Trump's Iran Deal, SpaceX’s Wild Ride, and Snap’s Specs

Summary

Pivot Podcast Summary

Episode: Trump's Iran Deal, SpaceX’s Wild Ride, and Snap’s Specs
Date: June 19, 2026
Hosts: Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway

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Episode Overview

In this lively episode, Kara and Scott unpack some of the biggest stories dominating tech, business, and politics this week. They dissect the troubled U.S.-Iran deal brokered by President Trump, SpaceX’s eventful IPO and Elon Musk’s latest acquisition, and Snap’s attempt to revive AR smart glasses. The episode also features regular banter, personal anecdotes, and sharp-tongued analysis of political messaging, branding failures, and the luxury of being an AI-era billionaire.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Cultural Banter & Sports Mania

(02:20–06:08)

• The episode kicks off with cheerful banter about the NBA’s New York Knicks ticker tape parade and the excitement around the World Cup, especially Scotland’s surprising performance.
• Kara admits to not being a big sports fan, while Scott revels in Scottish pride and the party atmosphere in Boston:
  • "Boston bars have run out of beer... they’ve literally run out of beer." (03:38, Scott)
  • Both hosts admire the good-natured international crowds and spotlight the unique culture—like Japanese fans cleaning up after matches.
• Memorable Moment:
  • "The gatherings... are making a comeback!" (03:58, Scott)
  • "It’s cute. I just like all the group activities.” (04:26, Kara)

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2. Reflecting Pool Fiasco & Symbolic Failures

(11:23–15:19)

• The hosts delve into the disastrous $14 million renovation of the Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool, now plagued by blue paint and rampant algae—another branding failure under Trump.
  • Kara: "It’s very much Trump—lack of transparency, overly expensive, and badly done.” (12:35)
• Scott riffs on the metaphorical value:
  • "The reflecting pool is actually doing its job—reflecting what’s going on 500 feet away." (13:17)
  • He jokes the pool has “given up” just like Congress.
• Both agree it’s a juicy symbol for Trump’s broader mismanagement and messaging problems.
  • Kara: "It’s the easiest thing to fix… to fuck it up this royally is really something." (14:08)

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3. Trump’s Iran Deal: Analysis and Outrage

(18:50–31:37)

• Deep dive into Trump’s new Memorandum of Understanding (MoU) with Iran, which both hosts believe is weaker and worse than the original 2015 Obama-era Iran nuclear agreement (JCPOA).
• Summary of the deal’s terms:
  • US ends sanctions, Iran gets to sell oil freely, $300B fund to help rebuild Iran (though US claims it won’t contribute).
  • Iran agrees not to develop nuclear weapons, but with far fewer verification controls than before.
  • The MOU isn’t a binding agreement; both sides can walk away after 60 days.
• Both hosts criticize the deal’s “business school” term, arguing it’s not worth the paper it’s printed on.
  • Scott: "A memo of understanding is a business term ... It means nothing!" (20:46)
• Politically, even conservative Republicans and usual Trump allies are condemning the deal (Ben Shapiro, Tucker Carlson, Bill Cassidy).
• Sharp Quotes:
  • Scott: "We withdrew from a deal, fought a stupid war ... alienated allies, weakened relationships, destabilized the global economy—so we could get a much worse deal.” (22:56)
  • Kara: "He just continuously bad. I think this will all hang on him." (25:15)
  • Scott: "This, in two words, is a fucking disaster for the American brand." (28:23)
• The pair debate Trump's physical and cognitive health, with Kara observing him seeming "old and cankly" at G7, led around by Macron. Scott disagrees, arguing Trump's judgment remains the main problem.
  • Kara: "I think we have to seriously talk about whether he had a stroke or not... fully appropriate to discuss it at this point." (26:54)

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4. SpaceX IPO, $60B Acquisition, and "AI Bubble" Dynamics

(37:29–49:16)

• Analysis of SpaceX’s public debut, its market surge to become the fifth most valuable public company, and the $60B all-stock acquisition of AI coding startup Cursor.
• Guest commentary from Puck’s Bill Cohen:
  • "It’s one great business (Starlink) and one glamorous business (rockets), and one lousy business (X, xAI)...with astounding valuation." (38:41)
• Scott’s Strategy Breakdown:
  • Musk is leveraging inflated stock to make high-multiple acquisitions that are “accretive” compared to SpaceX’s extreme P/S multiple.
  • The Cursor acquisition is smart—fixes Grok’s failure, gives SpaceX a solid enterprise coding tool.
  • "When you are sitting on a company at 130 times revenues… buy anything that makes sense.” (41:50, Scott)
  • Possible “everything looks cheap” effect for SpaceX in the current market.
• The hosts debate potential next targets (e.g., Perplexity, Mistral, Rocket Lab) and agree Musk’s method is more collector than inventor.
  • Kara: "He’s a little Henry Ford... he’s a collector, not really an inventor." (44:34)
• Also discussed: AI’s shifting fortunes, OpenAI’s leaked losses, Anthropic’s momentum, and the rise of companies like Bending Spoons.

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5. Snap’s Smart Glasses ("Specs") and the Fate of Wearables

(51:57–59:02)

• Snap unveils $2,195 AR smart glasses—dubbed "chonky" by Wired—prompting Kara and Scott’s critical review.
  • Kara: "He’s a handsome man and it immediately rendered him unhandsome... and pretending otherwise seems silly." (53:09)
  • Scott: "This is the first time I’ve seen an image of Evan Spiegel where I am cooler than Evan Spiegel." (54:21)
• Snap’s challenge: lacking Meta or Apple’s capital, they can’t afford the R&D burn rate for hardware hits.
  • "Meta can burn $60 billion on a failed product... Snap can’t." (55:24, Scott)
• Both hosts think the consumer AR glasses market is years away, and the best wearable is AirPods. Snap’s Specs, despite previous innovation, are "dead on arrival."
  • "This is the beginning and end of Snap as an independent company... this thing is dead on arrival." (54:29, Scott)
• Kara remembers earlier Specs demos as cool in concept but “ridiculous” in weight. The future, they believe, leans toward lighter earbud-like wearables with cameras and AI.
• Discussion of Snap’s past acquisition offers and speculation on its future as an M&A target.

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6. Predictions & Industry Tea

(61:40–69:56)

• Kara and Scott praise The View’s interview with J.D. Vance, noting its substance and viral effectiveness, reflecting on mainstream television’s potential for real innovation.
• Scott’s Prediction:
  • An activist investor is likely to force Snap to spin off or shut down the Specs division within the next month, as it’s a drag on an otherwise respectable social business.
    • "The person... that's going to impose that discipline will be an activist... shut this down or spin it." (65:46)
• They also theorize about the influx of AI-wealthy “douchebags” driving up prices in Europe this summer.
  • "Just wait till you see what the price of a bottle of bottle service is..." (67:15, Scott)
• Banter about their upcoming live Pivot in France.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the reflecting pool:
  • "The pool has been staring at Congress for several hundred years, and it’s just finally given up." (13:41, Scott)
• On Trump’s Iran deal:
  • "This is so... Here is the reality: We withdrew from a deal, fought a stupid war... so we could get a much worse deal." (22:56, Scott)
  • "He just continuously bad. I think this will all hang on him." (25:15, Kara)
• On Snap’s Specs:
  • "This is the first time I’ve ever seen an image of Evan Spiegel where I’m cooler than Evan Spiegel." (54:21, Scott)
• On Musk’s acquisition-fueled strategy:
  • "When you are sitting on a company at 130 times revenues... buy anything that makes sense." (41:50, Scott)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• World Cup & Parade Banter: 02:20–06:08
• Reflecting Pool Mess: 11:23–15:19
• Trump’s Iran Deal: 18:50–31:37
• SpaceX IPO/Acquisition/AI Market: 37:29–49:16
• Snap’s Chonky Specs: 51:57–59:02
• Predictions & The View: 61:40–66:03, 67:15+
• Vacation Planning & Personal Moments: 66:30 onwards

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Tone and Style

The conversation is fast-paced, irreverent, and unsparing—blending deep expertise with pop-culture-fueled humor. Kara’s journalistic directness meets Scott’s sharp wit and meta-analytical take-downs. They switch seamlessly between legislative discussions, business-school analogies, and personal stories.

