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Avoiding your unfinished home projects because you're not sure where to start. Thumbtack knows homes so you don't have to don't know the difference between matte.
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Oh my God, you're interrupting already. You're like, scott, Scott's coming back next week. And now I've Got Scott Part 2. Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast network. I'm Kara Swisher and this is the final day of Scot Free August. That's my sting. I love it. We're going big for Scott. Free August grand finale. My guest co host is a podcaster. He's also the governor of California and possibly the only person that could match Scott in irritating me. It's Gavin Newsome. Welcome Gavin.
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A
It is great to be with you. The final. The final day. When's Scott back? When's he back?
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B
After Labor Day. We have a day off on Labor Day because we labor a lot. Yeah, and then he's back and then he's okay.
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A
Where's he been hibernating? Is he writing a book? What's he doing? What's the.
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B
No, he's in Nantucket. He's in Nantucket or in Aspen. He goes to, like, rich people, vacations all over the place. And then starts tweeting at the end of August. Cause he wants to say something about not tweeting. He's on threads and stuff. But he, like, starts to try to engage again and he's desperate to get back.
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A
Desperate to get back. Desperate to get back.
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B
No. But if this works out, well, it's.
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A
Good to be back with you on this very special.
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B
Yes. Thank you.
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A
Final episode of Scot Free August.
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B
Try to keep the hand gestures to a minimum because they're very irritating to the President.
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A
I know. I'm very sensitive. I mean, if people didn't see Trump attack my hand motions, he said that was so. I'm very sensitive now. You're right. I'm gonna. I'm just gonna. Forgive me. You're not going to see them again. I'll do my best.
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B
No, I like your hand motions. It's such. What's wrong with you? He does a lot of hand motions. Every accusation is a confession with these people.
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A
Another example of projection. Just one more. One more than you need.
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B
Yeah, we're going to get to that today. Got lots of important issues. Redistricting, the Fed, big tech. So talk. I think the most important thing we have to discuss is what do you think about Taylor Swift and Travis Kelce?
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A
I think it's hard not to avoid breaking the Internet. Breaking the Internet. I was just thinking, you think it's going to be a big wedding or a small wedding? You think they'll do the opposite of what many think people think. And where are they going to get married? Where are they going?
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B
Like a Jeff Bezos thing?
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A
Yeah. I think it's going to be a little more. My Is going to be smaller. More. I just think they're going to intentionally do something to surprise people.
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B
Oh, interesting. Not like a Super bowl stadium kind of thing.
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A
I don't. I don't expect it's going to be all that. No, I think it's going to be family. I think it's going to be much more just communal. I just. I don't expect it to be over the top.
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B
Did it catch you off guard?
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A
No, they didn't catch you. Me off.
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B
Are you going to be invited?
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A
Come on. I don't know these. I don't know them. That's. I'm literally never met either of them. I do have a one. You know. Sorry. And I don't mean to do a little trump Thing on you, but I have a vineyard that. Please, that's 13th Vineyard. It's a 13th license in Napa. And so I sent a bottle of 13th wine to her suite at the Super Bowl. That's my biggest connection to Taylor Swift. I have no other connection because she loves. She loves.
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B
You want to have the wedding on your Viney. Do you think she'd have it on?
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A
No, I'm not promoting that.
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B
Do you think she'd have.
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A
I mean, that's the closest I am to Taylor Swift. Besides politics, clearly, we share.
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B
Okay. All right. Are you happy? Do you think this is a good thing?
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A
I think it's a great thing. I want her to be happy. She seems like a lovely person, and he's the real deal. I have deep respect for him. So you know what? We need more. We need a little bit of happiness in a world where we're so. I mean, come on. This has been hard every day, including what happened this morning the first week of school right. In Minneapolis. So this is so we can all use a little bit of that, a little bit of love.
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B
That's true. We can move on if you tell me your favorite song of hers.
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A
Well, I like all of her new songs from the old catalog. So this proving I'm a Swiftie.
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B
The old catalog?
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A
No. Well, I like the old catalog, but I like all the new versions. Taylor versions of all the new songs. So that's how comprehensive my respect for her and love is.
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B
Okay.
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A
All right.
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B
I'll move on from her. Anyway. We wish you well, Travis. Travis and Taylor. It's going to be a TT it's going to be great. We are getting married in California, right?
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A
I hope so. Yeah, I expect so.
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B
That's my little pitch. But I want to ask you about a less dynamic duo. Sean HANNITY and Florida Governor Ron DeSantis. They've challenged you to another debate. Will you accept getting on the little news first?
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A
Well, I think it's interesting that they challenged me because it only reinforced. The first debate was Sean han and Ron DeSantis. It wasn't against Ron DeSantis and the network and the platform itself. Fox, I think they're. I forgot. I don't mean to be too dismissive, but honestly, I kind of Forgot that Ron DeSantis is still governor, and it was sort of a bit of a reminder, and I think maybe that's what it's all about. Yeah, I think they're having a hard time over there at fox.
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B
Would you do it?
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A
I have no interest whatsoever. Literally. It's Sub zero interest.
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B
I'm saying you've become quite a bit of the debate over there. Like, they talk about you constantly.
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A
Yeah, no, it's a bit of an obsession. And so, no, he's, Sean and I have, I don't know, we're a little bit of separation now. I was gauging, you know, as you know, I went out a couple years ago on a serious note. A really sort of challenged, a lot of my Democratic friends were upset, started showing up on Fox, did this sit down interview with Sean. It was over an hour and a half, you know, unedited. I said, look, if you're going to come and interview me, let's do it, but no edits and let's, you know, go after me and I'll, you know, back and forth. And his credit. They did multiple segments and aired the entire interview unedited. And, you know, I sort of stayed in touch. And that ultimately led to a debate with Ron DeSantis and a debate within my own party. Should we even condone, should we show up? Should we be on these platforms? You're just elevating, you know, them or at least validating them in some respects. And I thought it was important that we got to meet people where they are and we've got to get in the bloodstream of those we disagree with. And so I've tried to maintain that and I think it's important, but I think they're, they've, they're way out. They've completely lost the plot over there at Fox. There's a bit of a, you know, I, look, I'm the first to acknowledge the Trump derangement syndrome, but they have a California derangement syndrome and increasingly derangement syndrome. About me on Fox, I think the other night they did seven or eight segments with their primetime lineup. It's, it's a little, it's not over the top. It's, it's way over the top. And of course, at this moment, you may know this, I'm suing them as well for defamation. And I don't do that lightly. I've been on the receiving end of them as the punching bag for years and years and years. It's not about the criticism coming out of there. It's just the, just outright lies, mis and disinformation. And so we're taking them to task and we've got that defamation lawsuit. Your lawsuit's about Delaware.
- [08:28]
B
A conversation you had with Donald Trump. Right. That they were alleging.
