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- [00:01]
Podcast Host (Ad Read)
This episode is brought to you by Prime. What if you had one more chance with the one that got away?
- [00:06]
Tyrus
Sam, you came home.
- [00:08]
Podcast Host (Ad Read)
Based on the best selling novel from Carly Fortune. Every Year after follows childhood friends Sam and Percy as they reunite in the dreamy, nostalgic lakeside town of Barry's Bay. Love can be hard to find. So if you're lucky enough to find that person, never let go. A second chance at first love Every Year after now streaming only on Prime.
- [00:30]
Tyrus
My addictions were food, women and attention. I needed people to praise me.
- [00:35]
Ken Rideout
I was very rich, I was in good shape. I had all the stuff you were supposed to have as a successful guy, but none of it meant anything to me. I'm not a loser, but I'm behaving like a loser and I left so much potential on the table. I'm gonna be the best at it or I'm gonna die trying.
- [00:57]
Tyrus
Ken Rideout is an endurance athlete, which I can't wait to get into that entrepreneur, podcast host, former Wall street trader whose memoir everything you want is on the other side of hard. I can't wait to get the definition of that chronicles his journey from a violent childhood outside of Boston through addiction, sobriety, fatherhood and elite endurance racing. We have a lot in common, similar but different backgrounds. I'm also was grew up in Boston for a little bit before we moved to. My mom got a job as a nurse in California. But let's start with just from the beginning. What was the inspiration? Because writing memoirs is not easy, especially if you're being real and honest and you're a straight, straight shooting guy. How difficult was for you to put this together?
- [01:50]
Ken Rideout
I wouldn't say it was difficult to put it together. It was difficult to put some of it out there in the world. It's funny, when I wrote the book, I have four children and it's very hard for people to relate to the winning. Not many people get to win races. I won a race across the Gobi Desert in Mongolia called the Gobi March. That's considered one of the hardest races
- [02:13]
Tyrus
in the Gobi Desert is no joke.
- [02:16]
Ken Rideout
So, so that's not really relatable. But when I started writing about my vulnerabilities and all the mistakes I made, my, my, my 10 year battle with addiction, like hardcore opioid addict, like 24, 7 for 10 years straight. Everyone relates to f ups and mistakes and vulnerabilities and the, the things that I was most nervous about writing were the things that people really, that resonated with a lot of people and it's what everyone wants to talk about when they reach social media or wherever they've tried to find me. No one cares about wins. They all want to talk about. How did you get over these losses?
- [02:54]
Tyrus
Well, you know, it's funny you say that, because when I wrote my memoir, a week before it came out, I called them and said, I don't want to do this anymore.
- [03:05]
Ken Rideout
I had that multiple times, dude. When I was writing it, I was like, I'm just going to give them the money back. I can't do this.
- [03:11]
Tyrus
Yeah, I was just like. Because it's. In a lot of ways, that process is therapy and you work through a lot of things and you. And it's when you look back on your life with wisdom, I think it. And you kind of resonates with you. Then there's that moment of vulnerability where you're like, I'm the finished product now. You know, I'm respected by peers. They don't know about a lot of the things in my journey in life and mistakes and mess ups, whatever you want to call them. I don't know if I want to share that because then I'm vulnerable again. You know, you're open for attack. And I think what works with your story is I think people respect the wins. But there's this. We have this facade of professional athletes, professional actresses, actors, and of this. Their life was just perfect. You know, they're just, they're champions and everything in their life is good. They have money, you know, and when you show them how much hell you go through or went through or put yourself through trying to maintain and get there, I think that's what resonates with people and I think that's what inspires people because they're like, hey, I've had these same issues. He just kicked ass in the Gobi Desert, which most people couldn't find on a map. It's remote, it's deadly dangerous. And if he can do that, then I can work on becoming a manager at my job or I can improve. I think that's where the winning side of it helps. Because I think if you just wrote a book about all your failures, I don't think there'd be a connection.
- [04:50]
Ken Rideout
That's right. And to your point, right, when you meet people and they're like, oh my God, it's Tyrus, isn't there a part of you that's like, you know that I'm an idiot just like you? Right? I just kept working and eventually it worked. And now you, you know me, but Like, I. I don't know how you feel. Obviously you have a different level of fame or recognition, but there's a part of me that's like, dude, every. You should be looking at me and thinking, if that idiot can do what he did, why can't I? Because I think I'm like the most average person on earth, except when it comes to my mentality. And I only developed that in my 40s when I was like, you know what? I'm sick and tired of being a mediocre loser. I'm going to do everything that I'm. Everything that I do going forward. I'm going to be the best at it, or I'm going to die trying to. And guess what? It worked.
- [05:35]
Tyrus
Yeah, you know what? That's one of the things that I guess I'm famous for, is how regular guy I am. You know, I don't do the security, I don't do the personal assistance. I fly like everybody else. You know, I dressed the way I dressed before I had anything. And. And fame to me is fleeting, I think, because I was on the bodyguard side of it. And I saw what happens to people when they get to a certain level. They forget who they are, they forget how they got there. And then when it's over, they expect everyone to be there. And that's. And that's. That's a recipe for disaster. So I never took it serious. And also some of that is. I'm still not convinced. I'm not above losing it all. That makes any sense.
