“Attention-Seeking D***!” Kanye West BANNED + Steven Crowder on Trump Iran War & More

Summary

Podcast Summary: “Attention-Seeking D***!” Kanye West BANNED + Steven Crowder on Trump Iran War & More

Piers Morgan Uncensored | April 10, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this provocative episode, Piers Morgan and guests dissect the UK government’s decision to ban Kanye West (“Ye”) from performing at the Wireless festival due to his history of antisemitic remarks and Nazi references. The discussion spans the boundaries of free speech, mental health as a defense, and where lines should be drawn for public safety. The latter half of the episode features Steven Crowder debating American and British standards of free expression, the Trump-Iran war controversy, feminism and the trans sports debate, and ideological splits shaping the US political scene.

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Kanye West Ban: Free Speech vs. Public Good

Key Participants:

• Piers Morgan (Host)
• Hen Mazzig (Israeli author, commentator, Jewish community advocate)
• Winston Marshall (Musician, podcast host, known for public disagreements with cancel culture)

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[00:30–07:55] The Decision to Ban Kanye (“Ye”) and Its Justification

• Background: The UK government revoked Kanye’s entry for planned performances, citing his pro-Hitler statements, swastika merchandise, and incendiary lyrics (“Heil Hitler”).
• Mazzig: Asserts that Kanye’s actions cross the line from speech into real-world harm; references over 30 reported incidents of antisemitic violence linked to Kanye.
  • “When you see...over 30 incidents that were antisemitic violence related to Kanye West, according to the ADL...when violence is coming into play, then us as a Jewish community facing unprecedented levels...we are feeling afraid for our safety.” – Hen Mazzig [03:28]
• Piers Morgan: Challenges consistency—why defend Roseanne Barr after a racist tweet but support banning Kanye? Mazzig clarifies Kanye’s actions are on another level (Nazi merch and explicit lyrics).

Double Standards, Racism vs. Antisemitism

• Morgan: Accuses Mazzig of a double standard regarding support of Roseanne Barr vs. condemnation of Kanye.
• Mazzig: Differentiates the scale and persistence of Kanye’s rhetoric vs. a singular racist incident.
  • “Roseanne Barr did not say, ‘Heil Hitler.’ She didn’t sell merchandise with swastikas. She didn’t.” – Hen Mazzig [05:27]
• On Mental Health: Mazzig skeptical of Kanye’s Nth apology; posits that mental health can’t excuse repeated antisemitism.

[07:55–14:14] Winston Marshall’s Contrarian View

• Marshall: Argues Kanye shouldn’t be banned—if antisemitism is a genuine concern, it’s broader than just rappers; points to anti-Jewish violence mainly rooted elsewhere.
  • “Jews are being killed in this country, and they’re not being killed by rappers.” – Winston Marshall [08:10]
• Morgan’s Counter: Kanye’s influence (33M followers) risks normalizing and spreading hateful tropes.
• Discussion: Draws parallels to UK bans of others who incite violence or support terror groups (e.g., Bob Villain).

[14:14–19:13] Where’s the Line? Artists, Activists, and Incitement

• Accountability vs. Artistic Expression:
  • The guests debate the line between an artist’s stage persona and incitement—if “Heil Hitler” is legit hate or just musical provocation.
  • Marshall: “If Kanye was coming to London and holding a Nazi rally, absolutely, I’d be against it. If it’s art, you’re in a sticky situation.”
• Morgan’s Standard:
  • “A headliner who doesn’t embrace the Nazis would be a good start.” – Piers Morgan [19:21]

[20:00–22:13] Hate Speech, Free Speech & Legal Consistency

• Are UK hate speech laws applied evenly? Should pro-Hamas chants and Nazi salutes both be treated as criminal incitement?
• Morgan: “I’m at a loss to understand the difference between saying ‘I support Hamas’ and ‘Heil Hitler.’”
• Marshall and Mazzig: Argue for nuanced and consistent application, cautioning that bans can fuel conspiracy theories about Jewish “power.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Piers Morgan:
  • “I just think Kanye, in the end, is a bit of a dickhead who just wants attention.” [28:01]
• Hen Mazzig:
  • “If he did it twice, maybe we have a conversation. But four times—there’s a pattern here.” [11:31]
• Winston Marshall:
  • “This is one of the greatest, if not the greatest musician of our generation. Won something like 24 Grammys.” [10:15]

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Redemption and Apology—Where's the Path?

• Morgan: Presses Mazzig on what Kanye would need to do for readmission; Mazzig insists on “meaningful engagement with the Jewish community”, not PR stunts. [27:24–28:01]
• Repeated apologies before album releases and lack of meaningful outreach demonstrate insincerity.

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[29:02–36:37] Steven Crowder Joins: US v UK Free Speech and the Kanye Question

Segment Guest: Steven Crowder (host of Louder with Crowder)

• Crowder’s Stance: Private venues should be free to book controversial acts; government bans represent a dangerous slope.
  • “If a private business wants to bring him in, they can do that if people will pay for the tickets.” [30:12]
• Morgan probes US hypocrisy: US has banned several foreign artists and now screens for “anti-American activity.”
• Crowder’s View on Kanye’s “mental health card”:
  • “I think he can be both (mentally ill and narcissistic). But this just seems like another overstep from the UK.” [35:02]
• Parallel Discussion: Enforcement is inconsistent across UK, US, and Europe; Crowder dislikes when speech is policed for ideas rather than actions.

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[36:37–42:18] Trump, Iran War, and Deep Divisions Among US Conservatives

• Morgan: Challenges Crowder about Trump's Easter Sunday threats toward Iran, asks if this rhetoric is appropriate for a president.
• Crowder: Dismisses language concerns (“I don’t care about naughty words”), critiques Trump’s lumping all Iranians with the regime (ill advised), but maintains Trump’s stance has long been “Iran can’t have a nuke.”

Conservative Split on War

• Traditional Republican unity on foreign strikes is fractured; some prominent right-wing commentators (Tucker, Megyn Kelly) blast Trump's actions.
• Crowder’s Argument: The split is more among media than ordinary voters. Trump’s anti-Iran stance is consistent and long-stated.

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[46:32–61:07] Broader Culture Wars: Feminism, Trans Women in Sports, and Campus Free Speech

Gavin Newsom & Democratic Identity Politics

• Morgan & Crowder lampoon California’s first lady’s recent comments on “patriarchy” and “femininity,” suggesting modern feminism is self-defeating.
  • “If you want to look for the root evils...look at feminism in the 1960s...this idea that men and women are fundamentally interchangeable.” – Steven Crowder [49:26]

Trans Athletes & Science

• Morgan: Rails against Megan Rapinoe’s claim that the Olympic ban on trans women isn’t “science based.”
  • “What could be more science based than that people born with male physiology shouldn’t be competing against women?” [52:52]
• Crowder: Backs up with data (swimming, bone density, testosterone), accuses left of “moral relativism” and suppressing dissent.

University Free Speech & Safety

• Crowder describes the University of Pennsylvania blocking a live-streamed debate and needing heavy security after threats, highlighting suppression of intellectual diversity on campuses.
  • “If I was a jazz musician, I could livestream it. But a transparent debate ... can’t happen. These people don’t give a rat’s ass about intellectual diversity.” [58:06–61:38]

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Final Reflections

• Morgan closes: The UK and US are both sliding on free speech, each in its way. Steven Crowder and Morgan agree on the value of robust dissent (“You irritate me sometimes but I very much enjoy our conversations.” – Crowder [61:51])
• Crowder, on political choices: “You’re not going to get the perfect candidate...you’ll have deplatforming and socialism light, best case scenario [if you don’t vote for Trump].” [44:48–46:32]

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Key Timestamps

Kanye Ban:

• [00:30–07:55] – Initial debate on banning Kanye, hate vs. free speech
• [07:55–14:14] – Is Kanye responsible for antisemitic violence?
• [14:14–19:24] – Double standards: Nazis vs. Hamas in UK law
• [19:23–22:13] – Free speech, hate speech, mental health excuses
• [27:24–28:01] – What would redemption look like for Kanye?

