Dana Perino (1:24)

That's why I got to do all

Tyrus (1:25)

that mobility work, carrying hammer, you know, but you have in your books, which. And you have been a huge influence on me and mine. Very supportive. But for those of you who don't know, and I don't know what planet you've been on, but I wish someone had told me. Everything will be okay. Let me tell you about Jasper. And the good news is. Now I think. I'm trying to remember, I think my daughter did a book report.

Dana Perino (1:51)

Yes.

Tyrus (1:52)

On.

Dana Perino (1:54)

And the good news is.

Tyrus (1:55)

Yeah. And the good news is that's when she dressed up like you. It was very cool. Very cool.

Dana Perino (1:59)

That was a great moment. She even put pearls on.

Tyrus (2:01)

Yes. She had the exact little outfit you had on. So my family's been a big fan for a long time. So. And speaking of family, you dedicated this book to your sister. What was. Before we even get into it. What was that?

Dana Perino (2:13)

Well, so this is my fifth book and I have not dedicated one to her yet. And she's four years younger. Than me and has always been my biggest fan. And I can remember specifically when I learned how to read, I must have been five or six. She was so proud of me. And she told everybody, my sister can read.

Tyrus (2:34)

Oh. Because at that age, like, it's amazing.

Dana Perino (2:36)

Yeah. She's like this, like magic. Look at what she can do. And she read all the drafts of this. She loved it. She wants no attention for herself. She does not have a public facing job in any way. She will do things for my friends out of the goodness of her heart. She never asked for money, recognition, anything. In fact.

Tyrus (2:57)

Yeah, this thing right here, when my

Dana Perino (2:58)

book painted, my sister painted that and she said it was one of the hardest ones she's ever done because it was black and white, rather like the colors. When it's like a colorful picture, it's a little bit easier. She's like this one because she said, you don't understand how many different color grays there are.

Tyrus (3:12)

And shadowing because, I mean, she got the tattoos pinpoint accuracy and she's very patient.

Dana Perino (3:19)

So she's been my biggest fan from the beginning. There's a character in here that's a small bit character, but the main character's younger sister lives in Colorado and her name is Anne. My sister's name is Angie. And there's a point in there where Ann sends Dot, the main character, a bracelet on the inside engraved with the words. With the word breathe. And my sister had sent one to me years ago, so I just added that in.

Tyrus (3:48)

So that's kind of a really cool duet because your sister's very behind the scenes, like doesn't want any of that. And then where you can't get away from it.

Dana Perino (3:57)

I know, it's such a. It's funny, you know, I actually was very happy being behind the scenes when I was the deputy press secretary. I loved that job because I could kind of tell everybody what to do, but I didn't have to have the pressure of being out front. And then when Tony Snow, who was going through cancer treatment while he was press secretary, he had to go in for some surgery and there was nobody else to brief but me. And I'll never forget he put his hands on my shoulders and he made me look up at him. You would still have looked down to see him, but he was 6 5. And I looked up and he said, you are better at this than you think you are. And there was no choice. I had to do it.

Tyrus (4:36)

What great advice. He just put it there.

Dana Perino (4:40)

So you're better at this than you think. You are. He was a wonderful, wonderful man. Did you ever get to know him?

Tyrus (4:45)

No, no. I came in.

Dana Perino (4:47)

You would have loved him.

Tyrus (4:49)

It was all Obama administration when I started at fox, I think just towards the end of it. And I was about as political as you were into wrestling. But we both. I think you're still kind of on the fence of wrestling. But you know, it's funny because nonfiction, I'm known for storytelling. Right. That's my thing in a lot of my comedy. I tell stories and I tend to take something that's true and kind of a little bit for fun. You, you are a facts person. You, I mean you've been telling and it's not easy in this day and age. Everyone wants to put their spin on things.

Dana Perino (5:20)

Yeah.

Tyrus (5:20)

And one of the things that I think is one of the most admirable qualities is when you tell the news. You just tell the news.

Dana Perino (5:26)

Yeah.

Tyrus (5:26)

You don't really add your. So how does somebody who's a very facts oriented person go to writing? And I mean just the, just the opening paragraph, the description, I mean it's very descriptive. It's like you can. I could see the office. And I laughed because when I was reading it a little. That's your move. You were doing it here and I called you on it. Now I'm just going to listen to this. Now. This is Dorothy. Doc Clark sat looking out her office window in Rockefeller center west towards the Hudson River. I mean I even know the direction. She rested her elbow on the desk and had her chin in her palm. She twirled a piece of her long blonde hair. Interesting. Is this any way. Just a little. Is this a little bit character you?

Dana Perino (6:10)

Yeah, sure. I didn't really know how to do that. I mean there's a little bit of me, but not completely. Obviously I write from a Democrat's point of view, but I did work in high tech priorities and I went through a quarter life crisis. I don't think guys go through this as much. Maybe I'm wrong, but girls certainly do. You get to around 25 and you start thinking, wait, nothing I had all planned out is happening and maybe I chose the wrong career. Why can't I find a great guy? And you start to have all this self doubt and it's a. You can spiral downward pretty quickly.

Tyrus (6:50)

I can. There's always a pressure to deliver because

Dana Perino (6:54)

you're no longer a kid.

Tyrus (6:56)

No, no, no, no. And when you're. And again, from a man's perspective, I don't think it's a moment. It's a constant. You're always measuring yourself to the next man, you know, and then if you have children or a family, there's always that constant pressure to improve, improve, improve. And then physically, I think when the hair starts falling out and it's a little bit slower, I think around 45 to 50, that's when men start getting a little.