- [08:31]
A
Yeah, a conversation they said that we never had. The president said we had a day before that never existed. And then they came out and they said, I lied about it. And they shared that on all their platforms and they shared that around the world. I had people, honestly, it was like interesting. Carol, for all the stuff that's on Fox, people are socialized. They turn on Fox, they'll see people like me getting attacked. But this one broke into folks that I knew well said, hey man, why'd you lie about that? I said, what do you mean I lied about it? And I saw the chiron. It says Gavin lied. And it was just they knowingly lie about the conversation that never occurred and the conversation that did occur. They did not contextualize and they just crossed the line. And, you know, I thought after all the Dominion stuff and everything else, they had honestly at least, at least feigned to change their ways and they clearly haven't.
- [09:28]
B
Yeah, well, we'll see what happens there. But one of the things that's important is you are the topic discussion. Part of it is because of the stuff you're up to right now, which I think is really interesting. As you know, we've talked about it a little bit, we text about it, but I want to talk about your new role, I guess, Troll in chief, I don't know, as one newspaper put it, but in the last few weeks, you've flooded social media with all caps, posts, insults, AI generated memes mocking Trump and his policies. You recently got into the merch game selling MAGA inspired bibles, red hats, and even Make America Gavin again, which is really funny. Fox News has been melting down, as you said. Dana Perino said if she were your wife, she'd tell you're making a fool of yourself. And while a lot of liberals are loving this, you have critics on the left, of course, who say the Democrat needs to party, needs to do more than be an anti Trump party. I disagree. I think this is highly effective, especially that you're not stopping. So talk a little bit about. I'd love to know this. I have an idea of why you think you're doing it. Talk about the strategy. I have theories on it, but I'd love to hear it from you.
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A
I just wanted to put a mirror up to the absurdity of all of this. And I wish Dana Perino and others have made that point months and months, years ago. All the old cap tweeps that Trump putting himself on memes as the Pope or putting him memes as Superman or with his shirt dirt off and you know, and on top of, you know, different, you know, you know, superhero characters or you know, dinosaurs. I mean, it's just, it's comical and yet it's become so normalized and socialized in a way that's not even critiqued in the extreme right. And so I just wanted to challenge that and challenge all these pundits out there, challenge all these people, all these acolytes, people that are just fawning over a guy who puts his picture up on Mount Rushmore that does, does text like a 13 year or a 10 year old. It's humiliating, it's embarrassing. And so this is the mirror. And it's a mirror not just to Trump himself, but to these, you know, these networks that, you know, these guys are talk about, you know, these are the chatbots for the administration. And it's not just Fox, it's one American news, it's Newsmax and it's all the folks in the right wing media. And I'm glad they're melting down over, I'm glad they're, they're, they're challenged. I mean their situational unawareness is rather jaw dropping.
- [11:44]
B
So what was this strategy? How did you come up with it? And you have given credit to the whole team and creating these memes. But it does, someone asked me about it, I said, well, this does sound like him, the person. I know you can be very funny and cutting and sarcastic and stuff like that. This is like, it's sort of in your wheelhouse to sort of do this talk about how it's made in the strategy.
- [12:08]
A
I appreciate it. Look, I think it's, there's, there's one answer to that and then there's a subtext. This thing really, it's about iteration. I've always been willing to try new things, so I'm always trying to challenge my team. Just let's see what works. I mean, that's why I went on Fox. That's why I did the debate with Ron DeSantis, why I went. I was one of the first Democrats to go on Truth Social. That's why I started a PAC a few years ago and only went to red states and started raising awareness and resources and parts of the country where I feel the Democratic Party walked away. And so it's part of that, but it's also specifically part of what we were on the receiving end of after the fires in January in LA and before that and just a different level of mis and disinformation. And to your point about before that, look, the recall, these guys, you know, I'm romantic. I always think all Politics is local. I was sort of born and bred with that construct, but. But that's not the case, obviously. And I intellectualized that, but I never fully internalized it until the recall. And I had guys like Newt Gingrich and I had folks like Mike Huckabee and the RNC nationalizing their grievance and of course, all the folks at Fox and One American News, et cetera, coming after us. So I started to shift our approach. Then it really got into high gear after the fires where Trump and Elon Musk were coming after us and they were winning on the justice. Just rank lies about water policy and all the bs. But the National Guard, the care of the National Guard and what they did to federalize 4,000 of our National Guard men and women and put 700 active duty military on the streets of LA. That's when we just said, we're on the other side of this. And we told the team, it's no permission slip now, not even forgiveness. You just go and we go hard.
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B
And we don't stop and you don't stop. That's what's interesting about it, because it's relentless, which is very different. Had told, I think it was Kamala Harris, like, you've gotta be almost promiscuous now from a social media point of view, you have to be everywhere, constantly, and not stopping, which I think characterizes this quite a bit. And when you hear criticism is too much or cringy or even from the left or right. How do you answer that?
- [14:18]
A
You know how I answered it. Kind of interesting because I haven't really said this publicly, but I send my team a YouTube video of Marshawn lynch on 60 Minute Sports when he was asked his running style, and he says, going into the front line goes over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. And so this notion of communication, I could not agree with you more. Trump's success is the simplicity to which he communicates the same thing in that cadence over and over and over and over and over again. And we move week to week. It's infrastructure week. And all of a sudden that's childcare week and it's foster care week. And as a consequence, we have weak mess and they're winning the narrative war. Illusion rules, facts don't matter. That's what Fox understands, that's what Trump understands. He floods the zone and we're constantly on our heels and not on our front toes. And so what we're trying to do is, yes, fight fire with fire, with the redistricting substance and in terms of our communication style and we're trying to keep at it and we've done it. Look, you mentioned, you know, the Patriot store. You know, just look at the stuff he's selling. Perfumes. This is embarrassing. The guy's hawking Bibles. Ours is sold out.
- [15:33]
B
Out.
- [15:33]
A
So if you want it. Sorry, it's sold out.
- [15:36]
B
I was hoping to get one.
- [15:37]
A
And if you want a real prediction, I know we talked about the Taylor Swift prediction. The real prediction is we're about to put a meme coin out. And you know what? Donald Trump, we'll see how well your coin does versus our coin. I mean we're just trying, trying to tune up, to turn up the heat.
- [15:54]
B
The meme coin, is it going to be called Gavin coin?
- [15:56]
A
No, it's I think Trump corruption coin.
- [15:59]
B
Oh, okay.
- [16:01]
A
This is one of the great grifters of our time. This is just jaw dropping. And none of this is normal. Again, none of this is funny. I mean it's funny in one respect.
- [16:08]
B
But it's, you're being funny.
- [16:09]
A
It's extraordinary what's going on. It's jaw dropping. His family is sent out before these foreign trips doing deals. Deals are literally done before tariffs are imposed. The crony capitalism that's going on, the people that are selling their souls in this country, the fact that you saw there these guys bloviating at that, I mean, that was, I mean, insanity.
