← Perpetual Traffic
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- [00:00]
Ralph Burns
Foreign.
- [00:03]
Lauren Petrulo
You're listening to Perpetual Traffic.
- [00:11]
Ralph Burns
Hello and welcome to the Perpetual Traffic podcast. This is your host, Ralph burns, founder and CEO of Tier 11, alongside my.
- [00:17]
Lauren Petrulo
Amazing co host, Lauren Petrulo, the founder of Mongoose Media.
- [00:22]
Ralph Burns
So glad you joined us here today. You're calling in from Nashville?
- [00:26]
Lauren Petrulo
Yeehaw.
- [00:27]
Ralph Burns
Did you do any like square dancing or anything like that while you were there?
- [00:32]
Lauren Petrulo
I. I skipped. I walked in a square.
- [00:35]
Ralph Burns
You walked in a square?
- [00:37]
Lauren Petrulo
But I'm a gringa who can't dance, so no, I pretended to honky tonk.
- [00:41]
Ralph Burns
That's good, that's good. Well, we've been told to keep things moving here. We can't like do too much like back and forth rapparte kind of stuff because it bores our listeners, so.
- [00:54]
Lauren Petrulo
Fair.
- [00:55]
Ralph Burns
Actually, fair enough. Like we did get a cut. We got an interesting comment that said, guys, get to the point when you're like talking about something. And I think it was just the introduction that was actually an episode where me and you both had like our worst mics. Like both of our mics failed at the last minute. Like this is the trials and tribulations of running a podcast. Always have a backup mic, which I don't have today. So hopefully we're actually recording here today. We have been known to be mobile. Like you're in Nashville. I'm in like multiple locations all the time. That's just the way that it is. So anyway, so hopefully you can hear us all here. And we are getting right to the point because today's show is all about what's working now. And we've done a lot of shows here where we've talked about all the Advantage plus stuff there is, which now people are calling the Andromeda Update, by the way. I don't think you and I even knew that because Meta's been kind of cryptic about it. I mean, you look at now, if you actually Google Meta Advantage plus News, you'll see us rank right at the top, by the way. I don't know if you realize that, but there hasn't been a whole lot of information about this. So just to reiterate, Advantage plus is now moving towards a fully automated solution as opposed to. And we did a screen share this. We'll leave links in the show notes about this. But this is a pretty massive change. And the massive change means that you as an advertiser no longer have manual control or will slowly no longer have manual control over your Advantage plus shopping campaigns. Now just being called sort of Advantage plus Sales or just Advantage Plus So Meta hasn't really. You look at press releases and so forth, they've been sort of vague about this. It's been people like us and others who have reported on it. But all of this is backed by the Andromeda algorithm, so that's kind of what it was. And you and I sort of thought like it was Llama that was backing it because that was the AI algorithm that was powering everything. But no, it's called Andromeda now. So they've changed quite a bit without really even announcing a whole lot. There isn't even a press release on this. It was something from way back in December. So anyway, we're here to clear all that up for you and then give some insights as to how it's working. What are your thoughts on it so far? It's only been a couple of weeks since this has been starting to get rolled out. We've done a lot of tier 11 lives on it. John has. John Moran has got his opinions on it. What's your sense inside Mongoose Media at this point?
- [03:33]
Lauren Petrulo
Well, full disclosure, we're a little biased in the sense that like we really like Meta and the AI pieces from the Advantage plus pieces. In our last episode, I was hyper skeptical. I hate that they removed so much control because Advantage plus audiences aren't working well for us right now. It's just not as efficient as we'd like it to. But following our most recent episode talking about those new rollouts, we did look and see that in general for our E Commerce clients, the Advantage plus new sales campaign, where you can't do very much to it, has a 15 to 20% lift in better conversion results. So on the E Commerce side, we've got some people that are like all in and excited and then like hyper skeptical. I'm excited for it working, but I'm not holding on to it for very long. And then the bias comes into like, I'm literally going to be with the Meta AI folks in two weeks in dc. So I. I'm going to be like, I don't know enough about this Andromeda stuff. You have to fill me in because it's having a further discussion along of how we use AI and a lot of that Advantage plus audience. So that's why I'm biased. Like I have to gear up for that meeting to make sure I'm as informed as possible because I'm going to be in the room with a lot of really smart people.
