Capitalism (Taylor's Version) (25-minute Podcast Version)

Summary

Planet Money: "Capitalism (Taylor's Version)"

Podcast: Planet Money (NPR)
Air Date: November 28, 2025
Episode Length: 25 minutes

---

Overview

This episode of Planet Money explores how Taylor Swift’s business acumen—particularly the release strategy of her latest album “Life of a Showgirl”—shattered sales records through modern capitalist tactics. Hosted in collaboration with the Vox podcast Today, Explained, the episode investigates the intersection between passionate fandom, music industry rulebooks, and the new face of pop-star capitalism. Along the way, the panel discusses backlash to Swift’s latest album, broader trends in music marketing, and the evolving expectations of artists in an era where business strategy and art are increasingly intertwined.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Album: Record Sales vs. Mixed Reviews

• Swift’s “Life of a Showgirl” broke the first-week sales record with over 4 million units sold, surpassing Adele’s previous record (set a decade earlier).
• Despite commercial triumph, many fans and critics panned the album for lack of quality.
  • Noel King (Host): “If the album didn't sound so great, how did it sell so much better than everything else? The answer to that question may just be the trade secret behind Taylor Swift.” [00:58]

2. The Variant Boom: Capitalist Genius

• Elias Light (WSJ): Explains the industry shift towards releasing numerous album variants (e.g. alternate covers, bundled merchandise, bonus tracks, etc.) to drive physical and digital sales.
  • 27 different physical editions released, including exclusive box sets, different jewelry items, and acoustic or voice memo tracks.
  • "There was a really wide range of options for the super Taylor F." [07:02]
• This tactic taps superfans’ willingness to buy multiple versions, artificially boosting first-week sales figures.
  • “If you can get one fan to buy three, five, seven copies, that is just gonna boost your numbers.” [08:23] — Elias Light

3. Industry-Wide Adoption & the Chart Game

• The variant strategy isn’t unique to Swift; it’s the new norm among top artists.
• The top 10 albums last year had, on average, 22 versions.
  • Elias Light: “Where you've really seen it come into play is when artists are in kind of tight races for number one.” [09:00]
• Example: A close race between Sabrina Carpenter and Travis Scott involved rapid releases of digital variants to clinch the top chart spot. Carpenter won by just 1,000 units because of these tactics.
  • “Sabrina's pretty much like, I want y’all to stream the hell out of this album in this song, boost my numbers up for the day so I can eclipse Travis Scott.” [09:25]

4. Criticisms & Ethical Concerns

• Increasing backlash from fans and critics:
  • Some see the variant strategy as "exploitative"—milking passionate supporters.
  • Environmental concerns over waste from numerous physical editions.
  • “Having all 20 versions of the same album with the exact same music on it is wasteful and it's very capitalist.” [11:22] — Host Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi
• Light speculates that hitting 4 million required every edition: “She only cleared that mark by 2,000 units, which is a pretty small amount ... it might have been the 38th variant that got you there.” [11:41]

5. Rule Changes & Evading the System

• Once chart authorities close one loophole (e.g. banning album ticket bundles), the industry pivots to a new strategy, now album variants.
• “Artists and labels are always going to try to figure out whatever strategy they can use to maximize that first week.” [13:25]

6. The Backlash Grows: Fans & Critics Unite

• The album’s negative reaction is felt more acutely than with previous releases; even dedicated fans express disillusionment.
  • “I have been for years a huge, huge Taylor Swift fan. I would still consider myself a fan, but I do not like this album.” [15:55] — Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi
• Leak of the song “Actually Romantic” (allegedly a dig at Charli XCX) soured pre-release attitudes.
  • “Honestly, it is a pretty crass song. You know, it's broad humor. It's not subtle. And I think the timing of that leak was a big negative for the reception of this album.” [18:10] — Ann Powers (NPR Music)

7. Resentment Toward Success & Changing Expectations

• Fans and critics have increasingly focused on Swift’s wealth and her brand’s capitalist excess, questioning her continued portrayal of herself as the underdog.
  • “A kind of larger backlash has been brewing against very wealthy Americans in general.” [18:50] — Ann Powers

