World Cup Controversy, Trump Accounts, and DOGE Farewell

Summary

Pivot Podcast Summary

Episode Title: World Cup Controversy, Trump Accounts, and DOGE Farewell
Date: July 7, 2026
Hosts: Kara Swisher (with guest co-host Anthony Scaramucci)

Overview

This episode of Pivot, hosted by journalist Kara Swisher with guest Anthony Scaramucci ("The Mooch"), dives into the intersection of sports, politics, and business. The focus is on Trump’s intervention in the World Cup, the fallout from his meme coin, the state of the U.S. under Trump’s presidency (including performative politics and corruption), the launch of Trump-branded investment accounts for children, and the broader tech and AI landscape. As Scott Galloway is away, the episode leans heavily on Scaramucci’s Wall Street and political insider take, along with Swisher’s signature sharp analysis and banter.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Taylor Swift’s Wedding, Celebrity Culture & Philanthropy

[01:26–07:06]

• Celebrity Guest List: Both discuss the eccentricity and diversity of celebrity guests at Taylor Swift's Madison Square Garden wedding, including Adam Sandler as officiant.
• Philanthropy: The couple donated $26 million to 20 different charities, praised by Scaramucci:

  “They gave a million dollars to City Harvest … God bless them for doing that.”
  (Anthony, 03:30)

• Comparison to Bezos Wedding: The Swift wedding felt “corny and authentic,” in contrast with the performative style of the Bezos event, which “tried to be the Venice Film Festival.”

  "This was like, hey, we're corny people, and we're gonna have a little bit of a cornball situation … But, oh, by the way, we're good people."
  (Anthony, 04:41)

2. Trump’s World Cup Interference & FIFA Corruption

[07:51–12:09]

• Trump’s Intervention: Trump called FIFA to reverse the suspension of US soccer star Foleren Balogan. Swisher and Scaramucci agree this exemplifies Trump’s attention-seeking, self-serving style.

  “I am the man. Everything is about me. Let's insert ourselves. Where's the attention this week? Oh, my God, there's billions of people watching the World Cup...”
  (Anthony, 09:04)

• FIFA's Role: Both call FIFA highly corrupt, “married” with Trump’s corruption.

  “What organization in the world is more corrupt than the Donald Trump White House? The answer is boing. FIFA.”
  (Anthony, 09:04)

• Impact: Swisher worries Trump’s involvement sullies any US win.
• Irony of Citizenship: The soccer player benefited from birthright citizenship, which Trump campaigns against.

3. July 4th, The MAGA Rally, and Rising White Nationalism

[12:09–15:38]

• Trump’s July 4th Speech: Swisher highlights Trump using the 250th anniversary to advance the Save America Act, and his focus on anti-communism rhetoric ("Communism is a loser and it will always be" [12:09]).
• White Nationalist March: Both note the uptick in white nationalist activity and the administration’s failure to denounce them.

  “Unfortunately, we have somebody in the White House that sort of blows the dog whistle for these people as opposed to denouncing these people.”
  (Anthony, 16:05)

4. Corruption, Emergency Powers, and the Save America Act

[17:01–18:39]

• Political Strategy: Scaramucci details Trump’s strategy to pass the Save America Act by stoking fear among minority voters and seeking long-term electoral dominance.

  “Trump said something people should really listen to. If I can get this thing passed, we won’t lose an election for the next 100 years.”
  (Anthony, 17:21)

• On Future Authoritarians:

  "I think we got Trump... I’m worried about the next lunatic that shows up with the same message."
  (Anthony, 18:29)

5. Tucker Carlson’s Wannabe-Strongman Persona

[18:39–21:43]

• Carlson’s Chances: Scaramucci argues Tucker Carlson is a “dodgeball bully,” not a real political threat, lacking Trump’s drive or grind.

  “He’s a dodgeball bully who feeds the ducks of his audience.”
  (Anthony, 20:49)

• Why He Won’t Run:

  “It’s a big boy sport…Trump is a grinder...Tucker doesn’t strike me as that.”
  (Anthony, 20:49)

6. Trump’s Next Moves & Grift Strategy

[21:43–23:24]

• World Cup Spotlight: Predicts Trump will milk attention by presenting the World Cup trophy (July 19).
• Financial Grift: Trump openly leverages gifts and business for personal gain.

  “He’s about glory, self-aggrandizement and moolah. That’s the holy trinity inside his brain.”
  (Anthony, 23:14)

7. Crypto and Trump’s Meme Coin Scandal

[27:26–37:18]

• Massive Losses: Nearly one million investors lost $3.8 billion on Trump’s meme coin; Trump walked away with over $600m in profits, profiting off trading fees regardless of coin performance.

  “All of the publicly traded crypto companies combined made less than Donald Trump did in crypto.”
  (Anthony, 28:36)

• Foreign Stake: Emirati royal family’s $500 million stake in Trump’s company raises influence questions.
• Damage to Crypto: The “scammer-in-chief” narrative and lack of serious regulation now make it harder for legitimate crypto progress:

  “Trump has opened up the floodgates and became the scammer in chief in the industry.”
  (Anthony, 31:14)

• Regulatory Uncertainty: The need for true bipartisan regulation (“The Clarity Act”) is hamstrung by political gamesmanship and grifting.

8. DOGE (Department of Government Efficiency) Winds Down

[37:18–41:57]

• Disastrous Results: Agency claims $215 billion in taxpayer savings, but cuts caused massive humanitarian harm. No final assessment will be published.

  “It was a nothing burger of massive proportions and actually led to death of people around the globe, especially children.”
  (Kara, 38:17)

• Missed Opportunity: Scaramucci laments failure to learn from the Clinton administration’s more effective approach.

9. Trump Accounts: Forced Investment for Children

[45:20–50:40]

• Systemic Issues: $1,000 invested for every child born during Trump’s term (2025–28), with 6 million accounts opened. Funded by Treasury, with big-name donors.
• Pros: Could spark financial literacy, asset-building.
• Cons: Susceptible to grift, doesn’t replace health care or basic child welfare policies.

  “This one I like, and I would like to see more billionaires. I’d like to see more people do this giving money.”
  (Anthony, 48:48)

• Corruption in Pardons & Favors: Scaramucci claims many pay for access and legal favor under Trump.

10. Meta’s AI Stumbles & Big Tech's Expensive Bet

[52:05–54:34]

• Slow Progress: Meta’s massive $145B AI spending isn’t delivering hoped-for results.

  “They have patience until bam. They don’t have patience...reminds me of Global Crossing and Cisco [dot-com boom] ...and that movie ended in tears.”
  (Anthony, 53:14 & 54:31)

• Parallels: The tech infrastructure race could suffer a crash, as in previous bubbles.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On FIFA and Trump:
  “What organization in the world is more corrupt than the Donald Trump White House? The answer is… FIFA.” (Anthony, 09:04)
• On Trump’s Meme Coin Grift:
  “He needs an Academy Award or a FIFA World Cup trophy. Maybe FIFA will give him the grifter prize.” (Anthony, 28:36)
• On White Nationalism’s Visibility:
  “‘Unfortunately, we have somebody in the White House that sort of blows the dog whistle for these people as opposed to denouncing them.’” (Anthony, 16:05)
• On Sycophancy:
  “When are you gonna say the emperor has not— I don’t want to see Donald Trump naked necessarily…” (Kara, 59:59)
• On Supergirl as a 'win':
  “It’s a really solid… good… strange movie… Later it’ll become a cult favorite, I think.” (Kara, 63:41)
• On Society’s Impact:
  “This guy is putting a suppression on middle and lower income people. They're like, holy shit… There's a two-tier justice system.” (Anthony, 51:08)

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Important Segments & Timestamps

| Topic | Timestamp | |---------------------------------------------------------------|---------------------| | Taylor Swift’s wedding & philanthropy | 01:26–07:06 | | Trump/FIFA World Cup intervention | 07:51–12:09 | | Trump’s July 4th events/white nationalist march | 12:09–17:01 | | Save America Act & political strategy | 17:01–18:39 | | Tucker Carlson’s prospects | 18:39–21:43 | | Trump’s grift, meme coin fallout | 27:26–37:18 | | DOGE winds down; critique of government ‘efficiency’ claims | 37:18–41:57 | | Trump accounts for children: pros and cons | 45:20–50:40 | | Meta’s AI “pause,” dot-com parallels, tech warning | 52:05–54:34 | | Wins and Fails; closing reflections | 59:26–64:33 |

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Wins and Fails (as shared by Co-Hosts)

Wins:

• Trump Accounts: More Americans exposed to investment, long-term saving.
• Birthright Citizenship: Supreme Court protecting constitutional principles.