- [04:47]
Ralph Burns
Well, also, that's going to be a great episode for us to sort of update everyone about all of this, because I don't. It's been a clunky kind of rollout and it's such a massive change. And Meta has remained largely, I wouldn't say silent, but there wasn't any big release. So anyway, just to clear this up, we've been talking about Advantage plus and the changes going from manual to fully automated. But the thing that powers it is this Andromeda. To read from Meta's press release, Andromeda is Meta's proprietary machine learning system design for retrieval and ad recommendation focused on delivering of step function improvement and value to our advertisers and people. Wow, that is horribly written. But what it is is, it's basically, it's part of their $65 billion in 2025. $65 billion. Lauren Ipprillo with a B. Like, imagine that is what Zuck is investing in AI and I believe mostly on Andromeda, not just like AI to compete with ChatGPT and all these others, but to enhance the algorithm so to.
- [05:55]
Lauren Petrulo
What they do, what they make money on, which is ad placement. So it's like we use a generative AI all day. And I find that when you use a generative AI within Meta, you end up getting more boosts because I assume the narrative they want to say is like, look at the better efficiencies when you leverage AI so that you can remove the burden of operations from the small business owner. But. But there's like, instead of chasing that, like another component, like another Claude, another copilot, another GPT, I think Zuck's investment is gonna be like, we went all in on Metaverse and creating something that's completely different. Whoops. Let's now go all in on AI in the way that we had invested with Metaverse.
- [06:38]
Ralph Burns
Yeah, I think initially it was, I felt like Llama was The response to ChatGPT and now Google, Gemini, Claude, name it, you know, perplexity, whatever, whichever answer machine you want on the LLM side. But it really is, they make their money on advertising, like selling to me and you. That's why they treat us well, which is good because we spend lots of money there. But at the end of the day, like, that's what drives their earnings and that's the thing that's driving everything in their business. So what's interesting, in their earnings call, they didn't really mention the Metaverse much. That's sort of like slowly mentioned less and less and less, which is funny because that's the Wall street just waxed them for that. Like, why are you spending $20 billion? And now they're like, oh, we're spending 65 billion on AI. And Wall Street's like, yay. Which makes sense because it's in alignment with their, the way that they make money, what drives earnings.
- [07:38]
Lauren Petrulo
Yeah, it's ads. And if you don't have success running ads, you're not going to invest with ads. And I know we talk about the tariffs and if you're living under a rock or like avoiding the news, good on you. But like, this is coming and it's hurting people's wallets and like my assumptions in the next like six to eight weeks, if the tariffs and stuff continue to go through. I know that like Mark Carney and President Trump sat down in the Oval Office yesterday and they had their first discussion. So Canada was like, super firm. We're not going to become a 51st state. Trump was like, never say never. But we understand, like the White House is not for sale. You're telling us Canada is not for sale. So to that extent, like, we don't know Canada's our number one clients. We don't know where the tariff situation is evolving, but it is happening. And like, we're talking about E commerce, where we see the advantage. Plus, like, this is a tremendous shift that is going to an external impact that anyone who does advertising is going to feel. Because if I cannot prove profitability even at large with advertising on Meta, I'm going to pull from that ecosystem like that. My big thing for Q2 at my company is I'm, I'm trying to meet with every single non Google, TikTok and meta ad network possible so that I could be testing those ad networks with my clients in Q3, because Q4 is a bloodbath on the top three. So if I'm not going to see success on Meta, I'm going to divert that money into another ad network. So Mark is reading what's coming where we need to have better ad delivery so people keep buying ads and AI can probably compound growth faster than a human in some areas of his business.