Dana Perino (7:22)

The classic midlife crisis.

Tyrus (7:24)

Yeah. Because it's both. I think it's when you start losing the core. Like. Well, I can't speak for all, but for me, it was always about my strength, my incredible, like, be able to throw things around and being very athletic. And that moment when I noticed that it took me like maybe one step in the ring to go get somebody, all of a sudden it took two or it took 15 minutes to recover from the gym and then it took two days and two nights. And there's a certain moment of vulnerability there where you're like, am I strong enough to defend my. You know, like, you think in the weirdest thing. So it's very different.

Dana Perino (7:57)

And it's interesting because I think women go through it at 25. Men are going through it 20 years later. And there's a. It's interesting because there's like my husband's 18 years older than me and he, he'd gone through a divorce. Then he met me. And then it just, it clicked and it worked for us.

Tyrus (8:13)

Right. Well, she took a deep breath inside. It has been a long day. I've seen you do that on the five.

Dana Perino (8:20)

I try not to. Sometimes I sigh for effect. Sometimes I don't want to say anything, but I'll just sigh for effect. Like when Jessica says something crazy.

Tyrus (8:31)

Greg and her get into their lovers quarrel.

Dana Perino (8:34)

Yes. I'll take a deep breath. Or sometimes Lawrence Jones catches me. Sometimes because my, my days, all of us work long days, but the length of my day is long. And so sometimes he's like, I saw you yawn. And Greg called me out on that the other day. He caught me yawning during somebody else's talking. I wasn't on camera, but he got me.

Tyrus (8:53)

Well, he's very clever at getting people. Now, this process how break this down for me because again, this is really. And the reason why I think when I finish this is going to be my favorite book of yours is because you stepped outside of your comfort zone.

Dana Perino (9:08)

Yes.

Tyrus (9:08)

And that's not an easy thing to do, especially when you are established.

Dana Perino (9:12)

Yeah.

Tyrus (9:12)

And you. And you are a best selling author. So you are literally stepping out your box. And sometimes just the idea of Stepping out the box for people is too much, or so many. There's so many criticisms coming in and things like that.

Dana Perino (9:26)

It was scary. You put out your. When you write your first book, think about your first book. Writing is something that is very. People judge it quickly, and you might think it's good, and you know that the criticisms that might be coming. So you're nervous. Okay. But then you write this. It's a huge bestseller. It's amazing, everybody. I loved that book. Loved that book.

Tyrus (9:50)

I tried to stop it.

Dana Perino (9:51)

Why?

Tyrus (9:52)

I. Two weeks before it came out, I called my writing coach and I said, I just realized that I just put a lot of myself out there.

Dana Perino (10:01)

Yeah.

Tyrus (10:01)

And I don't want people to know these things. I didn't think about it because the whole time I was writing it, it was almost like it was like a therapy session. So I'm just putting all this stuff out there, not really seeing the big picture. And then when they're like, it's done. And I call myself.

Dana Perino (10:16)

That's why it made it so great.

Tyrus (10:17)

Yeah. But I was really uncomfortable. Did you have a similar feeling? Was there a point in this where you're like, maybe I shouldn't do this?

Dana Perino (10:24)

So almost four years ago, I turned 50, and, you know, that's a moment. It's not a crisis, but it's a number. And you're like, okay. I feel like there are some things I would still like to try to do. And I read voraciously. Fiction. I read a ton of fiction.

Tyrus (10:46)

Yeah. Those of you who don't know, like, there's a pile of books in their office, and every one of them's been reading.

Dana Perino (10:51)

Yes.

Tyrus (10:51)

You're not a collector just for looks. You read.

Dana Perino (10:54)

And I love fiction, and I admire the craft so much. And I. You know, there's a book I read a couple years ago called Go as a River, and I set it down. I said, how did she do that? That's amazing. Now, I'm not pretending that this is winning the Pulitzer Prize. Okay.

Tyrus (11:08)

But you also don't do it for that.

Dana Perino (11:09)

No. But every third book, I'll read a deep book. I love it. Like a deep historical fiction, deep literary fiction. And then I'll read something lighter as kind of a palette cleanser. And then I like a variety. I don't typically like popular fiction. That's not my thing. Romantic comedy, that's a little bit. That's not frivolous, is what I like to read. And so I like to write books that I would like to read. And I had this idea bopping around for a possible swap where the D. And this is my idea for. For a reality show, a political reality show. In my mind, I was like, I wonder if you could ever take some people, like friends of mine, even from New York and swap them with my family and friends from Wyoming and tell me you have three months life swap. Good luck. And my hope would be that they would realize one, that the coast or the flyover state is. There are wonderful people there. Americans are more neighborly than you think. We are not as polarized as the media would tell us that we are.

Tyrus (12:16)

I hope we would be.

Dana Perino (12:17)

Yes. And that also maybe you could find love along the way.

Tyrus (12:21)

Well, also, it would also show that people are a lot more. Have a lot more in common than they realize.

Dana Perino (12:27)

Absolutely.

Tyrus (12:27)

Once they get the barriers down, you know. And I think this is a good role model for people to jump out the box and try something new.

Dana Perino (12:37)

And I added the thing about the. There's a subplot about the sanctity of the family farm and trying to preserve it. Even though there might be a lot of pressure to sell or, you know, or even the government wants you to sell because they want to get the new big high tech foreign investment into your town. And this happened in Wisconsin in 2019 and 2020. And. And the farms were taken and the factory was built and not a single thing was ever made there because they used Covid as an excuse.

