Loading summary
Transcript276 lines
- [00:02]
Kara Swisher
Support for this show comes from Smartsheet. Have you ever wondered about all the incremental steps it takes to launch a rocket ship or maybe get a race car around a track or perform a life changing surgery? These feats of human ingenuity are executed by many people, taking many steps that lead up to one big goal, making the seemingly impossible possible. Whether you're organizing a team, scaling a business, or sending a rover across the solar system, Smartsheet is a work management platform that helps all those details turn into one big leap. Smartsheet Work with flow. Learn more@smartsheet.com Vox support for this show comes from HubSpot. Growing a business can feel impossible, but HubSpot's customer platform can help. It's powered by Breez, their suite of AI tools, so you can generate more leads, close more deals and scale your service fast. With BREEZE agents handling the busy work, customers are cutting sales cycles in half and saving hours on work each week. Best of all, you see the results in days, not months. Visit HubSpot.comai to learn more.
- [01:12]
Scott Galloway
Support for Pivot comes from Virgin Atlantic. Too many of us are so focused on getting to our destination that we forgot to embrace the journey. Well, when you fly Virgin Atlantic, that memorable trip begins right from the moment you check in. On board, you'll find everything you need to relax, recharge or carry on working lie flat private suites, fast wi fi, hours of entertainment, delicious dining and warm welcoming that's designed around you. Check out virginatlantic.com for your next trip to London and beyond and see for yourself how traveling for business can always be a pleasure.
- [01:46]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, it's true you're not a journalist, but you're something. I don't know what you are. Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media podcast network. I'm Kara Swisher.
- [01:57]
Scott Galloway
And I'm Scott Galloway.
- [01:59]
Kara Swisher
I am about to be in a city that is having a military parade. Scott, I am wishing I had gotten out of town. We'll talk about that in a minute. But.
- [02:08]
Scott Galloway
Oh, are you in la?
- [02:10]
Kara Swisher
I'm in dc. No, no, not la. There's nothing. I have all the tanks here. That's where the actual insurrection is going on.
- [02:17]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, that's what I caught. Literally. Why doesn't he just stay at home and like masturbate? The Apprentice Martial Law episode or something?
- [02:27]
Kara Swisher
I mean, I don't know. I don't know.
- [02:30]
Scott Galloway
Can you believe it? A military. A military parade.
- [02:33]
Kara Swisher
It's insane. The last time I was recall one was during the first Bush administration, it was after something with Iraq. I don't know. It was something. But he had a lot of military people, and it was very disconcerting. And it wasn't like this gang here. There's a lot here. It's sort of like North Korea plus old Russia kind of stuff. And the only thing I remember is a stealth bomber going down the mall in Washington, from the Capitol to the. To the Washington Monument. And it was terrifying. I was like, this is not America. Like, the stealth bomber, even though it was cool and enormous, but it was just chilling to the entire crowd.
- [03:13]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, I mean, we don't want to put tanks on the ground in Ukraine as Russian troops pour over the border, but a guy wants to roll out tanks as he, you know, shitposts or tweets from a golf cart in orthopedic shoes. I mean, the whole thing is just such cosplaying masculinity. It's so weird. It's so.
- [03:30]
Kara Swisher
It is. It's so sad. It keeps every. Every one of these things. I'm. How small is this? Well, anyway. Anyway, we got a lot to get to today, including Elon groveling and Trump and China making nice for now. And just for everyone to know, next week, Scott and I will be together in France again.
- [03:48]
Scott Galloway
That's right.
- [03:48]
Kara Swisher
Trip to France.
- [03:50]
Scott Galloway
They tried to keep us out, so it's the impenetrable Maginot line.
- [03:54]
Kara Swisher
Do you have a French accent? Was that your favorite accent?
- [03:56]
Scott Galloway
I used to do amazing accents. Now it sounds like really a dead language that twins speak to each other. I could do an amazing Glaswegian accent.
- [04:04]
Kara Swisher
You couldn't. Oh, my God. You could even do Pepe Le Pew, that famous date rapist. Pepe Le Pew. You could do that.
- [04:11]
Scott Galloway
Oh, you didn't love Pepe Le Pew.
- [04:13]
Kara Swisher
Oh, my God, it's so bad when you watch it now. It's literally, Come hear, my love. It's literally Harvey Weinstein of love.
- [04:19]
Scott Galloway
Come hear my love of cartoons.
- [04:21]
Kara Swisher
It really is. You're like, go back and look at it.
- [04:24]
Scott Galloway
All right, between Pepe Le Pew, I Dream of Jeannie, and what was the other really sexist thing I was watching all the time?
- [04:33]
Kara Swisher
Oh, my God. Three's Company.
- [04:34]
Scott Galloway
Oh, the Price is Right. And now a new car and a woman in a bathing suit showing you the new car.
- [04:39]
Kara Swisher
That one was tame compared to, like, oh, they're all terrible. I like Dr. Jeannie. I hate to say it, but it was really sexist with that outfit.
- [04:48]
Scott Galloway
Yes, master Jeannie, Go to your bottle. Is it. I'm literally the only. Everyone should just appreciate how far I've come. How far I have come. Yeah, yeah.
- [04:59]
Kara Swisher
Why? Why have you come? You liked I Dream of. I liked. I Dream of. I still like I Dream of Jeannie. I'm sorry, Barbara Eaton Ross.
- [05:05]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, I wouldn't. But watching. I'm not exaggerating. I watched two hours of Day I Dream of Jeannie during my formative years. And I'm not sure that was the right baseline level for how you interact with women.
- [05:16]
Kara Swisher
I did the same thing. That's why we love each other. I watch. I love Die Dream of Genie. I watched it all the time.
- [05:21]
Scott Galloway
Oh, I bet you did, you little lesbian.
- [05:23]
Kara Swisher
I know. My little lesbian. Yeah, exactly.
- [05:25]
Scott Galloway
I think essentially Jeff Bezos is. Is I Dream a genie. He finds a 2000 year old magical woman with Botox and instead of freeing her, makes her his roommate. It's Jeff Bezos. It's literally Jeff Bezos's I Dream of Genie.
- [05:40]
Kara Swisher
Anyway, kids, look up I Dream of Genie and watch it sometime. It's really. It's a classic. Anyway, we've got a lot to get to today. As I said, Elon groveling and Trump and China making nice for now, but there's a lot going on, including the protests against Trump administration's immigration raids are now spreading nationwide. Nice job, Trump. Trump is claiming that Los Angeles would have completely obliterated without National Guard deployment, which is a flat out lie. Talk to anybody in Los Angeles. It's ridiculous unless you're watching Fox News and then it's true. He also deployed 700 Marines in the LA area against the objections of every single group of people, most of whom don't get along. In recent days, Trump has floated invoking the Insurrection Act, a law that grants the President the authority to deploy the military on US soil. It's a big move. California Governor Gavin Newsom, who has gotten a lot of attention and is doing quite a good job job pushing back, spoke out about Trump's actions in a televised address on Tuesday, calling this a perilous moment for democracy. Let's listen to some of that speech.
- [06:41]
Scott Galloway
California may be first, but it clearly will not end here. Other states are next. Democracy is next. Democracy is under assault before our eyes. This moment we have feared has arrived. He's taking a wrecking ball, a wrecking ball to our founding father's historic project. Three co equal branches of independent government. There are no longer any checks and balances. Congress is nowhere to be found. Speaker Johnson has completely abdicated that responsibility. The rule of Law has increasingly been given way to the rule of Don.
- [07:18]
Kara Swisher
Well done, Gavin. I have to say he's taken every opportunity here to show himself off, which he is. More protests are expected this weekend tied to the massive military parade in D.C. that's official, as I know, celebrating the Army's 250th birthday, but just so happens to fall on Trump's 79th birthday, which will call attention to the fact that the man is really old. The no Kings protests are set to be the largest nationwide mobilization since Trump took office. These look like astonishing, actually. They're all over the place. Trump is already warning that any protesters at the parade will be met with very big force, whatever that is. They are allowed to protest, by the way, FYI. But many of the no Kings people are saying don't protests in D.C. and give them a reason to attack us. But they are pretty much nationwide. First, let's talk about Newsom. And then let me just also add that Tom Cotton, as usual, popped up like a bad penny with an op ed in the Wall Street Journal titled Send in the Troops for real, playing off his infamous New York Times op ed in 2020. We're recording this ahead of Trump's military parade, which is on Saturday. Talk a little bit about Newsom, Trump, these protests. It feels very North Korean to me. But your thoughts?