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For Listeners Who Missed It

This episode is essential for anyone seeking an unfiltered, insightful breakdown of current affairs in politics and tech, particularly regarding Trump’s controversial Iran policy, the market’s frothiness around SpaceX, and the enduring challenges of consumer AR wearables. The hosts’ personal rapport, timely jokes, and refusal to pull punches make for a substantive yet entertaining listen.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

And I'm Scott Galloway.

[A]

We're not going to talk about the Knicks because we just got in an argument about it.

[B]

I think it's amazing. Stop shit. Posting the Knicks. It's super exciting.

[A]

No, no, no. What are you wearing? Explain what you're wearing. A World World cup is also very exciting. And I'm very.

[B]

The wee lass. That's right. Scotland, top of the table in their flight. They beat Haiti.

[A]

They're.

[B]

And they're playing Morocco tomorrow, which is a fairly serious. Do you know that I know you're excited to talk about team Scotland. They haven't appeared in the World cup since 1998. They've been in the World cup eight or 12 times and never managed to get it out of the group stage, which is. No one else has unfortunately had that. They have McTominan this time. They have a really strong midfield. I'm just super excited about team Scotland.

[A]

Yeah. Speaking of bringing the world together, New York is having its ticker tape parade for the Knicks, which I'm very.

[B]

Are you going?

[A]

No. Look, I'm not a sports fan, Scott. Unlike you, I'm not. I don't go to parades. I don't like large gatherings.

[B]

Is it through. I take it it's through Manhattan.

[A]

It's through the Wall street thing. And they're gonna like, throw the ticker tape stuff. Someone put a picture up. He was in a hotel room. I guess it was a guy. And at five in the morning, the noise was like, loud. Like people are like getting ready to go.

[B]

I've heard New York is literally electric right now still.

[A]

It is. I was just. This week. It was great.

[B]

I mean, and. But more importantly, this is a true story. Boston bars have run out of beer. Some Scottish fans. Oh, really? They've literally run out of beer.

[A]

Boston. I didn't know they were playing in Boston. Anyway, it's very exciting, all these sporting events. I love this. I like basketball. Bastable. If I had to watch something. But what's really nice is to see all these gatherings. And that's my favorite part.

[B]

The gatherings may or else making a comeback. Yeah.

[A]

And also people seem to. There's not a lot of fighting. It doesn't. Seems like people are jolly. Like all these pictures this morning from New York, they're like jolly. And all the World cup people like. Is it the Norwegians that keep rowing everywhere? They go up escalators and then they threw.

[B]

Then they threw the Japanese fan in the air.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It really does bring the world.

[A]

But the Japanese fans bring these blue bags and then they clean up afterwards.

[B]

They clean up.

[A]

I just like the whole thing. I like all the group activities and I think it's cute. It's adorable.

[B]

You know, the Scottish cleanup. Putting all their empty bottles in a corner.

[A]

Anyway, are you. So can Scottish have any chance since you're called Scott.

[B]

It's the strongest team we've fielded in a while. I think that. And they did win their first game, which means that the chances of getting to the next stage, realistically. Realistically, we probably don't go that far. But there's always a dark horse that makes it to the quarterfinals. Whether Morocco is considered it a dark horse. No.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Russia did really well at one point. I mean, I'm pulling. I think it's really exciting. It's more likely that in terms of the uk, that England represents us, but this is the strongest Scottish team in a while. And they had a fantastic opening game last night.

[A]

Did they? I don't know. There was some stuff on the social media.

[B]

Harry Kane is probably one of the three best players in the world right now. The disappointments were Spain, which drew. And Portugal, which Drew, which are both supposed to be amazing contenders. And also the US Team is the strongest it's been in a long time. And they had a fantastic opening.

[A]

That's what I heard. I feel like we should, like, dominate. Why don't we dominate? We have such, like.

[B]

That's such an American thing to say.

[A]

No, but I would think all the money that's been put into soccer, all the attention, it just seems like we

[B]

never make it in an elite.

[A]

I know. I guess it's not really as popular as football or basketball here, but it's

[B]

a group of people who just don't play together that often. This could be their year, though. Player by player. Pulisic. I mean, they have some amazing. They have some amazing talent.

[A]

Good. Well, I'm excited, and I'm excited for you to go to a game. You should go. It's a very. You're.

[B]

Oh, I'm going to a bunch of games.

[A]

Yeah. That's great.

[B]

I'm excited. Plus, it's really inexpensive. It's just such a good deal. I make. I make a decent living. And I'm blanching.

[A]

I know. Well, whenever I see. They have a lot of stuff on social media, like, of the prices, like, the lowest price is $11,000. And I was like, what?

[B]

Like.

[A]

Like, it's crazy. Maybe not that much, but it's like, as I said, it's easier to go to Mexico or Canada to watch these things. Oh, I have some. I have an invitation for you.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Leslie Stahl wants to have dinner with Emily Ratajowski. No. She wrote that piece, though. I can't believe you didn't comment upon

[B]

being a single mother.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

The one where she's breastfeeding yes, exactly that one. I'm here for it. I'm here for it. And by the way, I definitely read the article. I didn't just look at the picture. I definitely read the article.

[A]

Okay, all right. Okay. You got some questions, by the way, she asked. No, no, never.

[B]

No, she's playing that game, that hard to get game. I get it.

[A]

Anyway, Leslie Stahl. I had breakfast with her in New York, and we had a lovely time and impressive woman. She really is. We had a good talk. We had a good talk about what's happening.

[B]

You and Leslie Stahl. I'm trying to come up with. Is that like the Cagney and Lacy 80 year reunion? What is that like? What offensive jokes can I make about.

[A]

Oh, I can't. Don't. Leslie Stahl will take your skin off.

[B]

No, I'm scared of Leslie Stall. She's very good.

[A]

Well, she wants to have dinner with us.

[B]

I do not like to. On other people. You know this. You're supposed to clear out these invitations for me.

[A]

No, Lesley Stahl is worth it. Trust me. All right?

[B]

I'm sure she's super impressive and she will find me. She will like, like anyone you introduce me to. They find out I'm not nearly as interesting as they think I am. So let's just save everyone disappointment and social anxiety.

[A]

No, don't say no to Lesley Stahl. You're doing it. I'm gonna. I'm gonna say we're meeting, and then I'm gonna bring her, and that's how it's gonna go.

[B]

Why are you hanging out with Lesley Stahl? Is this like another, like, journalist mafia thing where you talk about how old, get it when they buy their companies?

[A]

No, she's came to code for years. She came to code for years. I. You don't understand the. The amount of people I know and have.

[B]

No, I think I do. I think I do. I hear from friends.

[A]

I would say we were friends, and so just. We just got together. She, you know, we wanted to just got together. We did talk about things.

[B]

You and an icon of journalism.

[A]

Yeah, we like. I do a lot of journalist people. Like, you know, you go for drinks with them and stuff. Like, you do that all the time. Anyway, she wants to have.

[B]

Hang out with people who drink. That's it. That's my criteria. Do you drink, period?

[A]

I don't know. I don't know. She'd throw some back. She looks like she could throw some back. Yeah. Anyway, she really is a big fan of yours, inexplicably and obviously. Oh, I got some other intel, but wasn't from Lesley Stahl. You were approached. You were approached. Just. I'm getting more info. I'm not going to tell everyone what that's about, but indeed, I got more confirmation on that topic.

[B]

You mean CBS lying that I approached them about Olympia?

[A]

Yes, yes. Someone who knows.

[B]

But I need to be fair, though. I thought a lot about this because it upset me. It was very immature of me to try and get clout by talking about professional outreach just to make myself look important. That was immature of me.

[A]

You never do so.

[B]

And I regret it.

[A]

Okay. You never do that.

[B]

Yeah, but it was just. It was immature of me. I just shouldn't have bragged about someone reaching out to me. Oh, I guess it's like, okay, that's a great way to show gratitude of someone coming to you with an opportunity is to brag. Brag about it.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Anyways, all right.

[A]

God. What is going on with you?

[B]

What is going on with me?

[A]

What is going on?

[B]

I need to hang out with Leslie Stahl.

[A]

You do.

[B]

All right.

[A]

Anyway, Leslie's lovely. Hi, Leslie.

[B]

Will she mentor me?

[A]

Oh, I doubt it. Anyway, I need.

[B]

I need someone I've been trying for years to do.

[A]

Mentor.

[B]

Yeah, no, I need someone. No, I need someone more affectionate and loving than you.

[A]

She's tall. Is not your choice.

[B]

I need. It's like that. Do you know who. Ruthie Rogers. She owns the River Cafe.

