Episode Overview

Pillow Talks - E235: "How Your Phone Is Secretly Sabotaging Your Connection (and what to do about it)"
Hosts: Vanessa & Xander Marin
Date: November 20, 2025

In this episode, Vanessa (sex therapist) and husband Xander dive candidly and humorously into how technology—especially our phones—is surreptitiously eroding intimacy in relationships. They discuss their own struggles, share community insights, unpack surprising statistics, test out a "no screens before sex" challenge, and offer a toolkit of actionable steps for couples to reclaim connection in the digital age.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Phones: The Fourth Most Common Source of Conflict

• [00:00, 03:57]
  After sex, money, and kids, phone use is the #4 reason couples fight.
  • Vanessa emphasizes how phones are an underestimated, everyday disruptor of connection:

    "Phones are the number four most common reason why couples fight. And obviously it doesn't feel good in the moment to be arguing about your phone usage with each other. But it really starts to build up a lot of resentment over time..." [03:57]

  • It’s often less about the phone itself and more about the underlying message: choosing phone over partner.

2. Personal Stories and Community Polling

• [02:41, 04:33, 09:33, 14:09]
  • Both hosts admit to their own imperfect screen habits and share that this is a common struggle, not just a listener issue.
  • Instagram poll results:
    • 49% have argued about phones.
    • 37% have had discussions but not arguments.
    • 13% say "never an issue" (which Xander jokes must be people without cell phones). [02:59]
  • Vanessa illustrates the creeping resentments and death-by-a-thousand-cuts dynamic in her and Xander's daily life: small moments of being ignored for a phone can snowball emotionally.

3. Why Phones Are Particularly Problematic

• [06:01, 07:34]
  • The insidiousness lies in how they divide our attention and how we rationalize our own use but judge our partner’s.

    “We are so quick to justify our own usage but then get upset at our partner...We don't realize we're doing the exact same things.” — Vanessa [06:01-07:34]

  • Phones are engineered for addiction—statistically, Americans check their phone every six minutes.

4. Shocking Usage Stats

• [13:00, 14:15]
  • Average American: 5.5-7 hours a day on their phone.
  • Breakdown: 1.5 hours gaming, 2+ hours on social media.

    "That's almost four hours a day of mindless things. So if you have four hours a day to play video games or be on social media, you have time." — Vanessa [15:17]

  • Xander points out, “No one ever complains that they don’t have time to scroll their phone.” [12:46]

5. Most Annoying Behaviors (from Listener Stories)

• [09:33, 14:07]
  • Scrolling during dinner or date night.
  • Picking up the phone in the middle of (even serious) conversations.
  • Scrolling instead of being present with kids or during family time.
  • Jumping on the phone immediately after sex ("boner killer").
  • Spending excessive time in the bathroom with the phone (often a gender divide).

6. The Sexy Tech Detox: “No Screens Before Sex (or Intimacy)”

• [20:20, 32:04]
  • Instead of a rigid, total detox, Vanessa and Xander try a playful, realistic approach: no screens for non-essential use after 5pm until they’ve shared some form of intimacy.

    "We had to prioritize some form of real intimacy. Before we were allowed to use our screens, we had to earn our screen time." — Vanessa [20:37]

  • Intimacy is broadly defined: could be sex, cuddling, a heart-to-heart, or making out.
  • For parents: adjust the rule to after the kids are in bed.

Results

• The couple found themselves more focused, playful, and connected, culminating in sex every day of the challenge.

  “It brought this really playful energy… We would say, ‘Hey, do you want to go earn our screen time right now?’” — Vanessa [33:01]

  • The rule removed pressure to be “horny first,” embraced spontaneous intimacy, and led to more intentional “us time.”

    “You have more focus on the stuff that's important, whether that's being with your partner...you're not divided again between all these other things.” — Xander [24:09]

7. Bigger Underlying Issues: What If This Feels Impossible?

• [41:31]
  • Vanessa suggests resistance to “no screens before sex” may indicate deeper issues:
    • Imbalanced pleasure in sex
    • Mental load imbalances (“I have a list of tasks a mile long and my partner doesn’t”)
    • Initiation imbalances (how sex is initiated feels bad)
  • The challenge highlights where relationships may be out of alignment or integrity.

