Epstein Saga Continues, Trump Launches Distractions, and Cuomo Relaunches Campaign

Summary

Pivot Podcast Episode Summary Title: Epstein Saga Continues, Trump Launches Distractions, and Cuomo Relaunches Campaign
Host/Authors: Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway
Release Date: July 18, 2025
Podcast Information: Pivot by New York Magazine offers sharp, unfiltered insights into the biggest stories in tech, business, and politics, hosted by tech journalist Kara Swisher and NYU Professor Scott Galloway.

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1. The Ongoing Epstein Saga

The episode delves deep into the continuing fallout from the Jeffrey Epstein case. House Speaker Mike Johnson has broken with former President Donald Trump, calling for the administration to release the Epstein files. Despite this, Johnson previously voted against debating the release, adding complexity to the political dynamics surrounding the case.

Scott Galloway draws parallels to historical conspiracies, critiquing Trump's attempts to distract from the Epstein files:

Scott Galloway (12:25): "It's as if we're at the Nuremberg trials and one of the people on trial starts playing the kazoo, hoping that we'll all forget why we're there."

Michael Barbaro highlights the internal turmoil within the Department of Justice, noting the firing of Maureen Comey, daughter of former FBI Director James Comey, who worked on the Epstein case:

Michael Barbaro (24:00): "... the House has advanced three crypto bills moving on... but yes, Epstein's not going anywhere until the files are released."

The discussion touches on various Republican figures pushing for transparency, including Representative Thomas Massie, and the potential manipulation of released files to protect influential individuals.

2. Trump’s Distractions and Fed Chair Controversy

A significant portion of the conversation centers on Trump's attempts to undermine Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell. Reports surfaced that Trump was contemplating Powell’s removal, even showcasing a draft termination letter to House Republicans, which caused market volatility.

Scott Galloway criticizes Trump's inconsistent behavior:

Scott Galloway (12:55): "He is so addicted to attention that they'd rather get attention for something that makes them look stupid than not be in the news cycle."

Trump's denials and contradictory statements about his role in appointing Powell have further muddled the situation:

Scott Galloway (13:09): "He has fanned these flames unbelievably and handled it so poorly he could not."

The hosts discuss the broader implications of these distractions, emphasizing how they divert attention from pressing issues like the Epstein files and economic policies.

3. Economic Insights and Fed Independence

The conversation shifts to the state of the U.S. economy amidst Trump's distractions. Recent data shows a slight uptick in inflation for June and some job market weaknesses, but overall economic resilience remains intact.

Scott Galloway underscores the importance of an independent Federal Reserve:

Scott Galloway (16:44): "... an independent Fed. Because here's the bottom line. If you let the government decide what to do with respect to our economic policies and our fiscal policies, you end up with trillion-dollar deficits."

He praises Jerome Powell for managing to reduce inflation from 9% to 2% without triggering a recession—a feat he describes as "literally like sticking the landing" (16:44).

Michael Barbaro adds that despite recent concerns, the economy is holding up better than expected, with reduced recession risks according to a Wall Street Journal survey.

4. Defense Department and AI Integration

The podcast explores the Defense Department's recent contract with Elon Musk’s AI chatbot, Grok. Scott Galloway expresses skepticism about the readiness and appropriateness of deploying such technologies in military applications:

Scott Galloway (42:43): "Companies like Andarella, Palantir... we should have our brightest working hand in glove and stop all the fucking walkouts at these companies saying we're not going to work with the defense industry."

He advocates for smart investments in asymmetric warfare technologies, such as drones and AI predictive tools, rather than traditional brute force military hardware.

5. Andrew Cuomo’s Mayoral Campaign Relaunch

Former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo has officially entered the NYC mayoral race as an independent after a decisive loss in the Democratic primary to Zoran Mamdani. Scott Galloway provides a nuanced view of Cuomo's prospects:

Scott Galloway (48:38): "I think he's a decent man, would be a decent elector. He has an opportunity to pivot to the middle..."

Despite Cuomo's efforts to reposition himself, including clarifying his policies and reaching out to diverse voter bases, Galloway remains cautious about his chances against Mamdani, who has gained significant traction.

Michael Barbaro supports the idea that Cuomo has room to define himself and suggests strategies for reconnecting with voters:

Michael Barbaro (50:54): "He has an opportunity actually to clarify himself in a really good way and in a very powerful way."

6. Media Funding Cuts and Public Broadcasting

The hosts discuss the House's advancement of a measure to cut funding for NPR and PBS, highlighting the political tug-of-war over public broadcasting:

Scott Galloway (59:02): "I think they do enormous service... it feels like it's been such a political football for so long."

Galloway expresses admiration for public broadcasters and suggests alternative funding models to preserve their independence from political pressures.

Michael Barbaro agrees, emphasizing the importance of unbiased, quality journalism:

Michael Barbaro (62:42): "I love everything that NPR and PBS do."

7. Crypto Legislation and Market Developments

House Republicans are moving forward with the Genius Act, aiming to regulate stablecoins and other crypto-assets. Scott Galloway supports the need for clear regulations in the cryptocurrency space to ensure stability and trust:

Scott Galloway (62:53): "I think the space needs regulation... the Genius act sets rules for Stablecoin users, such as one-to-one backing with Treasuries..."

Michael Barbaro notes the market's response, with Bitcoin trading at highs of $120,000, reflecting growing investor confidence amid regulatory clarity.

8. Predictions and Future Outlook

As the episode concludes, Galloway predicts continued distractions from Trump, with new incendiary statements likely to overshadow key issues like the Epstein files:

Scott Galloway (70:22): "There's gonna be something stupid incendiary which has absolutely no chance of ever becoming reality in an attempt..."

Michael Barbaro anticipates that Trump will eventually be compelled to release the Epstein files, leading to further legal and political repercussions.

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Notable Quotes:

• Scott Galloway (12:25): "It's as if we're at the Nuremberg trials and one of the people on trial starts playing the kazoo, hoping that we'll all forget why we're there."

• Scott Galloway (16:44): "... an independent Fed. Because here's the bottom line. If you let the government decide what to do with respect to our economic policies and our fiscal policies, you end up with trillion-dollar deficits."

• Scott Galloway (42:43): "Companies like Andarella, Palantir... we should have our brightest working hand in glove and stop all the fucking walkouts at these companies saying we're not going to work with the defense industry."

• Scott Galloway (59:02): "I think they do enormous service... it feels like it's been such a political football for so long."

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Conclusion:

In this episode of Pivot, Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway provide a comprehensive analysis of the latest developments in the Epstein saga, Trump's political maneuvers, economic indicators, the integration of AI in defense, Andrew Cuomo’s political comeback, media funding battles, and cryptocurrency legislation. Their discussions highlight the intricate interplay between politics, economics, and technology, offering listeners nuanced perspectives on current events shaping the landscape.

Transcript

[Kara Swisher]

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[Scott Galloway]

That's attio.com pivot.

[Kara Swisher]

Support for the show is brought to you by CVS Caremark. Making the show takes a lot of work behind the scenes. From booking interviews to recording to editing. All of this ensures we deliver the best possible show for our listeners. The same can be said for finding the best prescription drug prices. CVS Caremark works behind the scenes to help lower the cost for all of their members, providing the best possible prices without ever compromising on member experience. Interested in more affordable care for your members? Go to CMK CO Stories to learn how we can help you provide the affordability, support and access your members need. Support for the show comes from Intuit SMB Media Labs. Reaching the right small businesses starts with the right data. Intuit SMB Media Labs is a first of its kind small business ad network with access to audiences and insights from the makers of QuickBooks. You can target key decision makers by industry size, maturity, location and more. Your gateway to B2B SMB marketing success. Learn [e-mail].

[Michael Barbaro]

You see it a lot or not?

[Scott Galloway]

See what? What are we worried about?

[Michael Barbaro]

Root canal. I just had root canal this morning.

[Scott Galloway]

Jesus.

[Michael Barbaro]

I know. Oh, man, my mouth is not moving. Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher and I just have root canal, so I have a lot of mouth issues. Scott. I might drool during the show.

[Scott Galloway]

Let's be honest, that's a distraction from the Epstein files and I'm not falling for it.

[Michael Barbaro]

Tara, there's cane sugar in Coke.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm not falling for it.

[Michael Barbaro]

It's true. God, I have the worst teeth. Scott, do you have good teeth? I have terrible teeth.