[A]

Oh, I've heard of her. Sure. Yeah.

[B]

She's an older woman and she reached out to nowhere to say hi. And I was so pissed off because it ends up that the River Cafe is, like, in fucking Birmingham, London. It's like two hours.

[A]

It's far out. Yeah. It's for the.

[B]

And I go down there.

[A]

I have been there.

[B]

I go down there and I'm all pissed off. And this little woman, fairly advanced age, comes rolling out, and I'm like, what the fuck? Why am I not with Emily Ratajkowski? Was my first thought. And then I'm like, what am I doing here? Why did I agree to this? And within 10 minutes, she was holding my hand above the table, like, talking to me about my childhood. There's something about her. You just.

[A]

I'll try to find you a nice lady like that, but we, you know, a bunch of tough lady fans. That's what it is. Oh, oh. Can I do one call out? Katie Couric has had a grandchild.

[B]

Oh, I saw that. I saw that. That was nice. Good for her.

[A]

That's very nice. Congratulations, Katie. Before we get into it today, a reminder to check out our YouTube channel. Be sure to like the video and subscribe. We're into the YouTube situation and we're also in Roku. We're a lot of places.

[B]

Yes, Roku. Swear. You just type into. I don't know how you get that, though. We're with on the swerve channel or whatever it is. It's the Profji channel. I love the pivots on the proftea channel. We'll just ignore that for a second.

[A]

All right, well, that's fine.

[B]

People can stream us live. Oh, wait, yeah, stream us.

[A]

Okay. We're very promiscuous, but go to YouTube. We've got a lot to get to, so let's dig in First, Scott, the reflecting pool. I wanted to ignore this, but it's crazy. The paint's coming off today. This $14 million renovation. They put this American flag blue on it and they paid. Trump insisted on it. When there's other problems with that thing, it's for years and years. You know, like all fountains, all pools have problems. And this is a big frigging pool. But it's usually just the stone color. And he had painted it this color and it's turned algae green. There's algae everywhere now the paint is coming. There were pictures this morning. The interior department says it was a residual algae from the supply lines that were sitting there while the pool is being renovated. Most people say this is nonsense. All these pool people are weighing in, which I'm enjoying very much. They're deploying, quote, high tech nanobubble ozone technology to combat this. Except workers were seen pouring bottles of hydrogen peroxide into the pool earlier this week by hand. Some experts say the pool's new color has worsened the pre existing issues. Darker blue absorbs sunlight, increasing water temperature, making the PO ripe for algae. Apparently there's phosphates in it. It's like it's ridiculous and what a fucking mess up because they picked the wrong people to do this. They shouldn't have painted it. It's very much Trump sort of like lack of transparency, overly expensive and badly done. But I want to talk about bad messaging because this is the reflecting pool, which is ahead of the 250 celebration. That's a center of along with the Washington Monument, the Lincoln Memorial. You know that those are symbolically beautiful and actually much visited during the fourth of July. And it's going to shit. Talk about it from a brand. Is there a branding perspective? Because it's getting a lot of traction. Usually I think these things are silly. But this one, I'm like, yeah, this really. He fucked this up, like, royally, in a way that seems ridiculous.

[B]

Yeah. Like the analogy here, the symbolism is pretty strong. I would argue that the reflecting pool is actually doing its job and reflecting what's going on 500ft away. By the way, I stared into a reflecting pool for too long, and it made me think. I don't. I feel like it's been staring. The reflecting pool has been staring at Congress for several hundred years, and it's just finally given up.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it went full moss.

[A]

Right, Right.

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

I think symbolically, it's. For a lot of people, most kids have gone to the reflecting Americans when they go on trips to Washington. If you get to go on a trip to Washington, as many people do, it's just like everything about it is like, can you do anything that doesn't suck? Like, it's sort of. Even though it's just the pool, it's the easiest thing to fix in all the many things that are hard in this country. And to fuck it up this royally is really quite something. I think it's a messaging of sort of this old man who is addled, who overspends our money. It's all tax money, and we're going to have to pay for whether it's cleaning up the East Wing, whether these physical things. And you had talked about this, the destruction of the East Wing or what he did at the Kennedy center with the name coming down. It's just. It's all like, destruction. We're going to have to clean up after this, you know, this elderly toddler, essentially.

[B]

Yeah. I was asked. I was on a podcast yesterday, and they asked me what I thought about the reflecting pool in D.C. turning green. And I said, no notes. I mean, it's the metaphor, the analogy, whatever. It's just perfect. But there are only two people in my life that make me laugh occasionally. You make me laugh. You have a very infectious laugh. But that's actually, you know, what we were arguing at the beginning of the podcast, and one of our producers, Taylor, said something nice about each other, and I should have said, you have a great sense of humor. Your laugh is infectious, I think.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

It definitely softens you up.

[A]

Here, I'll do one. I like that you cry. Someone asked me if your crying was genuine, and I said, it is, and it's very moving. Sorry, go ahead.

[B]

Yeah, no, it's not an act. I really do have.

[A]

Someone thought it was deep issues. You cried somewhere at an event. And who was it? It wasn't Leslie Stahl. It was someone. No, no, no, no. Another secret meeting.

[B]

I cried at an event. That's like. I would be. I'd put it at 1 in 5. If I talk about my mom, young men killing themselves, or my boys, that's it. I'm done.

[A]

Yeah, I think it's about your mom. And I said, no, it was someone. And they asked if it was real. And I said, it really is. He's really very heartfelt.

[B]

Anyways, so back to algae. So the funniest people. There's two people in the world that make me, like, laugh out loud. One is David Frey, my friend who's a cosmetic dentist, who's one of the strangest, funniest people in the world. And he'll just call me and start talking about his day, and it cracks me up. And my friend Lee Lotus, who's godfather to my children, anyway, Hilarious. And we used to take trips together, like, before he found his partner, before I had a girlfriend, we used to go on trips together. Like, we would drive up the coast together. We did all these trips together. And we decided, he's like, we should go to Chicago. And so we went to Chicago, and It was during St. Patrick's Day, and they dye the river green. And he looked at me, the color. He goes to me, he goes, you'd think they'd be able to dye it clear. And we just sat there. I just sat there and laughed for, like, that's funny.

[A]

Anyways, well, get him down to the fucking reflecting pool, because it really looks.

[B]

He's literally the funniest guy in the world. And he. He's such a good friend. Speaking of D.C. when my sister was a senior in college at the University of Florida, he's like, you're the big brother. You need to take her to D.C. to our nation's capital. And so we went to the nation's capital and we, like, stormed into Speaker Pelosi, representative at that time, Pelosi's office, and started asking questions about the Presidio park and thinking, this will get your sister excited about our government and politics. And you know what she did? She did get excited, and she went to intern for some far right fucking crazy.

[A]

Oh, what? Really?

[B]

And I'm like, that's not why I brought you here.

[A]

Well, it kind of is.

[B]

And she's been kind of a. I'll give her this, A moderate Republican ever since.

[A]

And it's a sister's not that.

[B]

No, she's not crazy. No, but she is Kind of a, you know, she wears pearls and brash like a modern day.

[A]

Oh, you taught her about democracy. That's anyway algae bad messaging because it just sort of piles on with the Kennedy center thing, this thing. And now of course the biggest one. Donald Trump is defending his deal to end the war in Iran, saying critics who think he hasn't been tough enough or jealous bad or people or stupid. His comments come after he signed the Memorandum of Understanding or MoU at the palace of Versailles on Wednesday, which was the most epic troll by Macron I've ever seen. He lured him there with gold and, and it's the place of course where the Germans signed the World War I accord. So let's talk about the Treaty of Versailles. Let's talk about some of the terms of this agreement. The Strait of Hormuz will open immediately and Iran will be allowed to sell its oil freely. Also they'll get some sort of fees which didn't exist before. It's exactly the Obama deal, but worse essentially. I mean Obama got a lot more stuff and paid a lot less and nobody died and there wasn't the impact on the economy globally and in the United States. The US will end sanctions on Iran and unfreeze assets. The $300 billion fund will be established to help rebuild Iran, though Trump says the US will not contribute to it. Iran agrees to not procure or develop a nuclear weapon. But before the Obama agreement was much more stringent. The deal is set to be officially signed on Friday. Is not a final agreement. Doesn't seem much has been agreed at all. The two sides have 60 days to negotiate a longer term deal. Either side can walk away. The Republicans are, are not liking it and those who are trying to defend it are pretzeling themselves. He's lost the support of all manner of people, including Ben Shapiro, Tucker Carlson, of course lots of Republicans, Bill Cassidy and many others are like this is a piece of shit deal. They're saying it out loud. Senator Kennedy, the Democrats don't have to say anything and even Fox News is attacking him. Thoughts on the situation because someone, Donnie Deutsch said I was for this, this, you know, this attack on Iran. But now this is like bullshit. He reminded me of you the way he talked about it. But any thoughts?