- [08:35]
Scott Galloway
I think Newsom has basically identified himself right now. I think he's the big winner in all of this. I think he kind of accidentally has become the spokesperson for the pushback. So I think one of the silver linings here is that it is we now have what is kind of a de facto leader of the Democratic Party. And I think it's essentially Governor Newsom leads the fourth largest economy in the world. It's a net giver in terms of federal tax income. For all the problems California has, it's actually on most metrics, doing really well, whether it's the center of the newest technology in the world. More people are moving back to California now, and California has more billionaires than any other state. And these are people with options for all the shitposting these techno libertarians like to do. California, they could move anywhere in the world and they decide to stay in. See above California.
- [09:29]
Kara Swisher
And so that's why I. Scott, they're all back, just so you know.
- [09:31]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, you've been saying that for a while. You said there was going to be.
- [09:33]
Kara Swisher
A boomerang and you were right because of AI especially.
- [09:36]
Scott Galloway
Go ahead. So look, and anyone who has driven a Highway 1 or. Or checked out the surfers or Zuma beach, or been to the Hollywood bowl or. I mean, it's just. Or. Or been in the desert. It's sunset in the desert. Or been to Carmel or Yosemite. I mean, you just.
- [09:53]
Kara Swisher
Stunning state.
- [09:54]
Scott Galloway
Yeah. It's arguably the most beautiful country in the world. It just happens to be a state within the United States, and it offers the best universities, best technology. Anyway, he has become sort of overnight kind of the spokesperson for or the leader of the Democratic Party. The bad news here is that I think a lot of these protesters are playing into Trump's hands, and that is you can't tell people how to protest, but when you see images. So, for example, you know, if you could give the protesters. If the protesters are generally trying to help their own cause, and that is say, look, a lot of us have been here for 10 years. It's one thing if you want to deport criminals, but if you're deporting people, if you're rounding up people at a Home Depot that have paid their taxes for 20 years and then going to their schools and their churches, I don't think most people are on board with that.
- [10:43]
Kara Swisher
No, they're not, according to polling. Not at all. But go ahead.
- [10:46]
Scott Galloway
But in my opinion, they hurt their own cause when they show up with more Mexican flags than American flags. And I understand what they're doing. But keep in mind, a lot of Trump supporters and a lot of moderates, when they see protesters with Mexican flags, they think invasion. And the things that really hurt this protest, in my mind, and there's nothing you can do about it, because it's free speech. When someone shows up with a Palestinian flag and a mask, what people see as terrorism. And unfortunately, the media will cover those limited instances, which are 0.01% of these protests, as opposed to covering a really thoughtful civil protest with signs. And that's what most of this is. And just to show you how incredibly asinine this is, how the snake is eating its own tail is that if you. Who is the National Guard that's been pulled or deployed or activated, a lot of them are cops, a lot of them are people who work in law enforcement, and a lot of them are in this division called the rattlesnakes and that Governor Newsom uses for fire reclamation or clearing out brush. And then they get called up to the National Guard. But during the day, if they get called up to be police officers or if the LAPD gets called up, the LAPD is being deployed. Additional LADPD forces are being deployed to where The National Guard is. Because the National Guard's presence increases hostilities and likelihoods of violence.
- [12:17]
Kara Swisher
Right. Which is why the police department is like, get the fuck out of here. Like, we're handling it.
- [12:21]
Scott Galloway
So the LAPD has to be deployed to protect the National Guard, who is creating problems and dissent and agitate where there doesn't need to be any.
- [12:31]
Kara Swisher
I do think that is sinking into people. They're like, what are they doing here? And especially in areas I think the protests. I get it. They're gonna play the picture of the burning Waymo over and over again. The flags don't look good. But I think this weekend will be interesting because I think this no Kings thing could be really effective. Because I was just looking at some of this stuff, and Amanda was pointing out to me, like, they have 20 different no kings events in Maine, and they're very oversubscribed, kind of. They think a lot of people are gonna show up. So if there's a peaceful show of support, I think Americans do like that.
- [13:08]
Scott Galloway
Agreed. But that's not what's getting the media right now.
- [13:11]
Kara Swisher
And the Republicans have tried to weaponize protesting. Right. They're trying to say protest is insurrection, when in fact, of course, because they're the most hypocritical group on the planet. You know, the real insurrection was, of course, that attack on the Capitol. And so when it suits them, they say protests are dangerous. When it suits them, they say they're patriotic tourist visits or whatever they call it. I think they continue. I think Penny seems to be dropping with a lot more people, I think, than you think that it's like.
- [13:41]
Scott Galloway
I hope so. I really do. Because I think that at the end of the day, this is. I mean, first off, let's go to some historical analogies here. Right. Kent State. Right. The Ohio National Guard hopped up on authority in bad intel, basically killed four kids protesting the Vietnam War. And the governor called in troops to, quote, unquote, restore order. Right. That sounds familiar. He didn't restore anything. He radicalized a generation and permanently scarred the American psyche. The best analogy here is Hitler in the 30s, the Reichstag fire decree. And that is, he wanted to consolidate power. So when an autocrat wants to consolidate power, essentially, Hitler didn't invade Poland to consolidate power. He invaded civil liberties.
- [14:29]
Kara Swisher
Yes, he did. Yeah.
- [14:32]
Scott Galloway
The playbook here is you use the threat of chaos to invoke emergency powers and suspend basic rights and criminalize dissent. And that's exactly what's going on here. And this is essentially mostly, President Trump is lighting a match and kind of pointing at the smoke, so to speak.
- [14:49]
Kara Swisher
Which is why I do think there's a lot of push, a lot more pushback than I think there's a lot of pushback. Every Democratic governor is now prepared and seeing his playbook are trying to handle this in a different way. I think he's just incompetent at it. Now, I know again, you don't have to be competent to be, to do this. You can be clodish and idiotic. But to me, I mean, the question is will, which message will get through? And I do think Newsom has been an effective messenger, finally. Right. And so it's a question of messaging is we're not, we've been trying to get out of. He's also, every time he speaks, he goes, We've worked to remove criminals, immigrants from our state. We do it all the time. But these are, but these. There was images today of ICE people chasing farm workers across a field. This is not, this is weird to people, especially employers. It's weird. You know, it starts to hit businesses because of, because Steve Miller can't find enough immigrants. It's a similar. Reminds me a little bit of Doge. They didn't really find as much. Right. They didn't find as much trouble. They have to go after law abiding people who are here illegally, who are paying taxes. I feel like which of the dueling messages is gonna work is, we'll see, we'll see, we'll see.
- [16:11]
Scott Galloway
When ICE has to go do to a Home Depot, a church or school.
- [16:16]
Kara Swisher
And a field doesn't.
- [16:18]
Scott Galloway
In a field where people are picking.
- [16:20]
Kara Swisher
Our crops, they were chasing them across the field. They were picking like avocados, whatever the heck they were picking.
- [16:24]
Scott Galloway
It's a larger point and that is, are these the people we should be kicking out? I mean, are these church going people working at Home Depot picking your crops, Are those really the people you want out? And so look, I hope you're right. If I could. You can't manage or procure or manicure First Amendment speech. But if I had any advice, if I wanted to say, I've struggled my whole life with the difference between being right and being effective. And I think civil protest against, you know, the no Kings movement, it's very powerful. They're right. Where they lose all effectiveness and play into the enemy's hands is when they show up with masks, Palestinian flags and Mexican flags, bring the fucking American flags and be civil and make it impossible. I remember once you said to me, I always used to say, very Provocative things and all of these things. People were attacking me on Twitter. And you said something, you said, scott, don't give them anything. And right now I worry sometimes the protesters, I'll give you an ex. I mean, I'm really Machiavellian. If I were part of this Trump MAGA, weird, fucked up Stephen Miller movement, I'd send out 100 people with Palestinian flags and masks to try and cause trouble. Yes, I get to invoke an overreaction.
- [17:37]
Kara Swisher
They would do exactly what they claim other people do, the false flags and all the nonsense and to give people.
- [17:42]
Scott Galloway
The impression that these people on the left are out of fucking control. And, and, and get your anger glands going. Sex.
- [17:49]
Kara Swisher
I don't think they're competent enough to do that. I don't think, I think they are not competent, actually.
- [17:54]
Scott Galloway
They're just more American flags, less masks.
- [17:57]
Kara Swisher
I would agree. But I do think this has not been a protest that's given them enough stuff. Like the Floyd, the George Floyd ones.
- [18:03]
Scott Galloway
I think they're disappointed at how civil it is.
