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- [00:01]
Kara Swisher
Support for Pivot comes from TP Link. When you're looking for a home security system, you don't want to settle. You need the best to protect your home. And TP Link has an entire new set of Tapo 4K security cameras that you can choose from. TP Link can provide you with crystal clear video where every detail pops. And These cameras run 24. 7 with advanced face recognition so you know who's there instantly. No more sifting through endless footage. You get alerts for the people you care about right when it counts. So if you're ready to upgrade your home security, go beyond Clear with all new Tapo 4K security cameras at tp-link.com.
- [00:43]
Scott Galloway
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- [02:06]
Kara Swisher
Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York magazine and the Vox Media podcast network.
- [02:09]
Scott Galloway
I'm Kara Swisher and Donald Trump is definitely on that list, that Epstein list.
- [02:15]
Kara Swisher
But are you.
- [02:16]
Scott Galloway
I think I'm one of the few people that's not. I feel.
- [02:18]
Kara Swisher
I know. I was surprised.
- [02:20]
Scott Galloway
It's. First off, we have to start. We have to change. Rosie o' Donnell should legally change her name to Rosie Epstein.
- [02:27]
Kara Swisher
Yeah.
- [02:27]
Scott Galloway
I have never seen a lamer att attempts to distract people from what is going on. And by the way, I just wanna acknowledge I thought this was gonna be old news and blow over. You were right on this.
- [02:39]
Kara Swisher
Thank you.
- [02:40]
Scott Galloway
I was thinking about it. I was Saying last night to a friend. Last week I was in Ibiza on the most perfect night at Calvin Harris. You know, I like the, like the Pop 40 DJs concert.
- [02:53]
Kara Swisher
Okay.
- [02:54]
Scott Galloway
I had taken X for the first time in 30 years.
- [02:57]
Kara Swisher
What?
- [02:57]
Scott Galloway
And, oh, my God, I like me so much on X. Kara. I really.
- [03:01]
Kara Swisher
Did you think about hugging me? Did you think about me?
- [03:03]
Scott Galloway
I'm trying to think. You did not. You were not front of mind. I mean, when I was on Molly, and I'm like, we should do that. The music sounds amazing. It was a perfect night. And people were coming up to me and telling me how much they love my work and how important my work is. And I'm like, you know, with my pupils that look like frying pans. And that was like one of the best nights I've had in such a long time. And I thought, would I rather have that again or just to be sitting back in my hot girl summer watching Republicans eat themselves alive over this? I gotta be honest, I am so here for this. I think it's fucking amazing.
- [03:40]
Kara Swisher
I agree. Thank you for acknowledging that. I actually. Amanda had the same. You know, a lot of people thought it was distraction, and I'm like, no, no. This is at the heart of what he's. He has. And Amanda did make this point. He has trained them into QAnon, right? They're gonna regret the training into QAnon, which was useful when it was useful. But these people really, truly believe this. And I've spent a lot of time on these networks, so I know it like, you know, when you. When there's like, oh, it's no big deal. I'm like, no, no. This is like, I don't know, in a religion, what's the center of it? It's at the center of this thing. And the pedophile thing is particularly resonant with them. They absolutely believe Hillary Clinton had a basement. They absolutely. Some of them do. They absolutely believe that there's a there cabal that killed Jeffrey Epstein, et cetera, et cetera. So it's one of the structures of his presidency. In a weird way, you couldn't believe it. I don't believe it, but it's true.
- [04:37]
Scott Galloway
But it just. It's so intellectually or morally inconsistent. It's like if that. If Jeffrey Epstein had invited a bunch of migrant workers to his island, we would have nuked it. But as long as it was just pedophiles and this notion that we're shocked that a man found liable of sexual abuse, which is rape, might be on a list of a powerful man inviting people down to an island with underage women. Like that's supposed to be a big shocker.
- [05:06]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, well, actually, let's get to this thing because it's really important. We have other things we're gonna talk about, like tariffs and how Elon is blurring the lines between his businesses. Another thing I think I got right there. But just so you know, where Donald Trump is now, he's doing the wrong thing in dealing with him 100%. When he put that thing out, I was like, no, no, no, no, sir. You have to be with them. Even if you with them, you have to be with him. He says he doesn't like what's happening to his MAGA boys and gals. He's urging them not to waste time on Jeffrey Epstein keeps saying he's dead. He has been throwing his support behind Pam Bondi in a true social post. And also he was at some soccer thing where everybody booed him and he clapped at her. He put his hand up like his thumb up. But this civil war, let me just give people the idea, is really quite something. And many are demanding that Bondi, who they're calling Blondie, which is funny, be fired over this memo that found no evidence of a client list or Epstein being murdered. She's been very explicit about this. The Epstein investigation led to the White House confrontation between Bondi and FBI Deputy Director Dan Bongino, who's been pretty vocal about Epstein cover up claims near as he made his career, he made his podcast career. That was one of the structures of his podcast career. He didn't show up work last Friday. There were rumors, of course, he was leaking all over the place. Clearly, that he insists, but the administration says he's still on the job. I suspect he'll fall into line because that's the kind of guy he is, but who knows? But one of the things that's interesting is the various factionalism. And I'll go through this very quickly. Fox News is calling this a ticking time. Bog and Megyn Kelly, never. Not to weigh in on something grotesque said over the weekend. This could actually cost Trump the midterms. She's against Bondi. I guess Bannon's against Bondi. I guess Elon's against Bondi. Charlie Kirk's against Bondi. Laura Loomer. Anyway, it's really quite something. It's like a weird little civil war now. I think they're gonna fall into line now because I think he's going to put the kibosh on it behind the scenes. But I don't know. What do you think? What do you imagine?
- [07:05]
Scott Galloway
Well, just around perception. I mean, first off, it doesn't even seem that they're that upset about pedophilia. They're that upset about not pursuing a conspiracy theory. And the thing that strikes me is that if someone had counseled him on how to appear to be more guilty, it would have been difficult.
- [07:24]
Kara Swisher
Right.
- [07:25]
Scott Galloway
He immediately gets defensive and says, I can't believe you're not focusing on the tragedy of Texas. Or I'm thinking of canceling ROSIE o' DONNELL Citizen. He could not be acting more guilty. And whoever is coaching him is like, no, don't bring it up. He could have said, this is an important case and the FBI, it's up to the FBI how they want to handle this.
- [07:50]
Kara Swisher
Right. Except that he's made his career on it. That is the thing. He was very much, which is almost suicidal because he's been photographed with him like 67 times. There's videos of him like dancing with his, you know, white man dancing together. He's clearly been down there. He's on the logs. Let me. The only thing I would say is I know a lot of people who went down there, by the way. And, and I've told you I was invited to his house once and I declined because he's a sexual predator. Which I told the PR person. I'm like, no, I'm not going to a sexual predator's house. But one of the things that was, is interesting is a lot of people who went down there, I don't believe necessarily went for sex. I think it was interesting. He was an interesting guy. It was kind of sexy, like to.
- [08:32]
Scott Galloway
A lot of people giving a ton of money away.
- [08:34]
Kara Swisher
Giving a ton of money away. Even Bill Gates, I think he was bored. I don't know what happened with Bill Gates, but I'm just saying there was a lot of like. And a lot of what was really interesting to me. And Melinda Gates talked about this, saying I was not happy with his affiliation. Someone, I think it was Sergey Brin. He and his wife were invited down. They went down and the minute they got off the plane, his wife Anne knew what was up and was like, we're getting the fuck out of here, like kind of thing. And so I think a lot of people went for these things for curiosity, sort of the same way they went to the Diddy parties, I guess. And some of the people went for full on, you know, abuse of minors. That there's, it's weird, but the Fact that they didn't know the people who went that weren't necessarily doing that is grotesque too in a lot of ways.