[B]

Yeah, I've got to own it. I, I thought there was real legitimate rationale for military action. There's just no doubt about it. You've got to. Hillary Clinton talks about the dominion of failure and I find this fascinating.

[A]

Isn't that great? Explain that for the People, the dominion of failure.

[B]

Well, just to relate to it on an individual level, have you ever been at a. You're in a conversation with family or dinner and you say something and someone disagrees, and you double down and then you find yourself two months later defending and going deeper into a position that you've probably realized was wrong, but you've doubled down and you keep going further and further. And unfortunately, the American public rewards that doubling down as opposed to being contemplative and recognizing that a step back from the wrong direction is a step in the right direction.

[A]

Right, Right.

[B]

And we've basically told our politicians, never admit you're wrong. Dou down, never acknowledge that things have not worked out the way we'd hoped. And we need to change course. And just to go to the quote, unquote, memo of understanding. Let's start with the term memo of understanding. Memo of understanding is a business term. And I have written and received dozens of memos of understanding. And this is what they are. If you're thinking, usually in a business context, about acquiring a firm or doing a large deal, you outline general parameters.

[A]

Okay, this is what you do, but not specifics, correct?

[B]

Well, you identify ranges. This is what you do. This is what we do. We're interested in acquiring you. And this is kind of evaluation range, subject to the following conditions. These are the people who would stick around you kind of outline to basically say, we need to at least agree on some basics before we get serious and start conducting diligence and papering a deal. And it means nothing. I would bet that somewhere between a third and maybe 50% of memos of understanding are consummated in a legally enforceable deal. And that's the same thing here. This is obvious. They said Trump wanted an agreement and they said, we'll give you a memo of understanding because we know you're on your way out. This will not be enforceable. I don't even think we can get into a conversation around how terrible this deal is, including the fact that it doesn't include include random inspections. It's gone from one and a half billion in the JCPOA to 300 billion. And that sounds like a sea opportunity for Witkoff and Kushner. The fact that they've essentially have an opening to start charging tolls. Again, this isn't an equivalent deal. This is a much worse deal. But here's the thing. It's not even a deal, Kara. It's a memo of an. I don't know if you heard, but this morning it was announced that Mexico has presented the US With a memo of understanding and they're taking back Phoenix. I mean, this is so. This is. Here is the reality.

[A]

I like Phoenix, but go ahead. Sorry.

[B]

We withdrew from a deal, fought a stupid war, or apparently a stupid war with 13 people dead, hundreds injured, thousands of Iranians killed. Alienated allies.

[A]

Let's not forget those schoolgirls that got

[B]

accidentally alienated allies, weakened our relationship with Gulf nations, provided accidentally Iran with insight into a weapon more powerful than a nuclear arm. Destabilized the global economy such that we could get a much worse deal in terms of American politics. What this means is the following. JD Vance will not be president. Have you noticed already?

[A]

Oh, no. Trump keeps trying to hang it around his neck.

[B]

The president Vance is throwing Vice President Vance under the bus.

[A]

No, he's just, he's just his servant. To go there and do.

[B]

Basically, he has sent the equivalent of a, I don't know, a reputational mob and noose for the latest vice president. He is hanging Vice President Vance. This is, this is pensing him.

[A]

He's pensing him.

[B]

The most conservative Republicans are saying this is a, a terrible deal. A terrible deal.

[A]

Right. The comparison between the, they put up comparative lists between the Obama deal and this. And you're like, what? We lost all this stuff. Like what? Why? And you know, he had the advantage when he just say bombed some of the areas. Right. He had the what we're watching you kind of thing happening, which I think was strong. I agree with you. When the original bombing of those, even if they didn't take them out, they didn't completely and totally. I don't know why he had to say that. He could have just said, set them back again. And we're going to keep doing that if they keep developing nuclear weapons. But that was good. And then he couldn't resist because of the Epstein, as you said, the person on his shoulder is Jeffrey Epstein. And so he wanted to do something after Venezuela. He felt emboldened and did this. Like, this is to me. I don't think you're right. He is hanging J.D. vance out to dry, but this is hanging on him. This doesn't come off.

[B]

Oh, I agree. He won't be able to escape this.

[A]

He doesn't escape it. He can't blame it on anybody. Agreed.

[B]

He's in charge.

[A]

Let me just tell you, he looked real old at the G7. Like they kept moving him around and he was sort of wandering more than usual. He usually wanders, but he was wandering. He looked sickly, he looked Cankly, his hands looked like. Suddenly there's all these cuts on his hands. You know, Macron was wandering, moving around like he was an elderly parent at an old folks home, which I thought Macron did on purpose because he looked fantastic, right? He was fit and lively and stuff like that. But Macron was looking like he was his friend, but made him look elderly sitting next to him. And I think he was. And then the Versailles thing. Oh my God, did nobody on his team understand the symbolism and the marketing of that thing? And I know only, I mean, it's just he's so dumb. Like that's the whole thing. Like he just continuously bad. I think this will all hang on him. You're seeing the poll, the polling is down and you know, they think Georgia's gonna be. Gonna be all Democrat, which is unheard of, that Texas is now absolutely in play. He's gonna have the worst two years of his life after November. Just the worst. I think it's gonna go on and on and on. Macron led him around like an old man. It was really something to see. And I think, I think, you know what's really interesting is how much the polling is really declining, how much in danger he is of losing states like Georgia and Texas and Ohio. Stuff that you wouldn't have thought before. And I think it has a lot to do. And I know this is one thing, the algae is another. The Kennedy center, it's all like this old man. I think we have to seriously talk about whether he had a stroke or not. And you know, we did this with Biden and I think it's, it's fully appropriate to discuss it at this point.

[B]

We don't agree on the non important stuff. I think Trump looks remarkably robust for a guy of his age. I don't see any degradation or I should say any change in his cognitive ability. And his cognitive ability at 76 was exceptionally poor judgment from a narcissist who doesn't care about anything but himself and coming across as strong. And that he is arguably or verifiably a terrible business person. And I think he's the same person he was four or eight years ago. And that is someone with absolutely terrible judgment that diminishes our power soft and hard abroad. Let's talk specifically about the jcpoa. It required Iran. This is the deal that the Obama administration and Iran signed. It required Iran to reduce its enriched uranium stockpile by 98%, dismantle 2/3 of its centrifuges, cap enrichment at 3.7%. And accept IAEA monitoring. The 2026 MOU contains no nuclear constraints at all. Just a pledge never to build a weapon. A pledge from the IRGC that's worth a lot, which Iran already made when it signed the non proliferation treaty in 1970. The key here, quite frankly, is verification and inspection. And let's compare the two. The JCPOA had IAEA inspectors, continuous monitoring and 24 day access provisions. The MOU defers all of this to a 60 day negotiating window with no guarantees. Think of this in consumer terms, no leverage. We are paying more for less. The MOU comes with released assets plus a $300 billion reconstruction framework exceeding the JCPOA's cost while delivering fewer nucle concessions. This in, in two words, is a fucking disaster for the American brand. And it, I, I, I gotta be honest, I'm gonna enjoy watching all these acolytes and, and well they're not and weirdos try to try to explain this one away.

[A]

Well, they are only a few are but many more are being quite expl. Like you didn't have to hear a Democrat yesterday because all the Republicans were saying it, right? They were like, they said, I was like, I was listening to the television, I was packing for this and I'm like, oh, another Democrat. And I looked and it was a Republican Senator. It was like so vehement, right? It was so, except for one who was trying to defend it. But it was very hard. Like you could see them. Fox News has been very tough for top. And of course Wall Street Journal is like strafing him, which is a Murdoch property. So I, I don't know, I feel like all of the, and I, I, I, I'm going to disagree with you on his health. I think something happened and, and he still looks robust, but his physical demeanor and the way he wandered around all

[B]

the specialists he's seeing.