Tyrus (13:11)

Wow. You know, and that's one thing we don't get enough attention on the farm, that Midwest belt or farmers in general. Like the only time we ever really, even in the news, we never cover the stories until it's a disaster. Either their crops are flooded by crazy weather or we suddenly realize that these guys don't make enough to even feed their own families and they're feeding the world.

Dana Perino (13:32)

Yes. Or. Yeah, right, exact. Exactly. Or we have made some sort of policy disaster.

Tyrus (13:37)

Yes.

Dana Perino (13:37)

Or remember when there was the heat wave a few years ago and all those cattle had to be killed.

Tyrus (13:42)

Yes.

Dana Perino (13:43)

Because they were starving to death. And then you had the freeze in Texas and all them. And then you wonder like, how do. How does every restaurant you go to have steak on it? Well, there's a reason for that because there's people working really hard to make that happen.

Tyrus (13:56)

And there was also like massive flood that eroded all of the fertile.

Dana Perino (14:02)

It was like it took away all the nutrients.

Tyrus (14:04)

Yes. It was like it was a huge thing. Because fertilizer isn't as easy to come by as one thinks. Even though you would think, oh, I have a bunch of cows, I should have plenty. But it doesn't matter.

Dana Perino (14:13)

That's why they're worried about some of the. Some of that stuff that's stuck in the straight of Hormuz is what's used to fertilize, especially like rice plants in India. And we need those because people. That's the staple food of the world.

Tyrus (14:25)

Yep.

Dana Perino (14:26)

And it's not out there.

Tyrus (14:27)

So we get a little bit of. You get the craziness of working in the political world.

Dana Perino (14:33)

Like on a campaign.

Tyrus (14:34)

On a campaign. Big debates coming up. You've got to. And people don't. I think one of the nice things is it kind of shows the behind the scenes pressure because all people see is the actual debate, not the preparation and stuff. And one of the things I would. Would be the reaction when the debate goes wrong. You know, you, you. And I would love to have been a fly on the wall when Biden was up there. Or I'm just thinking recent, like Kamala with her. When things kind of go off the rail and the people who are prepared because.

Dana Perino (15:07)

How about when that fly landed on Mike Pence's head?

Tyrus (15:10)

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And. But something like that is like we're all looking at. But people. You can't plan for that. But when somebody goes up and they just completely botch the speech or they go off. They go off the rails and they go, yeah.

Dana Perino (15:24)

And that. I love that. I loved writing the debate because I loved the, the different characters that I had as the. As the Democrats. And some people like, oh, that was obviously Pete Buttigieg. Like, no, that wasn't Pete Buttigieg. That was.

Tyrus (15:38)

That's the thing. There's. There's. You can draw. The reason why I think this book is going to do so well is that you can draw. The best part of nonfiction is it's, it's convinces you that there's a little bit of real life in it. And I think that's what makes people draw to it. You know, that's why. Cause you're like, for example, you're not a big sci fi fan because you can't necessarily draw. Now, young kids draw because they have crazy imaginations and fantasies. But as you get older, reality kind of kicks in. And then you're like, yeah, well, like Star wars, for example. Everyone's like Darth Vader. And then I'm like, wow, what a deadbeat dad.

Dana Perino (16:10)

Right?

Tyrus (16:11)

You know what I mean? Like, you just. You lose the. Yeah.

Dana Perino (16:13)

Like, I don't like to write. I don't like to read about dystopian things. And the other thing I did with this and the way I convinced my editor of my nonfiction books was my same editor for this.

Tyrus (16:22)

You had to convince. Oh, please break down. No, no, because I did. I know this because with my children's book, I had to do a little bit of.

Dana Perino (16:29)

Well, I had to prove myself right. I think he was like, what? What is she up to now? Oh, my gosh. And when I said, think about the book. Everything will be okay, that was all my lessons, mentoring advice for young women. I said, this is the fictionalized account of that. And what I've done is hidden the vegetables inside the Mac and cheese. So you get the lessons about. Yes, you're going through a quarter vegetables.

Tyrus (16:51)

Very good.

Dana Perino (16:52)

Right. So you're going through your quarter life crisis and you're in a relationship that's really not going anywhere. But he's fine. But is he enough? And you're working in high tech PR and the clients are mean to you and you wish you had worked in politics and you get an opportunity. Okay, so it's not gonna be in Manhattan. You have to move to Wisconsin for a year. Are you gonna take that risk or are you gonna stay stuck? And she makes a good decision.

Tyrus (17:14)

Yeah. Because most people won't. And I've defied my life on taking the. I'll jump in, you know, but also in her situation, a little unique because it's not like she has a fan. Like, she doesn't have kids and all that stuff yet, so it's a little easier.

Dana Perino (17:28)

And that's how she convinces her two girlfriends to go with her, because she says this could be our last chance.

Tyrus (17:34)

Right. Because once you have a family, the decisions aren't just.

Dana Perino (17:37)

You're never going to. You're not going to be able to do this. Yeah.

Tyrus (17:39)

Now, obviously, in the sequel, if it's a happy, eventually they'll have a family. And maybe there is that call from D.C. see, I'm already. You know, because when you. When you tell a good story, people want more. Are you. I know. I heard you off the record. A source said you would never do this again, but I challenge it.

Dana Perino (17:57)

Oh, no, I'm doing it again.

Tyrus (17:59)

Yeah, 1,000%.

Dana Perino (18:00)

You should. The only spoiler that I will give here is that no one dies, but they live to fight another day. And what I love is that the book's been out for a week and I start looking at some of the comments on our social and people are already finished and they loved it.

Tyrus (18:14)

And I think next it's a quick read.