Fails:

• FIFA: Letting Trump politicize and taint the World Cup.
• Sycophancy of enablers in the administration, e.g., Douglas Burgum’s lack of integrity.
• Department of Government Efficiency: Humanitarian costs, performative outcomes.

Pop Culture Win:

• Kara's endorsement of “Supergirl” and noting Taylor Swift & Travis Kelce’s wedding as a positive moment.

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Tone & Language

• Candid, Sarcastic, and Deeply Critical: As always, the show skewers hypocrisy and corruption, mixing humor, eye-rolling, and real policy critique.
• Banter: Plenty of tongue-in-cheek, self-deprecating humor, especially from Anthony (“I’m totally shameless ... I would have maybe even gotten a drone for myself.” 06:20).
• Insider Feel: Industry lingo around investment, crypto, and politics is peppered with plain English summaries for broader accessibility.

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Final Reflection

This episode ties together the spectacle of contemporary American politics and culture, highlighting the troubling overlap between grift, celebrity, and governance. Whether it's Trump’s direct meddling in world sports, using meme coins for personal profit, or the questionable efficacy of dogged “efficiency” government programs, the underlying critique is clear: performative leadership and corruption remain unchecked. Yet there are sparks of hope—calls for financial literacy, constitutional guardrails, and even well-intentioned (if imperfect) child investment accounts. The episode ends on a note blending exasperation, humor, and a hope for better leadership and more critical public engagement.

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Transcript

[Kara Swisher]

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[Podcast Announcer]

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[Podcast Host Seth Matlins]

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[Podcast Announcer]

The Markets Podcast from Goldman Sachs Listen now.

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[Kara Swisher]

I don't wanna see Donald Trump naked

[Anthony Scaramucci]

necessarily, but have you ever thought about it though? Has it ever like, gone into the brain?

[Kara Swisher]

Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher. Scott is off today, so I brought in the one and only Anthony Scaramucci, the Mooch Podcaster, founder of Skybridge Capital and author of the upcoming book, which is Giving a Lot of Kudos all the Wrong Moves and I think I gave you a blurb, Anthony, didn't you?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I got a blurb out of it.

[Kara Swisher]

Hey, listen, I never give blurbs. You know that.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I got a. You know, I had to use the crowbar, ladies and gentlemen, to get the. I pivoted on pivot. I had to use the crowbar to get the blurb out of her. But it worked.

[Kara Swisher]

No, it's a, it's a big deal when I give a blurb. I gave one to you. I've given one to Ari Emanuel. Those are the only two. But I used his to insult him.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

So, yeah, I'm looking forward to his book, actually. I think that's good. I feel like you're going to learn a lot about Hollywood in that book.

[Podcast Announcer]

Actually.

[Kara Swisher]

You learn a lot about him, I have to say.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Better yet, then, if I'M learning more about him than. Better yet, It's.

[Kara Swisher]

It's got a sadness to it, actually. It's got a depth to it. How about a depth to it? Like, struggles that he had and he never shows that. He shows.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I think what you and I love about people is authenticity and honesty. And it sounds like we're gonna be getting that from Ari, so I look forward to the book.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. All right. But so be honest with me. You were at Taylor Swift's wedding, weren't you?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, I'll be really honest with you and tell you, I would have liked to have been invited to Taylor Swift's wedding because when you look up in the dictionary, name dropping and star fucking, there's a picture of me. But alas, I was not invited to her wedding.

[Kara Swisher]

It made no sense. The invitations. I mean, I got the dancers and everybody else, like all her friends and her cousins and everything. But the celebrities were just odd. It was so. They were. Some of them were obvious, like Bradley Cooper and those kind of people. But Adam Sandler being the officiant was interesting. It was such a. Was such a dog's breakfast of celebrities. It was fascinating. What do you think?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, what I love about it is it was original and it was true to whatever they wanted to. You know, at the end of the day, it's your wedding. Have at it.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, I liked it.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

And they went crazy. I mean, I one time got married with a lot of fanfare in a Roman Catholic church. The second time I got married, Deirdre and I got married in our living room. So, I mean, you know, it's a time in their lives. They're both first time married. I wish them nothing but great success with their marriage. But you know what? If you don't mind, I'm going to give them a shout out because they did list 20 charities. And I'm on the board of City Harvest, which is one of the largest food banks in the country. Country, if not the largest. And they gave a million dollars to City Harbors. And so God bless them for doing that because we have a lot of food insecure people in our great city car.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, they gave a bunch. Dolly Parton. They gave a bunch to all these, like, amazing. They gave $26 million, which is 13 times 2 if you're a Taylor Swift person. Which is her favorite number. But it was really interesting. What was interesting is how they handled it. I was going to compare it to the Bezos wedding. I want it to be fair, but for some reason, that one felt. And this one Cracked me up. And I don't know why the difference. Cause it was obviously an over the top wedding. It was directly in the middle of New York City, which I loved. And of course, they did it to protect them at Madison. You've been to Madison Square Garden a hundred times, right? Presumably. Yeah.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

No, I consider Madison Square Garden one of my homes. I'm a Nick and a Ranger fan. But I think the difference was the Bezos wedding was trying to be the Venice Film Festival, but for the Bezos family. And this was like, hey, we're corny people, and we're gonna have a little bit of a cornball situation. Go. And we're going to do whatever we want. But, oh, by the way, we're good people. We're going to write some big checks to charity. So, hey, listen, you know, I'm all about. If Jeff Bezos and his wife, Lauren Bezos, if they want to spend money like that, God bless. I have no problem with. I know other people get very upset with it. My attitude is, you know, you know, you make the money, spend the money, no problem. And people forget how many jobs are tied to events like this. You know, you've got porters and waiters, and you've got people in the hotels. And to me, I like people spending their money because it goes into the system and it takes care of a lot of people.

[Kara Swisher]

On an experience right now, what's really, to me was interesting is one is. Theirs was rather private, even though it was in the middle of New York City. 1. There weren't. You haven't seen pictures. Very many. You've seen very few pictures come out. And the ones that are out are just people. Hey, I'm going to this wedding and sort of bragging about, which I'm fine with. The Bezos one was so performative, like waving from the docks and the outfits and everything else. And I think that was one of the differences. I suspect there's gonna be a movie of the wedding. I suspect that's coming for all of us.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Let me ask Kara Swisher a question, though. Would you have promoted that you were going to the wedding? Would you have had, like, a selfie? A Swisher, like, selfie?

[Kara Swisher]

I kind of had. Would have to. Because it was such a strange group of people.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I'm totally shameless. I would have been promoting it. I would have had. I maybe even gotten a drone for myself.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, you kind of.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Because I'm a revolting person.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I think they wanted that. I think they wanted that. And I did like that even the celebrities were, like, showing off. Right. Like, I was. Oh, by the way, I was there and showing off their dresses. And it was all about like the Met Gala. But what was fascinating me is very little leaked. And it seemed adorable. It just seemed. I, you know, I like everything Taylor Swift and Scott doesn't. But I felt like, now I'm thrilled for you here for you, because you probably like her.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

What's not to like? I mean, let me. And I like success stories, you know, God bless her. What's not to like? All the girl, every kid likes her. God bless, you know. And by the way, he's won, you know. How many Super Bowls did the kid win? He won two Super Bowls. Three. Three. Okay.

[Podcast Announcer]

There you go.

[Kara Swisher]

Come. I know they're very handsome.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Although I will say this about him and he can respond to me. He can direct message me on Twitter, probably be mad at me. He has the thinnest arms, really, and the least amount of biceps of any tight end.

