Flight Cancellation Chaos, SNAP Ruling, and U.S.-Canada Trade War

Summary

Pivot Podcast Summary

Episode: Flight Cancellation Chaos, SNAP Ruling, and U.S.-Canada Trade War
Date: November 11, 2025
Hosts: Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway
Location: Live from Toronto, Queen Elizabeth Theatre

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Overview

This lively live episode of Pivot brings Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway to Toronto as part of their “7 Cities in 7 Days” tour. The discussion centers on current events impacting both the U.S. and Canada, with a focus on airline chaos, the SNAP food benefits ruling, and a burgeoning U.S.-Canada trade war. As always, the hosts mix sharp critique, humor, and insight, localizing major stories for their Canadian audience.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Flight Cancellation Chaos & Airline Infrastructure (03:38–12:02)

• Flight delays and FAA cuts: Kara shares her travel woes—her flight was three hours late due to FAA capacity cuts caused by a government shutdown, a situation that could worsen as the shutdown continues.
  • “Flight cancellations...could rise 15% or even 20% if the government shutdown continues.” —Kara Swisher (03:36)
• Broader impact: Both hosts stress how airline turmoil affects business, tourism, and economic vitality, especially during holiday seasons.
• Innovation and Public Good:
  • Scott frames major innovations like air travel, vaccines, and the PC as those that broadly benefit society rather than enrich a small elite.
  • The airline industry, he argues, is remarkable because it remains a break-even business despite delivering massive benefits to consumers.
    • “If you look at the most impressive innovations in history...the greatest innovation in history is the Western nation middle class. Longer story, but close up, there would be vaccines...another example would be the PC...” —Scott Galloway (04:06–05:06)
• AI analogy:
  • Scott wonders if AI could become an innovation that widely benefits the public, rather than just a handful of corporations.
    • “I’m hoping AI becomes one of these innovations where no small number of companies are able to aggregate trillions...and that is—we win.” —Scott Galloway (07:50)
• Airline safety:
  • The FAA is praised for making air travel statistically much safer than driving, though this success is threatened by current political dysfunction.
  • “There was a real visionary innovation around the FAA...they decided early on we are going to make this the safest form of travel.” —Scott Galloway (09:34)

Notable Moment:

• Kara: “Who do you think would survive that, you or me?” (On hypothetical cannibalism from historic travel hardships.)
  Scott: “It would be pretty obvious to me, right? ...You would be both gamey and stringy to eat.” (05:49–06:00)

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2. SNAP Ruling & American Social Values (12:02–17:55)

• Supreme Court SNAP decision:
  • The Supreme Court allows the Trump administration to restrict full SNAP (food assistance) benefits temporarily, showing a stark contrast between wealth and child poverty.
  • Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson’s procedural move is praised as smart, as the issue goes to a more liberal appeals court.
  • “So we have decided to over index—in the wealthiest nation in the world—the number of kids who go hungry. That is a really poor reflection on our values.” —Scott Galloway (14:22)
• American inequality and generational politics:
  • Scott laments that older generations in the U.S. are voting themselves more benefits at the expense of children, calling it a move from “winners and losers” to a real-life Hunger Games.
    • “The D in democracy is working too well, and as old people vote...we are now spending more money on ICE than we’re spending on children.” —Scott Galloway (15:05)
• Contrast with leadership opulence:
  • Kara juxtaposes child hunger with Trump’s constant social media boasts from opulent White House settings, characterizing it as grotesque.

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3. U.S.-Canada Trade War (21:40–34:24)

• Tariffs and political fallout:
  • The Trump administration’s tariffs on Canadian imports (up to 35% for many goods, 15% on steel/aluminum) are straining what was once the world’s closest economic partnership.
    • “Canada has the largest undefended border in the world with the U.S. …It would cost us somewhere between 20 and 50 billion dollars a year if either side decided to militarize their border. But we don’t, because we trust and we like each other.” —Scott Galloway (23:58)
• Economic asymmetry:
  • Trade is more important to Canada than to the U.S., but American exports yield much higher value per dollar.
  • “Trade between the US and Canada is asymmetric. For every dollar we push into you that you buy, versus every dollar you push into us, we get triple the amount of shareholder value.” —Scott Galloway (24:57)
• Canada diversifies partnerships:
  • PM Mark Carney announces massive investments (280 billion CAD) to diversify exports and reduce reliance on the U.S.
• Long-term impact:
  • Scott predicts the current rift will take a decade or more to heal, as Canada and others form new global alliances away from the unpredictable U.S.
    • “If and when Trump is out of office in ‘28, it’s going to take us a decade at a minimum to repair these trade alliances.” —Scott Galloway (27:59)

Notable Banter:

• “Can you imagine what would happen if Canada became the 51st state? We’d be so f**ing liberal, it’d be out of control.”* —Scott Galloway (23:44)

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4. Canadian Innovation & Tech Industry Analysis (29:27–34:24)

• BlackBerry as a cautionary tale:
  • Kara notes Canada’s early lead in mobile tech with BlackBerry but blames overreliance on U.S. ecosystems for Canada’s lost dominance.
  • “A lot of the innovations in technology didn’t happen here as much as it should have because of the dependencies on the United States.” —Kara Swisher (29:52)
• Why doesn’t Canada generate more tech giants?
  • Scott credits the U.S. regulatory environment and risk culture, lower taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and a cycle of successful founders reinvesting locally. Canada’s system, he observes, lacks enough “unicorn” success stories.
  • “The honest answer, I don’t have an answer for. ...When you get to the Canadian border, quite frankly, those unicorns somewhat stop.” —Scott Galloway (34:24)

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5. Local Politics: Mayoral Leadership and Masculinity (36:43–43:29)

• Mayoral themes—affordability and housing:
  • Comparison between New York’s and Toronto’s progressive mayors on tackling housing affordability.
  • Highlight of NYC’s newly elected progressive mayor and Olivia Chow’s policies.
• Masculinity and leadership models:
  • Kara asks Scott about candidates like Zohran Mamdani as positive male role models.
  • Scott sets out three pillars for masculinity: provider, protector, and procreator.
  • “I think of masculinity as being three things. Provider...protector...procreation...stop demonizing sexual desire.” —Scott Galloway (39:39)
  • Both generally endorse Mamdani as a positive model.

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6. State-run Grocery Stores & Welfare Approaches (41:42–43:20)

• Government-run liquor/grocery stores:
  • Scott is adamantly against the state running stores, arguing Alberta saw growth, better selection, and jobs after privatizing liquor sales.
    • “There are certain things the government does really well…someone from the DMV should not be picking out your produce or your alcohol.” —Scott Galloway (41:58)
  • Prefers cash transfers (higher minimum wage/SNAP) over state intervention.
• Kara counters:
  • The issue is about actually getting nutrition to the poor given welfare benefit cuts.

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7. Cross-Border Tourism Decline (43:29–48:45)

• Tourism trade deficit:
  • For the first time in decades, more Americans are visiting Canada than vice versa; Canadian tourism to the U.S. has dropped 25%.
  • Tariffs designed to boost manufacturing are hurting higher-margin tourism.
    • “Our obsession with trying to…prop up manufacturing...is taking down faster an industry which is higher margin and employs more people called the tourist sector.” —Scott Galloway (44:03)
• What would bring Canadians back?
  • Scott: “What could bring Canadians back? F** a new president.”* (45:24)
• Cultural kinship and estrangement:
  • Both hosts lament Americans' habit of taking Canada for granted, and Canadians' growing dislike of current U.S. leadership.
  • “We just—we love each other so much we take each other for granted. It’s like you wake up in the morning and you’re spooning your wife, and you forget how wonderful it is.” —Scott Galloway (47:03)
  • “They don’t want to be spooned by you, Scott, and neither do I.” —Kara Swisher (47:35)

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Audience Q&A (50:42–60:22)

Q1. State of U.S. Democracy & Leadership

• Who's the alternative to Trump?
  • Kara: The Democratic bench is broad and the movement needs to coalesce around affordability, dignity, democracy.
  • Scott: “America has been in dark places before...each time we've come back, learned from it and come back stronger.” (53:23)

Q2. Future of Advertising Careers

• Ad industry outlook in the age of AI and platform dominance.
  • Scott: Good if you’re established; if young, pivot to direct client relationships and small-screen media (mobile/social). (54:49)
  • Kara: “Google and Meta are going to dominate AI advertising.”