- [09:19]
Scott Galloway
So it's always the COVID up, not the scandal. And he's handling this exactly incorrectly because all of a sudden he's created a massive cover up of his own manufacturing and all of his just watching them eat their own tail of conspiracy theory when it comes home for you. But let's just. You have a situation. Okay, I'm in St. Barts and a Microsoft billionaire invites me on their yacht. And I go on the yacht. A lot of hot people, great party. I go, I have a good time. I leave. What if it ends up there were underage women on that boat? Did I do my due diligence? It was like I went on this boat. I won't even say who it is. But it wasn't the top, wasn't the founder of Microsoft. It was one of the founders. Yeah, but I didn't do diligence around the personal behavior of this guy or whether he had been convicted of anything or whether there were underage women on the boat. I just went because it sounded like a really good time. Now if, if. And I think there were a lot of people, quite frankly, just caught up in the strafe here. There were a lot of people who should, who deserve scrutiny and to have the reputation ruined or to have legal ramifications. But I think there were probably a shit ton of people like, oh, it's a rich guy who throws great parties and yeah. And he's, he wants to give me a ride to Boston on his plane. He gave a lot of people rides on his plane. I can absolutely see how people get caught up.
- [10:39]
Kara Swisher
The only thing is, it was before he was convicted. There was a lot of rumors about it. I knew them because he was a lot of tech events. And after. I think you have less of an.
- [10:50]
Scott Galloway
Excuse after, after Florida conviction.
- [10:52]
Kara Swisher
How many people knew about that?
- [10:53]
Scott Galloway
But do you think every powerful person has an obligation to conduct a background check on everyone they spend time with?
- [11:00]
Kara Swisher
No, it's just, it's a world that I think people aren't familiar with. And I think you and I are a little bit, I, I'm sort of more peripherally. You go to more of those abuses and things like that. But there is a, like, there is a, like a world where they sort of, you know, swan around just like Jeff Bezos's wedding. There's a world. And one of the things about Epstein, like I was at a dinner he was at with 200 people. And I got attacked by the anti Epstein forces. Like you were part of that. I'm like, literally, I never even met him. Like, I was near him, I guess there was a photo where I was vaguely adjacent to him, but I didn't talk to him or anything else. And it was so. It was really. Some of that happened a lot. He was at like 10 things, as I recall. I think that's where I was where he was. But what was interesting is people that actually then took the next step after his conviction. I'm always like, very bad judgment on your part to do so.
- [11:54]
Scott Galloway
But if he had said, in my younger days, I love to have a good time. I love to be at great parties. This guy seemed like, let's be honest, he was a guy who loved to have a good time. He was giving money away. He invited me to his island. I went. I had a great time. I didn't engage in pedophilia. I didn't have sex with underage minors. But I went. It was a terrible error in judgment and I apologize if he just said that. But the fact that he's trying so hard to create weapons of mass distraction gives people an understandable suspicion that he did more than just go to the fucking island and that it's always the COVID up. It's not the scandal itself.
- [12:33]
Kara Swisher
Can you talk a little bit about the. I think his misjudging of the depth of this mania on the right over this issue.
- [12:40]
Scott Galloway
I didn't see it. Did you see this? I did not see this.
- [12:42]
Kara Swisher
I told you. I said this is not a distraction. This is going to blow up. Because I've listened to these people and I've seen all the online stuff and they really are rabid around this. Look at what happened to Roseanne Barr. Look at what happened to. There's a lot of people who became insane over this topic. A lot, a ton. And even the average person who isn't right. I've noticed a lot of people putting up like, well, I wasn't into the Epstein conspiracies, but now I am. You know what I mean? Like, regular people are now like, what was he doing there? And so he's dragging in reasonable people, I guess, who would mostly just say, ugh, this is just ridiculous. I'm not a conspiracy theorist.
- [13:23]
Scott Galloway
Yeah. I don't. I find the whole thing a lesson in karma when you foment a conspiracy theory. And then they came for me, this is the ultimate example of that. Right.
- [13:37]
Kara Swisher
What do you think's gonna happen next?
- [13:38]
Scott Galloway
Every time I Think that Republicans are going to stand up for not having Medicaid stripped away from the people who elected them? Or that someone who's convicted by a jury of his peers, including Republicans, on that, of all 34 counts, or whatever it is, I think this is the final straw. Or I get hopeful that Lisa Murkowski or Susan Collins actually pretend to care. I think you're right. I think they're all gonna eventually fall in line. I think they're all gonna wring their hands. The only thing is Pam Bondi, I'm curious, she might be the blood offering here.
- [14:12]
Kara Swisher
No, no. I think Dan Bongino is. I think he can't give in to this. He can't. Like, he might. That's the thing. Cause he's so desperate for attention and love from these people, that's the only thing he could do, is give Bondi up in that regard. By the way, she's terrible. But, you know, like, is it like a list? Wouldn't you want to stack, rank the idiots? I think what it shows is how quickly this is all gonna devolve when Donald Trump is out of the picture. I think this is their. I think this. We are seeing their ass right now.
- [14:44]
Scott Galloway
And when you say devolve, what do you mean?
- [14:46]
Kara Swisher
Meaning they don't. None of them. They're so different. Like, there was always a problem in the left and the center in Dem politics. There is that, right? There's the centrist people who thinks the left is too left. There's a left who thinks the centrists don't understand that someone like Mon Domini is the future. That is normal, right? That is a normal political party, like the Tea Party and the more institutionalists in the former Republican Party. But this group, they are so on opposite sides of everything. And not just opposite sides. People who are on the same side on one thing are on opposite sides on the other stuff. And so the fracturing of this Republican Party that Trump has built once he is gone in some fashion is going to be spectacular. Because you think JD Fucking Vance is gonna hold this together? You think Don Jr. No. None of these people have the power of Trump to hold this stuff together. And even he is showing signs of not being able to, whether it's age or misjudgment or something like that. But I just think it's going to be a spectacular. You're seeing the signs of what's going to happen next. I mean, I think you are. Anyway, speaking of a mess, Tariff Palooza is continuing. He's saying the US will impose very severe tariffs on Russia if there's no peace deal with Ukraine in the next 50 days. I'm sure Putin is quaking in his boots. He's also threatened to hit EU and New Mexico, two of America's largest trading partners with 30% tariffs starting Aug. 1. And Canada also back in the crosshairs. In a letter to Prime Minister Mark Carney, Trump said Canadian goods would face 35% tariffs starting next month. Trump cited concerns about fentanyl coming across the border again as a justification the ones from Brazil because he didn't like a case against Bolsonaro. Talk a little bit about the Russian blend. I mean this is just keeps going and the markets have not gotten yippee as before. Some people including Jamie Dimon and others think it's a problem that the markets aren't paying attention to this so thoughts?
- [16:48]
Scott Galloway
I think literally the like I said the market just continues to yawn and doesn't none of these things have come through EOS backs down. The market seems to be rerouting around it. The companies that are driving the NASDAQ and the S and P are essentially global companies now that don't appear to be subject to this tariffs. Right. AI and Meta and Microsoft to a certain extent so far.
- [17:12]
Kara Swisher
Well except for copper, the 50% tariff on copper which including defense, electricity and tech, US imports over 40% of its copper and switching to domestic supplies could take up to a decade. Industry groups are warning they could slow AI data center growth. They have an event tomorrow in Pennsylvania.