[Kara Swisher]

He's a hunk.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Go take a look at his arms.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I'm just telling you this kid is very slender for a tight end, which made him, in my opinion, faster, quicker, and a better receiver. I don't see him as a blocking tight end. He was almost like a third receiver for Mahomes, which.

[Kara Swisher]

Interesting.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Which was part of the. Part of the warfare there and part of the offensive success story.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I guess I don't know what you're talking about. He looks handsome to me and I'm a lesbian. I think he's hot.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Am I allowed to say that I'm also a lesbian or probably it's not appropriate.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, you may say that if you'd like.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Okay, yeah, but that's my pronoun.

[Kara Swisher]

But anyway, I was happy for New York to do it, and it actually was in juxtaposition of something happening down in Washington, which was just a disaster. But first, let me start first, since we're talking about sports. President Trump has officially inserted himself into the World Cup. This is really bad. Even I know this is bad. US Soccer star Foleren Balogan is set to play against Belgium after FIFA overturned his one match suspension from a controversial red card. Trump personally called FIFA president Gianni Infantino to push for a review of the decision. Trump posted on Truth Social saying, thank you for doing what was right and reversing a great injustice. As we tape on Monday, Belgium has been granted the right to appeal the ruling. So things may have changed by the time you listen to this. I mean, why did he do this, it seems like it's just sort of sullies. And by the way, reminder. Trump was awarded the inaugural FIFA Peace Prize in December. Thoughts?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, I mean, I think we. If you're ever on Jeopardy. They don't answer the. They don't ask the questions like this. They say, what organization in the world is more corrupt than the Donald Trump White House? The answer is boing. FIFA.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, FIFA.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

That's the answer. So, I mean, so, you know, it's like the two of them got married and did something very corruptive and delicious. To the world's most favorite sport. But to me. Cause I wanna channel Trump for you. So get the barf bags out, guys. Cause I wanna tell you exactly how he thinks. I am the man. Everything is about me. Let's insert ourselves. Where's the attention this week? Oh, my God, there's billions of people watching the World Cup. Well, I gotta get myself inserted into that, right?

[Kara Swisher]

And Taylor's. He tried to insert him. The Taylor Swift wedding. You saw that. He tried to do.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

He tried to do that because she hates him, he hates her. Ba. Ba. But let's just roll. Hello? Butlick. Howard? Howard? Howard, are you there? But lick. Okay. Get some evidence together. Okay? And then he calls Infantino, who we're calling Sicofantino, and he says, this is what I want done. And he basically does it. And everyone's looking around, scratching their heads and saying, wow, this is low for America, you know, because it just makes us look crass. But to Trump, he's patting himself on the back. You know what he's saying? Nobody could have done this other than me. This is like another war that I solved. I need another FIFA peace prize.

[Kara Swisher]

Look, FIFA is very corrupt. And I did a whole show on this about the corruption and the ticket sales and everything else. But the games seem to be going well, right? People seem to be enjoying the people here from other countries. You know, you had Cape Verde, you had Mexico last night. Even I am paying attention to this a little bit.

[Podcast Announcer]

Bit.

[Kara Swisher]

But. But this sort of. It creates. Does it create a problem here? If this guy gets. By the way, just for people who don't know, this soccer star was born in the United States. His parents are from London. So he's what? He's the kind of the birthright citizenship that Trump rails against at the same time, which I think is kind of, of course, ironic. It's not ironic. It's typical.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, yeah, I mean, that's. That's Trump. You know, he doesn't even. He's probably not Even aware of that. And so that's another big irony of the whole thing. But. But just it has to be about him. Enough of me talking about me. What do you think of me? And how can I get myself inserted into every situation, even if it's controversial,

[Kara Swisher]

it sort of sullies a US win if there is one.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah, you see that? Okay, so now that's the FIFA's position. They're like, okay, the Americans are gonna win anyway. It'll mean more ratings. But somebody look, that was supposed to be done on the qt. And then Trump can't help himself. He's got these AI generated truth socials which are incredibly rev, where the guy's pulling out the trump card on the ref, saying, yeah, you're trying to throw me out, but I've got the Donald Trump trump card. So I'm back in. And so, you know, what happens is it's just a turnoff to people. And I gotta say this to you, Karen, I'd love to hear your opinion on this. I thought the games were going great for America. I thought people were coming in very. Thought the place was so hospitable. And I'd be like, all right, well, America's finally getting a slap on the back from.

[Kara Swisher]

That's cause he was out of it. He wasn't near it. That's why.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Exactly.

[Kara Swisher]

And speaking of being near, I mean, I think it'll just. You're right. If the Americans don't win, it hardly matters. Which is probably what Infantino was thinking. He also marked America's 250th birthday, which was kind of a dud, by giving a speech. It was essentially a MAGA rally on the National Mall after storms delayed the event. He honored veterans and astronauts while also touting his own record and pushing for the Save America Act. He also focused on his latest obsession, communism, saying, communism is a loser and it will always be. The night before at Mount Rushmore, where there was hail a lot of weather his way, which was interesting. He called communist menace a greater threat than Pearl harbor in 911 argued that American identities under renewed attack. I thought communists were losing. And speaking of threats to American identity, hundreds of mass members of the white nationalist group Patriot front marched through D.C. on the 4th carrying Confederate flags and chanting Reclaim America. Those photos were kind of bizarre to look at. They were on the subway. Talk a little bit about what was happening. And also, you couldn't see the fireworks because there were too many of them and too much smoke. We all have been advised to stay inside over the next day or two in D.C. because of the heat and the particulates from the fireworks, which nobody could see very easily. Talk a little bit about this communism thing. I hadn't heard communism from him. So thoughts on what's happening here?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, it's Mandani related. This is all related to the electoral success that the Democratic socialists have had recently. And this is also related to the speech that the mayor of New York gave from George Washington's desk, which obviously was very polarizing to some people. My arch nemesis, Steve Bannon, somebody I can't stand, actually nailed it in my opinion. He said, hey, you better pay attention to Zoramundani because he's a great communicator, he's got a vision for things. He understands where people are and how upset they are, especially young people. Exactly. And Trump's response is to label everything with a broad bush that it's communism car. And I think that's a big danger because when you do that you're missing the elements of what's got people upset. And this isn't communism. If you listen to his speech, I sort of felt like it was Scandinavianism, it was northern Europe, it wasn't communism. And Trump's trying to label it something that it isn't. And he does that very successfully at

[Kara Swisher]

a lot of people who's thinking of this, who is this successful? Because everyone's like communists. I haven't thought about communists since the Cold War essentially.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah. So I don't think it's gonna be successful. Cause you remember Zoran Mandani is not flat footed. When you're calling Hillary Clinton crooked or Joe Biden sleepy or Jeb Bush low energy, they're more like standard politicians and they're a little flat footed. This guy, in my opinion, has made one mistake. I won't name the billionaire, but when he doxxed a billionaire in New York City with social media, I thought that was bad. I mean, because you don't wanna put people in harm's way. If you wanna put a peer to tear tax in and people can pay it, no problem. But don't name the people cause you're gonna get Agreed. You're gonna make people in a dangerous position. But to me, this kid has only made one gaffe and I wasn't a supporter of his. I think the city's a lot cleaner. The city looks very safe to me. You said to me last week that New York is back, New York is flourishing. Is that not true?

[Kara Swisher]

Mm, yeah, absolutely. When you go there, it's hard to Walk the street. It's so full and vibrant, exciting. And it's. Along with the Knicks, the Taylor Swift thing, it's just. There's a lot happening there. But what, what is the, you know, having the, the white nationalists show up again was sort of my. I was like, oh, my God, them again in that, in those weird outfits they wear, the blue shirts and the khakis with the weird white mask that they have to hide themselves because they're not proud of who they are, presumably.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah, well, okay, but you see, see what's going on. Elon Musk said that this was a false flag operation. This is hard left people that are sending out these white supremacists. And there was a photo of a young African American woman on the bus with them and people saying, okay, that photo was contrived. Okay, I don't believe, I don't believe any of that, by the way. But I'm just saying, to me, they're doing that for publicity, they're doing that for the shock and awe effect. And unfortunately for this country and perhaps most countries, we do have racist assholes in this country, and we do have white supremacists in this country, but unfortunately, we have somebody in the White House that sort of blows the dog whistle for these people as opposed to denouncing these people or ignoring these people. It's like, oh, that sounds like a lot of fun. Can you guys bring the matches over here? Let's light the door. Flame log for the white supremacist bonfire. That's the stuff that I really can't stand.

