Trump's Crypto Windfall, Dems' Anti-Establishment Wave, and the Supreme Court’s Big Week

Summary

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Pivot Podcast Summary: "Trump’s Crypto Windfall, Dems’ Anti-Establishment Wave, and the Supreme Court’s Big Week"

Date: July 3, 2026
Hosts: Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway
Podcast: Pivot (New York Magazine / Vox Media)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the intersection of politics, tech, and finance in 2026 America, focusing on:

• Donald Trump’s unprecedented personal financial windfall—especially via cryptocurrency—during his presidency
• The anti-establishment surge in Democratic primaries, characterized by a youth-driven progressive wave
• Major, controversial decisions from the US Supreme Court, including campaign finance and birthright citizenship

Along the way, Kara and Scott reflect on how these currents affect the country’s trust in institutions, the mechanisms of political grift, and the direction of both parties heading into the future.

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Key Topics & Insights

1. Opening Banter and Pivot Tour (02:16–11:31)

• The hosts riff on Mitch McConnell’s health (“Weekend at Bernie’s” jokes), dad jokes, summer plans (Kara: tractor parade; Scott: Sardinia yacht), and upcoming Pivot tour stops (Denver and Minneapolis).
• Memorable quote:
  “So, what do you call a fake noodle?”
  “An impasta.”
  — Scott Galloway (03:50)
• Lighthearted segment sets up the heavy news to come.

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2. Trump’s Historic Crypto Grift (11:31–17:12)

• Trump’s Wealth Surge: Trump reportedly made $2.2B last year—$1.4B from crypto and meme-coins tied to his family brand.
• Kara calls it “astonishing… a level of grift… up from $622 million in 2024 before he returned to the presidency…” (11:31)
• Scott’s Take:
  • Trump is leveraging the Oval Office “as a tollbooth for the American government.”
  • The meme coin is “a financial instrument with no underlying value that goes up when the President tweets about it. That's securities manipulation with a big red hat.” (12:44)
• Societal Impact:
  Scott broadens to lament the “monetization of everything,” eroding institutional trust:
  “We monetize healthcare, education, enragement online. And now the President is monetizing the full faith and credit and power of the White House.” (12:44)
• Social Media & Vibes:
  • Social media creates perceptions of scarcity and corruption.
  • Quote: “The people in charge are exhibiting a level of corruption and depravity that just makes us feel bad about institutions.” (15:34)
  • Cites Jimmy Carr: “Satisfaction isn't a function of what you have, it's the delta between what you have and your expectations.” (16:06)

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3. Generational Malaise & Economic Frictions (17:12–20:26)

• Kara & Scott discuss the challenge for young Americans:
  • Scarcity of opportunity (“weaponized scarcity” in housing, education)
  • Generational wealth transfer: “Tax policy over 50 years has taken $50 trillion from the bottom 90% to the top 10%.” (19:48, Scott)
• Scott notes the “vibesession”—dissonance between prosperity displayed online and actual well-being.
• Kara expresses concern that “these people have no care… I even feel exhausted by their enthusiastic villaining and stealing." (17:42)

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4. Democratic Primary—Progressive Anti-Incumbency Surge (21:32–32:32)

• Backdrop: Colorado and NY see young, progressive, democratic socialist candidates ousting longtime incumbents:

  • Phil Weiser beats Michael Bennett (CO)
  • Mehlot Quiros unseats a 15-term Congresswoman

• Analysis:

  • Kara: Voters “haven't been particularly attracted to the idea of democratic socialism. …They've been attracted to vigorous young people who are committed to getting stuff done.” (22:09, paraphrasing Robert Reich)
  • Scott:
    • The Democratic establishment “lost on energy.”
    • “If you want disruption, you don't get to pick your form of disruption.”
    • Warns about overreach: “The reality is, if you really look at history, socialism just doesn't work, folks… Northern Europe is actually more capitalist than we are right now. They just have a social safety net.” (24:56)

• Memorable Moments:

  • Scott comments on disruption:
    “For those of us in the center, we don’t get to pick our flavor of disruption. …Democratic socialists effectively want socialism through democratic means. The reality is, if you really look at history, socialism just doesn’t work, folks.” (24:48)
  • Kara slams the conservative response to commonsense heat warnings as “impossible” and pervasively unserious. (27:44)

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5. The Supreme Court’s Big Week (35:05–47:33)

Major Rulings:

• Struck down limits on presidential firing of independent agency heads (weakening federal agency independence)
• Further loosened campaign finance restrictions (“more Citizens United”)
• Upheld laws barring transgender girls from female sports
• Upheld birthright citizenship (came “far too close” to nullifying it; a single-justice margin)

Guest Commentary:

• Leah Litman (Strict Scrutiny podcast):
  • “We came within a single vote of nullifying a constitutional amendment that is the foundation of our constitutional order…” (36:13)
  • “They have been systematically undermining our democracy… killing the Voting Rights act… enabling partisan and racial gerrymandering… killed campaign finance regulations designed to prevent political corruption… killing Congress’s capacity to govern, expanding presidential power…”

Hosts’ Take:

• Kara’s Main Worries:
  • Campaign finance (“the last thing we need... all the money”)
  • “No more independent agencies on things that deserve independence like the FTC…” (37:31)
• Scott:
  • “Citizens United is arguably one of the worst things that's happened… Of the 900 billionaires, they make up a third of political giving — probably more than half of influence.” (37:42)
  • On birthright citizenship: “This is the Constitution, just straightforward… If you’re born here, you’re a citizen.” (39:22)
  • Shares his own story: “I am an illegal anchor baby. …My parents… drove to San Diego and something like 37 days later, I was born at La Jolla… I've had to pay U.S. taxes… It seems like it's worked out for everybody.” (41:00–42:49)

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6. SpaceX, OpenAI, and the “Trump Accounts” (51:15–60:12)

• SpaceX & Big Tech “Donations”: The administration discussed SpaceX and OpenAI stock being donated to the new “Trump Accounts” child savings program.
• Elon Musk, Michael Dell, BlackRock, Bank of America, and OpenAI all mentioned as major prospective contributors.
• Kara: “This all feels like a shakedown… I don’t hate the idea of accounts… but it seems a little socialist to me.” (51:15)
• Scott: The government “should not be taking equity stakes in companies... It’s not patriotism—it’s protection money.” (51:19)
• Hosts riff on the parallel between government intervention, tech sector bubbles, and moral hazard.

AI-Driven Instability:

• Shared skepticism around current AI economics:
  • High token costs unsustainable (citing Mark Cuban & Alex Karp)
  • “Cheap models are eating the expensive ones… The token consumption of Chinese models has surpassed… Suddenly, the CFO of Uber goes, our entire AI budget was burned through in eight weeks…” (54:41, Scott)
• Scott likens AI boom to the 1999 dot-com bubble, forecasting contraction.

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7. Predictions & Market Analysis (62:37–70:37)

Scott’s Recent Victory Lap:

• His prior IPO prediction (Bending Spoons) proved accurate: “Bending Spoons surged 40% after the company’s IPO…”

Market/Pricing Warnings:

• Narratives shifting on AI:
  • “The narrative has moved from ‘Can AI work?’ to ‘Can AI pay?’” (68:24)
• “If the AI trade unwinds, the most vulnerable names are… Nvidia... Astera Labs... Marvel Technology… Tier 2: Vertiv, Super Micro… Microsoft, Alphabet, Amazon, Meta—nowhere to hide.” (69:00)
• Prediction: “A basket... down 20–40% in the next 12 months. ...The technology will survive. I believe the better AI players are going to be juggernauts in five to ten years. But these guys are just way out in front of their skis.” (70:16)

Kara’s Prediction:

• Growing signs even right-wing media will eventually turn on Trump’s children for corruption. The next reckoning may not hit Trump himself, but “his children and the children of the Lutniks… I think they're in for a lot.” (70:16–71:12)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Scott on corruption: “It's not a conflict of interest, it's a business model.” (12:44)
• Kara on youth progressives: “Voters have been attracted to vigorous young people who are committed to getting stuff done.” (22:09)
• Scott on institutional decay: “Institutional endorsements have become a liability. …You're going to start to see Democratic candidates say ‘Senator Schumer, please do not come to my rally.’” (31:02)
• Leah Litman: “We came within a single vote of nullifying a constitutional amendment… the foundation of our constitutional order…” (36:13)
• Scott describes American malaise: “There's an economic incentive to shitpost everything.” (16:07)
• Scott skeptically notes AI parallels: “This feels, it just feels so 99 to me.” (59:47)

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Important Timestamps

• (11:31–17:12): Trump’s crypto windfall, impact on public trust
• (21:32–32:32): Democratic anti-establishment primary wave, generational politics
• (35:05–47:33): Supreme Court major decisions, campaign finance, birthright citizenship, Scott’s “anchor baby” story
• (51:15–60:12): SpaceX, OpenAI, Trump Accounts—government/tech cronyism, AI economics skepticism
• (62:37–71:12): IPO predictions, the coming AI correction, Trump family corruption prediction

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Final Thoughts

The episode underscores growing convergence between corruption in politics and risk-taking in tech—with a special focus on how the boundaries of self-dealing and disruption are ever more blurred. Youth-driven disruption is energizing one party, while financial grift is defining the other. All of it plays out against a backdrop of institutional decay, economic anxiety, and an American public grappling with high expectations and diminishing returns.