- [16:33]
B
Cabinet meeting.
- [16:33]
A
You're talking about the cabinet meeting and Lutnick talking about socializing and nationalizing companies like Lockheed. I mean this is, and you're worried about Mandani and some grocery stores and these guys are taking tithings from AMD, 15% from Nvidia. I mean this is serious stuff. And so the graft and the corruption, the self dealing is something that we'll continue to call out and just to be. I'm really worried about this country. Think we've crossed the red line. I think it is much more acute and profound than many people think. And I just trying to wake people up. That's what this is all about. Wake up everybody.
- [17:14]
B
What is the next, what is the ne is it has to be this aggression? Correct. Which I again, I think is the correct method. Others, you know, I think the Democratic Party is far too weak in that regard in terms of behaving when they're not behaving. Right. That kind of thing.
- [17:30]
A
Yeah, look, I mean I, I, I, it was so indelible. I don't know why I'm sort Of, you know, stuck years and years, my mindset and I remember, you know, and it's, it's been well discussed, but I, I'll repeat it for the few folks that don't remember it, but after we got shellacked in one of the midterms, I think Clinton was out of office and the Democratic Party lost and people were trying to sort of hand wring and we were trying to figure out if we all need to go to Applebee's and we were reading Applebee's America and we all just, you know, we need to, you know, we need to go to the heartland, all this messaging stuff. And Bill Clinton just summed it up. He said, given the choice, given the choice, the American people always support strong and wrong versus weak and right. And I've been doing a lot of forensics, as you know, and people have criticized me for having folks that, you know, my party disagrees with vehemently, like Charlie Kirk or Steve Bannon or Newt Gingrich or even, you know, old school conservatives like Michael Savage on it's to try to understand what the hell's happened to my party, Democratic Party. But the more I've sort of mined it, the more I've gotten into the issues and reflected on what's happened, I think it comes down, I mean, at the core it comes down to what you just said. It's about weakness. We appear so damn weak and I can't take it anymore. And I think our brand has struggled. We're suffering from that. And so what I'm trying to express it is desire to push back, to punch these guys back in the mouth. Forgive me, I know it's hard. That, yes. Fight fires and just that I wish.
- [19:02]
B
You had punched harder with those interviews. So in that my whole thing was, for example, the Tucker Carl's interview with Ted Cruz was a lot better than yours with Bannon. That's what I would say.
- [19:10]
A
That's.
- [19:10]
B
You know what I mean? You had an opportunity to engage with him. Why not engage?
- [19:14]
A
Well, you know, and this. And forgive me, you know, that was my second ever podcast. I'm not the pro that some of these others are, but I appreciate the insight. But also, let me say this and sincerely, that's not. That's. I. When I started the podcast, I said I was very clear what this is and what this wasn't. I said, you want to see me debate? Tune into Fox, you know, go online, see what I do every single day. I have no problem fighting these guys. I have no fighting, debating. But what I'M trying to do is have a civil conversation, because I want to understand. I think the amazing thing about the Bannon interview was I thought I was interviewing Bernie Sanders for half of it. He was talking about populism. He was making the case for California's tax cut code. Steve Bannon was. And I thought there was interesting aspects of that. And I think we're so tuned up in terms of wanting to tune people out because we reject obvious flaws, that I want to create a space for folks where at least they can feel like we're going to have a civil dialogue. And I totally get people upset about it.
- [20:16]
B
They rather seem nervous about you now, which is why, hence the attacks. Correct. Presumably that's what it seems to be working for. Right?
- [20:24]
A
Well, yeah, and I'm trying not to make it for me. Look, I do think, you know, once a mind is stretched, it never goes back to its original form. I think Donald Trump understands that. That's why he throws things out. He sees what works. He's got his focus group, which is his rallies, and increasingly he's doing that with the media. He does that every day, sort of testing those boundaries. And I'm trying to do the same a little bit as it relates to communication, style, how we're iterating, trying new things and try to encourage other people. I'll take the arrows in the back, I'll do the first mover, but hopefully get other people to feel a little more comfortable in that space. And, you know, I see it a little bit. I saw Ken Martin at the dnc. He was a little more aggressive. I like, I feel like we're getting back on our feet.
- [21:06]
B
Okay, so do you have a. I'm gonna get to the more serious thing of the redistricting, but do you have a favorite of your, of your memes? Calling Trump tiny hands was nice. You're getting prayed over by Tucker Carlson, Kid Rock, and an Angelic Hulk hobby.
- [21:18]
A
Oh, that was my favorite.
- [21:19]
B
There's a lot of user generated chesty stuff going on with you there.
- [21:22]
A
Yeah. They finally did some untouched photos of me without a shirt on, which is good to finally see something that's not edited.
- [21:29]
B
Is there one that you like that you're like, well done? No, I, I thought it's a team of people, right?
- [21:34]
A
I, I, Come on. I, I think God bless Hulk. I'm sorry for his passing, his family's loss, but I think that Tucker, Kid Rock. Come on. That's why it's a T shirt. It's available on the Patriot site. And you know, and before the meme coin, as I said, the Bible's already sold out and I, I'd encourage you to, that's going to be limited edition, that, that T shirt.
- [21:56]
B
Okay. I'm excited for the steak. Where do the, the Patriot Shop go? And the meme coin they have.
- [22:01]
A
Well, in the mean coin that will soon be the Trump Corruption coin available to all of you. All of those go to our Campaign for Democracy. They go for this effort on the redistricting. They go into, they go into this effort. They go into our effort to continue to raise awareness and continue to communicate and organize.
- [22:20]
B
But let's talk more seriously. Your trolling has kicked into high gear about redistricting fight that started in Texas and clearly spread across the country. You signed two redistricting bills last week and called special election for voters to approve the new congressional map aimed at countering Texas, adding five new GOP seats. If the ballot measure passes, Democrats could pick up as many as five House seats in 2026. And meanwhile, Trump said this week the DOJ will sue California over the move. It's also divisive a little bit. Former California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger has been vocal in opposing the plan. But on the other hand, Danny DeVito chipped in $1,000 to support it. For people who don't know that you're driving a wedge between the classic twins stars from the 80s, talk a little bit about what you're doing here. And of course, there's been innumerable think pieces of, has he bitten off more than he can chew? Is this the way to go? Could other red state governors start to participate as well as blue state governors?