[Scott Galloway]

My dentist told me this. God, I have. I didn't go to the dentist till I was nine, at which point I had eight cavities and then I fainted in the. In the waiting room. So no, I don't have good. The Galloways are not blessed with Good teeth. I had braces in graduate school. I was very self conscious in my teeth. I have veneers. I have spent the GDP of a small nation. So my. Such that my teeth can just look reasonable.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, I just got a crown. I had an implant recently. They found another cavity while they were fixing this one today. So I took. So both sides of my mouth have, like. You know, when they put the stuff in, they don't even put me to sleep, which I would prefer. I have a great doctor, Dr. Schwartz, but I gotta tell you, he moves so fast. I was like, I have pivot to do. And he goes, you know, you'll drool. And I said, I get it. It's fine. We gotta bring the people their information.

[Scott Galloway]

It's an uncomfortable topic, but I'm a fan of women getting implants. It's important that you feel good about yourself. And I find that they actually. They may not look real, but they taste real.

[Michael Barbaro]

They do not. They do not look good. Anyway, so thank you, Dr. Schwartz, for doing it so fast.

[Scott Galloway]

Dr. Schwartz, the dentist?

[Michael Barbaro]

Dr. Schwartz, the dentist. He's my dentist.

[Scott Galloway]

We're meeting for whitefish later.

[Michael Barbaro]

I don't even know if he's Jewish anyway.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, okay, okay. I do. Spoiler. I'm sorry. A dentist in D.C. named Dr. Schwartz.

[Michael Barbaro]

All right.

[Scott Galloway]

No, no, he's a Baptist.

[Michael Barbaro]

I don't know for sure. Okay. That's a judge, people.

[Scott Galloway]

Based on that, he's the legislative age to Mike Johnson.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, yeah. Okay, listen to me. Listen to me, Scott. Even though I'm incredibly unattractive right now and possibly drooling, I don't even know if I am. Do you know who's eyeing us from across the room?

[Scott Galloway]

Who's that?

[Michael Barbaro]

None other than New York Times.

[Scott Galloway]

Emily Ratajkowski.

[Michael Barbaro]

No, Michael Barbaro.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, we love Michael.

[Michael Barbaro]

I know. This is the Daily. Apparently, he's got a thing for us. Here's what he said when asked which podcast or creator he would like most to collaborate with. Let's listen to the dulcet tones of Michael Barbaro. Is it Barbaro? I don't know.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

The king and queen of Pivot, Kara.

[Scott Galloway]

Swisher and Scott Galloway. I just think those two have an extraordinary chemistry and a tremendous amount of.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Wisdom, and so I want to work with them.

[Scott Galloway]

And implants.

[Michael Barbaro]

What does that mean? He wants to work with us. Work what?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, my God. First. So first off, I don't listen to a lot of podcasts. I listen to Daily. I absolutely adore it. It's like listening to chamomile. Tea. Explain the fed rate hike.

[Michael Barbaro]

Oh, yeah, it's delicious.

[Scott Galloway]

I get the sense that guy. I don't know, Michael. I get the sense he's so woke that he records from, like, underneath a weighted blanket in between panic attacks, wondering if his cat's milk is ethically sourced. I can't even imagine how woke that dude is.

[Michael Barbaro]

Oh, he's a really nice guy. He's a nice guy.

[Scott Galloway]

You know what? The Daily is seriously, like, I love it now. Listen to it. It's like having your, like, smarter friend whisper in your ear. It's worse than you think.

[Michael Barbaro]

Will I stroke you?

[Scott Galloway]

And sometime. Most of the time it's amazing. Sometimes though, it's literally like it took 23 minutes to give you the same vibe as a really good slack emoji. It's like that took 23 minutes.

[Michael Barbaro]

I know, I know, but he's like, stop insulting him. He likes us. He's more handsome than us. He'd be the. He'd be the best.

[Scott Galloway]

It's the best podcast out there.

[Michael Barbaro]

I know.

[Scott Galloway]

It's number one.

[Michael Barbaro]

Apparently we are.

[Scott Galloway]

Let's just say it's number one.

[Michael Barbaro]

No, it's shifts back and forth with Joe Rogan and different things, but I.

[Scott Galloway]

Love how he does that. And pause. He pauses it and they know. You know, they pause it. They're like, okay, put in a. Huh? Right now. Yeah, that's it. That's it.

[Michael Barbaro]

I like when he goes, this is the daily. I spent one dinner with him completely using his voice, talking to him in his voice.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, there's video of him. He's dreamy.

[Michael Barbaro]

He wasn't. He's dreamy. They're all dreamy now over there at the New York Times. They're doing a lot of video and a lot of, like Vaselines happening.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, no. Trust me. Unless they've cleared out the building. I spent some time there.

[Michael Barbaro]

I know, but if you looked at the video between him and Ezra Klein, it's like lettuce in your poly. I mean, come on. We're not good looking enough for There there. No, no, no, no, we're not.

[Scott Galloway]

I mean, Michael, we're big fans.

[Michael Barbaro]

We stack above Ross du hat or ever pronounce that guy.

[Scott Galloway]

Let's go. Let's take him to dinner and invite over like a kombucha sommelier. That guy's got to be so woke.

[Michael Barbaro]

Well, he wants us, so that's all that matters to us.

[Scott Galloway]

It's good to be wanted. Thank you, Michael.

[Michael Barbaro]

Thank you, Michael. We're very.

[Scott Galloway]

I like being objectified. If he could speak more specifically to our physical attributes outside of your implants, I would appreciate it. I have very broad shoulders. I look better. Michael, just so you know, I'm 60 years old, but naked, I look 59 and 7 8. You big. You big, tall drink of lemonade.

[Michael Barbaro]

True fact, Michael. I've never seen Scott naked. Actually, I've seen the top half of you naked. I have.

[Scott Galloway]

You've seen me naked a lot.

[Michael Barbaro]

No, I haven't seen the bottom half, and I hope never to. Let me just say it's on my list of things never to do.

[Scott Galloway]

Nickname of the fraternity. Don't ask me. Don't ask me.

[Michael Barbaro]

I know. The tripod.

[Scott Galloway]

Don't ask me.

[Michael Barbaro]

You've told me. The tripod.

[Scott Galloway]

Tripod.

[Michael Barbaro]

Stop it.

[Scott Galloway]

Stop it. I don't want to talk about it, okay?

[Michael Barbaro]

I. We're never gonna do a nitrous.

[Scott Galloway]

You're literally giddy right now.

[Michael Barbaro]

You're still on the nitrous. No, I'm not on nitrous. They didn't give me nitrous. I love nitrous.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, what's the point? You have got to start living your life. I go to the dentist.

[Michael Barbaro]

I want nitrous.

[Scott Galloway]

I have, by the way, I have terrible dental hygiene. I brush my teeth twice a day, and I'm like. I walk in there, and they love this, and I say, I have terrible dental hygiene. You're gonna give me a bunch of shit in a lecture, none of which I'm gonna listen to or use. I get my teeth cleaned every three months, and it's always like, a hot Brazilian woman who's a sing. I get really fucked up on the nitrous.

[Michael Barbaro]

They don't give me nitrous.

[Scott Galloway]

I start getting emotional, and by the end of my teeth cleaning, I'm holding her hand. Yeah. Or woman writing a memo to the dentist about what an amazing professional she is.

[Michael Barbaro]

You know, all the people who work at dental things that I've had experiences are great. All the clean. The people who clean. And we'll stop with the dentist stuff, but nonetheless, I don't do nitrous. I got those shots. I still feel like I'm spitting. In any case, let's talk about. It doesn't matter.

[Scott Galloway]

I have trays right now. Do you have trays? I have Invisalign. Every time I go.