Dana Perino (18:17)

Yeah.

Tyrus (18:18)

And it's witty. And some of the thing I've heard, looking at stuff, it was like, it's warm, it touches home. It's relatable. A lot of people have been in that same kind of a situation. And I think it's great that nobody dies. There's not salacious sex.

Dana Perino (18:33)

Can I ask you something, though? Because Paul Morrow, when he was. He's Paul. You know Paul. Did your audience know Paul?

Tyrus (18:38)

I'm sure, yeah. Yeah, they better.

Dana Perino (18:39)

So, Paul Morrow, nypd, everything. But he used to teach literature, and he's a great editor. So he looked at an early version of this, which I'm so embarrassed by, but he helps so much. Anyway, along the way, he said, I don't think this is realistic. I don't think these three Republican guys would ever go for those girls because they're Democrats. And I said, I don't know. Well, first of all, it's my book, and it's fiction, and they do, but I'm like, in real life. Do you think that's still true?

Tyrus (19:09)

No, no. Here's the thing. Women, when they're set in their convictions. Let's say if I. My. My wife and I wanted to date her, and she was into astronomy. Guess what? Suddenly I have an affinity for astronomy. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm all into all that. And she's a Democrat, and I'm a hardcore Republican. When it comes down to a man, when he finds a woman that he's attracted to or falls in love with, what she's into, he's willing to take. Now, women, on the other hand, completely different. But men, please.

Dana Perino (19:40)

What I like about this, too.

Tyrus (19:41)

Not with her, because she's a Democrat.

Dana Perino (19:42)

What I like about this is that. So she falls in love with this guy eventually, but then it's like, well, she's working on a campaign. And what I like in shows that I watch or books that I read, especially if they're hiding the vegetables inside the Mac and cheese. For guys, too. I think if guys read this book, it's like, this is how you treat a girl.

Tyrus (19:59)

Yep.

Dana Perino (20:00)

Okay. And so she might have a busy job and she might have to work long hours, so support her.

Tyrus (20:06)

Yeah.

Dana Perino (20:07)

Don't complain that she has a busy job.

Tyrus (20:10)

I think if you're complaining, you're already kind of looking out the door anyway.

Dana Perino (20:15)

Yeah.

Tyrus (20:16)

I think when it comes to. And again, that's the. The thing, because sometimes you might have an. Men sometimes have an ego issue. And again, I talked about before where men have this constant thing of, I need to improve, I need to be improve, I need to be alpha. And then. And some men can't handle their spouse's success.

Dana Perino (20:34)

Yeah, I know.

Tyrus (20:35)

And it's somehow a reflection on them instead of like, you're part of it, and it's okay not to be front and center. You're still her husband, her man, her boyfriend. You still do those things. But sometimes it's her turn. And I think some of that society.

Dana Perino (20:52)

Well, that was true for me with Peter. You know, when I met Peter, he had. Was very established in his sales and marketing, international business career. And so he was able to help me. I'll tell you one funny story about that. Do we have time?

Tyrus (21:03)

Yeah, we're on your clock.

Dana Perino (21:05)

Okay. So I got kicked out of the Oval Office early on, when I first started at the White House.

Tyrus (21:12)

All right, give me the names.

Dana Perino (21:13)

George W. Bush.

Tyrus (21:14)

Oh, okay.

Dana Perino (21:15)

So what happened was I was a deputy press secretary. This is 2005. I had just started, and Dan Bartlett, the head of comms, said, would you be willing to sit in on this interview the President has to do at 11 o'? Clock? Because I have to go to this other meeting. And I said, okay. I was nervous, but I was like, yes, I can do that. He says, I will go down with you to the Oval Office. I will brief the President on the interview. And then you sit in on the interview, take the notes, escort the reporter out, and then send me a note how it went. I said, okay, I can do that. So we go down there, and there's been a miscommunication between the President and Dan. And the President says, no, no, no, I'm not doing an interview with him. He's like, but you said you'd talk to him. He's like, yeah, I said I would talk to him. I didn't say it'd be an interview. So they've had a miscommunication. So who do you think won? President Bush, of course. And so. And he looks at. He looks at me as he's talking to Dan. He says, and therefore, she doesn't need to be here. And he did one of these, like, see yourself out.

Tyrus (22:15)

Wow.

Dana Perino (22:16)

So I slunk out of the Oval Office. I walk the 32 paces to my tiny desk, and I closed the pocket door behind me, slid it across, and I called Peter. And I'm tearful, not crying, and he says, what happened? So I tell him the story, and Peter goes, oh, my gosh, this is great. I said, what do you mean? He said, Just think for the rest of your life, you can say, I've been kicked out of better places than this.

Tyrus (22:44)

That's true. Yeah. Yeah. I've been fired by better than you, sir.

Dana Perino (22:48)

And so you think about his instincts to be able to help me deal with a humiliation as I've just started a big new job at the White House, and it's become my favorite story to tell.

Tyrus (23:02)

Well, not just that, but also at that moment, he took away the negativity and, like, we're in this together. He made it pop. And that's what you're. When you're not seeing it, you're just. Cause you're in it. You're in the moment, and there's a sense of pride there. I'm sitting in an interview with the President, and they basically said, get out. Get out. That's.

Dana Perino (23:20)

I don't even think the president knew my name.

Tyrus (23:22)

Right.

Dana Perino (23:23)

She doesn't need to be here.

Tyrus (23:25)

And sometimes that happens. Then you walk in. I never wanted to be there in the first place. I didn't even vote for you. You know, all these emotions come through, and you're like, I didn't ask to go in there.