8. Other Actionable Tech Boundaries

• [44:05-47:29]
  • No phones at mealtimes or on date night (physically move the phone away).
  • No phones first thing in the morning or right before bed.

    “If I'm not turning over to grab my phone the very first thing...I just start on such a more peaceful note.” — Vanessa [45:19]

  • Airplane mode after 8pm, or other time-based boundaries.
  • Build phone-free rituals—walking the dogs, morning coffee, 10-minute cuddle sessions.
  • Announce why you’re grabbing your phone (“Let me show you this article”), so the gesture reduces feelings of disconnection.
  • Ask for attention before speaking if your partner’s on their device.
  • Make explicit requests for phone-free windows (“As we're getting out of the house, can we do no phones?”).
  • Crucial: No phones during serious conversations.
  • Rule suggestion: Only one screen at a time! No double-screening with TV + phone.

    "One screen at a time. Do not be watching TV and on your phones at the same time. Because we do that all the time..." — Vanessa [36:31]

Notable Quotes & Moments

• "Phones...start to build up a lot of resentment over time because it leaves you feeling like your second best. Like your partner's phone...is more important to them than you are." — Vanessa [03:57]
• "When those things happen over and over, it's easy to build up a: 'Oh, like, they just don't care about me or they care more about this thing.' It's sort of like a death by a thousand cuts." — Xander [04:33]
• "We don't realize we're doing the exact same things." — Vanessa [07:34]
• "No one ever complains that they don’t have time to scroll their phone. That’s not a complaint anyone has ever made." — Xander [12:46]
• "Let's make sure that we put each other before Instagram reels, before Netflix, before all of our video game playing." — Vanessa [25:05]
• "It brought this really playful energy to when we did have sex...We would say, ‘Hey, do you want to go earn our screen time right now?’" — Vanessa [33:01]
• "Couples waste so many opportunities to connect. And I think women especially are more guilty of this because we are feeling like we're supposed to be turned on...But more women, our sex drives don't work that way...more women have responsive desire..." — Vanessa [34:38, 34:58]
• "If this is giving you heartburn...I'm guessing that it's a sign something bigger is off in your sex life." — Vanessa [41:31]
• "One screen at a time. Do not be watching TV and on your phones at the same time." — Vanessa [36:31]
• "If you can't finish your business in under five minutes, you gotta get up off the toilet. It's not good for your butt." — Vanessa [50:42]

Timestamps of Key Segments

• 00:00–02:41: Introduction, framing the phone issue in relationships
• 02:41–04:33: Personal confession: Vanessa & Xander’s own phone arguments
• 06:01–07:34: Unawareness & self vs. partner hypocrisy
• 09:33–14:41: Top problematic moments (from listener poll) & shocking stats
• 14:41–18:42: Deeper dive into phone/social media/gaming stat breakdowns
• 20:20–32:04: The "No Screens Before Sex" challenge—rules, implementation, and results
• 33:01–36:43: How play, humor, and intentionality improved sex, intimacy, and general connection
• 41:09–41:45: Addressing deeper reasons the challenge may feel difficult
• 44:05–47:29: Toolkit of further actionable tech boundaries for listeners

Final Takeaways

Vanessa & Xander encourage all couples—not just those in crisis—to try some form of tech detox, starting with what feels manageable. The episode’s tone is self-aware (“We’re not immune!”), practical, and light-hearted, making bold recommendations feel accessible. Their core message: put your partner first, before your screens. Not only will your relationship benefit, but you might find yourself—playfully and joyfully—having more intimacy than you thought possible.

Suggested Starting Challenge

• Try “no screens before intimacy” (define intimacy broadly) for one week—adjust start time to fit your life. Track changes in your own connection and energy.

Closing Wisdom

"I decided to marry this person...I'm saying that they are the most important person to me in the world. Why don't I treat them as such?" — Xander [52:56]