Steven Crowder Segment:

• [29:02–36:37] – Crowder on private vs. public bans, US/UK hypocrisy
• [36:37–42:18] – Trump: Iran, rhetorical violence, a divided right
• [46:32–49:26] – Newsom’s wife, patriarchy, feminism critique
• [52:52–55:46] – Trans women in sport, is science being denied?
• [58:06–61:38] – Campus speech, university censorship, and security

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Conclusion

This fiery episode lays bare the lacerating pressures on modern free speech—balancing artistic provocation against public safety, the limits of apology and rehabilitation, and the messy realities of partisan hypocrisy in both Britain and America. From Kanye West’s ban and mental health pleas, through Trump’s polarizing rhetoric, to the ideological culture wars over gender and campus debate, Morgan and guests provide an unvarnished, sometimes combative, and always uncensored take on who should be allowed a platform—and at what cost.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

The government stepped in to deny the rapper access to the country.

[C]

This is one of the greatest, if not the greatest musician of our generation. It's won something like 24 Grammys. Jews are being killed in this country and they're not being killed by rappers.

[D]

It's always this double edged sword that the Jews need to decide are we going to call out antisemitism or are we going to have Kanye west going on a stage here in Finsbury park and maybe telling people Heil Hitler. And people repeating it.

[E]

People can't do karaoke covers of Kung Fu Fighting in the UK without being fined or jailed.

[B]

I just think Kanye in the end is a bit of a dickhead who just wants attention. Genocidal rhetoric is a legitimate and successful negotiating tactic, or so I've been told this week, but clearly not when it comes to performing at music festivals. Kanye west, who likes to be called Yay. Has now been banned from entering the UK to play the Wireless festival. Over his past support for Adolf Hitler. The government said his entry to the UK would not be conducive to the public good, a decision which resulted in the entire festival being cancelled. Clearly the UK has the right to deny Kanye's entry, but is it the right decision? We'll later on get the views of Steven Crowder. He's facing a free speech battle all of his own. But first, here in the studio to debate this Israeli author and commentator Hen Mazig and Winston Marshall, host of the Winston Marshall show and a cancelled musician. So you know exactly how he's feeling. I'll come to you in a moment. Stay coming after me, Hen. Let me start with you. You're a Jewish man. What do you feel about the free speech aspect of this? Obviously everything he said. Yay, Kanye. About Hitler selling merchandise with swastikas on his talk about going defcon to on the Jews, whatever. All these incendiary, awful things. 3 Was it all disgusting, awful anti Semitic things which he has tried to explain as a mental health episode. Only he really knows whether that is the case. Should that be enough so we can all agree that it was all horribly offensive and disgusting? Is that enough to ban him from coming into a country to play concerts when he's just played two sellout shows in LA at the Sophie Stadium? Apparently $33 million worth of ticket sales went down hugely. Well, is it the right decision from a free speech perspective?

[D]

I think the last part is the terrifying thing that so many people still queued up. There were a million people on the line in Ticketmaster to buy tickets to his show. A man that released a song called Heil Hitler sold merchandise with swastika on them. He had black kids singing Heil Hitler in his music video. Horrific, horrific hate speech. I think the issue is when does this hate speech turn into violence? And that's where we put the line. I think most people, most rational people would agree that when hate speech is inciting violence, then we need to draw the line. And that's where I draw the line. And I think that when you see there was over 30 incidents that were anti Semitic violence that was related to Kanye west, according to the ADL that mentioned him. We don't know how many incidents that mentioned Hitler were also inspired by him. It might just been Hitler and we didn't know it was inspired by Kanye West. So I think when violence is coming into play, then us as a Jewish community that is facing unprecedented levels of, of antisemitism in the UK and around the world, we are feeling afraid to our safety and rightfully so when we're seeing people being stabbed outside of their synagogues. Is it the right decision to bring someone like this here? No, I don't think so. And I think that the organizers of the festival had to act and they didn't. They failed to act, sponsorship were pulled out, and then the government said, okay, we have a law that banned people from entering if they, whatever law that they were using. But that's the law here. And I don't think, you know, free speech should be protected in this country. But Kanye is not a British citizen. He wanted to come here to go on stage and sing and maybe do more than just singing. And that's what's terrifying for many of us.

[B]

So how do you square that position with the fact that in 2020 you said about Roseanne Barr when she was racist, I'm good friends used to be with Roseanne Barr when she had a racist tweet that she was cancelled for, it really turned her away from the people who were attacking Her. We're often doing it to people we're canceling. We're beating them up, and they're already on the ground. You supported her over racism. What's the difference?

[D]

Yeah, Roseanne and I were good friends, and I. And when everything went down, I did speak to her, and that was right after the tweet was coming up. I was trying to help her realize the racism from my point of view as half North African, half Iraqi Jewish man, queer Jewish men, that has this experience and has this worldview. And I failed to do it. I wasn't able to save her. And then, you know, I turned away.

[B]

But people will say, all right, look, there's a bit of a conflict here. It turns out if you're a mate of yours, you get a pass. If you're not, because you're not, I presume, mates with Kanye, then it's the false ledge hammer. And they will say that that's hypocritical.

[D]

I think that Roseanne Barr didn't say. I mean, Roseanne Barr did not say, heil Hitler. She didn't sell merchandise with swastikas. And she didn't.

[B]

She was. She was blatantly racist.

[D]

She was blatantly racist, and she had a racist tweet. And I think that's.

[B]

Is racism not as bad as anti Semitism?

[D]

It's just. I mean, both. Both hatreds are.

[B]

So you get my point. Yeah. Why people would say there's a double standard.

[D]

Right, but you know Kanye west on

[B]

the free speech part.

[D]

No, but Kanye west was racist to black people as well. In fact, he targeted black women in his hate speech. And Hitler didn't like black people either. So, I mean, it's. Yes, as a Jewish person, I can speak about.

[B]

Do you believe he's mentally ill?

[D]

I'm sure there's some mental illness there. I'm sure. I don't think anyone is doubting it, but I have family members that are mentally ill and suffering. Everyone suffered differently, and it's a serious topic that we need to take seriously. But to let a mentally ill person on stage, that has done so much harm. And by the way, he apologized four times, and every time he went back to the same thing. The same pattern starts from 2022, where he first went against the Jewish community. So there should be compassion. I'm against canceled culture. I think people should be allowed to a path back. But four times and still apologizing and going back to high. Literally, like there's a line.

[B]

I kind of agree. I got to say about this. Although I do think you held yourself slightly hostage to the double standard argument, which a lot of people do on free speech. It's an interesting debate about these things. What do you feel, Winston?

[C]

I mean, do you agree that Kanye should not be allowed?

[B]

Yeah, I actually think for the repeated offenses, the repeated anti Semitism, I. I don't buy it was all driven by mental health episodes. Heil Hitler, for example, was a song he wrote. He then produces it, he markets it, he packages it. This is all going on over a long, sustained period of time. He's not having a mental health episode for that entire duration. I don't think. I'm not a doctor, but I'm very suspicious and cynical about it. I think he's a supreme narcissist who loves attention, who at his best as one of the greatest music stars of my lifetime. But that's not the point. The point is, if you repeatedly goad an entire community in a hateful manner and you embrace people that annihilated that people, and you do it repeatedly over a period of years, and you do a song called Heil Hitler, celebrating the worst genocidal monster of my last hundred years, you know, why should you be able to come into this country and perform at a music festival?