For listeners: Even if you missed the episode, this breakdown should make you feel up-to-speed on the summer's biggest political-tech stories and help you catch the inside jokes, warnings, and arguments powering the conversation.

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Transcript

[Scott Galloway]

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[Kara Swisher]

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Kara Swisher]

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[Scott Galloway]

Release the Dick Jokes

[Kara Swisher]

Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.

[Scott Galloway]

And I'm Scott Galloway.

[Kara Swisher]

Scott I think Mitch McConnell dad might be in trouble. I don't know.

[Scott Galloway]

Just is this Weekend at Bernie's. Weekend at Mitch's.

[Kara Swisher]

I feel like it.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't feel like I've heard the whole thing. Right.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

If they pretend he's. I thought they should have kept Ruth Bader Ginsburg on ice for a while.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, yeah, right. What is going on in this country at our anniversary, our 250th anniversary? I think he was around for the first one, wasn't he? Mitch McConnell.

[Scott Galloway]

No. There you go. There you go.

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know why I'm thinking of him. I'm like, what's happening to him? Like, are they hiding him? Like, what is so strange? It was because that other guy came back. It turned out he a guy from New Jersey, Tom Keene or whatever.

[Scott Galloway]

So, more importantly, I had the chief investment officer of JP Morgan on.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh.

[Scott Galloway]

And as I do at the beginning of the show, I told a really crude joke. Not while he was on. Oh, no. And it ends up he's really offended. And he even put in a research note, like, six months later referencing. Or. I didn't read it because I knew it would upset me that he was upset. So from this point forward, I'm only doing dad jokes until Michael Cymbalis, chief investment officer of JP Morgan, accepts my apology. Michael, we didn't mean to embarrass.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, my God, you have. You can't do that. What are you doing? Stop being changed by other people. Be yourself, Scott.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, I also want to. I'm also not a sociopath. I think if you upset people, it's okay to apologize. Okay, so anyways, I'm now doing dad jokes.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay?

[Scott Galloway]

So what do you call a fake noodle?

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know.

[Scott Galloway]

An imposter?

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, my God.

[Scott Galloway]

So that is. Release the dick jokes. Michael, please forgive me. Otherwise everyone's gonna be forced to listen to my dad jokes. We all have a vested interest, and Michael was a terrible. Accepting my apology.

[Kara Swisher]

That was. Do not do a joke like that again, please. That's like a four year old's joke.

[Scott Galloway]

Okay? You tell me not to do something.

[Kara Swisher]

All right, I'm offended that you're not doing jokes. I'm gonna put it in my research note that you're not doing jokes.

[Scott Galloway]

Why couldn't we find the scarecrow?

[Kara Swisher]

Okay? Why?

[Scott Galloway]

Because he was outstanding in his field.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, no.

[Scott Galloway]

I know, I know. He needs to. He needs to accept my apology. It's only going to get worse, all right?

[Kara Swisher]

Michael, can you please.

[Scott Galloway]

It's only Going to get worse.

[Kara Swisher]

How are you doing? What are you doing for the fourth. For our anniversary? Our Fourth of July?

[Scott Galloway]

What do the curtains say to each other?

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know. What?

[Scott Galloway]

Pull yourself together, please, Michael. Please, please.

[Kara Swisher]

One is worse than the other one is. They're not.

[Scott Galloway]

What did the strawberry say to the other strawberry?

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, my God. Please. All right.

[Scott Galloway]

If we weren't caught in the same bed, we wouldn't be in this jam.

[Kara Swisher]

That's a little sexual.

[Scott Galloway]

All right. You see the problem here, right, Tara?

[Kara Swisher]

I see the problem.

[Scott Galloway]

You see the sense of urgency.

[Kara Swisher]

I see the sense of urgency.

[Scott Galloway]

Do you know Jamie Dimon? Maybe ask Jamie to lean on Michael to accept my apology.

[Kara Swisher]

I'll talk to him. I bet he likes a good dirty joke. He seems like a fella who likes a dirty. I could see him guffawing to that.

[Scott Galloway]

He has a good guffaw.

[Kara Swisher]

Anyway, where are you right now? What are you doing for the 4th of July? Are you doing anything? I'm going to a tractor parade.

[Scott Galloway]

You, too?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

No, well, wait. No. I'm going on a big fat boat around Sardinia, so. Same. Same stuff.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Find some DJ on Buena Facha or whatever it's called, and probably. And probably do X. Yeah, same thing. Same thing.

[Kara Swisher]

Same thing. Yeah. I go to this annual tractor parade in Vermont where Amanda's family rebuilt a barn that was falling down that they had this sort of funky hippie barn, and they redid the whole thing. And it's beautiful. I have to say. It's really.

[Scott Galloway]

Does that mean you guys have an open relationship and you're both looking for lesbians?

[Kara Swisher]

No, not at all.

[Scott Galloway]

No.

[Kara Swisher]

No. That time has passed for Kara Swisher, I have to say. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

You haven't hit your midlife crisis yet.

[Kara Swisher]

I had it.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh. I saw you on one of my favorite guys podcast. I love Dan Harris.

[Kara Swisher]

That was good. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

He's so comforting, isn't he?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Yes, 100%. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

He has. Whenever I. Let's bring this back to me. Whenever I'm mentoring young men, he has one of my favorite pieces of advice that I always give to people, which is action absorbs anxiety. Oh, I love that.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

You have a lot of upset about something, you're anxious about something, immediately start moving against it and addressing it, and

[Kara Swisher]

you start to feel better or anything. Do something else. Yeah, I think that's a really.

[Scott Galloway]

I like to adopt him as a big brother. Is he looking for a little brother? That guy is so comforting and smart and wise.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. You're going to be gone next week we have. We have special guest stars.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, who? Do you know who the guest hosts are?

[Kara Swisher]

I think Scaramucci is one. The Mooch. The Mooch is one.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't like it when the Mooch comes on because the downloads go up.

[Kara Swisher]

And we also have Puck's Matt Bellany.

[Scott Galloway]

Matt Bellany from the town?

[Kara Swisher]

The town, yeah. I like him a lot. I think there's a lot of, you know, media stuff. And actually, I have to say he and Eric Gardner has been doing the best coverage of sort of media murderers and things like that. Just smart. I just, you know, they did a great take on the Comcast thing. I just. I want to talk. He's always smart. He's also snarky in a way I like, but does great reporting. That's my. He's accurate as a reporter, so I like that in him. So. Yeah. And then, of course, Scott Free August. I've got a real lineup to try to replace you and figure out my next act.

[Scott Galloway]

Essentially, at some point, we should have a recommitment ceremony.

[Kara Swisher]

We should. We should. That was us on the top of the Empire State Building.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, God. So I got a lot to say about both those things.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, hold on. All right, go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Those two are reaching out to me. It is so obvious. Those people are narcissists who like each other but don't love each other. First off, if you do that for attention, you're really into look at Me.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, sure.

[Scott Galloway]

If you're engaged to someone and willing to let them climb up the Empire State Building, it means you like them, but you don't love them. It's like, if they fall, it wouldn't be a tragedy, right?

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know. Some people chase that kind of stuff, don't you think?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, but people don't. People can chase that stuff and not risk their spouse's life. Would you let your wife do that? Regardless of how competent a climber?

[Kara Swisher]

I have friends who are in those relationships. They love to do, like, extreme sports. I have a lot of. I have not a friends that do that, but I know a lot of people who do that, and they're very into that kind of thing. So, you know, they like all that, like, you know, surfing, like wind surfing in, like, very dangerous places.

[Scott Galloway]

Have you ever been to a recommitment ceremony?

[Kara Swisher]

No, no.

[Scott Galloway]

God, I've been invited to two and you know what they mean.

[Kara Swisher]

No, what do they mean?

[Scott Galloway]

It is so obvious. They might as well put on the invitation when they invite you to a recommitment ceremony. That he was fucking his secretary and got caught and doesn't want to lose his kids. So they have a recommitment ceremony. And the second thing it means is they're going to be divorced within three years.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, okay. All right. I've never been in mood.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm in such a good mood today, aren't I a bucket of sunshine today.

[Kara Swisher]

I know.

[Scott Galloway]

So.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, so if we have one, we should have a ceremony of. So we should climb something. I was thinking about us when that climb was happening. I loved it. This is why I loved it.

[Scott Galloway]

We look like Gandalf and Billy Barty ascending Mount McKinley.