[A]

Yep, yeah, all the specialists. And the way Macron. I felt like Macron knows exactly what's happening because he, cause he kept. It's how you move an elderly person, if you like. As my mom got less mobile. She was in that zone that Trump is in and she was mobile and very robust. As you know, my mother never shuts up. But it was like, and then it started to crumble essentially.

[B]

But I just want to briefly. And you put out a great chart on this. But where we are at the end of the jcpoa when he tore up the agreement, Iran had enriched uranium to 3.7%. It is now 60%. Just a short step away from weapons grade material US military leverage given away. This memo of understanding commits the US to not increasing its regional forces with Washington or the US withdrawing forces within 30 days of a final agreement. We typically. That's not negotiable. For us, one of our key advantages is we have these things called aircraft carriers that we can put anywhere in the world to deliver violence on an unprecedented level, which is an enormous advantage that we're giving up. The other thing that people aren't talking about or the press isn't talking about is that the JCPOA was multilateral. It was signed by the us, the eu, the uk, France, Germany, China and Russia. Whereas this is bilateral. So if they walk away from this, it doesn't impair their ability to sell oil, do business with all these nations. Whereas the JCPOA was the entire Western world and China and Russia saying, you have to stick to this agreement.

[A]

That's why he can't clean fountains and he can't do wars. And then the thing he said that, that the press conference, go watch that press conference, Scott, you will have another thought about his mental health. And he goes, well, we'll just bomb them. And I'm like, what? Like that's your plan? Like we'll just bomb them if they don't keep up. It's just, it's so embarrassing. And you know, the Republicans know it. And I think he's gonna, he's, he's in for a world of hurt. And Epstein's roaring its way back. Of course. The New York Times did a great piece. Very briefly, I wanna say the Ukrainian bombings in Moscow. Wow, that has sh. Did rather significantly. Putin's the other one that's gotta be on the ropes, I would imagine. As I said, I thought I'd heard from people that he was.

[B]

Well, I mean. Just a couple thoughts. One that is the most exciting, positive thing happening in the world right now, I agree, is that the west has a huge victory. Europe deserves incredible credit for being steadfast, which is in their interests economically and also the learning from both Iran and the war in Ukraine. As a follow on going, our military budget should be cut in half and it should be focused on one word, asymmetric warfare.

[A]

Asymmetric warfare.

[B]

These expensive platforms that risk too much where we can't. There's no way we're sending 50 B2s into a hostile area because America doesn't have the stomach or the money to lose on himars or lose its soldiers. Whereas if you build basically what are go karts or motorcycles with bombs on them and you send 50 out and 48 get shot down, but two make it through. This has totally changed the game of warfare. And how do we turn chicken salad into chicken salad fricassee or something even better is this is the opportunity and America needs this. This is how fucking stupid the administration is. Oh, wait, warfare's changing. Let's increase expensive platforms and the monetization of our military and defense. By increasing our military budget by 400 billion, we should be thinking about opportunities to take our military budget down to 500 and making it more lethal and more deadly with asymmetric warfare. That is the learning here. And they aren't taking the learning.

[A]

Yeah, they aren't. No, they aren't. Anyway, I think it's a disastrous week for Trump and a truly disastrous one. Anyway. And algae. Let's just say that again. Algae. Okay, Scott, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll discuss SpaceX's busy first week as a public company. Support for the show comes from Quince. It's really hard to get everything that you want. When it comes to breathable, quality clothes that elevate your fit, Quince comes pretty close to perfection. Quince European linen pants and shirts are perfect warm weather upgrade to add to your rotation, starting at just $34. Their tees are soft and easy to wear and their lightweight cotton sweaters are perfect for cooler summer nights. Everything is priced 50 to 80% less than what you'd find at similar brands. Plus, Quince works directly with ethical factories and cuts out the middlemen. So you're getting premium materials without a markup. I've gotten quints. I've actually buy it myself now. They gave me a chance to to get some free stuff, but I actually have been buying it myself, including especially all the athleisure stuff. But I've also recently bought some of the T shirts that are terrific and they seem that they'll last a little longer than some of the other stuff I get at fast fashion companies. I wear, I have a cardigan I love. I like everything they have and I really enjoy their colors and their ease of use. And they're very comfortable and they fit me great. They also have a lot of great seasonal colors and prints for spring that'll make getting dressed a breeze. Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com pivot for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com pivot for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com pivot

[B]

this is advertiser content from Harvey AI. We have a choice over who we work with and who we don't. Specifically who we allow to advertise and who we don't. And for those of you who watch my content, I am not an AI could catastrophe. I'm an AI optimist. I think it's going to create more jobs than it destroys. And I think our job as professionals is to figure out how to leverage these tools. AI, more than almost anything I do in terms of what I could point to for real economic leverage and savings is 100% in the legal fields. Harvey is the AI designed specifically for legal work, trusted by leading law firms and enterprise legal teams. All right, so now I'm looking at at their demo. It plugs into tools that lawyers already work with. LexisNexis, Microsoft. And this is the key. And I do this internally with my LLMs, with permissions. It lets you look at the firm's own files and databases. So here it's answering a question, reads the complaint, pulls the relevant terms, checks the web, weighs the evidence and drafts a response. But it also can do this in a shared workspace between the firm and the client. So they both have visibility into the work being done and can both add value to it. I think this space is clearly sort of hand in glove for AI, so there's no doubt about it. This, I think is going to be super helpful, not only for law firms themselves, but internally for general counsels at companies. Harvey is AI tailored for law. You can learn more at Harvey AI.

[A]

When I got a new car, I thought my insurance premium would increase and empty my bank account, like if fatween won the lottery. I've invested most of my winnings in chicken tenders because they're bomb, but bro, I bought a house and it's sick, bro. I'm thinking the floor is gonna be all trampoline, bro. With a helipad on the roof. The contractor said it's structurally unsound. They're just being babies. But switching to GEICO saved me hundreds. So my bank account is safe.

[B]

It feels good to save some hard earned cash. It feels good to Geico.

[A]

Scott, we're back. Let's go through a rundown of the latest SpaceX news as we tape. Shares are down 6.5% to $179, valuing the company at 2.3, which is what it was when we last talked. Shares surged around 50% in the first days of trading, making SpaceX the fifth largest company by market cap, surpassing Amazon. Tuesday was the first day that investors could buy SpaceX options contracts and about 1.8 million contracts changed hands. And amidst all this, SpaceX announced it will acquire AI coding startup Cursor for $60 billion in an all stack transaction. I thought this was rather smart. Cursor's annual sales recently hit 4 billion, making it a reliable source of revenue. It also gets them up to speed in enterprise. It moves the team, takes the shitty product of Grok and makes it. You know, this is a smart move. This is a very typical Elon move, is to buy something to get ahead. And I thought that was smart. In another win for Musk, the DOJ told a Mississippi federal court that it should throw out a lawsuit against Xai saying it has the right to run dozens of gas burning turbines despite not having permits for him. I'm not sure this is a victory for Musk. I think this is gonna come back to bite him. Before we get to our own thoughts, let's hear from our friend and founding partner of Puck, Bill Cohen.

[B]

Hey, Karen. Scott. So SpaceX, I mean, I think that, you know, Scott has been nailing this for, you know, weeks now, which is that it's one great business, Starlink, which is a fabulous business and kind of revolutionizing the world in many ways. And one glamorous business, the rocket business, and one lousy business, X and Xai, that they crammed in there and won astounding valuation with infinite multiples because only Starlink is really profitable. And it's just the latest example frankly of the Wall street hype machine that is so, so good at hyping up stocks and companies that need to raise huge amounts of capital. I mean, you got to give Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley credit for, you know, raising $85 billion of equity and getting this thing launched at a huge valuation. 2.5 trillion now exceeding Amazon. And it's been trading up, although for the last couple of days it's been trading down. So maybe we've at a minor peak and maybe as usual, it'll be the retail investors that get left holding the bag here.

[A]

And of course a bunch of lockups come off over the next couple of months. Scott, how do you feel now? And talk about the acquisition of Cursor. I think it's smart. I do. I think the thing in the data centers is a mistake on the government's part to do that because I think people are truly mad. But your thoughts?

[B]

Look, the IPO is nothing short of remarkable. And the fact that it, it's gone up so much. I mean it's off a touch today, but I think it's up. What is it up? 30 or 40% since it initially priced buying. I mean kind of the kind of. The game now is for the first whatever hundred years of the market CEOs were compensated to under promise and over deliver and the last 30 or 40 years or 20 years at least it's been over promise. Get your stock up based on these incredible projections of the future and then use that cheap capital to pull the future forward by investing at a rate no one else can match. Amazon or Netflix, right.