Dana Perino (23:34)

Right.

Tyrus (23:35)

I was told, you know, and then you get a nice little voice that says, we're okay, we're okay.

Dana Perino (23:39)

You're okay. So five years later, President Bush's book came out, and I did his book tour, the PR for it, and we were on a plane, and I was just trying to entertain him, And I said, Mr. President, do you remember when you kicked me out of the Oval Office? And he said, I never. I never. I wouldn't do that to you. I said, no, remember? Because you were going to do an interview. And then Dan said, no. You said, no, it's a conversation, not an interview. And then you told me to get out of the Oval Office. And he said, dana, I have no recollection of that. I said, yeah, but then. And he interrupted me and he said, are you still upset? And I was like, a little bit.

Tyrus (24:13)

I think you can be. I think.

Dana Perino (24:15)

And then at some point, I think you can let it go.

Tyrus (24:18)

Well, especially after, you know, you get hit with the, you know, Shoes. The shoes?

Dana Perino (24:21)

No, no, the microphone. It was. It was one of these.

Tyrus (24:23)

Yeah. And. But didn't. You didn't flinch. Boom. And just.

Dana Perino (24:28)

Yeah, I didn't bawl. I was crying. Cause it hurt so bad. And when I got outside, one of my favorite pictures of the president and me is just us from behind. And he's got his arm around me. He said, what happened? I thought you were just crying cause a guy threw a shoe. I was like, sir, I'm a little tougher than that.

Tyrus (24:45)

Yeah. Wyoming, hello. Yeah, I actually have a black guy at the moment. So what happened? I was wrestling with my daughter.

Dana Perino (24:52)

Oh, dear.

Tyrus (24:53)

Teaching her some wrestling, self defense stuff. And she's really good. And I was. I was trying to. We were in the water and I was showing her. I was like, I'm gonna throw you, but hold onto my arm. And when you hold onto my arm, swing your legs around. I'm trying to. You know, she's. And she came around and she was like, knee. And she threw the knee like pop. And I was like, good job, sweetheart. Good job, sweetheart. And it wasn't until we were at dinner, we were celebrating Ingrid's birthday. And Ingrid was like, what's wrong with your eye? I was like, what are you talking about? And when I. My daughter was like, I gave him a black eye. I was showing him how a knee strike. And I was like, yes, she did. So I carry. But it's a. I wear it as a badge of. Because I said to her, you know, she said, daddy, did everyone give you a black guy in wrestling? I said, no. And if they did, I would have beat them unmercifully. So consider. You got me. You know, be proud of yourself.

Dana Perino (25:38)

You're the only one ever did.

Tyrus (25:40)

So. All right, we need to get back to this bad boy because I'm really curious to. How nervous were you when it was coming out?

Dana Perino (25:49)

I think even now that it's out and it's getting. Good response.

Tyrus (25:54)

No, no, it's getting phenomenal. Excellent. Let's. I think sometimes.

Dana Perino (25:57)

I just found out it was in the top 10 of Apple ebooks downloads.

Tyrus (26:00)

You need to smell your flowers sometimes.

Dana Perino (26:04)

Yeah. I knew that this was something I had to prove myself. This is a different audience, obviously, the Fox audience. There are many people that read fiction and romance. But here's another thing that kind of surprised me. I guess I should have thought about it. A friend of mine who works in publishing told me this, but it didn't occur to me that there's so many novels that come out that are of a certain political persuasion to the left, and they can be very woke as well. This has none of that in there.

Tyrus (26:34)

And that's racist. Anybody can pick it up. And it doesn't matter if you're a donkey. An elephant, preferably. Leave your politics at home.

Dana Perino (26:43)

So Jessica Tarlov read an early draft because it's written from a democratic point of view and I wanted to see if I got it right. And she loved it.

Tyrus (26:52)

I was like, okay, because you've been around it.

Dana Perino (26:56)

Yeah.

Tyrus (26:56)

And you've always been a person open to other people's opinions and ideas. You're not closed off. I think very rarely have I ever seen you, like, getting in a shouting match on the. It's just not worth it. You know, you respect other people's opinions, but if you're around it long enough and you've worked with. You worked across the aisle, you've never had a problem with that. You and Harold have a great relationship, Jessica.

Dana Perino (27:16)

I have. You know, like, Donna Brazil and I have been very good friends ever since.

Tyrus (27:18)

You're the one who sat in that chair.

Dana Perino (27:20)

Hurricane Katrina, actually, in, oh, five, not long after I got kicked out of the Oval Office.

Tyrus (27:26)

You got to fix that. 43.

Dana Perino (27:28)

She and I became very good friends. And one of the things that might feel a little unrealistic to some people reading this, if they're watching or maybe if you're too online and you read this, you think, well, these Democrats are normal. And people think that Democrats today are lunatics because they only see.

Tyrus (27:45)

That's the fringe.

Dana Perino (27:46)

The fringe attention. But there are people who live. I was like, well, you know, like, I actually. There are people who think teachers unions are a great idea. And what I try to do is be fair. But also, there's a couple of lines in there that I think I get in from a conservative point of view.

Tyrus (28:03)

I think the idea is the book. If the first thing on your mind is political affiliation, then most books aren't for you.

Dana Perino (28:12)

Right.

Tyrus (28:13)

If you're. If you're right, how you vote is maybe, let's say, what it should be, would be if the top 10 responsibilities in your life as a human being. I think your political stuff should be, like, towards the bottom. So if you're gonna read something that's more about the human nature in the heart that just happens to be in a political setting, and that's what I feel this book is. This book isn't pushing anyone. It's showing a situation that has probably happens, especially now, more than it's talked about. The only part we hear about is the extreme side of it.