- [06:23]
Ken Rideout
I know the feeling. That's exactly how I feel all the time. And I'm grateful when anyone recognizes me. Opportunity like this to speak to you is like incredibly humbling. When my in laws are super nice people, very reserved, very conservative. My father in law went to Princeton and Columbia, NBA. Like, really straight lace guy. When you know, they're like, okay, great book. They're super proud. When I told them I was coming on your podcast, you would think that I told them, like, I was the host of the Tonight Show. They were like, oh, my God, we.
- [06:55]
Tyrus
Look, they love you and I appreciate it. And it's just. I think just because there's. I wish I could say I had some secret formula that I just have something that nobody else does. But I think the fact that I just talk like everybody else does, I don't. I never try to pretend I know more than I should. And again, I have been poor or on the L side more in life than on the W side. So that resonates, you know, and that. And that's why when I'm looking at the title of your book, it's so such a powerful book. It the Other side of Hard. And explain that because that is, that can mean so many things. But that's a really powerful title.
- [07:39]
Ken Rideout
Every single thing that I have in my life came from hard work. And I'm sure you can attest to this. It's like when people ask me how I did, I said, well, I. The first thing I did was just dedicate myself to running a minimum of 10 miles every day. And it sounds incomprehensible to people who haven't started the journey. And I always say, yeah, if it wasn't hard, every idiot would do it and it wouldn't be novel to work hard. It's the same thing with being in great shape. Yeah, it's hard, but it's the biggest flex in life when you show up and people like, holy shit man, you're really working out, huh? That's the best compliment you could possibly give me. Because you and I know when you see someone shows up in physically in good, good shape, you know, all the grit and determination that took delayed gratification, the sacrifices to eat right, all of this stuff is hard. Was it easy to get on Fox News? No. Was it easy to do all the things you've done? No. But the magic is in the hard work. And yeah, it seemed like an obvious title to me because everything that I had was hard. Like I worked in the prison to pay for college. It sucked. But if I didn't do that, I wouldn't have said, yeah, you know, probation officer or parole officer, which is what I thought I might do. Coming out of college I was like this, there is no way I can do this job. Which forced me to look for what else I was qualified for. And really there was nothing on an academic basis that I was qualified for. I didn't have academic pedigree, certainly didn't have any professional experience, but anyone can be a salesperson. And when you're a good salesperson, you can sell anything. And I eventually ended up making my way to New York and working on a trading desks for 20 plus years and had a lot of financial success. But it also led to my addiction because with that success came this overwhelming like imposter syndrome or fraud complex where kind of like what you were describing is at any moment they're going to realize I'm a dope and I don't know anything that's going on, they're going to kick me out of here and now. Where else am I going to make a million plus dollars a year talking to my friends in trading commodities?
- [09:44]
Tyrus
But take me back to when you. There had to be some real life lessons working in the prisons, because I'm sure there was guys that you saw there that you could relate to or like, how. How did you end up like this, you know, or you saw guys who were like, you know, thank God for penitentiaries. I'm not going to end up like that. But also you kind of figured like, it's. That road is not as wide as you think.
- [10:07]
Ken Rideout
No.
- [10:08]
Tyrus
Where that path where you end up on the wrong side of things. And it's. Those routes are a lot closer than. Than people realize, 100%.
- [10:17]
Ken Rideout
I was playing high school football and one of the guys, one of the teams we played against, the coach who was new, my dad just approached me after a game in my senior year. I played quarterback. And he said, what are you doing for work next summer? In the summer before you go to school? I said, I don't know, maybe working for the park department or something. And he said, come and see me. And he worked at. He was the warden at the local prison. And I showed up figuring I'd be doing maintenance, cutting grass, like summer help. And this is way before the Internet. It's like 1989, I had just turned 18. They send me a letter saying, go to this uniform store and get these uniforms. And I get them and it's like police uniforms. I mean, it looked exactly like a cop. Now, growing up where I grew up, like, my stepfather had already been an inmate in this prison. Most of my mom's relatives were inmates in there at some point. So it wasn't completely foreign to me. I just never really fit in with these people. I always knew I've got to get. I've got to figure out a way to get out of here, which is why I was going to college. And yeah, I didn't work there for more than a few weeks before I realized, like, this is a dead end. And actually I worked there with Mickey Ward, who. They made the movie the Fighter, about
- [11:25]
Tyrus
one of the greatest fights, him and Gotti. I still, I still remember where I was that day. It was in Pasadena, California. I was just flipping through the channels. I just finished playing Madden with some buddies flipping through the channels. I came in at round two and I was like, this is one of the greatest. Their. Their story was amazing. Of course, what happened to Oturo was horrible, but that is still, I think, one of the Greatest that fight stands up against any fight. And I would say maybe Evander Holyfield and Riddick Bowe would be at the heavyweight division in terms of guys just unloading. But, yeah, that was an amazing fight.