[A]

Using this inflated stock.

[B]

Or go acquire companies. So for example, with Cursor and Cursor's a really good company and they're buying it, they're buying it at a multiple of 15 times revenues. So when SpaceX is trading at 130 times revenues, it's accretive. So a $60 billion acquisition, which is a lot of money, but that gives them a really strong company, a really strong AI coding tool that has 26% share for a 3 1/2% dilution of that crazy $2.5 trillion market cap.

[A]

Right? And it makes the GROK story go away. The Grok failure story go away.

[B]

I mean when you are sitting on a company, a Stock that's at 130 times revenues, you tell, tell every investment bank and you tell your corporate dev people anything that makes sense. Buy it.

[A]

Right?

[B]

Because.

[A]

Would you give me a name? What should he buy?

[B]

Oh shit here. I don't know enough about the.

[A]

He's going to shove Tesla in there, as I said he would.

[B]

Well yeah, but that's not an acquisition, that's him stuffing.

[A]

Yeah, but I'm saying what would you

[B]

is there that's adopting one of the dwarfs so you can continue to sleep with Snow White. Look, I don't. I think we're going to see a lot. I think the M and A space. I think if you're any investment bank and says I have this cool AI tool that would help shore up this component of xai, they get the calls returned right now because the way to think of it is if you're looking for a house in San Francisco and it costs $2 million and you're with. It's a lot of money and you're worth 3 million, it's worth. You really think about it. If overnight you were 30 million, you're like honey, buy.

[A]

Buy it. Right, Exactly.

[B]

So everything in the world looks cheap to them. Right now. Because almost anything is technically accretive and adds to earnings because nothing out there is trading at 120 times revenues.

[A]

Yeah. Like, it could get perplexity.

[B]

They could get perplexity. Yeah, that'd be an interesting one.

[A]

Yeah. Because they will paper over their problems with Grok, which are rather significant, which you may.

[B]

Regulators. Regulators won't get it through. But if they could, they should buy. They could acquire mystery. I mean, they could.

[A]

That's a good idea.

[B]

That would not get past regulators. But what could they not buy right now? I mean, there's rocket science. Does Rocket Lab or whatever the fuck that company is, does that have any technology they could use? They are looking at everything right now.

[A]

Yeah, they've got to. Yeah. There's some really interesting stuff. The thing is, he doesn't want to create sort of like a basket of nothing fits. It's got to be strategic. Like, in terms of what? Like, so cursor gets some enterprise business, highly talented people, it gets them a product. People like that people are using. That's what they gotta look at. They can't just buy anything. Because I think his big mistake with Grok was that he overstuffed it with geniuses. And then it was sort of like a hot mess, essentially. And this is more his way, the way he bought Tesla from the creators of it. He didn't make Tesla, he bought it from their inventors. And he does that with a lot of stuff. And I think that's what he does best. He's a little Henry Ford, like in a lot of ways, if you think about it, versus an Edison. Right. Everyone looks at him like as if he's an inventor, but he's not. He's a collector, right? A really good collector.

[B]

He hasn't been an acquirer typically, though.

[A]

No, no.

[B]

He tries to go vertical.

[A]

He does, but he buys things that are. He sees things that are promising and buys them. He doesn't found them in a lot of ways, you know. So I think this is more his cursor. I thought, okay, maybe he's laid off the ketamine or something, because that's a good idea, right? That kind of thing. And it's not. It's just the right thing. It's sort of like if you put them in charge of their AI the way he put Gwynne Shotwell in charge of SpaceX, you really could do well. And he keeps. He just wanders. Someone described him. He comes in, he kicks some cans and he leaves. And that's what they prefer, essentially. And so I think that's probably good to put it in the hands of better people than him at this particular thing. And that's a smart move. It is, you're right. He could buy anything.

[B]

But the one thing, I mean everybody, every banker, the bankers taking anthropic and OpenAI out are looking at SpaceX and thinking, okay, that manufactured scarcity thing was really smart. How do we do it? I bet they're actually reducing the size of their offerings because they go this, this, a ton of people rushing through a small door of, of smaller float and increasing demand. Wow, did that work out well for those guys?

[A]

And then those lockups come out right when they were going public. The SpaceX lockups come out in the fall, in September. I think a lot of them, it goes to, I don't know, 40% something. There's a big, there's a big float,

[B]

there's sorts of things. If it trades above a certain amount for a certain number of days, there's soft lockups if you're on, if you bought the stock.

[A]

But the big ones come in the fall and. Which is right when these people are going to go public. Right, presumably. Which it means a possible decline. Like that's the thing. That's when you see.

[B]

Yeah, but there's, there's got to be. Everyone has just thrown their numbers in the trash bin and said, I would love to be Anthropic going public to say, oh my gosh, if you like this company at 120 times revenues, we're not growing 24% a year, we're growing 400% a year and you can buy us for the low, low price of 40 times revenues.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I would love to be an IR for anthropic. The weird thing, and I'm mean, I talk to a lot of companies about their AI efforts. What's going to be weird for OpenAI is what you're seeing a lot of in corporations right now is they are, they're blaming the model. A lot of corporations right now are swapping out chatgpt and OpenAI for Anthropic. And quite frankly, some of it is not OpenAI's fault. Fault. What it is is all these companies who are not seeing the return that was initially promised, they're blaming it on the initial. Are blaming the model.

[A]

Yeah, they're blaming the industry and swapping

[B]

out OpenAI for the hotter brand right now, which is Anthropic. So it's going to be very interesting

[A]

to see the numbers that got leaked of OpenAI. Whoa, whoa. They lose Money.

[B]

Yeah, they're burning a lot of capital. It's going to be very, very interesting to compare OpenAI and anthropics revenues. Now. OpenAI's, to be fair, OpenAI's losses somewhat exaggerated by the conversion from nonprofit to for profit and compensation costs. But once somebody smart like Bill Cohen actually looks into it and goes apples to apples, what'll be most interesting is to see how much momentum Anthropic has gained and how much momentum OpenAI has lost because that kind of sets the tone for everything. But I'll tell you, their valuations went up their first day. Valuations are up 40 or 50% because of SpaceX and even smaller. Guys, guys. There's this really cool company out of Italy called Bending Spoons. It's a private equity company that's about to come public and they did a roll up of like Vimeo and AOL and Eventbrite. Basically they found a bunch of orphans. Wetransfer, Evernote, Eventbrite, meetup. All these companies that were sort of left for dead and they've streamlined the back end, which is what private equity does, and they're taking them public. I love this company. I think it's a really smart idea.

[A]

They probably have to look at that.

[B]

They probably got them at really good prices. And these are companies that needed scale.

[A]

Like how they cleaned up Yahoo, Right?

[B]

Exactly. But every banker and every company going public right now because of SpaceX. I mean, there's an argument that they get hurt because there's not enough capital out there. But I'd go the other way. I would say everything looks cheap now in the context of SpaceX.

[A]

We'll see where it goes. But I think Bill is right. The retail investors will be left holding the bag when it comes to pass that a few earnings in. All right, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about Snap's new smart glasses. This is a treat for Scott. I know Foreign.

[B]

Teleport. Here's a finding that should stop every tech leader cold. Organizations most confident in their AI deployments have more than twice the security incident rate of those that aren't 72% versus 33%. That's from Teleport's 2026 Infrastructure Identity Survey of more than 200 infrastructure security leaders. The data data breach isn't just a costly endeavor, it can damage trust. The most frequent causes of data breaches are human error and compromised credentials. But in the AI era, agents that are granted broad privileges dramatically increase risk. Solution services like Teleport an AI infrastructure identity company provide an identity and access platform that is purpose built for modern, highly automated environments which are now deploying agents into production. Teleport establishes a unified identity layer for humans, machines and agents that is cryptographically backed that enables agents to be controlled and contained with the same rigor that you apply to other actors in your infrastructure. Because in the new era of AI, the problem isn't agents, it's the privileges we're giving them. Download the free [e-mail] pivot. Support for the show comes from Framer if your team wants a website that looks and feels handcrafted but is still fast to ship, Framer is built for that. You design on a visual canvas with responsive layouts, hosting and a CMS built in so the work is production ready. From day one, agents work alongside you to draft pages and polish sections. Then you review and publish what goes live. Framer is the pro site builder for creators, teams and businesses that want a professional site and care enough to get every detail right. Agents solve the gap between AI generated ideas and production ready website work. The agent works in the same place where the real site is designed, designed, managed, reviewed and published. It lands on the canvas, stays editable and can be published when the team is ready. Agents and Framer work alongside teams to streamline collaboration on the same canvas, build custom code components, create and manage CMS content, optimize SEO settings and ship everything all in one place. Learn how you can get more out of your site from a Framer specialist or get started building for free [e-mail] pivot for 30% off a Framer Pro annual plan. That's framer.com pivot for 30 percent off framer.com pivot rules and restrictions may apply.