Dana Perino (28:41)

Well, in 2024, during that election, one of the polls came out and said that 68% of young women ages 19 to 29 would not even consider dating someone who didn't vote the way they do.

Tyrus (28:54)

See, I think all those polls are lies. I think people just like Facebook, and they put the picture with their best Foot forward. But it's not an accurate picture of what their life is like. I think it's very. To sit there. I would never. I would never.

Dana Perino (29:07)

Like what. Also, that's why I know that dating apps work for some people, but to me, science is science. Chemistry is chemistry. People meet and there's a connection or there's not.

Tyrus (29:21)

I love. In the book, you say a very respectable dating site, like Hinge. Yeah, it was very. Not the other one respectable, you know, and that's. But that's a. That's a real taste or a little tip of you. You know, like. And there's something about decorum. We just don't have it anymore. And something that in this book, you're really showing that you can have a story without using the cheap shit to bring people in. It's a story.

Dana Perino (29:57)

Also, I really like. There's a couple in the book. Their name is Ted and Jeanne Jankowski, and they run the bookstore. And he's a Democrat and she's a Republican, and. And they've been together 55 years, and they laugh about it.

Tyrus (30:09)

Most people are like that, right?

Dana Perino (30:12)

And then there's a lady Rose, and she's older, and she volunteers on the Democratic campaign, and she's friends with this guy Charlie Cooper. Charlie Cooper's a Republican. And Dot and her friend Fletcher are like, what is she doing talking to him? And when they ask her if she got any intel and she says from Charlie Cooper? No, we were just catching up. We went to high school together because

Tyrus (30:35)

that's how it really is. The only time. I always thought voting was very personal. And it was like certain things that when I was growing up, in my household that you didn't talk about. You didn't talk about your marital relationship behind closed doors. You didn't talk about religion. You didn't put. Well, you just didn't push it on people. And politics was left for. There's a reason why. There's a blind. Why you vote. You don't need to.

Dana Perino (30:59)

I never. Otherwise, you know, I've never asked anybody how they voted.

Tyrus (31:02)

Yeah, I was always considered a rude thing.

Dana Perino (31:05)

Yeah.

Tyrus (31:06)

How'd you vote? Excuse me, sir? No, you know, like, that's just. And all of a sudden that became to where they divide in this book, I think shows how the world. It's. It's more closer to what's real than what's not real. What we see on. On social media and TV are extremes to push ratings. You know, you couldn't have a show where it's like, everyone gets along the

Dana Perino (31:32)

other thing that I tried to do in this book is one of the characters I love, Jake, Jake Taylor. He's a twin and he's a cop and he served in Afghanistan and he's one good looking guy and the girl from Staten island and he have a spark and a connection and it's. There's nothing negative about cops in here, nor should they're military. And so I guess I, I just wrote it the way I would write it. But now that people are pointing this out to me, I'm like, oh yeah, you're right. I guess maybe because you don't need.

Tyrus (32:04)

You're telling. I think when you try to throw in if the book was about a cop faced with corruption or like there was this great book. Michael Keaton was in this movie where he was a stand up cop and he. His best. His partner was killed and his wife and him took on the four kids and he needed a house and so I think he stole money from a drug dealer to buy the house. And that situation was like where he struggled with trying to do for his family and his fallen partner.

Dana Perino (32:36)

That was a great movie.

Tyrus (32:37)

Yeah, but I'm just saying those situations, but adding unnecessary spices to a story.

Dana Perino (32:45)

Yeah. So many times I read fiction and there's just like a little dig at conservatives all the time. I mean like all the time.

Tyrus (32:52)

Constantly with movies and stuff or things that you don't need. Like one of the things I like about this is it's adult relationships and it's not a bunch of salacious sex scenes and things like that because. And it's so random in movies where it has absolutely no place. You know, they just put it in there for a shock value.

Dana Perino (33:08)

I've been reading a lot of fiction. I just can't believe, like there's just a lot of smut in there. And I'm like, whoa. Jesse made fun of me because the book was before it came out, it was trending number one in clean and wholesome romance. And I had friends and I would

Tyrus (33:24)

be extremely proud of that. Yeah, that would be something you hang your hat on because that's true talent.

Dana Perino (33:29)

I said there's illusions to.

Tyrus (33:32)

Well, I mean it used to be in a movie if two people were looking at each other and they're like this. And all of a sudden you go up to the moon, you realize that something probably. Yeah, yeah. You don't need the, you know, that's

Dana Perino (33:42)

the camera shot, that's the move, that's it.

Tyrus (33:45)

Simple. But leave the rest to your imagination. Okay. Because Then if you are watching with your kids in the room, like, hey, what are they doing? Oh, well, they watched a, they watched a movie and they went to sleep.

Dana Perino (33:53)

Or what about when you're on a plane? You travel a lot.

Tyrus (33:55)

Yeah, that's.

Dana Perino (33:56)

That's uncomfortable.

Tyrus (33:56)

That is horrible. And they really need to do something about it. Something that Ingrid gets very upset about because we'll be sitting with. She'll be sitting with our daughter flying somewhere. And on the next seat across, somebody's watching a rated R movie. And it's like it used to be on airplanes. I remember when I flew it always would have a little thing edited for playing. Playing. So things would be cut out, movies would be cut out, the cuss words would be dubbed over.

Dana Perino (34:23)

You wonder if there should be a way that the screen, like technology, like the screen means that only the person looking directly at it can see or

Tyrus (34:32)

take the time and have them edit the movies appropriately. Sitting on your airplane is not the time to watch your NC17 movies or graphic violence.