[C]

Well, before I defend why he should be. And I do think Kanye should be there, I think that actually the thing that's most offensive about this incident to me is our prime minister, Keir Starmer, saying the reason why Kanye cannot come to this country is because he, Starmer, wants to do everything he can to confront anti Semitism, the poison of anti Semitism. Well, I'm afraid Jews are being killed in this country, and they're not being killed by rappers. Jews are absolutely under threat. Only this month or last month, we had in London Jewish ambulances being firebombed. Not by rappers. We have a community in Britain, the majority of whom think Jews have too much power in this country. We have a community in Britain, about half of whom think Hamas are good and support Hamas, and they are not the rapper community. Ok, now, the reason I bring this up is. Let me hold you on one point.

[B]

You made one point. You made one point there, which is you talk about Jews have too much power. That was precisely an argument repeated by Kanye when he was trying to justify what he was saying. He repeatedly said in the music business, people at the top are all Jewish. They've all got too much power. They punish artists like him and so on. That was one of his key arguments. He has 33 million followers on X, for example. Right. So my point being. We'll let you finish your point by putting on that. On that issue, the influence of somebody like him cannot be understated. It certainly can't be ignored. If a guy with 33 million followers is saying repeatedly, jews have too much power. Jews, all the tropes that go with all the other stuff he was doing, it has to seep through. So when you say all this stuff is going on, it's got nothing to do with rappers. I say, well, let's not be too hasty in assuming that this stuff filters down. Kanye has enormous influence.

[C]

Yeah. Okay, so let's take them as two separate issues. There is a serious anti Semitism problem, and we all know where it's coming from. It's not coming from rappers. And I don't believe. But how do you know is actually doing.

[B]

I don't know.

[C]

They aren't fueling it because it's specifically an Islam problem.

[B]

Okay. But when you have somebody like. Like him adding fuel to the fire. Okay, he's been doing. So how do you know he's not influencing people to think? Actually, yeah, he's right. Too much power.

[C]

He could be influencing people. But let's start with the basics. This is one of the greatest, if not the greatest musician of our generation. Won something like 24 Grammys again and again and again. He comes out with absolute mega hits. They're all awesome. Some of them are pretty provocative. And he's also a guy who is unwell. He said lots of contradictory things, even in his song N Word. Heil Hitler. Hallelujah. Those three things are not compatible with each other. In fact, in the song, the verses are about how he's a cuck. Like, this is. This is a. You gotta take this for what it is. It's not clear to easily define what Kanye ism is. Should somebody sell Kanye?

[B]

Should a rapper who sells merchandise with swastikas on it, should that person be welcomed back to run?

[C]

Kanye has apologized. He did a massive apology in the Wall Street Journalist. Yeah, he's done a big apology. Not only that, he said he'd love to meet members of the Jewish community. When in England. Wouldn't that be great?

[D]

But he took four times and he said sorry. He went back to it. Sorry, high Hitler. Sorry, swastika merchandise. Sorry, Death Con three on Jews. There's a pattern here. And the guy is clearly not. Doesn't mean it when he says he's sorry.

[C]

That's subjective, right? You don't believe it.

[D]

I mean, it's A pattern. And four times, you know, if he did it twice and then maybe we, we could have a conversation. But four times we are in a world wisdom.

[B]

As you know, the mental health card now gets played by, I mean we saw it with Hugh Edwards, right? So for American viewers, he was, was, you know, the most famous news reader in Britain who was brought down by a scandal involving him paying money to a 17 year old boy for sexual favors and so on, was then found to have pictures of, you know, young kids, indecent pictures on his phone and so on. You know that guy. But my point being, when he was exposed, he immediately said, I've got mental health issues and therefore you can't leave me alone. Everyone has started to do that and I can't.

[C]

This is not a political rally, this is a music concert. I bet you you've no idea what

[B]

he might say when he gets on stage.

[C]

You don't know what he's going to say on stage. And maybe you could say Kanye, you can come. But these are the terms. And if you're going to come, you can't say this and that.

[B]

It's too late once he says it.

[D]

And also the maybe it's too late,

[C]

but then he could be punished for it. He could be signed for it, I could be punishment. That would be a thing. But then, hang on, if you're going to be censorial, if you're going to be sensorial, where do you draw the line? The whole music industry supported the Marxist organization Black Lives Matter. We're going to say no one who supported BLM is allowed in the country.

[B]

But how do you square you saying, well, you say to him, these are the rules. You're suppressing his free speech in advance, aren't you?

[C]

If you want to use the Public Order act, which is. But Kanye hasn't broken the law. If you look at other examples like NI Cap, they broke the law when they said up Hamas, up Hezbollah on stage.

[B]

Well, he supported the Nazis publicly, repeatedly.

[C]

But that's not illegal.

[B]

Well, why then is it illegal to support Hamas publicly in the UK but not the Nazis?

[C]

Well, that would be a good conversation to have. Is there a Nazi organization that exists?

[B]

Are Hamas better or worse than the Nazis?

[C]

Yeah, they're the same. That's the point. That this is the double standard.

[D]

But you know that Hitler is bad

[C]

and the Nazis, Hamas and Hezbollah is the spirit of Hitlerism. I've met Hezbollah militants, they love Hitler.

[B]

Right.

[C]

When I went to Lebanon last year. So why are you telling me?

[D]

Are you from Europe?

[B]

So we ban. Hamas is a prescribed terror group and we ban people from using insignia, flying flags, supporting them, chanting about them. That is a criminal offense in this country. It should be the same, shouldn't it, about Nazis? I mean, if you're out there embracing and endorsing the Nazis as Kanye has

[C]

been doing, I would be open to that conversation. The difference though is is there an actual Nazi party that exists in the uk? I don't think there is. There is a Hamas that exists. Is there a Nazi party?

[D]

There are Nazi. There are Nazis. There are people that believe this ideology. The same way that you don't have Hamas party. You have people that believe Hamas ideology. And I think that's the problem here, that Jews are being used as political football. It's not about Muslims, it's not about

[C]

Kanye west is not making people more anti Semitic. It's already happened. They're going, look, Keir Starmer is controlled by the Jews. They're not letting him come.

[D]

It's always this double edged sword that the Jews need to decide, are we going to call out antisemitism and protect our and people will accuse us that we are controlling the world if we actually get it. Or are we going to have Kanye west going on a stage here in Finsbury park and maybe telling people that the same song, the Heil Hitler and people repeating it. We've seen it happening with Bob Villen, right, where he said death to the idf. It became a chant that everyone in so many music festivals around Europe have started chanting.

[B]

And he was banned from the United States.

[D]

Yeah, he was as he should have been, I think. I mean, I think that you have so much power, you are a big rapper and there's a difference between cancer.

[B]

Could Bob Winston have been banned from the United States?

[C]

It's a good question. I absolutely, like you said at the beginning, defend the right, both the United States and our country to decide who comes in and out of our.

[B]

They're allowed to do it, but the question is, should they do it? So by the argument you're presenting about Kanye and why the UK government shouldn't have banned him, should the US government have banned Bob Villain?

[C]

Personally, I wouldn't have banned Bob Villain, but in this spirit of free speech which I believe America holds dear, and as far as I know, I might be mistaken here, Bob Villain didn't support an actual terrorist organization.

[B]

He did chant Death to the idf, right? I mean, that's a pretty direct statement of intent that you want IDF people dead.

[C]

Here's the bit where it gets Tricky. It's between the artist being on stage as an artist and being a political activist. If you're just a political activist. If Kanye was coming to London and holding a Nazi rally, no music, absolutely. I'd be against it. That's not good for the public good. You get into this difficult situation where you start saying people who are musicians can't support. We couldn't have Rage against the Machine come here because they have a Maoist red star at the back of their crowd. We couldn't have Andy Warhol's Mao famous portrait coming to London because obviously Mao is the most evil. I think he's the most evil person of the last hundred years because of. By def count, if you have these rules when it comes to art, you're in a very sticky situation, I think. How would you. Would you allow artists different sway? Or is there. Is there room?