- [09:15]
Ralph Burns
Absolutely. I mean, can you compete as a media buyer with $65 billion in investment in a technology that's going to be a gazillion times smarter than you in so many different ways to be able to if this thing works. And yes, we're seeing positive results as well. We'll probably have a case study here very shortly between yourself and myself to sort of show what the effect is. But this is still in early days. But that's what this podcast is all about, is talking about the stuff that's coming down the line and also testing it in real time with real money. My chief traffic strategist has already spent a million dollars of his own money and his own businesses to test it prior to bringing it over to tier 11. But anyway, so that's like real money there. The point is, Zuck knows he needs to stay ahead of the curve. And if you've got that big, you know, that, that, that just tidal wave of cash, like, you know, the, the ability to be able to spend 65 billion like that, like you and I go out and buy something for a thousand bucks, it's probably like what he thinks, oh, I don't know, 65 billion. It's kind of a lot. But, you know, we're sitting on 200 billion in cash, so who cares? You know what I mean? So it's like it's nothing. But he realizes that that is going to give them a competitive advantage overall versus the other networks, which, let's not forget here that the main reason why this is happening is not for you and me necessarily. You have very talented media buyers. We have very talented media buyers. This is really, I look at it as like yet another way for them to expand the metaverse of meta in the advertising space is to the small business advertiser, the E Commerce brand, the new Shopify store, who's like, maybe they're a couple hundred thousand in revenue, or maybe they've made their first five figure months, or maybe like, those are the people that this stuff is really targeting because that's going to expand the usage of the platform even more, which is, I think, the number one thing that they want. Secondly, to that, that means more competition. That means maybe at a later date, this is going to be even more competitive. And we know that one thing to be true in all platforms. CPMs don't go down typically.
- [11:34]
Lauren Petrulo
Well, we have inflation in the ad network as we do with cash. And I will say, like, with that competition, it's like we've had great guests on the show. Like, we've talked about TikTok, we've talked about Shopify, like, these different ad networks and ways that you can put your money. Like, I cannot emphasize how great shop campaigns have been for our clients. That's something that I learned. If you remember, like, Anders came on the show and he was telling us, like, with the winter update, how that became available for all Shopify stores, not just Shopify plus, which was where it was exclusive before we've rolled this out even on the clients that we're consulting with or clients that like may not be a good fit that shop the shop campaigns is a practically guaranteed roas. No one else can do that. And that has allowed us to shift some serious money from some accounts because this is the in app roas that is as trackable as it can be. Because Shopify owns the ad network. Shopify has all the stuff. So they are providing your consumers with the gap between what they're willing to pay and what you're willing to pay for that consumer. So they're giving away $10 shop pay coupons for for your store. They're incentivizing reasons for people to buy within shop campaigns a la Fetch how Fetch has been doing it so well. So I think like Fetch and shop campaigns and more ad networks that are coming out that own the full ecosystem of the user they're so successful. Whereas like Mark Zuckerberg's team has it Shop like Instagram Shop Meta Shops has been around for years and they have not nailed a system the way that others Instacart's ad network same situation. I mean granted that's exclusively for brands that are being sold in other stores. Like you have to have a wholesale channel for it to work. But there's ad networks that are working very well outside of Facebook, Google and TikTok that have incentivized people to invest into those platforms. And shop campaigns is the one that I think most listeners, if you have a Shopify store can easily jump into and try. So I know we're talking about what's working now. Like I am telling you, it's doing very well.
- [13:47]
Ralph Burns
I think it's totally relevant to this whole conversation is that Metta is trying to get bigger. At the same time, the goal of getting bigger is to take a lot of the media buying, not necessarily strategy, but the day to day like button pushing as we sort of refer to it out of it, but also put it in the hands of the small business owner to be able to expand the market. Now we've seen this happen many times before, usually when there's a lot of rookie money coming into play or in the case of like Cyber Monday, Black Friday, Cyber Monday, Black Friday, Cyber Monday. I always say Cyber Monday, Black Friday. But it's really sort of the reverse. There's a lot of stupid money that comes in there. Like you and I both know that huge brands just pouring money in CPMs rise as a result. So I think what you're talking about here is Alternatives to this machine that is still working and is going to get even more powerful over time. And I know that Meta, like, they have so much data. Well, last time we checked, it was 55,000 data points on each individual. That was like three years old. I gotta figure that's 10x now.