[Kara Swisher]

Does he. It's all around the Save America act, though. I mean, that's really the focus. There's story after story of him, the desperation of either passing this or pulling some emergency powers, declaring a national security emergency around voting and everything else. To me, that's where everything funnels down to, is this fear of November?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah, I mean, listen, I mean, that's the goal, right? We gotta get black and brown people not to vote. And so we're gonna get ICE agents out. We're gonna scare you. I've gotta get this legislation passed, the Save America Act. And if we get that passed as well, hopefully you'll stay in your house and we can organize as much of the white vote as we possibly can to win these. And so Trump said something people should really listen to. If I can get this thing passed, we won't lose an election for the next 100 years. Did you hear him say that? Yeah, he said that. Pay attention. So now, thankfully, thune is American enough still where he's blocking Trump and he's stopping him. But, you know, listen, what comes next is the answer, Cara, Because I think we got Trump. I think the courts have knocked him to the ground a notch. I think his age is getting him. I think some of the podcasters have broken from him. Some of the traditional Republicans are just waiting him out. Okay, so I think we got Trump. I'm worried about the next lunatic that shows up with the same message, you know?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Any thoughts on who that would be?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

None of the current lunatics. You know, they don't have the Riz Kara Swisher. It would have to be a young lunatic that we don't know right now.

[Kara Swisher]

Not Tucker Carlson. I've never asked you about Tucker Carlson. How do you look at him?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Tucker is a typical dweeb in the high school. I wasn't a clique guy in high school. My uncle owned a motorcycle shop, so I did have a leather jacket. But I was also the captain of the football team, so I was not into the whole clique thing. But Tucker would have been that kid that was like a sneaky bully. And so a sneaky bully is. No one's looking. I'm gonna poke Kara in the eye, okay? No one's looking. I'm gonna do something devious or pranksterous to somebody that's we than me due to my insecurities. Right. So Tucker wasn't the out and out bully, because when you saw that guy, you just walk up to him, punch him in the face, and make him go away. And so what Tucker does, he's like a dodgeball bully. Okay, so hear me out a second. You remember when you were in elementary school, you were probably the smart. You were probably the smart kid in the back lurking with the ball.

[Kara Swisher]

I was too small to hit. I was always the last kid before to get hit. Of course.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

And you were always waiting for the big jock to hit the other jock, and then you snuck up and hit the big jock and you won.

[Kara Swisher]

Correct. Thank you.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

But Tucker is a dodgeball bully, okay? He's been sneaking around, bullying and terrorizing people for his adult life, and now he's got a very big, broad podcast that he can do this on. My buddy Chris Cuomo. People should go look at the tape. He took a karate chop to Tucker's Adams apple as he was spouting his BS about Russia, okay? And Chris doesn't give a shit. They just took him to the ground. And so I say to myself, number one, is he on the Take from Russia, I don't know. So I'm not gonna say yes or no, but he uses Russian talking points when he talks.

[Kara Swisher]

He does?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah. Number two, he's all of a sudden anti Israel, and we can debate that. I'm not saying Israel's got a great brand right now. I think they've had a lot of mishaps. But you went from pro Israel hanging out with Huckabee to now you're anti Israel. And I'm like, guy, what are you doing? Exactly? And you know what he's doing? He's feeding the ducks of his audience. Okay, so he's a dodgeball bully who feeds the ducks of his audience.

[Kara Swisher]

Does that give him a chance or not?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

No, no, he's got no chance. And I think he's a complete tool. Also, if Trump is alive when he announces his candidacy, Trump is gonna send like orange maned cruise missiles up to Maine and blow Tucker out of the water. Because one thing about Trump, he knows the Achilles heel of people like Tucker. And I predict Tucker won't run, because, listen, that is a big boy sport, as you know. It's not podcasting. It's not hanging around waiting for your next massage. It's like, okay, we gotta get on the road. And you can hate Donald Trump, but Donald Trump is a grinder. I watched him eight in the morning till midnight. Let's grind this thing out. Tucker doesn't strike me as that.

[Kara Swisher]

I see.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Pass me the nail file. I'm about to get a mani Petty. Tucker Carlson, the dodgeball bully.

[Kara Swisher]

Can I ask you one last question on this? So what's Trump's move? We got July, August, everything's quiet. What does he have? He doesn't have much time till the midterms. Besides trying to stop the election itself. What does he do now? How does he get attention? What is he going to do?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, we have more revulsion coming. And so on July 19, he'll be in the Meadowlands. He'll be at the New Jersey New York stadium, handing the trophy to somebody who has won the World cup because Infantino Sefantino is going to let him do that. So that's going to be a big day for him, lots of attention on him. He'll have billions of people watching him. He'll be very happy about that. Right? Exactly. And he's announced his grift to the public. Okay, so if you ever thought that he hasn't learned from the kgb, he has actually. Because what does the KGB do? They spy out in the open. Right? Remember, John Le Carre would explain to you that the person shows up, they look like a KGB spy, they act like a KGB spy. So you don't think they're a KGB sky, but guess what? They are one. And so Trump is like, let me announce to you my grift, okay? And so here's all the different things that I'm doing. He even put the $15,000 of Infantino tickets that were given to him on his financial disclosure, the FIFA tickets that were given to him. So what he's gonna do is he knows he doesn't give a shit about his party. He doesn't care who wins the election as long as he's not overly investigated. He's gonna pardon himself and his family. He's going to try to make $10 billion over the next two years.

[Kara Swisher]

All right, well that'll get us into. So that's what he's working on.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

That's what he's gonna do. Yeah, he, he's about glory, self aggrandizement and moolah. That's the holy trinity inside his brain.

[Kara Swisher]

All right, okay, well, we that because we're going to talk about something that you know a lot about, which is cryptocurrency. Okay, Anthony, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, millions of investors lost billions on Trump's meme coin.

[Podcast Announcer]

Support for the show comes from Vanta. Every new tool your team signs up for, every vendor that turns on AI features, every new integration has a chance for something to go wrong. And most security programs weren't built for AI pace of growth. Enter Vanta. Vanta is the number one agentic trust platform used by over 16,000 fast moving companies including Ramp, Cursor and Harvey to ensure they're always audit ready. And now Vanta is helping companies like yours watch the risks that show up between audits across your vendors, your AI tools and your whole environment. How the Vanta agent works like a 24.7grc engineer in the background finding issues, drafting fixes for you and cutting vendor assessment time by up to 50%. Whether you're a fast growing startup or a global enterprise, Vanna is here to help you automate your security and compliance and earn improved trust. Get started [e-mail] pivot that's V A N T A dot com pivot. This is advertiser content from Harvey AI. We have a choice over who we work with and who we don't. Specifically who we allow to advertise and who we. And for those of you who watch my Content. I am not an AI catastrophist. I'm an AI optimist. I think it's going to create more jobs than it destroys. And I think our job as professionals is to figure out how to leverage these tools. AI more than almost anything I do in terms of what I could point to for real economic leverage and savings is 100% in the legal fields. Harvey is the AI designed specifically for legal work, trusted by leading law firms and enterprises, legal teams. All right, so now I'm looking at their demo. It plugs into tools that lawyers already work with. LexisNexis, Microsoft, and this is the key. And I do this internally with my LLMs, with permissions. It lets you look at the firm's own files and databases. So here it's answering a question, reads the complaint, pulls the relevant terms, checks the web, weighs the evidence, and drafts a response. But it also can do this in a shared workspace between the firm and the client, so they both have visibility into the work being done and can both add value to it. I, I think this space is clearly sort of hand in glove for AI, right? So there's no doubt about it. This, I think is going to be super helpful, not only for law firms themselves, but internally for general counsels that come. Harvey is AI tailored for law. You can learn more at Harvey AI. Support for the show comes from anthropic. Not every question has an easy answer. And when you're working through something complicated, it helps to have a thought partner to kick ideas around with and uncover what's really going on beneath the surface. That's where Cloud comes in. Cloud is the AI for minds that don't stop at good enough. It's the collaborator that actually understands your entire workflow and thinks with you. Whether you're debugging code at midnight or strategizing your next business move, Cloud extends your thinking to tackle the problems that matter. Plus, Cloud's research capabilities can have comprehensive, reliable analysis and citations. Turning hours of research into minutes. And Cowork brings Cloud's code agentic power to your desktop. No terminal required. Just point it to a folder on your computer and add Connect, including Google Drive and Gmail. Describe what you need and it handles the rest. You just queue up tasks and come back to find finished work for problems we're solving. Get started with Claude today at Claude AI Pivot. That's Cloud AI Pivot. And check out Claude Pro, which includes access to all of the features mentioned in today's episode. Claude AI Pivot.