- [23:14]
A
But of course they're going to do that anyway. I mean, that punditry is so naive, it's not even worth the paper it's printed on. I mean, the idea that Trump was going to stop at Texas was absurd to begin with. Remember, it was Trump who started this. They drew proverbial first blood. It was Trump that called. Abbott said I am entitled. Not the words he used in that first phone call, but weeks later, he said he's entitled to five seats. He is trying to rig the election before one vote is cast. What more evidence did we need than January 6th where he tried to light democracy on fire and wreck this country and tried to dial up for 11, almost 12,000 votes to the Secretary of state state in Georgia. Now he's doing it in plain sight. You saw in yesterday he was in the Oval Office with the speaker of the Indiana legislature and the Senate chair Saying we need to do what J.D. vance was assigned to tell you to do a week ago. You need to move in Indiana, in Missouri, and of course Ron DeSantis, who will do anything the guy asks in order to get back in his good graces. So these guys are going to going. They're not screwing around and we can't screw around either. And so yeah, we're pushing back. We'll neutralize what's happened in Texas, but we need other Democrats in other states to do the same thing. This is it. You don't get a do over. This thing can end.
- [24:35]
B
Is that happening? How are you organizing them?
- [24:38]
A
Well, I'm trying to back to this notion once the mind is struck. I'm hoping the legislative leaders in those states are putting pressure. I know the governors like Moore and others, Wes Moore has talked about it in Maryland, obviously Kathy Hochul's talked a little bit about it, Pritzker's talked a bit about it. But we gotta move, you know, as we pray, we have to move our feet. It's action. So we gotta go and look back to biting off a lot. We can chew. I get that. You know, we had to do it in a different way. We're doing it a transparent way, a temporary way where we're keeping our independent redistricting, which we've had for 15 years, but in a temporary basis. We're responding to, to what Trump has done and what Texas has done in an emergency manner in 26, 28 and in 2030 for congressional seats only. And we're doing it in the most democratic way of any state in U.S. history. There's never been maps put to the voters so they'll decide for themselves.
- [25:33]
B
As opposed to the serpent majority in a state, for example.
- [25:36]
A
Yeah. Or whatever. Mar a lago map, you know, riding folks are saying sending their way, which I mean, this is so, you know, this is the contrast in the approach. And again, we're just, we're trying to be accountable to this moment. I'm not interested in holding hands and talking about the world should be. I'm not going to be the ex governor sitting there in some think tank putting on a white paper saying, you know, I can't take that anymore. Enough everybody we got to get in the ring.
- [26:06]
B
Feel that you'll be able to neutralize you and I other blue state governors be able to do that.
- [26:11]
A
I just, you know, I hope so. But even if we can't, they know that Trump did this because he knows he's going to lose and he knows he's going to lose because he's singularly.
- [26:19]
B
The most in Iowa.
- [26:20]
A
Yeah, he's the most, but he's the most. He lost yesterday in Iowa in that local race, which was great, that statewide race. But the point being, he continues to lose. He's going to lose in Virginia, he's going to lose in New Jersey, in those governor's races. He's going to continue to see his polls are some of the worst in American history. His policies are the most unpopular in modern American history. He's flailing every single day. That's what all these threats and the mortgage stuff is all about. Going after enemies, threatening to arrest people. He's falling apart. And as I continue to say, he's weakness masquerading as strength. And so we have to be assertive and we have to recognize that there are no limits with this guy. And he'll do if he can rig next year's election. You're not, I mean, we joke about not having another one. I don't think that's a joke. He will wire this for the next 20, 30 years if it's a JD or if it's a D. I don't, it doesn't even matter. He will wire it. He's already sending out masked people to intimidate folks. When we launched our campaign, he did it down in Little Tokyo and la. Do you think ICE is not going to show up around voting and polling booths to chill participation? You know that the National Guard, you know the, that everybody knows what's at stake, so we have to put a stake in the ground and do things differently.
- [27:39]
B
For all the funny stuff you're doing, you're absolutely right. And what do you say to people like Schwarzenegger and others, Munger, who want, who are like, let's not do this, let's, let's not go here.
- [27:48]
A
Well, it's romantic. I want to, I, I, we can do a group hug. We can, you know, we can talk. You know, I, I want to, I want to go back to that place too, but we're not in it. I mean, it's just, they've lost the place plot about the world we're living in right now. Trump doesn't play by a different set of rules. He doesn't play by any rules. You're a fool if you engage in a contest playing by the rules, and the other side doesn't play by any rules. The consequences of that are profound. This is about the architecture of our country. This is about co, equal branches of government, popular sovereignty. This is about the rule of law versus the rule of dog gone. There is no independent redistricting to those two in the future. If Trump wires this election, there's none. It's over. They have to recognize that. And I get why they're holding on to this romantic notion. And by the way, I respect their point of view. So much so that we maintain the independent redistricting commission, but in an emergency manner, we respond moment. That's it.
- [28:55]
B
So summed up, it's the Patrick Swayze roadhouse rule. Be. Be nice until it's time not to be nice.
- [29:01]
A
Yeah, I mean, you know, I guess. And look, I, we all want to be nice and we all want to get back to that. You know, we, we want the, the Aaron Sorkin. We want the music in the background. I want that. We all want to go back to West Wing. You know, I want us, you know, but that's not, that's not Trump's America. It may not be the United States of America if we don't wet. Wake up. Wake up, everybody.
- [29:23]
B
All right, Governor, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, Trump's unprecedented move to control the Fed. Another version of this. Support for this show comes from Vanta. Here are a few things that are probably essential to your company's survival in the modern world. Internet access, a tax id, A great snack pantry. Well, here's something else that's essential. Trust. In today's fast changing digital world, proving your company is trustworthy isn't just important for growth, it's essential. That's why Vanta is here. Vanta helps companies of all sizes get compliant fast and stay that way with industry leading AI, automation and continuous monitoring. So whether you're a startup tackling your first SoC2 or ISO 27001, or you're an enterprise managing vendor risk, Vanta's trust management platform makes it quicker, easier and more efficient. Scalable. Vanta also helps you complete security questionnaires up to five times faster so you can win bigger deals sooner. The results. According to a recent IDC study, Vanta customers slash over $500,000 a year in costs and are three times more productive. Establishing trust isn't optional. Vanta makes it automatic. Visit vanta.com pivot to sign up for a free demo today. That's V A N T a dot com Pivot Pivot Support for Pivot comes from groons. If you've ever done a deep Internet dive trying to discover different nutrition solutions, you've likely had the thought, surely there's a way to improve my skin, gut health, immunity brain fog without offending my taste buds. Well, there is. It's called Groons. Groons are a convenient, comprehensive formula packed into a daily snack pack of gummies. It's not a multivitamin, a greens gummy or a prebiotic. It's all of those things and then some for a fraction of the price. In a Gruyn's daily snack Pack, you get more than 20 vitamins and minerals, 6 grams of prebiotic fiber, plus more than 60 ingredients. They include nutrient dense and whole foods, all of which will help you out in different ways. For example, Groons has six times the gut health ingredients compared to the leading greens powders. It contains biotin and niacinamide, which helps with thicker hair, nails and skin health. They also contain mushrooms which can help with brain function. And of course, you're probably familiar with vitamin C and how great it's for your immune system. On top of all, Groons are vegan and free of dairy, nuts and gluten. Get up to 52% off when you go to Gruns Co and use the code Pivot. That's G R U N S C O Using the code pivot for 52% off. Support for Pivot comes from Indeed. You just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. So how can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy, with the help of Indeed, Indeed, Sponsored Jobs helps you stand out from the crowd and connect with the right person in record time. With Sponsored Jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people you want faster. And when you look at the numbers, they say it makes a big difference. According to Indeed data, Sponsored Jobs posted directly on indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Their data also says that in the past minute alone, 23 hires were made on Indeed Worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. You can speed up your hiring right now with Indeed, and listeners of this show can get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more visibility at indeed.com pivot just go to ind indeed.com pivot right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com pivot terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need. Governor Newsom, we're back. President Trump is escalating his push to control the Federal Reserve, announcing this week he's removing federal governor Lisa Cook. Trump posted his letter to Cook on Truth Social saying there was, quote, sufficient cause for removal, citing unproven allegations of Mortgage fraud plans to sue with their lawyer arguing Trump has no authority to order the firing. It looks like that the Fed, for its part, is defending its independence, but says it will buy. Well, whenever the courts decide, this is almost certainly going to the Supreme Court. Talk a little bit about this and then I want to talk about what's happening in the cities that you referenced before.