8. Swift’s Response to Criticism

• Swift maintained a “not the art police” stance, suggesting an open, reflective approach.
  • “I'm not the art police.” [19:27] — Taylor Swift, paraphrased as reported by Ann Powers
• Powers observes some fans felt this attitude came off as dismissive.
  • “I think to others that almost felt like, I don't care about your opinion.” [19:47] — Ann Powers

9. Villain or Victim? Interpreting the Album’s Persona

• Powers posits Swift now performs “the villain” rather than “the victim”:
  • “I don't think she's playing the victim so much on Life of a Showgirl. I think she's playing the villain.” [20:56] — Ann Powers
  • The track “Cancelled” is highlighted as riskily aligning with right-wing U.S. culture wars: “The word canceled hits a certain way. It's far more associated with the right, with the maga movement and with President Trump himself than it is with anyone else. And I have to think Taylor Swift knew that.” [21:40]

10. Art, Wealth and Growth: What Do We Expect from Pop Stars?

• Comparisons with Beyoncé: While Beyoncé uses her platform to speak to broader social and racial issues, Swift remains focused on autobiography.
  • “She has very much clung to autobiography as the center of what she does.” [23:48] — Ann Powers
• The expectation of artistic evolution: Powers questions why pop stardom is viewed as a journey of self-improvement.
  • "I find it strange that being a pop star and producing albums is sort of being talked about as if it is a life journey of self-improvement." [24:18] — Ann Powers

11. The Real Motive: Controlling the Narrative

• Powers speculates Swift released this album less for money and more to control her legacy and public persona, providing a “marker” that reflects her new, happier life.
  • “She needed a marker on the highway that said, hey, I'm happy now. I'm in control. I have power ...” [24:50] — Ann Powers

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Noel King: “It is also capitalist genius.” [00:50]
• Elias Light: “I mean, artists never want to admit it, but a lot of artists, and also their labels are fiercely competitive and they really care a lot about sort of the commercial reception of their work.” [07:23]
• Ann Powers: “She is sort of like I imagine her clinging to a giant pendulum as it swings back and forth. She really occupies a unique space in popular culture ... But I really think we're seeing it play out that Taylor Swift has become the avatar for so many of our anxieties, so many of our dissatisfactions.” [16:03]
• Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi: “Like, at this point, you could just tile a bathroom with how many different versions of one album she's put out.” [11:35]
• Ann Powers: “Do I blame her for that? No, I don't blame her for that. I get it completely, but let's recognize it for what it is: It's a marker on her highway, and she's going to go somewhere else pretty soon.” [25:15]

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:24 – 02:12: Introduction and framing—Swift’s album sales vs. criticism
• 03:00 – 08:45: Elias Light explains the variant strategy and industry trends
• 09:00 – 10:29: Sabrina Carpenter vs. Travis Scott—when sales rivalry goes nuclear
• 10:29 – 13:34: Ethical critique, sustainability, and what’s next for the industry
• 15:04 – 18:50: Ann Powers on backlashes, changing fandom, and the power of leaks
• 19:27 – 21:19: Swift’s response and allegations of dismissiveness
• 21:19 – 24:48: Artistic purpose, comparisons with Beyoncé, and the search for growth
• 24:50 – 25:15: Ann Powers on Swift’s true motive: controlling the narrative

---

Conclusion

“Capitalism (Taylor’s Version)” is a sharp, insightful dissection of how one of the world’s biggest pop stars leverages fandom, strategy, and narrative control to dominate an evolving music industry. The episode highlights the increasingly capitalist nature of pop music marketing, the shifting relationship between artists and their audiences, and the complicated expectations we place on our icons. Taylor Swift might be polarizing, but as this episode makes clear, she’s reshaping what it means to succeed in both music and business.

---

For fuller insight, listen between [00:24 and 25:15]—the heart of this focused, provocative episode.