Q3. AI, Disinformation, and Regulation

• AI as a driver of propaganda & social division.
  • Kara: Propaganda isn’t new, but AI and social networks amplify it. Regulators must finally introduce guardrails, especially for youth.
  • Scott: Warns that the economy’s “bet on AI” gives tech companies power to divide and alienate youth. Calls for strict regulations, bans on synthetic relationships for minors, school phone bans, antitrust action, and even criminal penalties for big tech execs.
    • “It’s as if we have connected a profit motive into planning our own extinction.” —Scott Galloway (58:23)
    • “No synthetic relationships for anyone under 18. No phones in schools, no social media under 16. And quite frankly, holding these companies to the same account as every other company. We need antitrust, we need fines, and...someone needs to do a f**ing perp walk.”* —Scott Galloway (60:22)

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• "If you don't think vaccines are the biggest innovation in history, your head's up your ass and I can't save you." —Scott Galloway (05:02)
• "Trump always chickens out...He'll taco the thing out." —Kara Swisher (34:24)
• On U.S.-Canada relations: "It's just unkind." —Scott Galloway (25:04)
• "We're about the Hunger Games...for everybody else, you die a pretty slow, ugly death." —Scott Galloway (15:50)
• "All of us in America think our kid is in the top 1%. I can prove...99% of our children are not." —Scott Galloway (33:18)
• On AI: "There is now...a profit incentive attached to evolving a new species of asocial, asexual youth." —Scott Galloway (59:47)

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Closing Reflection (60:22–61:51)

Kara closes by stressing the importance of in-person connections and relationships beyond tech-driven media bubbles:

• “You got to get along with people you don’t agree with…The most significant relationships are with each other and unlikely ones where you have disagreement and challenge each other.”

Scott urges Canada and other allies to “embrace imperfect allies” and stick with America through challenging times.

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• Flight delay/airline chaos: 03:36–12:02
• SNAP ruling & inequality: 12:02–17:55
• U.S.-Canada trade war & Mark Carney: 21:40–34:24
• Canadian tech/BlackBerry debate: 29:27–34:24
• Local mayors & masculinity: 36:43–43:29
• Government-run stores & welfare: 41:42–43:20
• Tourism drop: 43:29–48:45
• Audience Q&A: 50:42–60:22
• AI & regulation climax: 56:24–60:22
• Final reflection: 60:22–61:51

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This episode deftly blends policy analysis, social commentary, and playful banter, revealing the deeply intertwined economic, political, and cultural fates of the U.S. and Canada while illustrating how current dysfunctions affect everyday life and democracy on both sides of the border.

Transcript

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[Scott Galloway]

Ladies and gentlemen, from Toronto, Ontario, welcome to this live recording of the Pivot Podcast with your hosts and Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway.

[Audience Member]

Hi, everyone.

[Kara Swisher]

Live from the Queen Elizabeth Theatre in Toronto, this is Pivot from New York magazine and the Vox Media Podcast network. I'm Kara Swisher.

[Scott Galloway]

And I'm Scott Galloway. And where are we, Kara? Toronto.

[Kara Swisher]

This is the first stop on our 7 Cities in 7 Days tour, which should challenge our relationship quite a bit. We're spending all our time together. Before we start, we want to say a big thank you to our sponsors, Odoo and Upwork.

[Scott Galloway]

Or as I like to say, Kaching.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, we're taping the show for audio and YouTube distribution. So look pretty, you'll be able to hear it or watch it next week. And let's begin. We've got a lot to talk about tonight, Scott. From terrorists to tourism to local politics and beyond to. We're making these in each city, whether we go to Boston, we're making them local, we're localizing them. That's what we're doing. So we're gonna talk a lot about Canada and things like that. We learned up On y'.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

All.

[Kara Swisher]

But first, how was your flight here?

[Scott Galloway]

My flight here?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

I feel like you're setting me up. My flight here was fine. Was great.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Super easy. Yeah. Not mine. Not mine. No.

[Scott Galloway]

See, this is when she asks a question, it's not really. Cause she wants to know me. She wants me to say, kara, how was your flight, by the way? Just quick fun fact. There are more raccoons in Toronto than kids under the age of 10.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, good to know.

[Scott Galloway]

True story. True story. 5% of Torontonians are vegan. I don't know if that's especially high.

[Kara Swisher]

Or low, but is it Torontonians or Toronto?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it's Toronto, but it's Torontonians.

[Kara Swisher]

No Tonians. No hello.

[Scott Galloway]

Passport, coming my way.

[Kara Swisher]

He was literally. We're in the car here the entire time. I haven't seen him in a while on ChatGPT. Having a relationship with a chatbot the whole time. And this is what he was doing. He was asking questions like this, I'm in a relationship.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm in a synthetic point relationship, and I just. I'm addicted and I can't. And plus, you're like, you're not doing this.

[Kara Swisher]

No, no, no.

[Scott Galloway]

That was sexist.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Okay. Okay. Anyway, flight cancellations. Mine was three hours late, actually, across the U.S. could rise 15% or even 20% if the government shutdown continues. The FAA started off by cutting around 3% of flights at select airports, including mine. We're taping this Saturday. By the time it airs, that number could be up to 10%. Here's what do you think of this? What's going on? It's bad for everybody. Business, tourism. I thought I almost wouldn't make it here.

[Scott Galloway]

It feels as if Somebody has asked ChatGPT that how could we most elegantly reduce the prosperity of Americans? Because we generally think of innovation as things that can capture economic value. So we think about E commerce or search or social, because a small number of companies were able to sequester the value through IP or distribution and capture value for a small number of companies. But if you look at the most impressive innovations in history that really change things, they're typically things where we're the winners. And that is no small group of entities called a Delaware corporation are able to skim massive value. So it's consumers and the public that really are the big winners. And some of those things are, I believe the greatest innovation in history is the Western nation middle class. Longer story, but close up, there would be vaccines. And by the way, if you don't Think vaccines are the biggest innovation in history. Your head's up your ass and I can't save you.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

But literally tens of millions of kids every year get to be adults because of vaccines. But no one company has really been able to sequester and capture shareholder value. Another example would be the PC. Think about just the. You were basically able to put a $30 million supercomputer from 1970 on everyone's desk for about 300 bucks by 1995. And then the third biggest, I would argue, innovation in terms of how it's changed the world, is we're going to be in seven cities in seven days, skirting the surface of the atmosphere at 7:10, the speed of sound for very little cost. Whereas to get across the US just 100 or 150 years ago, we'd begin eating our nieces and nephews.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Who do you think would survive that? You or me? Me.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, it's pretty obvious to me, right? It would pretty be obvious to you. You own the prisoner.

[Kara Swisher]

You would be both gamey and stringy to eat.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I don't think it would be like, how about some Scott with your makers and Ginger? Yeah, if you bit into me, I.

[Kara Swisher]

Would totally kill you and eat you if I needed to. Anyway. Go on, go on. As you say.