- [18:05]
Kara Swisher
I know they don't have enough stuff. And if this no King seems bigger than this military parade, it's a dueling messages here. So one of the things that doesn't help the Trump people, there's new reporting, this incredible piece in ProPublica on Trump's favorite autocrats, President Bukele of el Salvador. A US investigation found that Bukele colluded with MS.13. Of course he did. Even paying the gangs for votes, according to ProPublica. And despite his crime fighting reputation, Bukele has his top aides blocked, talking extraditions of Ms. 13 leaders to the U.S. this guy is working hand in glove. So U.S. money is going to pay Ms. 13 people. This piece is astonishing. And of course, no surprise whatsoever. This guy is such a sleazy. He presents sleazy and he is sleazy. And the way he's gotten into this is like the plot of a Harrison Ford movie of a Jack, you know, a Clancy, Tom Clancy thing where the, the alleged good guy crime fighters like up in the grill of drug dealers and other people. So this piece is really not great for Trump because it looks like Trump is paying for Ms. 13 leaders.
- [19:20]
Scott Galloway
I don't even think that'll rise to the top.
- [19:22]
Kara Swisher
I don't know. I think it has a little minute. I sent it to a lot of people I know from El Salvador. I'm like, you might want to read this because it looks like he's not pushing back crime. He's just like, he's getting one of the things in the story is he's getting people like there was a lot of crime in the streets and so there'd be dead bodies on the streets. And what MS.13 is doing at his behest is burying them. So it's, you know, it's sort of, I don't, this guy is, I think this guy is going to be eventually cooked.
- [19:50]
Scott Galloway
I mean what I was trying to do is I try and step back from the, you know, force, if you will, or get outside the matrix. I think the biggest takeaway is I think this is all going to calm down. I think to your point, I think the administration realized, no, this isn't working as well as we'd hoped. One, I think the big takeaways here are that I think to your point, a lot of states are going to prepare for this. This has created, I think a bit of a fascist indigestion. I do think more and more people are like, wow, is this really, I mean all of these emergency, fake emergency orders to violate people's rights. It seems like it's going really far. Two, I do think that Newsom is now kind of the de facto party leader and but the biggest thing is that it's been, it will be a two week distraction from thoughtful, robust discussion about around this tax bill which is really will have much more impact on the nation than, than, than, than those.
- [20:49]
Kara Swisher
Absolutely. But let me just say in these polls that are coming out, the Quinnipack poll that show very bad polling for Trump on immigration, he's underwater on every issue including the bill. Right. Including Medicaid cuts, including immigration.
- [21:04]
Scott Galloway
I thought he was still positive on immigration.
- [21:06]
Kara Swisher
I thought no, no, no, it's not. He is way down and there we'll see how the rest of them. But there's several polls where he's show where people are including. What's more interesting is obviously Democrats are gonna be against all this stuff, but Republicans are particularly irked and they were irked by the Elon thing too. That seemed to set their nose, set them off. And so this polling is interesting. It doesn't give him strength with going into this bill because polling is showing that people don't like it, don't like the bill itself. And so I do think at some point the Republican members of Congress are going to look very carefully at these polls and if Trump is not as strong as he as he seems, it'll take some shine off of him, I think. I think it absolutely does because projection of strength when polling is showing lack of Strength is to me a problem. Speaking of lack of anything, Trump says the US and China have a trade deal again. It's essentially the old deal which going back to zero, he posted on Truth Social. The deal is done pending final approval for both him and President Xi. It's such nonsense. According to Trump, China will resume shipments of rare earth minerals, though the Wall Street Journal reports China put a six month limit on those export license. The US Rolled back some of the export restrictions and scrap proposed visa limits on Chinese students. More taco. But tariffs will remain. US tariffs on Chinese goods will now total 55% while Chinese tariffs on American products are at 10%. I feel like we're back at square one. It's surprise no one of course also that Trump is highly likely to push back his July 8 deadline to reach trade deals. According to Treasury Secretary very best scent. This, this is like spinning wheels. It's like. And you're back exactly where you started essentially.
- [22:53]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, that's been our prediction all along that after all of this nonsense, after this erosion in brand equity of the US after creating a brand association, toxic uncertainty, we're going to end up kind of where we were before the tariffs. I would argue we may even be a little bit worse off.
- [23:06]
Kara Swisher
Worse off because of the brand is us brand is broken.
- [23:10]
Scott Galloway
Well, but even, even on straight empirical terms because I think, I think China has recognized they have a very strong hand because of their, of all things, their rare earth mineral magnets which I guess are key to automakers.
- [23:21]
Kara Swisher
They key to a lot of people.
- [23:23]
Scott Galloway
A lot of people and they kind of have a monopoly on. And again the calculus these guys just haven't been able to do is they look at both sides of the equation and who is bigger or where the sum is greater. But what they forget is that it's a different scale because China will starve people. We freak out when our Netflix goes down for 30 minutes. It's just their tolerance for pain is much greater than ours and their leadership's ability or willingness to impose pain for national interests are just, you know, it's just such a different system. We say to our companies, you know, our companies that donate money to PACs who get people nominated because of gerrymandering. So essentially you have kind of corporate profits sort of are the most, at this point are the most influential thing. America's run for profit, you know, China's run for power. And that is they decide what would be best according to the ccp would be best for the long term interests of China, according to them. And for them, they, the number one thing is we maintain power, but it's different. And kind of the long term thinking, if you will, is much more on China's side because they're not worried about quarterly earnings, they're not worried about BYD hitting its numbers this quarter for fear that BYD isn't going to give money to the ccb. Because basically all the money BYD has is in the CCP's control. Yeah, control.
- [24:45]
Kara Swisher
You know what he should have just done is settled the situation in Gaza and settled the situation in Ukraine. He'd get his famous Nobel Prize, right? Like that's all he had to do and shut the fuck up instead of all this manic. He confuses. There's an expression I use with people, I use it when I was a manager and I'm not a manager anymore, but that people that confuse activity with productivity, right? Like people that are manic and move around a lot, they look like they're doing things. It's sort of like, look busy, Jesus is coming kind of thing. This guy confuses activity with productivity and none of this is productive whatsoever. And it makes us look stupider and, and it gives an enormous amount of tells to all kinds of people. Whether it's Europeans or Chinese or whoever we're dealing with. Everyone can tell what's gonna happen here. World's worst poker player of all time, really, when you don't know who the sucker in the room is, it is as it's turned out, trump. But I find this just ridiculous. Waste of our time and not good for the U.S. economy. Okay, Scott, let's go on a quick break. We come back. Elon's caving continues. What a surpr eyes. Support for this show comes from pure leaf iced tea. You know that point in the afternoon when you just hit a wall? You don't have time for self care rituals or getting some fresh air. So maybe you grab a beverage to bring you back, but somehow it doesn't do the trick or it leaves you feeling even worse. What you need is a quality break, a tea break. And you can do that with pure leaf iced tea. Real brewed tea made in a variety of bold and refreshing flavors with just the right amount of naturally occurring caffeine. With a pure leaf iced tea in hand, you'll be left feeling refreshed and revitalized with a new motivation to take on what's next. The next time you need to hit the reset button, grab a pure leaf iced tea. Time for a tea break. Time for a pure leaf.
- [26:55]
Scott Galloway
Support for the show comes from Trinet. Trinet's full range of HR solutions were built for purpose driven companies such as Zap Surgical. Founded by pioneering neurosurgeon and inventor Dr. John Adler, Zap Surgical has spent the last decade developing precision brain care solutions that make world class radiological surgery universally accessible, treating more patients with greater accuracy and charting a new frontier in medicine from physical health and mental well being. And when Dr. Adler needed a provider of HR solutions to help him recruit the best of the best, he went with Trinet. Trinet provides HR solutions to the small and medium sized businesses that put their people first. That's because they know that your company, whether it's a staff of five or 500, would be nothing without the people working there. And by supporting essential HR functions from payroll to compliance to access to benefits, Trinet wants to help you take care of your employees. Trinet can also help you scale, providing industry leading expertise to help you grow your team, attract top talent and and stay competitive regardless of your size. Learn what Trinet can do for your business@trinet.com Vox that's T R-I-N-E-T.com Vox to get started Trinet your path their purpose.
- [28:04]
Kara Swisher
Test test check 1, 2.
- [28:07]
Scott Galloway
You know you need unique New York. You know you need unique New York. Does that sound all right? Ah, that's better. You can always tell something's missing when.
- [28:20]
Kara Swisher
You get isolated results like AI that's.