[Michael Barbaro]

I did use Invisalign. Yes.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm serious. I am paying for my dentist's house in Aspen. He lives in Aspen. He's never at his dentist. He's like this. He's like, this dentist to the stars, Jonathan Levine. And every time I walk in there, they're like, oh, we found something. You need some antibiotic crypto treatment that's going to cost $11,000. And I'm like, well, it's my teeth. I got to spend it.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, you got. I can see you going, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, they see you coming. Oh, all the Doctors see you 100%. Just say, anyway, we have a lot to get to today. Let's get. Besides Michael. Anytime, Michael, call us. We're really easy. We're totally easy. Trump lashes out at his base over the Epstein files. This is going on and Grok goes to Washington. But first, look, President Trump. And Jerome is trying to. Speaking of a distraction, this is something that's been ongoing. He said it's highly unlikely he'll fire Fed Chair Jerome Powell. Let's just be clear, he's not allowed to. So it is highly unlikely, unless he comes up with some scheme. Despite reports that he was considering it, even showing a draft termination letter to a group of House Republicans to get their buy in. I guess after those reports rattled markets on Wednesday. I mean, the Dow dropped like a, Like a. Just like a lot. Like a lot. And Trump said in an Oval Office presser, we're not planning on doing anything. At which point the markets bounce back. Trump also said he was surprised that Powell was appointed, apparently forgetting he was the one who did that back in 2017. And quite effusively, literally, all these. It's so interesting. He just, he's the one who appointed him. He's pretending he didn't. He was like, I don't know who pointed him. And there he was. Trump has been slamming Powell for months for not cutting interest rates, calling him a major loser and a stubborn mule. He's now targeting the Fed's $2.5 billion renovation project, suggesting there might be fraud at play, which could be grounds for Paul Powell's ouster. It's ridiculous that everybody, the bankers are being public about it. The Wall Street Journal is being very explicit and Powell himself has been pretty vocal about Fed independence, which means serving at his full term, which is up next year. It's not that long. Let's listen what he said to the Economic Club of Chicago back in April.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Our independence is a matter of law. Congress has, in our statute, we're not removable except for cause we serve very long terms, seemingly endless terms. So it's, we're protect. Protected in the law. So, you know, Congress could change that law. But there's I don't think there's any danger of that. Fed independence has pretty broad support across both political parties and in. In both sides of the Hill, so I think that's not a problem.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah. Jamie Dimon, Goldman Sachs CEO David Solomon, other the bank CEOs are touting Fed independence. Even Secretary of the Treasury Scott Bessen confirmed to Bloomberg that the formal process of finding Powell's successor has begun. But he didn't say that Powell should come out. He didn't name any candidates. Reports suggest that Kevin Hassett, director of National Economic Council, is a top contender. Kevin Warsh, former Fed governor, is also in the mix, as is Besant himself. So what is happening here? And then which of these do you think he will name?

[Scott Galloway]

I think I know exactly what's going on here.

[Michael Barbaro]

Okay, tell me.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it's as if we're at the Nuremberg trials and one of the people on trial starts playing the kazoo, hoping that we'll all forget why we're there. It's a magician sawing his assistant in half and then yells out Benghazi, hoping that people will look away. This is what is going on at the White House right now. It's his comms team and Claude or ChatGPT saying, what can I do every day? What can I announce every day that will capture the media's attention such that they look away from the Epstein files. Look at how he. Look at how he. This has nothing to do.

[Michael Barbaro]

He's been at this for a while, like Scott, he has. He's been at Powell before Espene, but go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

He waves a letter talking about the firing. Waves a letter thinking that everyone from Vox Media podcasters to the New York Times to CNBC will go, chairman Powell, he's threatening to fire him. And then the next day he goes, oh, no, I was just kidding. This was all a giant ruse. The day before, it was 85% tariffs on Canada. The day before that, it was revoking the citizenship of a talk show host because he doesn't like her. And tomorrow, Kara, it's gonna be something else. He is in a room.

[Michael Barbaro]

Coca Cola didn't turn out to be true. That's the only one I liked.

[Scott Galloway]

He is in a room. Oh, yeah, that's right. We have a new trade agreement to change the sugar cane. Or the sugar cane sugar.

[Michael Barbaro]

Make it Mexican Coke. Make it Mexican Coke.

[Scott Galloway]

Every day, his comms team, and this is all he cares about right now, is saying putting into ChatGPT, what will the media go for in order to ensure that the Story of Epstein is pushed out of the news cycle. He had no intention of doing this before the market's reaction. He has no legal authority whatsoever to start revoking citizenship for no real reason. And tomorrow it'll be something else, something illegal. This is.

[Michael Barbaro]

Make a guess of what it is. Give me one. If you're sitting in there, what would you tell him to do?

[Scott Galloway]

I think he's going to announce a 700% tariff on SUVs or something. I mean, it's getting so ridiculous and weird and crazy. What's amazing to me was that the market responded that it's still. The market's still taking this guy seriously.

[Michael Barbaro]

It wasn't for a minute now it.

[Scott Galloway]

Was like, ugh, every 24 hours. First off, he and are, you know, are the wealthiest man in the world, are such attention whores. They are addicted to attention that a heroin addict will shoot a parent going, this is a bad idea. I've got my kids for the weekend and my in laws are coming over. This is probably not a good idea to shoot up. But they can't help it. They're so addicted. These guys are so addicted to attention that they'd rather get attention for something that makes them look stupid than not be in the news cycle. And he now has a very valid reason. Because I'm not the one conspiracy I've always held onto.

[Michael Barbaro]

Okay, we're gonna get to Epstein in a minute, but go ahead, keep going.

[Scott Galloway]

This is what's going on, Kara. Okay, this has nothing to do with.

[Michael Barbaro]

The chairman, but he will stay there. There's no way he's pulling him out.

[Scott Galloway]

Look. Okay, so let's go to the substance of the issue. The majority of nations that have grown their economy faster than the rest of the world have one thing in common. 1. They are in fact democracies. China's an exception. But the majority of the economic growth around the world has come from nations that dec. They're going to democratically elect their leaders. They have great universities. They're usually blessed with natural resources. They have the wisdom to engage in alliances so they can trade. They bring women into the workforce. I mean, there's just a few that have civil rights. There's a few things that are the underpinnings of economic growth. And one of those things is an independent Fed. Because here's the bottom line. If you let the government decide what to do with respect to our economic policies and our fiscal policies, you end up with George Washington to George Bush, trillion in deficits. And then you end up since George W. Bush with another 30 trillion in deficits. The reason why every fiat currency in history, and it'll happen to the dollar, ends up being worthless is that the political pressure to increase short term prosperity by printing money or lowering interest rates is greater than these elected leaders fidelity to the long term interests of the country. And so when we let politicians who have two and four and six year cycles make these decisions, we end up making short term bad decisions that hurt the country in the long term. So the best practice, one of the key best practices across almost every G20 country is they say there's too much temptation for the leader to want to get reelected and give a short term sugar high and lower interest rates. And I taught micro and macroeconomics in graduate school and they will be teaching in graduate school for years. This period where Jerome Powell managed to take inflation from 9% to 2% without triggering a recession, that's like literally like sticking the landing.

[Michael Barbaro]

All right, well, but that said, the impact of Trump's policies over the last few months is starting to show up in the economy. New data out this week is inflation ticking up in June. Prices also rose in categories affected by tariffs like toys, furniture and appliances. The job market is starting to show some cracks where there are indicators that consumers are reining in spending. Still, the economy is holding up better than expected. Economists now see less risk of a recession than they did three months ago, as you noted, according to a Wall Street Journal survey. Is there another shoe to drop? Banks are riding the volatility. Goldman Sachs has posted the best ever quarter for stock trading and several other banks beat earnings expectations. And at the same time, Trump is threatening new sanctions on Russia. Another economic probably maybe not so much for our economy. If there's no peace deal with Ukraine in the next 50 days, he says he'll launch a secondary tariff slapping 100% countries that continue doing business with Russia. That would mean countries like India, China, Turkey face heavy tariffs for buying Russian oil, a move that could trigger a global spike in energy prices. I doubt, I'm not sure Putin cares. But talk about these circumstances. Where are we with the economy from.

[Scott Galloway]

Your perspective, the real question on everyone's mind right now, or the most important question we should be asking ourselves is that at this moment, Kara, is Michael Barbara touching himself? He's back. He's back.

[Michael Barbaro]

The answer is yes. The answer is always yes. But go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, look, the economic data that came out, I looked at it and I thought, okay, this is the ultimate anger pillow for the far left and the far right. There's Some indication that certain items, especially the ones subject to tariff, had a greater increase in inflation. But at the same time, catastrophists like me are disappointed because the reality is inflation at, I think at 2.7 or 2.8 just isn't that big a deal. And the economy has been more resilient than people who are kind of in the back of their minds looking for some schadenfreude of the economy collapsing and blaming it on Trump.

[Michael Barbaro]

So it needs to collapse next summer, everybody.