[Scott Galloway]

Okay.

[Kara Swisher]

But anyways, I may have to in the United States.

[Scott Galloway]

But if you. First off, I would argue that the administration is trying to threaten people and has conflated coarseness and cruelty with masculinity and leadership and is basically trying to say, we're going to make your life miserable and they're not afraid to. And I wonder, I mean, when you think about airline travel, there's few things that have created more connection, more global commerce. It's just deploying human capital to its best use, whether it's for a few days or over a couple of years. But I think it's amazing. And what's interesting about airline, if you think about the airline industry, again, going back to the notion that as capitalists, we like to think the greatest innovation creates a small number of companies with trillions of dollars in value. What's happened with the airline industry? If you added up the profits of Boeing, Airbus, Bombardier, a Canadian manufacturer. I own a Bombardier plane. That was an incredible douchebag.

[Kara Swisher]

That's why his trip was easy.

[Scott Galloway]

Anyways, by the way, if you buy a plane from Bombardier, you're getting it for 50% off because Canadian taxpayers continue to bail that company out. So thank you. But essentially, if you added up all of the profits and losses of all the airlines in history, all the jet manufacturers in history. This year they're at break even. So there's something around the notion that. And I'm going to bring this toward a timeline.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm waiting for you to land the plane, but go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, this is where Kara says, is there something.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I'm thinking it. There's a big part of the world.

[Scott Galloway]

Is there something resembling a period at the end of this? I wonder if AI is going to be. I'm hoping AI becomes one of these innovations where no small number of companies are able to aggregate trillions of dollars in value. And that is we win. And I think there's some geopolitical concerns here. I think China is going to dump into the market a bunch of inexpensive LLMs to go after the jugular of America or they're sick of fucking with them. But I think that AI could be more like the airline, the PC or the vaccine industry. And that is, it could end up benefiting all of us. But a small number of companies aren't going to be able to sequester that kind of value. I don't know how I got here.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

I don't either.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm like watching this go.

[Scott Galloway]

Anyways, my flight was fine. How was yours? Woo.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm gonna be on his plane tomorrow to Boston. Here's the problem is that this is a. I was thinking that if I miss this flight, given I have to fly commercial as opposed to you, for example, like we have all these people working for us. We have this whole tour going and it just eats into economic vitality. We've sold out. We've sold out everywhere. It's all the people. You come here, you go to dinner, everything that leads to it. And then this idiot who was on, like, I forget what stupid reality show he was on. Sean Duffy is running our transportation department.

[Scott Galloway]

Secretary of Transportation.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, fine, whatever. The idiot, the incompetent moron. And then he just. They're using it as a political pun, which is grotesque. And then from the safety point of view, two planes almost collided in LA today. There's going to be a collision in midair or something terrible is going to happen. And airlines are among the most safe, safe thing to do in general compared to almost any other transportation, which is.

[Scott Galloway]

There was a real visionary innovation around the faa and that is, I mean, if you think about from Kitty Hawk to a man landing on the moon, I think it was 70 or 80 years. I mean, just the innovation there has been incredible. But what was really visionary about the airline or the air transportation industry is. They said it feels very unnatural. I don't know how many of you are like this, but out of the blue I started getting on planes and I think why am I sweating and feel like I'm going to die? And I realized that I had anxiety. It was the first time I noticed I was getting old and suffering from depression and anxiety. Was on a plane when I started freaking out and when I did some research on it. It is not natural. Our species is not used to skirting along the surface of the atmosphere at 500 miles an hour. So every, you know, 300,000 years of instinct says to you, get the fuck to the ground. This is not a good idea. And so it is a very anxious process. It's much more anxious than going at 0.1 the speed of sound on the ground in a four wheeled vehicle. You just get anxious and compliant. And the vision of the FAA and different regulatory bodies around the world is related to transportation, air transportation. And said, whereas we're making auto safety One Sigma, we're going to make planes Four Sigma. I love aviation. I invest in aviation companies and they're generally speaking really shitty businesses. Because the cost and time to get FAA certification is so intense. Because they decided early on we are going to make this the safest form of travel. Because you naturally just feel so unsafe in this thing. If you knew as many people who had been hurt on an airliner as you knew people who had been hurt in an auto accident, you'd never get on an Air Canada flight. You'd be like, no, I think I'll just take the Greyhound or what I used to call the dog, you'll take a bus. But it was visionary because now most of us, while anxious, get on a plane because we see those stats that the most dangerous part of your airline travel is the ride to the airport. So it was somewhat visionary.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it is. And of course we're blowing it. As always, we're blowing it with this story stupid thing. Because people become. There's lots of statistics showing people are now cutting flights. We're going to Thanksgiving and Christmas. The economic toll will be gigantic on this whole thing. And so.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it's almost as if we were so fucking stupid we'd impose tariffs.

[Kara Swisher]

Right? Exactly. We'll get to that. We'll get to that in a minute. But one of the other things the United States is these snap food benefits. Last week we talked about which we correctly predicted that Elon Musk would get his trillion dollar pay Package, which he's not gonna get until he meets all kinds of criteria. But it wasn't related, but it had the juxtaposition. With these SNAP food benefits, the Supreme Court is letting the Trump administration continue to hold back full benefits. That's actually a very smart move by Judge Jackson, who's a liberal justice. Cause it goes down to the circuit court, who will probably quickly force him to do so. And not that the Supreme Court, she wanted them to make the decision because it's a more liberal court than the Supreme Court. So actually it was a smart move on her part. So Judge Jackson currently is in charge of the emergency decision. She sent the appeal back to the First Circuit Court of Appeals, can handle the matter quicker. Will probably decide against President Trump and his people who want to stop children from eating food. And one of the things that's happening is you have these juxtapositions of very wealthy people, largely tech people and children, and people who are desperate for food. And of course, there's all this misinformation online about the use of snap that you can buy all manner of things which you can't get.

[Scott Galloway]

Hair extensions.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, hair, whatever. It's quite racist in general. But again, another. Another bad black eye on the United States. We're going to get to tariffs in a minute.

[Scott Galloway]

But it really does reveal the ugly side of the United States. And that is. My dad used to say that America is a terrible place to be stupid. And I think that was a harsh, unfair way of saying America is a terrible place to be unfortunate. And capitalism at its core does believe in winners and losers. That we create an incentive system where people who work hard are talented and also, quite frankly, really lucky can have an extraordinary life. And quite frankly, the people who aren't as lucky or as talented don't have as nice a life. That is a basic trade off that we opt for in a capitalist society. But when the net gets so low that people just massively, just hit the ground, it reveals something ugly about a culture, especially when it's been recognized. The kind of prosperity that America has.

[Kara Swisher]

This is prosperity. This is astonishing that we're allowing kids to be starving in the United States.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, where I was headed with this was that a budget and fiscal priorities on behalf of voters reveals a nation's character. And this is America's character right now. And that is somewhere about 22% of America's population is under the age of 18. But 40% of SNAP recipients are kids. So we have decided to over index in the wealthiest nation in the world, the number of kids who go hungry, that is a really poor reflection on our values, because effectively, what's happened in the United States is people. My generation really, Kara's generation, because she's much older than me, but I am.

[Kara Swisher]

Not much older than you.