[B]

No, not really. I think the criteria for free speech, I don't think it's a simple thing, this free speech debate. And I think it's quite organic, actually. And we've been having a lot of it in the last decade in particular. I do think here, though, for me, the line is, it's a bit like all the people who are arrested for posting on Facebook after the riots up north, after the mistaken identity of asylum seekers committing crimes in that particular instance. For example, if you're saying this is disgusting, you know, f the asylum seeker, okay, you're allowed to be hateful like that. That's acceptable. I may not agree with you. I understand why people get intemperate if you say there are a bunch of asylum seekers in that hotel on Main Road, in whatever, go down there and chuck a firebomb at them, which is what some people were doing on social media. That's a crime.

[C]

Yeah, that is a crime.

[B]

And it should be because you're inciting a specific act of violence. Now, the sort of slightly more cloudy area comes when you have someone like Kanye west with an enormous following who is brazenly supporting an ideology that believes in the extermination of Jewish people, which is Nazi.

[C]

He has apologized in January saying he is not an anti Semite.

[B]

He did this repeatedly and kept apologizing. And also, Ken, he's not a great guy when it comes to free speech either. Let's take a look at this clip.

[D]

We can circle back when you can count.

[B]

Okay, Where's he gone? Sneaker.

[D]

And we'll have the top lawyers, like a Johnnie Cochran, Robert Kardashian level legal team, you know, looking at all of these contracts together. After that moment happens, then I will say I'm sorry.

[B]

Okay, if that's your position.

[D]

Interview adjourned.

[B]

Love you. Okay, that's the end of the interview. So there's a repeated pattern of Kanye walking out on me, which is, by the way, he's perfectly entitled to do. But it makes his position as the great Pied Piper of free speech a little tenuous.

[C]

You've had so many anti Semites, Holocaust deniers, you've had Kanye on the show several times.

[B]

But I think if you have somebody on a show where you get to challenge them directly about their views, that is called journalism. And that's completely different to giving them a platform on a music festival stage with hundreds of thousands in the audience, millions watching worldwide, potentially. And you allow them to be whatever they want to be. And you're basically saying, we don't care that you've embraced the Nazis repeatedly over a number of years. We accept you've apologized, so it's fine.

[C]

Okay, so then who is allowed to do performances?

[B]

Who.

[C]

Who is allowed to do performances? Who judges what?

[B]

A headliner who doesn't embrace the Nazis.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Would be a good start.

[D]

I think that's fair. Yeah. Like someone that doesn't say that Hitler was a great guy and that he's a Nazi so many times that the media stopped reporting it as news because it was already. Oh, you know, it's a Monday. So kind of.

[B]

How did you feel when Abu Hamza was, you know, giving his. His sort of rally cries in the streets of Britain?

[C]

I thought that was absolutely repugnant.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

But he's not.

[B]

So you do think people espousing Republican views.

[C]

Oh, by the way, I think I'm defending someone's views who I don't like. I don't like Kanye West's views.

[B]

No, I get it. I get it. I'm just testing your resolve about free speech. Should a hate preacher be allowed to spew hate in the streets?

[C]

If you're inciting violence, as you say, absolutely not.

[B]

Does embracing a violent ideology count as inciting violence? That's really what this boils down to. If you support Hamas on the streets of this country, that's a crime, because you're embracing and supporting an ideology that is deemed terrorism and is therefore a criminal offence in this country because they're a prescribed terror group. I'm at a loss to understand the difference between saying, I support Hamas and Heil Hitler.

[C]

You think both should be banned?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Right. Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I mean, I think this is a controversial thing. I think it should be absolutely banned to materially support Hamas and Hezbollah. But as in the States, you cannot materially support Hamas and Hezbollah, but American citizens can vocally support them.

[B]

They have. Anybody who's not an American citizen who is deemed to have supported Hamas, for example, is not allowed entry into the United States now.

[C]

Correct. As with Mahmoud Khalil, which we debated last time I was here, and I thought that he had broken the terms of his entry in his visa, which is why I argued that they were absolutely in their right to remove him.

[B]

Hey, let me just go back to the mental health part of this, because it is an added dimension to the Kanye story. His supporters say, look, the guy is bipolar, okay? And that his actions show he's bipolar. Kim Kardashian, who's married to him, has basically confirmed that, I think, in various interviews. So let's assume for a moment he is. Has genuinely had a severe mental illness which has made him. Could be. Made him behave irrationally. We had a very interesting example recently at the baftas when the Tourette sufferer John Davison used very hateful, racist language against two black performers. And people, including me, said, well, this guy can't help it. He has Tourette's. He will say the worst possible things that enter his mind because he can't help himself. And people who defend Kanye will say, well, what's the difference on that one? You give John Davison a pass. Rightly, they say, why do you not afford the same pass to Kanye? Why do you not take his apologies, his latest burst of apologies going back quite a while now? Why don't you take them seriously? Take him at his word that he's now got treatment. It's worked. He no longer will say these things. He doesn't believe these things. He was mentally ill. What do you say to that?

[D]

We heard that. We heard that in 2022. And he actually went to meet with Candace Owens and spoke about how it's Jewish doctors are behind this whole ploy that they are the ones giving him mental illness by drugging him. And then he had to apologize again. And he came back and, you know, there's so much grace that you can give a person. And to say, yes, you know what? We're not. We shouldn't be challenging anyone's mental health issues. And everyone has their own experience. And we can't judge how people are going through it. But the question is, how many people were beaten up after the BAFTA because of the Tourette syndrome statements that we've heard? Not many. We have over two years, would you

[B]

let Donald Trump come into this country?

[E]

Sure.

[D]

Why is the President of the United

[B]

states who's only two days ago signaled an intent to murder 90 million people in Iraq?

[D]

Yeah, he said that. And it was already.

[B]

And you defended it.

[D]

No, I'm not defending it.

[B]

Well, a guy called Hassan Abi responded to it by saying Donald Trump is Adolf Hitler. And you then said comparisons like this only hurt your argument. Donald Trump hasn't killed 6 million Jews. Hundreds of thousands of other undesirables criticized Trump for the things he did because he's not Adolf Hitler. Literally, almost metaphorically. No, he hadn't killed 6 million Jews.

[D]

Do you think he's Adolf Hitler?

[B]

No, but I've always said the suggestion is preposterous to compare the two. Right. To the point I see the President of the United States, Donald Trump, in a post on his truth, social signaling, an intent which he said is more likely to happen than not to wipe out an entire civilization in Iran. 90 million people. He. His words, not mine. And when I see that, I'm like, okay, sorry, that's kind of worse than Hitler. Actually, if you went ahead and did that, it is worse. So all the people like me who've defended Trump, he's not Hitler, they're right there. He's trying to make us think maybe he is. So you defended that?

[D]

Well, I don't think I would defended it. I think I just said that it's not Hitler because Hitler was just one person. I didn't even suggest throughout the segment that Kanye west is Hitler or that anything he says is similar to. Or everything he did is similar to what? To the levels of Hitler. I think we just need to be more nuanced. Why is nuance so difficult for people?

[B]

Nuance is tricky in these things, and actually a lot of it is driven by your own personal political persuasion.

[D]

Yeah, of course. And I know I'm biased as well when I speak about this, but I

[B]

think in a way, everybody has an inherent bias. Right. It's just natural. Right. And it's how we. I am a big, firm believer, and I berate myself most when I fail this test, that you've got to be intellectually honest and consistent. Right. In other words, if Joe Biden had said what Trump said, I would be just as critical as I was of Trump. But those who only criticize one side when they do something like that, but not the other, are intellectually dishonest.