[Scott Galloway]

But go ahead, the headline, and I haven't seen the headline, the headlines from Fox will be economy resilient. The headline from CNN will be inflation rising. There's something in here for everyone. There's a little bit of data showing that the tariff sensitive goods services went down. They're not subject to tariffs. Some of the things, some of the industries subject to tariffs have shown a little bit of a spike in price. But the reality is we're not going to probably see the effects of this or not until the fall because it takes a while for it to snake through the economy. The Russia thing, when I immediately knew that the war was not going to end was when I saw Chiron yesterday saying that Trump has demanded that Putin end the war in 50 days. That is just so fucking stupid. You really think the Russian people have endured over a million deaths and or casualties and you think that he's going to scare when the President says it needs to end within 50 days. The interesting thing though, I mean, Russia's economy does. You want to talk about an economy that appears to be cracking? The ruble shot up. It's now back to being worth less than a cent. And it did recover a little bit. But this war is really, I mean, I believe they lost. What did they lose? 17 or 18,000 people in Afghanistan backed out. They've lost a million people here. And it feels as if the economy is really starting to show tracks there. And I've said this for a long time, I think that both Biden and Trump, to a lesser extent, but they both deserve credits. The greatest investment in terms of ROI in the last 20 years for America has been the 50 or 60 billion dollars a year or about, I don't know, 8% of our military budget that we have given in weapons. That is sort of a stimulus to red states and weapons manufacturers in the US there's no way SYRI would have gone. There's no way we would have been able to take out Iran's air defenses. It has sent a message to China to Be very careful, Be very careful. Invading a motivated, technically literate Taiwan. This has been. NATO is coming together. Europe has been inspired to increase its defense spending. This has been the best investment Americans could have made. And all by, by the way, we did this without putting a single boot on the ground. And you watch what we're going to see in terms of technical innovation around drone technology. So I think this is. There are never good wars, but there are less bad wars. The support of Ukraine and incredibly brave people. There is the least bad war in a while.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah. Although the devastation obviously is horrific. I think they'll come bouncing back like that'll be the place to be in 10 years. You know, Ukraine, keys full of technologists, full of. I just, they are, they are very innovative country in terms of. They were before and now I think more than ever. They're very technically oriented. So I think you'll see a piling of Silicon Valley people in there, similar to Latvia, Estonia, all those countries. But Ukraine will be really, I think, a centerpiece of that when this war is over. Yeah, we'll see. When we get back after a quick break, we'll talk about the drama that's not going away anytime soon. Foreign.

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Michael Barbaro]

Scott we're back with more news. The Epstein mess continues since we last spoke. House Speaker Mike Johnson has broken with Trump and is calling for the administration to release the Epstein files. That said, he voted against doing a debate about whether to release them or not, which is interesting. But Republican Representative Thomas Massie, who's a real thorn in Trump's ass of Kentucky, is attempting to force a vote on the House, directing the DOJ to release the files. The measure has been co sponsored by at least five other Republicans. Interestingly, almost three minutes of footage is wiped from the video released by the DOJ of Epstein Seldor. According to the forensic experts working with Wired, Maureen Comey, the federal Manhattan federal prosecutor who worked on the Epstein case, has been fired. Yes, she is the daughter of James Comey. She also worked on the Diddy case. Meanwhile, President Trump has called the story Democratic bullshit and pretty boring stuff, labeling those who are invested in as weaklings and stupid. The Democrat stuff isn't working very well because one incredible thing is Bill O'Reilly was on it, going on about how this was the Biden administration doing all this and the anchor was like this was all the Trump administration. He died under the Trump administration. He was prosecuted under the Trump administration. And all of a sudden Riley went, oh, like speaking of old man, he got it completely wrong. Anyway, it's not a Democratic thing. This was all done under Bill Barr and everyone else. So any change in opinion whether Republicans would be pushing him? Because as I predicted, Laura Ingraham, many others sort of tamped it down. Looks like Dan Bungino's not going anywhere. I said they were all going to bow down. That said, I don't know if they'll bow for too long. And obviously Elon is not bowing down at all. He is tweeting up a storm about this and he made a very good point that essentially deny everything, make other allegations and try to make it go away. And he said it's not going to work this time. And he's pushing on it really hard and probably changing the algorithms of X to push a lot of this stuff because it's good for X. I hate to say it, but he's certainly not backing down and neither are many others. Any thoughts? Alex Jones is not at all, but I'm not sure he matters as much.

[Scott Galloway]

This is a rare, he's an incredible communicator kind of going. I think the learning is that when everyone is zigging, there's always a huge opportunity to zag. When everybody is following one strategy or one investment thesis, then it creates enormous alpha and upside to go the other way. And Anthony Scaramucci pointed this out and I thought it was so remarkably insightful that basically every politician in the world says something along the following. I'm socially liberal and fiscally conservative. I mean, what does 80% of America say? That if you want to describe their politics? And they don't want to assign themselves to a party that go socially liberal, fiscally conservative.

[Michael Barbaro]

Actually that's not true, but go ahead. It's the opposite. Most in the middle, they're more socially conservative and they want more Medicare system.

[Scott Galloway]

That's where I was headed was that Trump decided, no, the opportunity is to be fiscally liberal, Keynesian, socialist, irresponsible fiscal policy, shower money on everyone, increase the size of government, run up deficits. This is like if the Democrats all of a sudden said, oh, we are in charge and we can just continue printing money. And all of a sudden the Democrats are now the adults in the room going, oh my God, this has gotten out of control. He's also, he zags around communication. American politics got so politically correct and starched and there were so many lies and telling people what they wanted to hear and couching everything in passive aggressive behavior. And he just came out and said, oh, she's fat or he's an idiot. And America, quite frankly, just loved it. They absolutely loved it where he is. Really, this is such a rare misstep for him because if he had just taken the approach of say, his taxes, he was never going to release his taxes. But he lied. He lied and said, oh, of course I'm going to release them. And then wink, winked behind the scenes, don't ever fucking release my taxes. If he had done that here, eventually this one had gone away, but he became so defensive and obviously guilty.

[Michael Barbaro]

He looks guilty.

[Scott Galloway]

It looks like when I walk in and my dog Leia, my Great Dane has gotten into the trash. I know it, she's sulking around like, oh, won't make eye contact, putting her hindquarters.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, that look, we have the dog look.

[Scott Galloway]

He looks like this times 10. He has fanned these flames unbelievably and handled it so poorly he could not. I think I said this on Monday. If someone had said to him, if he had said, tell me, give me the body language, the statements and the complexion of someone who is clearly guilty of something and freaked out about it, that is how he has behaved.

[Michael Barbaro]

So what should he do? Say again? As I said, should he just say he's gonna release them and then not release them or agree with his people and say it's terrible, nothing can be done about it? I mean, in this case he does have the power to release it. So it's really hard to say, yeah, I agree, we should release it and then not release it. Cuz he's the one who promised it in the election. He's the one who talked about it incessantly. He's the one who trained his followers to be conspiracy theorists, right? And these people are committed, more committed to the conspiracy than they are to him at this point.

[Scott Galloway]

It's just so weird about this and the statement about what it says about our politics and that is first off, what do you know, the first bipartisan action or the first demonstration of bipartisanship in this fucked up electoral body is over a conspiracy. That's what it took to bring Democrats and some Republicans together. It was a conspiracy. And what's weird about it is I get the sense that they're not the people who are so outraged about this. They're not outraged that they want to know if these people are guilty of raping children. They want to know if their conspiracy is valid. It's just so strange. And also what I don't get as a following and why I believe, wow, there may be a. There. There is that. If he had just done what any number. I mean, at some point, this island looked like a little bit like what you would imagine Davos would look like, except with bathrobes and ankle monitors. I mean, this gathering, there were so many people there that are really powerful, and the majority of them have said, yeah, I fucked up. I thought it was going to be a good time and a good party, and everybody else was, you know, was gone.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, you talked about that.

[Scott Galloway]

Keep in mind, Kara, this is a country that has forgiven him after he was found liable for sexual abuse.

[Michael Barbaro]

And so many accusations on top of that.

[Scott Galloway]

And he's worried about. And he thinks this is worse.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

So how could it be worse?

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah. Who'd have thought that? Someone who had that.

[Scott Galloway]

What are your thoughts here?