- [14:50]
Lauren Petrulo
I imagine so, yeah, like, especially with AI being involved in WhatsApp and Instagram, like, now you have more of those conversational pieces and like the decentralization of search. There's a lot of search bars that are now leaning to how you search and chat. People aren't saying, like, red boots. They're like red boots that I can wear at a bachelorette party in Nashville, Tennessee in July. Like, people are having expanded search. Like, we're evolving as consumers. And I think this, like $65 billion investment from Mark is a really good ploy because, like, I'll take it back to my Disney days. Disney World wanted to do everything they could to get you into their, what a 47 square miles. It's the same size as San Francisco or twice the size of Manhattan. Like, Disney World is massive. But Disney World was never able to get a monorail from the airport to Disney. They were like, Orlando, we will give you whatever you need. We'll bend over backwards, let us have a free train from the airport to Disney World. And Orlando was like, no way. You'll monopolize the vacationer. Because then they never have a chance to put their money in anything. Universal, SeaWorld, Legoland Taxis. That's like, if you don't know this, sorry, Like, I come from Disney, I live in Orlando. This is why I know so much of these things. But hopefully some people like to get out. But yeah, if you know the monorail which transports you from Magic Kingdom to some of the resorts, to Epcot, they wanted to install that from the airport. And Orlando has terrible transportation. So the only ways that you can leave Orlando Airport to Disney World is you can rent a car. They used to have a Magical Express. There's other ways that you can get to Disney World, but what's happening is that then people are being exposed to other places they can spend their money. And I think that's what's happening with meta. We are divesting money off of Meta. Sometimes people are going to continue to look for easier, fewer buttons for them to push with a guaranteed roas. Meta owns more information on the consumer and they have to rebuild the system because otherwise that those dollars are being diverted to other places. Which is good because you don't put all Your eggs in one basket. But I think it's a bit of a reckoning that's coming that Mark Zuckerberg and his team of brilliant humans are hyper aware of.
- [17:00]
Ralph Burns
Yeah, totally. So let's talk about that in the time we have left here. I mean we're talking about meta getting bigger and more powerful and then bringing in new advertisers. We're also talking about, we still don't really know what the effects of the tariffs are. We're going to put a pin in that, as everyone likes to say. Now you ever notice like everyone is using that same expression, let's put a pin in that. It was like, let's think outside of the box. Anyway, let's put a pin in that for right now because you're talking about other advertising platforms. We had TikTok on here for three shows. We're having Snapchat coming on very soon.
- [17:36]
Lauren Petrulo
Woohoo. I'm so excited by the way, like really excited because I have questions for them actually. Wait, Ralph, since we get to tell people that they're coming, like this is exciting. If you're in our telegram group and you have a question for Snap, like if you have tested Snap ads, I would love to know at our agency, our most successful Snapchat ads, like we worked on a huge account that was spending more than anyone could possibly imagine on a daily basis. Like I'm like too intimidated to say the numbers out loud anyways. You can, if you read my lips and you're watching YouTube, you might be able to figure out how much it was a day. It was a lot.
- [18:11]
Ralph Burns
Perpetual traffic for/YouTube.
- [18:13]
Lauren Petrulo
Okay, but to that like at volume, Snapchat was amazing. And then at smaller ad budgets, Snapchat really worked well for the non obvious Snapchat audience. And I'm talking older adults because people assume Snapchat is predominantly like Gen Alpha, Gen Z. But we had success on smaller limited budgets for the 50 plus crowd. So I'm excited for Snapchat to come back because. And if you've tested it, like if you're in the Telegram group, submit your questions because I'm coming hard because like I told you, my biggest goal is I need coming in hot. I need to find other networks because if I'm over reliant on Facebook, Google or TikTok, I'm just paying more when there's opportunities for paying less. And what I'm thinking is I believe what Zuckerberg is aware of that many others are thinking about. And he's like no, no, stay, stay Stay. I'm like, show me why.
- [19:11]
Ralph Burns
Well, I mean if it's more powerful and it's better than it is right now, I mean we're seeing lifts on both of our ends. Like that is a reason to stay. However, if you were, and this is part of what's working now, which is fascinating, if you were to say, okay, we've got the two big ones, Google and meta. All right everybody, we talk about those all the time.
- [19:30]
Lauren Petrulo
I'll say TikTok is the next tier. Like that's the third is TikTok.
- [19:34]
Ralph Burns
If you're a Shopify store. TikTok shops. Am I assuming like or what else in there?
- [19:41]
Lauren Petrulo
Even for lead gen, they have that native lead form which is great. So it's a new resource to build your top of funnel. I think it's an Incredible discovery platform. TikTok shops obviously when you have that direct integration. They do have like the Advantage plus equivalent if you're driving website conversions, which we got to talk about with their team a lot.
- [19:59]
Ralph Burns
We'll leave links in the show notes for that one.
- [20:01]
Lauren Petrulo
It should be a part of your media mix. I would say after Google and meta, the obvious next one is TikTok. Assuming YouTube is counted within your Google Ads, by the way, for that disclosure.
- [20:13]
Ralph Burns
Well, I think most people hopefully at this point in time know that Google only YouTube is part of Google.