- [28:23]
Scott Galloway
Only right for one of your systems. Get AI that can work across your data and applications. Learn more@IBM.com the AI built for business IBM.
- [28:40]
Kara Swisher
Scott, we're back. Elon Musk says he regrets some only some of his recent posts. He didn't say which ones about President Trump writing in an X post at 3am this week that quote they went too far. Although he didn't exactly say which post or what he meant and which ones. The public groveling comes after a private phone call with Elon reaching out to Trump late Monday. According to the New York Times, Vice President J.D. vance and White House Chief of Staff Susie Wiles were reportedly the peacemakers pushing Elon to repair his relation with Trump. When asked about Elon Musk post, Trump told the New York Post, I thought it was very nice that he did that. I don't know what to say. I don't think he can hold on after. If Trump does some things he doesn't like, I think he'll have another 3am Something else happening, but we'll see. He's trying to turn his attention to Tesla Hyping the Robo Taxi launch in Austin this next week. He says it could slide because Tesla is being super paranoid about safety. Also, we'll talk about this advertising thing in a second. But talk about this appall. I mean, it's just Trump's never letting him back. That's what I read from it. And Susie Wiles has played this beautifully in jacking this guy out of the picture. And by the way, speaking of polling, his polling is even worse than Trump's.
- [29:56]
Scott Galloway
Yeah. I think right now he looks like a dog roaming around with one of those domes. You know, it's like, okay, I'm gonna.
- [30:04]
Kara Swisher
Give you one of those.
- [30:06]
Scott Galloway
I've just been neutered and I look stupid and I'm upset and depressed. I think he's just walking around with his dog dumb right now. The President is more powerful than Elon and I think he was under the impression that I'm invincible, I'm Rocket Man, I'm Iron Man. And he gets into a fight. It's a giant fucking distraction. He's not going to get anywhere near the Westlawn again unless it's highly catered and manicured. And I just thought it was so funny listening to all these Fox people talk about how sad it was the fight was. And they're like, none seem to be worried about Ukraine or Gaza. They don't. They just don't. But they're just so, like heartbroken over the breakup.
- [30:48]
Kara Swisher
I know of Musk and cheating. They all turned on Musk in a second after being his biggest cheerleaders, which was hysterical to see.
- [30:55]
Scott Galloway
Yeah. Again, another. I don't know.
- [30:59]
Kara Swisher
I know. Sad.
- [31:00]
Scott Galloway
Another. Another distraction. Who cares?
- [31:03]
Kara Swisher
Yeah. And his Robo taxi thing is. I mean, it's incredible how many people are using Waymo, even though some of them got destroyed in Los Angeles. But we'll see if he catches up.
- [31:13]
Scott Galloway
You're not going to the launch event? I mean, I was looking at it last night, 2015, he said it was going to be two years. And then every year since 2016, he said it's going to self drive is going to go.
- [31:24]
Kara Swisher
Every interview I've ever done with him, he's like, well, next year when we have full self driving, it's going to.
- [31:29]
Scott Galloway
Come within the year.
- [31:30]
Kara Swisher
One of my interviews was in a lawsuit where he lied about it. Right. And then he said the interview was fake. It was just crazy. He said it so many times and it got comical after a while. It's like, oh, this year? This year, is it gonna be this year? And of Course, we'll see. I'm sure they'll get them out on the streets because other people are deploying them so he can just copy them. But I feel like I don't think this is gonna be the winning move for him. And also for people who don't know, the Optimus robot thing is the other thing they're trying to do with Tesla. And the person who ran left, there's all these people leaving Tesla. I think it's in a. I think it's in a spiral.
- [32:09]
Scott Galloway
Well, he needs. It's going to be interesting because he has a launch event which they delayed another couple weeks. It's being in a done in a geofenced area of Austin to try and control it. But even he said Tesla is either going to be worth a lot more with self autonomous and Cathie woods out there saying that autonomous is the Future and putting $1,000 thousand dollars price target on Tesla. Or he said, or it's going to be worth next to zero. And if you were to value Tesla, it's just an automobile company and say, all right, that looks like they are losing, slash lost the autonomous race. And you valued every Tesla at the same market cap as byd, which is generous because BYD is doing better and seems to have a better car for less money. But if you gave Tesla the benefit of the doubt and said, okay, it's at least a BYD like brand and gave them the same market cap per vehicle that BYD command, it would mean that Tesla stock would decline by 95%.
- [33:05]
Kara Swisher
It's such a brand destruction. I honestly, Scott, when I see them on the street, I don't let them in. I don't know why. I just hate the brand now. And I like the brand. I really did like the Tesla brand, but I just don't like people in them. And I know that's unfair. I feel like a jerk for doing that. First time in a while, I saw a cybertruck in dc. There were a bunch of them here at the beginning of the Truck Trump era. And I saw one and I hadn't seen one in a while. And having seen it not in a while, I was like, what a terrible. Who didn't stop him and say, you can't do this, you cannot release this trial.
- [33:42]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, but just some compensation for that is it's good to know that right now there are more National Guard troops and Marines in LA than there are stationed in Syria or Iraq combined.
- [33:52]
Kara Swisher
Correct.
- [33:52]
Scott Galloway
I mean, talk about if you're the President, for me, it always comes Back to management. What is a manager supposed to do? You're supposed to deploy capital to a greater return to your competitive set. And this is how he is deploying the military capital. He's taking it down in Syria and Iraq. He's not using his sway and power to force Israel to announce a multinational Arab force into Gaza and stop the destruction there. He's not figuring out a bipartisan legislation which he could get, to put more teeth into the sanctions against Russia to get them to the table. He's sending in the National Guard to fucking Paramount Boulevard to, like, Culver City. I mean, he does not know how to allocate capital. I just don't. And at the end of the day, the president, folks, who you want as a president, is someone you don't hear about, and it's just a very good manager and knows how to allocate more capital than any capital allocator in history. And this guy is just a terrible capital allocator.
- [34:51]
Kara Swisher
Oh, he never did. Come on. He was such a shitty business person. One of the things that. My favorite part, we'll go back to the selling thing is all these people posting pictures of, like, having lunch in la. La. And, like, it's terrible here. There is a lot of AI Slop.
- [35:05]
Scott Galloway
By the way, I grew up in la. I've texted all my friends and I said, what's going on there? How is it? And they're like, you're watching the same thing I am. That's not. I mean, granted, a lot of my friends are pretty privileged. They're not living in downtown la, but they're like, yeah, we haven't seen anything.
- [35:20]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, I have friends all over la, and they're like, this is ridiculous. But anyway, there's a lot of AI Slop out there showing. Much worse than it is. It's just not true. A lot of the imagery that's being used, and Fox, of course, it's like it's Armageddon there. It's like, I feel like they're using clips from that movie Escape from LA or something like that. Anyway, the second thing, this is interesting because we're headed off to France, which. For Cannes Lions. And it's the. Or is it Cannes? Lyon? I don't know Cannes.
- [35:48]
Scott Galloway
It's called Cannes.
- [35:48]
Kara Swisher
I know it's called Cannes. Cannes Lions. Whatever.
- [35:50]
Scott Galloway
Cannes Lions.
- [35:51]
Kara Swisher
We're going to France. Underpants and advertising is the big deal here. But this was an interesting story, and I don't know if Linda Yakarina is gonna be there, but I hope not to see Her Elon Musk X has made a habit of threatening advertisers with legal action if they don't sue her.
- [36:07]
Scott Galloway
I love that. Advertise with us or we'll sue your ass.
- [36:11]
Kara Swisher
X is really used threats of lawsuits. This is a Wall Street Journal story. It was really interesting, everybody. I'd heard this from a lot of people. So to secure at least six large advertisers of pressure campaigns targeted advertisers like Amazon, Verizon, Pinterest, Ralph Laure of the illegally including accusing of illegally colluding in an ad boycott after must take over the platform. And the threats weren't empty. Pinterest declined to increase ad spending on X and found itself added to the ad boycott suit. Which is they're gonna lose. And as the world goes these days, the FTC is investigating whether antitrust laws are violated by coordinated boycotts of advertisers. So I think this is probably gonna go away. What in the fuck? Actual fuck you have to like, you have to take my ads if I don't think it's a safe place. Made tried to make safety improvements on that platform, but it's not working. It's not a safe place to advertise so easily. It's so clearly not a safe place to advertise. What do you think about this? This is nuts.