[Kara Swisher]

Anthony, we're back. Nearly 1 million people who bought President Trump's Meme coin have lost a combined 3.8 billion. Guess where it went. At the same time, Trump disclosed earnings of $636 million from the meme coin. In 2025, Trump profited whether the coin price rose or fell, collecting fees every time the token was traded, which is called a vig, which he often prompted his followers on Truth Social to do. Meanwhile, Michael Saylor's strategy has abandoned its famous never sell bitcoin wasn't a holder mantra. The company is launching a $1.25 billion monetization program to raise capital with bitcoin sales already sold 216 million. Trump's disclosure, by the way, showed active trading of strategy shares for people who don't understand what's happening. We talked about this. Last week, he made several billion dollars, largely related to crypto. Very small amount in real estate. Similar. Similar to what he always makes in real estate. Essentially nothing more or less, but there's a lot of. And of course, the kids have their own grifts going on, and Ivanka have their own grift. So talk about how we should be thinking about crypto now and what happened here with Trump.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, I mean, it's important that people understand how dramatic this grift was. I mean, he needs an Academy Award or a FIFA World cup trophy. Maybe FIFA will give him the grifter, you know, prize of the. You know, we gave you the FIFA Peace prize, but the grifting has been so good. Here's the FIFA grifter prize, because this is unbelievable. And just to put it into context for everybody, all of the publicly traded crypto companies combined made less than Donald Trump did in crypto. Just so everybody knows, he made more money than Coinbase, Kraken, put them all together. Kraken's not public, but you get my point. They do disclose their financials. And remember this, okay? Trump's disclosure was 927 pages. Barack Obama, his was eight pages. Okay, so this guy filed a phone book. He didn't file disclosure. But. But the crypto stuff is so bad. It is so egregious. So many people lost money. And the differential of 3.8 billion losing and him making 800 is just, to me, insidious. But I'm gonna. I'm gonna say this to you, and I know you get this. The Emirati Royal family bought $500 million stake in his company before the inauguration.

[Kara Swisher]

Right?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Okay, So. I don't know. You tell me. That was just a. Hey, that's a nice gesture. And, hey, Kara, how are you doing? You know, there's a Kara Switcher. It looks like it's from your longevity documentary behind you. I'd like to buy that from you for $500 million just because, you know, you're a nice person. Kara. Is that how the Emirati royal family treated that situation?

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

So to me, it's again, I'm taking the money. And by the way, you stupid crypto bros, what did you think was gonna happen? Oh, you thought I was supporting you? No, no. This Clarity act, which everybody would like to get passed, that can't happen because my opposition hates me and they're gonna vote against it despite me. And, oh, by the way, that spites you. But, ha ha, guess what? I didn't care about you. I didn't care about your industry.

[Kara Swisher]

Right. So what happens to the crypto? What is happening? Like what Saylor has done? Obviously, he's been super aggressive, and you've been deep into crypto and bitcoin particularly. Does this hurt the bitcoin business? Business? Because it was actually improving, allegedly, under Trump with all these, you know, Gensler was gone. Everything else. Where does this leave crypto now? Because it then has this taint, as the World cup has, of Trump's finger. Dirty fingers all over it.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah. So nobody likes me in the crypto community for saying this, but I'm gonna continue to say this. Gary Gensler was a pain in the ass to the industry. But you know what Gary Gensler did? He blocked a lot of the lowlifes and a lot of the people, a lot of the scammers out the industry. Trump has opened up the floodgates and became the scammer in chief in the industry. So people said, oh, this is going to be great for the industry. It's not great for the industry. You would want the mama bear. You would want propitious and ordinary transparent crypto regulation with a defense system against scumbaggery. We didn't get that. So when Trump announced that meme coin, Kara, I was at the World Economic Forum with Brian Armstrong on a panel panel, and I said, this is going to be very bad for the industry because this makes us look terrible. And his opposition, there are young Democrats that would probably support the cryptocurrency industry that are looking around saying, I can't do it now because of what Trump has done. And so, to me, I think it's a big issue. You mentioned Saylors. We might as well bring them up. Michael's gotta be careful because he is an absolutist and he's an extremist. So he said at a one side of his mouth, I'm never selling my bitcoin. You should sell one of your kidneys to buy and hold bitcoin. But he's got pressure on him and he's got a cash imbalance. And so guess what he's doing? He's starting to sell his bitcoin. Like Michael's not gonna take advice from me. And I like Michael. But I would say, Michael, you become part of the story. Go on your yacht, sail off into Sicily somewhere, stop tweeting about bitcoin, get out of the story making business. Because what happens in a situation like this is like a fight squadron. Let's say we got B17, it's about to strafe Berlin and one has engine trouble and is lagging behind the others in the squadron. What are the Messerschmitts going to take out first? They're going to take out that one. And this is Michael right now. So get out of the story. I wouldn't sell any more bitcoin, by the way. Your job is to have bitcoin go back up and you getting out of the story will probably help that. I'm long term bullish on bitcoin. I think we're in the typical four year cycle where we've corrected 50%. We could correct more, but I think the long term bias for bitcoin is up and I think if you hold it for five years, you're going to

[Kara Swisher]

be well situated here. You have Trump sort of dirtying up the industry in a ways. What needs to happen from a bipartisan, how can it return to a way where you don't have too much regulation? At the same time you zero out a lot. All the, all the scammers.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

So I think there's only one thing and that is time and demography. So I think if you're above the age of 60 and you're in the Democratic party, you hate crypto. I think if you're below the age, if you're in the 50 to 60, you're crypto BI curious, but you're like crypto skeptic. If you're below the age of 50, you're generally like, okay, I get this. And there should be an ecosystem allowing us for tokenization and for general improvements at the financial services services fintech community. And so I think he set the industry back. I think it'll be three, four, five years before we see the right type of regulation. I Want to be wrong. You know, Cynthia Loomis, Tim Scott are saying that the Clarity act is going to get passed. If you go to the poly markets,

[Kara Swisher]

explain what the Clarity act is.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Okay, so the Clarity act in the most simple elevator pitch is exactly that. We're going to offer you clarity on regulation associated with crypto. Where is Bitcoin going to be regulated at the CFTC or the sec? Where are these other coins going to be regulated? What's going to be allowed in the industry? How are we going to deal with stablecoins? Are they going to be able to pay interest on the balances that you put at a stablecoin company? What will the banks be able to do? Will we charge the banks on their balance sheet? Which they would do right now. If I held my bitcoin. I can't hold it at JP Morgan but if I was able to, they hit them with an overcharge on their capital account. But let's say they could segment it out. Will the money center banks eventually be able to custodian bitcoin? And so why are we calling it Clarity? Because the pendulum has been swinging back and forth between the administrations. You get hard left leaning regulation from the sec, then it swings back to hard right leaning regulation. We were having regulation by enforcement under Gensler, now having light touch regulation. This would provide a clear signal to Democrats and Republicans. Here are the laws as legislated by the Congress, signed by the President. And so this is the interpretation bandwidth you have now as opposed to this, you know, this wider bandwidth.