[Kara Swisher]

I love. I love everything about New York right now. These people climb the Empire fucking stairs and then they put up that map. You would have liked their message about love and power and stuff.

[Scott Galloway]

That was nice. I did like their message.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Their message I just love. And they. And then that picture of them looking hot. As hot in the elevator.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. They're narcissists.

[Kara Swisher]

I love that.

[Scott Galloway]

Look at me.

[Kara Swisher]

I know. You would know nothing about that topic.

[Scott Galloway]

And I have an easier time recognizing other narcissists.

[Kara Swisher]

I understand. But the other part is. Okay, first you have the Empire State Building. Of course, the Knicks and everything else. And the. And the World Cup.

[Scott Galloway]

I can spot someone who does edibles from across the farm. Like, dude, you do edibles, don't you?

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, I wouldn't do that if I was climbing that fucker. I was trying to see.

[Scott Galloway]

No, no, you don't. You don't need to be high climbing at the Empire State Building.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. All right. Anyway. And then like a mom, Donnie jumping in the pool. I love that. And then Taylor Swift getting married. Madison, I love New York so much today for all this.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, God, here we go.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm just telling you. Are you going to the wedding? I wasn't invited.

[Scott Galloway]

No, but I heard all her ex boyfriends are showing up and doing a harmony of maybe it's you.

[Kara Swisher]

I love that she's going over the fucking top. I love someone. I like anyone who goes over the top. I love the Empire State Building people. I like Mamdani jumping. Mom. Donnie jumping.

[Scott Galloway]

That was. That was brilliant. Him going to the pool is great.

[Kara Swisher]

I like it.

[Scott Galloway]

Bloomberg did the same thing. But no one criticized Bloomberg.

[Kara Swisher]

He's not as good looking. Well, that's the way he is.

[Scott Galloway]

No, I agree.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. I don't know. I just love the whole thing. I'm so excited for this.

[Scott Galloway]

He was doing water aerobics.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. This is why I had Matt had Bellamy on because he wrote. He goes, do you think she's filming it for a Disney special? Really? Really? Of course she is. Like, I just love that. I love the whole thing. If you're going to get married, make it a thing, we should have a ceremony. Let's do that on our tour, on our Pivot Tour.

[Scott Galloway]

Are we gonna get married?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. No, we should do a ceremony of some sort. Anyway, by the way, we just planned our new Pivot tour for November.

[Scott Galloway]

We did. We have a new city.

[Kara Swisher]

We are not gonna say. Should we say, all right, you can say, Go ahead, say it.

[Scott Galloway]

We're coming to the great city of Denver.

[Kara Swisher]

Denver, yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Excited about Colorado.

[Kara Swisher]

And another one that we didn't go to, we've been to recently. But Minneapolis. We're going to Minneapolis.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, yeah. We're going back to Minneapolis to show civic pride.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. That was for the resistant, unsubscribe, but now we're going for big. So those are new cities, Denver and Minneapolis. And we're going to some ones we've already went to. Anyway, we're very excited and we're gonna have ceremonies everywhere. We should get to the news, actually. There's a big piece of news.

[Scott Galloway]

Why not?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. First, let me just tell you, Donald Trump's embrace of crypto is paying off in a big way. Trump earned about $1.4 billion over the past year from crypto, according to a new financial disclosure, which I think is undercounting all the grift he's doing. A big chunk of that came from sales of his Trump meme coin and digital tokens for the Trump family crypto company, which he gets paid no matter what. And everyone who's invested in is losing. Just so you know. He got all this money. It's not just crypto. Trump pulled in at least 2.2 billion in total income for the year, up from 622 million in 2024 before he returned to the presidency. That includes more than 620 million in real estate, hotel and golf related income, which is Almost nothing. Plus 86.5 million from legal settlements from ABC, CBS, YouTube, Meta and X. This grift is just. And it turns out we're paying for the East Wing, we're paying for the Kennedy center, we're paying for all manner of things that he is up to, which he said the public wasn't paying for. So what. This is astonishing. I think they're undercounted. What did you. I mean, nobody's surprised, but the grift is really quite astonishing. I thought was, wow, that's a lot of money. Your thoughts?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, there's the grift and there's the, I mean, there's the micro. And that is 2.2 billion in personal income while sitting as you're occupying the oval office and 1.4 billion of it from crypto, a financial system that he now supposedly regulates. It's not a conflict of interest, it's a business model. And essentially what you have in America is slowly but surely we're monetizing everything. We monetize healthcare, we monetize education, we monetize enragement online. And now the President is monetizing the full faith and credit and power of the White House. And he went from 622 million the year in net worth before taking office at 2.2 billion after. He's essentially set up a toll booth for the American government. And the meme coin would have been a five alarm scandal for anyone else but him. Absolutely. It's a financial instrument with no underlying value that goes up when the President tweets about it. And that securities manipulation with a big red hat and the fact that he did it the Friday night before his inauguration under the COVID of dark, you know, that he called people and said, thanks for giving me 10, 20, $100 million for my campaign. FYI, the coin gets announced tonight, it'll go up and then you can. If you dump it, you dump it. But on a larger level, I was thinking about our 250 year anniversary. And in, I mean, this is the reality that since 1991, childhood poverty has gone way down. Crime has been cut in half, the number of people have gotten educations has gone up. We have a healthier, better educated populace than ever before. Crime is at its lowest rate ever in New York. Right? But happiness, as Jimmy Carr says, where satisfaction isn't a function of what you have, it's the delta between what you have and your expectations and what's happened in America. Because there is now a normalization, an algorithmically normalized 0.1% in terms of your expectations. I'll give you an example. From 22 to 42, I did nothing but work. And I think my first vacation, the only vacations I took with my mom, we went to Niagara Falls once. We used to go to Magic Mountain because we couldn't afford to go to Disneyland. And I remember going to Club Med in Mazatlan when I was like in my late 20s. I thought it was fuck. And I mean, it couldn't have been any tackier. Bad daiquiris, not a very Nice beach, all you can eat, but that you wouldn't want to eat all of it. And I thought it was amazing. I just thought it was the most. I was, I brought back Club Med shirts, I had a Club Med hat. I just thought Club Med was the most amazing thing. And I was talking about, did you pay by beads?

[Kara Swisher]

Was it? Didn't you have beads?

[Scott Galloway]

You get beads for bars, for drinks. It's amazing. And because here's the thing, I had never been to, nor was I being reminded 105 times a day as people vomited their experience at St. Barts in Mykonos, my expectations were dramatically lower. And then you combine that with the following. The people who are supposedly in charge are exhibiting a level of corruption and depravity that just makes us feel bad about institutions.

[Kara Swisher]

Right, exactly.

[Scott Galloway]

So you have a coarsening of our discourse where quite frankly, there's an economic incentive to shitpost everything. It's happened a lot during the Biden presidency. It's also to a certain extent happening now. You have social media vomiting everybody's wealth in your face and giving you the impression that if you have made $3 million on Ethereum and your boyfriend doesn't have a six pack, you're failing. And also the people in charge seem to be genuinely like low character people

[Kara Swisher]

grabbing everything, all the goodness.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. And people don't trust the cdc, they don't trust the Supreme Court. It's like what William Gibson said, the future's here. It's just not evenly distributed. Prosperity is here. They see it everywhere, but people don't feel like it's evenly distributed. So people now a quarter of a people under the age of 25 feel good about America. It's 3/4 of people our age. So it's definitely like Kyla Scanlon coined the term vibe session. But the 250th anniversary, if you, if the. Well, you're down there, what's the vibe like?

[Kara Swisher]

Well, you know, I think people feel like this, this guy grabs everything, like. And what my, my worry is that it goes. We all hate everything because of these people.

[Scott Galloway]

Right.

[Kara Swisher]

We think everything's on the take and it sort of makes you feel like nothing works or, or that there's no payoff or anything. And, you know, I was really struck by a really interesting exchange this week between, you know, Elon Musk attacked Ro for saying he's killed children with the cuts of usaid, that he bragged about putting it to a wood chipper, et cetera, without any care for the impact. And then he Said, show me one person who's been killed. And then Nick Kristof, who does amazing reporting in the New York Times.

[Scott Galloway]

Names. Here's some names, here's some names.