[Scott Galloway]

Essentially, old people have figured out a way in the US to vote themselves more money. The D in democracy is working too well, and as old people vote. So as a result, we are now spending more. You know, those massed ice, like, weird secret police force. We're now spending more money on ICE in the United States than we're spending on children. So your budget reflects your values. And I think this is bringing to light some very ugly things about America that we have decided we're no longer capitalism believing in winners and losers. We're about the Hunger Games, where if you win, it's a life you couldn't have never imagined, but for everybody else, you die a pretty slow, ugly death.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it's a really. We'll see how it goes. I don't think it's a particularly good look for. Go ahead. You can. I think it will have implications. I think between the ICE raids and the cruelty of them and SNAP benefits and the juxtaposition between Trump tweeting 17 photos of the Lincoln bathroom, which has a lot of marble now, and the Oval Office, which I don't even understand what's happening in that Oval Office. So much gold is happening there. And then this ridiculous ballroom, all of it together, is, I think, an indictment on the Trump administration. And it looks like I'm waiting for three spirits to visit him on Christmas this year. That's my feeling. That's what's happened to Marjorie Taylor Greene, in case you're interested.

[Scott Galloway]

So.

[Kara Swisher]

We don't know what to think of that. I think it's a scam. We all think it's a scam. We know it, but we're here for it. We're fine as long as she's the best. She is the. We were talking about. There was this poll recently of who was the leading. Who was the Democrat, and it came up. No one. You know, it was 17%. No one. But I feel like it's. Marjorie Taylor Greene is the leader of the Democratic Party at this point, don't you think?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, there they did some analysis where they tried to figure out. So Trump's popularity has really taken a dive, and they tried to suss out what. Yeah, yay.

[Kara Swisher]

Suss it out.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, yeah, they figured out he's a mendacious fuck, and they think A bunch of. There's some academic research now saying that the one thing that they think has had the greatest impact on his popularity has been the visual image of them tearing down the East Wing. And we are a highly visual species, so it's not these. These visual metaphors are incredibly cool.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, the ice people, there's a lot.

[Scott Galloway]

Of visuals now, but they say that image of Ukraine tearing down the East Wing has somehow connoted or inspired a visceral reaction.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. And what he's gonna put in place.

[Scott Galloway]

From the American public.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, I don't know what the next president's gonna do.

[Scott Galloway]

Presumably, you know what it's gonna look like. It's gonna look like the best whorehouse in Iraq.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Can you imagine going, ugh. By the way, the East Wing wasn't all that. But that's okay. They shouldn't have torn it down. They should have renovated. That's what I felt. So we're going to go on a quick break and when we come back, we're going to talk about the U.S. canada trade war, which won't be awkward at all.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Support for the show comes from Odoo. Running a business is hard enough and you don't need to make it harder. With a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other. One for sales, another for inventory, a separate one for accounting.

[Scott Galloway]

Before you know it, you find yourself.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Drowning in software and processes instead of focusing on what what matters. Growing your business. This is where Odoo comes in. It's the only business software you'll ever need. Odoo is an all in one, fully integrated platform that handles everything. That means CRM, accounting, inventory, e commerce, HR and more. No more app overload, no more juggling logins. Just one seamless system that makes work easier. And the best part is that Odoo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. It's built to grow with your business, whether you're just starting out or you're already scaling up. Plus, it's easy to use, customizable and designed to streamline every process. It's time to put the clutter aside and focus on what really matters running your business. Thousands of businesses have made the switch, so why not you try Odoo for [e-mail] that's o d o o.com.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

Support for this show comes from Upwork. So you started a business, but you didn't expect to become the head of everything. Now you're doing marketing, customer service and it. With no staff at some point, doing it all becomes the reason nothing gets done. Stop doing everything. Instead of spending weeks sorting through random resumes, Upwork Business plus sends a curated shortlist of expert talent to your inbox in hours. These are trusted, top rated freelancers vetted for skills and reliability. And with Upwork Business plus, you can get instant access to the top 1% of talent on Upwork in marketing, design, AI and more, all ready to jump in and take work off your plate. Upwork Business plus can take the hassle out of hiring and the pressure off your team. That way you can stop doing everything and instead focus on scaling while the pros at upwork can handle the rest. Right now, when you spend $1,000 on Upwork Business plus, you get $500 in credit. Go to Upwork.comSave now and claim the offer before December 31, 2025. Again, that's Upwork.comSave. scale smarter. With top talent and $500 in credit, terms and conditions apply.

[Kara Swisher]

Scott, we're back recording live from Toronto. Hello, Toronto.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, my God.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Scott has remained dressed this entire time.

[Scott Galloway]

It's early in the program.

[Kara Swisher]

He has so much respect for your Canadians.

[Scott Galloway]

It's early in the program in Austin.

[Kara Swisher]

The shirt came off immediately.

[Scott Galloway]

I get the sense the ladies want a little dessert.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, they don't. Little dessert.

[Scott Galloway]

That's right. No, surrender to the dog.

[Kara Swisher]

They do not want a little dessert. What kind of dessert would you be? I'm thinking chocolate pudding or. No, vanilla pudding. Excuse me. I'm sorry.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm a tall drink of limoncello.

[Kara Swisher]

Limoncello?

[Scott Galloway]

Like lemonade? Like a tall drink of lemonade.

[Kara Swisher]

I know what limoncello is.

[Scott Galloway]

All right, move on.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. I'm trying to think of what dessert you are. I'll think about that later. Anyway, we're back, as I said, recording live from Francesca. So it's a great time to talk about trade tensions between the US And Canada. Elbows up. Since President Trump took off. We're paying attention. Since President Trump took office, the US has imposed sweeping tariffs on Canadian imports. Many Canadian goods face up to 35% tariffs, and steel and aluminum face rates of 15%. After four decades of close economic partnership, Prime Minister Mark Carney is saying it's time to date other people. He's looking to double exports with countries other than the U.S. within the next 10 years. His government's new budget proposes spending 280 billion Canadian. That's 200 billion U.S. over the next five years to help offset the effects of the U.S. s trade war, attract investment, increase defense spending by the way, Carney is two seats away from a majority government. A Conservative MP defected to the Liberals is doing rather well. And of course there was the Doug Ford ad, which angered President Trump, which I wasn't seeing it coming from Doug Ford, I'll be honest with you. But I'm also down for that. So talk about what's going on here, because that of course incensed Trump. And we're sorry about the World Series, by the way. Not really, no. I'm from California. Too bad.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

Sorry.

[Scott Galloway]

But I grew up in LA and I was rooting for a. Wait for the Blue Jays.

[Kara Swisher]

Were you?

[Scott Galloway]

Were you?

[Kara Swisher]

You are such a suck up to Canada.

[Scott Galloway]

True. You are. Okay, I tweeted about it.

[Kara Swisher]

That's cause you were conceived here. So talk a little bit about the tariffs because it's a really difficult situation. And of course he continues to say, you do not want to be the 51st state, I assume. Thank you. But he keeps talking about it. It's demented, obviously that's a waste of time. But talk a little bit about where.

[Scott Galloway]

The tariffs are, because by the way, we'd like it. We're progressives, we'd win every Democratic house. Can you imagine what would happen if Canada became the first 51st state? We'd be so fucking liberal, it'd be out of control.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it's true.