- [17:29]
Scott Galloway
$70 billion investment and then Peter Thiel calls JD Vance and says you're about to shut down AI and the moment there's a whiff that this is going to threaten AI and the seven stocks that responsible for 38% of the S&P check down 20% and there's panic buying. He listens to the markets and he listens to a small group of people including Jamie Dimon I think and I think he's just going to back down. I think he' playing poker with a weak hand and keeps hoping the other folks around the table are going to fold. And I mean just in terms of what's nonsensical Canada, arguably our closest ally, largest undefended border in the world. Housing is a real issue in America. Young people are really angry because the percentage of first time home buyers is at an all time low. The entrants are paying for the price of the incumbents weaponizing zoning such that they can increase or decrease the supply of new houses. And you want to Talk about taking inflation up. What are the two primary inputs for a new house or two of them, Canadian lumber and Mexican drywall? Gypsum. You want to make things worse? You want to start talking about panic buying before the tariffs. That creates inflation. The first uptick in an inflation number here. I just think they have to fold. And what happens if inflation really starts to spike and Chairman Powell, who has his own ego, says, you know what, we're contemplating raising interest rates?
- [18:55]
Kara Swisher
Well, Trump has the crosshairs on him too, but he can only crosshairs so many people.
- [18:59]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, but he doesn't care. He's in there for. He's in there at least for the shirt. I just think the markets. The adult in the room in the cabinet is not a DUI hire to head the Defense Secretary. It's not an acolyte to basically pervert our justice system, our attorney General. The adult in the room here is the bond market, the 10 year and to a lesser extent, the equity markets. And they will absolutely respond if these tariffs actually become a reality. You're going to see the markets. I mean, my co host at Prophet Markets said what's interesting is that when these things clearly weren't going to happen, the markets kind of freaked out and now the markets have gotten used to them and aren't freaking out. He wonders that, okay, maybe Trump is so angry he's not being taken seriously that he'll actually go through with a couple of these things. But. But what is so insane and so stupid about these threats is the following. And that is trade agreements take 18 months minimum just to hammer out, not.
- [20:00]
Kara Swisher
90 and 90 days. What?
- [20:01]
Scott Galloway
And then they take four years to implement because just the logistics of trying to track this stuff and figuring out the regulatory bodies that will do it and the payments and the notion that he just sets this goal and this is why business people shouldn't be president. He just doesn't understand how government works.
- [20:19]
Kara Swisher
He's also playing. He played at being a businessman. I'm sorry, just like he was a laughable businessman.
- [20:24]
Scott Galloway
I agree. And the thing he doesn't. The thing, the overarching construct or philosophy that he doesn't understand about global trade and geopolitics is that the most, in my opinion, the most visionary move in geopolitical history was when after defeating an army that had put people in concentration camps, had murdered our soldiers, violated Geneva Conventions, that was the Japanese had brutalized tens of millions of people across Europe. We defeated them. And what did we decide to do? We decided to borrow a shit ton of money and rebuild their nations. Recognizing that if we could create prosperity overseas, it would be of massive benefit domestically. That was the most visionary thing I believe ever done geopolitically. And what that set off was a recognition that global trade and prosperity are not a zero sum game. It's not a win lose game that when Vietnam does really well, they not only export those Nikes, they start importing them and buying them.
- [21:32]
Kara Swisher
You know what was interesting, there was a story, one everyone's writing the story, which we've talked about for months now, which is that suddenly all these other partners are to going, getting together across Europe with China, Europe with. We talked about this early, but they're suddenly running back. The second thing is a lot of the people here who are here legally are sending all their money back to their countries now and not spending it here, which is interesting. Before the outflow of capital from immigrants here who are here legally is huge, is like gained because they don't feel that this is the place to put down roots or you know, or long term. And I have to tell you, I've heard from so many people about nervousness of leaving a lot of students leaving this country and maybe not wanting to stay. Like before they would have us would have been the place they would have stayed and brought their incredible talents. Now they're like, I think I'm going back, I think I'm going back kind of thing, which I never heard from these people before, these kind of people.
- [22:33]
Scott Galloway
The analogy I use is that what if one NBA team got the number one? They got the number one through number one million draft picks. Every other team, their first pick for their team was the millionth and first draft pick. We get the top million, we get the top people around the world. We get the most elite of the elite. What do the smartest people in Scotland all have in common? They left. And the majority that left came to America and World War II. The most elite scientists, including the guy who figured out relativity, decided to come to America because they didn't like the environment in Europe that was emerging. And now we have thousands of scientists applying for intellectual asylum in France.
- [23:21]
Kara Swisher
I mean literally, I want to go RFK scientists can get on the plane. They get on the plane.
- [23:25]
Scott Galloway
That's right. And who did? What did these European scientists who saw an emerging fascism and inhospitable environment, what did they bring to the us? They brought our ability to land on the moon. They brought not Nazis, but people who fled the Nazi regime. They brought chemotherapy, they brought quantum computing. Oh, and by the way, they brought the bomb, folks, and had the bomb, had the scientists who understood how to split the atom stayed in, stayed in Vienna or in Austria. I mean, the war could have ended much differently. And instead what we've decided, let's take the most elite human capital in the world and let's encourage them to go back, go abroad anyway.
- [24:10]
Kara Swisher
It is, it's ridiculous.
- [24:12]
Scott Galloway
Again, the biggest own goals of the last 20 years have been the unnecessary invasion of Iraq and Brexit. This could be bigger economically than all of those things.
- [24:22]
Kara Swisher
I would agree. But the problem, the only problem is he is still in our innards ripping everything out. All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, Google makes a major AI deal and SpaceX invests in XAI. Support for the show comes from Coda powered by Grammarly. We love seeing our team come together to make this show happen. I mean, Scott has like seven podcasts on the network, so it's nice that he still works with us. But the difficult part is trying to keep track of all the information, data and projects we're working on across dozens of platforms, products and tools. If that sounds like a familiar struggle, you might want to check out Coda, the All In One collaborative workspace that's helped 50,000 teams all over the world get on the same page. By offering the flexibility of docs with the structure of spreadsheets, Coda facilitates deeper teamwork and quicker creativity. And their turnkey AI solution, Coda Brain is a game changer powered by by Grammarly, Coda is entering a new phase of innovation and expansion, aiming to redefine productivity for the AI era. Whether you're a startup looking to organize chaos while staying nimble, or an enterprise organization looking for better alignment, Coda matches your working style. Its seamless workspace connects to hundreds of your favorite tools, including Salesforce, Jira, Asana, and Figma, helping your teams transform their rituals to do more faster. You can head over to Coda IO Pivot right now and get six free months of of the team plan for startups for free. That's C O D a IO Pivot and get six months of the team plan for free. Coda IO Pivot.
- [25:58]
Scott Galloway
Support for Pivot comes from Framer. It's a big moment when any business owner gets to hit publish on their website. It's how your company can finally get recognized all around the globe. But if you end up making a simple cut and paste webpage, you've just jumped into the deep end of the ocean without a life raft. But when you use Framer. They don't just help you keep afloat, they help your web page shine. Framer is the design first no code website builder that lets anyone ship a production ready site in minutes. Framer uses a powerful, user friendly platform that delivers developer level results without writing a single line of code. It's free to start, you can browse 700 pixel perfect templates or design from a totally blank canvas. Real time collaboration means your writer, designer and marketer can all tweak the same page page at once. No version control nightmares. Plus their built in AI handles the heavy lifting by generating starter layouts, auto translating your entire site to any language and can even suggest on brand color palettes. Are you ready to build a site that looks hand coded without hiring a developer? Start free today@Famer.com go to Framer.com to start building a site for free. Framer.com support for Pivot comes from Mint Mobile if you're looking for ways to save money this summer, you're not alone. You can start. Start by saving on something you might be overpaying for anyway. Your phone bill. Mint Mobile offers premium wireless service at an affordable price. All of their plans include high speed data delivered on the nation's largest 5G network, plus unlimited talk and text. And you won't need to give friends a new number either. When you switch, you can bring your existing phone number with you, plus all of your contacts. With Mint Mobile, you can say goodbye to your overpriced wireless plans, jaw dropping monthly bills and unexpected over overages. Get 3 months of unlimited service from Mint Mobile for 15 bucks a month this year. Skip breaking a sweat and breaking the bank. Get this new customer offer and your three month unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at mintmobile.com pivot that's mintmobile.com pivot upfront payments of $45 required equivalent to $15 a month limited time new customer offer for first three months only. Speeds may be slower above 35 gigabytes on unlimited plan. Taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details.