[Kara Swisher]

And by the way, there's thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands more. And then instead of actually engaging him, she did exactly what Elon asked for, because that's his thing. It's like, name one person who's hurt. That's their little stupid trick. And he does. And then he's like, nick Kristoff is evil. I was like, you fucker. It made me think. It sounds really. Including this crypto stuff is like, what is wrong? I wanted to fight the feeling of everything sucks. And it was really hard. For the first time, I was like, these people have no care. The same thing with Stephen Miller spouting off about the. They won all these Supreme Court cases, but they lost the one that they really care about, which was birthright citizenship. Right. And so they just can't stop the hate. They just have endless pools of hatred and grift. And I wonder how you survive that. And especially if you're a young person looking at it, like, what is your reaction? That to me was like, I even feel exhausted by their enthusiastic villaining and stealing. Like, I find them exhausting. And I just don't know what I would do if I was a young person looking at Aldis, you know?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, it's. Look, there's a lot of issues. I mean, the number of people in the middle has gone away, and young people have a rational reason to be upset. The traditional means of building a life, finding a mate, developing economic security, advancing up the ladder, which is typically some sort of certification, either vocational programming or a college degree, and then buying a house. The incumbents have weaponized scarcity to make it more expensive for them to get those things, such that the people who already own them a college degree in housing can see the value of those things go up. And also our tax policy, which continues to transfer wealth from them to the incumbents. Right. Loosely speaking, our tax policy over the last 50 years has taken $50 trillion and transferred it from the bottom 90% to the top 10%.

[Kara Swisher]

Rich old people.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, yeah. So they justifiably can be very, you know, very upset. Having said that, if you actually look at the data, things aren't as bad as you would believe in terms of the vibe. But again, and this is the great Jimmy Carr, your happiness and your purpose isn't a function of what you have. It's the delta between what you have. And your expectations and the downside of a meritocracy and especially when social media speedballs, it's is everyone believes if they're not in the top 1% they're failing.

[Kara Swisher]

Except when they're looking at the President just stealing. Stealing.

[Scott Galloway]

Agreed. 100%.

[Kara Swisher]

That's really it. Like there's just no even like look, Grift has been around.

[Scott Galloway]

It's not fair.

[Kara Swisher]

The game is really around forever from the beginning, right? From every country, every historical thing. But this is Grift on a very explicit scale and also like yeah, that's right, I'm taking it. That's right, I'm cheating. And let me tell you, let me put on another story that came out. Politico is calling this week's Democratic primaries in Colorado and anti establishment avalanche. Obviously it was happening in New York, which is no surprise with Mamdani getting you know, backing a bunch of people, one of whom is really problematic. Colorado Attorney General Phil Weiser though upset longtime senator Michael Bennett, who you and I both have a lot of regard for, who looked like a lock for the nomination a year ago. We thought he'd be governor of Colorado. And then 29 year old democratic socialist Mehlot Quiros unseated a 15 term congresswoman and Manny Rootnell, a progressive state representative, defeated a moderate Democrat. The results add up to a grow of progressive anti incumbent. I think that's actually Steve Bannon was very canny on this stuff. Victories notably with what happened in New York. And there are a number of primaries still to come over the next few months. All this as a New York Times Sienna poll showed Democrats within striking distance of putting the Senate majority back in play. I want you to not go negative yet because I want you to understand, talk about these victories and what they are. And let me read something that Robert Reich wrote on Substack about these elections. Pundits eager to declare a new move or sound the alarm about socialism or having a field day. But they're wrong. Voters who have supported these candidates haven't done so because they've been particularly attracted to the idea of democratic socialism. Most even don't know what democratic socialism is in reality. Voters.

[Scott Galloway]

That's right.

[Kara Swisher]

Have been attracted to vigorous young people who are committed to getting stuff done. Steve Bannon said nearly the same thing, which was really interesting and I would agree talking to like Louie like he's just sick of people not getting stuff done like and looking for something else, which is interesting. What are your thoughts on this? I think Reich, and I hate to say It Bannon, are correct.

[Scott Galloway]

I think that's exactly right. The establishment didn't lose on policy here, Kara. They lost on energy. And look, I've been calling for disruption in the Democratic Party. I think Leader Jeffries and Minority Leader Schumer are absolutely the wrong people to provide the kind of robust, energetic pushback that the Trump administration warrants. But here's the thing about disruption is you don't get to pick the exact calibration of your disruption. So, for example, I consider myself a moderate. And I'm convinced that the true litmus test of someone is truly a moderate is everybody hates you. But you don't get to. So think about the senators who are moderates, like Fetterman and Manchin. Everybody hates them. So people claim they want a moderate, but when someone actually shows up and occasionally he agrees with the other side, they become an apostate at the same time, guys like me claim we want disruption, we need to disrupt the Democratic Party, and then when it happens, we freak out about it. But here's the bottom line. There's a lot to like here. And I say this, full disclosure. I have given money to Senator Michael Bennett for everything he has run for for the last 10 years. I hosted a fundraiser for him for president. You know, by the way, if you get money from me, it's not a good sign, but I think the world of Senator Bennett, former school superintendent, one of the most credentialed people in the Senate, qualified, lost to a state AG nobody had ever heard of a year ago. But here's the bottom line. If you want disruption, you don't get to pick your form of disruption. And these candidates, there's a lot to like about these candidates. They're young, they're energetic, they're unafraid, they don't have a bunch of blather about how you would go about universal healthcare. They're just like Medicare for all. So there's a lot to like about them. But the reality is, for those of us in the center, we don't get to pick our flavor of disruption. What I would say that bothers me is that democratic socialists effectively want socialism through democratic means. The reality is, if you really look at history, socialism just doesn't work, folks. And they will always point to, well, what about Northern Europe? Northern Europe is actually more capitalist than we are right now. They just have a social safety net and they spend.

[Kara Swisher]

They call themselves that, though, don't they? You always threat about Sweden, for example, or the Netherlands.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, but they're. But here's the System that's worked. Democracy, individual rights and capitalism, call it what you want. But when you start believing that you should have government sponsored grocery stores or that you shouldn't have border, I mean, that shit, quite frankly, it just not only doesn't make sense, it threatens our ability to win the midterms. Rahm Emanuel had a fantastic statement in the thread we were on and he said it publicly. We have to stop arguing and atomizing ourselves between blue and cobalt blue. So I'm more focused on my energy, on the grift and corruption and just stupid decision making of the Trump administration. There's a lot I like about this disruption. You don't get to pick your flavor of disruption. And you know what? Young people just want change.

[Kara Swisher]

They just want change. I'm gonna. Interestingly, I was just on Scaramucci's podcast and he said he actually has been impressed by Mamdani and he was very against him. He was sort of where you are, right. That kind of thing. And he's like, I have to say he's effective. And I do think they're not looking for necessarily just upsetting the incumbents.

[Scott Galloway]

They want people who do shit, do shit.

[Kara Swisher]

One of the things about Weiser and I was watching this thing is he was just a more energetic campaigner. He wanted your vote more. And he wasn't necessarily much more liberal. It wasn't that because Michael's pretty liberal, relatively speaking. Right. Especially in Colorado. He just looked like he could, like, he, like he just was energetic and not just fake, fake energy. It's not just fake energy. Maybe like what Kennedy felt like back in the 60s. It was like, I, I literally just want you to do your job like I want. And, and I do think, I think you're right about capitalism. I agree with that. But it needs to have everyone gets health care. That is not. I think, I think that's a really good message of the Democratic socialists and everyone else. Everyone should get good health care. Everyone should get a good minimum wage. Everyone should get, you know, and what's incredible, I'll tell you what really absolutely struck me and I real. I finally realized that the Republican Party is fucked in seven ways to Sunday. What's coming next? Not. I mean, post Trump was. Mamdani said, can we, can everyone like we have an electrical grid problem probably coming up with this heat because there's a huge heat warning all over the east coast, including in New York. And he said if you could put your air conditioning to 78 versus 74, that would be great. That's all he said immediately, Ted Cruz and Nikki Haley, I told you, she can't help herself, said communism, right? Or socialism. This is what socialism is. Immediately there are tweets from many years ago where, when she was governor of South Carolina and he. The same thing in Texas where they asked people to put their, put their air conditioning down surfaced. What is wrong with them? Like he was asking a normal thing that they themselves had asked for. The minute they jumped on it, they were trying to do socialism. They look like idiots and everyone can see it. And that's why I told you Nikki Haley is impossible. She's never gonna win anything because she's so such a suck up in so many ways. It was so not sensible. He was saying something sensible and everyone sees it it and did not immediately think communism about the air conditioning, even though I love air conditioning. And so that to me is they're vigorous young people who want to be effective. That is what I think is attractive.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't disagree with any of that. And the thing that Mamdani and some of these people are doing the most admirable thing about Donald Trump, President Trump, is action orientation. It's ready, fire, aim. It's like, no, I'm going to do this. We're doing it. And the courts might challenge it, we might have to roll it back, but Americans really respect that. And Mandani, to his credit, immediately imposed certain taxes, certain policies. And I think young people think, well, at least he's fucking doing something now. The glass half empty for me is the following. Whenever the far left and the far right agree on anything, it's a really. That's a tell. It's a really bad idea. I believe they both, the far left and the far right come together on what I believe are anti semitic themes. They both come together on an isolationist foreign policy. And what I see here is they both come together on socialism as an economic policy. Donald Trump is investing in intel. Donald Trump is entertaining the idea of investing in OpenAI. Donald Trump believes that the government should have a golden chair in US Steel. All that happens when you do that. All that happens when you do that is you end up with warehouses in Ireland full of deloreans and Air France. And you see a lot of that rhetoric from the far left. We absolutely need a more progressive tax structure. But here's how you get to a progressive tax structure. The thing we spend the most money on is not the military, it's not our debt, it's not even Social Security. The thing the American government spends the most money on. We spent $2.2 trillion on give backs from the tax code in the form of loopholes to corporations and the wealthy. We need to reduce spending on tax loopholes and give backs to the wealthy and corporations. And if you look at Northern Europe, they're very capitalist. They let companies go out of business. They don't take stakes in Spotify. Their tax rates are either the same or a touch higher than ours. But they do is they enforce them and they say Spotify. You don't get to write off your jets, your plant, property and equipment. And the richest people don't get to have donor advised funds where they get to write off donations they haven't made yet. So. But what I don't like about. I mean, quite frankly, there's some things that really bothered me about the winds in New York because I felt like being anti Israel with a litmus test. Obviously, as a Jew, that concerns me.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, there was one. There was one. The outlander is not.