- [37:11]
Scott Galloway
I mean, I know very little about X. I got off it two years ago. But NBC did a study and they found that over 150 verified premium accounts, I guess that's the blue check ones have all posted or amplified pro Nazi content. And I think, I think the easiest way to get fired in media is to buy ads on X. Because if you buy ads on X, it's like going to work for the mob. There's no getting out. It's like you're not allowed to leave. And what basically is happening here is there's a non zero probability if you begin advertising on X, if you decide to stop, you might end up in a lawsuit. They might sue you. I can't think that's a good business strategy. I can't imagine how hard it must be to be, generally speaking, ad salespeople that end up at Cannes, they're either former athletes or hot women because that's who media buyers want to hang out with. And they're generally like 105 IQ, 135 EQ people. They're the fraternity rush chairman. They weren't the president. They weren't scholars. They're super social, super likable, nice people. And they make good Money. Their colleagues hate them because they're the most overcompensated relative to their IQ and their work ethic. But they have, they're really attractive and you know, they're nice people to hang out with. That job at X must be the worst job in the world right now.
- [38:28]
Kara Swisher
100 threatening them. They don't like being threatened.
- [38:30]
Scott Galloway
Well, and I imagine most of the salespeople at X are not threatening people. They're not. They're probably just trying to sell fucking ear cleaner ads. But whatever it is, they're doing their best to get l' Oreal to test again on this platform that doesn't work. And then I would imagine a lot of advertisers who have no shortage of places to spend their precious ad dollars are like, boss, why would I advertise with you? Is someone gonna call me and threaten to sue me if I decide to pause my campaign? Right.
- [38:58]
Kara Swisher
Which is.
- [38:59]
Scott Galloway
I don't need that shit.
- [39:00]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, I think. Listen, Linda used to have a great reputation of this cadre of people. She's never gonna work in this business again.
- [39:09]
Scott Galloway
Will she need to though? My guess is he's. They're not dumb. He probably promised her enough fuck you money.
- [39:15]
Kara Swisher
But you know how that works. People who work for him don't always end up in the best place.
- [39:20]
Scott Galloway
But it must be just realistically, Kara, he's been able to attract so many talented people to run different companies for him. I don't believe that his compensation system must be very generous.
- [39:32]
Kara Swisher
Possibly. Well, I've heard different things. I've heard mixed things. A lot of people couldn't get out fast enough and then they didn't get what they were paid. He does a combination of things. In this case, it is an embarrassment that someone who was a well regarded advertising person is resorting to lawsuits in order to sell ads. And in a paranoid fashion. I've heard from lots of people that she truly believes that there was a. Was a conspiracy because she's in that world. She's sort of a trumper and everything else. But it's just, it's an embarrassment. Linda, you used to be. I worked with her. She was good. This is an embarrassment. And she should be ashamed of herself what she's done. Anyway, she was good. She was really. She was the top one and. Or one of the top people.
- [40:15]
Scott Galloway
And she worked at NBC, is that right?
- [40:17]
Kara Swisher
She did. I worked with her and she was, you know, she was an ad person. Right. You know that type.
- [40:22]
Scott Galloway
And I sure do.
- [40:23]
Kara Swisher
And good at it's people.
- [40:23]
Scott Galloway
I hang out with it.
- [40:24]
Kara Swisher
I like them and good at good at it. But this is just you have covered yourself in shame and let me tell you, all your old friends say that to me. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. We come back, we'll talk about OpenAI Google deal. Put us in a box. Go ahead. That just gives us something to break out of because the next generation 2025 GMC terrain elevation is raising the standard of what comes standard. As far as expectations go, why meet them when you can choose shatter them. What we choose to challenge, we challenge completely.
- [41:07]
Scott Galloway
We are professional grade. Visit gmc.com to learn more.
- [41:11]
Kara Swisher
Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. With the price of just about everything.
- [41:15]
Scott Galloway
Going up, we thought we'd bring our prices down.
- [41:17]
Kara Swisher
So to help us we brought in.
- [41:19]
Scott Galloway
A reverse auctioneer which is apparently a thing Mint Mobile unlimited premium wireless Everybody to get 3030 better get 30 better to get 202020 better get 2020 every 151515 just 15 bucks a month sold.
- [41:31]
Kara Swisher
Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required new customer offer for first three months only. Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of network's busy taxes and fees extra. See mintmobile.com this episode is brought to you by Amazon's Blink Video Doorbell. Get more at your door with the easy to install Blink Video Doorbell. Get more connections. Hey, I'm here for our first date and more deliveries. Hi, I have tacos for two.
- [41:57]
Scott Galloway
Oh thanks.
- [41:58]
Kara Swisher
We'll be right down. And more memories babe. Come down. I have a surprise. All new Blink video doorbell with two year battery, head to toe, HD view and simple setup. Shop now at Amazon.com blink for just $69.99. Scott, we're back with more news. OpenAI plans to use Google Cloud service to meet its computing needs. The deal doesn't replace OpenAI's need for Microsoft's Azure, which used to be the exclusive partner. Google is not yet delivering compute to OpenAI, but the deal was reportedly signed last night. It's important they need more compute. In a similar story, Facebook is working with scale AI, this very talented guy who's the founder of it. In trying to reboot their AI, the llama stuff wasn't going as well as Mark Zuckerberg expected and he's now shook the trees there and is redoing it, which is good. He's good that way to do those things. And on the AI news front, OpenAI has delayed the release of its first open model in the which is really expected this month, but it's pulling away even. I've talked to meta people and other people and they're like, OpenAI is pulling away in terms of features, constant features. So it's still a real race going on here. Google's extended voluntary buyouts, by the way, to U.S. employees in multiple division as cost cutting measures to help fund for AI spending. And they're all rejiggering. Even at Google, there's new people, they're reassessing who should be running this and what their focus should be. Each of these companies, but they're all doing a lot. And this new I research lab that MET is doing is going to be dedicated to pursuing super intelligence. There's just a lot going on in the sector.
- [43:38]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, I thought both announcements, the announcement that OpenAI was going to work with Google, the Google Cloud, kind of blew my mind because I would have thought that Microsoft would have captured all of that business. And I don't know if it's a falling out and OpenAI wanting to diversify their compute supply chain or if according to Microsoft, Microsoft is saying we just don't even have enough, given how amazing and how dominant OpenAI is and we need more than one source of compute. It just kind of blew my mind when I heard that. The other thing that I thought was really interesting is that Google is now a newspaper company. I remember at the New York Times we were constantly sending out letters saying, saying voluntary buyout. Google just sent out voluntary buyout letters to a ton of people and basically saying that these are the jobs that are most vulnerable to AI. And typically the way it waterfalls is that all right, we offer you a buyout and if you don't take this buyout of X, if you get fired in 3 months, you only get 0.5x. Now, the problem with these types of buyouts is the best people leave. And the way you usually do these buyouts is you go to your top 10% and you say, FYI, you're on the inside. We're doing a buyout, a buyout slash layoff, trying to encourage people to leave. But you're doing really well here. You're about to get promoted. Just ignore the letter. That's the smart kind of buyout move, is you go to the people who don't want to leave. The other thing they're doing is everyone talks about quiet quitting. The new quiet firing is back to work mandates. And if you'll notice, on the same day Google announced a return to work mandate mandate because they know they'll lose 10, 20, 30% of people who got really used to walking their dog in Prospect park every afternoon. And so a lot of people will leave. So. But what's interesting is Google, which has got the greatest concentration of intellectual of IP around AI, has real insight into the world where the economy and jobs are not have said AI is going to eliminate a lot of these jobs.
- [45:39]
Kara Swisher
Which we've heard from a lot of companies. You know, know we've heard from a lot when, even when we're together, we were with. I forget who it was. Diller or someone else. He was talking about it. All these companies have been talking about this and are on the front end. I think it's actually a good thing that Google does this. I think it's a good thing that Mark, everyone was sort of writing, oh, Meta's AI thing got shook up. I'm like, good. Like they're doing it quickly. Right. They're adding and subtracting people. Mark is a going for it kind of guy. Like. Right. He always, like, meta's not working, gone like that kind of thing. And that's his superpower, I think, is his control. And speaking of good managers, he is a good manager. And so it's interesting that people look at it as a bad thing. I don't think any of this is a bad thing. I think it shows that people are sort of adjusting as they're extending, if that makes sense.
- [46:28]
Scott Galloway
Yep, yep.
- [46:29]
Kara Swisher
You know, it makes sense to do this. And the more these companies do this, the stronger they're going to be. But I do pretty much everyone at the other companies I've been talking to, a lot of these other companies do acknowledge that. That OpenAI has been running away with it in terms of features, moving faster, getting things done. Obviously, one of the worries at Meta is that ChatGPT has become the Kleenex. Right. There's like Google became the word for search, that ChatGPT is now the word for this. And so can you catch up if one company represents, you know, that's what people think of when they think of AI from a marketing point of view? It's an interesting moment, I think.