[D]

But that's being criticized from both the far left and the far right. Yes, everyone is not happy with what you say.

[B]

Yes. Which is, I'm fine. Which is a badge of honor. I had a woman pass me in the street, a young woman today with her friend, and she burst out laughing when she said, which is not an unusual occurrence. And she said, piers. She carried on talking. She walked by, Piers, some days I love you and some days I hate you. And I turned to her and I said, this sounds pretty perfect to me. And she went, you're not wrong, you're not wrong. Carried on laughing. Which, the final question for you, nothing to do with free speech, but should, should our king be going to see Donald Trump in the United States for a state dinner and then addressing Congress?

[C]

Absolutely he should. Why would. What's the argument against it?

[B]

The argument against it is that there's been this war, which many people view as illegal. The UK Government and Prime Minister view it as illegal. And he was very disparaging about British troops in Afghanistan, for example. He's been very disparaging about the British military, very disparaging about our Prime Minister and so on. Is this a good time for our monarch to go and say, well, thanks for all the awful things you said about everything to do with Britain. We, we're going to go sit and have dinner with you in Washington.

[C]

Our relationship with the Americans is at an all time low. They are, whether you like it or not, whether you like this administration or not, they are our closest friends, they are our cousins. And I firmly believe in that relationship. No matter who is leading either country now, I hope that we are close to them in the future and anything that can be done to repair that relationship, I mean, you say, look what Keir Starmer's done. He didn't allow them to use the bases at Chagos. It's not that he didn't join the war. He actually obstructed the war. And considering how much we rely on the Americans, particularly with NATO now in the balance, I mean, NATO could well fall apart. The American people resent their taxes going to defend us. Have you seen the British armed forces recently? We've got nothing less. It's completely degraded and depleted. We need the Americans. The Americans actually protect us whether we like it or not. And without that relationship, we're in serious trouble. Falklands could go.

[B]

I do not disagree with you on that final question for you, Ham. Is there any, in your eyes, any time period for redemption for Kenya? Is there a moment when you would say, okay, he can come in, what would he need to do?

[D]

Yeah, it's not that difficult. He should just show that he's meaningfully engaging with the Jewish community.

[B]

He's trying to do that. He's met with Jewish leaders.

[C]

He met with Jewish leaders.

[B]

He's taken out a whole page ad in a paper.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Right before his album was released. That's not meaningful. What would be meaningful is to cancel the show. He should have canceled his shows and say, okay, I'm going to go and work on meeting. And by the way, that's the advice I gave for Zanbar as well. I said, go and meet the black community. Go and discuss with them and understand your racism. And the same thing Kani should do. You should go and meet Jewish leaders. Not just one Jewish rabbi in New York. Not to put out the Wall Street Journal ad was just a press release before it was a minute. The ink didn't dry on the Wall Street Journal ad and it already released an album and announced.

[B]

You know what it comes back to? I just think Kanye, in the end is a bit of a dickhead who just wants attention. And he will say and do anything which gets him attention. And the anti Jewish stuff was getting a lot of reaction. Probably he was saying, seeing it through the prism of some of his followers who were urging him on, and then he suddenly realized it all gone too far. Then he's, you know, and maybe he is also mentally ill from time to time as well. I don't dispute that. But I think a lot of it is driven by his inherent narcissism and desire for attention. And he just crossed. For me, he crossed the line. Great debate. Thank you both very much.

[D]

Thanks.

[B]

Really appreciate it. Should American presidents swear on Easter, or ever, for that matter, Should American presidents threaten genocide whether they mean it or not? Should countries ban musicians for offensive outbursts? Well, Steven Crowder, host of Louder with Crowder, has all the answers, I'm sure, to all of these burning questions. They're probably different to some of mine, but he joins me now. Stephen, welcome back.

[E]

Thank you for having me, sir. I apologize for being tardy. We just had some updates as I was getting ready to do this.

[B]

It's, you know, always in your case, I always allow a few minutes because you're a busy man. Let's start with Steve, with somebody who won't be joining me, which is Kanye West. Yay, as he likes to be called, who a few hours ago was banned from my country. I'm here in the UK at the moment. Banned from headlining the Wireless Festival on the grounds of. From the UK government's point of view that his presence would not be conducive to the public good. And that follows a lot of furore about Kanye. Now, the UK law allows for entry refusal if an individual's conduct, including expressing views that foster hatred or incite public disorder, is deemed a threat to society. What is your response to. Because he's just done a big couple of shows in LA at the Sophie Stadium, made $33 million, apparently, so no problem in the US with him performing. What's your view about what's happened in the uk?

[E]

Well, I would need to glean a little more information. Is this a private venue or event that wanted to hire him?

[B]

Yes.

[E]

Or was it some kind of. Yeah, yeah, they should be able to. They should be allowed to, as we are stateside and the issue, again, I always think it's important to reduce it to its choke point. Sure. It's easy for people to say, yeah, the song N word, Hail Hitler. This guy probably isn't a good faith actor, whatever their opinion may be, but people can't do karaoke covers of Kung Fu Fighting in the UK without being fined or jailed. Right. You have thousands of people who. So, like. It's kind of. We have this conversation a lot where people say, well, what about dreamers, you know, anchor babies in the United States? And I say, yeah, but Democrats don't want to deport violent felons who are here illegally in our prison system. So if we were able to find common ground on that, then we could have that conversation. But until the left moves our way, I'm just going to be critical because I don't like commies. If a private business wants to bring him in, they can do that if people will pay for the tickets.

[B]

But what if a government, in this case the British government, wants to ban his entry because they deem what he said about Heil Hitler, about selling swastika merchandise and so on, deemed him to be. Not conducive to the public good. Should a government have the right to. I mean, obviously they have the right legally to do it. Should they be doing it?

[E]

Yeah, yeah, of course the government has the right to do it. And I understand that you guys have a different standard than the United States. Freedom of speech is. This is really the only place where it's enshrined into our constitution as an absolute. I know we share some views there and differ a little bit. The United States, we had this conversation stateside where they said you can't revoke, you know, visas for students who are here, you know, supporting Hamas, chanting from the river to the Sea. Well, the truth is, in many countries you're not allowed to show up to a government protest at all. For example, if you do that in Korea or Japan. The UK though, has a different standard. It's speech that they don't like. It's not about speaking out against the government. It's not about being a part of a terror cell. And that just doesn't sit well with me. I guarantee if you go through a bunch of the punk, indie, lesbian, chain gang variety, you'll find people saying things comparably offensive. So is the standard applied equally? The answer is no anywhere liberalism thrives. And yes, countries do have the right to determine who is allowed entry and who is not. The standard by which that is determined is my fundamental disagreement with all of Europe and Canada.

[B]

I just googled how many music acts has America banned and it's at least 16, most of which are British or Irish or for all sorts of misdemeanors.

[E]

At least the Irish, we can agree on that one.

[B]

I'm actually Irish, so we can't. But the.

[E]

I thought you were Welsh.

[B]

And also we know that there's a current campaign going on that if you've been overly critical of Donald Trump, for example, on your social media, you might get a visa rejected and so on. So is the American as strong on free speech now as you would like us to believe? Or actually, is there a lot of commonality in the sense that our government doesn't like people who promote Hitler and the Nazis and your government doesn't like people who attack the president or Hamas and what's the difference?

[E]

Yeah, well, you'd have to provide me with some evidence that people are being denied entry simply for posting a mean tweet toward Donald Trump. I haven't seen that. If that's the case, I wouldn't support it. Is. Is that the situation? Because I've not seen more than in

[B]

2025, the administration began scrutinizing applicants for what it terms anti American activity. This includes ideologies or views that despise the country or promote values hostile to its stability. It's a very wide ranging thing and apparently people had been rejected because they were being overly critical of Trump.

