Planet Tyrus – "Ben Lamm: Bringing Back the Dire Wolf"

Date: February 3, 2026
Host: Tyrus
Guest: Ben Lamm (Co-founder & CEO, Colossal Biosciences)

Episode Overview

In this high-energy and humorous episode of Planet Tyrus, host Tyrus welcomes Ben Lamm, CEO of Colossal Biosciences, for a fascinating conversation about de-extinction—the science of bringing extinct species back to life—and its cultural, scientific, and ethical implications. The discussion spotlights Colossal's headline-making achievement: bringing back the dire wolf, and explores the broader impact of such technology on conservation, science, pop culture, and even the future of humanity.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Allure of Extinct Creatures and Science as Inspiration

• Game of Thrones and the Dire Wolf:
  The popularity of the dire wolf in pop culture, and the misconception that it was fictional until recent scientific feats.

  "Now obviously the direwolf, you know, got really popular in Game of Thrones, right? … A lot of people thought it was invented in Game of Thrones." (Tyrus, 01:11)

• Kids as Science Ambassadors:
  Passion for dinosaurs and extinct animals is a powerful "gateway drug" for getting kids (and, by extension, parents) interested in science and conservation.

  "Dinosaurs are like the gateway drug for the sciences. ... 30% of our investors came to us through their kids." (Ben Lamm, 05:05, 05:34)

2. De-Extinction, Conservation, and Technology

• Mission at Colossal Biosciences:
  Building a “DNA record store of life on Earth” and developing de-extinction and genetic rescue across all vertebrate species. The dire wolf was selected partly because of its impact in inspiring youth and conservation dialogue.

  "How do we go build a DNA record store of life on Earth? Because we're just losing a lot of species really quick." (Ben Lamm, 03:08)

• Artificial Wombs and Genetic Engineering:
  Challenges of de-extincting large animals (e.g., giant sloths, woolly rhinos) due to lack of close living relatives for surrogacy. Colossal is working on artificial womb projects for mammals and birds, using advances in AI and biotechnology.

  "The artificial womb stuff still feels a little science fictiony to me." (Ben Lamm, 14:00) "Once we get artificial wombs done, it's just a function of time ... anything that we see in biology we can replicate with engineering." (Ben Lamm, 19:25)

• Exciting Candidates for Revival:
  Discussion about the plausibility and current limits for giant sloths, stellar sea cows, dodos, thylacines (Tasmanian tiger), and even the legendary Megalodon ("Why would you want that in the ocean?").

  "One of the number one requests we get, which we're not working on, is Megalodon. I was like, why on earth would you want a super predator?" (Ben Lamm, 18:03)

3. The Process of Bringing Back the Dire Wolf

• Technical Feat:
  Extraction and reassembly of ancient DNA from dire wolf remains to create genetically diverse individuals, using living wolves as a genetic baseline and advanced gene editing.

  "We took a 73,000-year-old skull and then we took a 12,000-year-old tooth. ... Got 13 or 14 full reads of the full genome, which is incredible for that old DNA." (Ben Lamm, 32:35)

• First Generation – Observations on Behavior:
  Three dire wolves named Ramos, Remus, and Khaleesi, now about a year and a half old, raised in ecological preserves. Discussion about their transition from hand-reared animals to behaving like true wolves, including hunting and social hierarchy emerging naturally.

  "There was this turning point ... I don't know if this is safe. ... They're behaving more and more like wolves." (Ben Lamm, 34:52–37:39)

• Long-term Vision for Rewilding:
  Debate on whether dire wolves will appear in zoos or in wild ecological preserves, with a preference for reintroducing them into natural habitats where possible.

  "Our vision is long term rewilding of these species. ... I do see a world where people can see and view these incredible animals back in a natural or semi-natural habitat." (Ben Lamm, 39:50, 41:03)

4. The Bigger Picture – Science, Society, and Discovery

• Interdisciplinary Impact:
  The same technologies enabling de-extinction are paving the way for breakthroughs in combating genetic diseases and preserving biodiversity.