- [28:08]
Kara Swisher
Scott we're back. The AI talent war is escalating. Still, Google just hired the CEO and co founder of Windsurf, an AI coding startup, along with several of the company's employees. The under the $2.4 billion deal, Google also gets some non exclusive licenses some of WindServe's technology. The startup will still operate independently without those key employees. The move comes after a $3 billion deal and OpenAI fell apart. Windserve's founders were reportedly wary of Sharing intel with Microsoft. It's the latest setback for OpenAI which has been losing talent to rivals like Meta in recent weeks. First of all, this seems getting to be a little insane. The second thing is it feels like everyone's running, you know, trying to get to the borders, like pick someone, get all the people they can and pick up the land grab in terms of people. And they're also doing non deal deals where they're trying to be cute with the government. We're not buying this company, we're just buying everything that matters and gutting them. Related SpaceX reportedly invest $2 billion in XAI and that's not all. Elon Musk says that Tesla shareholders will vote on whether to invest in xai. Let's listen to what I said about this back in April. It looks like he's not interested in making cars anymore or he's making other things. He wants to shift Tesla and I think you're going to merge xai, X and this together in a big and Tesla. Yeah. So now SpaceX too. Like this is, he's being, he's making a turducken here. He said in a post on X that he does not support a merger of Tesla and xai. But who knows what he's saying. By the way, he also said that Grok will be available in Tesla vehicles after the launch of Grok 4. Users have discovered the model seems to refer to Musk's opinion also through news articles and X posts when answering questions. So it's, it's mostly Musk stuff that they're borrowing from. The LLM is. Anyway, talk a little bit about this.
- [30:02]
Scott Galloway
Well, the more interesting one I think is these acqua hires and that is some VCs have become, it's become so difficult to find alpha or the outsized returns because so many VC firms have raised a ton of money. There's just more capital now chasing fewer good deals that some of them have gone really downstream and are actually incubating and starting companies themselves and then spinning them out. You know, that was kind of what essentially Sam Altman's Y Combinator was doing. And I think what you're going to see is a lot of. If I were venture capital, a young venture capital partner I'd be calling, I would try and find 12 really bright AI researchers and a couple managers and at various companies and say get together, I'm your first 50 million in find, determine a very small slice of the AI world to focus on. And if we can build 12, 20, 50, 100 really talented AI people and the focus on your research is important, but it's not profound. But essentially what's happening here is that if you're an HR manager or recruiter and you can pull together a couple dozen really well respected AI executives who can show an ability to work together and build shit, the marketplace is so frothy and there's so much cheap Stock that within 12 to 36 months someone might show up and pay a billion dollars for those 24 professionals to rent you. Yeah. Or figure out a way not to raise the antennae of the DOJ or FTC and do some sort of crazy license that gives you money. But it's gotta be a great time to be an AI researcher with any credibility anywhere. If you are a really talented Young partner to VC, you identify 300 talented AI engineers, researchers, executives, product managers. You call them and say come start a company, you got 50 million within 24 months we're going to be acqua hired. Add 1 to 3 billion. Because these companies, I'm not even sure that the technology. No one talks about the technology or the company or the brand or the customers they have. They're just the war on talent here and the cheap capital chasing this talent has created alpha, if you will.
- [32:19]
Kara Swisher
So do you think it's going to get past the government? Not for too long. I don't know.
- [32:24]
Scott Galloway
Under this administration, yeah.
- [32:26]
Kara Swisher
Although inflection certainly did. Remember Microsoft got that one.
- [32:29]
Scott Galloway
But the ofTC and the DOJ are mostly now about what bothering media companies who and what is giving money or bother to or bothering Trump or woke.
- [32:41]
Kara Swisher
Media companies that seems to be their focus.
- [32:43]
Scott Galloway
I think these things. These guys have been so savvy at weaponizing government and giving money to the right people that I would imagine an acqui hire. I was part of an ACWA kill.
- [32:55]
Kara Swisher
Really? They bought you and killed you?
- [32:57]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, it's really. I always feel like I have a pretty good instinct for business and when my company L2 was acquired, I couldn't figure out what they were doing. I gave them a list of the most valuable people at the company. Pretty much all of them left. Every decision they made was like that episode of Seinfeld where George Costanza decides to do everything entirely the opposite. Everything they did was entirely the opposite. I'm not exaggerating. I did a call weekly with my quote unquote boss, which was hilarious. A group of people dramatically less talented than me that just showed up and talked big thaws.
- [33:29]
Kara Swisher
Wouldn't you like to get that time back?
- [33:30]
Scott Galloway
And they literally told me don't do anything. Don't do anything. We don't want you doing anything. And I left. I hated it so much. I left several million dollars on the table. And my partner used to say to me, I used to say, I can't handle this, I gotta get out here. And she'd say, how much money do you get if you just go in for five more mornings? And I would do the math and she'd go, so you don't want to just go in for five more mornings?
- [33:51]
Kara Swisher
Oh, right, yeah.
- [33:52]
Scott Galloway
And she would do that to me every week. Anyways, finally I said, I'm out of here.
- [33:56]
Kara Swisher
There's a point where you can't anymore. I have had that job. I'd be like, no, I can't.
- [34:00]
Scott Galloway
I would say things like, I think there's an interesting opportunity to go after Latin American CPG companies and I want to hire two people and start doing research there. And they're like, well, hold off on that. I mean. And I now have come to the conclusion that we were threatening them and they thought, we'll take a competitor off the market, we'll milk them for their cash flow, we won't make any new investments in the company.
- [34:22]
Kara Swisher
And this guy doesn't have a good idea in his head.
- [34:25]
Scott Galloway
And then a potential competitor is gone. And this company, as I look back on it, has acquired a bunch of companies in verticals that were threatening their mothership.
- [34:36]
Kara Swisher
That's no way to create a company, by the way. That's not.
- [34:38]
Scott Galloway
This company's done this company to their credit. This company's done really well from a shareholder standpoint.
- [34:43]
Kara Swisher
Oh, really? Okay.
- [34:43]
Scott Galloway
All right.
- [34:44]
Kara Swisher
Well, I still think it's non creative and awful not using Scott Galloway's God given talent.
- [34:49]
Scott Galloway
That's right.
- [34:50]
Kara Swisher
That's right.
- [34:50]
Scott Galloway
That's right. Sell more shit. The Internet. Sell more shit on the Internet. Facebook's evil. Sell more shit.
- [34:57]
Kara Swisher
What do you think of my correct prediction once again about this doing more of the integrating with this company with all this stuff? Even if he says they're not merging, they're kind of. It's kind of the same thing, right? It doesn't really matter if they merge or not because they're interwoven in such a way that they're impossible to pull apart.
- [35:14]
Scott Galloway
Well, first off, so everyone says Twitter's now worth $33 billion. Not really. He got his other company to invest at a mark on that company, to give it a $33 billion cap. He's essentially figuring out that, okay, I've got some really amazing assets and I've got some shitty assets and I'm going to conglomerate to prop up my shitty assets which are overvalued specifically Tesla and a little bit Twitter. And he is a visionary. He wants to bring all these things together with AI at the heart with Twitter providing all of the data set with I don't know, SpaceX and satellites giving better guidance and autonomous driving capability and his Tesla cars gathering more information and turn it into just kind of one big AI driven company with distribution around cars, rockets, satellites, media. I mean you can see this becoming kind of like starnet, right? And he is a visionary. Having said this, and this is unrelated, but I think important. If I were the ftc, Skynet, if I were the FTC or the doj. In my view the most dangerous monopoly in the world right now is SpaceX. 60% of low earth orbit satellites are owned by one company. That is not that, that is not acceptable. This is one private company who is run by someone who is reportedly a drug addict, can turn off and on battlefield technology that might shape the future of Europe and democracy. Okay, it's bad that Meta has too much control over the ad market. SpaceX is the most dangerous monopoly in the world right now and they have. Do you realize 87% of space launches weren't from America? They weren't from NASA. They were from one company, SpaceX. That is an enormous security risk.