[Scott Galloway]

Anyways, so just a little bit of context. We have the strongest alliance in the world. Churchill said the only thing worse than fighting with your allies or fighting with your allies is fighting without your allies. And I think America right now is taking for granted a lot of things. We're taking for granted the faa, we're taking for granted Veterans affairs, we are taking granted competence in the administration and across all of our great public sector employees. But we're also, quite frankly, frankly, taking for granted our friends. Canada has the largest undefended border in the world with the US that says something. It would cost us somewhere between 20 and 50 billion dollars a year if either side decided to militarize their border. But we don't, because we trust and we like each other. Canada went to World War I, a colony, came back a nation. On a per capita basis, they lost eight times as many people as America won. They were actually went to World War II or entered World War II before we did, they were in Afghanistan with us. So this has been this unbelievably prosperous relationship where in the words of Animal House, quite frankly, you fucked up. You trusted us. And that is about somewhere between 60 and 70% of exports from Canada going to the U.S. it's about 17% of ours. That's a bit misleading because of the exports that come into the US from Canada. They're generally low margin products. They're oil, petroleum, lumber, and they're in companies that trade at a PE multiple of about 20. Whereas the products that we import or export into Canada are more like automobiles, electronics, iPhones, pharmaceuticals that have double or triple the operating margins. And usually our revenues in a company that trade at about a multiple of 20 to 30. So for every dollar of exports that we push into Canada, we recognize about three times the shareholder value. So trade, if you will, between the US and Canada is asymmetric. And that is for every dollar we push into you that you buy, versus every dollar you push into us, we get triple the amount of shareholder value. So if anyone has been taken advantage of over the last 20 or 30 years, it's been Canadians. We benefit more from this trade than you do. But we've decided. We've decided. And this is what is just so sclerotic and stupid, economically stupid, about what we're doing. We've decided because we're. It's like going through an angry divorce. And one partner's much wealthier than the other and has said, well, I'm going to damage myself more, but because I have so much more money, it's going to hurt you more. So it's not only irrational, the bottom line is it's just, for lack of a better term, it's just unkind. And what you're seeing is Carney, by the way, I don't know if you know this. I have another podcast called Prof. G.

[Kara Swisher]

No, I haven't heard of it.

[Scott Galloway]

My most viewed podcast with this was this guy who reached out to me, his office, and said, we want to come on your podcast. And it was Mark Carney. And I had no idea who the guy was. This was.

[Kara Swisher]

He had no idea who the guy was.

[Scott Galloway]

I didn't. I'd never heard of the guy.

[Kara Swisher]

He's the Prime Minister of Canada.

[Scott Galloway]

No, no, no. This was during the election. That's why I called him. And he came on and by. It's like 70 minutes later. I'm like, hold me that guy. I'm like, dad, dad. Seriously, that's the dad I want.

[Kara Swisher]

Wait, wait, you didn't have those feelings for Justin Trudeau?

[Scott Galloway]

Justin's more like, I'd like to roll and pick up chicks with Justin. Justin's like, that seems to be his.

[Kara Swisher]

Job right now with him.

[Scott Galloway]

I met him in person like three Days ago. And I'm like, jesus Christ, look at this guy's skin. And he's beautiful. He looks like he's in a fucking boy band. He doesn't look like. Anyway, where were we? Bring me back Mark Carney.

[Kara Swisher]

What do you think of him?

[Scott Galloway]

Anyways, so what are these leaders doing? Trump and the trade wars have absolutely accomplished what he was hoping to accomplish. They've inspired a massive flurry of deal making. That's the good news. The bad news is it has nothing to do with us. So essentially every world leader is on a global tour trying to figure out new supply chain and new alliances that don't include America. And the unfortunate thing about this is that if and when Trump is out of office in 28, it's going to take us a decade and at a minimum to repair these trade alliances. Because once you establish alliances with other nations for your lumber and for your parts and for your whatever it might be, your petroleum, your oil, whatever it might be, you're not going to say, I'm sorry, girlfriend, we can't trust you the next time some weirdo comes into office. When Covid hit, I was on the board of a company called Urban Outfitters, an apparel company. And we recognized that 70 or 80% of our tops were coming from a 10 mile radius of Shenzhen that basically got shut down. And we said, okay, never again. We can't be this. Supply chains were maximized for no slack and just pure efficiency, which made us vulnerable to a supply chain shock. What Canada is going through is sort of a self imposed own goal. Covid from America, where they're going to diversify their supply chain and never put themselves in a position again where they need to trust this meth lab that they have an apartment on top of.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

Yeah.

[Kara Swisher]

So one of the things that actually your point about it being a good thing for Canada? I think absolutely. Because it creates a situation where you have to be one of the issues around Canada. I'm sorry to insult BlackBerry because when I had my baby, I was holding a BlackBerry in the delivery room in my hand because I was texting with someone at the time.

[Scott Galloway]

Wait, so you actually birred the child?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I did. You know that.

[Scott Galloway]

Okay, Louis.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, my God.

[Scott Galloway]

Don't say anything.

[Kara Swisher]

You need to invest. You need to invest in our relationship. He's coming tomorrow to the Boston. Louis.

[Scott Galloway]

Louis. Oh, great.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. I actually had him. I had a cesarean scar. Do you want to see it right now?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, God, no.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, good. All right. But now I'm getting back anyway. I love BlackBerry but one of the innovate, the. A lot of the innovations in technology didn't happen here as much as it should have because of the dependencies on the United States. And it's a good thing to get out from under a dependency because with the us, BlackBerry was absolutely out front in terms of innovation, in terms of usage. But as you know, it got run over. It got run over by Apple and Google and everything else. And that to me was. And again, Waterloo's an astonishing technology school. Did you know about Waterloo?

[Scott Galloway]

A little bit, yeah.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, you didn't. So one of the things that I think is interesting is how can you revive innovation in places like Canada and not rely. Because the reliance on. I was looking at a list of American, the most valued companies in the world, and they're all US companies, whether it's Nvidia or Apple or Meta or Alphabet. And it's really important to establish and not just to support them, to really think about innovation within each of your countries and to get off the relationship with the US may not be the worst thing for most countries in the world, given how repugnant we are at this moment, but also because it's important, because I think of BlackBerry, they dominate it. They dominated the early technology era of mobile computing and then absolutely didn't.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, look, this is the question I get most. I live in London right now and it's like, why can't we, you know, one company. So I think Nvidia right now is worth more than the Canadian GDP. Is that right? Yeah, it's worth 5 trillion, I think Canadian. Anyways, the bottom line is you don't command the space you occupy in terms of technology. There's just no getting around it. And we can talk about BlackBerry and root for a company that's been irrelevant for 10 years, but.

[Audience Member 2]

True.

[Scott Galloway]

But you got great universities, you got a great culture. I think there's something to the. I mean, I hate to admit this, but the ready, fire, aim, regulatory environment in the US does create a lot of fast movements, opportunities. In addition, I would describe the benefit of the US as being kind of comes down to one word, and that is risk. So people, you know, when I describe. I don't know if this is true of Canada because 50% of the people living in Toronto were born in other countries. But when you describe, when people, when I'm in the UK say, why are you guys doing so much better than us? I was like, well, you're the ones that decided to stay. And so, for example, what you need is, quite frankly, you need 10 or 20 Shopifys. Because what happens is a company starts, it gets huge. They have huge liquidity events. The people who started these companies decide to stay there because they collect mates and dogs. And then they start a VC firm and start salting the environment with more and more venture. In addition, and this is unfortunate, but the environment in the US where there's more upside because of lower tax rates on the wealthy, we have a very strange tax system. It's progressive, right? Until you get to about the 99th percentile. And then once you get to the 99th percentile, it plummets. So the tax rate on someone in the 99th percentile, if you're living in a blue state, might be 52 points. The tax rate on the 25 wealthiest families in America is 6%. And the superpower of Americans is their optimism. But it's also the Achilles heel, because all of us in America think our kid is in the top 1%. And I can prove to every one of us 99% of our children are not in the top 1%. But what it create, and then we have a very low safety net. So what it creates is an incentive system where people are encouraged to take more risk because there's just so much more upside. But there's gotta be something else, and I'm not sure entirely sure what it is. Why, you know, when you get to the Canadian border, quite frankly, those unicorns somewhat stop. And the honest answer, I don't have an answer for.