- [20:19]
Lauren Petrulo
I, I have people asking me, well, what about Instagram ads? When I'm like, here's our Facebook budget.
- [20:24]
Ralph Burns
I know, isn't that crazy? It's like I have to. I mean, I still say Facebook every now and then about meta, but it's like meta is like, it's a lot of things.
- [20:34]
Lauren Petrulo
They're pushing it so hard. It's all on their like mini dev. If you look at business portfolio, if you log in@business facebook.com, it's like meta business. Meta for business, formerly known as Facebook for business. So they're in that transition. They're using some of those dollars to have a more uniformed perspective. But yeah, so after Facebook and Google, I would just say that TikTok is a very strong contender. And I know it was hot in the news and people didn't think it was going to have anything with it. I never thought it was going away. It's too much of a contributor to the economy. But yeah, that would be the top three. So that's why I'm like desperate to find like what are my 4, 5 and 6.
- [21:10]
Ralph Burns
So the other one is. That's interesting. And this recently came out Is that threads, which was the fastest. Is it still the fastest growing app at that point in time when it was launched through Instagram? Now we'll have ads on it. We don't have any data on that too. But I mean as far as like what's working now and just like breaking news, that's one of the things that did come out from Meta this past week. Our partner manager messaged us about, about that just a short while ago, right before, you know, about four or five days ago, prior to this podcast here. So super interesting. But yeah, Meta is now threads including, but also Instagram, like go through it.
- [21:49]
Lauren Petrulo
As an additional placement. Right. So that you'll have the ability. Now we at Mongoose Media, we like again we just heard about threads being released as well. So we are trying to figure out how are ways that we can do advertising specific to that platform. So what's working now at a high level like Ralph and anyone that's listening for sure is just personalization and relevancy. So like you want to have ads that make sense for that platform. You don't want to have just the same ad everywhere. And the best way I can describe this is if you're taking the train and you can see those billboard ads that take up very specific sizes. They're made to fit those placements. The best one I had ever seen was, I think it was Giovanni Rana, the Italian pasta company. They had like a before, immediately before, after. So there are three different billboards based off of how that building was set up, where it was before.
- [22:42]
Ralph Burns
Yeah, it's cool analogy actually.
- [22:44]
Lauren Petrulo
You. Yeah. Oh, like the way. Oh, thanks.
- [22:47]
Ralph Burns
I like that.
- [22:47]
Lauren Petrulo
But it's like when you can have.
- [22:48]
Ralph Burns
It play off of your environment when you're in Nashville.
- [22:52]
Lauren Petrulo
I appreciate it. No, I wouldn't say only Nashville, but I appreciate it. Ralph.
- [22:58]
Ralph Burns
Keep things going. People say too much rapport building. Come on, come on. Keep things snappy.
- [23:04]
Lauren Petrulo
Personalize relevancy to the location. So same as like for a lot of, like a lot of people that know like, I love pornhub as an advertising platform, but you have to use pornhub relate. You have to be mindful of it. I know we're going to ruin our reading, but if you're not advertising on Pornhub, it's an amazing.
- [23:20]
Ralph Burns
So it's Meta, then Google, YouTube, then TikTok, then Pornhub top four.
- [23:27]
Lauren Petrulo
It depends. Depends on what you're selling that are not interested in being present on pornhub. The reality is it's one of the best websites you can spend nothing to get, but you have to, you have to have it. Relevancy, right? Like we're having ads for Mongoose Media that I say click here before you finish and then it goes to a VSL where I'm talking about, hey, if you want to stop blue balls in your bottom line and want an erection in your sales, call us.
- [23:50]
Ralph Burns
There goes the rating on podcast. There it goes. Apple, you know what? Apologizing in advance. You know why?
- [23:58]
Lauren Petrulo
Why? We have nothing to apologize for.
- [24:00]
Ralph Burns
One, just so we don't get delisted by the Apple gods, which are coming out with their own ad network, by the way. And that's another thing.