- [37:04]
Kara Swisher
Well, speaking of that, of course he's getting protected by people. Texas Governor Greg Abbott doesn't want to reveal his and his staff's communication with Elon Musk and his representatives from these companies pro because Texas Newsroom requested the emails in Abbott's public information corner to argue they should not be released in part because they include quote, intimate and embarrassing information. I want to. I mean how much more embarrassing can this guy be in public? I don't know, he's sort of speaking of showing your ass all the time. This is what he does. Interestingly, you know, he constantly is making a mess. So it'll be interesting to see who, who steps forward because it's certainly not going to be Greg Abbott who's such a chode, but who could could make that happen? Like make that obviously other companies or.
- [37:45]
Scott Galloway
When you say make that happen, you mean a breakup of SpaceX?
- [37:47]
Kara Swisher
Not the breakup of SpaceX, but that the government has more leverage on them. I mean obviously more competitors would be one way, but certainly not people like Greg Abbott will protect him.
- [37:59]
Scott Galloway
Well, no, a doj, an FTC and an attorney general that do their fucking jobs, they're focused on the long term.
- [38:04]
Kara Swisher
She's busy with episodes.
- [38:05]
Scott Galloway
The long term. Well being. Material and economic well being of America, American citizens. But what I took from the Epstein thing and what you just said about Governor Greg Abbott's reticence to let go. I believe that pretty much almost every piece of information, unless it's just scurrilous, intimate information on someone's private life that's for nothing but clicks.
- [38:25]
Kara Swisher
Why were they talking about that? Right.
- [38:27]
Scott Galloway
What this all comes down to is I believe that the basic. This fidelity, this passion, this irreverence for anonymity, I think has become dangerous. And you brought this up. What do stormtroopers, the KKK and ICE have in common? Or people on campus not allowing Jews into certain parts of UCLA public spaces? They're all wearing fucking masks. And what I see online is this ridiculous fidelity to anonymity has resulted in troll farms that are tearing society apart or letting people behave in a way they would never behave in person.
- [39:01]
Kara Swisher
But now they're doing it in person. I mean, those ICE people should not. I'm sorry. If their jobs are hard. They picked a job. This is the life they've chosen.
- [39:10]
Scott Galloway
What has been the most accretive, positive thing among law enforcement in America? I would argue that it is the following. Body cams. If you're a cop and you run up against somebody who's mentally ill and treating you like shit, I can't imagine how tempting it is to just punch them in the fucking face and put cuffs on them. I can empathize with that. But because they have a body cam on them and their badge number and their identification on their vest, they behave in a manner that is incredibly honorable and shows fidelity to the law.
- [39:45]
Kara Swisher
And some of them still don't, even despite the body cams.
- [39:48]
Scott Galloway
I think our men and women in blue are, given the situations they are thrust into every day, remarkable. And show a lot more patience than your average citizen. That was a reversal in anonymity. They not only don't have masks, it's like if you're a cop and you're gonna use the full. You're gonna use the full weight of the federal government and laws where you can deploy lethal power and incarceration against citizens, then we need to know exactly who the fuck you are and record it in 4D color. And when you let people put on masks, you're going the opposite way. There's gonna be a decline in civility and fidelity to the law because you just get this rah rah speech that the President said. It's okay. Go in there and if there's a 13 year old screaming, no, my mother is a citizen, or you might not put your head. You might not put your knee on the head of a woman working at Home Depot because people can actually see your face. That's a good thing. And I have, and I have argued for this. I don't believe. I believe social media in these platforms should force identification. You could still have accounts that are anonymous. If there's a person who needs an account to talk about women's rights in wherever the Gulf, you could figure out pretty easily is this person using an anonymous account because they're in real danger. Are they doing it just under. Just to tear at the fabric of society or let people engage in depraved behavior? But anonymity, in my opinion, is one of the most in our fidelity and our misunderstanding are. Conflating the First Amendment with anonymity is one of the most damaging things in our society. It goes back to the Epstein list. Let it out.
- [41:30]
Kara Swisher
Let it out. Scott and Carol, release the Epstein list. We are with Roseanne Barr on this one.
- [41:35]
Scott Galloway
At the same time, Democrats have to put away this bullshit purity test on everything. People are human. And if someone ended up on a plane going to an island to party and there's no evidence that they engaged in anything, then it's like, okay, forgive them. Yeah, they had poor judgment. They didn't. But release, for God's sakes, release the list and Governor Grabback. Everything that happens at a level of Governor or Senate.
- [41:57]
Kara Swisher
What do you think is embarrassing? What do you think's in there? What's intimate, embarrassing?
- [42:00]
Scott Galloway
They're probably saying, give me money and.
- [42:03]
Kara Swisher
I'll make sure that's more than embarrassing. They're saying intimate and embarrassing. It was a weird choice of words, right? Intimate and embarrassing.
- [42:13]
Scott Galloway
The Nixon tapes, bra size. The Nixon tapes eventually got. Got released.
- [42:17]
Kara Swisher
Everything should get released. I agree.
- [42:19]
Scott Galloway
People should be able. You said something I always thought was really powerful. People should be able to have secrets. And that is if it's just people's private lives. Okay. I don't think people have a right to publish everything. I do believe in privacy. I do believe that people should be able to have secrets. But when it comes to national security, government regulation, conversations among our elected representatives, I believe that for defense reasons, you can say it needs to be sealed for a certain amount of time. But eventually, be clear, folks, it's all gonna come out and what's gonna happen to their behavior? It's gonna improve.
- [42:52]
Kara Swisher
Well, you know, it's interesting. I'm seeing online a lot of people when these ice people go in now, sort of normal people, they were bothering a janitor. And all these doctors and nurses were like, get the fuck outta here or show your face. Like this guy was. And they're like, you're. And the cop, which was not getting beaten up in any way. Cause the video showed it was like. Like you're assaulting an officer. And she's like, I am not. I am not doing that. Take off your mask. Like, you're seeing a lot of people personally offended by it. And it's not the American way to hide your face.
- [43:20]
Scott Galloway
I think that's been really inspiring.
- [43:22]
Kara Swisher
You know what? In the Superman movie, the bad guys are hiding their fucking faces all the time. And not Superman, because he's a very handsome man. All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break. And we come back, Elon Musk and Don Lemon go to court. DON lemon.