[Kara Swisher]

That's an opportunity, but we're gonna move on. But it's really. It's just an interesting time. I think ultimately Trump Taco, you know, he will taco the thing out. Trump always chickens out. And so at some point, he'll repair those relationships, although he has to wake up first. Anyway, we're gonna. He's been sleeping a lot lately in meetings. He just did yesterday when that guy fainted, the Ozempic guy fainted. Anyway, we're gonna go on a quick break. When we come back, we're gonna talk about something New York City has in common with Toronto, a progressive mayor.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Support for the show comes from Odoo. Running a business is hard enough, and you don't need to make it harder. With a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other. One for sales, another for inventory, a separate one for accounting.

[Scott Galloway]

Before you know it, you find yourself.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Drowning in software and processes instead of focusing on what matters. Growing your business. This is where Odoo comes in. It's the only business software you'll ever need. Odoo is an all in one fully integrated platform that handles everything. That means CRM, accounting, inventory, E commerce, HR and more. No more app overload, no more juggling logins. Just one seamless system that makes work easier. And the best part is that Odoo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. It's built to grow with your business, whether you're just starting out or you're already scaling up. Plus, it's easy to use, customizable and designed to streamline every process. It's time to put the clutter aside and focus on what really matters running your business. Thousands of businesses have made the switch, so. So why not you try Odoo for [e-mail] that's o d o o dot com.

[Kara Swisher]

So let me get this straight. Your company has data here, there and everywhere, but your AI can't use the data because it's here, there and everywhere? Seems like something's missing. Every business has unique data. IBM helps your AI access your data wherever it lives. To change how you do business, let's create smarter business. IBM. Scott, we're back recording live from Toronto.

[Scott Galloway]

Nice. We love it here. What? How much do we love it here?

[Kara Swisher]

I do. I know we're moving here.

[Scott Galloway]

Another 20 years of global warming, this is going to be the greatest city in the world.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it's going to be great. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Seriously.

[Kara Swisher]

So back in the US we had one local election that transfixed the whole country. The New York City mayoral election. Toronto's mayor, Olivia Chao, is a progressive who campaigned on affordability issues when she ran in 2023. Like a certain newly elected mayor, her advice to him in a recent interview, she was talking about the issue that defines affordability is housing. Not so much. Free buses. I just want to ask you a question. You've got a thing from. How do we pronounce it? Mamdani.

[Scott Galloway]

There's no thing for him. You have a thing for him so you can pander to your Afghanistan liberals.

[Kara Swisher]

No, no. Here's what I think. I want to ask you this question, okay? You're on this incredible book tour and Scott's book is number one on Amazon right now. Notes on being a man. I'm going to throw. Throw you a bone there because it's worthwhile to be that way. But here is a man who is the description of the men you're talking about, right? Who is respectful, who's community oriented, who has gone around the city and met people, et cetera, et cetera, et Cetera. I'm just curious.

[Scott Galloway]

A rich kid living in a rent controlled apartment.

[Kara Swisher]

No, it's not. No, listen, Cuomo. Cuomo was in a rent stabilized apartment too before. I find it interesting. But these are the kind of people you want to men to be like or look up to or not. You don't think so?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, honestly, I hadn't run the macho test on Mondavi. I think he's a super impressive young man. I think he's an incredible candidate. I think the Democrats can learn a lot for him. I thought he ran a great campaign. He's bold, he takes risks, he's smart. And I want to be clear. We talk about this a lot. I think once someone is elected, you have an obligation as a citizen to rally behind them and hope for their success and support them and let them prove you wrong. Voting. When you go to a voting booth, we're not in a suicide pact. You know, one of the things I keep saying about. I've been thinking a lot about, quote unquote, the mating crisis, because I wrote this book on young men. And another, yet another reason why young people aren't hooking up is because women are becoming slightly more progressive and men are becoming much more conservative and women don't want it. The moment a dude starts talking about his conservative values, she's like, okay, I'm out. And I literally try to think. Can you think of anyone when you were dating, when you were single? Well, maybe you did.

[Kara Swisher]

I've never been single.

[Scott Galloway]

You've never been single? No, I've been single most of my life anyways.

[Kara Swisher]

A month. I was single for a month.

[Scott Galloway]

Single for a month.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, you know, I'm beachfront property in Malibu. Among lesbians at least. Go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, I'm the part of the beach that washed away and it's gone forever anyways. But I can't remember.

[Kara Swisher]

You're the Inland Empire, I guess.

[Scott Galloway]

I can't remember what the political leanings were. And it's yet another reason why people are writing each other off. But to your point, as I think about it, I think of masculinity as being three things. Provider. I think every man at the outset of his career should assume that at some point he needs to take economic responsibility for his household. And sometimes that means getting out of the way and being more supportive of your partner who's better at that money thing. But I don't think it's a bad idea to start out saying I'm going to have to be economically viable in a capitalist society that disproportionately evaluates men. And my self esteem is largely based on my economic viability. I'm not saying that's the way the world should be, but it's the way the world is too. Once you have that prosperity, you move to protector. I think this is the part of the program that the men we're supposed to look up to for masculinity. Specifically the richest man in the world and the President have totally missed the whole protector part of masculinity. And then three, Procreation. I think sex and being horny and wanting to have sex makes you a better man. Makes you want to dress better, smell better, have a kindness, practice, be resilient, make an approach while expressing romantic interest and making someone feel safe. Stop demonizing sexual desire. It's an amazing thing. It makes men better men. Mamdani.

[Kara Swisher]

Mamdani. You got it. Yeah. You got it.

[Scott Galloway]

Stop it. Stop shaming me. I get him, right? I think he's a great role model for. As I think about it, I think he's a great role model for young men. He takes risks. I think he's happily married. He seems to be talking about protecting other people. So as I'm thinking about this real time. Yeah, I think he's a great. What? Best of luck to him.

[Kara Swisher]

In any case.

[Scott Galloway]

What do you want?

[Kara Swisher]

In any case, I think he's a great role model. And you know, I'd even fuck him. So would you, so. But you would. That hair. Come on.

[Scott Galloway]

A few beers, you never know. I'm done.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Okay.

[Scott Galloway]

I mean.

[Kara Swisher]

All right. And I know you hate. Very quickly we have two more things and then we'll get to questions from the audience. I know you hate the idea of a state run grocery stores, but here in Canada, most provinces have government run liquor stores. Some states in the United States have them. That's okay though, right?

[Scott Galloway]

No, it was a bad idea here and it was a bad idea there. When Alberta got rid of their government owned liquor stores, the number of liquor stores tripled, the number of employment tripled, and the number of products available to consumers was up Eightfold. That's nothing but a transfer of wealth from consumers to the government for shitty service. There are certain things the government does really well. They're really good at taking care of our national parks. They're really good at collecting taxes. They're really good at the Navy. They're really good at the dmv. Someone from the DMV should not be picking out your produce or your alcohol. The private sector does some Things really? Well, one of them is grocery. We do not need food sponsored food lines called government owned grocery stores. Grocery is the last thing that should be nationalized.

[Kara Swisher]

It's the idea of getting better nutrition to poorer people who now can't buy.

[Scott Galloway]

It and give them money. Give them money.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, we are not giving them money because of snapdragons being cut.

[Scott Galloway]

The problem when government gets involved on a lot of this stuff is it creates an infrastructure where the majority of the money does not end up in the pockets that you're supposedly helping. If you want to get more food or make food more affordable for people, what you do is you give them money, more money in their pockets. $25 an hour minimum wage. If he is proposing, which I'm a huge fan of, and then let them force Trader Joe's, Kroger's, Loblaws or whatever you call it up here to compete against each other and battle it out in this full body contact violence called the private sector.

[Kara Swisher]

All right, we will talk to him. I see your point, but I appreciate you acknowledging he's a good role model for men.