Transcript

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

This message comes from Capital One. Banking with Capital One helps you keep more money in your wallet with no fees or minimums on checking accounts. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capitalone.com bank for details. Capital One NA member FDIC. This is Planet Money from NPR.

[Noel King]

Taylor Swift's new record got all kinds of people all hot and bothered. They said it was sloppy, it was immature, just not that good.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Her name was Kitty made her money being pretty and witty they gave her the keys to this city.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Some listeners were disappointed it didn't sound as advertised.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

This is a sad day to be.

[Ann Powers]

A Swiftie and that's just my truth.

[Noel King]

But it is also capitalist genius.

[Elias Light]

Death of a Showgirl the life of a capitalist. That's what I think this album honestly should be called.

[Noel King]

The Life of a Showgirl broke records for sales the equivalent of over 4 million albums sold in the first week. At the same time, a lot of fans had concerns about the actual quality of the album. If the album didn't sound so great, how did it sell so much better than everything else? The answer to that question may just be the trade secret behind Taylor Swift.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Inc. Hey, thank you for the lovely bouquet. You're sweeter than a peach but you don't know the life of a show girl bab and you're never ever gonna.

[Noel King]

Hello and welcome to Planet Money. I'm Alexi Horowitz. Ghazi today on the show. Sure, Taylor Swift is a talented musician and performer, but we're here because of her talents at money making. Our friends over at Vox's daily News podcast today explained had a great dissection of how musicians are using new business savvy to game the charts and play off the spending habits of their biggest fans. None more than Taylor Swift. So we are turning it over to Noel King at Today Explained to take us through, as she calls it, capitalism. Taylor's version also why T Swizzle doesn't even really care if you like her album.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Thank you for an unforgettable night. We will see you next time. Give it up for the band.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

This message comes from Vanguard Capturing value in the bond market is not easy. That's why Vanguard offers a suite of over 80 institutional quality bond funds actively managed by a 200 person global team of sector specialists, analysts and traders. They're designed for financial advisors looking to give their clients consistent results year in and year out. See the [e-mail] audio that's vanguard.com audio. All investing is subject to risk. Vanguard Marketing Corporation Distributor I'm Noel King.

[Elias Light]

My full name is Elias Light, and I report on music for the Wall Street Journal.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Are you a Taylor Swift fan?

[Elias Light]

I am. A little more of the early stuff, a little less of the more recent stuff.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

What did you think of the new record?

[Elias Light]

It was not my favorite, but again, as a reporter, I try to keep that out of what we write.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

You don't want to tell me what your beef?

[Elias Light]

I mean, I'm more of a melody and rhythm guy than a lyric guy, but I found some of the lyrics to sort of be cringy to a level where they pulled me completely out of the experience of listening.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Every joke's just trolling in memes. Sad as it seems, apathy is hard.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

She set a record, as I understand it, for biggest debut week. How big was it?

[Elias Light]

So she cleared the 4 million threshold, which honestly most of the industry thought could not be done. And the previous record was around 3.5 million, set by Adele. Hello.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

It'S me.

[Elias Light]

That was a decade ago, and at that time, sort of streaming was just taking off and a lot of artists were very wary of it. We need to fight, like the Spotify thing.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

I really believe that we in the music industry can work together to find a way to bond technology with integrity.

[Elias Light]

And when Adele dropped that album, she kept it off streaming, not just for the first week, but for something like seven months. And the only song that was available to stream was hello, that massive first single. And she just. The sales numbers were through the roof for that. More recently now, artists are very comfortable, most of them, with streaming, especially the stars. They want to have their album in every possible place that a fan might want to listen to it.

[Ann Powers]

I pre saved my album on Spotify. Did you?

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Hey, it's Sabrina. You can pre save my new album Short n Sweet on Spotify now, but.

[Elias Light]

Sort of a new technique has become popular for the first week, which is release a lot of different variations of the album. And that both gives your biggest fans a lot of different ways to support you and also allows you to kind of boost your first week sales numbers.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Okay, so Taylor has released a bunch of albums since Adele released 25. This was the first one that beat the record. And what you're saying is it beat the record because there were so many different variants you could buy?