[Scott Galloway]

Not Chevalier.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Chevalier is the problem. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

By the way, she's going to be the poster child. She's about to become the poster child for Republicans in 2016 anyways. But let me circle out to where I started. I don't get to pick the calibration and the color and the flavor of disruption. Disruption. They're youthful, they're energetic, they're unafraid. And that for me, is 70 or 80% good. Do I worry that they're embracing a form of socialism that has never worked throughout history? Yeah. I trust there'll be modulating forces from the center on both sides on that. But the reality is we need. The Democratic Party needs to shed its skin. Leader Jeffries and Schumer are getting clear signals. No one gives a fuck what you think you have become. Institutional endorsements have become a liability. Just as we thought US Bases in Gulf states would provide a veil of protection. They'd become bullseyes. You're gonna start to see Democratic candidates say, senator Schumer, please do not come to my rally.

[Kara Swisher]

They are. They are, actually. They're like all talking about whether they'd vote for him. He's gotta go. I told him that to his face. He thought I was kidding. I was like, no, you need to step down. It was like. He's like, ha, ha. I was like, no, time to go. Time to move along. I mean, we don't want a Mitch McConnell. The situation.

[Scott Galloway]

These guys cling to power like an African dictator, which I'm sure is a hate crime.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. I was like, we don't want a Mitch McConnell situation here. We wanna move along. Anyway. I agree with you. It's very. It's exciting. I find it exciting.

[Scott Galloway]

We needed disruption.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Good for them. Youth, energy. Have at it. I think it's a good thing too.

[Kara Swisher]

I like non cautious people. I do. I think the Democrats have played it too cautious. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, the Supreme Court finishes its term with some major rulings. That was something.

[Scott Galloway]

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[Kara Swisher]

Scott we're back with more news. It's been a big week for the Supreme Court as it wrapped up its term. Let's go through a roundup of some of the cases the court ruled on. Court struck down a federal law that bars the president from firing members of the ftc. So no more independent agencies. Essentially, they lifted limits on how much political parties can spend on advertising and other expenses with candidates a problem. And more. Citizens United upheld two state laws barring the participation of transgender female athletes from girls and women's sports team and upheld birthright citizenship, striking down an executive order. Let's hear some thoughts from Leah Littman, who co hosts the podcast Straight Strict Scrutiny, which breaks down all things Supreme Court. Hey Kara and Scott, here are some quick thoughts on the most recent Supreme Court term. We came within a single vote, one vote of saying the Constitution doesn't mean what it says on birthright citizenship and nullifying a constitutional amendment that is the foundation of our constitutional order of multiracial democracy after the Civil War. They have also been systematically undermining our democracy, killing the Voting Rights act, enabling partisan and racial gerrymandering. They've also just killed campaign finance regulations that were designed to prevent political corruption. As a result, the super rich will be able to effectively funnel more than $500,000 directly to candidates in the upcoming election. And they have been killing Congress's capacity to govern at expanding presidential power against a backdrop of a president who has been engaged in corruption and pay to play. And that is just the start of it. Yes, I think she sort of articulated it. The ones that really upset me and the birth rate citizenship was far too close. Far too close. That was disturbing. And by the way, a lot of the Trump people have to go back home wherever they come from. The two that really upset me to me is this the Voting Rights Act? Voting Rights act, absolutely. But the finance, to me it's all the money. The finance regulations designed to prevent political corruption. That was more more Citizens United was the last thing we need. And then secondly, the ability of the no independent agencies on things that deserve independence like the ftc. And you've seen what Brandon Carr has done. Although one of the justices did say Brandon Carr is a moron. And part of his essentially said that in his Ruling. I think it was Kavanaugh. Could have been Gorsuch. Whatever. They look the same to me. So those two were like, like giving more power to the President in general, which I think will be just as bad with a Democrat and is terrible with Trump was two problems. But the money to me was the focus I had. What about you?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. Citizens United is arguably one of the worst things that's happened in recent history to the US because of the 900 billionaires, they make up a third of political giving. It's probably more than half of influence because they can be much more targeted. The unions just give money to whoever's the union candidate. But a private equity Firm can give $700,000 to Senator Sinema and say, just be the holdout for the infrastructure bill and ask that they strip out the carried interest loophole. And that costs 20 or $30 billion, which is the most ridiculous loophole in history. See above $2.2 trillion spent on loopholes where private equity owners get their commission on investment gains in the form of long term capital gains. It's totally indefensible. So that's bad. The silver lining, the dotted silver lining on this out of control spend is that what we're finding is it's gone past its utility and that is it used to be 20 years ago, like 97% of the time who raised the most money won. It's no longer happening. Tom Stier spent a quarter of a billion dollars and didn't win. Right. It's almost like the full local news station employment Act. The amount of money they're spending on the whole, it's really bad. But what you are seeing is it's no longer the key fulcrum for who or the key lever for who wins. The thing that upset me the most, that was just so frightening that we was even this close was birthright citizenship. I mean, this is the Constitution, just straightforward. The constitution says if you're born here, you're a citizen.

[Kara Swisher]

It's right there.

[Scott Galloway]

And I'm gonna give you a couple anchor babies. Baligan, who got a red card unfairly, the attack. The premier striker for the World cup team. His parents were here. I forget. She couldn't go home. He was born here.

[Kara Swisher]

She goes too pregnant.

[Scott Galloway]

She was too pregnant, couldn't get home. I think the airline said you're too good for us. Right. And also it's a fairly small number. It's only 7%. It's a fairly small number of babies.

[Kara Swisher]

It is. The whole word anchor baby is so fucking ridiculous.

[Scott Galloway]

Not only that. But to a certain extent, this is what we don't like to talk about. Immigration is not only the secret sauce, it's the most illegal. Immigration is probably the most profitable form of immigration because they're risk takers and they generally fold back across the border when the crops are picked or there's not enough demand for them. And they pay taxes and they usually don't stick around to collect Social Security and they usually don't call the fire. They. They commit crimes at a lower rate than citizens. The reality is we didn't just wake up and find, oops, there's 15 million undocumented workers here. Republicans and Democrats have looked at each other and gone, wink, wink. It's nice having cheap housing being built in Phoenix, Arizona, picked for cheap or whatever. And how are we gonna get all these people to wipe grandma's ass for 11 bucks an hour?

[Kara Swisher]

I mean, Asian immigrants are the biggest nurses aides.

[Scott Galloway]

I mean, so it's not. This has been an economic decision. Has it gone too far? Absolutely. But be clear, folks, we didn't just wake up. No. And let this happen. So Baligan is one anchor baby. You know who else is an anchor baby?

[Kara Swisher]

Carol Melania. No, The Trump Baron Trump.

[Scott Galloway]

You could say she's a mail order bride. She's not an anchor baby. She wasn't born here.

[Kara Swisher]

That's true. Sorry, who?

[Scott Galloway]

Your co host, Kara.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, right. You're an anchor baby.

[Scott Galloway]

My parents, at the ages of 19 and 24, got on steamships from Glasgow and London, respectively, and they landed in Canada, where my mom was a stenographer and my dad was a candle salesman. They met at a dance, they fell in love, they had sex there.

[Kara Swisher]

So the conception was Canada.

[Scott Galloway]

In Toronto, they claim they got married and had me. I'm not sure if that's true. I'm not gonna argue it. I don't care. But they decided they could not.

[Kara Swisher]

That's it. Also, I'm a bastard.

[Scott Galloway]

That was. My dad said ankle band. My dad said, a few inches, we short to the blanket, whatever that means. And by the way, he was a bastard. He was born. He was born in Australia to an unwed woman who was a nanny at the McVigar family.

[Kara Swisher]

The entire family is really.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, literally, we're bastards all the way through. I am the Jon Snow of Jon Snows. And anyways, my father, basically, my father's mother freaked out, said to her boyfriend, we gotta get outta here. I've already sold the baby to this wealthy family. And they literally went to the dock and got a ship To Glasgow, Scotland. Anyway, my parents. My mom's seven and a half months pregnant. They said that we cannot endure another winter here in Toronto. And they read an article in the Toronto Globe and Mail saying that the best weather in North America was in this town called San Diego.