- [12:03]
Ken Rideout
Yeah. So Mickey was a guard there, and Dickie Eklund, who was played by Christian Bale, he was an inmate at the time. So I say that just to give context to, like, A, how I grew up and B, how crazy it was working in a prison in Boston because everybody knew everyone and all of the guards were like, one decision away from being inmates themselves or one break. And it was a horrible, horrible job. Not just for the fact that obviously the guys are in prison, but just the mentality. Like, none of the guards seemed happy with their station in life. Not everyone, obviously, but for the most part, people were pissy. They weren't very nice, and it was just super hostile all the time. And I was working there full time in the summer, playing football and hockey in college. And, yeah, once I realized that wasn't for me, I started kind of panicking and figuring I better focus on schoolwork because I'm going to have to get a real job. And I had no idea what I was going to do. And I eventually got a pharmaceutical sales job in New York. York, which is how I ended up there, and then bumped into some kids that were making a ton of money at the gym, kids that I was working out with other guys at the gym. And I was looking at them like, these guys are idiots. How are they making so much money? And they. They were all working on trading desks. And eventually someone asked me if I wanted to be the trading assistant on one of these desks. And I took the job all full of piss and vinegar, thinking, this is the greatest thing ever. I mean, I was making like 40 grand. It was an entry level job, but immediately it was just like being in a football locker room or any sports team. They were hazing me, which was crazy because I was boxing for the New York Athletic Club. I was. I had worked in a prison. I wasn't exactly what you would describe as a pushover.
- [13:42]
Tyrus
Yeah, you weren't an easy out.
- [13:44]
Ken Rideout
No. And these guys are, like, harassing me. And eventually, after a month or two, I slapped. I slapped the guy in the face and they fired me. But when they did, a trader at Enron, who was the most senior commodities trader probably in the world, he was a Boston guy, too, from Martha's Vineyard. He heard the story, called me up and said, hey, so and so at this other trading desk, is going to call you. Like, I was so naive. I didn't even know we had competitors. And this other competitor, desk trading desk, called me and said, do you want a job? Within 48 hours I had a job making 80 grand. And once I started there, that big trader was now my number one client. And I went from making 80 grand. No, no bullshit. In three months I was making like $250,000 to expense account to do.
- [14:30]
Tyrus
And you're what, like 19, 20 right now?
- [14:32]
Ken Rideout
No, at this point I was 24 or 25.
- [14:36]
Tyrus
That is a lot of money when you have a chip on your shoulder and that young. And was it a situation where you were trying to make up for everything you didn't have growing up? You know?
- [14:50]
Ken Rideout
Exactly. Everything that I would buy had to be the best. If I bought sheets for my bed, they had to be like frate sheets. Like I went from being a complete fashion mis fit, like the shittiest suit you've ever seen, terrible shoes to like only Armani suits. The best shoes. I was just an idiot. In hindsight I was, I was a poor kid with money. Like I was behaving exactly the way you would think someone would. I thought that it made me important. I couldn't wait to tell people how rich I was. It's just embarrassing shit. But it was not who I am. Which is what eventually led to the drug addiction. Once I tried those drugs, I was like, oh, I feel great now. I don't have any insecurities.
- [15:28]
Tyrus
I, you know, because I guess I was lucky because rappers dressed cheap. It was all tracksuits and like Sean John velour suits and you know, everyone looking like they were already going to the gym. So, you know, it still was expensive, but nothing like those kind of suits. When do you think I always. Because my addictions were food, women and attention. That was what my addictions were. I needed, I needed people to praise me, you know, and, and that was one of the, the things so I'd surround myself with, with people that are a little bit lower on the scale that would tell me how great I was all the time. Even though I knew the guy in the mirror did not agree with them. And so one of the things that I used to do is I, I used to self sabotage. Like I knew that I had to say a certain way too. And I had all these Division 1 school offers and I, you know, you're going to be playing at your, this football player, blah blah blah. And I would eat against myself. I would never miss a workout, never miss A training, but then eat pizza and drink beer all night, you know, Like, I just. It was like there was two. Two dudes and I. Like, there was one guy who wanted the best things in life, but he wasn't strong enough for the guy who just wanted his needs met all the time. So. And originally I always. As I got older, I was like, I wasn't. But I never was having fun doing it. I think I was searching for medicine because it was always. There was never a moment that, like when I overate or was with a woman I shouldn't have been with that I ever was, like, happy about it afterwards. There was always a disgust, couldn't shower fast enough, or. Or, you know, tell myself, you know, I've never eaten this, you know, whatever. There would be this shame, self shame session. Was that similar? Was the drugs an escape or were you looking for medicine?
- [17:20]
Ken Rideout
That's exactly how I would describe the addiction. When people ask me about it, other addicts, I'm like, after the first few weeks or months, maybe it was no longer fun. Now I was like a junkie. If I didn't take the medicine, if I didn't take those pills, I would be sick, really sick. And if you've ever seen anyone withdrawing from heroin or opioids, it's scary when it's happening to you because you're like, holy shit, when's this going to end? And guess what? It ain't ending for like seven to 14 days. No quest, no if and buts. And it gets progressively worse. And then around four or five days, you're like, okay, I'm in the storm right now. But you know, like that saying, you never come out of the storm the way you went in. And eventually you start to take pride in your momentum and recovery. And those withdrawals were so bad that I spent 10 years avoiding them by just getting high again. I had to be sober for a couple of days. And I'm like, I can't take it. I'll stock next week and then I'll get back anything. But never was I thinking, like, yes, I'm so happy I'm high. I would literally contemplate suicide in between being high, I'd be high. That would wear off in a few minutes. And then I'd be like, I can't live like this. I'm going to just end it because I'm not a loser, but I'm behaving like a loser. And I left so much potential on the table.