[Scott Galloway]

I think he is a good role model. I'm glad you pointed that out.

[Kara Swisher]

Last thing, Tourism is down between the US And Canada. Last year Canada was the top source of international tourists to the U.S. generating over 20 billion in spending and supporting 140,000American jobs. In the first half of this year, U.S. saw a 25% drop in Canadian. We miss you Canadian visitors. This summer, for the second time in nearly 20 years, more US residents travel to Canada, largely escaping, than Canadians traveling to the U.S. why don't you think they want to come see us? Scott.

[Scott Galloway]

It'S so funny. Especially these tariffs are going to reinvigorate the manufacturing sector. But here's the problem. Nobody wants to work in the manufacturing sector. You don't get to take your dog to work on the shop floor. And 11% of the American public works in manufacturing. Yet 80% of Americans think we need more manufacturing. We have this fetish of around manufacturing. And the reality is over time, America's been very good at arbitraging out of low wage jobs into more service, more information, more innovation industry. 12% of American public is employed in the tourist industry. So our obsession with trying to falsely, sclerotically, idiotically prop up the manufacturing sector with quote unquote tariffs is taking down faster an industry which is higher margin and employs more people called the tourist sector. When you come to Disneyland, we get much more money, much more margin, support much more jobs than if we tariff your shit such that our lumber's more competitive. This again? If you were. Look, it's as if the Trump administration said to ChatGPT, how can I elegantly reduce the prosperity of Americans inch by inch and make it almost irreversible for all of us.

[Kara Swisher]

It's not that elegant. It's not elegant at all. But what could bring Canadians back to us?

[Scott Galloway]

What could bring Canadians back?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, what could we do?

[Scott Galloway]

Fuck a new president. I mean.

[Kara Swisher]

So let me get a prediction from you, because, you know, the World Cup. The World Cup. Are you coming for the World Cup? No, they're not coming for the World Cup. Are you coming for the World Cup?

[Scott Galloway]

I'm coming to Vancouver. There's two cities. Two cities or three cities in Canada? Toronto, Vancouver, and then Montreal.

[Kara Swisher]

There's lots of cities in.

[Scott Galloway]

I used to come every year in June to Canada for tourist reasons. Anyone Want to guess? F1. Montreal. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Hello. European food and hot women. Did I just say that?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. So what could we do? Say Trump leaves.

[Scott Galloway]

Right?

[Kara Swisher]

His tiny minion doesn't win. JD Vance, the most uncharming person in politics that exists.

[Scott Galloway]

Talk about pandering.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, south park has him exactly right. What would the first thing the US should do to get tourists back to the us? Canadian tourists.

[Scott Galloway]

I just. I think all we need to do is make America America again. I just don't. I don't think we need advertising. I don't think we need Disneyland and Niagara on the American border.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, they have Niagara, too, but go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

I just. This. I mean, let's be honest. We're pretty much the same goddamn people. We're fraternal or maternal twins. Right? And the fact that we don't. We just. We love each other so much. We take each other for granted. It's like you wake up in the morning and you're spooning your wife, and you just. You forget how wonderful it is. It just. This is not a Canada and America. Like we're you and you're us. And the thought that we even have this kind.

[Kara Swisher]

No, no, they don't think so. They don't want to be spooned by you, Scott, and neither do I. But that's another issue.

[Scott Galloway]

This is really interesting, though, because we Americans are so narcissistic.

[Kara Swisher]

That's correct.

[Scott Galloway]

That we agree with you.

[Kara Swisher]

Scott was shocked by that. I was not.

[Scott Galloway]

Americans feel much better about Canadians right now than Canadians feel about Americans.

[Kara Swisher]

Yep. So, Scott, they hate us. They really hate us.

[Scott Galloway]

So I don't. I don't Think there's anything we can do other than what I would call just going back to a sense of normalcy and someone who doesn't declare war on his friends?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes. I would say the one thing we could say is we're so sorry. We are so sorry. That's what I see. That's how you do it.

[Scott Galloway]

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

I tell you, I was conceived here.

[Kara Swisher]

You were surprised by that. They don't like us. I'm just telling you. Anyway, we're going to finish up and then we're going to get to questions from the audience.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Support for the show comes from Odoo. Running a business is hard enough and you don't need to make it harder. With a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other. One for sales, another for inventory, a separate one for accounting.

[Scott Galloway]

Before you know it, you find yourself.

[Sponsor Announcer]

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Kara Swisher]

Okay. All right, so we're gonna. Scott in his head is going love me Canada. It's gonna be all night tonight with us discussing this. So let's get some questions from the audience. Where are they? They're okay right here. There's a podium here. So we would love any questions you have. There is no question too rude. And Scott made it through the entire show without a dick joke, so you should be happy.

[Audience Member 3]

Thank you so much. We've been watching and we're kind of terrified as to what's happening in America. And we've been watching the dismantling of democracy with the legal systems and the military. And I could go on with 250 things.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Audience Member 3]

There's a lot to say.

[Kara Swisher]

There's a lot these days.

[Audience Member 3]

So my question to you is, what is your suggestion? Because it seems to.

[Scott Galloway]

To be.

[Audience Member 3]

There's a mobilization around Donald Trump and all of his followers. Who are we supposed to follow on the opposite side? What is your suggestion? There needs to be a leader.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, the recent election, something didn't. It didn't. The recent election.

[Audience Member 3]

Absolutely.

[Kara Swisher]

It's not just at the top levels. It was down in the yes. City councils.

[Audience Member 3]

And we're very hopeful that. And I think that says to us that the American people have a voice.

[Scott Galloway]

Right?

[Kara Swisher]

They do.

[Audience Member 3]

But who's leading that voice? Who's gonna take it to the next level? And that's my question to you.

[Kara Swisher]

We don't know right now. You know, we don't know. We don't know who the Democrat. There's a lot of Democratic Party officials. There's other people maybe you've not heard of yet. There's leaders. My whole take on the. Whether you like Mamdani or not is we contain multitudes, is how the Democratic Party should be. Not that we have to agree on socialism or Abby Spanberger in Virginia is much more conservative. Or if you're Jared Paulus in Colorado, the Democratic Party has to say, here's the three things we care about. Affordability, dignity and democracy, or something like that. And I think it's really going to be interesting to see who emerges. But there's some great candidates. It's just a question of the fever of Trump is a fever that the United States has all the time, whether from the Salem witch trials to the McCarthy era to the Civil War. We have fevers that are really ugly and grotesque. And I feel like we're gonna come out of this. And I agree this sad, decrepit, cruel man will be gone, but we'll see. He's got a lot of that. He's got a lot of people who love him. You know, Absolutely. Any quick things.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. But to build on Kara's point, America has been in very dark places before and is actually. It's tested our democracy and the democracy has been damaged in Like a muscle that's damaged, it's grown back stronger. At one point, slave owners controlled our quote, unquote democracy. Right after the Great Depression. There was Henry fucking Ford.

[Kara Swisher]

Fuck that guy. I mean he's dead, but he should be deader.

[Scott Galloway]

Veterans were marching on the Capitol and this guy named, this young general named Douglas MacArthur opened fire on them. We were essentially putting, we were interning people because of their Japanese background in camps. We have been through very dark times and each time we have come back, learn from it and come back stronger. So that's not an excuse to be complacent. But our democracy is being tested. I think a lot of Americans are recognizing that a lot of our blessings we've taken for granted. So I'm hopeful that our democracy, like a muscle, is being tested and it's gonna grow back stronger. We've been through worse before.

[Kara Swisher]

I also believe in young people again, New York Mayoral. You can have all the feelings you want about it. Young people voted and they said what they wanted and they said, we don't want an ass grabbing, terrible Trump lovin Democrat. So we'll see. I believe in young people. That's who I believe in.

