't subscribed to it, well, I don't know what the hell you're doing with your life because you should be all right. So we're showing an ad in the news. Like, actually this is on your LinkedIn, so we're going to leave links in the show notes for Lauren's LinkedIn. You definitely get a follower if you want to really see what's going on right now. So explain to us what we're seeing here.
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Yeah. So road beauty actually is really good at selling their product, but they utilize food, which is, I think, a big thing that you wouldn't think to put hand in hand. So, like having a lip gloss or having a lotion or something like that, but then pairing it with food. So I did kind of like this whole campaign breakdown of, like, the psychology behind it of why beauty brands use food within their ads, within their advertising, within their photography. It's really kind of this whole sensory marketing. And I think that is something that is interesting because you wouldn't think to pair a lip gloss with an ice cream or again, like a lip gloss with a croissant. So it's like, how can you as marketers really take this sort of like, beauty aesthetic and then really showcase it in, like, a way that's going to make your senses, like, it's emotional, it's craveable, it's. It makes it feel Irresistible. And I think that's like the indulgence of food is really understanding like how you can kind of tie these things together and not only make your imagery look really interesting and different, but then also making it capitalize on your senses too. Like I think the biggest thing, you know, that I, that a lot of marketers forget is that it's very emotion driven, very sensory driven, especially when it comes to makeup. And so I think just trying to give these different like senses as you're doing this is something that's really interesting. So really just kind of did this whole breakdown of their socials are really good with showing these like limp tip limp tints which are like served on dessert trays. This sort of like dripping glossy textures of like honey and chocolate or this strawberry berry visual where it's like the different shades of berries and then whipped cream shots of makes it feel indulgent and just like this creamy sort of texture. So again it's like you not only can look at the product but you're like, oh, this is going to give me a really glossy look. Because of like when you think of honey you always think of that like really sort of like glossy texture. And so like you just again your senses kind of compare that which again makes it really good for paid social. But then it also makes it really good for your socials as well.
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Right.
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And again just kind of driving into that like food inspired visuals which again it's a deep emotional and psychology trigger. And then again it gives you that like that pleasure and that craving. So it's like something that you start to think of and then with your paid ads it's something that is so different from your feed that it captures your attention really fast. And then again it activates like your senses of sight, texture, taste, smell, memory. It's again it's scroll stopping but. But it also like resonates really well. So I think for them like they've done a really great job of just kind of making it seem, making it like your senses and comparing everything and capitalizing on how they can take not only beauty products and craveable products and put it in this way that is it's beauty but it's definitely outside of the box which makes it very interesting. And I think that's where people start to resonate with the brands is that road is not only like it's a good product but again like they think outside of the box when it comes to how they're tapping into their products. So just I thought it was something that was Interesting. As we were kind of looking through these different brands.
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Can this be related outside of. I'm trying to think. Because this is taking something that's known and familiar, and everybody knows what chocolate tastes like. Everybody knows what a strawberry or a raspberry tastes like. It's like you're relating something that's known to something that is not known yet because you haven't bought it, you haven't actually experienced it, which is great marketing. So it's like, I think a lot of great brands really do this. They remind you of things that you're familiar with, whether it's things from your past. I heard this ad on the way to the gym this morning. They were obviously targeting Gen X people. Get your MP3 player and your, oh, geez, what's that? Your fanny pack out. And I'm like, oh, my God, that's me. Like, I know. Like, I don't even know what was for. I think it was for, like an insurance app, but it was like. Like, I forget what the name of it. It's just sort of lost. But it's only the first time I've heard it. The point was, is like they were resonating with something that is known and familiar, and that type of familiarity is then being translated to the brand. This is far more sort of sensory in the fact that it's really relating to food and everyone knows what those foods sort of taste like. And relating that to a beauty brand and sort of dripping that into the experience that you may have when you purchase. Is it relatable to. I mean, I guess answering my own question to a certain degree, because the insurance company kind of did it, but not like with food brands. But maybe it is. It's like, is this type of thing exclusive to beauty and wellness, or is it just in general a trend that you can see. See outside of the beauty and wellness industry?