- [24:06]
Lauren Petrulo
But we knew that was coming when they made it so that like Best Buy and AT and T and all these brands can have their text. But sorry, I'm just going to finish this one thing of the relevancy we're doing with Threads. You want to be strategic about that placement. So we are. Our approach right now is how do we use Threads as an ad placement? Not for a conversion goal that's typical of other platforms, but for a conversation starting goal. Because what threads is, is a place for people to connect. Social media is social first. So threads is socialization. So our ads that we are going to launch first with threads are going to be starting conversations that our brand can command. So if you're in the sexual health space, if you're in the weight loss space, what is something that your audience is actively talking about, thinking about, you get to start the discussion. And the way Zuckerberg has explained meta and social media for them is this is your public living room, this is your town hall. Bring people into the conversation. And when you're facilitating that conversation, you're guiding it. You're showcasing your expertise, you're building your ability to know like and trust your audience with you, and then you can present solutions that they're relying on to work.
- [25:22]
Ralph Burns
Makes sense. All right, last but not least, I wanted to ask you this. Any tips that you have for people? Because we're mentioning TikTok Shops is sort of like your third platform or the one that you should test first.
- [25:34]
Lauren Petrulo
TikTok. Not just shops, TikTok shops for placement.
- [25:37]
Ralph Burns
I know you're specifically mentioning TikTok shops as like the first place you would go for if you're an E commerce brand. No.
- [25:46]
Lauren Petrulo
Oh. TikTok Shops and shop campaigns. I'll put both of them. You can't scale shop campaigns the same way you can scale TikTok shops. TikTok shops. You can just keep going until you run out shop campaigns. You're extremely limited by the number of impressions they can do because it's basically guaranteed roi. So I would love to give them a million dollars because I know I'm going to get a million dollars of sales. You only pay on the purchase, so. Yeah, well, you set the parameters. You can say what do you need the ROAS to be? Anyways, yeah, TikTok shop is amazing, but I would explore TikTok not just for e commerce because their TikTok they have native lead gen so you can get people into your ecosystem and it's a really good discovery platform that then you can convert on Google, YouTube and Facebook later.
- [26:28]
Ralph Burns
Like, what's your thoughts? Just at a very high level on TikTok for lead gen because it was one of the big conversations we had and they didn't really. I don't think they really had a great answer for you when they were on here couple months back. Anyway, what's your thoughts?
- [26:42]
Lauren Petrulo
It was when we started as I hadn't even known that it was there. My reality is, is I know that over 80% of people that get into our ecosystem for anyone that's generating leads are never ever, ever, ever, ever going to buy. So if I can generate marketing qualified subscribers and I say subscribers hard because I don't think you're a lead until you've shown me proof of life. And proof of life is clicking or replying to an email. So if I can get people into my ecosystem even cheaper, like mud ads is dirt cheap, but I'm able to ask specific questions and I can get them in the ecosystem. Absolutely. I'm doing it on TikTok because it's the same audience and I know people are like personally I know people that are abandoning Instagram because it's too much and they're using TikTok because those algorithms are providing them more content that helps them learn to be a better entrepreneur. So I know they're spending more time on TikTok so I'm going to capture their information when they're currently in The I'm watching TikTok to learn about AI. I'm watching TikTok to learn about how to eat healthier. I'm watching Instagram for puppy videos and pranks.
- [27:45]
Ralph Burns
It's true. It's become. Well, it's so true though because TikTok has become like for so many people, like the default search when they're searching the way that a lot of people will search YouTube for discovery and or education the same Thing have the user behavior is very similar over on TikTok.
- [28:05]
Lauren Petrulo
I love that you did that because the other day so I just presented at founders board here in Nashville which is why I'm here. I had done like my email triage and just talking about how these micro changes lead to macro growth and I was doing it in Canva and I was like why? How do I animate this so that each bullet goes through and I'm layering like White Lotus gifs. I thought I was hilarious with them. If you're not watching the show, who are you? But whatever I made I used to use Schitt's Creek, now I'm using White Lotus Gifts.
- [28:32]
Ralph Burns
I tend to go heavy on one show but anyway keep going.
- [28:35]
Lauren Petrulo
Yeah, absolutely have continuity. So in that I use chat for search. Honestly I rely on chat for search but they fail me on instruction videos. I like to watch videos. So I will always go to Google for my default searching because I don't want to search on a social media app because it will suck me in and I'm like avoid, avoid.
- [28:55]
Ralph Burns
It is true.
- [28:56]
Lauren Petrulo
I'll Google because they're too good almost. I know, I know, I know my.
- [29:01]
Ralph Burns
So it's like a how to search. Like if you do a how to search on TikTok it's too much for you.