[Kara Swisher]

San Diego.

[Scott Galloway]

So they loaded up my mom's Austin Mini Metro, which is basically a lawnmower with doors like. If you've ever seen Mr. Bean, that's the car in seven and a half months pregnant.

[Kara Swisher]

No idea. You were.

[Scott Galloway]

My mom and my dad drove to San Diego and something like 37 days later, I was born at La Jolla. They were not County Hospital, they were just visiting and let me make a flex. I'm a US citizen.

[Kara Swisher]

Why didn't I know this about you?

[Scott Galloway]

I am a U.S. citizen. I've had to pay U.S. taxes. Yeah, me and my companies have paid well over $100 million in taxes over the last 30 years. It seems like it's worked out for everybody. Oh, my God. I just want to notify the IRS and the Trump administration. My mother. I am an illegal anchor baby. I think my citizen should be revoked. And by the way, when I sell my next company, I'm going to be in Dubai and I'm not going to be subject to US Taxes. I am down for you to revoke my US citizenship and also abdicate, absolve me of all and refund me of all the tax payments I have made because my parents decided to come to the US and drop a nine pound stone called Scott in San Diego instead of Toronto.

[Kara Swisher]

Wow.

[Scott Galloway]

And I would imagine that there is more of Baligan and Galloway than there are people eating cats and dogs that were born in the U.S. right?

[Kara Swisher]

Or just showing or running across the border to be pregnant. The screed from Stephen Miller, who I cannot wait till he gets his reckoning, is astonishing. So hateful and like, ridiculous and full of lies that it's. But it's so full of this whole. Their whole. Let's not use the term anchor baby. Because it's so gross. It's such a gross way of. And hateful way of looking at it. I had no. Scott, you could have been sent back wherever. Where would you. Canada. Where would you have been sent to?

[Scott Galloway]

Did you hear that fucking weirdo talking about eugenics? That people should be sterilized before they get here?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I know. Right. But they're not allowed in at the time.

[Scott Galloway]

1939. Germany's calling and wants you back.

[Kara Swisher]

I know. Wait a second. Where would you go? What country would you go? To. No, that's the other thing. Where do we send them back to? Right. Because would you go to Canada if this passed like you would send them?

[Scott Galloway]

People are leaving. Last year was the first time Since World War II we had negative immigration

[Kara Swisher]

in the U.S. i think it lost at the Supreme Court, which it could have. Right. Where would they send Scott Galloway back to? Was it Canada or is it England or is it Scotland? Like, what country are you from? What country are you from?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, my parents. My dad is or was a Scottish or British citizen. My mom became a citizen of the US But I guess back to the uk I don't know.

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't know.

[Kara Swisher]

God, that's interesting, Scott. Well, God, I had no idea. Well, okay. Well, I'm glad you're safe.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm opening a bar in St. Barts, so I'm a French citizen.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay.

[Scott Galloway]

But then I have to. Then I have to root for Team France and I just can't do that.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

I just can't do that.

[Kara Swisher]

All right, well, this is some news. I didn't know.

[Scott Galloway]

Something to think about after seeing Team Japan. Has there ever been a product that's been better for the umbrella brand than Team Japan? Did you see what they did after they lost in a heartbreaking loss to Brazil? They all walked over to the Japanese side and they bowed to apologize to their fans.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, they did these.

[Scott Galloway]

I think I'd like. I want to move to Japan anyways. Yeah, I would love to spend more time in Japan.

[Kara Swisher]

I lived there for a couple of months. I loved it. All right. Other Supreme Court news. Wow, Scott, this. I'm just. I need to calculate the situation.

[Scott Galloway]

You need to get me kicked out?

[Kara Swisher]

I need to get you kicked out. You're like calling Stephen Miller. I'm going to ask everyone for their ID when they come and be a guest host. In other Supreme Court news, by the way, NPR retracted an article saying that Samuel Alito, another piece of shit. Sorry, Samuel, but you are had. Retired reporter Nina Totenberg has said she heard retirement announcements were coming and mistakenly assumed it was Alito, prompting her team to publish a pre written story. That seemed like odd. It seemed like that. I think he's probably leaving, right? He's gonna have. You're gonna have to. He's got two years left to put in, you know, younger versions of Alito and Thomas, I guess. Correct.

[Scott Galloway]

Why would you think these people are any less narcissistic than Ruth Bader Ginsburg? They all think they're gonna live forever.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, they may not leave. Oh, interesting. You don't think they'll do it for the take one for the team kind of thing?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, that's what Souter did. I think it depends on the individual and I just don't know him well enough. Rbg. I mean, RBG and Senator Feinstein, both lovely, important women who've really forged paths, screwed, who really put a unfortunate punctuation mark at the end of the sentence of their career by not believing they would ever die.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Oh, you think Alito will just stick around because he loves himself?

[Scott Galloway]

I have no idea what he's like, all his things.

[Kara Swisher]

And by the way, in Thomas's, whatever his is anti whatever, he like mentioned Dred Scott an awful lot, which of course was a terrible thing. 14th amendment is here to protect all of us, so it's glad that it's there. They're gonna try to. They're gonna try to take it down, but they're gonna be as successful.

[Scott Galloway]

Protect podcasting and erectile dysfunction. Drug sales.

[Kara Swisher]

Exactly. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about SpaceX donating to Trump accounts.

[Scott Galloway]

Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile.

[Kara Swisher]

Now, I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of

[Scott Galloway]

unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made 15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal, so there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment

[Kara Swisher]

of $45 for three months, $90 for six months, or $180 for a 12 month plan. Required $15 per month equivalent to taxes and fees. Extra initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes. Me slow when network is busy. See terms.

[Scott Galloway]

Is Donald Trump still cool? Well, at first it was what he was promising to America. He was promising change. Yeah, promising change. That's a big thing. Has he lived up to that? No. No, I wouldn't say so. I'm disappointed. We're in Washington, D.C. for one of the events that Donald Trump is throwing for America's 250th anniversary. And it's UFC night. Proud to be American. We got free tickets. It's just going to be a great time. That's about it. It's an opportunity to talk to a group that was Central in the 2024 election. Young men. Why do we think Trump and men seem to have a connection? I feel like he just knows how to advertise himself with the younger crowd. It aligns with masculinity, I feel like, to a certain extent. But if they don't like Donald Trump, what do they prefer politically otherwise? I care about my family. I care about my country. I want people to be safe and happy where they live. I care about my wallet too, man. I'm Estad Herndon and this is America. Actually, catch us Every Saturday on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. No one could blame you if you thought this Men's World cup was going to be a disaster. The president of the United States isn't exactly a welcome mat for the world, and there have been plenty of embarrassing stories for the country. There was the mom of Kate Byrd's goalkeeper who wasn't let into the United States to watch her son play until the team started doing well and people clamored for her entry. The team from Dr. Congo hadn't made a Men's World cup in 52 years and hardly made this one because the United States was supposedly worried about Ebola, even though no one on the team had Ebola. If you were watching Senegal Norway last week and were wondering where all the Senegalese fans were, they weren't let into the country. But you probably noticed we let in like a million Vikings. I wonder what's different about their fan bases. Oh, and who could forget we're literally bombing one of the countries that up until Friday was playing here.

[Kara Swisher]

Missiles aren't the problem, but, but, but

[Scott Galloway]

somehow the vibes at this World cup are mostly positive. The World cup might just be healing us on today. Explained from vox.

[Kara Swisher]

Scott, we're back with more news. The Trump administration has talked with SpaceX about donating stock to the administration's Trump Accounts child savings program. It's unclear whether Elon Musk has agreed to that or how it would be structured. Trump accounts are set to launch on July 4th with over 6 million children enrolled. Other big donors include billionaire Michael Dell and his wife and companies like BlackRock and Bank of America, which have agreed to donations made by employees. Also apparently OpenAI is reportedly also discussing giving Trump administration a 5% stake in the company. Proposal reportedly involved other US AI companies also giving government similar stakes. This is, this is a To me, it was really interesting. Paul Graham had a really interesting point. The reason that OpenAI was doing that is because they don't get asked for 10%. Like I thought that was true. This all feels like a shakedown or you get something in return for doing this kind of stuff. I don't hate the idea of accounts. I don't want to I wish. We hope we will be renaming them from Trump accounts to something else, USA accounts, but it seems a little socialist to me. I don't know. What do you think?