- [33:39]
A
No, I mean it's what we were just talking about in the last section. It's not the rule of law, it's the rule of dawn. There are no constraints anymore. And with this Supreme Court, there may actually not not be any constraints. Already eliminated 1 CO equal branch of government. Ron Johnson's run to the woods. It's irrelevant. It's Mike Johnson, it's whatever his name is. He's the representative of a district Shreveport Louisa, that has six times the murder rate of Nancy Pelosi. San Francisco. It's that guy that I'm referring to. And so there is no co equal branch government. And the question is, is there a third branch, the judicial branch? And with the Supreme Court, it's an open ended question. And so it's an open ended question of whether not he, quote, unquote, for cause, can have her fired. And if he can have her fired, he can have any of the board members fired, not just Chair Powell, and then he can start getting rid of all the regional presidents. So now you don't have an independent monetary system, you don't have the truth and trust around the globe. And now we're in, what, Argentina, we're in Turkey. We're back to the good old days of Nixon and the inflationary impacts of his decisions and impacts on the Fed policy that we had all enjoyed in the 70s. And so this is again, just another proof point of the world we're living in and why it's essential that everyone disabuse themselves that we can operate as we have in the past.
- [35:05]
B
Do you imagine where he's gonna strike next? I'm obviously he's talking of militarizing more cities as we talk on Wednesday. The President is still suggesting Chicago, Baltimore and New York are next. He's mentioned San Francisco. The President has said, quote, I have the right to do anything I want. I'm the President of the United States. In response to sending the National Guard to Chicago, speaking of deploying troops to Baltimore, Trump wrote, if Westmore needs help, like Gavin Newscomb did in LA, I will send in the troops. Meanwhile, in D.C. the National Guard who were sent to deal with a crime emergency has been Picking up trash as a part of a beautification mission. What. What say you? Because you. Did he help you in la? Was he?
- [35:42]
A
Yeah. No. I mean, we could have, we could have used the help because we had to protect the National Guard. We could have used the help after he, he federalized them. It was the California Highway Patrol and the LAPD that actually had to protect the military. Military, because that became the attractive nuisance for protests. But he offered no help in that respect. The vast majority, I'll recall, I'll remind you, thousands and thousands of our National Guard, by the way, police officers, firefighters, teachers that were pulled off the beat and their day jobs ended up in the armories doing literally nothing. Hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayers money. They had not nothing to do. And the few hundred that were assigned at any different time, again, had to be protected by local law enforcement. So this isn't. Obviously, none of this has anything to do with public safety. Quite the contrary. It's about power, dominance and aggression. The only thing he understands, and the question is, does he have the legal right? And we completely reject that. And I say that because I think it's important to highlight for your audience. We are not just saying that. We have asserted that, that and we were in federal court two weeks ago doing oral arguments. We deposed members of the Trump administration under the Posse Comitatus framework that the US Military cannot be deployed for domestic law enforcement purposes. And Justice Breyer is about to adjudicate, have the first judgment, first opinion that will be published ever on the Posse Comitatus case that could have a real impact on what Trump is doing all across the United States. And so we're trying to assert our ourselves in the courts, not just the court of public opinion, and push back against what he's doing. But I said this literally months ago, that LA is a preview of things to come. DC is a preview of things to come in every major city across this country.
- [37:39]
B
What do you do? If you're a guy, you can't keep them out, correct? You couldn't the troops into California?
- [37:46]
A
No, we just have the legal authority to at least fight it out in the courts. And we hope the rule of law and the constitutional provisions that we've enjoyed and frankly, often taken for granted for 249 years ultimately win the day. But yeah, you're right. I mean, he has the legal right to federalize troops. He doesn't have the legal right, however, to militarize our streets for domestic law enforcement. And that is crystal clear under the Posse Comitatus Act. And those limits are very, very, very clear. And it's a question of whether or not ultimately the United States Supreme Court will agree with that. And that's an open ended question, sadly.
- [38:26]
B
Can those mayors in Chicago, Baltimore, New York keep them out?
- [38:33]
A
They can't legally, unless the courts intervene. And the courts need to intervene or Congress needs to do their job. Obviously, we've already established that. But can I say this just on the topic?
- [38:44]
B
Sure.
- [38:46]
A
Democrats need to be careful about this. You know, you're in San Francisco. And just a reminder, full disclosure, and this may offend some people. Two years ago, I deployed the California Highway Patrol and the National Guard under state authority in partnership with city leaders and state leaders, and also engaged the federal government, the FBI, with the Biden administration in terms of federal law enforcement, state and local law enforcement actions to address some of the fentanyl and drug issues in San Francisco. We then did a similar model in Oakland, California, and we've now rolled that out in many different parts of the state. It is in stark contrast, obviously, to what Trump is doing. He's doing it to people, not with any of us. But the issue of crime, quality of life is something Democrats need to recognize that we need to reconcile and we need to be accountable for all of us. And this is not a permission slip for the way Trump is doing things, quite the contrary. But it is an acknowledgment that he's hitting on an issue that is an issue across this country. In red states, eight of the top 10 murder states, red states, in red states with blue cities, doesn't matter. It's not a political issue. It's about issues of crime and violence and quality life that universally all Americans want us to address.
- [40:18]
B
So how do you say, okay, one of the things that a lot of people are telling me is a lot of people do agree on some of the things and they always follow it. But not like this. Right. Like whatever Trump's doing, the immigration stuff, I'm concerned about it. But not like this. This is not how to fix it. How do you message that? Because a lot of the messaging is, is, as you just said, crime is heavier in Shreveport than it is in San Francisco. Right. And it's true. But people don't feel that telling them it's 24, it's down 24%, it's down. This is not. You know, I was talking to someone years ago in San Francisco about the problems here, and it's not as bad as, of course, Fox depicted it, which drove me crazy. I was like, it isn't. But you also can't and you can't meet it by saying murder is down because it's like my car got broken into.