[E]

Right. So I would actually say that the idea of not allowing a hostile attitude toward the country is self explanatory. I would argue that in the UK you have an entire wave, a generation of migrants who are hostile to the traditional English way of life and they shouldn't be allowed to get in. If we're talking about like Bob, I Think it was.

[B]

Was it Bob Villain? Yeah.

[E]

Was it? Yeah, Bob Villain chanted death to the IDF or something like that. I mean, we can acknowledge that's a great. Now I was president, I'd probably allow it because there's some artistic license. You know, not everyone means everything they say as an artist, otherwise just be embarrassing for Share. But the standard by which it is judged, okay, is this offensive speech or is this speech, or is this an action with someone who has indicated they are fundamentally incompatible with this country and its way of life? That's the standard, as I understand it, by which the United States applies it.

[B]

My issue with Kanye West, I don't believe he's as mentally ill as he likes everyone to think. I think he's an attention seeking narcissist who settle that stuff about Nazis and so on to get attention, to cause outrage, be provocative. And there was such a monumental backlash. He's now played the mental health card. Am I being unfair? Do you think there's merit to my position on that?

[E]

No, I think. I think he can be both.

[B]

Ha ha.

[E]

That's what I think. I think he can be both. I think he's absolutely an attention seeking narcissist, as many performers are. We all have narcissism in us. It's sort of the pop psychology term of the day. It just comes down to degree. And I think he might have some mental issues because he has said that he has, and I don't have any evidence to the contrary. But this just seems, again, like another overstep from the uk. Again, if we're gonna correct the problem like I can, the reason I'm here is to talk about a free speech issue here in the United States on campus. And these schools are federally subsidized. Offensive speech is not the standard here. It has never been the standard. Someone saying, I hate America, death to America, or showing in perpetuity that they're incompatible with a country to which they want to be welcome, we shouldn't welcome them. That's different from someone saying something that's offensive. For example, someone in the UK being fined or jailed for saying Islam. The political prescription of Islam is incompatible with a Western way of life. But people have been fined. People have been charged in the UK with that. We need to find where we agree and where we differ. We have this conversation a lot with abortion. And I'll get people on the right who get upset because I'll concede a point just to get to the truth of the matter where people will always come up when we Do a change my mind and say, well, what about rape and what about incest? I'll say, okay, let's allow that. Let's just grant that completely. For the sake of argument, would you then do away with all late term abortions on the other side? And they say no. I go, well, then let's not act like that's where this disagreement is taking place. That's not where the disagreement is taking place on freedom of speech.

[B]

It's a really interesting debate. But talking of offensive speech, were you comfortable with President Trump on Easter Sunday saying there'll be nothing like it. Open the fucking straight, you crazy bastards who you'll be living in hell. Just watch Praise be to Allah. And then talking about wiping out an entire civilization in relation to what he might do to Iran. Are you comfortable with that kind of language from the President of the United States, from the guy sitting in the Oval Office publicly?

[E]

Well, which part of it? Which part of it? If we're talking naughty words, I don't care. I didn't elect Donald Trump because I thought he was a pastor. I didn't vote for him because I think even necessarily that he's a devout Christian. I thought it was trolling. I actually laughed pretty hard at the Praise be to Allah. I do think it was ill advised to say whole civilization. And the reason why is because you see a lot of people and this is again about applying it equally. Donald Trump has done a pretty good job and certainly Marco Rubio in delineating between the Iranian people and the regime. I think we probably agree there are very few governments, if any, that are in more diametric opposition to the people they govern than the IRGC and the Iranian people. I mean, we don't get very accurate polling out of theirs. You tend to not get out of the Islamic world. The overwhelming majority of the Iranian people support the help, support the military intervention. Doesn't mean that it's our job to be clear. That's a conversation to have stateside domestically. But separating between the regime and the people is important. Donald Trump has done that consistently. He didn't do that with his, with his phrase here. I definitely think that did him no favors. On the flip side, when I see people saying World War 3 and I see people saying he's killing innocent civilians, we're bombing Brown people, we're killing Iranians, I go, well, hold on a second. You guys never delineate between the IRGC and the Iranian people. I also think that it's undergirded by the fact that if remarkably inconsistent and ill advised. He did say, God bless the Iranian people in that same post, which would seem to clarify and be consistent with what he just said 12 hours earlier. Right. People were offended. Keep in mind, 12 hours earlier, they said, do you think this is a war crime? And I think it's, no, because they're animals. And they killed 40. The number always goes up. Maybe 60, maybe 120,000 of their old people.

[B]

Wow.

[E]

Their animal people say, I can't believe he would say that. But he did say no. Targeting military sites, targeting strategic infrastructure to do away with a totalitarian and I would argue, evil, satanic regime. The IRGC is not a war crime. Because the people want it and support it. Doesn't mean that it's legit.

[B]

Legit. What does it say with, you know, Trump? Obviously, the campaigner in 2024 was absolutely emphatic. I will not drag America into any more senseless wars, particularly in the Middle East. And here he is dragging America into the biggest Middle east and war he could possibly have dragged them into. Tucker Carlson has been blistering in his attack on it. Megyn Kelly has been blistering. You've got all these people on the right. Marjorie Taylor Greene. There's a real split on the conservative right in America, and it's really bubbled up and boiled over with the Iran war. Why do you think that is? Why? I mean, if you go back 20, 30 years, there would have been complete unanimity about a Republican strike of this nature. It wouldn't have been. There would have been no split. But there's a real split here ideologically between what people believe they thought they were voting for and what they think they're getting from Trump.

[E]

Yeah, well, I don't think there's as big of a split with the voter as there are commentators. For example, my perspective has been I supported the strike on the enrichment facility. And I said, give this three months and then I'll have to reassess it because I know there's information that I cannot have on Iran as it pertains to national security, I would say that would be due largely to their own ignorance. Because anyone who thinks that Donald Trump has been anything other than consistent going back to the 1980s, which is kind of a marvel. The only reason we're able to have this long of a consistent track record for any president is because he was a celebrity. He's always said, iran cannot have a nuke. They will never have a nuke. That was what he said that day of that famous escalator ride. It was part and parcel of that speech. So anyone who thinks that Donald Trump being tough on Iran is a betrayal is simply uneducated and didn't listen to him. And you could also argue, and I think there are two reasonable sides on this issue. I don't think war criminal, I don't think genocide is one of them. You could argue that he's ending a 47 year war and it's right in line with his promises. When I hear people say, why would we strike Iran? They've never done anything to us. You hear that a lot. Many, many, many Americans. Hundreds if not over a thousand, depending on the numbers. And they've pledged to kill many more. It comes down to that discussion. And when you want to deal with this issue, anyone can say, I'm against this, I don't like it, of course. And I think there's a reasonable position to hold to say Donald Trump has gone back on his word when his only statements on Iran have been criticisms of the jcpoa, of Barack Obama, of the previous administrations, saying he will guarantee that they cannot have a nuke, and by the way, advocating for military intervention on air several times. If someone voted for him and says, I didn't know that, that's kind of on them. And then I would say let's bring the conversation back to where there's a reasonable disagreement. Doesn't it just seem to like this is the kind of thing that would be a geopolitical disagreement that you would hear about in debates. Now you have people saying, invoke the 25th for him, doing exactly what he said he would.

[B]

One of the people saying that is an old friend of mine, I joke, who actually tried to get me deported from the United States, Alex Jones, he's actually been on your show and he

[A]

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[F]

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[A]

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[E]

How do we 25th Amendment is asked

[G]

the problem is to get the 25th Amendment is harder than impeachment. You have to get 2/3 of the House and 2/3 of the so what do we do? Tackle Trump and and pretend. Let him pretend he's president and publicly report that he's going through a health issue. Advanced takeover. It literally needs to be something like that. It's that bad. The long time you've never called for

[E]

a internal coup before, Ever, ever, ever.