[Elias Light]

That's a great question. I mean, we don't have a counterfactual, but it certainly helped. I mean, she just did a absolutely massive amount of physical sales. Breaking news, Taylor Swift is back and she's breaking records. And now when I say records, 1.2 million copies of vinyl alone in the first 24 hours. I think it's genius. If they're buying it, why not keep giving it to them, Boy. So I think there were 27 different physical editions. There were a couple of those CDs came in kind of box sets which had clothing.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

My Life of a Showgirl cardigan just came in.

[Ann Powers]

Cardigan arrived.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

In pretty box. I mean, I don't even own a CD player, but I have a CD now.

[Elias Light]

Some of the Vines vinyl came with different, like, jewelry items. There was like a bracelet. People liked a necklace.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

That is why I bought 1, 2, and 3. I got the hairbrush and the barrette. So let's open it up.

[Elias Light]

Some of the CDs came with bonus acoustic tracks. There were also the digital download versions that came with bonus acoustic tracks.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

And you're never, ever gonna.

[Elias Light]

Some of them had voice memos from Taylor about songs that she'd done instead of the acoustic.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Opalite is a song on my album that I think is just so infectiously contagiously.

[Elias Light]

So there was a really wide range of options for the super Taylor F.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

I'm not going to say it's cheating because all's fair in love and capitalism, but album variants are very clearly a strategy to boost sales numbers. Why?

[Elias Light]

Yeah, I mean, so I think one thing people sometimes don't understand. I mean, artists never want to admit it, but a lot of artists, and also their labels are fiercely competitive and they really care a lot about sort of the commercial reception of their work. They want to say they got a top 10, a top five, ideally a number one. The problem with streaming, right, is for the listener, it's like this amazing offering where you're paying $11 a month for almost all the music in history, right? But for artists, a lot of their biggest fans actually will spend more money on their behalf. They want to support them. And certainly there's other ways you can kind of tap into that. Buy merchandise by selling concert tickets. But one way they've increasingly tried to do it is by releasing a lot of kind of variations of this album and making them more like collectibles. A lot of people who buy the vinyl don't even listen to it. They just put it up on the wall. So I bought every single vinyl and CD variant for Taylor Swift's the Life of a Showgirl, so you don't have to.

[Ann Powers]

It's so pretty.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Side A. Oh, my God, look at the rippling.

[Elias Light]

And then at the same time, again, if you can get one fan to buy Three, five, seven copies. That is just gonna boost your numbers. And most artists, again, especially at this level, they're competing with their peers, and they want to win, so they want to kind of push every lever that is available for them to get a big first week.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Taylor Swift does go the extra mile. It's what people like or at least recognize about her. This thing about I'm going to do 38 variants to boost my sales. She's not the only person doing it, I imagine. Who else?

[Ann Powers]

No.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Yeah.

[Elias Light]

I mean, again, this has become a super popular tactic. So the 10 biggest albums last year, ranked by physical sales, came in 22 different versions on average. Where you've really seen it come into play is when artists are in kind of tight races for number one. And last year, there was a race that turned a lot of heads.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Oh, I leave quite an impression after.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

Three number one albums, would have thought.

[Elias Light]

I feel amazing. It was Sabrina Carpenter versus Travis Scott, and it was very close. And as it got near the end of the week, they were both. I mean, Travis put out, I think, six different digital variants on the final day of the week, and Sabrina put out three of her own. This is a chess move. Sabrina's pretty much like, I want y' all to stream the hell out of this album in this song, boost my numbers up for the day so I can eclipse Travis Scott. Honestly, she didn't come to play. She took courses from Ms. Taylor Swift on how to secure that number one album.

[Ann Powers]

I'm sorry.