  "The pipeline ... working on the application of our technology to humans is 100 times easier than what we are doing." (Ben Lamm, 30:34)

• Myth versus Reality:
  Enjoying the scientific method—constantly challenging old assumptions, recalibrating based on new genomic evidence (e.g., human and chimp similarity, platypuses as mammals that lay eggs).

  "The phylogenetic tree and how we think about the tree of life, I still think is like fundamentally dumb. ... Everything's closer related." (Ben Lamm, 23:36)

• Humor & Wonder:
  Joking about public requests for resurrecting creatures like Megalodon or cave bears, and reflecting on the value of preserving awe and curiosity in science.

  "Why on earth would you want a super predator ... in the ocean?" (Ben Lamm, 18:03) "You brought back a direwolf! ... That, I would say, would have been more crazier than that if you brought back the cave bear." (Tyrus, 55:40)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Inspiration and Legacy:

  "Dinosaurs are like the gateway drug for the sciences. ... If your kids are interested in dinosaurs, they have a high likelihood of being successful in different curiosity points around science and even successful in life."
  — Ben Lamm (05:05)

• Pop Culture Influence:

  "30% of our investors ... found out about Colossal ... through their kids. ... Tom Brady invested. His kids told him about it."
  — Ben Lamm (05:34)

• Excitement About Discovery:

  "I just was like, hey, stop it. Just reached up, petted [the great white shark]. ... My reaction – if you could just get back a foot, that would be really cool."
  — Tyrus, recounting a close encounter (16:37)

• Limits of Science and Imagination:

  "There are people that are convincing [about thylacines still being alive] ... I fell down that rabbit hole where I felt like a hundred percent, they still exist. ... But, I'm pretty convinced they're gone."
  — Ben Lamm (45:06)

• Reflection on Legacy:

  "There's going to be a history book somewhere in a sixth grade Biology class with the ... probably the worst photo of you they could ever possibly have. ... That's immortality."
  — Tyrus (55:27)

Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|---------------------------------------------------| | 00:00–03:22 | Introduction; Dire wolf, fossils, and Colossal's mission | | 05:05–06:34 | Dinosaurs as science inspiration; investor stories | | 09:48–14:00 | Artificial wombs and species like giant sloth, moa | | 16:37–18:04 | Great white stories, public fascination with Megalodon | | 23:36–26:17 | Rethinking the tree of life; genetics, DNA, and surprise findings | | 32:35–34:52 | Scientific achievement: Sequencing and building dire wolves | | 34:52–37:39 | Behavior and socialization of real dire wolves | | 39:50–42:09 | Rewilding vs. zoos debate; future of revived animals | | 45:06–46:19 | Thylacine speculation and the role of myth in science | | 55:27–56:29 | Reflections on legacy and the magnitude of the achievement |

Flow & Tone

• The episode is energetic, playful, and peppered with humor and personal stories.
• Tyrus brings an unabashed sense of wonder to the “mad science” at play, while Ben Lamm provides technical clarity and shares his own boyish excitement.
• Scientific rigor mixes with casual banter, fantasy speculation, and practical questions about ethics, legacy, and the relationship between people and nature.

Episode Takeaways

• De-extinction isn't just a wild fantasy—it's happening, with real implications for science, conservation, and culture.
• Reviving extinct animals, especially charismatic or culturally significant ones like the dire wolf, captures the public's imagination and catalyzes broader interest in biology.
• Technology developed for de-extinction holds great promise for saving endangered species and even human medicine.
• The journey—not just the destination—matters in science: curiosity, adventure, and willingness to continually challenge assumptions are as vital as any breakthrough.
• The legacy of this work is only just beginning, and the conversation around “what’s next?” is as exciting as what’s already been accomplished.

End of Summary