[Scott Galloway]

Again, it's where the far right and the far left meet with just different objectives and different claims. OpenAI offering the government a 5% equity stake is essentially to buy protection, neutralize regulation, lock in a government anchor client. It's not patriotism, it's protection money. It's a moat. And you don't think they're going to be the first to get government contracts versus other AI startups. It's also the beginning of what I think is going to be one of the biggest bailouts in recent history and that is we're starting to see cracks, cracks in the wall where there's fewer people, fewer companies have actually figured out a way to create demand. There's only two now, OpenAI and Anthropic consistently. And their spend and capex commitments are so out of control that I think Sam Altman says, I like the idea of the full faith and backing and maybe even government backed debt from the President. And here's the bottom line. The government should not be taking equity stakes in companies. They just shouldn't. I mean there are some exceptions. Occasionally when I do think you can make an argument in the Great Financial Recession that it made sense for the government to bail out the automobile industry because it was a huge employer, but they didn't start saying you can only buy Fords or occasionally it saved Tesla's

[Kara Swisher]

ass back when it was these companies

[Scott Galloway]

have gotten trillions of dollars in market cap. Let them run. I mean this is just straight up cronyism. Privatize the gains, socialize the losses.

[Kara Swisher]

Can I ask you a question? One of the things Al Karp seems insane every time he opens his mouth and hopped up on something he was going on.

[Scott Galloway]

Sort of very cogent. I thought he was very cogent.

[Kara Swisher]

I do too. And I had to listen for a second because he's so nuts. He always throws in some nutball thing on the side and his manner. But what he was saying is something that Mark Cuban had said to me previously is this token maxing is going to come back to bite people and that when people find people are cheaper than the tokens, it's going to sort of collapse. Mark Cuban said this absolutely first to me months and months and months ago and Karp was, was articulating this idea of these open systems, mostly from China, as you predicted, Scott, taking the place with regular corporations and two things he was saying is one, keeping your data yours and not giving them to OpenAI's and Anthropics. And secondly, the cost of these tokens is really untenable and as nutty as he is. And he took a number of slaps at competitors because he can't help himself. He made a lot of sense. I can't believe I'm saying this too, but he did. As I was. I had to listen to it twice. And I was trying to think if I could put it in someone else's voice because every time I hear him, he says nutty things. But this is the kind of thing I was like, this is going to collapse. And a bunch of economists, all of these world economists, are all worried about these cracks that you've talked about. So talk a little bit about this because this idea, you had the idea of China, these open systems from China replacing and sort of knocking the stuffing. You have these economists saying this, you have cars, Karp saying this. Again, I want to give credit to Mark Cuban for being the first to mention it to me. Talk a little bit about this because all this government intervention seems really problematic going forward.

[Scott Galloway]

The government intervention is bailout, cosplaying growth. And Karp is right. Cheap models are eating the expensive ones. The token consumption of Chinese models has surpassed the token consumption of frontier models in the US because all of a sudden the CFO of Uber goes. Our entire AI budget was burned through in eight weeks. And I don't see any consumer talking about the improvement in ride hailing service

[Kara Swisher]

or it's not improving. It. It's not improving.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it's sort of like experimentation is over. This can no longer be a magic trick. You either have to incorporate this into the plumbing and show me roi. We're going to reduce our budgets here. And AI is following kind of the same curve as cloud computing, and that is margins compress. This reminded me of 99. And tell me if you think this analogy is apt. Okay, so the Internet comes and we think everyone's going to buy their dog food and their cars and Pepsi is going to buy their sugar online on the Internet. And we're all going to buy, not just CDs and books, but we're going to buy everything online. And there's the front layer. So everyone invests in Amazon and eToys and pets.com and it ends up that they're just not nearly creating enough demand and not enough commerce is going through E commerce to justify anything resembling the valuations these companies are getting. So they go, oh, wait, we're not sure which part of the application layer, which LLM, if you will, is going to win. So let's all invest in the infrastructure layer and everyone invested safely. And like, I can't pick the winner, so I'm going to invest in Cisco or in Telco infrastructure. And Cisco hit an all time high, lost 93% of its value from 99 to 2001. And I see kind of the same thing here where everyone's saying, all right, let's invest in the demand side. Xai La Llama Groq, Claude chatgpt and all of a sudden it looks like the demand may not be be as exponential as we thought or it's too costly or it's too expensive. Yeah. Which lowers demand. And some of the players who thought they were going to need infrastructure for their own demand, specifically Meta and Xai have said we overestimated the demand of our own LLMs. So we're renting out our infrastructure. In a matter of 30 days. It looks like we've gone from a supply crisis to a demand crisis. And what you'll see, I think, think is just as in 99, the first companies to crash were the B2C. Then it went to B2B. Oh, wait, not pets.com, let's go to, remember Internet Capital Group? Oh, they're selling sugar in between, you know, from farmers. Right.

[Kara Swisher]

I totally forgot about. I wrote so many stories.

[Scott Galloway]

It had a valuation greater than General Electric and then everyone figured out no one was buying anything and it was easier to fax your orders than it was to go on the Internet Capital Group Group website. And then everyone went to. It went B2C, then B2B. B2C gets creamed. B2B then gets creamed. And then the infrastructure guys got creamed. I think we're sort of going through a similar cycle right now, overbuilding. And we're starting to see the beginning of the cracks at the application layer. Saying people are questioning the amount of money they're spending on Anthropic and OpenAI. What's evidence of that, that OpenAI and Anthropic are considering delaying their IPOs.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I agree. And I do think one of the things I think we'll recover would be computing demand, because there's only going to be more computing demand eventually. And I think that's what happened with all those Internet companies. Like, look, there were a million. Like, I forgot about icg. Oh my God, you just brought me back. You know, everyone remembers pets.com, but, you know, eventually there'll be a Google.

[Scott Galloway]

Right.

[Kara Swisher]

Eventually there'll be a Facebook.

[Scott Galloway]

The technology will survive. These companies will survive.

[Kara Swisher]

I would bet computing is an area you would want to eventually. Once it crashes, buying it up would be a smart thing. Right. Computing apps would be an important thing. Understanding where it's going. But you're right, a lot of these companies aren't ready to buy these things and prices have to come down and then that'll have a knock on effects of Oracle and all the others who have. A lot of other companies will be affected in the blast radius of this. I agree. I think these economists. I was reading the report from this thing and usually I don't pay that much attention to like predictions, but I was like, this makes perfect sense of where it's going and it does have a feel. You're absolutely right of 1999.

[Scott Galloway]

Amazon's an amazing company from 99 to 2001 and it lost 92% of its value. Meta is an amazing company. Four years ago, in 2022 it lost 72% of its value. These companies, the natural curve of these companies is very volatile. And the technology and these companies will survive and they will be great companies. Or can they go down 90% in value? The answer is yes.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I agree.

[Scott Galloway]

This feels, it just feels so 99 to me. It's like I was saying, the government

[Kara Swisher]

meddling makes it worse.

[Scott Galloway]

The government, oh yeah. Propping them up because Trump is like my entire administration is. America is a giant bet. Whether it's the GDP growth growth, CapEx spending is, earnings growth in the S P is all a big bet on

[Kara Swisher]

AI his political money.

[Scott Galloway]

If these guys go down, it's going to be really rough for me. I'm telling you, a bailout is coming.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, one would assume. Yeah. Because they're the future of America. Yeah, you're right. 100%. All right, Scott, one more quick break. We'll be back for predictions.

[Scott Galloway]

1, 2, 3. I'm stand up comedian John Marcos Serato. And I'm actor penis model Russell Daniels. The downside is our podcast where we bring on guests to talk about how miserable their lives are. Because let's face it, things are not getting better. Every episode we talk about what's wrong with our lives. Our guests lives, the world, but in a fun way. Bottom line is you're gonna walk away feeling better about your life. We've had so many cool guests. Caleb Huron, Busy Phillips. Stavro Halkias, Laverne Cox, Hassan Piker, Alana Glazer. I promise you're gonna have a good time now on the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is the downside. I'm Seth Matlins. My new show, Create or Destroy Reimagining Marketing, explores how every decision a company makes, not just the marketing ones, but the hr, ir, pricing, org design and planning ones. The ones most don't consider marketing at all, contribute to either creating value or destroying it. Each week I sit down with CMOs, CEOs, founders, cultural thinkers, the people building, breaking and reimagining how businesses grow or don't, for conversations about what creates value and what destroys it. It's a business show, it's a marketing show. Creator destroys the show that argues they've always been the same thing. From the Vox Media Podcast Network. And the wisdom is company new episodes drop weekly on YouTube and your favorite podcast app. As America reaches its 250th anniversary, how should Americans assess their country's strength relative to the rest of the world? We're moving into a genuinely multipolar world, and that's a world in which every nation is basically for itself because nations can no longer rely on the United States to protect them. I'm John Finer. And I'm Jake Sullivan and we're the hosts of the Long Game, a weekly national security podcast. This week we sat down with historian and foreign policy expert Bob Kagan to assess America's role in the world at 250 and the future of American power. The episode's out now. Search for and follow the Long Game wherever you get your podcasts.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, Scott, before we get into this week's predictions, I want to play a prediction you made last week at Cannes.