[Audience Member 2]

Hello, Scott Guerra, My name is Daniel. I'm here with my wife. It's our first anniversary tomorrow and we both love you.

[Kara Swisher]

Congratulations.

[Audience Member 2]

Thank you. We both love you and wanted to ask. Both of us have worked in advertising. I had an agency that I exited last year and I'm still working as a strategist and consultant. She works in advertising. My question is, and I also teach in post secondary. So my question for you mostly Scott, is are we screwed to work, continue to work in these industries. Should we pivot now? Yeah. What are your thoughts on that?

[Scott Galloway]

It's situational because I'd say if you're over the age of 40 and you have senior level sponsorship and you're doing well and you own relationships, which is always the key in a services industry, I would say ride it out and keep going. If you're younger and thinking, okay, I have some options in other industries, I think you want to get out of the ad supported ecosystem. I think it's going to be a difficult industry. It's better to be good in a growing industry than great in an industry that's flat or declining within your industry. If you decide to stay in it, I would say try and get as close to the relationships with the clients as possible and also try to get good at buying media and creating content for a small screen. The return on investment of your human and your financial capital we inversely correlated to the screen you're creating content for. If you're in the business of big screens movies, that's a shitty business. It's only going to get worse. If you're in the business of a medium sized screen tv, that's a huge business, it's gone flat. But if you're in the business of design and creative for the small screens is champagne and cocaine, my brother.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, there you go, There you go. I think Google and Meta are going to dominate AI advertising and they're going to get, they're going to hold and our country just. Well, there's one case in Virginia right now with Google. They might break it up, but it doesn't matter. They dominate everything in advertising. And he's right. Small screen. All right, last question. Really quick, make it a good one. Hi, I'm Kelly, I'm here with the bummer question. Oh, okay.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

So AI has been the fuel on the fire. That is disinformation.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes. How do we curb or is the horse too far out of the barn.

[Sponsor Announcer 2]

As my mom would say?

[Kara Swisher]

It's not AI. It was here before. By the way. Propaganda has been around since the beginning of time. Let's be clear, it's just been amplified and weaponized in a way. And social media has certainly done its job. So it's not a new thing. I think the question is, now that we have AI here and it's not as protected legally, at least in the United States, as social media is, it's time for our regulators to get very clear about guardrails, beginning with young people in terms of the usage and safety. Let me tell you, my whole book was about how they do not give a fuck how safe you are. They are people who have never felt unsafe a day in their lives, don't care about safety, they don't care about your safety. And so we have to engage as citizens to get our legislators to get a fucking backbone and start to really legislate reasonable guardrails. I'm not talking about innovation killing guardrails. But the fact of the matter is, as Scott said pointed out, the AI boom right now is allowing Trump to. It's kept the stock market up, which is allowing Trump to do all manner of heinous things like that's an after effect. But we have to absolutely get control of the technology industry and pass. We don't have any laws in our country regulating them. We have to start understanding how easy it's going to be to destroy all our democracies. Not Just the US because we're so vulnerable, but everywhere without understanding. There should be reasonable and important legislation around transparency, privacy, usage, safety, all kinds of things. And it's not that hard. We do it with every other industry and it should be done here. This is all I talk about now. And I want to start with young kids because everybody agrees on that, everybody agrees on the safety of children. And so that would be my beginning. Scott, why don't you end it?

[Scott Galloway]

So you're zeroing in on what I think is the most important topic that has the least amount of coverage. And that is we're all like, what's going on with our kids? What's happening to our society? And it's because people don't want to acknowledge and the incumbents want to make sure we're focused on other weapons of mass distraction. But the thing that really ails the west right now is the following. Our economy in the United States is a giant bet on AI. The economy would be flat, the stock market would not be up 16%, it'd be up 0% if it wasn't for the massive run up in these 10 companies related to AI based on incredible expectations. So we've effectively connected the entire global economy. 40% of the S&P is these 10 companies. That represents 20% of global market value. If these companies sneeze, the whole world gets pneumonia. And these companies are in the business of a lot of things, but mostly they're in the business of dividing, polarizing and sequestering people from one another. There is now, unfortunately, the deepest pocketed godlike technology has connected trillions of dollars in shareholder value to separating our children from their parents and each other and making them feel shitty about the flag, each other and democracy. There is now, unfortunately, a profit incentive attached to evolving a new species of asocial, asexual youth. And it is terrible for the species, it's terrible for the economy. It's as if we have connected a profit motive into planning our own extinction. So what do we need to do? No synthetic relationships for anyone under the age of 18. No phones in schools, no social media under the age of 16. And quite frankly, holding these companies to the same account as every other company. We need antitrust, we need fines, and quite frankly, someone needs to do a fucking perp walk.

[Kara Swisher]

Other than that. But you need to get involved. And on that note, we want to thank you. Scott's book is really amazing. It's called Notes on Being a Man.

[Scott Galloway]

Thank you.

[Kara Swisher]

Number one on Amazon right now, is that correct? I think it's going to be. He does, of course, because he's so insecure. He's like, it's going to be two or three on the New York Times bestseller list. It's going to be one. And so I urge everyone to buy it in bulk so that he gets that little moment in the sun that he would adore. But it's a great book and one of the things we'd like to end on. We want to thank, obviously, Canada, but one of the things we always talk about in this era of AI and separation and anxiety and partisanship is you got to get along with people you don't agree with. And obviously Scott and I don't agree on a lot of things, but it's been a real journey. You saw it here right now. I'm correct about Zoron, but it's really important that you have personal relationships in the real world. We talk about tech a lot. We talk about online a lot. But the most significant relationships are with each other and unlikely ones where you have disagreement and challenge each other. And that's the most critical thing to do. We make our money with tech and media, but we really make our money because of a relationship, a personal. Don't you think?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah.

[Kara Swisher]

Anyone he can't stand.

[Scott Galloway]

I think we need to embrace our imperfect allies. Canada, hang with us where you're at.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, please do. Thank you so much. We love and Americans love Canada. We really do. Most Americans do.

[Scott Galloway]

Thank you, Turmeric.

[Kara Swisher]

Thank you, Scott. Read us out.

[Scott Galloway]

Today's show was produced by Lara Naiman, Tony Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Corinne Ross. Ernie and Todd entered this episode. Jim Mackle edited the video. Thanks also to Jabros, Ms. Siervero and Anchalon. Amazing ground support provided by Trish Parneto, Kelly Schwatner, Kalyn lynch and Nico Alvarez. And a big shout out to the Vox experiential team, Tara Riley, Courtney Given, Abby Aronofsky and Caitlin Burla. Nishakura is Vox Media's executive producer of podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media. You can subscribe to the [e-mail] pod we'll be back later this week for another breakdown of all things tech and business.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Support for the show comes from Odoo. Running a business is hard enough and you don't need to make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other. One for sales, another for inventory, a separate one for accounting.

[Scott Galloway]

Before you know it, you find yourself.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Drowning in software and processes instead of focusing on what matters. Growing your business this is where Odoo comes in. It's the only business software you'll ever need. Odoo is an all in one, fully integrated platform that handles everything. That means CRM, accounting, inventory, E commerce, HR and more. No more app overload, no more juggling logins. Just one seamless system that makes work easier. And the best part is that Odoo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. It's built to grow with your business, whether you're just starting out or you're already scaling up. Plus, it's easy to use, customizable and designed to streamline every process. It's time to put the clutter aside and focus on what really matters running your business. Thousands of businesses have made the switch, so why not you try Odoo for [e-mail] that's o d o o.com.

[Audience Member]

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