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Yeah, I mean, definitely. I think, again, like, anything that's gonna spark an emotional memory or emotions, I think is something that's always something that, you know, any brand can really capitalize. Whether it's like you said, if they're who they're targeting, like a gen. A Gen x with an MP3 player and a fanny pack. It's like that, you know, your audience, you're talking to that audience, you're bringing up those memories of nostalgia. And I think that's something that works really well, especially when it comes to creative and advertising, is just, how can I bring it back to a nostalgic time and a nostalgic era that Makes me understand like what they're trying to talk about. Like, like again, like this bowl of cereal. Not, I'm not saying that everyone eats cereal, but like as a kid you ate cereal. So it's like, like you think of like the milk and the flavor that you had, like, and how it like tasted and how it made you feel. So I think, yeah, I love cereal.
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So like with sweet cereal, the milk that's left over, oh my God, that's.
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Like cinnamon Toast crunch milk. Cereal is like, are you kidding me?
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Best.
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So yeah, I think again, it's just bringing back that nostalgia is something that resonates really well with people.
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Yeah, that was the word that I was looking for that you nailed. And I think it's, it's like this is just a generalized rule in advertising, just in general. Like you're trying to. If you're introducing a brand new product, you want to relate it in some way, shape or form to something that's known. Whether it's nostalgia, something from the past, or something that's known to this day. It makes that connection. And it certainly said like, if you're seeing this, with this particular brand itself, are you seeing that as a trend overall in the beauty and wellness space? Other brands latching onto it and they're sort of the leader of it or like, how is that manifesting itself?
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Yeah, I mean a lot of other brands are definitely doing this. I would say Ro just they. I don't know if they were the first. I mean that definitely they had been one that had really capitalized on it, but definitely. I think kind of all beauty brands take this like, food approach when it comes to their products because again, it's the flavors, it's like the creaminess, texture of like how it feels and whatnot. So I definitely think that food is a big sensory play, that big trigger.
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Yeah.
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That people can understand when they're thinking about a product. When it comes to beauty and skincare.
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Yeah. Look at how we responded to the Cinnamon Toast Crunch milk. It's like. And if you can relate that to a brand, like, bingo, you've got it.
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Exactly. Yeah.
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B
Oh my God, that's so cool. Well, this is awesome. We are, we're going to do a series on this and these are going to be shorter episodes where sort of bite sized chunks where you can sort of take these, these pieces of information. We are obviously we're focusing more on the beauty and wellness space because it's obviously it's an area where we've got a high degree of specialty and of course, if you want to learn more about that, you can head over to tier11beauty.com by the way. That's tier 11 with an actual 11. We got that URL supposed to. The guy who's tier11.com is holding us out for like 50 grand, by the way. Lauren, I don't know, maybe we should, like, take a collection here, pay for that URL. Anyway, so tier 11 beauty.com with more information about what Lauren and her team does as well as the tier 11 team. And of course, watch this over on YouTube in this series here, which is perpetualtraffic.com forward/YouTube and subscribe to the channel so you don't miss a thing. So we're going to be doing four or five shows on this, which is going to be very cool. And you've made me really hungry for cinnamon toast crunch, by the way. Like, oh my God. It's like the worst thing I could possibly eat for lunch because I'll be taking a nap in an hour. Well, thank you so much for showing up despite the fact that you were experiencing an earthquake yesterday. We didn't even mention that to start off the show.
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A
Yeah, we're good. We're safe. Everyone's safe. Came out alive.
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You've got one of those buildings that, you know, kind of rolls with the punches a bit, which is great.
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Exactly.
- [28:38]
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So it doesn't matter. Like, we'll never stop here. Perpetual traffic. We'll continue shows whether it's an earthquake. I've done shows in a hurricane before, so earthquakes. This is a first for us. We did one show with a tornado, with a guy that worked in Oklahoma. So that was like two years ago. Anyway, so make sure that wherever you listen to podcasts, you leave us a rating and review. We really do appreciate that. We will read it out on Ear here, especially over on Spotify. We're getting a lot of comments over there. Comment, leave a rating. Really appreciate you listening to the show. The more ratings and reviews we get, the wider the audience we can actually teach how to do this stuff the right way. And you're certainly doing that on the creative end of things, especially in the beauty and wellness space here. Lauren, so super appreciate you for coming on here today, withstanding the earthquake. And we will be back with this series, ongoing for the next month or so. All links and everything that we mentioned here in the show Notes. Can we share some of the stuff that you shared? Actually, we'll share your LinkedIn, which has a lot of this anyway, so definitely follow Lauren over on LinkedIn. And of course, check us out over at tier11beauty.com. So on behalf of my amazing tier 11 compadre, Lauren Schwartz, until next show, see ya. You've been listening to Perpetual Traffic.