[Kara Swisher]

It feels like grift again, that's what it. It has more of a nervousness around it. Cause the Trumps are.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, well, well it. Let me explain why it does though because all Gillibrand and these people are asking for were is okay, we don't want the President's family to steal another couple billion dollars of crypto. So can we at least legislate or create a rules based system that's ethically guided? And the White House said no, we like when the President steals. Scott Besant said that the 2.4 billion that he took is a sign of US innovation is what he said in an interview. This guy, I mean, you know, I mean, you gotta be kidding me. I mean it'. This is literally unbelievable. This guy.

[Kara Swisher]

Jesus.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

It's like, I mean, but it's, you know, you know what it is? It's like a sock puppet at this point. It's like that used to be a person, you know, like Prince, formerly known as Prince. That used to be A person formerly known as Scott Besant. He's now a sock puppet for Caroline Levitt and Donald Trump. Okay, and you're saying that with a straight face in an interview, guy. I mean, come on.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I know. I agree. So, small thing. July 4th officially marked the end of the Department of Government Efficiency, better known as doge. In a post on X, the agency said, well, the formal mission of of DOGE has come to an end. The mission to eliminate waste, fraud and abuse will continue. Good stewardship of taxpayer dollars and accountable government are not temporary initiatives. Researchers estimate doge's cuts to USAID and humanitarian aid contribute to hundreds of thousands of deaths worldwide. DOGE claims it saved taxpayers about $215 billion through spending cuts. The original goal was 2 trillion. Many people feel it costs the United States. Actually, one thing we won't be getting is a final assessment of what actually accomplished. Budget director Russell Vogt recently told Congress no plans to publish a closing DOGE report. Of course not. Because if they did a good job, they would tell you, I think this was just as it turned out, as I said it would. It was a nothing burger of massive proportions and actually led to death of people around the globe, especially children. So, any final thoughts on doge? Just another waste of time.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I mean, again, there was a doge. It was the Clinton Corps reinventing government.

[Kara Swisher]

That's right. Yeah.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I just want to remind Everybody, we took 426,000 jobs and we eliminated them over eight years through attrition and buyouts and process redesign. And what I never can understand for the life of me is I think I'm a reasonably smart guy, but I know I'm stupid in a lot of areas, but if I had a B next to my name, you have to explain this to me, because you hang out with these people more than I do. So I've got billionaires that troll me on Twitter because they're smarter than me and they know more about everything than I could possibly know. But. And I understand that, yes, you know more about neurology than neurologists and more about the military than the military. Yes, you have a billion dollars. You're the smartest. I understand that. But why wouldn't you have gone to 25 year veterans of the GAO, the government administration office, and said, okay, where are the worms in the system? How can I plug a few holes? I'm not going to save a $trillion or $2 trillion. But, you know, from an engineering perspective, the structural design and the embedded costs of the government, what could we do to Stop some of the bleeding. And how could we do that gradually? And they didn't want to do that because why?

[Kara Swisher]

Because they wanted to please Elon and let him jump all over the place. Place with. I don't know, I think he just was to please Elon. I think Elon felt like this was important. And that's where they had the falling out over the tax bill when he started to show what he really was made of, which was spending more government money. And I just think it was just all an act. I thought it was all nonsense and idiotic and possibly gave Elon and his minions access to lots of secure government data. I always thought it was about the data, but that's just me.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, it was definitely. It was definitely a missed opportunity because we could have gone back to pay as you go legislation that got us to the budget surplus during the Clinton era. Yeah, sure was. Yeah, we could have gone. We could have gone with a Clinton esque doge like system that was bipartisan. We could have said to our fellow Americans, hey, we're not gonna fix the problem in 10 years. But you know what? Over a 20 year period of time,

[Kara Swisher]

we need to do that.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

We could get the speed spend in line with where the GDP is. And we didn't do that. And you know what's gonna happen. And you know this, and I know this. My buddy Ray Dalio knows this. You're gonna have an American president in 2036, 2040, dealing with a $55 trillion budget deficit. And they're gonna be sitting there saying, okay, the money's not worth anything anymore. Because the only way we can pay for this guy is remember, remember, unfunded tax liability is what a deficit is. That's what Milton Friedman said. All deficit spending, unfunded tax liability. And guess how we're paying for it? We're using the most pernicious and most regressive form of taxation because we're cowards. We're using inflation. And so we're gonna blow out your bank account. You think you got $1,000 in your account? It only has $750 worth of purchasing power. Cause that's our way of monetizing all our debt. And that's a problem. And that's one of the reasons why I am long gold and one of the reasons why I'm long Bitcoin. Because I do think that these will be part of the. As we reinvent ourselves once again, they will be part of the answer to the way the monetary system works in the future.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, this was a missed opportunity and it was all performative. Performative. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. We come back, the pros and cons of trust Trump accounts.

[Podcast Announcer]

Support for the show comes from npr. Is social media bad for your mental health? Are we spending too much on other people's weddings? Why is heteropessimism trending if the culture is asking it? NPR's it's been a Minute podcast is talking about it. It's Been a Minute stands for your right to be curious. One big question at a time. Four days a week, host Brittany Luce breaks down the ideas, trends and conversations shaping the culture. She goes beyond the obvious takes talking with creators, critics and cultural voices who help you see things differently. You'll hear dialogues with both up and comers and cultural icons. I love npr. I've been listening to it for my entire life. They do a great job. You know, try to hit it straight down the middle. Fantastic production values. It's Been a Minute. Those cultural trends don't happen by accident. It's not just what's true trending, it's why it's trending and what that says about us. Brittney and her guest dig into the latest memes to unpack how they got into your feed in the first place and why they're stealing our attention. These are the conversations you want to have and the ones you'll be bringing up later. Follow NPR's it's been a Minute podcast and indulge your cultural curiosity.

[Vox Media Narrator/Corespondent]

No one could blame you if you thought this men's World cup was going to be a disaster. The president of the United States isn't exactly a welcome mat for the world. And there have been plenty of embarrassing stories for the the country. There was the mom of Kate Byrd's goalkeeper who wasn't let into the United States to watch her son play until the team started doing well and people clamored for her entry. The team from Dr. Congo hadn't made a Men's World cup in 52 years and hardly made this one because the United States was supposedly worried about Ebola, even though no one on the team had Ebola. If you were watching Senegal Norway last week and were wondering where all the the Senegalese fans were, they weren't let into the country. But you probably noticed we let in like a million Vikings. I wonder what's different about their fan bases. Oh, and who could forget we're literally bombing one of the countries that up until Friday was playing here. Missiles aren't the problem, but but somehow the vibes at this World cup are mostly positive. The World cup might just be healing us on today. Explained from Vox.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Is Donald Trump still cool?

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, at first it was what he

[Podcast Announcer]

was promising to America.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

He was promising change. Yeah.

[Podcast Announcer]

Promise.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

That's a big thing.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Has he lived up to that?

[Vox Media Narrator/Corespondent]

No.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

No, I wouldn't say so. I would say so. I'm disappointed.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

We're in Washington, D.C. for one of the events that Donald Trump is throwing for America's 250th anniversary. And it's UFC night.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Proud to be American. We got free tickets. It's just going to be a great time.

[Vox Media Narrator/Corespondent]

That's about it.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

It's an opportunity to talk to a group that was Central in the 2024 election. Young men. Why do we think Trump and men seem to to have a connection? I feel like he just knows how

[Anthony Scaramucci]

to advertise himself with the younger crowd. It aligns with masculinity, I feel like, to a certain extent.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

But if they don't like Donald Trump, what do they prefer politically otherwise?

[Podcast Announcer]

I care about my family. I care about my country. I want people to be safe and happy where they live.