- [18:36]
Tyrus
What was. What was? Because there's always the lowest point I think it was for me that I stepped on the scale, and I was legitimately a pound and a half away from 500 pounds.
- [18:48]
Podcast Host (Ad Read)
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- [19:18]
Tyrus
There's that lowest point where you're all of a sudden the day four and five don't seem so bad of the storm. Is there a specific memory where you're like, I can't do this anymore. Like, I've got to change?
- [19:32]
Ken Rideout
There were. There were, like, so many times where I felt like that. But the. The kind of. The pinnacle of when it all came to a head is my wife and I adopted a daughter from ETH and when we got matched with her, like, they send you the letter, here's the baby. Okay, you can go next month and get her. I just said to myself, like, my. My wife kind of knew that I was, like, a wacko. She didn't know the extent of it. She's very, like, conservative, squarish person. Like, never did a drug in her life. Not interested, not even inexperienced. Like, nothing. And that's probably why I married her. Like, she had everything that I wanted. And so I went to an outpatient detox facility in New York that basically gave you. Helped you with, like, a medically assisted withdrawal week. So you would. I would go there every day in the morning, and they would give me, like, Ritalin to stay awake, Xanax to go to sleep, blood pressure medicine, tons of medication. But you had to go every morning because, you know they're not gonna trust a junkie with, like, a week's worth of that kind of medicine, right? So one night after, like, the third night, fourth night, and once I'm seven days sober, they're gonna give me a different drug called Vivitrol. That's an open opioid blocker, which you can't get high. Like you Heroin, nothing will affect you. This blocks all the opioid receptors in your brain. So I knew that if I could get seven days, which is crazy, because seven days, you're like, okay, I could stand on my head for seven days, but it's just it's the worst depression you've ever experienced. It's everything. So after the fourth or fifth day, I woke up to take a leak in the middle of the night. My wife found me unconscious and I just, when I woke up, I was like, just so absolutely disgusted with myself. I just unloaded and told her everything and like, the extent of the addiction and needless to say, she was horrified. But as I was talking to her and telling her this, like, just in between, like hyperventilating, I was. We were on like 52nd floor of a high rise in, on the Upper west side. Brand new, gorgeous glass building. Like on the surface everything looked great. And I'm talking to her and looking at the balcony and I'm like, I'm just gonna make a run for it and jump off the balcony. And I'm like, just going like, I'm literally contemplating, like, should I do this? And thank God I didn't. And obviously I made it to the seven days, got the shot. And then from there I was like, not on easy street, but at least I had a 30 day period where no matter what I did, I wasn't getting high.
- [21:54]
Tyrus
And the most painful thing is not necessarily what you did to yourself. It's what your wife and family had to endure. Because when you're in it, you're defensive, you're protecting, you know, you do everything you can to protect the, your evil secret. When you look back to me, I still struggle with the guilt of, you know, having me not letting them down or just not being there the way I should have been there because I was so caught up in my, my bullshit. Do you still struggle with that when you look back? You know, because it takes a special person because you got. Obviously you have to forgive yourself. And, and sometimes when you're ready to forgive yourself, the people that you, that you hurt the most aren't. And was that, was that tough? Because sometimes the thing is like, well, I'll just start fresh, you know, I'll just, I'll just leave it all behind me, you know, and, and, and, but I still. There is a work to do there because you have to fix the people who depended on you, loved you and stood by you, even though you know you wouldn't. You weren't even standing by yourself.
- [23:00]
Ken Rideout
Yeah, no, it's still hard. I feel totally humiliated when I think about it. But you know, when you're in any kind of recovery, they tell you that you're only as sick as the secrets you keep. And the more like I said to you earlier, the more I share my experiences with people, the more support you find, which is why, like, AA and NA meetings are so helpful and it's such a successful route because you meet other people that are going through the same exact thing and living in this constant shame storm. And as a matter of fact, even in, you know, 10 plus years later in 2023, I still wasn't living the life I wanted. I was, I had won all the things that I had ever dreamed of winning in terms of endurance sports. And my relationship wasn't great with my wife and I just wasn't. I just wasn't the person that I wanted to be. And I wasn't as happy as I thought I deserved to be. So I went to like an, an inpatient trauma healing center called On Site Workshops. It's kind of like Hoffman Institute, if you've ever heard of that. It's like a five day intensive psychotherapy healing center, I guess. And it was crazy. Like, I get there and I check in and I get to my room and right away I'm like, oh my God, there's three beds in here. Like, I'm too old for this. Like, I'm not having three roommates. And they were like, no, no, you have roommates if you want to stay. And I was like, I was so angry. And I'm laying there and then this guy comes in, beard, super good looking, big guy. And I'm like, oh, this guy's got to be some kind of athlete. But you're not supposed to tell anyone your name, just first name. So I was like, hey, what's up, man? Oh, yeah, good to meet you, America. And I'm like, hey, did you play sports in college? Yeah. I said, did you play after college? He's like, yeah. I said, who'd you play for? He said, because you're not supposed to ask the name. So he's like, oh, I played for Denver, then I played for the Jets. And I was like, oh, shit, Eric Decker. He's in the book. I talked to him before talking about
- [24:55]
Tyrus
he's a good dude.