[A]

Support for the show comes from Mint Mobile. We've all come across things that sound too good to be true, like high salary, low experience, job postings or cheap coffee where the price makes sense after the first sip. Or certain gluten alternatives that don't hit the the same as the real stuff. Phone plans fall under this too. You see a great deal and immediately wonder, what's the catch? But sometimes the catch is that there is no catch like Mint Mobile offering premium wireless for just $15 a month. It's just a good deal, plain and simple. To get your new wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month, go to mintmobile.com pivot that's mintmobile.com pivot cut your wireless bill to 15 bucks a month at mint mintmobile.com pivot. That's it. There's no catch. $45 upfront payment required. Equivalent to $15 a month new customers on the first three month plan only. Speed slower above 40 GB on unlimited plan. Additional taxes, fees and restrictions apply. See Mint Mobile for details. Scott, we're back and there's a new wearable that I know you'll be rushing out to buy. Snap just announced its augmented reality smart glasses called Specs. Evan Spiegel called it a way to bring computing into the world and make it more human. Though the style wise wired notes the glasses are chonky. I would think that's a perfect word actually. And at a price point of 2,195, they're well above the cost of most Meta Ray Bans, which are a couple hundred. And then though it's still about a thousand cheaper than Apple's Vision Pro, which people people think they're gonna get rid of and replaced with their glass version that'll compete with the Ray Bans. Investors don't seem to be impressed. Snapchat fell nearly 10% on Tuesday after the glasses were unveiled. I mean, I very much like Evan Spiegel, but that was bad, him putting them on. I can't say anything else. It just. He's a handsome man and it immediately rendered him unhandsome. And they looked kind of ridiculous and pretending otherwise seems silly. And by the way, Meta's version of these glasses, which have more utility and they have to be this big and chonky. The Ray Bans don't almost have no utility, just a few things. But the ones that have more utility, like mapping and all kinds of things like as if you have a cell phone in your hand or very heavy, no matter how you slice it. So your thoughts on the chonky glasses?

[B]

I've never. This is the first time in my life I've ever seen an image of Evan Spiegel at the. That I'm cooler than Evan Spiegel.

[A]

Yeah, he doesn't look good.

[B]

It looked. I think. Okay, so $2,200 for four hours of battery life, bulky frames from a company that has never turned a profit. Let's go. I mean, this is a terrible thing to say. I've never been a fan of Snap. I've always thought it was subscale. I think Evan is an innovator. I'm glad he's a billionaire. He seems like a lovely guy. He is a lovely guy. I've met him. Lovely guy. This is the beginning and the end of Snap as an independent company. This thing is dead on arrival. It makes the mixed reality headset from Tim Cook look like a viable product. This is. I mean, I don't know if you've heard, I'm not a big fan of these wearables and headsets.

[A]

No, I am looking forward to seeing what Apple comes in with. A lighter version. I am looking forward, but they are very chonky. Have you tried these on? I have, I've tried the specs and

[B]

I'm not part of the in crowd, the cool crowd. This is.

[A]

They're very heavy.

[B]

It's all headed to AirPods with AI and cameras built into them. I just. And maybe there'll be some cool light glasses, sunglasses. But here's the problem. Snap doesn't have the capital because. Because what Meta can do is meta can burn $60 billion on a failed product and it's like a speed bump. Bump. This product is overpriced, under engineered because Snap it, whatever it is, 6 or 8 billion mark cap doesn't have the capital to compete in the hardware space.

[A]

And you can't make those smaller. I mean, from what I understand, they got a lot packed in there. Even the Ray Bans are a little heavy that I don't wear them because I find them, they're heavier than my glasses and they have limited features. Like, limited, limited features. And so it's like take a picture, record something. I think one of the things, you know, recognition is important. I think, you know, like if you were blind or other things, like who is that very helpful. That kind of stuff with limited features is great. But if you want anything really substantive and actually when you put them on and look through them, it's cool. Cause the room becomes like. I saw one thing with the specs. This was many years ago, actually. They brought it to my house and I tried them on and they were so heavy, they were ridiculous. But when you look through them, there was the planets in front of you and you could walk through the planets and it was beautiful. Like, I have to say that was cool. And I was like, how can we get to this kind of thing? So for the first time I understood the planets. I know it sounds dumb because they were swirling around me and I was like, how do you create this in a way that is light? And I don't think you can. I think you kind of have to have some sort of holographic room or something that you live in, or your room has cameras. But this idea that you can have it all from the glasses means you have to wear these chonky glasses, but when you're in it, it is quite lovely. It's just the. I don't know how they're gonna make these light and easy to wear. You know, they're in the movies. They're always. And Iron man always has a pair that looks pretty cool.

[B]

But there's military applications, there's commercial applications, but from a consumer standpoint, these glasses and these three, it's always been like. It's always been like going to the planetarium at Griffith park, which I used to do with my college buddies. We get ridiculously fucking high, go to the planetarium and think, this is amazing. We got to do this again in another 24 months.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, that's a really good.

[B]

It's just not. Yeah, the commercial application is the most ubiquitous screen in the phone, I mean, in the world. Your iPhone that you can hold up to something and use ar, not VR. And then where. The only wearable, in my opinion, that's going to really take off is the one that's already taken off, and that is AirPods. And I mean, keep in mind specs, Snap launch specs, and they are an innovator in 2016 for 130 bucks and nobody bought them. So naturally the solution was to make them 15 times more expensive and way out heavier.

[A]

Yeah, specs sort of look like the Ray Bans, I'll tell you that. They definitely do. The early specs.

[B]

This is debt on arrival. Snap is an innovative subscale company that should be searching for an acquirer. Right. Right now.

[A]

Yeah. Who would buy them either?

[B]

I don't know. I don't. I don't know if. I don't know if Meta is allowed to. I don't. I don't know. It's probably someone.

[A]

He's the chief product officer.

[B]

And even. Even despite the fact the stock is now 90% or whatever it is in the last five years, it's still not $6 billion. It's not chump change.

[A]

Yeah. Remember he was offered a ton of money to be bought by Zuckerberg. I think it was in the million. It was in this area. Yeah. He turned him down.

[B]

Well, it's interesting. I think he was offered 3 billion and now it's worth 6 or 8. But if it had been 3 billion in Facebook stock, that would be worth 30 or 50 billion now.

[A]

Yeah, now I know. Anyway, good try, Evan, but really, you don't look good in those glasses. I'm sorry. You don't. I like you, but we have to tell the truth. All right? Scott. One more quick break. We'll be back for predictions.

[B]

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[A]

Ask your doctor about EBGLISS and visit eglis.lily.com or call 1-800-LILYRX or 1-800-545-5979. Okay, Scott, let's hear a prediction. I have to say, can I make one quick prediction? Sure. I was really struck by how. And I was just on the View, and I liked those ladies of the View, but I thought they did a fantastic job with that interview with J.D.

[B]

vance. I agree.

[A]

I thought they did a great job. And I have to say. Cause I'd be thinking, like, someone was like, tv's over. I'm like, is all TV over? Or can you innovate tv? And when you see things like that, you're like. Like, they created a viral moment that was also substantive. There are ways to innovate in the broadcast space, I think. Not secular, because secularly it's going down. But when I saw that, I'm like, there would be a way to do this that was like, they did a great. They showed you could make products that are really people like. And I think it was viewed by a lot of people. It did, like, a huge social thing. And I was just, what would you do to innovate? Television was really. It made me start thinking. And I have to say, I pay compliments to them because that's not where you expect. I think the best interview of him was done, I have to say, of all of them. And I thought they asked exactly the right questions. They had the amount of fairness and quality and also had a lot of good side eyes. Sunny Hostin and Anna had the best side eyes. But it was well done, I have to say.