[Vox Media Narrator/Corespondent]

Care about my wallet, too, man.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

I'm Ested Hernton and this is America. Actually, catch us Every Saturday on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Kara Swisher]

Anthony, we're back. Speaking of trying to make money for American citizens, Trump accounts, which I hope will the name will be changed after he leaves. The new investment accounts for children have officially launched. Trump marked the occasion by ringing the bell to open the markets from the Oval Office on Monday morning. Six million Trump accounts have already been open for children under 18. According to Treasury Department. A fraction of eligible kids. That's a small amount, actually. Babies born during Trump's term between 2025 and 2028 will receive a thousand dollars deposit of seed money in these accounts. The Social Security Administration is interesting process for parents to enroll their babies in these Trump accounts at the hospital as they register for Social Security numbers. We've seen a number of individual and corporate donors to these accounts, including Michael Dell and as you mentioned, Ray Dalio. The latest is SpaceX president Gwynne Shotwell, who just announced she's donating company stock. What do you think about these accounts? I'm not necessarily against them. I don't. I think it's. I just, I feel like grift will happen because Trump's involved with it. And at the same time I feel like maybe we should just have, you know, childcare. Maybe we should just have healthcare. Maybe should we just have these Kind of things that cost people. I don't mind forced savings, which essentially this is. And I have accounts for my own kids, for college and things like that.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

But.

[Kara Swisher]

And everyone should be able to avail themselves to them in a tax free basis. So, so. And at the same time, relying on the stock market's problematic from my perspective. But go ahead, let's hear.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, I want to listen, I have to say this one straight. For me, as a Wall street person, I like this because even if it's going to be 6 million people, that's what it looks like right now, getting these people auto enrolled in the stock market and the idea that they have some investment, which means they're technically invested in something and if it could spark some aspiration, if it could spark some interest in long term thinking and saving and investing, I like those things. Listen, Michael Dell, I think gave $6.25 billion. I know he's a very wealthy man, but I think it's a very generous statement that he's trying to make. I don't like the Trump name on it, but of course, anything that Trump does, he's gonna have to put his name on it. He's trying to get his signature on your money. He's trying to get his face and your passport. He cannot help. But here's the thing I would say about this, and people should really be concerned about this number. 40% of the Americans own nothing in a retirement account. And I want you to think of the pressure on that. And so that also we do know this and we don't teach it in school. And perhaps we should. We know we have a lot of financially illiterate people in the country. And if you're listening to this podcast and you're financially literate, don't look down on those people. Figure out a way to educate those people because more educated people and more financially literate people will mean there'll be more self sustaining people. Okay? And there'll be people seeking their aspirations. So I do like this one. Trump is taking more credit for it than he deserves. This was an idea that was proposed 10 years ago. Lots of people blocked it. I think, believe it or not, Vice President Harris, if she was president, would have accepted this at this point in our culture. You're making a different point though, and I would just say not to conjoin those. The point that you're making, which I agree with, we need a platform of good food in the school so the kid doesn't go to school unhealthy or hungry. We need some Sustainable educational ideas. And we need some healthcare for these kids. That's more important than putting $1,000 in their savings. I accept that. But I would just say to you, Cara, and people listening in, you gotta deal with the world the way it is, not the way it should be, and not the way we want it to be. And so this one I, I like, and I would like to see more billionaires. I'd like to see more people do this giving money.

[Kara Swisher]

So is this like, although some people feel like OpenAI doing it as a way to get a bailout at some point, or you give him the money and he takes credit for it, and then you get some sort of break of something else that giving money, these things gives you something else.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, that's been the case with Donald Trump. I mean, we've learned that you give him money, you buy a documentary from his family, you get more rocket contracts, you line up behind him, he takes care of you. You've got people that have given him money or given money to his pac, and Howard Butlik has written them out of certain tariffs and has gotten them an exemption on certain things. So, yes, we know that there's a pay per play system going on. And so, yeah, there's people thinking, you know what? I'm gonna give this, I'm gonna get the tax cut, and Trump's got two and a half years left. I may need a favor from him. Him and he's the guy that pays for play, and I can get in there and ask for that favor and probably we'll get it done. There's a queue of people and I'd be very interested. I'm not an investigative reporter, but I would love somebody to work on this. There's a queue of people that are lined up for pardons. And I know it's in the tens of millions of dollars is being paid to get these pardons. They're hiring lobbyists, they're hiring attorneys, they're hiring, they're, they're buying, I don't know, fragrances from the family or they're buying

[Kara Swisher]

all men are Kellyanne Conway.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

So, yeah, they're buying meme coins. I don't know what the hell they're doing, right? But I'm sure there's a legion of people. They're like, hey, we got a two and a half year window. We broke a lot of laws, but this guy could pardon my ass. And this is Trump's personality. Rather than using the norms in the system, he breaks the norms and then he brags about it. And only I, only I could have gotten our player back on the field. Only I, I could take in billions of dollars for myself. These other presidents were stupid. They could have made billions of dollars for themselves. But I'm the genius. You see what I mean? And it's very corruptive. And let me tell you what, it does which pisses me off the most, if you don't mind, because we grew up similarly. When I was a kid growing up, maybe Richard Nixon was corrupt, but he wasn't so corrupt that I thought the system was broken and unfair. I looked up at the system, I said, all right, the guy's probably corrupt, but you know what? If I go to a good school and work my ass off, I can move classes in this country. Country. This guy is putting a suppression on middle and lower income people. They're like, holy shit, there's a two tier justice system. You're either one of the President's crony friends or you're not. And if you're not, you're not gonna make it. And I'm gonna do way less economically than my parents did. And I don't have any hope and I don't have any chance. That's what the corruption does in a society, and that's what pisses me off the most.

[Kara Swisher]

Yep, I would agree. I would agree. So we're both sort of for these things, but it' just seems like I'd love to get the Trump name off of it. I almost signed up for one, I almost did, but then I was like, I have enough stock holdings. So last thing, very briefly. So Mark Zuckerberg told Meta employees the company's AI agents aren't advancing as quickly as expected. Like a lot of corporate people, Zuckerberg said Meta's AI reorganization hasn't delivered the results the company had hoped for, though he expects progress over the next three to six months. In May, Meta laid off around 8,000 employees and reassigned about 7,000 to AI focused team. Zuckerberg said this move is not as clean as it should have been. Meta's expected to spend as much as $145 billion on AI infrastructure this year. Everybody's a little worried about it, even Palantir. The Palantir, even though you said it in a crazy way, was making a lot of sense around the high price of tokens, the effectiveness, the safety of your data, whether you want to hand it over to these things. All signs of possible highs of this spending. Do you think? How much impact, how much patience do investors have if companies keep saying progress is Slower than hope. Including the center companies in this.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Yeah, well, I mean, you know the answer to that. I know the answer to that. They have patience until bam. They don't have patience. And this is very reminiscent of Global Crossing and very reminiscent of Cisco. And you and I are old enough to remember Web One where we were building the infrastructure. We're putting all the switches in, we have all these transatlantic Trans Pacific cables. We've got cables coming down the, the Persian Gulf all the way into the Strait of Hormuz and we are going to electrify and globalize everything. And they overspent and they had too much leverage in the system as a result of which, like a real estate speculation, the system got built, but it collapsed and the people that were owning the equity and were buying the Hopium at that time actually got crushed. And so what I'm fearful is also the way this stuff is booked, right? Because if you're, you're spending on the R and D and then someone else is booking a profit at the same time, to me, you've artificially stimulated some people's earnings, particularly the data centers and things like that. And so I'm worried about that because that's exactly what happened in Web one. And you and I are old enough to remember that movie. And that movie ended in tears. Yeah, that wasn't a happy Hollywood ending.

[Kara Swisher]

Then there was Google, then there was Meta, then then there was, you know.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, yeah, well, yeah, well, that's the bet. So now you've got your cards, you're playing this hand. You gotta hopefully you can close your position out before the thing blows up and then you wait for whatever replaces it. Right. You know, listen, Altavista, Ask Jeeves.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I'm okay.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

We could. You remember the search engines, right?

[Kara Swisher]

Remember Internet Capital Group? Scott and I were reminiscing about that.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Remember Internet Capital Group? Remember the boom in Internet capital? They named the page. I knew it was over when they named the Patriots stadium, the Internet Capital Group stadium or whatever the holding company was. And so to me, what I'm worried about here, and I think it's fair to be worried about this, is this is a great technology. I think it'll add to productivity, it'll boost things. The Internet certainly did that. But as we invest, there were pockets in the railroad industry that blew. Our pockets in telecom that blew up. And there's going to be pockets here that blow up.