- [43:36]
Scott Galloway
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- [44:45]
Kara Swisher
Support for Pivot comes from LinkedIn. From talking about sports, discussing the latest movies, everyone is looking for a real connection to the people around them. But it's not just person to person. It's the same connection that's needed in business. And it can be the hardest part about B2B marketing. Finding the right people, making the right connections. But instead of spending hours and hours scavenging social media feeds, you can just tap LinkedIn ads to reach the right professionals. According to LinkedIn, they have grown to a network of over 1 billion professionals, making it stand apart from other ad buys. You can target your buyers by job title, industry, company role, seniority, skills and company revenue, giving you all the professional you need to reach in one place. So you can stop wasting budget on the wrong audience and start targeting the right professionals only on LinkedIn ads. LinkedIn will even give you $100 credit on your next campaign so you can try it for yourself. Just go to LinkedIn.com pivotpod that's LinkedIn.com pivotpod Terms and conditions apply only on LinkedIn ads. Support for this show comes from Intuit QuickBooks. Are you a business owner looking to grow your business? You did what most dream of doing, starting your own business. Now you're faced with the reality of how to make your small business run smoothly. Intuit QuickBooks can help. QuickBooks is a powerful AI driven all in one business solution. That means those day to day tasks, invoicing, expenses, taxes, can be done effortlessly. But here's where where it gets really good. You don't need to hire a team of analysts to find growth opportunities hiding in your business data. QuickBooks can help with cash flow optimization, profit and loss analysis, and it helps you see how your business is doing and uncover new ways to be more profitable. QuickBooks can help you unlock the growth in your business so you can get back to enjoying your business. Manage and grow your business all in one place. Intuit QuickBooks your way to money get 90% off for 3 months. Months limited time only. Terms and conditions apply. Scott, we're back with more news. This is just a quick thing. Don Lemon's lawsuit against Elon Musk and X over the cancellation of their partnership will go to trial. Musk's team had tried to convince a judge to strike the complaint. San Francisco judge ruled that Lemon credibly alleged Musk had committed fraud by false promise. He'll probably win. Elon still won't pay him. As a reminder, Lemon filed the suit after X canceled his partnership a few hours after he taped a contentious interview with Musk. I don't know if Don will win this one, but it's good that he gets to go forward. We'll see some interesting emails with Linda Yaccarino and stuff. I hope he gets his money. Hope they all at X. There's a whole bunch of people from Twitter who haven't gotten their money. They all should get their fucking Money, Elon. Give them their money. Even if you don't like them, give them their money. So we'll see. He probably won't.
- [47:34]
Scott Galloway
I love Don Lemon. I like the fact that he, I think, got fired from CNN and got fired from Twitter. And I think he's one of these people that's doing really good work. If you follow him on his Lemon Drops podcast. What I appreciate about Don, I also appreciate about Megan, even though I don't agree with her politics, it's clear they work really fucking hard. And I really appreciate people who've achieved a certain level of celebrity status and probably economic security and just show up and work really hard. And I like. I think he's fearless. I'm a huge fan of these new niche media companies. I just. I like them. I'm rooting for them, and so I hope this is what happens. He's going to take him to court. My guess is that Musk's attorneys are going to go. We'll fight and intimidate and try to embarrass him, but legally, we don't have a leg to stand on. And when they realize he's not backing down, they'll settle with him. And I hope he gets a big check, because it was embarrassing for him to accept a job, ask real questions, and then be fired unceremoniously. And he's entitled to whatever severance he's legally entitled to.
- [48:39]
Kara Swisher
Yes, yes, he should have never signed it, but that's another issue. I agree with you about the niche media companies, but there's a very big difference in what Don Lemon's doing and what Megyn Keller. I get that she works hard, but she works hard insulting women, screaming about things. If that's the way you want to make your business, it's fine, but it's grotesque. I'm sorry. And a lot of these companies, some of them are amazing, and some of them are just a bunch of hacks, and they both will benefit.
- [49:02]
Scott Galloway
Well, okay, I'll use others. Whether it's Puck or the information or what they're trying to do with the Daily Beast or Axios or. Even if you don't, even if you don't agree with them, the way they acquit themselves. I'm here for these little niche media companies running the Daily Wire. I hate their shit, but I totally respect what they've built.
- [49:23]
Kara Swisher
See, I have a thinner. I have a much bigger reveal. It's gotta be well done, even. I like the Bulwark. I don't agree with a lot of stuff they do but they actually do journalism. The ones that don't are heinous. I'm sorry, they're just hacks. And I don't like hacks doing well, even if they're exciting and innovative in some way.
- [49:41]
Scott Galloway
Well, they now do traditional media.
- [49:43]
Kara Swisher
I would agree. Same thing. Same thing. I have the same filter for those. I agree, I agree. Anyway, I had this interesting argument with Alex because he was insulting CNN or something like that. And I said, the reporters of CNN are great and you don't have to like the night stuff and you need to distinguish between them. And he said, I can't. And we had a great discussion about it. And I would agree with him if it tends too much towards the screamy and not the amazing reporters. I have a problem with it too. At all the stations.
- [50:11]
Scott Galloway
The problem is it's the screamy stuff that makes all the money.
- [50:13]
Kara Swisher
Carol, I get it. That's why I don't like the small ones that do it or the big ones are their shitty reporters or they have disingenuous work. I just don't like it no matter what. Anyway, but tech. Speaking of someone who's disingenuous, tech investor and Trump advisor Marc Andreessen said universities will pay the price for promoting diversity and alleged discrimination against Trump supporters. Andreessen made statements and messages sent to a group chat with White House officials and tech leaders. He's always doing this. He's such a. If you've ever gotten a text from Marc Andreessen, he's so high handed, it's kind of ridiculous. The investor said he views Stanford and MIT as mainly political lobbying operations fighting American innovation. He's got to fucking be kidding me. The messages discuss the counterattack against universities and called for National Science foundation to receive the bureaucratic death penalty. They never keep these group chats confidential and I suspect Andreessen doesn't care. I like them out because you see what an arrogant asshole he is. But you know, again, as usual, they say things very firmly, as if things don't have nuance. Parts of MIT and Stanford and lots of universities, including conservative ones, can have a lot of problems and parts of them are great. And again, the same thing. He can't distinguish between that and has decided to say things like, they will pay the price. They will die a death. All this, like there's so much like drama with these men.
- [51:36]
Scott Galloway
I actually agree a lot with what Mark said and I don't. But go ahead, that's clear. And in our occasional disagreements where white people show up, that and how sexy I Am.
- [51:47]
Kara Swisher
Can I? Before you begin explaining why. When. No, when you have a point. I think you do it from a place of real thinking about it. I think he does it because he's an unpleasant piece of shit.
- [51:58]
Scott Galloway
And so they backfill into an ultra conservative point where they just want to tech loot.
- [52:02]
Kara Swisher
Correct? I think you asked.
- [52:03]
Scott Galloway
They want to cash subsidies and then not pay taxes is where it all comes from.
- [52:07]
Kara Swisher
He gets break after break after break and then he pretends everybody else in America. Yes, exactly. Go ahead.
- [52:12]
Scott Galloway
So look, 60 years ago, 12 black people at Harvard, Princeton and Yale combined, that was a problem we needed. Race based affirmative action. The DEI apparatus has become so large and so in my opinion, unuseful. And it creates more problems now than it solves. 52% of gay men go to college, 34% of straight men. Harvard's freshman class is 60% non white. But 70% of those non whites come from upper income homes. The academic gap between black and white was double what it was from rich and poor 60 years ago. It is now flipped. So what we need is, is affirmative action based on the primary arbiter of your success moving forward. And that is how wealthy or not wealthy your household is. We still have an economic apartheid because of our checkered history in this nation where black and Latino households only have 20,000 in wealth and whites 150,000. But quite frankly there has been too much privilege crammed into the small number of non whites who are rich. Tyler Perry's kids shouldn't have a better chance of getting into college. Having said that, my industry is guilty of artificially constraining supply such that we can raise prices faster than inflation. Which is total bullshit. We should be letting in more kids. And we have let in a preponderance of international kids relative to domestic kids. He was right on that. Not for diversity, that's lying. But because they pay full freight. And we love kids from Honduras or from Italy who pay the full tuition, the full sticker. So we're not inviting them. Diversity or for dei. And it has come at the cost. The cartel, the artificial scarcity, the lvmh, the rejectionist exclusionary culture trying to be a hedge fund for LVMH as opposed to a public servant has crowded out a lot of unremarkable good American kids who might have remarkable futures. He has a point, but the culprit. He positions it as if it's as if it's non whites who are the problem or advancing the rights of non whites or women. That's not the Problem. The problem is a system that has basically said we're going to reject too many kids. We're going to sit on the GDP of Costa Rica and only have 1500 kids or what do you know, Harvard? And create some Vaseline over the lens that letting in the Taiwanese daughter of a private equity billionaire is somehow diversity. It isn't. International students are outstanding. We love having them giving kids with adversity in their background. Maybe it's a kid from the inner city, maybe it's a kid who struggled with his sexual identity. Maybe it's a kid going through transition, fine. But how we solve the problem and how we come together is the following. Every university in this nation that has over a billion dollars in endowment should grow its freshman class faster than population growth or lose its tax free status. Here's what we need. We need to let in more international students, more trans kids, more gay kids, more white kids from red states. We need more kids. You know where you don't have this argument is community colleges. Because if you just show up and pay the fucking tuition, you're in. So we don't have all this agita and all this problem. So instead of arguing about who gets in and who doesn't and creating unnecessary agita in between special interest groups, which is totally unnecessary, we just need to let in more kids. UCLA, 74% admissions rate. When I applied, I was unremarkable. Now it's 9%. We need to just let in more kids such that people like Marc Andreessen can't cloud a very real issue or use that as cloud cover for what is this thinly veiled, ultra conservative viewpoints that quite frankly come across as a little bit bigoted and hateful against special interest groups who needed a leg up for a long time.