[Scott Galloway]

My prediction is the biggest IPO in terms of first day pop is going to be a European, the Berkshire Hathaway. I've forgotten Internet brands. And that's this company called Bending Spoons that I had not heard of until two weeks ago. I'm kind of fascinated with it.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, Scott, take a victory lap. Bending spoons surged 40% after the company's IPO this week. What's next before you get to your prediction?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, so first off, the company was up, up. So SpaceX was up, I think 22 or 23%. We predict it would be up 20. Benny Spoons was up close up, I think 42% yesterday.

[Kara Swisher]

40. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

They're going to have to show that they can scale a model of buying stuff at, you know, ex Ebitda and then orphans. These orphans. And then substantially reducing costs, which is Latin for hire younger people and replace the expensive 40 year olds and to their Credit, they have some of the highest revenue per employee of any digital digital company right now or any Internet company. But they're going to have to show that they can consistently make these accretive acquisitions. What this really is, Martin Searle kind of pioneered this model. He went and bought all the big agencies. I don't even remember them now. Ogilvy Mather, he could go in and buy these companies at seven times EBITDA or eight and they'd immediately, he'd take their earnings and the market would reward him with 12 times. They're going to have to show that this model, this private equity like model of acquiring companies, they don't get them cheap, they get them from a good price. You would argue that their ability to reduce costs, continue to see growth, add some growth organic and then the market will give them a markup. They're going to have to show they can continue to do that.

[Kara Swisher]

It's slightly down right now. Today. They're going down today.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, to be clear, the valuation last year was, it was about 7 billion. It came out at 19 billion. It's trading at about 23 now. The stock's not expensive. But you would argue that they are going to have to show sooner rather than later their ability to continue to scale these types of accretive acquisitions. But I thought when I talked to, when I looked around and I said okay, all of the oxygen had been sucked out of the air for SpaceX. And when these guys came out at seven or eight times earnings and all of those brands and the fact they were only raising a billion and a half dollars, I thought this thing's going to get. I mean this is the Sad part about IPOs. This is what I believe JP Morgan and Goldman Sachs are doing. And that is they use AI and their incredible market insight and their incredible marketing machine. They are the new engineers. They engineer a 20 plus percent pop on day one. Because the reality is that is the ultimate branding event. Everywhere in the news today is that Italian company Bending spoons is up 20%. And personally I wanted to see the company go up. And the reason I brought some sunlight to it was because I am so sick of talking about American AI companies. I love the idea a European company

[Kara Swisher]

that's not AI and also cleanup, a cleanup company. You know what's interesting is that I'm just looking at the meta thing. They're at 20, the PE ratio is 20, which seems healthy. And that SpaceX is valued at $500 billion more than them is insane.

[Scott Galloway]

That makes no sense.

[Kara Swisher]

I don't care how good they are at robots, it's just nutty. What he'll do is he'll fold Tesla into this. But as I've said many times, which

[Scott Galloway]

is another anchor to anchors.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, two anchors cling to each other. But it is, there are some real values here. Right. Like meta seems to be. I mean I don't usually make meta

[Scott Galloway]

on a price earnings basis. I don't think has ever been this cheap and the cheapest of them all and was my big tech stock pick for 26 though Amazon has never had a price earnings ratio this low.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. What is theirs? Wow. You know Google Alphabet is 27, Met is 21. Amazon you're right, is low 29.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah and it's usually it's average over the last 20 years has been 55. And anyways, industrialized robots all gone forever. But so my prediction is that essentially, and I said this, we're starting to see cracks in the wall around evidence. And I think it's nuanced, not definitive. It's not cracking because AI doesn't work. It's cracking because investors are starting to ask much more pointed questions. Specifically, can we actually earn a return on the trillions of dollars being spent here? And there's evidence that the narrative around AI is changing and that is Capex is outrunning monetization. The largest cloud companies are on pace to spend 6 to 700 billion on AI infrastructure just this year. Yet many enterprise customers are struggling to demonstrate measurable roi. And that is the narratives move from can AI work? To can AI pay? And it used to be spend more money. This is the future, infinite demand. And it's like Whoa, hold on. CFOs are starting to tap the brakes here and the market is splitting. JP Morgan noted the divergence. AI infrastructure suppliers continue to outperform and the companies writing the biggest AI checks, the hyperscalers, have begun to lag. And that's reminiscent again of late stage infrastructure booms where the suppliers prosper before the customers earn adequate returns. And also Wall street as it does eventually focuses on ROI. And the debate has shifted from 12 months ago the debate was who can build the biggest model. Now it's who can make money.

[Kara Swisher]

Right?

[Scott Galloway]

And one of my role models here are this fantastic chief economist who by the way has I think a much better sense of humor than certain chief chief investment officers at other big banks. Apollo's Torsten Slok, does he like a dick joke? I think Torsten loves a good dick joke, but I'm not going to speak for him. I'm not going to speak for him, but he puts out these fantastic emails every day with a chart and he argues that the markets may be pricing and productivity gains that will take years, not quarters, to materialize. We're starting to see central bankers issue warnings.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, they are. They're all over the place. Place.

[Scott Galloway]

And here's the thing, Kara. If the AI trade unwinds, the most vulnerable names are generally the ones whose valuations depend most valuable on continued AI infrastructure spending. The Tier 1 risk level is Nvidia, Astera Labs and Marvel Technology. These companies are extraordinary businesses, don't get me wrong, but they're the most exposed to a slowdown in GPU and networking demand.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, they're the Cisco. Nvidia is the Cisco.

[Scott Galloway]

And then the Tier 2 Vertiv, super microcomputer, Core Weaver. These are effectively picks and shovels for the AI gold rush. And then you go to the third level. The Microsofts, the Alphabets, the Amazons and Meta. There would be nowhere to hide here. And that is the technology story is intact. It's just that the valuation story is beginning to get stress tested and I don't think it's going to survive that stress test. So what's the prediction on all eight or 10 of those companies? A basket of them down 20 to 40% in the next 12 months. And by the way, still great companies. The technology will survive. I believe that the better AI players are going to be juggernauts in five to 10 years. But we are entering. These guys are just way out in front of their skis.

[Kara Swisher]

Yep, I would agree. I'm going to make a short prediction too thing that we'd started beginning with the Trumps. I just noticed this New York Post on Trump family corruption, which was interesting. I think it's not Trump that's gonna pay for this. Cause I think he's gonna die before we can get to him. But I think his children and the children of the Lutniks and the rest are gonna get it. I do think they're gonna get it.

[Scott Galloway]

You mean be prosecuted?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes. Here's why. This is the New York Post. The Trump sons, meanwhile, are part owners or investors in companies neck deep in key defense contracts to mine tungsten reserves in Central Asia. It stinks to high heaven if the President's family making bank from obscure resource companies in the former Soviet Union sound famil because Hunter Biden's lucrative connection Burisma Ukrainian gas company was a major scandal in the 2020 election and beyond. Republicans, including Donald Trump, were justifiably outraged at the obvious influence peddling. These kids are going to pay a price. That's my prediction. Years from now.

[Scott Galloway]

You don't think they'll get pardons?

[Kara Swisher]

I think he'll try, but I think there's all manner of ways to get to them. I just think they're in for a. I think they're infer a lot. That's my prediction anyway. But I think it's all part of the same thing like you're talking about that we cannot save these Internet companies. We cannot keep intervening for friends of Donald Trump or family members anyway. It's gross. Socialism is really what it is. Communism really. Anyway, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com pivot submit a question for the show or call 85551, pivot. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot. Be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube Ch. And please beg the chief investment officer of that bank to forgive Scott so we can start telling dick jokes again. We'll be back next week.

[Scott Galloway]

Release the dick jokes. Today's show was produced by Lara Neyman, Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Todd Wiseman. Additional assistance from Kate Gallagher and Brad Sylvester. Earning a Todd engineer this episode. Thanks also to Drew Brosmia Silvera and Dan Shalon, Nishat Khuras, Vox Media's executive producer of podcasts. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thank you for listening to Pivot from Vox Media. We'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Spotify, it's Jay Shetty. Are you one of those media strategy people scrolling through spreadsheets, searching for an audience that pays twice as much attention to your ads than they do on social media? Let me introduce you to fans. And they're here with me on Spotify. Trust me, I know fans. They don't skip. They stay for hours. They don't move on. They manifest. They're not a demographic group. They're fans. Spotify advertising. You're among fans. Queen Carvania stood haloed by the morning sun. An army hung on her every word.

[Kara Swisher]

My champions, I have sold my chariot on Carvana. Twas a lovely suv, an inexplicably queenly offer. They're even coming to the castle to collect it.

[Scott Galloway]

Tonight we feast.

[Kara Swisher]

An offer you can feast on. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pickup fees may apply. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task unless you have a partner like Shopify, they have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website to marketing to selling and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need. There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz and Allbirds continue to trust and use them. With Shopify on your side, turn your big business idea into Sign up for your $1 per month [e-mail] specialoffer.