- [47:12]
Scott Galloway
I agree. I have nothing to add.
- [47:14]
Kara Swisher
Yeah. But I mean, it depends on how important it'll be to them.
- [47:16]
Scott Galloway
When have you heard that from me?
- [47:18]
Kara Swisher
I know. Yeah. They're the Kleenex. Everyone's interesting. All right, last thing. These two interesting little stories, which I thought we should talk about very briefly. ABC News has parted ways with senior national correspondent Terry Moran after he Called President Trump and Stephen Miller world class haters on X. If you remember, Moran was the one who did that testy Ms. 13 interview with Trump who kept pretending a Photoshop thing was real. The network announced it would not renew Moran's contract after a 28 year stint, calling the expos a clear violation of policies. As a reminder, ABC paid $60 million to settle case over comments made by anchor George Stephanopoulos last year. Moran seems okay. He's already told followers he did a really delightful video that'll be on Substack shortly. Sort of taking it well. Any thoughts on this? He shouldn't have posted that, largely because he was a. He was a beat reporter and was covering the White House. It's he probably. Even if he thought that he should have kept it to himself, he could have done it in a different way by pointing to polls or things they've done or videos or other people talking about it. He shouldn't have done that.
- [48:23]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, but Dan Rather and Peter Jennings did much worse. But when the market was booming, they didn't fire people for this. They just called him in and said, hey boss, sex with your grownup. Don't do this again. So he wasn't fired by abc, he was fired by Alphabet and Meta, who are sucking so much oxygen out of the room of cable ad supported news that these guys are looking for, looking for reasons to fire people. And I think this is, quite frankly, I think this is bullshit. I don't think this is how you treat people. The Guy worked there 28 years. He was the kind of guy that in my mind sort of did the work and was good at what he did. So what you do is you're commenting to say what? You made life hard for us. Business sucks. You need to announce that. I don't know Terry. I mean, I know Terry. I don't know him well. I think he was looking for his next gig. ABC needs to cut costs. There's a way they could have done this without publicly shaming the guy pretending to have fucking virtue. If the company was going, if the company's revenues were increasing 10 or 15% a year, they would have called him in and said, boss, you can't do this again. He would have said, fine. And they would have wink, wink, see at the country club. But now they're all looking to cut costs. So they pretend to be virtuous and have these journalistic standards. If Terry had been anchoring a news program where they had more and more opioid induced constipation ads that were Increasing the ad rates faster than inflation. They would have found out Skyrizi.
- [49:43]
Kara Swisher
It's Skyrizi is the ads. But go ahead.
- [49:45]
Scott Galloway
But Mark Zuckerberg fired him, not abc. ABC is looking for any reason it can to lay off people and then pretend they're journalists. Meanwhile, they're about to get fucked in the ass by in a bad way, not the pleasurable way, by a fascist and bend the knee like every other media company that's scared to death at this guy right now, trying to stray out of his crosshair. So, yeah, fine. When people work for you for 28 years, they're given do overs.
- [50:15]
Kara Swisher
I agree. Scott. I think he's a talented bride, but he did put himself in a. Given the history here recently. Not a smart move on his part. I agree. He should have been just taken off for a little while, talked to and then he would. Had. I would have had him.
- [50:31]
Scott Galloway
Remember when Dan Rather walked off set and CBS went to black for what was it, six minutes?
- [50:36]
Kara Swisher
Yes, I remember.
- [50:37]
Scott Galloway
He left the air. But they found excuses to keep Big Dan around.
- [50:41]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, until he did that lawsuit that didn't work out so well. They definitely. I agree, I agree. When I saw it, I was like, oh, no, no, no, he's coming back.
- [50:49]
Scott Galloway
All these companies talk about how we're a family and a team. Team. You don't need a family or a team when you're doing well. You need them when you up. They should have treated him. He was there 28 years doing the work. You showed the guy a little bit more grace. And if. If at the first false move that you up, you get ceremoniously drawn and quartered, guess what? All of us are going to be unceremoniously fired at some point.
- [51:11]
Kara Swisher
Well, except now he's not because he's on his own. I'm like, welcome to the. Do whatever the you want.
- [51:15]
Scott Galloway
I hope he does well.
- [51:16]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, let's do substack.
- [51:18]
Scott Galloway
Let's promote it. Do you know what it's called?
- [51:19]
Kara Swisher
Absolutely. I'm going to bring him on on Scot Free August.
- [51:22]
Scott Galloway
Oh, I like that.
- [51:23]
Kara Swisher
Yeah.
- [51:23]
Scott Galloway
Oh, that's cool.
- [51:24]
Kara Swisher
I'm gonna bring all troublemakers. Bringing in Scaramucci. I'm making troublemakers for you.
- [51:28]
Scott Galloway
I really like Terry because more than anything, he's very handsome.
- [51:31]
Kara Swisher
He's very handsome. He's a handsome man. In any case, I agree with you. Given this environment, he shouldn't have done.
- [51:38]
Scott Galloway
ABC, you're so righteous. Now here's $10 million. Dear fascist, dear leader. Oh, ABC. Good for you. Bobby Iger. You're a man of principles.
- [51:46]
Kara Swisher
Here's the thing. Thing I've never thought of anywhere I worked as my family. Have you? I've never had been under that delusion. You have a much more romantic version of companies, don't you?
- [51:57]
Scott Galloway
Yeah, but my companies are smaller and I get very strong paternal reward from my companies because it's a bunch of young people. So I get very. I'm very rapacious. The first year or two years I'm like, you got it. This is like the Navy seals. Anyone can try out, but most of you aren't going to be here anymore. Year. But the people I've worked with, I mean, you know, my people I've been working with, my people I had 20.
- [52:20]
Kara Swisher
Years of seeing people working for code. I get it, I get that. And I never would have treated them like this, but it's a really interesting thing is that a lot of these. I kind of would rather the Google thing like, okay, it's not working. We're shifting. It sort of feels cleaner to me in a lot of ways and not be offended by it. But Terry Moran is a very talented broadcaster and we wish him incredible well about wealth and health and whatever the heck. And don't feel bad, Terry. Don't worry about it. Fuck em if they can't take a joke. Anyway, you'll like it better on the outside. It's much more fun.
- [52:55]
Scott Galloway
That's right. Come on in, the water's fine. Independent. Independent. Well, you're an independent journalist. Independent, like whatever it is I do.
- [53:01]
Kara Swisher
Yeah.
- [53:01]
Scott Galloway
You're gonna enjoy it. It's fun.
- [53:03]
Kara Swisher
Yeah. It's true you're not a journalist, but you're something. I don't know what you are.
- [53:06]
Scott Galloway
I'm something.
- [53:06]
Kara Swisher
You're a turducken. You're a turducken of some sort.
- [53:09]
Scott Galloway
I'm that alien from Close Encounter. It's like we don't understand him, but we think he's nice.
- [53:15]
Kara Swisher
Yeah. In other Disney news, this is interesting though. Disney and Universal have sued AI Image Generator Midjourney, which is a people really don't like Midjourney for copyright infringement. The lawsuit alleges Midjourney helped itself to countless copyrighted works to train some of its software. While news organizations, record labors and others have filed similar suits. This marks the first suit by a major Hollywood studio. This is a good move on their part. Midjourney, just like this. You know, doing shit with Mickey is not cool for or whatever Mickey's out of. Maybe he's out of copyright, but I think his parts of him is. Parts of Mickey is. But what do you think about this?
- [53:51]
Scott Galloway
When I was in the fraternity, one of my fraternity brothers or one of my close friends was the head of campus events at UCLA or involved in campus events. And he ran this ad that showed for Simba. They were doing a screening of the Lion King and he showed Mickey Mouse riding Simba in the Daily Bruin. And we got a call from, I think it was Disney's lawyer saying, hi, Just FYI, you'll be served a subpoena. We wanted to give you some Ford notices of courtesy, but you know you're not allowed to do this. And I'm like thinking, I can solve every problem. And so of course we did like three bong. And then I said, I know Michael Ovitz was president of our fraternity. He was president of ZBT ucla, we'll call him. We know these powerful people. I know how to solve this, right? I think I can fix any problem. Total arrogant douchebag American male. And I'm like, but first we need to get high. So we call the lawyer and we say, look, we apologize. This was clearly wrong. We won't do it again. But we were fraternity brothers with Michael Ovitz thinking that would carry real wait. And we won't do it again. And we apologize. We're just, you know, just a bunch of college kids. And the council said, the general counsel was like, oh my, my. My daughter goes to UCLA and end up. We know her. We had a nice conversation. Da, da. He's like. He was like, anyways, guys, he goes like, back to the lawsuit. He's like. He's like. He's like, guys, I'll see you in court. You don't. With the mouse. And then he hung up.