- [24:56]
Ken Rideout
Oh, the best. But it's like one of those things where like us talking about it and saying, you know, not that I put myself in the same category with Eric Decker in terms of athletes, but if those guys are strong enough to go and do this shit, then like, maybe there's something to it. And then I did an interview with Lance Armstrong. He's like, oh, I've been to On Site three or four times already, so I can't. That was like, one of the most important things I ever did for myself. Because that certainly helped me deal with a lot of the guilt and shame that I felt for what I had put myself and others through.
- [25:26]
Tyrus
Because the guilt and shame can be just as heavy a weight as the addiction.
- [25:31]
Ken Rideout
Yeah, man. I couldn't get happy. I couldn't. Even though I was sober, I couldn't enjoy my life. Nothing ever felt like enough. If I won something, I was like, I could have gone faster. If I didn't win, I was, like, inconsolable. It was just like a losing proposition. Even when I won, I would. When I won a marathon, the day before I turned 50, I won the Myrtle beach marathon. And I always go to the races by myself without my wife and kids, because it's like, work, you know, I want. I'm, like, focused. And when I won, I called, and I'm like, I did it. I won. All I wanted to do was win a big marathon. And she was like, oh, my God, so great. Are you happy? And I was like, there was no one. Was really. It wasn't really that competitive. And she's like, how much did you win by? I said, less than a minute. And she's like, well, what if someone was even remotely better? You would have lost. Yeah, you know, like, yeah, I guess so. But that was my mindset. I was just like, it's not enough if I gotta, like, run super fast and win.
- [26:23]
Tyrus
Finding joy is the battle, you know, And. But when, you know, we've talked a lot about the negative stuff, with all the stuff you're going through, the addictions and the fluctuation up and down, money and all that stuff, you still kept it going in the gym. Was. Was the gym, the church. Was that the place where you were the best version of yourself?
- [26:49]
Ken Rideout
Oh, definitely. I was too insecure, in vain to be out of shape. Like, I could destroy myself emotionally and psychologically, but physically, I was too insecure to show up here, like, you know, dumpy and, like, not taking care of myself at all, so. And the drugs had more of an effect if I was depleted. And I also felt like they were a reward for working out hard. At least if I'm working out, I don't feel as guilty. If all I was doing was taking drugs and lounging around, that could have, like, easily spiraled into, like, heroin and, like, the next step in the addiction. But that was the only thing that kept me from, like, really going off the deep end.
- [27:28]
Tyrus
Because you, like, had that pendulum, you know, you had the. I'm in the gym. So therefore, what I'm doing to myself outside the gym, it's okay. Because as long as I go back to the gym, I'm still functioning.
- [27:39]
Ken Rideout
That's right. And I looked. I didn't look like a junkie. I was, you know, but for all intents and purposes, rich, relatively speaking. I mean, not compared to New York finance guys, but compared to the rest of the world. I was very rich. I was in good shape. I had all the stuff you were supposed to have as a successful guy, but none of it meant anything to me. Even now, when. When I talk to younger guys that are like, oh, I love watches, I love cars. I can appreciate. Appreciate all that stuff. But when someone's talking to me about, I want to buy this watch, and I'm like, do you really love it? Or are you hoping that people see it and identify you as someone, a person of means? Or wow, he's like, really knowledgeable and rich. Because if you think about it like that, the people you're trying to impress with your material, possession, possessions, anyone that would be impressed probably sucks. You don't even want to be friends with them.
- [28:29]
Tyrus
Right. Or they rob you first chance.
- [28:31]
Ken Rideout
Yeah. What am I doing? I'd rather have the money in the bank.
- [28:34]
Tyrus
You know what? Because I always had to have a big, giant chain. I had to have the big.
- [28:38]
Ken Rideout
Don't get me wrong, I love nice stuff.
- [28:39]
Tyrus
Oh, yeah. But I did. But I was like, I had to have this big chain. And, you know, I always wanted the big. The watch, but for some reason that I never really crossed. But I always had to have a big chain, and I always had to have my ride. Had to be cool, you know, I had to have an awesome car.
- [28:55]
Ken Rideout
Same.
- [28:56]
Tyrus
And it was like, the more I became more like who I am inside, then the changes became heavy, you know, and it was like. It's a weird. Because it was my trademark. I had the big chain and the hat and. And I remember my daughter had wanted. Got me this little tiny, like, King Kong thing, and it would never have fit on my chain. My chain was too big. So I got a little necklace for it, and I would wear it and the chain. But I couldn't. You couldn't see because the big chain would cover it up. Yeah. And I was like, what was more important to me was my daughter seeing that I had my little. Because my daughter thinks it looked like King Kong. So even as a baby, like, it was. Her mom took her. My wife took her to Universal and they had the King Kong ride. She's about 3 years old, and she just started. Daddy. His daddy's here. You know? And I was like, you know, And I was like, I don't know how to take. Okay, he's got. He's got the greenish blue eyes. Okay, I'll let it go. But there's that moment, like that little $40 trinket or whatever was way more valuable to me than the chain. So I got rid of the. I got rid of the chain. And then as life would happen, I sent the thing to get cleaned while we were moving. And my little. My little Kong got lost somehow in the move. I don't wear a chain at all anymore. You know, I kept the chain that she got. I wore that for a while, and then I just stopped wearing it. And I realized that, like, if it's not going to be something from one of my kids or my wife, I'm not going to wear it. But that to me was like, hey, man, that's change. Because I would not go on TV without my chain. I would not walk to the wrestling room without. If I wasn't there, like, you'd be like, hey, like, you know, and. And it was like, why was that so important to me? Because I needed everyone to see that I was successful.