[B]

Yeah, I agree with you, though. I thought they did as good a job as they were very respectful. They were pushed back when it was appropriate. I thought he did the best he could with the hand he's been built or dealt. I should say. I don't. You know, he was, you know, kudos to him. He wants to be president. Kudos to him. You gotta go into the lions den.

[A]

He did. He did.

[B]

And I thought he was actually, in a weird way, I thought it was a win for both of them. I thought he came off as is.

[A]

It was well done.

[B]

More human.

[A]

Yeah, I thought it was well done. Here's the problem. The only question they didn't ask him is the one they asked Kamala, what would you separate yourself from?

[B]

Oh, that's a great question.

[A]

That's the one I would ask.

[B]

What would you do differently? What would you do differently?

[A]

I would ask exactly the same.

[B]

That's exactly right.

[A]

That would have killed him because he'd have to have the same answer Kamala did, which is not a thing. I can't think of a thing. He couldn't say say anything is the thing. So that would have been the killer question. Sadly, I was not there.

[B]

He wouldn't have come on if he were there, I don't think. Anyways, okay, so my prediction is, and I've sort of already made, that an activist is going to show up and 4,7 either to sell or spin the Specs division. They've spent three and a half billion over the past decade on their fever dreams of a wearable with no real return, and they spend about a third of their adjusted EBITDA on specs per year. And better capitalized competitors, including Apple and Meta, are struggling to make this product category work. And if they spun or shut down their specs division, it's not a great business, but it's a good business. And that is Snap, for all of its issues and being subscale, is only one of four scaled social networks. It has a billion monthly active users and nearly nearly a half a billion daily active users, said my children.

[A]

Yeah, mine too. My kids, my sons.

[B]

Users still like it. Snap has over 6 million in revenue, it's still growing 10% a year and it has a billion in subscription revenue growing 60% a year. If Snap were able to achieve Reddit's forward revenue multiples, it would be worth 3 1/2x what it is today. So anyways, I think there's an activist play around saying to search, you have got to stop with the spec shit and either spin that into a separate company for other dumb people to finance, but the core business is a good business and you've saddled it with a shitty business and you don't have the capital to do that. Unlike these other companies that can go play in traffic, you have to be more disciplined than this Evan. And the person or the entity that's going to impose that discipline will be an activist that comes in and buys 5 to 10% of the company and so says shut this down or spin it. I think you're going to see that in the next month.

[A]

Who is the activist?

[B]

You know, I always go to the same people, but there's activists everywhere now.

[A]

Yeah, you're right.

[B]

That's you're about to see, quite frankly, you're about to see 20 new hedge funds from former SpaceX, Anthropic and OpenAI employees. You know what I was saying? I had dinner with a Group of friends last night. My friends Fernando and Tony and Steven last night at Roof Gardens. Beautiful nightcare. Beautiful night. And then we watched Team England. Oh my God. Was that fun? Was it in New York or 4, 2 or London?

[A]

London.

[B]

Okay. And we were saying. And granted these are. Do you realize how expensive like Europe is going to be this summer with all these newly minted douchebags headed to Europe this summer? I mean, I can't wait to see. I'll just hear about it. What a table in Ibiza. Klaas, for a big event when you have a bunch of 34 year old. And let's be honest, they're almost all dudes. We have a bunch of 34 year old dudes who woke up and are like worth 11 million. The first thing they're gonna do is head to Santro Bay this summer. And I said, I said, is it sank on sank 55. Yeah. I'm like, do you realize how expensive radish costs?

[A]

$50.

[B]

I mean, we talk about San Francisco real estate. Just wait till you see what the price of a bottle of bottle service is. Yeah, you know.

[A]

Well, that's why you're paying when we're there next week.

[B]

Scott, baby, I always pay for you. I always pay for the women.

[A]

I know you do.

[B]

I think all men should always pay for the women. I'm highly sexy.

[A]

I really don't like when things cost ridiculous amounts of money. It makes me.

[B]

Unless it's at the Hotel du Cap with the dog.

[A]

I see.

[B]

Then it's worth it. I haven't. Worth every penny. Another bottle of my friend who doesn't drink.

[A]

Guess who I'm bringing the children. And he's like, wait a minute.

[B]

Maybe no, you're not invited. I forgot about that.

[A]

Oh, yes, exactly. That's what I thought. You were very sweet with them in the pool last night.

[B]

Your kids are less awful than most those kids.

[A]

My kids are. They're great.

[B]

I do think. Wait, I just got to reveal that one moment though. I'm at the hotel. Be careful with you Amanda and your two kids. And I'm going down to the pool with Amanda and the kids. I'm like, you want to come down with us? And you're like, no. And please just keep them down there as long as possible. And you literally just splayed on a chair. I did.

[A]

I knew.

[B]

And you said to me, you gave me kind of that dad to dad. Look, you go do me a favor. Keep it down as long as possible. Keep Amanda and the kids down there as long as Possible.

[A]

You like to swim? I don't like to swim. I'm like a cat. I don't like to swim. So there you have it.

[B]

I can't wait.

[A]

Do you have your. What is it? Zodiac. Do you have the Zodiac ready?

[B]

Oh, I hired the same guy. He'll show up.

[A]

I want to ride in the Zodiac. Where you almost try to push me out.

[B]

All I know is he always. He somehow manages to navigate that thing with a lit cigarette at all times.

[A]

I love you in the Zodiac.

[B]

I think I pay him like €800 a day and he just circles the hotel and waits til ready to go somewhere and zooms me there like James Bond.

[A]

I want to ride in the Zodiac this year. Take Saul in the Zodiac. You'll kill him, though. My son is already a 34 year old hedge fund zillionaire. He just acts. That's how he goes through life. Four and a half. He's like.

[B]

He's ordering bottle service.

[A]

As a matter of fact, I do own the world.

[B]

He's ordering a bottle. Yeah.

[A]

Anyway, I'm very excited, by the way. We'll be in France and we'll be doing a live pivot, which we're very excited about, and hanging out on the Croisette.

[B]

We're doing a live pivot.

[A]

We are doing a live pivot.

[B]

I did not know that.

[A]

Yes, we are.

[B]

All right.

[A]

What do you mean you did not know that?

[B]

I did not know that.

[A]

What? I thought I had the week on recorded live. We're gonna record it live, not broadcast live, but we are gonna be together. Oh, my gosh.

[B]

Nice. Where are we recording it from?

[A]

Just show up where MJ tells you.

[B]

Okay, I'm in.

[A]

We wanna hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com pivot to submit a question for the show or call 855-elsewhere in the Karen Scott universe. This week on Prophecy Conversations, Scott spoke with the legend Heather Cox Richardson about the future of American democracy, the state of both political parties, and what history suggests comes next. Scott, you did a great job, I have to tell you. Let's listen to a clip. It does raise a larger question, I think, about where the United States is in this moment. And that is, obviously, this is hitting consumers incredibly hard. They were already hurting from the tariffs. Now they're gonna be hurting even more from the rising and cost of diesel and the cost of what that's going to do to food and gasoline and so on. But to what degree is the corruption and the incompetence and the self dealing among Trump and his inner circle, affecting the way that ordinary Americans who are not paying a lot of attention to that because they're working three jobs to put food on the table, you know, to what degree do those things speak to each other? That is a very good point. I do think the algae. The algae. I think it unites us all. Anyway, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot. We'll be back next week and congratulations to New York Knicks, especially the Brunson family. There were some pictures of him with his daughter.

[B]

Lovely.

[A]

What they all really exhibit masculinity and community in the way. That is wonderful. So congratulations. I hope everyone's having a good time right now at the ticker tape parade. And we'll be next week in France, Scott and I, so I hope you'll enjoy our shows from there.

[B]

Anyway, Scott, Today's show was produced by Lara Naiman Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Todd Wiseman. Ernie Andershot entered this episode. Thanks also to Drew Bros, Mr. Varian. Dan Shalon, the Shock Crow. As Vox Media's executive producer podcast, make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from Vox Media. We'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business business. The oatmeal savages descend on you wee lasses in Boston. Go tartan Army Scotland.

[A]

When I got a new car, I thought my insurance premium would increase and empty my bank account like if Fatween won the lottery. I've invested most of my winnings in chicken tenders because they're bomb. But bro, I bought a house and it's sick, bro. I'm thinking the floor is going to be all trampoline, bro, with the helipad on the roof. The contractor said it's structurally unsound. They're just being babies. But switching to Geico saved me hundreds. So my bank account is safe.

[B]

It feels good to save some hard earned cash. It feels good to Geico.