[Kara Swisher]

Do you expect to blow up because a lot of economists are suddenly sounding alarms now. It took years before that happened. And the one you were talking global crossing and everything else. It took several years before it broke, essentially.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, you got to tell me where rates are going. You tell me where the rates are going and I'll tell you where the fuse is. Because if we manage to stave off despite the economic data and the specter of current inflation, and remember, we had 100 basis point differential on rate expectation. So if you and I were doing this podcast January 1st, Anthony, what are you expecting? 3:25 basis cuts this year. What is it now? We flipped it over to 1:25 basis point hike. So that did affect a large part of the markets. It did affect crypto and obviously gold also sold off as a result of that. But if you're telling me we have a 50 basis point, 75 basis point rate increase due to the quagmire in Iran, all the assortment of different things, you're going to shorten that fuse. Somebody could say, hey, I'm going to miss a bond payment here. Sorry. I think it's very telling, Kara, that Facebook, which mints money, and Google, that mints money, I think they combined went out to raise in bond market activity something like $140 billion in the last six weeks. And so that's telling you something. They're like, holy shit, we're spending so much money, we better get another hundred or so billion dollars in reserve here to protect ourselves and to create a layer of protection on the interest rates that we're going to be paying.

[Kara Swisher]

We're going to be paying. So we'll see where that goes. Anyway, one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails.

[Podcast Host Seth Matlins]

I'm Seth Matlins. My new show, Create or Destroy Reimagining Marketing, explores how every decision decision a company makes, not just the marketing ones, but the hr, ir, pricing or design and planning ones. The ones most don't consider marketing at all contribute to either creating value or destroying it. Each week I sit down with CMOs, CEOs, founders, cultural thinkers, the people building, breaking and reimagining how businesses grow or don't, for conversations about what creates value and what destroys it. It's a business show. It's a marketing show. Creator Destroyed Troy is the show that argues they've always been the same thing. From the Vox Media podcast network and the Wisdomist Company. New episodes drop weekly on YouTube and your favorite podcast app.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

A lot of us probably grew up with mountains of video game stuff, cartridges, consoles, discs, other discs, broken discs, more discs, everything. And now it seems like those discs are gone. This week, on the vergecast we're talking about why the gaming industry is going all digital and what it means that that's going away. Plus whether Rivian can take on Tesla, whether any of us can figure out how to vibe code, and much more on the Vergecast. Wherever you get Podcasts.

[Home Depot Advertiser]

As America reaches its 250th anniversary, how should Americans assess their country strength relative to the rest of the world?

[Podcast Announcer]

We're moving into a genuinely multipolar world, and that's a world in which every nation is basically for itself because nations

[Anthony Scaramucci]

can no longer rely on the United

[Podcast Announcer]

States to protect them.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I'm John Finer. And I'm Jake Sullivan, and we're the hosts of the Long Game, a weekly national security podcast.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

This week we sat down with historian

[Anthony Scaramucci]

and foreign policy expert Bob Kagan to assess America's role in the world at

[Interviewer/Reporter]

the 250 and the future of American power.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

The episode's out now. Search for and follow the Long Game wherever you get your podcasts.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, Anthony, let's hear some wins and fails. You go first.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, listen, I mean, we talked about it, so I think the win of the week is the Trump account. Actually, I don't like to call them that, but I want Americans to get into saving and the investing mindset. And certainly if you can get children into the saving investing mindset, it could be a life changer. So I think that's the clearest window for me, the second clearest win, which is obscure to people, but I think it's meaningful is the birthright citizenship. And we talked a little bit about that last week on my show. I think that is the big message. I say, sorry you pushed and shoved us around. We are afraid of you here at the court. But you know what? It was a 6:3 decision and we're gonna stick with the Constitution over the Orange Maniac. And I think those are two people, big wins. So losses for me are FIFA and sick of Fantino. I think this is a big loss for him. And I think weirdly and sadly, I think he's hurt the game. And I think it sucks because the World cup to me is about togetherness. When you want to love people and you want to love the world. I think of the World Cup, I'm like, all right, look at all these people. The happiness and the sadness is based on a sporting event. It's not based on a war. I love the whole environment. I love the whole carnival. And I just think the notion that this guy poisoned that, too. It's like he won't stop at Anything.

[Kara Swisher]

He won't stop at anything.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

So those are the wins and those are the losses.

[Kara Swisher]

That sort of goes into my fail is the continued sucking up of people like Besant and others about like, yes, there's plenty of people behind me. The cultism is so strange and it's. So at some point, when are you gonna say the emperor has not. That's that kind, which. I don't want to see Donald Trump naked necessarily. But this.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Have you ever thought about it, though? Is it ever like that? You're an imaginative person. Has it ever just gone into the brain?

[Kara Swisher]

I have a sense of what it looks like and it's.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

And the whole like. It's like an open spam can. Like, you just opened a spam can and there he is.

[Kara Swisher]

Have you thought of it? Open Spam can with a penis, which. A bent penis.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Well, you don't know.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Yeah.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

We haven't confirmed or denied that. It just could be an open spam.

[Kara Swisher]

Can't I believe porn stars is what I do. But the sycophancy is just astonishing. And Douglas Burgum in particular, with the whole thing around the reflecting pool. I mean, first of all, everything like that fair, nobody was there and they were pretending they were there. That was hysterical. But he was going on and on about these cuts and without any proof. And then why are you meeting people? Why don't you just accept this? And they're like, cause you're a liar. Doug Burgum, like, to me, he seemed to be. Even though he's an obvious. Obvious suck up. Obvious suck up. But the level of suck up ery is really. And I'm like, you're not stupid and you're sucking up. And that to me was really a fail. I thought that. I just can't believe it's gonna continue. I just don't know when it's gonna stop. And I'm sort of waiting for the moment where somebody points to him and says, you're naked, essentially. My win is so over the holiday, I went to see Supergirl. Cause everyone didn't wanna see it. Right? Cause it's, you know, it's this big disaster for one, and people aren't going to see it. And I have to tell you, it's a pretty good movie. It's a pretty good movie. I know it's not gonna win. I see the numbers. I could see why it would be hard to get a man to go to it. It's Pretty Woman focused. There's a sex trafficking thematic. It's dark. But I do think this actor who's in it, Millie, I think it's. Alcock is amazing. Was amazing. And I think it's a lovely. I think it's a good. It's a really solid. It wouldn't. There's been some. Some bad movies in this genre, in the superhero genre, and lots of bad ones. This is not one of them. And I'm sorry it's not doing better. I bet it has a life outside of this time. Later it'll become a cult favorite, I think. Cause it's really interesting and strange movie.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

I'll definitely go see it. Look, I'm a big Superman aficionado and I love Supergirl.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, she's really interesting. It's dark, but it's dark. And I can see why people wouldn't necessarily go to it. So I get it, I get it. I get it. Anyway. And of course, the biggest win of the week is Taylor Swift. Congratulations. With you and Travis getting married, it's just nice. I mean, two crazy kids. You two crazy kids. I hope for the best. I hope you can make it, both of you.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

That's great. But you know, if. Guys, I would like to be. If you're probably not gonna have another wedding, but if there's an anniversary party, Kara and I would like to be invited.

[Kara Swisher]

We will go, we will send to you.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

You may have invited me to this, but I may have just missed it in the mail. But I would like to be invited.

[Kara Swisher]

Agree. We will be there for you. Anyway, Anthony, I really appreciate it. Just for people to know, we wanna hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to submit a question for the show or call 855-51-PIVOT. Okay, that is the show. Thank you, Anthony, as always. People can check out your book all the Wrong Moves this fall. It's a really terrific book. Thank you for listening to Pivot. Be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on Friday. Again, Anthony, thank you so much.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

It's always great to be on with you, Kara. Thank you, guys.

[Kara Swisher]

Today's show was produced by Lara Naiman, Zoe Marcus, Terry Taylor Griffin and Todd Wiseman. Ernie Anderjad engineered this episode. Thanks also to Kate Gallagher and Brad Sylvester. Nishat Kurwa is Vox Media's executive producer of podcasts. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from Vox Media. We'll be back later this week for another breakdown of all things tech and business and. Hello, Scott. Whatever. Yacht you're sailing on in whatever fancy sea we miss you.