- [30:47]
Ken Rideout
Yeah, no, I know what you mean. One of the things that I love doing now is talking to young, young athletes. And I talked to a lot of fighters. I hosted a podcast for a long time with Teddy Alice, called the Fight with Teddy Allison. Together, I helped him train Alex Vozdyk, who was the WBC Light Heavyweight Champion of the World. We trained him for a fight against Agar Berabiev, who was the IBF champ who then unified the titles. It was just killer fight. But in going through that, I came across a lot of fighters. And I would always tell the young kids that always had a lot of diamonds. I' do you understand that when you have your profile and you're an elite athlete, you can walk into any club or any venue where you want to be impressive with a T shirt, jeans, and a pair of Jordans and be the coolest guy there. There could be another guy draped in diamonds, but you have something that they can't buy, and that's always more impressive. So save the money. Buy fake diamonds. What do you care? Like, anyone who would be impressed by that sucks. They're idiots. You're good enough without that. You're. You're. These people would die to be you.
- [31:50]
Tyrus
You know, that's. I'm a huge fight fan. I. I I. You know, that's. And one of the. How I burnt off so much weight. I lost 147 pounds this year, was just heavy bags. I just started banging on the bags and Sugar. Shame. Only Juicer Jr. I had was at a fight with my wife. And we were watching. I think it was Vargas was fighting, and he smoked the kid and. But they had a lot of the guys, you know, they always have fighters that are in the weight class that they're looking, you know, and I'm looking at all these young, young guys. Everyone was blinged out. And I think probably the. The funniest one was Telefimo. You know, he's about, what, a foot and a half tall, if he's lucky? And, you know, everyone's, you know, people recognize me and all that stuff. And. And he comes by and he sticks his chest out and he's got all his chains on and stuff, and he's like, yo, what's up? You know, And I was just like, I remember when I was stupid like that. And then on the other side, sitting quietly with his. With his wife and. And his child was Sugar, Shane Mosley Jr. And I was like, what a nice young man. So I went over to talk to him, and he was kind of like, he was. Because he had some losses, I think, Golden Boy. And then were kind of like, oh, he's. He's too good, because he might hurt some of our stars.
- [33:05]
Ken Rideout
That's right.
- [33:06]
Tyrus
But they didn't think he was good enough or whatever. But I was. I. I was like, I'm gonna follow this guy's career. Like, you know, I'm. Have you on my podcast or whatever. And he just had his first, like, big, big win, dominant win under a new thing. And I was. And I said to him, what. You know, I was so impressed with you. Even was. Because you carried yourself like somebody with wisdom. You carried yourself like a grown man, a husband and a father. And unfortunately, in the boxing world, that is never celebrated. You know, they want the guy who can't do an interview without taking a swing at somebody, you know, and, you know, and I was like. And I get it, because to be a fighter, you gotta. It's a combat sport. You gotta be. You gotta. You gotta be a little bit. You gotta be a little bit animal. You have to be. Yeah, but. But I think we put so much emphasis on the bullshit, the bling, all that stuff. And most of those guys, unfortunately, by the time their career is over, they've already hawked that stuff, or it's Been repossessed.
- [34:07]
Ken Rideout
No, that's exactly right. Even Floyd's going to it right now. He's in the news for, like, someone confiscating his jewelry. But Shane Mosley Jr. Is my friend. He used. When I lived in the Pacific Palisades. He'd come over to my house for dinner. I loved him.
- [34:20]
Tyrus
I love that kid. I mean, he's a grown man. But I'm just saying, like, I just had him on my podcast, and. And, you know, people sometimes are like, well, isn't there another. You know, you can get a bigger name? Ah, this is my guy. Like, don't worry, he's gonna be there. Like, just five losses. Doesn't. Boxing's the only sport in the world that doesn't respect the L's?
- [34:38]
Ken Rideout
That's right.
- [34:39]
Tyrus
You know, you.
- [34:39]
Ken Rideout
I think fighting in his dad's shadow was not easy.
- [34:43]
Tyrus
No.
- [34:43]
Ken Rideout
Because he started right when his dad was wrapping up, and it was a
- [34:47]
Tyrus
lot of pressure, you know, but that. And to capitalize on that pressure. Take me through the process of the Gobi Desert. I mean, what was your prayer? Now you're tr. Now you. You train, you work with boxers and stuff, because endurance is everything. That second wind, in some cases, that third win. And what was your training like going into that event? Because that's not something I think that you could be like, well, I'm just going to win. You know, that's what was taking. What was your training camp like going into that?