[Elias Light]

And it's just the digital variants are sort of the easiest one to put together. It's like, oh, look, here's my album. Plus a voice note or an acoustic song or. Sometimes people honestly don't even add music. They just put out different artwork. So you can just throw them out very quickly and say, hey, fans, this is only available for, you know, six hours. Go get it again. In that case, because the race was so close, Sabrina Carpenter ended up winning by only about 1000 units.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

This is a really interesting way to kind of game the music business, which, of course, is a business, as these artists know. Is there anyone lobbing critiques at this strategy?

[Elias Light]

Yeah, I mean, definitely. As the strategy has become more popular, the backlash has sort of become a lot louder. And you see a lot of fans who are arguing that this is kind of exploitative. You're basically kind of milking your most passionate supporters for as much money as you can take from them. You know, there's also a growing body of fans who are concerned about the environment, and they're worried that all these CDs and records, if they're not made in a sustainable way, are pretty wasteful. Again, because Taylor Swift's so big and because the album did have a pretty polarizing reaction, there's been a lot of chatter online about sort of whether she needed to do this and whether she's kind of gone too far.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Having all 20 versions of the same album with the exact same music on it is wasteful and it's very capitalist.

[Elias Light]

And you shouldn't have this rush to, like, buy one cover and then two days later there might be another one that's out.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Like, at this point, you could just tile a bathroom with how many different versions of one album she's put out.

[Elias Light]

Side note, I think it is that thing where I bet she probably could have broken the record without putting out 38 different versions. But if she wanted to get to 4 million, she only cleared that mark by 2,000 units, which is a pretty small amount, right? So, yeah, she squeaked in, she squeaked by. So if you, if 4 million is your goal, it might have been the 38th variant that got you there. They have the data, we don't. But again, whether or not artists should sort of care about fairly arbitrary commercial goals is a valid question. But it seemed pretty clear that 4 million was the target.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Do you think the new normal is 12 variants, 20 variants, 38 variants?

[Elias Light]

I think for now it definitely is. What we see happen, and we've seen it happen again and again is sort of artists, again, they care intensely about getting the biggest numbers possible. They'll come up with a strategy to do so, and then the chart rules will change and they will have to adjust. Right. So a while ago, there was a popular period in the music industry where you could bundle album sales with tickets. So you would find artists who had a really great live business selling just an album accompanying a tour ticket. And they would do huge numbers, which they could never achieve if they weren't able to kind of link those two together. Then the bundling was kind of mostly banned and sort of the new era came in. And now people are more into this variant strategy. At a certain point, if the chart rules change again, there will be a new. A new system they come up with. I think the one thing you can guarantee is that artists and labels are always going to try to figure out whatever strategy they can use to maximize that first week.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Elias Light WSJMux coming up, everyone's a critic.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

This message comes from NPR sponsor Zoom. Work isn't just meetings. It's calls, chats, docs, emails, calendar invites, events and more. And Zoom brings it all together on one platform. Everything flows together so that you can finally focus on what matters. With Zoom, ideas happen faster, projects move forward, and your workday finally works for you. Zoom is more than meetings. It's a unified platform powering how people get work done. Learn [e-mail] podcast and Zoom ahead. This message comes from NPR sponsor AARP. Where do you see your career in 12 years? What are you doing now to help you get there? The sooner you start enhancing your skills, the sooner you'll be ready. That's why AARP has management, finance and small business reskilling courses, all to help your income live as long as you do. Because the steps you choose to take today will help you love what you do in the future. Learn [e-mail] skills I'm Ann Powers.

[Ann Powers]

I'm a critic and correspondent for NPR Music. I have been called a Taylor Swift whisperer. I'm a music critic, and in that capacity I have been writing about Taylor since she started making music back in the early mid 2000s. So I'm not a Swiftie, but I definitely respect her, absolutely respect her as an artist and as a businesswoman and as a pop cultural phenomenon and all the things. I found it really interesting to observe the backlash against Taylor Swift.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Some of those lyrics are AI generated. Can I prove it?

[Noel King]

No. Worst writing lyrically she has ever done in her entire career. Worst, tackiest, most out of touch, most childish.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

I have been for years a huge, huge Taylor Swift fan. I would still consider myself a fan, but I do not like this album.

