Philosophy Bites: Lewis Gordon on Frantz Fanon

Original air date: October 17, 2025
Hosts: David Edmonds & Nigel Warburton
Guest: Lewis Gordon (Author of What Fanon Said)

Overview

In this episode, Lewis Gordon, a preeminent Fanon scholar and philosopher, discusses the thought and legacy of Frantz Fanon with hosts David Edmonds and Nigel Warburton. They explore Fanon's biography, key philosophical insights (especially from Black Skin, White Masks), his approach to colonialism, dehumanization, violence, and visions for postcolonial society. Gordon emphasizes Fanon’s radical humanism, his deep concern for existential authenticity, and how his interdisciplinary legacy continues to influence global philosophical, political, and psychiatric thought.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Frantz Fanon’s Life and Context

[00:47-01:31]

• Short, Remarkable Life: Fanon died at 36; born in 1925 in Martinique—the same year as other revolutionary figures like Malcolm X and Patrice Lumumba.
• Interdisciplinary "Rock Star": Gordon positions Fanon as "a rock star, superstar, canonical figure... in philosophy and in psychiatry and in revolutionary thought" ([00:56], Lewis Gordon).
• Creole Roots and Philosophical Humanism: Growing up Creole in a French colony shaped Fanon's insights. The Afro-Francophone Creole language—where "there is... no separation between the person and the body"—influenced his refusal to separate dignity from humanity, even in death ([01:41], Gordon).

2. Fanon as Polymath: Physician, Philosopher, Activist

[02:28-03:30]

• Fanon’s multiple roles are not unusual in the history of philosophy (e.g., Imhotep, William James). Philosophy, like medicine, is "a practice at the intellectual level of healing" ([02:42], Gordon).

3. Black Skin, White Masks - Core Arguments

[03:30-08:55]

• Sick Society: Fanon critiques colonialism for producing "sociogenetic" disorders—societal structures causing both psychological and political suffering ([03:38], Gordon).
• Two Kinds of Lies:
  • Lie 1: Black inferiority—"seals black people into our skin"
  • Lie 2: White superiority—the "white mask" that white people don
  • Result: "If some people are put above human and some people are below human, what happens to the human being?... the attempted murder of humanity." ([04:46], Gordon)
• Mental Health and Colonization: For Fanon, "sometimes the people who suffer the most... suffer from actually being healthy." The real problem is societal injustice, not individual pathology ([05:51], Gordon).
• Narcissism: Both victim-centered inferiority and superiority are forms of narcissism—forms of "living a lie" ([05:51–08:55], Gordon).

4. Decolonization and the Post-Colonial Vision

[08:55-11:34]

• Response to Dehumanization: Create "a more humane and human world... not a perfect world, but... a better world" ([09:16], Gordon).
• Nation-State Critique: Fanon supported national liberation as a step, but saw the nation-state as an ongoing barrier to true equality. He and others pressed for broader federations, e.g., a "United States of Africa" ([09:16], Gordon).
• Radical Humanist: Ultimately, Fanon was dedicated to "the liberation of humankind," not merely Africa-specific liberation ([11:19], Gordon).

5. Fanon on Violence and Nonviolence

[11:34-15:34]

• Misconceptions: Fanon is often misunderstood as an advocate for violence. In reality, he "detested violence," seeing it as dehumanizing ([11:52], Gordon).
• The Dilemma: If you do nothing amid oppression, you are complicit; if you act, you will be labeled violent by oppressors. "There's only one thing you could do that they would accept as non violence... for you to do nothing." ([12:47], Gordon)
• Counter Violence vs. Violence: Fanon makes a distinction between violence to perpetuate domination and violence as resistance—a struggle that aims to make violence obsolete ([13:17], Gordon).
• Healthy vs. Unhealthy Conflict: "Conflicts that are designed to strengthen relationships are healthy... Conflicts that are designed to eliminate the other are unhealthy. Those are war. Fanon was against the latter, but he was for the former." ([14:51], Gordon)

6. Civil Rights and Broader Liberation Movements

[15:34-17:35]

• The US civil rights movement was about inclusion and rights, paralleling other movements like women's, LGBTQ, and Native American rights ([15:43], Gordon).
• Fanon’s critique of decolonization extends to struggles that seek to shift who is the colonizer, not to end colonization itself.

7. Fanon’s Pragmatic Humanism

[17:35-19:26]

• Fanon was a pragmatist, not utopian. He sought reasonableness and "human maturity" rather than perfection ([17:44], Gordon).
• Critique of rulers who presented themselves as so perfect "there’s no room for the next generation to create the country in a way that is livable for them" ([18:30], Gordon).

8. Influence and Legacy

[19:26-22:45]

• Fanon’s influence pervades decolonial thought, African diasporic studies, psychiatry, and existentialism ([19:28], Gordon).
• Part of the philosophical lineage from Marx to Sartre, urging humanity to take its future into its own hands.
• Radical Hope: “Humanity is also a yes.” ([20:37], Gordon)
• Charisma and Humanity: Fanon's "rock star, handsome" persona captivated people, but Gordon warns against fixating on biography over thought: "There is a tendency with black thinkers to talk so much about their lives, we forget their thought. And that is a form of dehumanization of them. So I tend to focus on his thoughts. And his thought was extraordinary. He's worth reading, even if you were butt ugly. But he was very fortunate to be rock star handsome." ([21:05-22:45], Gordon)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Fanon’s Character and Legacy:
  "Fanon is a rock star, superstar, canonical figure, not only in the global south, but in philosophy and in psychiatry and in revolutionary thought." — Lewis Gordon [00:56]

• The Nature of Racism and Dehumanization:
  "If some people are put above human and some people are below human, what happens to the human being? Fanon describes what happens as the attempted murder of humanity." — Lewis Gordon [04:46]

• On Societal Sickness:
  "Sometimes the people who suffer the most in a society suffer from actually being healthy." — Lewis Gordon [03:38]

• Fanon on Action and Violence:
  “If you stand on the side and permit it to happen, you’re complicit with violence. For Fanon, you need to be an agent. You need to act against violence. But if you actively act against violence, you get entangled in violence and you will be called violent.” — Lewis Gordon [12:15]

• On Idealism and Maturity:
  "Fanon, I would argue as a psychiatrist and as a philosopher, was also arguing for human maturity. In other words, a lot of his arguments — oh, humanity, please grow up now." — Lewis Gordon [19:03]

• On Fanon’s Appeal:
  "He's worth reading, even if you were butt ugly. But he was very fortunate to be rock star handsome." — Lewis Gordon [22:37]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Fanon’s Biography and Roots: [00:47–01:41]
• On Philosophy and Medicine: [02:28–03:30]
• Thesis of Black Skin, White Masks: [03:30–08:55]
• Decolonization and Vision for Society: [08:55–11:34]
• Fanon on Violence and Action: [11:34–15:34]
• Relations to US Civil Rights, Other Movements: [15:34–17:35]
• Pragmatism and Human Maturity: [17:35–19:26]
• Fanon’s Influence & Charisma: [19:26–22:45]

Conclusion

Lewis Gordon provides an accessible yet rich account of Frantz Fanon’s enduring philosophical, political, and human legacy. Fanon’s radical humanism, his analysis of societal sickness under colonialism, and his insistence that true liberation is global and humane, not merely political, remain potent and relevant. Gordon’s reading connects Fanon to broad existential and decolonial traditions, underlining both the depth of his thought and the charisma that made him—and his ideas—unforgettable.