[Michael Barbaro]

I think I. I'm fascinated how interested I am now in understanding. I think there's a huge opportunity here for fraud, that they will release certain things. Because he keeps saying she can release the credible things. Right. And so I think there was a joke. I thought Jordan Klepper did a great job talking about that. They're going to try to fake things, like fake conversations and things like that. There's a huge opportunity for manipulating this information if it does get released. So be dubious of some of it and creating kind of a mess so you don't know what's what. There's a huge opportunity for really hurting people that are not guilty, who just stupidly went to his island at the same time. A lot of it probably is. It's probably worse than you think. Right. What this guy has on these people, because he was operating for decades, by the way, Jeffrey Epstein. It wasn't a short time. And people kept going after he was convicted and in a sweetheart deal. All the people in Florida were involved in the sweetheart deal, including one of Trump's former cabinet members, and so. And ended up having to leave because of it. I think Trump is. He's acting guilty because he is guilty. And the question is, what is he guilty of? Right. What exactly is he guilty of and what proof is there? Why hasn't the proof come out till now? You'd think this stuff would come out, and it's kind of interesting that it hasn't. That's another thing. The other thing is he keeps saying, incredible evidence. Everything he says I pay attention to. I think it's a big, giant mess. And if I were him, I'd let it all out and let the chips fall where they may and make it confusing for everybody. Make it a bigger hot mess than it is. I think it's not gonna go away. The Maureen Comey thing, why would you do that? Why would you file the prosecutor of Ghislaine Maxwell, Is he preparing to pardon her? And I think. Let me just say, I think Elon has a very good point. What is she doing in jail? He's calling it a hoax, the whole thing. Why is Ghislaine Maxwell in jail if it's a hoax? I'd like to know.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, and again, if the election was stolen in 2020, how many people have been arrested? Zero. Anyway, so again, what is Maureen Comey's firing again? Start playing the kazoo. Do you think it was an accident that he fired her yesterday?

[Michael Barbaro]

No, I just think what's interesting is a firing of federal prosecutor and a tape gap that reminds me of someone. Nixon.

[Scott Galloway]

I feel like just Maga has given us license to talk about our favorite conspiracy. Do you remember the Godfather? I don't think he was murdered. I think this is what happened. You know how in Godfather 2, the Robert Duvall character visits that guy in witness protection or in prison who's going to testify against Michael Corleone? And Robert Duvall, the concierge comes to him and says, hey, you know, in ancient Rome, they used to kill themselves and then their families would be taken care of. He basically says to them, if you kill yourself, we'll take care of your family. I think something along the lines of, all right, if you want to kill yourself, we'll figure out a way such that no one gets in the way. But something went on here. This is just two cameras, two guards, and through just a series of very, very unlikely events, he was able to do this. I mean, this really is the stuff of conspiracy theory. It's just sort of like you read about this, and there's no less than probably a dozen or two dozen people. If someone came to that person and said, oh, by the way, if somehow $10 million ends up in a Swiss banking account, this guy's going to end up dead. I think there's a lot of people who are on that island who would probably nod. So this is. And again, I come back to the same thing. First off, the Comey thing was another one of his attempts at distraction, hoping that the media would pick up on it.

[Michael Barbaro]

If I had to guess, he slept with someone underage. And there's proof of that.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, that's called rape. Right. Raping killers Raping children.

[Michael Barbaro]

That's what I'm saying. I think that is.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, that's what everyone's guess is.

[Michael Barbaro]

That's the assumption.

[Scott Galloway]

It wasn't that he had mushroom chocolates on the island and watched the sunset. I mean, it's not. This is. He is really worried here. And you think, well, maybe he's worried about his friends. He doesn't give a flying fuck about anyone else.

[Michael Barbaro]

What about a special counsel? Did you see Lauren Boebert's suggestion?

[Scott Galloway]

Matt Gates hire a special counsel? But how special will that counsel be?

[Michael Barbaro]

I know Matt Gates was her suggestion. She's such a bubble head, man. She's such a bubble head.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't know what that.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, I don't think you hire. Although he'd know how to find it. He'd know.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. Like appointing Matt Gaetz to the special counsel is like trying to defuse a bomb by strapping it to your ex wife. I mean, that just. I thought that was funny. You're not really trying to solve the problem here. You're trying to kill two birds with one stone.

[Michael Barbaro]

This is so bad. Oh, my God, can you imagine? And of course he gets sucked up into it because of course it'll start talking about his problems. Same problem, similar problems.

[Scott Galloway]

Wait, we're gonna have a special counsel. Make it a special counsel who was accused and investigated. And I think he was cleared to be fair. Of the crime he'd be investigating.

[Michael Barbaro]

Who knows what's the next thing? Just very quickly and we'll move on.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, I know what the next thing is. Something fucking outrageous and stupid that we all go over here. So we're not talking about Epstein.

[Michael Barbaro]

I don't think anyone's going over here.

[Scott Galloway]

I know, but. Well, okay, but I was working out with my son yesterday and the Chyron and CNBC and CNN all talking about Chairman Powell. He's not going anywhere. Nothing is different about Chairman Powell's job than it was 48 hours ago. Except it's crowded out. More and more reporting about Epstein.

[Michael Barbaro]

Epstein's not going anywhere is what I meant. Epstein's not going anywhere until the files are released. That is it.

[Scott Galloway]

That's what you think? You think this is going to. There's no.

[Michael Barbaro]

He's not dying. I mean, the Fox News is interesting. The other day, they were counting Fox News and It mentioned Epstein four times because Trump said something and Biden 52 times. It was crazy. They're trying very hard. A lot of conservative media is very nervous about what to do here because they love the conspiracy theory. But they don't love that it's linked to Trump so closely now. So it's going to be hard for them to figure out, although the Wall Street Journal certainly has been aggressive in covering it. But still not heavily, not as heavily as it should be. They sort of give it glancing attention. So it'll be hard for all these conservative media things, but I think it's going nowhere until they release the files, and then that will take up all the time. And now Trump's whole administration is Epstein. That's it. That's all it is until the midterms, I think. I don't think it's going away like his other. Most of his stuff moves on. This is not moving on, but we'll see. We'll see. And another news. Defense Department is going to start using Elon Musk's favorite chatbot, Grok, which is interesting because Elon's really attacking Trump. XAI announced this week that it secured a $200 million contract with DoD to develop and implement AI tools for the agency. Anthropic. Google and OpenAI were awarded similar contracts. XAI is also rolling out Grok for Government, a suite of products that can be customized for specific uses across science and healthcare and other sectors. And I suppose it can go into Hitler mode if it needs to. And that's not all. The latest GROK update included companions for super subscribers, an anime girl and a panda. They're already doing all sorts of problematic things. I'm not going into it. What happens, we'll see when it gets into the government. I don't think they're capable of making a commercial product or product for government, but so far they haven't been able to. Your thoughts, any quick thoughts?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, initially, in order to try and quell concerns about AI and stave off any possible regulation, they all had had, literally all of them, whether it was LLAMA or Anthropic or chatgpt, all had language that essentially said that they would never use their models for military warfare or nuclear industries. They have all recently changed that language or gotten rid of it because there's money here and big money. So all of this, I mean, all of them were like, this is dangerous. We realize it's dangerous. We will never use it for military applications. And they're like, oh, there's a check here. Get rid of that line.

[Michael Barbaro]

I'm doing the Michael Bargot.

[Scott Galloway]

So what you're saying is.

[Michael Barbaro]

What you're saying is, Scott, that they're greedy fucks?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. So what you're saying is Even though he claims to be a heterosexual. If you have a dreamy salt and pepper beard, he'd go there. He'd go there anyways. Poor Michael Bobron. The last thing anyone's gonna do now is compliment us. Literally the last thing. Anyway.

[Michael Barbaro]

He is exquisite.

[Scott Galloway]

No good deed goes unpunished. Michael.

[Michael Barbaro]

He's exquisite. Michael, we think you're exquisite.

[Scott Galloway]

But also I personally, I really endorse and in favor of this intersection, which for some reason we have avoided between our nation's most innovative companies and our military industrial complex. I think other nations are trying to figure out, I mean, one of the learnings we're gonna take away, I think, from the war we were talking about, the war in Ukraine is the following. That just stating you're going to increase your military budget by 120 billion. That's again, drunk uncle practicing his karate in front of everybody thinking it's impressive.

[Michael Barbaro]

Karate, Karate.