- [29:07]
Lauren Petrulo
Yes, because I'll get distracted and be like oh this is good too.
- [29:11]
Ralph Burns
It's one of the reasons why I tend to not use TikTok at all because it's like it is so good. It's so incredibly addicting. Which is probably one of the bigger reasons for you to potentially think about advertising.
- [29:24]
Lauren Petrulo
Recommend everyone to give a shot to the legion side because it's such an under underutilized aspect of TikTok advertising. But TikTok videos, if you're not posting your videos on TikTok you should because they have a higher increase rank on Google. And so I learned how to animate because of a TikTok video that showed up in my Google feed.
- [29:42]
Ralph Burns
That's great. And last but not least on lead gen if somebody has not listened to your diatribes multiple on the show in the last two years on lead gen on TikTok how do you make sure that it's qualified lead or a subscriber not yet a lead but then like what are the quick down and dirty there?
- [30:02]
Lauren Petrulo
You always ask a pre qualifying question so that they can opt out as being qualified and you kick them out. You don't want them in for like if you're a business that's not spending X amount a month. Or if you're not doing X amount a year, I might not have a solution for you on the agency side. That can work maybe on the group coaching or the private consulting. But like, I, I need to filter you into whichever bucket makes the most sense. If you only serve, for example, I'm like, what's closest near me? Okay, Stanley cup, right? I say you only serve it. Have a Stanley cup made for athletes. And you ask, how active are you? You're like, not at all. Okay, cool. You already know that they're a disqualified person. So you always have to have a qualifying question that allows you to eliminate someone.
- [30:44]
Ralph Burns
It's your knockout question is your first question. Got it. Makes sense. All right. You know, we just, just took on a franchise. They're like, what's your first question? They just gave us the form and everything. It was not, are you a homeowner? Because it has to be that. It's like, if you're not a homeowner, they're not going to do any sort of improvements on their house like you do not. So there's your qualifying question. Anyway, knockout question. That's the big tip right there. That's what's working. Now, I know you got to check out at your hotel room, so I don't want you to incur any late fees here. Keep Robbie waiting, but we'll leave all links over in the show notes. All those TikTok episodes. If you didn't listen to that series, I would highly recommend you go back to that. We sort of hit on a lot of the high level stuff here. It was really good. Like, we got some of the smartest people on TikTok there, especially in the advertising.
- [31:29]
Lauren Petrulo
We had huge executives. Like, we had the people direct in the place, and I saw some of them at Shop Talk in Vegas, which is amazing because they are boots on the ground when they have something like a Shop Talk, which is probably like a 200 to 400,000 investment that they made to have that booth. But otherwise they are, they are in the system. They are leading the charge of these products. So if you don't have the ability to pay over five grand just to get a ticket to go to Shop Talk where you could meet those teams, you can listen to the episodes and have access to what they said. And I'm not sure, I'm sure if everyone remembers, but one of them gave their direct email in the recording to say, reach out to me if you have questions.
- [32:16]
Ralph Burns
That's like, what do they call that like the hidden gem? No, that's the Easter egg. That's it. I knew there was a name for it. All right, we'll leave links over in the show notes over@petpetualtraffic.com of course, you can watch this over on perpetual traffic.com YouTube. That's our YouTube channel. You can see us and you can see you in Nashville. See, there you go. There's a sale right there.
- [32:37]
Lauren Petrulo
It's like my brother is right next to me.
- [32:39]
Ralph Burns
Yeah, it's amazing. It's such a visual representation on Broadway.
- [32:43]
Lauren Petrulo
Just a plain background. I'm in the kitchen of the hotel rooms. I'm like, super boring.
- [32:48]
Ralph Burns
It's okay. It's fine that the juices and what we squeezed here in the episode. So there you go. I don't even know what that means. All right, well, like I said, all links are over in the show notes. Make sure that you do leave a rating and review. We actually do read them and respond to them, even if they're negative.
- [33:02]
Lauren Petrulo
I appreciate the feedback. It's not that it's negative necessarily. It's honest. And I think that we can't improve if we don't know how to.
- [33:10]
Ralph Burns
That's true.
- [33:11]
Lauren Petrulo
We can guess. We appreciate you all. Thank you so much.
- [33:14]
Ralph Burns
Yeah, thank you all. All right, well, that's it for this week's show. So on behalf of my amazing co host, Lauren e Petrulo, ciao till next show. See ya.