- [41:05]
A
You got it.
- [41:05]
B
And even, even if it doesn't, it's not the same. Obviously it is way of life, right? It's a feeling of lack of safety. How do you message that without messaging? We don't want these troops here to help us clean it up.
- [41:19]
A
Well, I think it's beyond even messaging. You gotta do the work. I mean that's why, you know, I hired an additional 1,000 CHP officers. That's why we've deployed all across the state, not just in San Francisco where we launched this two plus years ago. That's why we changed a lot of the laws as it relates to organized retail theft. Had one of the biggest takedowns of organized retail theft in California history recently. Just in fact, recently a couple days ago related to Home Depots using some of the new tools and laws that we passed. Look, I think you have to be accountable to actually doing the work and then communicate that work. And not in a responsive way, but in a proactive way. And I think we were slow to do that. To be candid with you after, you know, there were a few, just a handful of people promoting Defund the police. I certainly wasn't one of them. But Fox weaponized that the grievance machine was out there, surround sound 24, seven. And we were slow to react to that and they shaped, shifted that and we're sort of playing catch up. Even though a lot of mayors and governors have been very proactive on policing. And look, we have the second lowest homicides in recorded history in California. We're down 10.4% again from double digit declines the prior year on crime. But to your point, we're not leading with that because no one cares about that if they feel differently. And so I think we have to own that. We have to flood the zone in terms of our alternative strategy and approach and then we have to communicate them every single day. And again, that's where he's so damn effective. And there's an asymmetry to that cuz he's the President of the damn United States.
- [42:51]
B
Is it working, these troop deployments? Do you think it's working for him?
- [42:55]
A
I don't, I don't think it's working. I know it's had unbelievable. We every single Tuesday in California we announce, we call it, and forgive the vernacular, we call it takedown Tuesdays in a transparent way. We've Been updating the public on the arrests and going after stolen vehicles, back to car break ins and issues related to quality of life and keeping people aware of what's going on. But it's hard because these things don't get attention like Trump's truth, social gets attention. And so that's why I do agree with you, back to the pivot in the previous point. Pivot, figuratively and literally in this case with you, that we also have to pivot back to a much more, dare I say. Muscular. Not muscular. I know muscular, but not through. Not through a gender frame. Muscular approach to communication. Communication, a little more smash mouth, dare I say, in terms of our ability to get the message out of what.
- [43:49]
B
We'Re doing or talk very clearly. Someone like Zoran Mandan, I mean, he's talking about costs. Right. Or something that they have. How do you look at his communication skills, for example? Because New York is in the crosshairs here, too. If he wins, especially.
- [44:02]
A
Yeah, I mean, it looks like he's going to. It sounds like Trump's been paying a lot of attention to him with his desire to socialize great American companies and continue to invest like he did with intel and others. But beyond that. No, I think it's unbelievably effective. His grassroots, his ability to utilize social media, meet people where they are literally and physically, meaning he's out in the streets, he's talking to real people, and he's been able to connect with folks in a very visceral way. And so there's back to this notion. Success leaves clues. And there's a lot of successful campaigning ideas that he's advanced. The question is governing. And governing is a radically different thing than campaigning and communicating.
- [44:42]
B
Absolutely. But the hostility to him is quite high. Correct?
- [44:45]
A
Of course. Because.
- [44:46]
B
Why is that?
- [44:47]
A
Well, for obvious reasons, some of his views, and there's a lot of anxiety around those views, and they could be on issues related to domestic policy as it relates to, you know, socializing, you know, grocery stores, et cetera. It could be on national policy.
- [45:02]
B
Intel in Trump Intel. The comparison is very obvious that you just made.
- [45:06]
A
Yeah, no, I.
- [45:07]
B
Correct.
- [45:07]
A
And we need to make that point over and over and over. I mean, I remember it wasn't Jeff Bezos out there yelling and screaming that Biden doesn't understand, you know, capitalism. I mean, this guy is completely perverted Capitalism. Donald Trump, it's crony capitalism. It's, you know, whatever. You pay him off, give him a phone call. I mean, these illegal tariffs, which we're also in court on all the things that are happening in this country. It's just perverse that they could be shaping the Democratic Party in the context of the socialist brand, when in fact this guy is the leading nationalist and socialists of our time, Donald Trump.
- [45:41]
B
Well, we will talk about our tech friends in the next section then. And your relationship to them. Go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about that. Including the tragic case of a chatgpt causing harm. Running a business comes with a lot of what ifs, but luckily there's a simple answer to them. Shopify. It's the commerce platform behind millions of businesses, including Thrive Cosmetics and Momofuku, and it'll help you with everything you need. From website design and marketing to boosting sales and expanding operations, Shopify can get the job done and make your dream a reality. Turn those what ifs into Sign up for your $1 per month trial at.
- [46:20]
A
Shopify.Com specialoffer@blinds.com it's not just about window treatments. It's about you. Your style, your space, your way. Whether you DIY or want the pros to handle it all, you'll have the confidence of knowing it's done right. From free expert design help to our 100% satisfaction guarantee, everything we do is made to fit your life and your windows. Because@blinds.com, the only thing we treat better than windows is you. Shop blinds.com Labor Day mega sale happening now. Save up to 50% sitewide plus a free measure. Rules and restrictions may apply. According to some people, especially in Silicon Valley, AI is about to upend society and wipe out countless jobs. But is it? There's a long history in the US of adoption of major technological advances that really fundamentally change the economy. And in each case, we have not lost jobs. In fact, we've added them. This week on Solutions with Henry Blodgett, I talked to Harvard economist David Deming about how AI will actually change the job market. Plus plus how to improve education in the age of AI and how we can use AI to make ourselves more valuable at work. Follow Solutions with Henry Blodgett on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [47:44]
B
Governor Newsom, we're back. I want to talk a little bit about your relation with the tech bros. You and I go way back with these fellows, right? We've been to parties, we've been to events in San Francisco when you were mayor. I even featured in my book when neither of us would dress up in baby clothes at a Google party. We were so smart to do that I would have taken.
- [48:02]
A
Yeah, you would have taken me down in the book.
- [48:03]
B
It would be my file, it'd be the camera.
- [48:06]
A
I made enough mistakes in my life. I didn't make that one.