- [56:04]
Kara Swisher
I'm going to insert myself, myself. He's a grievance person. Everything is a grievance. And it all relates to his unhappiness at growing up or whatever happened with his family or whatever. Everything always is a grievance with this guy. And let me tell you, it was from the start when I started covering him. He was always aggrieved by someone or something and it was always someone else's fault. Always. This has been literally, when he was selling Netscape stock, it was Netscape's fault when he was doing this. It was microscope. It was, this guy can never find fault with himself 1.
- [56:35]
Scott Galloway
But if he wants to solve the problem, it's pretty easy. He went to an amazing university, the University of Illinois. The Illinois, by the way public universities will educate two thirds of our kids. And a lot of them, including the University of Illinois are doing their level best to live up to their mission. And that is to let in not only just amazing, freakishly remarkable kids, but just good kids that might end up being freakishly remarkable. If he wanted to change things and I walk the walk here, I do this, he should be giving a shit ton of money to the University of Illinois under the condition of the following. Let in more kids and guess what'll happen, Mark? More republican white kids from Kentucky will get admissions.
- [57:10]
Kara Swisher
Yes. He will not do this. So one of the things when he goes the tell is mainly political lobbying operations for fighting American innovation. Shut the fuck up. It's the same thing that he does all the time with all his arguments. He's frequently wrong but never in doubt. And it's exhausting with this guy. All right, I'm just saying I think you make a good faith argument about the DEI bureaucracy but the solution of these guys is to kill rather than try to figure out what the best way of getting the most kids in. They do not care about what you care about. They would never give the money to create that vocational thing. They would never go for. They are not solutions based ever. They are are tear down based. And they really don't like people. I mean ultimately they don't like people. And by the way, if you saw Marco Diesel with a poor person, I'd be shocked like that. He like he. He just doesn't like they don't care. And I think you do. So that's why I allow it from you and not from them. Even if you agree with me.
- [58:07]
Scott Galloway
Thanks for your grace.
- [58:08]
Kara Swisher
But you are. You have good faith. You have good. There's a difference between disagreement under good faith and disagreement cause you're a giant fucking asshole who knows needs therapy about his parents.
- [58:18]
Scott Galloway
I got a little of that.
- [58:19]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, I know that. I know that.
- [58:20]
Scott Galloway
I did. Molly of Calvin Harris. Mark, come with me.
- [58:24]
Kara Swisher
I can't believe you. I like to do Molly with Kara Swisher anyway. I would never do it with you anyway because we'd hug and then things weird things would happen. Okay, Scott, one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails. Support for this show comes from Salesforce. Today every team has more work to do do than resources available. But digital labor is here to help. Agentforce. The powerful AI from Salesforce provides a limitless workforce of AI agents for every department. Built into your existing workflows and your trusted customer data, AgentForce can analyze decide and execute tasks autonomously, letting you and your employees save time and money to focus on the bigger picture, like moving your business forward. AgentForce what AI was meant to be? Learn more at salesforce.com AgentForce.
- [59:18]
Scott Galloway
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- [60:16]
Kara Swisher
Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and fails. I shall go first.
- [60:19]
Scott Galloway
You go first.
- [60:19]
Kara Swisher
I saw two movies, one with Mr. Louis Swisher on. We saw F1. I thought it was a solidly good movie. Brad Pitt looks fantastic. There's a young guy in it. I'm blanking on his name, who plays the young driver. He's amazing. The whole thing is delightful. And you know exactly how it's gonna end. You don't. There's not a stitch of.
- [60:40]
Scott Galloway
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and assume he wins a race.
- [60:43]
Kara Swisher
He wins a race, right? But he, you know, he's, he, he tries to let the kid win, but he wins. And of course. And then, you know, he's like, it's like a Clint Eastwood movie, this thing you've seen 109,000 times. That said, I learned a lot about cars and about tires. I like a lot about tires. There was a one sexy lady technologist in it who I love, who is his love interest. And I wanted to go to F1 after it. I have to say, I was like, I would like to go to F1. This was really interesting and the whole, there's a little technology in there. Fantastic movie. Superman, also a great movie. I have to say I liked F1 better, but I can see why, everybody? Superman is goofy, funny. It is so not woke. It's just goofy. Superman has always been an immigrant. It's always been a tone of this series. He comes from another planet. There's always this thing of him being from Krypton. I thought the guy who played him was delightful. I thought Rachel Brosnahan was fantastic. She was in Marvel's Mrs. Maisel. I thought the whole cast was great. It was so fucking goofy. It was like there were jokes all over the place. And there was one character, this guy who plays Mr. Terrific, another person I've never seen so funny. Whoever did this has an amazingly good sense of humor, and I think they brought it right where it belongs. I thought I like Henry Cavill, but too brooding. All the Supermans before Chris Reeve, who I thought was wonderful. Too brooding. Now it's really fun and I see why it's getting. It's what everyone wants. It's a fucking relief to go to that movie. And there's a dog in it, too. And then Supergirl shows up and she's like a badass partier, and it's just fun, fun, fun, fun. So that's my win. My fail is Trump attacking Rosie o'. Donnell. And I thought. Rosie o'.
- [62:24]
Scott Galloway
Donnell. No, Rosie Epstein.
- [62:25]
Kara Swisher
Rosie Epstein.
- [62:26]
Scott Galloway
This is called Rosie Epstein.
- [62:28]
Kara Swisher
She called her a threat to humanity. She moved to Ireland, by the way. I thought o' Donnell's reply was so fantastic. She did it on a bunch of places. But she called him King Joffrey with a tangerine spray, and I loved that. And I called her Oleana Tyrell.
- [62:42]
Scott Galloway
I thought AOC had the tweet of the week in a read. Wow. Who would have thought that electing a rapist would have complicated the release of the Epstein files?
- [62:50]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, exactly. That was really good, too. I love these women that, like, slap the fucking shit out of this guy. But what a fail. Like, what is he doing, Rosie? He's. He, like. I don't know what his deal. Rosie o'. Donnell. He's obsessed with her. This has been going on for a long time.
- [63:05]
Scott Galloway
He's obsessed with getting people to look away from the implications of pedophilia.
- [63:08]
Kara Swisher
No, she. It goes back. You remember speaking of Megyn Kelly when she used to do a good job this well?
- [63:14]
Scott Galloway
Rose Abstein. That's all you have to remember.
- [63:16]
Kara Swisher
Abstein. Anyway, fail, Trump, victory. Rosie. Okay, your turn.