- [35:19]
Ken Rideout
That's a good question. And that's the. Actually, the mindset that I did have. So a friend of mine was the CEO at Equinox guy, Scott Derues, who's now the CEO of Ironman. He. He had reached out to me through a friend who wanted to talk about some advice about running because I had won some big races. And when he told me about the race, I don't know why, I just said to him, like, dude, I bet you I can kill everyone at that race. And he was asking me, like, have you ever an ultramarathon? I said, no. What about sleeping in a tent? Running with a backpack? I said, no, I've never done anything like that. But I don't know why. That race just seems appealing to me. This was like, four or five weeks before the race. It was sold out for, like, a year in advance. And I emailed the race director and the woman. They. They knew me. I had been in the Wall Street Journal and New York Times. And so she said, yeah, you can get in. So I had, like, really four full Weeks of training. I always stay in shape, I always stay ready, so I never have to get ready. But there' difference between being fit and being ready to race. And so for four weeks, I put. I bought a bunch of backpacks because, you know, the things like on your shoulders and your waist for 20 to 50 miles every single day in the, in this, in the raging heat. So. And it's like all you had, it was self supported. So everything you needed for a week, all the food, everything except water was in this bag. And again, with no experience, you don't know what you're going to need and not need. There were certain safety requirements that you had to have, certain, certain things. So I just started buying all the gear, bought a bunch of backpacks, loaded it up with towels and bottled water to simulate the weight that I'd have to carry. And I just started running through my neighborhood in Nashville. And it's funny, even when I meet people now, they're like, are you the guy that runs everywhere? I'm like, yeah, that's me. Because I run a minimum of 10 miles every day.
- [37:08]
Tyrus
I do 10 miles on my stationary bike downstairs. Like, I like to ride bikes, bikes. So I ride the bike. It's a little bit better on my knees and stuff. So you started training for this. But those. Nashville's hot. But it's not like, I mean, you're going to the Gobi Desert. I mean, how, how did you. Was there any. Were you doing stuff with the sauna? Were you wearing bodysuit? Like, what were you doing to try to get yourself be prepared for how much? Because you don't have a lot of. You have little or no fat, so you're going to overheat a little bit faster than somebody with a little more size on them. Did you think about that at all?
- [37:48]
Ken Rideout
To be honest with you, I knew it was going to be hard. But I also thought, how do you train for something like this? I've got years of running every single day, minimum of 10 miles. So in my mind, there's two voices in my head. There's one that's like, you're going to embarrass yourself and get killed. But I just need the voice that's telling me we're killing everyone. I'm going to destroy these guys. They're all nerds. Whether or not that's true or not, this is the voice that has to be like 1% louder than the, like, Beta voice, right? And that's what I did. I mean, I was scared shitless when I got on the plane in Nashville, I tell this story. My wife's driving me. I'm driving to the airport with my wife and in Nashville to start, like, the journey to Atlanta, South Korea, Ulaanbaatar. Like, it was a. An odyssey to get there. And she's like, oh, my God. Are you excited? You're going to Mongolia? That's going to be cool, exotic travel. I'm, like, excited. I feel like I'm going to the electric chair. I told everyone I was going to win this race. I've got, like, 10.
- [38:44]
Tyrus
Oh, so you wrote checks that your ass had to cash.
- [38:47]
Ken Rideout
Exactly. I had, like, big sponsors. Athletic Brewing, Ketone, IQ Roka, sunglasses. Like, people paid a lot of money to, like, get me there and sponsor this. So. But right when I walked on the Jetway, it was the weirdest thing. Like, my brain knew. It was like. Like walking out of the locker room room for a fight. I was like, okay, effort. I'm not here to, like, take place. I want to win or die trying. And it was literally like, that race. It's funny. A couple producers have reached out to my agent after the. Since they read the book and were like, yo, we want to make a talk about optioning the rights to the book. And I always tell them, like, you could write a whole movie just about my experience. The week in the Gobi Desert, because there were so many ups and downs. Like, the first day I got killed, I finished fourth, which, you know, I think I'm going to destroy everyone easily, and I get killed by, like, every, like, all the guys that were competitive. And after the first day I was talking to this, it was all international people, all, like, experienced.
- [39:46]
Tyrus
So you were the only American there was.
- [39:49]
Ken Rideout
There was a couple of Americans, but there were only a few. And they were just participants. There were probably, like, 20 people that were competitive and then another, like, hundred.
- [39:57]
Tyrus
They were just trying to make the. I did it, you know?
- [39:59]
Ken Rideout
Yes.
- [40:00]
Tyrus
Like, getting a guided tour up Everest. I'm not.
- [40:02]
Ken Rideout
Yeah, yeah. South African guy, Killian Ryan. Really nice guy. He said, yo, these guys, I heard them talk, and they think they're going to eventually wear you down. They know you're a marathon runner, and they. They. They think that they're going to take advantage of your lack of experience and they're eventually going to kill you. And I was like, dude, I die before these goons kill me. You do. I'm killing them. And he was laughing. And I'll come back to Funny Story at the end with him. But, yeah, the next day, I won the Stage the next day I took it much more conservative because the first day I went out way too hard. But with a few miles to go on the second stage, it was 28 miles. I fell down the side of a mountain into my back, my backpack, ripped the strap, ripped off the bag. I was busted up everywhere, bleeding like crazy. And I finished like 10 minutes ahead of the next guy. But I was 12 minutes down from the first day. So going into the third day I was, I was in second place now to a Swiss guy who was awesome. If I raised him 10 times, he'd win nine. And it just like the whole story about what happens next is like a novel. Like going into the fourth day, I'm in, I'm in second place by about eight or ten minutes and I. And there's another Israeli guy who's in third. So the three of us, me, the Swissy and the Israeli, we're off the front on a 50 mile day. So everyone's starting out really conservative and we're just jogging across these plains and I just felt really good. I ran over to the Israeli guy and I was like, hey, David, did I tell you I never get tired? I feel so good today. I'm gonna start hammering once we get to like 30 miles. And dude, it was like a movie. Like within two or three minutes I looked back and he was walking and I was like, I think I.