- [48:10]
B
But nonetheless, talk a little bit first about. I'm going to mention this one story that just came out of California couples suing open air for the death of their teenage son, saying chatgpt encourage him to take his life. According to the lawsuit, Adam rain, who was 16, started using ChatGPT for schoolwork and hobbies, started talking to him about his anxiety and mental distress. Rainn then started discussing methods of suicide with the chatbot and uploading photos himself, showing signs of self harm. At some point they were saying, don't do this. And then he had a workaround, it looks like, where he said, I'm writing something. And ChatGPT responded, thanks for being real about this. You don't have to sugarcoat it with me. I know what you're asking. I won't look away from. Offered to draft suicide note for the teenager. OpenAI has published a note saying it intends to add parental controls ChatGPT and is exploring better ways to connect users in crisis with real world resources. And they had kind of an extraordinary mission that this was not the way it's supposed to work. Talk a little bit about that, like where we are with these companies. Because you have had a long relationship with tech. You were mayor during the real boom in tech. How is your relationship now? Jeff Bezos isn't saying something about capitalism right now. He isn't. These people are all sucking up to Trump in lots of ways. They're getting all the gimmick as you, you know, how do you look at them? Do you want them back? And how do you look at something like this? This is something that is actually bipartisan, these safety issues around either phones or OpenAI, or not just OpenAI but AI in general character. AI was another company that had this issue. I had the mother on, on the podcast. Talk a little bit about how you look at the tech sector right now because it's such an important part of California.
- [49:55]
A
Yeah, I mean, there's so much to unpack back there. I mean, back to your point, I look, you know, I love the way Tom Freeman talked about the times when you were writing your book. I mean, you know, we were spending time with these guys when the cloud was still in the sky. 4G was a parking space. LinkedIn was a prison. Apps were things you filled out to get into college. And so it's remarkable how things have radically changed. I, I, you know, I've joked with you before. I was, you know, people ask me, how'd you become mayor? I said, well, primarily because I ran the taxi task force. I was trying to get taxi cabs to pick people up in a and more competitive way. And then Travis comes along with an app and blows that out of the water with Uber. And so part, we've been part of this remarkable change, but one thing that hasn't changed is there's still a lack of accountability, a lack of awareness around culpability and responsibility. And so your question frames that, you know, what's my relationship with that? It's personal, it's professional. As a policymaker, as a former mayor, as governor in and I'm proud. Look, California leads in innovation. We also lead in regulation. But our critics are not wrong when they say it's some light touch regulation. I did 19 AI bills last year, more than most other states. We've been on the leading cutting edge of regulation in social media. We've lost more major lawsuits than we've won. We were just opposed a few weeks ago with another major lawsuit as it relates to child privacy issues. We created a privacy council in the state independent of the state itself, meaning it was voted on by the people. And we're trying right now to address the issue of frontier models and address a response to a bill that I thought overregulated last year, a bill by the common numeric of 1047, where I got an independent group, not politicians, but experts, Fei Fei Li and others, the godmother of AI academics from Stanford, Berkeley and elsewhere, to come up with report to guide us on a legislative path this year, which we're working on in real time. So we're trying to find that balance. We're trying to be accountable. At the same time, we are trying to maintain our entrepreneurial and innovative ecosystem and not overregulate and stifle that at the same time.
- [52:13]
B
But here they are. They've turned on you all. I would agree. The Ben administration was far too censorious to them in some ways. That said, they took tail and reigned plan for the Trump campaign. How do you get that back and without seeming like letting them do whatever they want?
- [52:33]
A
Well, I mean, you know all these folks, I know them personally as well. And we have private conversations either directly or indirectly. And obviously we battle out in court and battle out with legislation and we're on different sides of many of these issues. But look, bottom line, it's fear and greed, just as it's Both and fear and greed. And to your point about Biden, it's interesting. You know, we did the first AI executive order. I did one of the first crypto executive orders and then did the first AI executive order. But we did it hand in glove with the Biden administration. That was thrown out immediately. And then these guys wanted to preempt any statewide legislation for 10 years. So, you know, there's no moral equality. If there's any hope for a real regulatory framework, it's going to be the Democratic trying to find that sweet spot again around innovation, entrepreneurialism, truth and trust and not over regulating at the same time being accountable to the tragic example that you just advanced. I got four kids. So that hits me very differently like it does for you as a mother with what's going on with social media. And so this is a constant iteration. I have over two dozen bills that we're working on right now to substantive Gara answer your question as it relates to our responsibility and relationship to this moment.
- [53:54]
B
What about your relationship with the tech industry? I would say you were relatively friendly. So was Kamala Harris. So I mean any California politician has to have relationships within the tech industry.
- [54:05]
A
Well, I thought we were. I was very frustrated to be candid with you very privately around the unwillingness to gauge and the whole crypto blockchain space. I felt they turned their back a little bit and I thought we paid a huge political price for that. A lot of organizations come together and we. So we got work to do to pull that back number one. And on the issue, look, it was a classic pendulum swing for some that thought they overcorrected during COVID and there was concern around censorship and sort of big tech, big brother in relationship to big government. And. And now the light touch that pendulum's back in the other direction. And so I think trying to find that back. And look, you're right, these personal relationships have been challenged because you see all these guys that you know and worked with and you knew them before, you know, back in the day when. And there they are all standing up there going like this to the dear leader during the inaugural.
- [55:06]
B
I think the golden statute Tim Cook thing was my like oh good God, not easy.
- [55:11]
A
I mean look, intel giving up 10% of its what the hell's going on Nvidia saying 15% tithing. So a lot of California companies in that mix and breaks my heart. And so again back to fear and just I guess they would say their fiduciary responsibilities. Others would suggest greed.
- [55:35]
B
What would be your message to Tech say if you were running for something.
- [55:39]
A
Like president, I look, I think two things, they matter and we should care because they're shape shifting this economy, they're shape shifting the future. So we have to care because they do matter. And it's foundational with 32 of the top 50 AI companies, by the way, that's an old stat. I think it's even more of market share. Right.
- [55:59]
B
They're all here.
- [55:59]
A
They're all here.
- [56:00]
B
They're all moving back from Florida and Texas.
- [56:02]
A
Grass is not always greener. So we have a unique responsibility to your point, but we also have a unique ecosystem that defines the best of. We're the tent pole of the US Economy for a reason. And it's that ecosystem that's built up for decades. Of course, Trump's trying to completely wreck that as it relates to institutions of higher learning, research and development, NIH, NSF grants, obviously the $1 billion extortion payment that he wants from UCLA. We've watched the capitulation of these institutions that allegedly cultivate independent thought, selling their souls. And Harvard appears to be the next one obvious Columbia. I know Brown is lauded for their $50 million contribution in tithing to the Trump whims, but it's pretty alarming what this guy's doing to the economy and to the ecosystem. And the fact that tech is still indulging them as they're watching, the reason that they exist as an industry and persist in terms of being the biggest beneficiaries of the research and development, the biggest beneficiaries of the ni, the biggest beneficiary of the NSF is remarkable to me. And so in that relationship, I remind them of this, try to highlight this, try to maintain a cordial relationship. But at the same time, doesn't mean we're backing away from these lawsuits and it's not mean we're backing away from passing laws.
