Plain English with Derek Thompson — BEST OF: How Gen Z Sees the World
Podcast Host: Derek Thompson (The Ringer)
Guest: Kyla Scanlon
Air Date: December 23, 2025
Episode Theme
This “best of” episode explores how Generation Z (roughly those born between the late 1990s and early 2010s) perceives the world and navigates adulthood. Derek Thompson interviews financial commentator Kyla Scanlon, who brings both research and personal insight as a member of the oldest cohort of Gen Z. They cover major themes such as technology’s impact, financial uncertainty, changing work ethics, institutional trust, politics, anxiety, dating, and the “algorithmic self.”
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Defining Gen Z’s Subgroups
[06:26]
- Kyla breaks Gen Z into three “subgenerations”:
- Gen Z 1.0: Graduated high school pre-Covid, smartphone is a tool, not an environment. (“I remember flip phones... I graduated into the pandemic. My first interaction with work was entirely online...” [06:38] Kyla)
- Gen Z 1.5: The “Covid cohort,” came of age during pandemic school shutdowns. Technology and institutional trust are complex due to pandemic-era education.
- Gen Z 2.0: Never known a world without smartphones or social media; digital reality is “the air you breathe.”
Notable Quote:
“For [Gen Z 2.0], the technology is all consuming... It just feels almost inescapable.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [09:35]
2. Complex Relationship with Technology and Institutions
[08:34–13:29]
- Smartphones: Shift from being tools to being immersive environments.
- Social media is both connective and corrosive. Many young people wish apps like TikTok didn’t exist.
- AI intensifies uncertainty about the future:
“You have young people who are in college... saying, ‘I don’t even know if a career path for me is going to exist.’”
— Kyla Scanlon, [12:14] - Pandemic: Fostered both a distrust of institutions and a backlash against enforced digital immersion.
[11:42]
Kyla self-describes as “a huge hypocrite” for making social media content while acknowledging its negative effects.
3. Gen Z and Financial Nihilism (“fafonomics”)
[14:13]
- Rise of high-risk speculative investing: meme coins, stocks, and sports gambling.
- Fafonomics: “Effing around and finding out”—a strategy of chaos due to lack of predictable economic pathways.
“For young people... it doesn’t feel like that predictable progress path is there.” — Kyla Scanlon, [15:12]
- Centrality of housing crisis. Financial nihilism is rooted in the un-affordability of basic milestones (home, job stability).
“It’s housing. It’s such a boring answer, but... nobody can afford housing.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [15:46] - Career ladder is broken, returns on education are unguaranteed.
4. The Attention Economy: MrBeast & Gen Z Work Psychology
[20:11–30:00]
- MrBeast as Gen Z “Corporate Leader”: Laser focus on quantifiable success (clicks, views, engagement) over traditional ideas of artistic merit.
“‘Your job is not to make the best produced videos... It’s to make the best YouTube videos possible.’” — MrBeast memo, quoted by Derek, [23:34]
- Disappearance of creative freedom:
“The algorithms are closing in on us. There’s less and less room... to be creative, because everything is so mathematically driven.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [24:46] - Shift in work evaluation: From hours spent to quantifiable outcomes. Gen Z wants to work “smarter,” not longer.
5. Collapse of Institutional Trust & Political Realignment
[33:03–42:25]
- Gen Z’s trust in institutions (except the UN) has plummeted.
- Causes: Political gridlock, misinformation, disappearance of stable economic pathways.
- Phones and algorithms amplify negativity, eroding trust further.
“Rage is an excellent monetization machine... We’ve had the WWE-ification of politics.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [37:36] - Political swings: Young men shifted right, driven by economic anxiety more than ideology; young women became more liberal, often in reaction to threats to autonomy:
“The conservative shift was mostly about the economy.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [41:00] - Polarization and tribalism affect dating and relationships.
6. Housing as the Core Anxiety
[44:36]
- Housing is repeatedly invoked as Gen Z’s foundational problem—impacting everything from financial security to when/if to form families.
“Housing is the foundation for how we interact with the economy.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [44:52]
7. Delays in Adulting, Romance, & Isolation
[46:34–51:21]
- Marriage, home-buying, and family formation all delayed, largely for economic reasons.
- Dating is down: Only 56% of Gen Z adults have been in a relationship in their teens/twenties (compared to 70%+ for previous cohorts).
“Young people have zero interest in paying for apps... It is such a point of friction to date and to be rejected and to have to try again.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [48:36] - Anxiety and social isolation, amplified by technology and pandemic life interruptions, are frequently cited barriers.
8. The “Algorithmic Self” & Mental Health
[52:21]
- Phones, algorithms, and always-on digital life drive unprecedented anxiety and confusion about identity.
“It is difficult to find yourself... Who am I underneath all this? There’s just... not so much room for experimentation.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [53:10] - Gen Z left to construct identities in public, under quantifiable scrutiny, which is unnatural:
“I don’t think people are meant to discover who they are in front of an audience of thousands of strangers they can’t see...”
— Derek Thompson, [55:22]
Memorable Moments & Quotes
- On generational nuance:
“Every time somebody says this generation is like X, they’re engaging in some massive unforgivable overgeneralization.”
— Derek Thompson, [05:12] - On the smartphone as ‘oxygen’:
“The air you breathe—something as invisible and boring as oxygen.”
— Derek Thompson, [08:34] - On MrBeast and the attention economy:
“[He] is a master of his craft and you definitely have to give him credit for that. Like, you know, don’t hate the player, hate the game.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [22:17] - On algorithm-driven identity:
“There’s a really good research paper... all about how you kind of create this new personhood when you interact with [the digital] reality.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [37:06]
Segment Timestamps
- [06:26] — Gen Z’s subgenerational breakdown
- [09:26] — Technology as tool vs. environment; social media backlashes
- [14:13] — Meme stocks, fafonomics, and financial nihilism
- [20:11] — MrBeast memo and the quantification of creative work
- [33:03] — Institutional trust in freefall among Gen Z; causes and consequences
- [39:19] — Gen Z’s political identity shifts and tribalism
- [44:36] — Housing crisis and its psychological impact
- [46:34] — Delayed adulthood, “adulting”, and why Gen Z isn’t dating
- [52:21] — Social anxiety, algorithmic selves, and rising rates of depression
Episode Summary Statement
Derek and Kyla draw a nuanced but sometimes stark portrait of Gen Z as a generation defined by digital immersion, economic instability, and skepticism:
- They feel both empowered and suffocated by technology.
- Their pursuit of financial security feels more like a gamble than a grind.
- They mistrust institutions and instead chase quantifiable metrics, whether in work or personal life.
- Their relationships, identities, and ambitions are shaped—and sometimes stymied—by forces outside their control.
- And underlying it all: a sense that the conventional adult milestones are out of reach, leaving them to “fuck around and find out” what comes next.
Final take:
“For the first time ever, you have to navigate these two different realities... Like where you’re having to figure out this stuff, like the technological stuff on top of the real-world stuff. And that’s just life. But it is immensely complicated.”
— Kyla Scanlon, [56:32]
For listeners seeking an introduction to Gen Z’s worldview, this episode presents an original, honest, and sometimes sobering conversation—grounded in data, lived experience, and left with room for empathy.