[Scott Galloway]

The lesson you can take away from the war in Ukraine can come down to one word. Asymmetric. And that is there have been $300 drones that have been taking out $3 million TU144 tanks or whatever they're called. We should be massively investing in asymmetric warfare. Things like drones, AI predictive technologies. Because the reality is the kinetic era is over. And that is thinking if you have more tanks, you're automatically going to win the war. That used to be true. Wars used to be a function of brute force. It's no longer the case. And I think companies like Andarella, Palantir, which I have been critical of, the reality is, at the end of the day, we should have our brightest working hand in glove and stop all the fucking bitch stupid like walkouts at these companies saying we're not going to work with the defense industry. No, they can do that.

[Michael Barbaro]

They can leave. They can leave.

[Scott Galloway]

People do what they want and they should be inquired for. Oh, come on, we're going to walk out over lunch? That'll show it.

[Michael Barbaro]

Well, no, no, they have to leave. If they don't want to do it, they should leave. And they have every right to eat.

[Scott Galloway]

I love what you say. You don't like chick fil A, don't eat a chick fil A. But don't walk out over lunch and think that somehow that's gonna make any difference. And a lot of these. I don't. I've said this a lot. I sound very. I don't know what the term is Republican here. I think a lot of Americans take for granted just how many people out there would like to kill us and take our shit away. And that we need the most robust fighting force in history. And you invest in your opportunities, not your problems. The most successful organization in a modern world is the US military. So we should continue to invest in it, but we should continue to invest in it smartly. And I do think these companies can bring a lot of value to the Defense Department.

[Michael Barbaro]

The one thing I like, everybody got some. I think there should be a lot of competition with the Defense. They have an opportunity here not to have one. They have a problem with StarLink and with SpaceX, with the Space stuff, putting up satellites. If you have all the companies here, that's great. One thing that's a problem is that ChatGPT is taken. I don't know if you've seen the recent stats. Still, ChatGPT is huge. The others are progressively smaller. Microsoft doesn't even show up and Grok doesn't show up at all.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, it's running away with it.

[Michael Barbaro]

It's running away with it even though they're losing all kinds of researchers. That said, I think it's good to have competition in the sector if we're going to do this. Did you get the anime girl at all?

[Scott Galloway]

I didn't.

[Michael Barbaro]

Nobody's using Grok. No one's using. Very few people are using Grok anyway.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, really?

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, it's. Look at the numbers. It's like crazy how far down the chart they are anyway. All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about Andrew Cuomo taking on Zoran Mamdani. Again.

[Kara Swisher]

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Michael Barbaro]

Scott we're back with more news. Are you registered in oh no, you're Florida Florida Former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo will officially run as an independent.

[Scott Galloway]

Let's just make sure the New York State Comptroller heard that. I am a Florida resident, yes, Florida resident.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yes, you are. Former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo will officially run as an independent in the NYC mayoral race after being defeated very handily by Zoran Mamdani in the Democratic primary. I mean, he beat him like a rug. Cuomo posted a campaign video on X, which has under 6,000 likes. It's really sad. A reply from Mamdani with a link to donate to his campaign has over 181,000 likes. It was well done. The former governor plans to ask all candidates other than Mamdani to pledge to drop out of the race in mid September if they aren't in the lead, including himself, I guess. And current Mayor Eric Adams, who will also run as independent, said Cuomo asked him to drop out of the race, which he called the highest level of arrogance. And I would agree with Eric Adams. I don't agree with him on anything. Meanwhile, Mamdani has been making the rounds, meeting with business leaders and visiting D.C. to meet with Democratic leaders. He had a pretty cool reception from a lot of them because he just did. He's tried a little bit to assuage their worries. A lot of people are looking at Bill de Blasio's policies in Mamdani's. And Bill de Blasio is left of Mamdani, which is interesting according to a lot of people stuff I've read. But Cuomo, oh is so non vibrant. He looks like an old man. He looks weird. People are making memes out of his camp. Him walking around with his face and stuff like that, which are very funny. And he's getting. I know he's shook up his whole campaign, but I don't see him making any ground here. Any thoughts?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it reminds me of when in 2016 people said that only Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump could make each other vibes viable. I feel as if Governor Cuomo, who I like more than most people, I think it's easy to be critical of him, I get it. But I actually think he's a decent man, would be a decent elect. I think he'd be a good placeholder. I think he'd be competent. I would have voted probably for Cuomo. Some of mom dominated. As I said this, I'm not a New York resident. I also think that people totally freaking out about his international policy is he needs to make sure the subways run on time. I think some of his policies are absolutely asinine. But having said that, I like you. I think I got swept up in this fever of young people taking charge and pushing back on the establishment. And he's a viable. I think it's going to be a rough summer for Mamdame. He has done something very smart in the last week and that is he is pivoting towards the center. He has agreed not to use or applaud the term globalize the infetada, which is deeply offensive. You said infata intifada.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah. Thank you.

[Scott Galloway]

Only Cuomo and Eric Adams could make a guy who wrote a rap song praising the funders of Hamas a viable candidate. And also what this really is a lesson in and this kind of, and I'm sort of here for it, is young people pushing back. And also he put on a masterclass and how to run a campaign for a New Age. It is going to be a rough summer for him because I think these guys with their money and also I think New Yorkers are really gonna start digging into some of These policies. And basically people are gonna get smart. When they start pushing back on him, they're gonna start saying, okay, these quote unquote state sponsored grocery stores are nothing but state sponsored breadlines. He's going to have a rush, but.

[Michael Barbaro]

There'S only gonna be like three of them. Scott. That's like over maybe. So they could take. There's only gonna be like three or four politics. So it's fine to like try to get better. If he pivoted and said, you know what I really wanna do is get better food into these neighborhoods and let's figure out an interesting and good way to do it. He could do that. He could pivot that in a second.

[Scott Galloway]

And he should, he will. He should and he will.

[Michael Barbaro]

Second thing, a lot of the other stuff, he just has to be more explicit in what he means by rent freezes. So I think he has an opportunity actually to clarify himself in a really good way and in a very powerful way.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, if he's smart, he'll pivot to the middle. And he's sort of doing.

[Michael Barbaro]

It's not just the middle. Clarify himself. Okay, here's what I wan.

[Scott Galloway]

You mean back away from ridiculously fucking stupid positions?

[Michael Barbaro]

No, but he was thinking, but he wasn't specific. And when you start to actually hear the specifics, they're not quite as nutty as you think they are. As you think they are. Which I did.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, he's backpedaling the rent freezes. Rent freezes don't work.

[Michael Barbaro]

No, but it is a rent freeze on a certain number of things. Anyway. Nonetheless, he has an opportunity to define himself and he's got to do that. That's the key thing is he's got to define them, not let them do it, because they'll do it in this ham handed way that makes him look like an idiot. Secondly.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, let's go. You think he's. You think I'm just gonna. You think he's gonna have no problem that he's gonna run away with it?

[Michael Barbaro]

No, I think he's gonna have. He's gonna. He has an opportunity to keep the narrative going for himself or they're gonna do it for him. And so he needs. That's all I'm saying is. And it's an opportunity to clarify. And so anything that seems weak, the things that bug you, that drive you crazy, he should start to clarify for those voters. Secondly, as an opportunity to reach out to, to voters of color, poor voters of color, and really go into those neighborhoods and start talking. That's where Cuomo's strong. He absolutely is. So he can start doing that. The third thing is that the rich people of New York have lost their fucking ever loving minds about this. Calling him a mark. I'm like, calm the fuck down. You've worked with all kinds. The stuff they've tolerated on Trump, you have no credibility. You people, you're just no credit. You look like rich people running for the hills. And that is. That to me has astonished me, like Ken Langone, like just all of them, like, calm down. Like you might have to work with this guy. So let's figure out a way to work with him, right, Rather than like kneecap him almost constantly. I don't know if he's going to run away with it. I can tell you if Cuomo doesn't do something because he really looks. Go look at his physical. He used to be a big, vibrant man. It looks like he's lost weight. I don't know how, but he looks like he's lost a substantive amount of weight. He looks non vibrant. He looks old. He looks very awkward in regular settings with people. I think he's like all the energy that Cuomo did bring to the table and he absolutely did. He's lost. And so is Adams the other choice. I think he and Adams are going to eat each other up and Mamdani's going to win. I don't see how he can't win unless he makes a big giant mistake. And if he clarifies himself and becomes more palatable to more people and it doesn't have to be the rich people because they're never going to like him, I think he's got a great chance.