[Ann Powers]

Which is more intense this year and with this release than it was with her previous release, the Tortured Poets Department, Although that album also did incur a bit of a backlash. I'm most interested in how both critics and the general public are now responding to Taylor in a very different way than they did even about the Eras tour. She is sort of like I imagine her clinging to a giant pendulum as it swings back and forth. You know, I feel that's what's happening with her. And this is this is possibly inevitable with anyone of her stature. I mean, she really occupies a unique space in popular culture, certainly in pop music. But I really think we're seeing it play out that Taylor Swift has become the avatar for so many of our anxieties, so many of our dissatisfactions. And that's pretty interesting to watch.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Yeah, let's talk about some of the anxieties and dissatisfactions in whether or not Taylor Swift deserves this. So in the first half of the show, we talked about how Taylor Swift is a very, very successful businesswoman. No shock there. But two things happened with this album. The first is there are so many variants. There's a Target exclusive Crowd Is yous King Vinyl. There's a hairbrush that falls apart. There's a tiny bubble in a champagne collection. Right. It's on and on and on. So there's that and. And then there's that. A lot of people, when the album first dropped, decided they didn't really like it.

[Ann Powers]

Yes.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

How do we square those two things? Do those two facts depend on one another?

[Ann Powers]

They're in relationship with one another. I'm not sure if they depend on one another. What's interesting about the backlash about the album itself is that it seems to have been triggered by the leak of the lyrics for a particular song. Actually Romantic.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

I heard you call me boring Barbie when the coke's got you Brave, which.

[Ann Powers]

Is the song that allegedly is aimed at the pop star Charlie xcx, an attack on her. Honestly, it is a pretty crass song. You know, it's broad humor. It's not subtle. Yeah. And I think the timing of that leak was a big negative for the reception of this album.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

But, Anne, it's not like. And then we realize that Taylor Swift is Rick or. And then we realize she's gonna, like, what? How did everyone become so irritated about the same thing?

[Ann Powers]

Yeah, I mean, this has been building for a while, actually. I think after Tortured Poets Department came out. Since that time, I've started to see more and more online chatter about Taylor Swift's wealth, her social status, and her choice to continue to write songs in which she is the, quote unquote, underdog, even though she is so on top of the world. Not coincidentally, I think this was going on as a kind of larger backlash has been brewing against very wealthy Americans in general.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

And her response, Taylor's response is what exactly?

[Ann Powers]

Well, Swift did a small number of interviews upon the release of the record, and in one of them, on the Zane Lowe show on Apple Music, she basically said, I'm not the art police.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

It's like everybody is allowed to feel.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Exactly how they want.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

And what our goal is as entertainers is to be a mirror, which I'm.

[Ann Powers]

Sure to her felt, you know, open hearted and confident and reasonable. But I think to others that almost felt like, I don't care about your opinion.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

If it's the first week of my album release and you are saying either my name or my album title, you're helping.

[Ann Powers]

So this was particularly exacerbating to Swifties, to fans who also have been struggling. And that has been a notable part of this backlash. It's not only professional critics, it's not only online trolls who never liked Taylor Swift anyway. A lot of very die hard Taylor fans are also publicly raising doubts about their hero.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Yeah, there is something to that I don't care about your feelings vibe. Because if you listen to Taylor Swift's music, including songs on this album, like Elizabeth Taylor, to hear this artist who so frequently seems to be playing to us and telling us, hey, feel really bad for me, come out and say, oh, but I don't care what you think. This is not a two way street, guys.

[Ann Powers]

Well, this is where my opinion might differ from some others opinions.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Oh, tell me.

[Ann Powers]

I don't think she's playing the victim so much on Life of a Showgirl. I think she's playing the villain. I think she's inhabiting a role consciously in which she can express these negative emotions, but she's doing it in this very swaggering, macho way. The one song that truly does trouble me on this album is called Cancelled.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

Good thing I like my friends Cancell.