- [55:23]
Kara Swisher
And what happened? You took it down, right?
- [55:27]
Scott Galloway
And here's the bottom line. The best companies usually invest a lot, have good people, and they're also rapacious about the defense of our ip. And as I go full circle for my fraternity in this situation, this is a moment for content creators to absolutely rally together and not do one off deals. But to get someone really mean and really angry and a lot of law firms and charge everyone a certain amount of money and go after all these guys and say, okay, if we see you're crawling our books, our content, our songs, our speeches, anything, we're coming for you. And you gather it all similar to what the artists do around the rights labels, where they say you can, and then we'll license it to you. We're going to make a Lot of money or you guys are making a lot of money, that's fine. If you want to use all of Penguin portfolio, Randoms, House. This is archive of every single book they have. Fine. And then we're going to figure out a deal with our authors. We're going to do this for all artists. We're going to. By the way, I met one of my. I literally met my favorite artist last night. We'll come back to that, because I know you're dying to talk more about me, but this is a moment. We passed that moment about 20 years ago, letting Google crawl our shit, and now it's too late. This is that moment in AI. All of these guys should be binding together. Everyone from Axel Springer to News Corps to the Royal Academy of Arts to everyone that has intellectual property. Shit.
- [56:51]
Kara Swisher
That was what Diller said a year ago. A year and a half ago.
- [56:54]
Scott Galloway
100%. And I said it a year and a month ago, thank you very much. But they need to speak with one voice and they need to be very aggressive in the pushback here. All these little efforts pushing back Reddit filed a lawsuit last week. They all need to come together.
- [57:11]
Kara Swisher
How you doing?
- [57:11]
Scott Galloway
Anyway?
- [57:11]
Kara Swisher
You're 100% right. 100% right. Well, we'll see if they do. So the mouse. We like this move, which you did to Terry. Not great.
- [57:19]
Scott Galloway
You didn't want to hear about my favorite artist.
- [57:21]
Kara Swisher
Oh, who's your favorite artist? Very quickly.
- [57:22]
Scott Galloway
So I went to this very, very fancy event last night. I went to the Royal Academy of Arts, like, summer gala last night. You know, I don't like to go out.
- [57:29]
Kara Swisher
Do you wear spats?
- [57:30]
Scott Galloway
I was forced to go out. And I only own one piece of art. I don't buy wine or art because all my friends, as they got rich, started buying art and wine. And I'm like, I'm just not that guy. But someone very important to me, when I was in Istanbul with them, took me to see this exhibition, said, I know you'll just love this guy, even though he knows I'm not in art. And it was a guy named Grayson Perry, and his art, he has. Do you know that big orange. You probably know better than I do. You know that big orange sketch etching I have in my living room, and it's called Map of a Politician, And I just fell in love with it. And then this person, for my birthday bought it for me. And it was the only piece of art I own. And he's a really interesting dude.
- [58:09]
Kara Swisher
Did you buy any?
- [58:10]
Scott Galloway
Oh, no, I didn't No, I literally own one. I own two pieces on one piece of art and one photograph. The piece of art makes me feel closer to the person who bought it for me, and I love it. I have a photograph of Otto Frank and returning to where his family was. And whenever I'm feeling sorry for myself, I just go look at that photograph. But anyways, he was there last night and I got to meet him and that was really exciting. He's a really lovely man. But anyways, I got to meet the artist of the one piece of Art Island.
- [58:35]
Kara Swisher
Oh, that's nice. That's lovely. Scott, you are just evolving into such a lesbian. It's fantastic.
- [58:41]
Scott Galloway
All right. By the time I'm 90, I'm going to be like, I'm going to have manners. I'm going to be able to read the room on my hundredth birthday.
- [58:47]
Kara Swisher
The journey of Scott Galloway.
- [58:48]
Scott Galloway
There we go.
- [58:49]
Kara Swisher
All right, Scott, one more quick break. We'll be back for predictions.
- [58:52]
Scott Galloway
He's a human boy. This Father's Day helped dad be all he can be with a gift from the Home Depot. Because he's not just dad. He's the handyman of the house. The plumber in a pinch and the emergency mechanic. Upgrade his gear this Father's Day with The Husky Mechanics 270 piece tool set from the Home Depot. Now on Special buy for $119. A $695 value for every kind of dad. Find the perfect gift this Father's Day at the Home Depot. Oh, such a clutch pickup, Dave. I was worried we'd bring back the same team. I meant those Blackout motorized shades. Blinds.com made it crazy affordable to replace our old blinds. Hard to install? No, it's easy. I installed these and then got some for my mom too. She talked to a design consultant for free and scheduled a professional measure and install hall of fame son. They're the number one online retailer of custom window coverings in the world. Blinds.com is the goat. The goat.
- [59:56]
Kara Swisher
Save up to 50% with minimum purchase at blinds.com rules and restrictions may apply.
- [60:01]
Scott Galloway
A few weeks ago, Google dropped VO3 generative AI video. But now with generative AI sound to go with it. This is video from VO3. What do you think about the idea that we're just a bunch of prompts?
- [60:13]
Kara Swisher
If I'm generated from a prompt, how.
- [60:15]
Scott Galloway
Come I don't have six fingers? So is this about to do the first plunge into an active volcano? Let's send it. And this breaking news. The Secretary of Defense, Pete Hegseth has died after drinking an Entire liter of vodka on a dare by rfk. But how are the reviews? A slop monger's dream, says the Verge. It might actually take my job, says you YouTuber Matthew Berman. The world is not ready, says Mashable. We're so cooked, says thousands of people on social media. But are we? Maybe not. That's our take at Today Explained.
- [61:03]
Kara Swisher
Okay, Scott, let's hear a prediction.
- [61:08]
Scott Galloway
I sort of had kid gloves around this, but that one prediction.
- [61:12]
Kara Swisher
Do that noise again. What is that? What is that? Why did you just make that noise?
- [61:18]
Scott Galloway
I don't know. I have a prostate exam later today and I'm just practicing. Okay, elbows on the table. Elbows on the table.
- [61:26]
Kara Swisher
That's all I know.
- [61:29]
Scott Galloway
Run your hands through my hair. Yeah, Yeah. I think Gavin Newsom is now coming out of this the de facto leader of the Democratic Party. And that was a void the of the fricking Grand Canyon, as you've noted.
- [61:42]
Kara Swisher
Now, should he declare for his presidency? I was thinking this. I almost texted him and said, you should declare for his presidency. He has right now.
- [61:47]
Scott Galloway
He has actually.
- [61:49]
Kara Swisher
And then start making pronouncements.
- [61:50]
Scott Galloway
No, probably not yet, because it would warrant. But he's already the people who should declare presidency. The people that nobody knows because they'll get a ton of. He is already the de facto candidate by virtue of what's happened this week, and he should start. And he also, and I said this a few months ago, him bringing Charlie Kirk on and Newt Gingrich onto his podcast, as much as the Taliban of the left hates that, that was the right move.
- [62:14]
Kara Swisher
It was just a bad interview, Scott. I don't have a problem with him having it on. It just. He didn't do a good job. But go ahead.
- [62:19]
Scott Galloway
I think he's the de facto leader of the Democratic Party right now coming out of this, too.
- [62:22]
Kara Swisher
Can I ask. Can I add something? Who do you think? If he was running. I was thinking if he ran, his vice president should either be Pete Buttigieg or someone I saw the other night, Gina Raimondo. Anyway, those are my ideas.
- [62:34]
Scott Galloway
I think she's fantastic.
- [62:35]
Kara Swisher
She is amazing. She was. She's just sharp as a friggin T attack.
- [62:39]
Scott Galloway
If you want someone that's good for the economy and just does the work, she's. She's that person.
- [62:43]
Kara Swisher
It's a question. She may run for president, by the way.
- [62:46]
Scott Galloway
So a woman will not be the Democratic nominee, and nor should she be if we have another woman lose for the third time. Carrie, you're not going to have a female president for 50 years.
- [62:53]
Kara Swisher
I thought she would. As much as I think she is utterly capable of being president. I thought she should be the vice president for Gavin Newsom. That would be a really interesting.