[Scott Galloway]

I think like Cuomo is a flawed candidate. I think for 67, I think he looks great. I think he looks really robust. There's a lot of flaws there. Those flaws are dwarfed by a guy who cut a backroom deal with an unpopular president to let ICE into his city. Adams. The only prediction I'm willing to make here is that it's not going to be Eric Adams. And also I, to a certain extent, you know, everyone's focusing on the moment that Mamdani, in my opinion won, at least the primary was when on the debate stage they asked them what is the first place you would visit? And they all got out their virtue signaling and self importance and said, well, I'd go to Israel, dude, you're the make sure the trash is picked up. And he said, and this was the moment for him. He said, I'd go to Brooklyn. I'd Go to Harlem. I'm about improving the city and these folks in operational roles. When you're the governor of South Dakota, do you really need to go to Israel? Yeah. You're basically saying, I'm gonna take taxpayer money instead of doing my fucking job. I'm gonna pretend I'm bigger. I'm gonna pretend that I should be president. No one gives a shit what you think about. About the war in Ukraine or Gaza. You're here to run the city and make sure we have good schools, that people are safe. And instead, they. And he ran right through that. That was brilliant on his part. And it also. More than that, that's why I think.

[Michael Barbaro]

He'S gonna do a good job here. But go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, and what it says is it might be a turning point. The most exciting thing about his win, and I would not have voted for him. The most exciting thing about his win was within seven days of him winning, 4,000 young Democrats filled out paperwork to run for office across the nation. And that's what we need. We need more young people who think, if this guy can do it, so can I. I am so sick of the old pulling the future forward on my credit card. I have had it. And so I'm like, we've both said we're a little bit caught up in this fever and what it says about Democratic politics. And they should absolutely take some notes from his playbook around how he weaponized new media and also focused on affordability and represents, you know, a new generation. Anyways, TED Talk over.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah. Let me say one final thing. One of the things that drives me crazy is there was an Arizona race where an influencer didn't win. Thought that she might. She got pretty far against an equally progressive candidate who was taking over her father's seat. And they're like, it's a sign for, you know, of trouble for Mondami. No, it isn't. If you're genuine in your area, if you're Abby Spanberger and you want to be more conservative and centrist in Virginia, it works for Virginia. That'll work. If you're in Ohio and you're more centrist, that'll work. If you're AOC and you're who you are, that'll work. What you have to be is genuine and interested in where you are. It doesn't speak to the bigger Democratic Party. That said, they will use. If he wins, the Republicans will try to make Mandani into a demon. I think it's gonna be very hard to do. So they tried really hard to do that with Nancy Pelosi. It didn't work. It worked for Hillary Clinton. He is so charming. It'll be very hard to demonize him. And I think making these people more than they are is probably a bad idea. Everyone should be who they are in the area they're in. That's my only thing.

[Scott Galloway]

Have you interviewed him?

[Michael Barbaro]

I'm doing. I'm going to.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. I just. I was saying Kara Swisher and this guy are like, I think that'll be. He should do it. It totally fits.

[Michael Barbaro]

I was deciding, should I interview Cuomo? I was talking about this with Amanda.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, yeah, I would. It'd be an interesting interview.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yes, it would be.

[Scott Galloway]

You're getting your ass handed to you. What is your thought here? What are your plans? What's your plan? Yeah, you come across as tired and that you're of the past. How are you gonna combat that?

[Michael Barbaro]

And your social media is cringe. Do you need some help? Anyway, blink your eyes. Rise three times if you do.

[Scott Galloway]

I think the whole world is. Well, not the whole world, but those of us who are, you know, the side piece of Michael Barbara are hoping that you interview both, especially Mamdani, but also Cuomo. I'd love to see you interview both those.

[Michael Barbaro]

I'm going to ask him. I'm going to ask him. Or hear it, I should say anyway. The House has advanced three crypto bills are moving on. And a defense measure after setting a record for the longest vote in the history of the chamber. GOP Holden doubts. Agreed. After being promised a future vote to ban the Federal Reserve from issuing digital currencies. The Genius act, which would regulate stablecoins, is on track to hit Trump's desk this week and could mark Congress's first ever major crypto legislation. We'll see. Bitcoin is currently trading at $118,000 after hitting a high of $120,000 at the start of the week. Very quickly on crypto and also, I just want to note, they're also voting to cut funding for NPR and pbs, which is heinous on their part. They managed to get that through so far in this rescissions package. Thoughts on either of those things?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, look, pbs, npr. I grew up with them. I think they do enormous service. And there's just certain people who won't get straight down the middle news anymore with these funding cuts. I am a little bit. I have a little bit of a Republican twinge on this, and that is their public funding has become such a political football that I wonder if at Some point they're better off without the public funding and just leaning on listeners such as myself who register enormous value to support it. It just feels like it's been such a political football for so long.

[Michael Barbaro]

That means people in rural areas will never have any news that is not tinged.

[Scott Galloway]

I think, look, that's a fair point and I touched on that at the beginning of my comments.

[Michael Barbaro]

It's going to be 1.1 billion couple percent. It'll hurt them though.

[Scott Galloway]

I would love to see an NPR and a PBS be really well funded by private individuals such that the Republicans could stop using it as a punching bag at every hearing for years.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yes, that's correct.

[Scott Galloway]

So let me commit. I'm gonna give, based on what you said, I'm going to give some money to NPR and PBS and public radio because I think they do an amazing.

[Michael Barbaro]

Job and they're best for public broadcasting is what you want to give to. Go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Corporation cppb. But here's what was interesting is the survey came out and they asked people what media entities are the most trusted for trying to be moderate. And what was interesting is the two that came up as the most trustworthy in the middle were companies formerly known as having a conservative and or progressive bent. And the two were the Wall Street Journal. And I think it was pbs. Was it PBS or npr? I think it was pbs. But what's interesting is that quality journalism does break through, even if you have a political bent or a reputation for political bent. Because the Wall Street Journal was always known as conservative. But they said they limited their conservative viewpoint to the opinion section.

[Michael Barbaro]

They did. They do. You know, I worked there.

[Scott Galloway]

I know you did.

[Michael Barbaro]

And they're amazing journalists.

[Scott Galloway]

It's a testament, quite frankly. You gotta give it to Rupert Murdoch. I agree.

[Michael Barbaro]

He left it off.

[Scott Galloway]

He has done an amazing job stewarding that publication.

[Michael Barbaro]

He has.

[Scott Galloway]

And then in our business, I've said for a long time, I think we should every time we do a podcast, send a royalty check to Joe Rogan who blew the medium open. NPR's podcasts there are the original gangsters saying that audio quality, it matters. Production quality. They do such a good job when you listen to their stuff. It is so tight and so well produced. Anyway, I'm a fan. I'm gonna corporation for public broadcasting.

[Michael Barbaro]

I think one of the things that you have to note is that they have what drives me crazy is this idea that Elmo is woke or they're saying be nice. They're not like they do. They go on and on. These right wingers and remember, you know, Tinky Winky was gay or whatever. And then because he had a purse and the thing that drives me crazy. Same thing with Superman. Like they're like Superman's woke. And then of course, it's the most successful movie of this summer. Secondly, if you go back to old Superman things and you read it out loud, they would call that woke. It's like everyone Superman says, this is from the 40s. Be nice to everyone, regardless of their religion or their race. This has been a Superman thing forever. It's just these people using these iconic things like Elmo and Superman and as a cudgel is really. Is so lame. They're so lame. Be nice is not a woke thing. It's a nice thing to teach kids. And I love everything that NPR and PBS does. And please watch Ken Burns American Revolution coming up. And then we'll send you a tote bag if you give me $25.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't know Elmo, folks. Elmo is conservative. If you actually listen to Elmo, he talks like a dictator or a LinkedIn influencer on mushrooms.

[Michael Barbaro]

All right, crypto, really quick, two seconds and then we'll get to your.