Dana Perino (34:41)

I watched Black Swan from like on a flight home from the UK and it was like three rows ahead of me. I was too afraid to watch it. I don't like scary movies or suspense and. But I. So I watched with the sound off. I just watched it that way. I'm like, oh, I know exactly what happened.

Tyrus (34:56)

Yeah, it's.

Dana Perino (34:57)

But that's because I was afraid it was a scary movie.

Tyrus (35:00)

Right. But they don't. I think, I think and use the word conservatism. It always assumes it's. It's. The definition of the word has changed over time. Where it used to be conservative meant respectful. It meant you weren't tradition. Tradition and things like that. And you wouldn't have TV shows with, you know, all everyone's business out and you know, stuff like that. I think that's making a comeback and I think it's. It's willing to. And this proves that there is that audience that just wants a good story that if they left their book open, they won't have to run across the table and be like, don't touch it to their kid. You know, like it's it.

Dana Perino (35:38)

Right.

Tyrus (35:39)

Because it's the human condition and the interactions that matter to people.

Dana Perino (35:43)

I think the pro. Like if you have a. Your daughter's maybe a little too young, but if you have 14 year olds too, they could read that.

Tyrus (35:51)

Yeah, yeah. My daughter re asked for a copy.

Dana Perino (35:54)

The other thing I really like about this one scene about like vegetables and hiding in the Mac and cheese. They go to a Family farm for dinner. And Dot wants to ask the farmer about why is it that farmers used to vote for Democrats and then it changed over time and now it's almost all Republican. Why is that? And he starts to explain. And she has an instinct to defend the Democrats on something, so she almost interrupts him, but she stops. And in her mind she says, maybe I should listen.

Tyrus (36:29)

And I think maybe that's a T shirt, right? You know, maybe you should listen. Let them finish. You know, that's something that I have to work on. I find even you deal with it so much in front of the camera. Where at home, when someone says something you don't want to hear, you immediately get into your rebuttal. You immediately get into the. Well, well, if that's, you know, and if we all just take a breath.

Dana Perino (36:49)

Yeah. I think also, especially for young women. So you have young daughters, especially that age, as they're trying to express themselves and explain things like, it's. That age is not easy for anybody in the world. So what I witnessed one time in South Carolina, my girlfriend's daughter was there at the dinner with us. She's 13, only child, gregarious girl, but quiet. Ish at dinner. But we're having a conversation about something, some policy thing. And she wanted to make a point. So I said, macy, what do you think? Go ahead. She was having a hard time getting the words out. And three of the guys around the table were trying to help her finish her sentence, anticipating and guessing what she was going to say, and they kept interrupting her. And she's like, no, it's. And then she would try again. Like, you know, young women, they can get on a little bit of a loop. And she couldn't land the plane. And. And then every time they interrupted her, she had to go back to the beginning. So on the third time, I said, let her finish, because I know what that means. Like, when my dad, when I was in third grade, I had to read the Rocky Mountain News and the Denver Post before he got home from work. And I had to prepare to discuss two articles before dinner. And I think back on that time as, like, super, super helpful. Obviously, I always love to read fiction, but he helped me learn how to analyze the news.

Tyrus (38:12)

And that kind of led to where you are today.

Dana Perino (38:16)

Absolutely.

Tyrus (38:17)

And that's the. And that's. I think this book will inspire some young people and maybe help some people who are, you know, they. They only. They think, oh, I can only talk to a certain part of the population because of how we vote. That is Terrible. That is the dumbest thing.

Dana Perino (38:31)

Well, and actually I don't really think people who think that way are reading this book.

Tyrus (38:34)

No. Well, you never know. Maybe they. I'm going to read it so I can have something to argue and troll her on.

Dana Perino (38:40)

Some moms and dads who are concerned that they're young sing. Daughters are shutting off, you know, 55% of the population that they would never consider dating. Like the pool is shrinking.

Tyrus (38:53)

Yeah. And not just that is there are a lot of good people out there. And again, I hate that term, both sides because we're just assuming that you're either one or the other and then one and there's. It's polarized. A good person is a good person regardless of their color of their skin, their religious beliefs.

Dana Perino (39:11)

I think that you've really brought that you bring out the good in so many people and I think that's why your shows are so successful. Not just the podcast and the Gutfeld show, but your one on one shows. When you go out on the road, people want a little bit of that. They love that wisdom. Like for example, I heard, I didn't get a chance to watch, but I heard last night that your take on the correspondence dinner shooter was wise and helped people think it through in a way that they might have been sort of might have been out there in their brain, but they hadn't landed the plane. You help people do that.

Tyrus (39:46)

Well, I think sometimes we automatically assume stuff to make us feel comfortable. He's crazy, he's deranged, he's this, he's that. And it has to be that. It can't be that. There's a real civil control type war going on to where. And I said he was none of those things. He was a soldier. He was, he was, he understood the mission.

Dana Perino (40:13)

Yeah.

Tyrus (40:14)

And so when. And that's uncomfortable for people to say this guy, what he was doing, in his mind, he's the hero. Every, every villain story is paved with good intentions, you know, and when you're told that what you do is, and you say these things and you go to these rallies and, and you hear these horror stories and it's in a man's nature, unfortunately to. I'm going to solve this problem. I'm going to be a hero, I'm going to be a martyr. And when there's a he, there's certain, if there's 75% of the media who is going to repeat it without saying it, like first, the first thing that came out was, oh, I think there's a Lot of reports about this is staged. I'm not saying that. But you are saying that because you're

Dana Perino (40:57)

repeating that Jasmine Crockett did that.