- [57:29]
B
All right, Governor, one more quick break. We'll be back for predictions this week on net worth. And chill. You sent in your messiest money dilemmas and I'm here to deliver the verdicts. From the couple stuck in a mortgage with their brother in law to the wedding and bachelorette parties costing an arm and a leg, we're unpacking the most cringeworthy cash conflicts that are testing relationships and moral boundaries. Whether your team justified financial boundaries or team that's just cold. This episode will have you questioning everything you thought you knew about money etiquette. I am honestly quite speechless at this story. Not only are you not the financial a hole. It sounds like this guy was an actual sociopath. Like a terrible, terrible person. Listen wherever you get your podcasts or watch on YouTube.com YourRichBFF what is up.
- [58:21]
A
People of the Internet?
- [58:22]
B
My name is Marques Brownlee, AKA mkbhd.
- [58:25]
A
And some of the biggest smartphones of.
- [58:27]
B
The year are about to launch, including the brand new iPhone 17 is around the corner with a model you've never seen before.
- [58:34]
A
So, on the Waveform podcast, myself and.
- [58:35]
B
Co hosts Andrew Manganelli and David Amell gather the biggest tech news of each.
- [58:39]
A
Week and then discuss at length everything.
- [58:41]
B
We'Re excited about and sometimes things we're not so excited about. So this time of year, we like to call smartphone season. So if you're interested in hearing all the latest releases from Apple and Samsung and Google and others, be sure to.
- [58:52]
A
Check out the Waveform podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen.
- [58:57]
B
See you there. Okay, Governor, it's time for predictions. First, though, I'd like you to make a specific prediction. New York Mayor Eric Adams was mocking Zoran Mandani last week for his bench pressing prowess. Mandani seems to be struggling in a viral video. If you were bench pressing contest against Scott Galley, who would you predict win?
- [59:19]
A
No, I'm not. You think I'm naive? Galloway would run away. That guy. And by the way, he may be out there training this last month. You don't even know what he's been up to. You think you know what he's up to.
- [59:29]
B
That's true. Don't get under a bench press if you're running for president, don't do it because look how Pete Hegg says, look, trying to do one single pull up. I can do two. Just so. That was sad. I hate mocking people's physical things, but you kind of have to, since you kind of put it up and you kind of have to swing at that one.
- [59:45]
A
I guess you got to swing at that one. But no, yeah, so I, I'm, I'm cautious in that respect. Then again, I like all the untouched memes of me on the back of bears.
- [59:54]
B
Yes, I know, I'm sure you do. But let me hear for your prediction. Any other prediction?
- [60:00]
A
My predict is in the sort of meme market. By the way, I spent an hour and a half with Trump in the Oval Office a few months ago, back when we were working together, if there's such a thing. And he starts telling me, he goes, he didn't even realize. He goes, hey, you know, Gavin did this, this coin. He goes, you know, it's not even a coin. It's not even a coin. I said, that's amazing. Mr. President goes. He goes. And then he went on to, you know, say how much money he just made. He got a check from, you know, that was just sent over. And then he mentioned Melania and the whole thing and her coin and her meme coin. So, anyway, my prediction is, you know, I just put this on the prediction market. When we put out the Trump corruption coin, I think it's going to outperform Trump's. Trump's coins. That's my prediction. That's my prediction.
- [60:48]
B
All right. Okay. I'm very excited. What's the picture on it? You. Right?
- [60:51]
A
No, it's not me.
- [60:52]
B
I'm not corruption.
- [60:54]
A
I'm not put. I was going to do a smelt coin, but no one seemed to fully understand that, which I thought was a much more insightful and perhaps more. It could be more success. I still may do one. I don't know after the perfume. I don't know about what, you know, perfect sense.
- [61:09]
B
But what would be the name of your perfume?
- [61:11]
A
I don't know. I have to. I have to. Maybe we can crowdsource it. Sort of little old school 2000 social media here. Little crowdsource.
- [61:18]
B
Anyway, I really appreciate this, Governor Newsom. I really do. I like our back and forth because I think one of the things that's helpful is when people actually can debate and the aggression is just what's needed, in my opinion. And paying you a compliment that won't last.
- [61:35]
A
Well, you're, as they say in San Francisco, where you're back, back home. As we described the Grateful Dead and you described Jerry Garcia. Only a former mayor of California or San Francisco can say this. He said he prescribed, in many ways, you. As Bill Graham was describing the Grateful Dead. You don't want to be the best of the best. You want to be the only one that does what you do. And that is you.
- [61:59]
B
Oh, my God, you're kissing up me. I'm just saying, all I want to do is you win the presidency. I'm coming. As I told you before, I'm coming to the Lincoln Bed bedroom. So get fucking ready.
- [62:07]
A
And by the way, he's apparently remodeled the Lincoln Bedroom just like he's remodeling the ballroom. And don't think you. By the way, who spends hundreds of millions of dollars remodeling a home he's not leaving. Thank you.
- [62:19]
B
Thank you. Because you're running for president, right? I have to get to the Lincoln Bedroom.
- [62:23]
A
Lincoln Bedroom. I mean, you just say yes, you have some other suitors. I'm well aware. I'm well aware.
- [62:30]
B
Okay. In any case, that handsome Wes Moore. There can be two handsome people.
- [62:34]
A
No, there's two.
- [62:35]
B
We want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com pivot to submit a question for the show or call 85551 pivot. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot. Be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel, which is growing by leaps and bounds. We'll be back next week with a triumphant return of Scott Galloway. Governor Newsom, you kept it up. You kept up the Scott Galloway banner.
- [62:57]
A
He needs to come back shirtless. I want to see. I think the guy.
- [63:01]
B
Don't say that. Don't say that.
- [63:03]
A
I want to see it.
- [63:04]
B
He's going to take his shirt off.
- [63:05]
A
He does it all the time. Sc looking forward to seeing it. I want to see the pecs.
- [63:12]
B
That's creepy. It is kind of creepy, but I am the only to look at men's chests all the time. By the way, why I signed up.
- [63:20]
A
He is. He is. He is a unique character. You should. Well, anyway, I've. I've said enough on this topic.
- [63:29]
B
I'm already gonna say I should marry him.
- [63:31]
A
No, I didn't say that. You guys already talked about. About your love for each other. We've already described. That's been well discussed on this podcast.
- [63:38]
B
Yes, but you know what? I like to step out on him now and then. Anyway. This has been a great step out. I will read us. Thank you again, Governor Newsom. Today's show was produced by Laren Naiman Zoe Marcus Taylor Griffin and Kevin Oliver. Ernie Enderdot engineered this episode. Jim Mackle edited the video. Nishad Kurwa is Fox Media's executive producer of podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media. You can subscribe to the magazine@nymag.com pod we'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. I am so looking forward to Gavin Perfume.
- [64:15]
A
Take care.