[G]

But that's how dangerous this is.

[B]

I mean, when Alex Jones is suggesting you're nuts, that's, that's a bad day, isn't it?

[E]

Well, like you said, it's Alex Jones suggesting you're nuts. Is that a bad day? I couldn't disagree with him more on that. And here's the thing, all right, those 25th is ass. And the alternative, when I hear people say there's no difference, the border has been secured to the tune of anywhere from 96 to 99% depending on the metrics that you want to use. Many Americans were single issue voters and that was a single issue. The other was the economy. Most Americans were two issue voters. So to be clear, they're not the same. And if people are, it does come down to a binary decision. Okay, J.D. vance, very flawed.

[B]

Get it?

[E]

Everyone is. No one gets the perfect candidate they want. Let's say it's Rubio flawed or your choice is Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsom, Gretchen Whitmer. And I can already hear what people are saying. You're just trying to put us in the binary, man. Or we could do a parliamentary system, which is an unbelievable failure. Sorry, no offense to you, but I was raised in Canada and I think it's silly that you can have someone elected with 30 something percent of the vote. In some cases less. People need to be really careful about what they're looking for because the decisions, the choices they're making now do affect that outcome. And there will be a return of woke. You will have biological men in women's sports, you'll have biological men in women's locker rooms, you will have de platforming and you will have socialism light best case scenario if no alternative is presented because what I hear from these people is not working within and correcting the system, which does have a self correcting mechanism. You know, we have primaries, we have the ability to generate actual feedback. I would say Donald Trump is usually pretty intent to listen compared to a lot of previous presidents. That's one of the downsides. He's very accessible on social media or the alternative. But I don't for a second believe that Kamala Harris and Donald Trump are no different. I don't believe for a second that whether it's Rubio Vance or Gavin Newsom, whoever's in the polls right now, the Kalshee sheets, I don't believe that they're even remotely similar. And I would vote for Donald Trump again and I hope that these people would say the same, but I don't know that they would. I mean I heard Tucker Carlson, for example, and this is just a criticism of the actual point. He said to mock someone's religion is to mock or to mock someone's faith. I don't want to misquote him is to mock faith itself. That's goofy, silly, dumb, dumb talk. And I don't agree with it. I don't agree with it.

[B]

The mention of Gavin Newsom, according to Polymarket, Newsom is the red hot favorite to be a Democratic nominee in 2028 at 24%. However, there's an Instagram post from his wife Jennifer Siebel Newsom at the weekend that is raising concerns perhaps, but maybe some glee. Tomi Layram posted I love this woman. She may single handedly put Vance or Ruby in the White House in 2028. Let's take a look at the Instagram clip.

[H]

Trust me, I'm not a fan of Pam Bondi nor Kristi Noem, but I need to call out that it's no surprise to me that the first two prominent people pushed out of this administration were women. Let me explain the conservative women that Trump hand picks who align themselves with an agenda that controls women, restricting our rights, limiting our autonomy, and pushing us back into this straight jacket of femininity that is only in service of men. There's a familiar pattern here. Women are brought in packaged mar a lago style and Lifted up as long as they commit to wholeheartedly serve the interests of the patriarch at the top. Now, it looks like power or proximity to power with a big title, but it never comes with job security and protection. There's no secure place inside this handpicked patriarchal body that systemically disrespects, devalues, and discriminates against women and girls.

[B]

Now, in the wake of that post, social media's been flooded with some of her previous pearls of wisdom, including saying every problem we have, society will be fixed when women come together and we need to fight against the rabbit hole of dangerous and limited narratives around what it means to be a girl and boy. And she's also said her husband is working hard to institutionalize their values before leaving office. I mean, is she turning out to be potentially the secret nightmare for the Democrats? Do you think

[E]

she should be, but she's not. Because that's something that the Democrats embrace. I mean, you're talking about a party where the previous, the former Vice President Joe Biden said that he thought it was an act of evil for parents to not affirm their child's transition. So shouting some bullshit talking points, forgive me, about patriarchy really isn't gonna hackle anybody's feathers. I will say this. She makes a good case for her household, voting one vote per household. And when she says rights, what rights are being trampled on? When people talk about the patriarchy, can they explain to me what they mean by patriarchy when they talk about the straight jacket of femininity? I'm sure you had. I don't know what term you use, grandma, or do you use. What's the term that you guys use in the uk, Generally speaking?

[B]

Grandma.

[E]

Yeah, okay, Grandma. Most of the time when you look at a woman who you really admired and you say, you know, they don't make them like that anymore. Incredibly feminine and ironically, was a matriarch, wasn't she? Yes, but no one said she has job stability. They said she made the house a home, hearth and home. Everyone wanted to be at grandma's house because everyone felt safe and everyone felt nurtured. And that is something that is been shunned by feminism, by the way, at their own peril. If you want to look for the root evils that plague most of modern society, look at feminism in the 1960s. And I'm not talking about wanting to put on a two piece and go out to the beach. I'm talking about this idea that men and women are fundamentally interchangeable and that somehow we need to do away with masculinity. And you want to know how you know it's not true. Bear Grylls has that show the Island. Go watch the season where the women. There's an all women's team and all men's team. And it reflects statistics that we see that men have longer, more long lasting, meaningful relationships. They have greater sense of loyalty, ties, duty. They're more willing to die for their friends. Women are jealous. Feminists are jealous because they claim to be these great emotional communicators even though they don't want traditional relationships, but they want the guy to pay for the dinner bill. They don't want to go Dutch. Men say what they mean and, and men are better at friending. That's the great irony in all of this. Women tend to. Because men are violent, right? We'll deal with our fists often, not all the time. But there's a certain line that you don't cross that holds us accountable, that keeps us in behavioral order. Women don't have that. So there's often gossip, there's often backstabbing. And you know the thing too, they talk about how all these problems that plague society as though, as though having women in charge has never happened. Now there's an exception, Thatcher, by the way, hopefully she's a national hero to you guys. Very strong woman. As a general rule, historically, women have had a shot running societies. Do you know why it stopped? Unfettered cruelty. Unfettered cruelty. A lot of people like, oh my gosh, this is going way too far. This idea that somehow women will be peaceful, that women will all get along and they'll be able to hash it out communicatively flies in direct opposition.

[B]

Well also some of the most bloodthirsty, ruthless mass murderers in leadership history in the world were women. I mean, that's the other part of this and I've done that's not exclusive to either sex. I've done crime series of literally called killer women where they've done despicable things. So this idea they're immune from some of the traits that they love to throw at men I think is a little far fetched on this issue. This ever burning issue of the trans women competing in women's sport. For example, recently the International Olympic Committee said that they were going to ban trans women from competing in women's sport. Which of course is obvious because the Olympics are split on sex based rules. We have male, female, because otherwise the females would not win more than about one medal. I think I read. But no, Megan Rapinoe who was of course the star of the U.S. women's soccer team football team. She has come out and says this is outrageous. And this is why she says it's outrageous.

[I]

This committee is framing it as based in science, which it's not. And this will ultimately just prevent people from competing within the women's category that they feel like have an unfair advantage. It's just really hateful. It's like there's been so few athletes that are trans, are competing as trans and it's like so blatant on its face. It's just a total act like acquiescence to the Trump administration and to really right wing conservative politics.

[B]

I mean, what struck me about that was that she doesn't think this is a science based debate. What could be a more scientific based debate or ruling than that people born with a male physiology should not be competing against people born with a female physiology because obviously the male physiology is more powerful. Bigger muscle mass, bigger lung capacity, better for endurance, for speed, for power. It's obviously the most glaringly obvious example of why it's science based, isn't it?