- [63:01]
Scott Galloway
Let me be looks this and sexist in one fell swoop. I can guarantee you not one person. The Democratic nominee will not be under 5 foot 10. No president in the last hundred years has been under 5 foot.
- [63:11]
Kara Swisher
We are a handsome man. He's a handsome.
- [63:14]
Scott Galloway
That's my point. I hate to say it. The first we will have a female president. She will be a Republican. And the key attribute she will bring is a reputation that if your family runs a stop sign, she'll drone your ass. Yes, she will be the first female president of the US Will have to be someone so fucking scary she'll drone your ass.
- [63:32]
Kara Swisher
Well, that would have been Liz Cheney, right? That would have been in the old days.
- [63:35]
Scott Galloway
Liz is probably the closest we could have had to an electable female president. Someone else will come, come along.
- [63:41]
Kara Swisher
She would drive.
- [63:41]
Scott Galloway
Anyways, it's not going to be a Democrat and the Democrats are not going to take their chances on a gay man. They're not going to take their chances on a woman. They're not going to take their chances on someone who's less than 5 foot 10. I'm sorry. That's the bottom line anyways, as VP, that's a really good one.
- [63:57]
Kara Swisher
Just play that game for a second.
- [63:59]
Scott Galloway
I'd probably macho it up and bring in like a former military person. I don't know. Mark Kelly. There's a lot of. There's so many good VP candidates, I think. Yeah. I don't know. They'll figure out what states they need help in. Who do you like?
- [64:16]
Kara Swisher
I think there's a lot of interesting people I don't know yet because I think Wes Moore is always talked about and most feared by the right. That's for sure.
- [64:23]
Scott Galloway
He's very good.
- [64:24]
Kara Swisher
I still like in my life. Michael Bennett would be such a good president. I always think of who'd be a good president. Of course, that doesn't matter anymore. Celebrity matters probably. I think when I ran into Gina Raimondo the other day, I was like, oh, she's so fucking impress. So impressive.
- [64:41]
Scott Galloway
You know who we just had on the raging moderates pod yesterday was Richie Torres.
- [64:47]
Kara Swisher
Oh, I don't. I'm not a fan.
- [64:49]
Scott Galloway
What?
- [64:49]
Kara Swisher
Not a fan. Sorry.
- [64:51]
Scott Galloway
Oh my gosh. I love that guy.
- [64:53]
Kara Swisher
I think he's so performative. I still keep thinking I agree with you.
- [64:57]
Scott Galloway
Raised by a single mother, struggled with Depression, not impressed.
- [65:00]
Kara Swisher
I don't like him. Oh, by the way, let me say. By the way, our producers are saying there have been presidents under five' ten.
- [65:07]
Scott Galloway
But not in the last hundred years. Who?
- [65:09]
Kara Swisher
Harry Truman, Jimmy Carter.
- [65:11]
Scott Galloway
Jimmy was five foot ten under, I guess.
- [65:13]
Kara Swisher
Yeah, must have been.
- [65:14]
Scott Galloway
That's what our producers did today. What did you do?
- [65:16]
Kara Swisher
5, 9.5. 5. 9.5. I don't know how tall Harry Truman was.
- [65:20]
Scott Galloway
Okay, 1.7.
- [65:22]
Kara Swisher
That wasn't a particularly successful presidency, even though he had a great post presidency. Harry Truman, five' nine. And he came to office because the president died, so five foot.
- [65:31]
Scott Galloway
Now, Jimmy Carter was five foot ten point.
- [65:35]
Kara Swisher
All right, well, whatever. He's that tall. He wasn't tall.
- [65:38]
Scott Galloway
Whatever. All that matters is I'm 8 inches.
- [65:41]
Kara Swisher
Oh, my goodness.
- [65:44]
Scott Galloway
I won't tell you my nickname in the fraternity. I won't tell you my nickname in the fraternity. Don't force me to tell you my nickname in the fraternity, Kara.
- [65:51]
Kara Swisher
It's Tripod. So you've already told me.
- [65:55]
Scott Galloway
God, we're like an old couple.
- [65:56]
Kara Swisher
I know we are. Give me the Republican candidate, then. Give me just.
- [66:01]
Scott Galloway
No, it's going to be. I think it's going to be J.D. vance.
- [66:03]
Kara Swisher
I do not think. Think that.
- [66:04]
Scott Galloway
No, go ahead.
- [66:05]
Kara Swisher
It's either me, Marco Rubio, or like a Glenn Youngkin. That's my feeling.
- [66:09]
Scott Galloway
Youngkin's the guy who would win.
- [66:11]
Kara Swisher
Well, I'm just saying. Although he hasn't had the most spectacular.
- [66:14]
Scott Galloway
Virginia situation, but Trump's going to have so much power that he'll basically. Unless he has a huge erosion in his base, he'll be able to pick the person. I think it'll be. I don't think it'll be. I think. Oh, I don't.
- [66:26]
Kara Swisher
He likes fans. I don't think he likes.
- [66:28]
Scott Galloway
You don't think he likes Vance?
- [66:28]
Kara Swisher
Vance is unlike likable. He really is. He repels voters. They need a interesting looking person. It's gotta be like a Youngkin or. And Trump wants to keep it there, so it's not gonna be his son who forget that. I mean, he knows he's a loser probably. It's gotta be Rubio or something like that. Something like that.
- [66:52]
Scott Galloway
I think Rubio's too short.
- [66:53]
Kara Swisher
All right. Okay. Anyway, he's also somewhat charmless too. Also. That's true. When he said Lil Marco, I thought that is correct.
- [67:01]
Scott Galloway
Oh, wait. So my predict, my actual prediction is that the worst, I think probably the worst acquisition of the last decade in terms of value destruction or overpaying happened last week. OpenAI's acquisition of the design firm, I think it's called IO.
- [67:15]
Kara Swisher
Oh, yes. Jony Ives.
- [67:17]
Scott Galloway
I think Johnny Ives. Fantastic. Just to be clear, company with no products gets acquired for $6.5 billion dollars. For a guy who is a genius designer, he deserves all his due. Sorry, boss, that's not worth six and a half billion dollars.
- [67:34]
Kara Swisher
This thing will be cosplaying Steve Jobs.
- [67:37]
Scott Galloway
This thing will be written down by, let me be clear, iconic, legendary designer. Maybe even worth like a hundred million dollars, which means a $6.4 billion write down. And in addition, OpenAI is going to find that designing products, they'd be much better off. Let me save them some time. Partner with hardware firms, right? Absolutely. Hard you thinking that you're going to bring in this guy Ritchie, like genius, who dresses incredibly well and rightfully is considered one of the great designers of all time, is going to figure out a way for you to get into products? No. Very charming guy.
- [68:14]
Kara Swisher
He is. He was the last speaker at code along with Lorraine Powell, Jobs and Tim Cook.
- [68:19]
Scott Galloway
Yeah. By the way, amazing. I'm not. I'm not this. I'm not the whole thing. When the two of them did this promo video on the acquisition and it was so much like I'm just a billionaire standing in front of a billionaire wanting to be trillionaires. I mean, it was just so like.
- [68:35]
Kara Swisher
It was, it was strange. It was strange. Whatever. Let's give it to them. They've done a nice job. All right, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com to submit a question for the show or call 85551 pivot. Elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe. This week on Prof. G Markets, Scott spoke with Katherine Ann Edwards, Ph.D. economist and columnist for Bloomberg News. She weighs in on the latest jobs data and unpacks how the economy has reacted to Trump's policies. Let's listen to a clip. What we are seeing is the effect of uncertainty. And uncertainty is all about I idling. I'm not gonna move much in either direction until I know which way the wind is blowing. So I'm not gonna hire that many people. I'm not gonna fire that many people. I'm not gonna make massive investments, but I'm not gonna pull back from the ones that I have. I'm just waiting in place to understand what the world is gonna look like. And that has been the economy, really, since September. Really? Very, absolutely true. No one knows what to do because he's crazy. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. Scott, we'll be back next week from France where I will be charging things to Scott's room very soon. Very, very soon. Overpriced, whatever it happens to be. But that will be the charge there. Scott, we'll be back next week from France. In fact, Scott, read us out.
- [70:01]
Scott Galloway
Today's show is produced by Lara Naiman, Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Kevin Oliver. Ernie and her Todd entered this episode. Thanks also to Drew Bros, Ms. Sibero and Dan Shalon Dishak. Khurra is Vox Media's executive producer. Podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York magazine, Vox Media. You can subscribe to the magazineanymag.com pod. We'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. This is not leadership. It's fascist foreplay. And history will not be kind.