[Ann Powers]

And in that song, Taylor Swift is addressing her friends who have gone through struggles with the media that resemble the ones she's gone through.

[Sabrina Carpenter]

They're the ones with matching scars.

[Ann Powers]

So those lyrics, you can read them several different ways. I suppose the word canceled has been in the vernacular for a while, right? But in 2025, in the America of 2025, the word canceled hits a certain way. It's far more associated with the right, with the maga movement and with President Trump himself than it is with anyone else. And I have to think Taylor Swift knew that. It's sort of. I mean, she may live in some kind of, you know, fame bubble, but it was surprising to me when I heard that song. And actually I immediately thought, oh, this is risky and not in a good way.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

A lot of people have asked whether a person can create great art when they are rich and happy. So I remember when Cowboy Carter came out and there was this line in one of the songs where Beyonce talks 16 characters. That was it. Where she talks about being overworked and overwhelmed.

[Ann Powers]

I'm like.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

And that line really triggered people. They were like, no, girl, you're not. There is. So this is a similar type of pushback from a very, very broad audience.

[Ann Powers]

Beyonce did something very smart and very deft, which I also think was, you know, she did it out of Conviction, which is that at a certain point in her career, she stopped speaking so much personally as representatively. She started connecting her personal stories with the history of racism and, you know, oppression.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Need another.

[Ann Powers]

She's continued to do that. Also, uplifting her family, uplifting her community as she's defined it. In that way, she has managed to sort of make her music bigger than herself, make her art bigger than herself. America.

[Noel King]

America has a problem.

[Ann Powers]

Consider that next to Taylor Swift, she has very much clung to autobiography as the center of what she does.

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

Beyonce is, you're arguing, very clearly evolving and Taylor Swift, and this is an argument I heard a lot about this album. She is not growing as an artist. What do you make of the critique that this album is an example, not that Taylor Swift isn't a great artist, but that she's not growing?

[Ann Powers]

I find it strange that being a pop star and producing albums is sort of being talked about as if it is a life journey of self improvement. Like, have we asked that of. Did we ask that of Mick Jagger? You know, I don't know. I don't necessarily think we did. Another thing is I don't have any problem with someone writing songs about adolescence for their whole life. Like, that's fine with me. Now, do you want to hear my theory about the record?

[Alexi Horowitz-Ghazi]

You're damn right I do.

[Ann Powers]

I don't think Taylor Swift made this record to make more money. I really don't like, does she need the money? Obviously not. I do think, however, that she's very interested in controlling her public narrative and controlling the narrative that she's building through her albums. She's very, very focused on her music being the center of everything. And I think she made this record because she is now in a happier place in her life. And she just can't stand the thought that that last album tortured Poets Department, which shows her at her most vulnerable is the album that's gonna stand. As she's going through this happy phase, as she's getting married, she needed another marker on the highway. She needed a marker on the highway that said, hey, I'm happy now. I'm in control. I have power. I no longer, you know, feel the way I felt when I was wallowing in my own misery. Do I blame her for that? No, I don't blame her for that. I get it completely, but let's recognize it for what it is. It's a marker on her highway, and she's going to go somewhere else pretty soon. Soon.

[Noel King]

That was NPR's Anne Powers speaking to Noel King from today Explained. Today Explained is Vox's excellent daily news show. They tell one news story every afternoon. You can find it wherever you get your podcasts. This episode of Today Explained was produced by Ariana Espuru, Aminah Al Saadi, Laura Bullard, and Adrian Lilly. I'm Alexi Horowitz Ghazi. This is npr. Thanks for listening.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

This message is sponsored by dsw, the birthplace of the humble brag. Full of all kinds of shoes that get you at prices that get your budget. And when there are never ending options for every style, mood, occasion and budget, there is unlimited freedom to play. And that's something to brag about. So go ahead. Stock up on fresh sneakers from your favorite brands or try those boots you always secretly knew you could pull off. Find the shoes that get you at prices that get your budget. Dsw. Let them surprise you.