Tyrus (40:59)

Jasmine Crockett was just fishing. She needs something she's done. But when you have Anna Navarro going on, who's not going to be irrelevant soon saying that. Oh, I don't believe that. But a lot of people are saying that that's basically you co signing. Yeah. And that's the. Because there's no consequence. So. And then when they see that then they. And this is where. If I was him and I threw my life away for a cause and the people that were preaching to me about what needs to be done and then they're on TV backtracking. He should have some real questions right now and he should be very cooperative. I think the best thing. And again, I don't. This is not about. But I think him being alive and a chance to see. You know, sometimes when you're brainwashed, you can be a brilliant person and be caught up into something. It's not until the aftermath to where you look back and be like, what did I do? What did I do? And that might, might help change this in a really strange way. Because you know, they're like, well, he's a teacher. What does that mean? You know, so it's. It was. I always just try to look at from my philosophy. I don't ever try to speak on stuff I don't know and I never want to. I think the mental health thing is just, it's like a comma now. It's just like race is. We use these terms to make ourselves feel better instead of like there's a

Dana Perino (42:15)

real problem out there so that you can move on and just talk about junior.

Tyrus (42:18)

And also it takes the, it takes the responsibility off you to watch what you say.

Dana Perino (42:22)

Yeah. And also it's like there's all this news going on and, and what we're talking about. Jimmy Kimmel, who told a tasteless joke, shouldn't have done it. But he told it. Whatever, it's free. It's a choice. And ABC gets a choice. And the President and the first lady can say he should be fired. All of that is protected under free speech. And the other thing we're talking about is the ballroom. I'm like, in the meantime we've got a left wing violence situation.

Tyrus (42:44)

Well, we have, we have domestic terrorists in this country who have been inspired by politicians and. But no one's comfortable saying that. They rather say nut job right then because then it's Lone wolf. It takes. No, no, no. It takes a village to raise a monster. And when everyone starts looking at I. I think about the things. Even with saying things like that on tv. I also think about when I do speak, that there are certain people who are just as extreme on our side who will take everything we say to the point where, like, you make all these outlandish claims and you say things. There is people that will treat what you say as gospel and then they think they're your martyr. So there is a responsibility. And I think there's a lot of people in the media who they don't care, but they just need to get it out there because as soon as they say something, the first thing they do is they see how many likes they got. Or is this viral? And you'll hear them say, oh, man, what I said on TV last night went viral. That doesn't mean it was a good thing.

Dana Perino (43:44)

I'm so glad. I hope that he doesn't have a phone in jail so that he can check what are they saying about me?

Tyrus (43:50)

Oh, he's going to. But he's going to have people outside that are going to glorify him. Because right now there is a sect in this country that does not accept elections, that does not accept reality, and they rather live in a bubble to where they're always the victim and victimhood is contagious. I think that probably was worse than anything in the pandemic was we had a outbreak of narcissism and victimhood and virtue signaling to where it doesn't matter. It's my truth. How can you argue with somebody who has a lock on their own truth? You can't. So calling him mental just gives us a couple days to be like, well, it's not us. And I think we all need to take a responsibility in that. And that's why, like working with guys, Harold and Jessica and stuff like that, people like, well, how it's their opinion. You don't know them, their family. They're good people. Harold and I love each other. I'm always happy to see him and it's always a hug. I don't care how he votes. I don't. He's a good person. We disagree and when we have conversations because there's a mutual respect there. And I think that's the one. And I will say this book is very respectful and that's something that respect respects, needs to be sexy again. It used to be. It really. It really does. It's important with the purple state and because we're on the five today.

Dana Perino (45:09)

I know. We gotta go get ready for that. Thank you for being my friend.

Tyrus (45:13)

Oh, always.

Dana Perino (45:14)

For reading the book and for recognizing that. Yeah, it was scary, but I'm really glad I did it.

Tyrus (45:18)

You did it. And now it's gonna be a box set. Maybe a Hallmark movie.

Dana Perino (45:24)

The town is real.

Tyrus (45:25)

Yeah.

Dana Perino (45:26)

It's called Cedarburg. It's about north. It's 35 minutes northwest of Milwaukee. I call it Cedar Falls in the book. I threw a party in the town. And Tyrus, they were so happy.

Tyrus (45:35)

And you're doing book tours everywhere. And we'll have the technology to put her stuff up so everyone can see where they can go.

Dana Perino (45:40)

We have the technology.

Tyrus (45:41)

We have the technology.

Dana Perino (45:42)

Excellent.

Tyrus (45:43)

We can make this book better than it was.

Dana Perino (45:44)

I love your show.

Tyrus (45:45)

Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, we hit 100 or 101. Now we're just keep.

Dana Perino (45:49)

Here we go.

Tyrus (45:50)

Going up that ladder.

Dana Perino (45:50)

Here we go.

Tyrus (45:51)

Maybe we'll get a commercial in there sometime. I'm just throwing that out there, but. Well, thank you so much. And again, zoom in.

Dana Perino (45:58)

Purple state.

Tyrus (46:00)

And I'm telling you from the first page, it brings you in. You know, it's funny. Your sister paints, but you painted in this, and you should be very, very proud of yourself. And description is everything.

Dana Perino (46:13)

Yeah.

Tyrus (46:13)

And. And everyone can see her do this. Now

Dana Perino (46:17)

trim my hair.

Tyrus (46:18)

Yep. I. I can't do my fingers more. No, thank you,

Dana Perino (46:26)

Sam.