- [63:22]
Scott Galloway
So I'll excuse my win and my fail for personal indulgence here. As you know, my father passed away last week. I wanted to talk a little bit about him. And a couple of the takeaways over the past few days. My father was born out of wedlock in 1930 in Sydney to a woman who was a domestic helper, a nanny for the McVickar family, a rich family in Australia. And one of their daughters was childless, which was a crime back then. And they said, we'll adopt your baby. And they gave her some money and she agreed. And then she had the baby, changed her mind and basically convinced her boyfriend, my grandfather, to meet her at the docks and they immigrated back to Scotland. My dad was raised in depression era Scotland. He says his first memory was during the Clydesbank, I think it was called Rage, where the Luftwaffe bombed some docks and some factories. And he was very, he felt a real sense of patriotism. He was 15 when the war ended, but he said when? I love this image. He said when he was 10, him and his buddies in service to their nation, anyone with an accent in their neighborhood, they would follow around and take notes on them and then report them to the authorities. Like if someone had an Italian accent, they assumed they were a spy and they would follow them around. I love that story. Anyways, he, at the age of 17, lied about his age, wanted to join the RAF and he was told he was too tall to be a pilot. So he joined the Navy. And within 48 hours of joining the Navy and saying he could swim well, he was jumping out of a helicopter, practicing pilot rescue in a freezing North Atlantic, trying to put 150 pound dummy back in a basket. Sent his money home to his mother so he could save to come to America. Got home after serving honorably in the Royal Navy for two years and found out that his mom had spent all the money on whiskey and cigarettes. Which kind of scarred my father and has always had a really unhealthy relationship with money, but basically made the best decision I've ever made. And that is he took a huge risk and came to America where he met my mom, his second wife, and had. I was born to his second wife, my sister, who's been an enormous source of love and reward for me for a long time. By his third marriage, he, he really did live kind of the American dream. One of my favorite stories was when he first got to San Diego. He interviewed to be a salesman at a candle manufacturer. And the HR person said, how long have you been here? And he said, two weeks. And she said, you gotta wait here. And she brought in her boss and said, we have to hire this guy. He's only been here two weeks and he's already learned to speak the language. And my dad had a pretty nice life. But the reality, Kara, is my father wasn't a very high character person. He had four marriages, four divorces. Left his last wife when she had late stage Parkinson's. Wasn't as kind as he could have been to me and my mom or to my sister. And that created a lot of tumult in my life. And that gets to some of the learnings. The first learning is having gone through this. First off, a lot of people, I've gotten about six or seven hundred text messages and emails from you and other people who have been very supportive and nice. And I just want to say thank you. It does help, but also just to be grateful. I've been sort of overwhelmed by gratitude, even though maybe it wasn't purposeful. Again, the best thing that happened to me was being born in America. My dad took that risk such that I could be born in America. I have broad shoulders, I'm tall, I have a good voice, and I have made an exceptional living communicating. And all of those things I inherited from my father. And there's no reason not to be grateful for those things. And that helps a lot just to focus on the good stuff. And then about the advice I would have for anybody that I learned with my relationship, which was tumultuous at times with my father, is the following. And that is about 20 years ago I decided, look, I used to go back and forth. I had very conflicted relationship with my father because he wasn't very good to me as a kid. And so I would get angry at him as an adult and think I don't want to be a very good son. And then I recognize and it's been an enormous unlock in my life. Just imagine the son you want to be or the partner you want to be, the girlfriend you want to be, the employer you want to be, the boss you want to be and hold yourself to that standard and stop keeping score. And it was such an enormous unlock for me. I've had such a wonderful relationship with him for the last 20 years. Just trying to be a generous and loving son and not think about whether or not I was in the debit or the surplus category. And I've approached. That's just been such an enormous unlock for me in the rest of my life. Thinking about what kind of partner do I want to be, what kind of friend do I want to be, and living to that standard, not keeping score. And that started with my decision to try and be a loving, generous Son, regardless of what had happened in our relationship previously. Anyways, I'm writing this book on masculinity and I. I digress to these three pillars of masculinity, of being a protector provider and a procreator. You know, my dad did protect his country. He took huge sacrifices and put himself in personal risk to try and do the right thing and served his country. He did provide for two families. And obviously he was a procurator, had two kids and four grandkids. But it's also a cautionary tale. He never was really able to speak, to think about others in a very generous way. So even when my sister and I were thinking about whether or not we should have a service, we decided not to. Because the reality is, the sad truth is nobody would show up. He didn't have any friends. He didn't really have anybody other than his daughter and his son who care about him. And so it really is a cautionary tale. But my dad did serve his country. He did his best. He checked the primary box, I think around being a father. And that is, he was much better to me and his daughter than his father was to him. Anyways, 95 lived a very rich life and his son and his daughter will miss him terribly.
- [69:42]
Kara Swisher
No. Scott. I'm so sorry.
- [69:44]
Scott Galloway
Almost made it through.
- [69:46]
Kara Swisher
It's okay. Scott. This is your best quality. Don't think it's not. Let me just say the best. I know your sister just a little bit. She's wonderful. But the best thing he did was give us. You.
- [69:56]
Scott Galloway
You. That's nice.
- [69:58]
Kara Swisher
Thank you. Anyway, now you got me crying. Scott.
- [70:03]
Scott Galloway
There you go.
- [70:04]
Kara Swisher
We'll have to go through this lucky at some point.
- [70:06]
Scott Galloway
There you go.
- [70:07]
Kara Swisher
Probably have a party.
- [70:09]
Scott Galloway
Four wives, four divorces. When you were in 70s California with a strong John A Glasswegian accent, you could not only think with your dick, you could listen to it. God, he had a good. He had a nice time.
- [70:19]
Kara Swisher
Yeah. And you. And then his son last week was in Ibiza having Molly.
- [70:25]
Scott Galloway
Win, win, win, win.
- [70:29]
Kara Swisher
Scott, you are a journey and I really appreciate that about you. And I think you took a lot of lessons from your dad. You had a tough time and it sounds like your mom was the real strong person for you, but it's still you're from where you're from, right? And that's what makes you the person you are. Anyway, I really appreciate that. And whatever you need, all of us are here for you.
- [70:50]
Scott Galloway
Appreciate that.
- [70:50]
Kara Swisher
Including all your listeners and me too. Anyway, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions. About business, tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com pivot to submit a question for the show or call 855-51PRIVOT Scott, I can't believe you made me cry. Elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe, this week on with Kara Swisher, I spoke with astrophysicist and author of the new book More Everything Forever, Adam Becker. Let's listen to a clip.
- [71:16]
Scott Galloway
I think that a lot of what's happened in this country over the last, at this point, 10 years has shown like the kinds of risks that we as a society take by having billionaires. By allowing that kind of concentration of wealth, it erodes the democratic fabric of the country. And at this point, our democracy is in mortal danger and may already be lost.
- [71:42]
Kara Swisher
Ooh, that was a. That was a particular. It's a great book. It's about the idea of more everything forever, which is a lot of sort of these tech people think, when in fact it's more everything forever for themselves. Anyway, it's a great book. He's really interesting. He sort of knocks away all the myths around living on Mars, et cetera. All their dreams that are not good for most of humanity but is good for them. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on Friday. Scott, read us out.
- [72:10]
Scott Galloway
Today's show was produced by Larry Naimon, Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Kevin Oliver. Ernie and her Todd engineered this episode. Thanks also to Drew Burrows, Mia Siberio and Dan Shalon. Nishat Kurwas, Vox Media's executive producer of podcasts. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media. You can subscribe to the magazine and my bag.com pod. We'll be back later this week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Thanks to everyone for all your warm wishes. It helps a great deal. Support for the show comes from Intuit QuickBooks. Do you own a business that's ready to thrive? It's time to let Intuit QuickBooks take things like unpaid invoice choices and tracking expenses off your plate so you can take things to the next level. Intuit QuickBooks is a powerful AI driven all in one business solution. They can help with day to day tasks like invoicing expenses and taxes. QuickBooks can help you unlock the growth in your business so you can get back to enjoying your business. Manage and grow your business all in one place. Intuit. QuickBooks. Your way to money. Get 90 off for three months. Limited time only. Terms and conditions apply.