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

And if you give me a little bit of space here, I do want to expound on that. First off, the root issue here is feminism. She says something so mind numbingly stupid because she's a feminist lesbian in a boy's cut who's never been held accountable. You could ask her one question. What? Science says you can be born into the wrong body. It doesn't exist. Every study we've conducted shows the opposite. I'll give you two more case studies. My sound guy, Billy, by his sophomore year in high school, we found out he was a D1 athlete swimmer. You wouldn't know it to look at him. He, he would have literally broken every senior female's record, would have beaten every single Olympian in that pool. And he was a chain smoker. Lia Thomas went from rank 500 and something to number one. And of course we know that that obviously is in line with bone density, with lung capacity, with muscle mass, with hormones. You go to UPenn, by the way. Leah Thomas. And that's where I was supposed to be speaking this Friday, a debate with a professor. We put up the money, we said their rules, their moderators, they said you can't livestream. They changed the rules last second. We went through this whole saga. If we want to discuss it, the women came forward. I believe it was 16 women. Someone can fact check me. I think it was 16 came forward and said, hey, we're uncomfortable with the If I may say, the cock and balls in the locker room, it's making us uncomfortable. It wasn't even related to the medals. Did they run an investigation? No, they sent them to the counselor which by the way happened to be at the LGBTQ center for effectively re education. They had to file a lawsuit and the President of the United States had to step in while these people say that they are pro free speech. Hey, those women don't get that back. Those women who lost those medals don't get it back. But they will silence speech. Someone like perhaps yourself were aligned on this issue or myself where I show up and say let the games begin. An open debate for anyone to attend. Give us your best professor and we'll argue about this. Well then you can't livestream. They're not protecting the most vulnerable among them because there is no rooting in morality. They don't believe the left is a monster, a Frankenstein monster created from different parts of moral relativism. That's the only way that you get gays for Palestine and it's the only way that you get feminists for men beating the crap out of them in women's sports. What key is to Marxism, what's extraordinary

[B]

is if you go back to the most successful Democrats of you know, say the last 30, 40 years, Bill Clinton and Obama, they have repeatedly warned the Democratic Party not to go down these hard left woke rabbit holes of issues like the trans issue. Cuz they can see how preposterous it is to deny actual science. Why? Why is the penny not dropping with. With Democrats? Why are they still trying to cling on? Why are people like Megan Rapinoe who presumably would like her side to win power to affect the changes she wants, why are they prepared to die on this absurd hill?

[E]

Do you think they can't not. It's not permissible. And I mean that quite literally. This is why you had. Remember when we had all those debates, there was like 12. The last time we had a primary in the Democrat party was I believe 2012. Quite the democratic Party there. None of them. They started bragging about how they all had an F rating from the NRA and they dunked on Bernie because he only had a D minus. There is not a single Democrat in the United States on the national platform who doesn't support transitioning and men and women sports. You have someone like Gavin Newsom who will lie and say that he didn't. We've run the clips where he obviously did and you will not find a single one who will put Any limits on abortion whatsoever when the context is up to and including birth. They can't, because their loyalty is to Marxism. They see everything through the prism of oppressor and oppressed. And that's why, okay, today it's white and it's black. And then, okay, it's stop Asian hate. But we find out that it's mostly black Americans committing the violence against Asians, we'll do away with them. They're not useful pawns to us. Okay, today it's gays, gay marriage. But tomorrow, okay, we're gonna women, we're gonna call them TERFs. And I will tell you this, mark it down. Gavin Newsom's wife guarantee you won't be able to help herself and will support all of this silly shit. And I haven't spent that much time researching her, but I know she's a feminist and that's all. All it takes.

[B]

She said some ridiculous things. This debate you were gonna have then with the historian Jonathan Zimmerman at the University of Pennsylvania on Friday, ironically, about free speech, because of this block they've. They've tried to impose on you. Live streaming, this. Is that now happening, that debate, or is it off?

[E]

We're at a standoff where, you know, we reached out to them to give you an idea that's been going on for a long time. So it's actually 10 years in the making. 10 schools, $10,000. When I started to change my mind, we always invite. This is kind of the first time someone did that on campus. We invited professors out. They were more interested in banning us. We've been repeatedly trying to communicate with them, but they've called the campus police to remove us. So we issued a call out to 10 schools, eight Ivy League, said, send anyone from the humanities program, Poli sci philosophy, obviously, I'm not going to argue geothermal regulation with a geologist. We said, you pick the moderator, you pick the rules. We'll come to your home turf. We'll even give $10,000 to the department of your choice. We're just going to livestream it. So easy that a college dropout comedian host can do. It was agreed upon. We livestream every day, as you well know. Then they let us know. They even actually sent us the costs, the riders for us to bring our own livestream equipment. They said, no, we're not going to allow it. And I just got an update just right before coming on here. They said it's due to safety. So if I was a jazz musician, I could livestream it. If it was some other form of Performing arts. But a transparent debate that would be respectful between one of their professors and someone fronting $10,000. Many more. When you take into account security, that can't happen. That can't happen on campus. This is the same campus, by the way, where Leah Thomas happened and those young women were suppressed.

[B]

On a serious point about the safety aspect, I think it's ridiculous, obviously, and so ironic given the. The debates about free speech. But on the safety aspect, post Charlie Kirk, given, you know, you know, how violent a lot of the rhetoric can be, particularly from the hard left. Do you. Do you worry about your safety?

[E]

Yes, yes, very much. And that's also another problem. So I have a security team. It's our biggest line item that we've had to increase this year. I think I spoke with you about this after Charlie Kirk passing. You're just seeing the one that got through. It's a constant game of cat and mouse. We have to take unbelievable security measures. So our security team, my security team went out there, but they said we have to use their campus security or campus police. Regardless, they still have not gotten us an estimate. They don't want this to happen. And like you said, they're worried about the violent protests, they're worried about the safety issues, and they know which side will be reflected in that. If I'm willing to go out and take the risk to have an actual transparent, open debate with a very qualified, by the way, very respectful guy only I should also shout out, the College Republicans are the ones who actually made it happen. No individual professors responded and the school has been dragging their feet. Yeah, now it's absolutely a worry. Which is also why the no estimate. Could be half a million dollars, could be $2 million for campus police. They always find an out and they will claim it's not freedom of speech. But at a certain point, you have to look at the totality and say, hey, 94% of all political dollars given from those in academia. There's a study out there, over 400,000 donations were examined in higher education. 94 cents out of every dollar goes directly to the Democrat Party. You wouldn't get that kind of a political split in San Francisco. Is it by design or is it just by happenstance? Going through it now? And this is not the first time I would say that it's by design. And they don't seem to give a rat's ass about intellectual diversity on campus. So long as, you know, you identify with the right gender, you meet a racial quota, and that's no way to run a country and it's no way to establish a place of higher learning.

[B]

Well, Stephen, I believe in diverse debate on uncensored and you'll always be welcome here. Even if we disagree about all sorts of things. That's part of the fun. It's the whole point of living in a democracy.

[E]

And I. And you irritate me sometimes, but I very much enjoy our conversations and I appreciate it. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You're Irish. I didn't know.

[B]

Well, it just means you can't call me a British asshole because I'm technically an Irish one.

[E]

That's fair.

[B]

I'll take that one. David, good to talk to you. Take care.

[E]

Good to talk with you. Be well.

[B]

Piers Morgan unsensed and is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. You enjoy our show. We ask for only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan uncensored on Spotify and Apple podcasts. And in return, we will continue our mission to inform, irritate and entertain. And we'll do it all for free. Independent, uncensored media has never been more critical. And we couldn't do it without you.

[J]

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