[Scott Galloway]

I think the space needs regulation. There's just no getting around it. By the way, I bought my first for the first time and I'm a coiner. I bought indirectly through a Bitcoin treasury company. I bought Bitcoin finally just for diversification and I'm just so sick of missing out on all this. What they've done. Bitcoin is just, it's a remarkable phenomena. There's no getting around it. And I don't understand the nuances of the regulation, but this category needed some sort of clarity around regulation. The Genius act sets rules for Stablecoin users, such as I think it requires one to one backing with Treasuries, monthly reports, redemption rights, anti money laundering compliance. Those are good things that'll be good for the space. Many of them already do this. I think Circle and Paxos already do this and it will bring some clarity to the unregulated players. Then there's something actually called the Clarity act and it formalizes the regulating bodies, which I think is a good idea. Bitcoin and Ethereum will go to the CFTC or ico Tokens will go to the sec. Stablecoins will have shared oversight. And then there's the Anti CBDC Act. This is the one I really don't understand. And as far as I can tell, that act is to make sure that the Federal Reserve cannot create a digital currency. They're worried that threatens the dollar's reserve currency status and they frame it as defensive privacy, preventing the government from spying on how you spend money. But it's essentially a play towards my understanding is it's a nod towards the anti surveillance crowd. But it's also the government probably doesn't want wants to ensure that the dollar's reserve currency is not threatened. So to their credit, I think they're trying to bring some clarity to the space such that it maintains its momentum.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, David Sacks got what he wanted in this one. He shepherded this one through anyway. We'll see where it goes. And we should be watching that. Absolutely. What's happening there? It's interesting that you invested. All right, one more quick break. We'll be back for predictions.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile.

[Michael Barbaro]

With the price of just about everything.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Going up, we thought we'd bring our prices down. So to help us, we brought in a reverse auctioneer, which is apparently a.

[Scott Galloway]

Thing Mint Mobile Unlimited Premium wireless. Everybody get 30, 30. Better get 30. Better get 20, 20, 20. Better get 20, 20. You better get 15, 15, 15, 15. Just 15 bucks a month.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

So give it a try. @mintmobile.com Upfront payment of 45 for three.

[Michael Barbaro]

Month plan equivalent to 15 per month required new customer offer for first three months only. Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of networks busy. Taxes and fees extra.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

See mint mobile.com the summer is heating.

[Scott Galloway]

Up with Marvel Studios. The Fantastic Four. Light them up, Johnny.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

On July 25th.

[Scott Galloway]

Time to save the planet. What's the plan?

[Kara Swisher]

Trust me, I hate that.

[Scott Galloway]

Bad plan. Come on. Terrible.

[Kara Swisher]

That's a stupid plan.

[Scott Galloway]

Prepare for Fantastic.

[Michael Barbaro]

We will face this together as a family.

[Scott Galloway]

Marvel Studios the Fantastic Four First Steps.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Only in theaters July 25, May PG13.

[Scott Galloway]

Some material may be inappropriate for children under 13. Get tickets now.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Right now at the Home Depot, you'll find storage solutions made to fit your needs. Grab an HDX tough tote to protect your tools or keep your sports equipment contained with reinforced Snap Fitness lids. Or stack up and make better use of your space with bins and totes built to last. Whatever your story, we've got the gear to keep it organized and protected at the Home Depot. How doers get more done.

[Michael Barbaro]

Okay, Scott, before you get to Bridges, I just want to say I had been approached by so many people about your incredibly touching tribute to your dad. And I just want to say again, it was really wonderful and I think our listeners really. I've been hugged more this week than ever before. People without asking, people are like, I need to hug you. I was like, okay. On your behalf. So I just think you really. One of the strengths that you have is you show your emotions, and it's really important to a lot of not just men, but women seeing you do that, I have to say. And so it's been unusual this week to get so many responses to. So there you have it.

[Scott Galloway]

Thanks for saying that.

[Michael Barbaro]

I predict you're gonna get even more woke.

[Scott Galloway]

You know, I love what you. You describe me as a San Francisco lesbian, by the way. I am in San Francisco. I'm in San Francisco.

[Michael Barbaro]

What are you doing there? I'm coming there next week. What are you doing? Where are you? I know that hotel. What hotel are you in? You don't say.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm at the Four Seasons. I'm visiting my sister. I'm gonna have lunch with her today. And I'm also going.

[Michael Barbaro]

I'm gonna say hi to your sister. She's a. She's fantastic.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. So as you know, I'm in Colorado, so I took the opportunity to come out and just have lunch with my sister.

[Michael Barbaro]

Oh, lovely. Anyway, let's hear your prediction then. Besides the fact that you, me, and Michael will be in a cuddle puddle soon.

[Scott Galloway]

Hello.

[Michael Barbaro]

Hello.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Hello.

[Scott Galloway]

Smack her ass, Michael. Smack her ass. Like she keeps pretend. She keeps correcting me. Poor Michael.

[Michael Barbaro]

God, Michael, we're so.

[Scott Galloway]

What's his relationship? Is he married?

[Michael Barbaro]

What's his marriage? He's married.

[Scott Galloway]

He's married. The three of us. The three of us will have a couple spicy margaritas and explore. How serious is that relationship? We're gonna have a sex tape, and then we're gonna send it to Meredith, his boss. He'd probably get a raise at the New York Times. Come on. That's a good one. If chamomile teal tried to explain the Fed rate hike, that's the daily. I love that. Oh, I'm sorry. My prediction. My prediction.

[Michael Barbaro]

No, I asked him to be a co host during Scot Free August. I hope he.

[Scott Galloway]

And what did he say he'd be per.

[Michael Barbaro]

If he wants to do it, he's got to ask the time for permission.

[Scott Galloway]

Meredith, if you can't do it, you're getting in the way of our throuple, which is discriminatory, and I mean. Meredith, stop giving in to your heteronormative patriarchal management views around what Daily the pod your podcast host should do.

[Michael Barbaro]

That's so funny. Okay.

[Scott Galloway]

Love Meredith. Anyways. Okay, so my prediction is pretty straightforward. Before this podcast even airs tomorrow, there's gonna be another incendiary. Look over here. Batshit crazy hollow threat promise. I'm raising. I'm putting a 200% tariff on MyAnna Marie's rare earth minerals. I am firing. I have decided I'm going to imprison Alec Baldwin and there's gonna be something.

[Michael Barbaro]

Error 51 he should release the files on Eric. That would work. That would work.

[Scott Galloway]

This is my prediction.

[Michael Barbaro]

We need a conspiracy with a conspiracy.

[Scott Galloway]

He's not focused. He's not doing anything the majority of his time right now. And efforts are not being spent on increasing the material or psychological well being of Americans.

[Michael Barbaro]

No, they're not.

[Scott Galloway]

It's on. They're in a room with AI going what can he do? Or announce tomorrow? It doesn't matter if it's stupid. Doesn't matter if he has any intention of actually following through. That will keep the news off of one word Epstein every day for the next seven days. Kara. And we should track this and read them out.

[Michael Barbaro]

Okay. All right.

[Scott Galloway]

There's gonna be something stupid incendiary which has absolutely no chance of ever becoming reality in an attempt. And the media will fall for it. They'll go, Jesus Christ, what is he thinking? And they'll start talking about that rather than what he doesn't want everyone to talk and that is he is freaked out for some reason about the release of the Epstein files.

[Michael Barbaro]

He thinks it's going to go away. He does. Internally they're saying they think it's going to go away. I don't think it is. Sorry, Trump, you better address it. That's all he's got to do. He's got to address it.

[Scott Galloway]

Do you have any predictions?

[Michael Barbaro]

I think he is going to probably have to release these things and then we'll have to worry about the fraud involved in it. I think he has to release them. I don't think he has a choice here. I don't think he can. He is very good at pushing things off. I think think he absolutely. He's gonna have to release these things. And I don't think it's gonna be like his taxes or anything else. He's not getting away with this one. I think Elon is correct about that. It's not gonna work this time anyway. We wanna hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com pivot to submit a question for the show or call 85551 pivot elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe. This week on Prof. G. Conversations, Scott spoke with Greg Lukianoff, a free speech advocate, First Amendment attorney, and President of fire Individual Rights and Expression. Let's listen to a clip.

[Emily Ratajkowski]

Well, in terms of First Amendment law, Anonymous speech is protected, but. But I don't think that's sufficient enough of an answer. And I think I tend to think of the justification for anonymity as like a seesaw that essentially if we lived in a free and enlightened society in which people welcomed dissent and welcomed disagreement and there was no imaginable idea that you you'd be punished for it, then the justification for anonymity would kind of ring hollow to people.

[Michael Barbaro]

Yeah, I like that you talk about that issue a lot, Scott. It's an important one. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back next week. Scott, Read us out.

[Scott Galloway]

Today's show was produced by Lara Neyman, Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Kevin Oliver. Ernie Intertodd engineered this episode. Thanks also to Jude Burrows, Mia Sevara and Dan Shalon. Nishat Kura is Vox Media's Executive producer of podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media. You can subscribe to the [e-mail] pod we'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Michael Collis.

[Kara Swisher]

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