- [41:44]
Tyrus
Psychologically, you gotta understand now, just forgive me now, when someone has a 12 minute lead, does that mean they get a 12 minute head start and you have to make the difference?
- [41:52]
Ken Rideout
It's like the Tour of France. They, you take the cumulative time every
- [41:56]
Tyrus
day and then, then you add it all up together. So if the guy's up 12, so in the next day you got to at least cut that in half or get.
- [42:03]
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
- [42:04]
Tyrus
So you basically the best. Whoever has the best overall times of the four ends up being the overall winner. Unless the guy just has like an incredible. Where he finishes like 20 minutes ahead of somebody, which you know exactly right. Okay, so you know you're in. Good.
- [42:18]
Ken Rideout
So in that 50 mile stage, it's just me and the Swiss guy now. And we can't even, I mean, we're going across rolling planes like a movie. Like you're looking back, you can't even see the people. You can't see anything for like seemingly hundreds of miles in either direction. We haven't seen people in four days. So we're kind of like power hiking up the steep mountains because again, you're not on a road, you're in, like, dirt and shit and desert sand. And we're going up. And eventually we get to some flats with, like, 15 miles to go. And he says, oh, I'm hurting. I'm gonna walk a little now. Again, we're alone in the desert and it's hot, and you get up water like every five to 10 miles. So I'm like, all right, I'll walk with this guy a little because I'm tired too, but I could probably keep running, but let me conserve if he's hurting, like, let's see how it plays out. With a few miles to go, and eventually he, like, really fell apart. Was like, I gotta sit down. And I was like, telling. And I'm like, dude, don't sit down. Let's get to the next aid station so you can get help there. I'm giving him my water. And eventually the aid trucks come by, the race directors, you know, patrolling the course, and they start rendering first aid. So I'm like, are you guys good with him? He's good. Yep, Yep, you're good. You can go. And I just took off and blew the race open. I won that stage by 90 minutes and ended up winning the race by 90 minutes. But coming into the last day, the morning of the last stage, it was only like 6 miles, and it finished in, like a Genghis Khan old, like, temple slash village. And the South African guy says to me, oh, you got a 90 minute lead, man. Are you gonna let someone else win this stage? You can take it easy and just cruise it in. And I looked at him like he was crazy. I was like, brother, I'll die before I let someone win. And if I thought someone let me win, I'd punch them in their face. This is a race to the death, right? And showing up, me and the Swiss guy got in a shootout like, sprinting like lunatics with our backpacks, which are now practically empty, but you still had all your mandatory gear. And we're just running through these little, little village streets into this big fortress. And then I beat him by like 5 or 10 minutes. So I won by over 90 minutes. But it was incredibly relieving to finish winning. And I was so happy it was over. Couldn't wait to get home.
- [44:28]
Tyrus
What type of shoes were you wearing? Because, I mean, it wasn't like a traditional hiking boot or running shoe. A running shoe I don't think would stand the terrain. And then the hiking booze would be heavy.
- [44:40]
Ken Rideout
They were trail racing shoes. They're, like, super common. They happen to. Those happen to be from hoka, but I had a partnership in years after with Reebok and they made a trail shoe. But it's basically like a running shoe with like a really strong rubber sole. Because, you know, running shoes, you would never survive. Like the rocks that you're stepping on in the terrain, it's just, they're too unstable. It's. They're special, special specialty shoes for trail racing. But dude, every day you'd come back, let your stuff air out, dry it, be soaking wet. Because every single day they'd run us through like a river like two or three times. So we go, I hate being wet. And they'd be like, there was no way to get through. You had to like run through the river.
- [45:19]
Tyrus
Yeah, running in wet shoes cannot be fun.
- [45:21]
Ken Rideout
And on the 50 mile day, we ran through a river, a river with like three miles into a 50 mile race. So you were wet and stuff, muddy all day.
- [45:34]
Tyrus
That is just unbelievable. So now here you are, you've conquered a race that not many people, maybe a handful of people can say, especially at that time, that's in 90 minutes that you literally won. Like, they would need an extra day to catch you. And that's. Was there the joy at the end of that?
- [45:55]
Ken Rideout
There was probably more joy at the end of that than any other win. Only because I didn't know what to expect. Like at a. When I won the world championships in the marathon at the Chicago Marathon, when I called my wife, she was like, how happy are you? And I was like, I just feel relieved that it's over. Eventually I was happy. But it wasn't like overwhelming joy of like winning the heavyweight title. It was more like, oh, thank God. Everything I thought was. Is validated. But winning the goby march was definitely happy because I was, I didn't know what to expect. And after the first few days, I was like, jesus, am I going to like come here and embarrass myself? And so to finally have it over with was definitely fulfilling.
- [46:35]
Tyrus
So now here you are, accomplished author, accomplished athlete, accomplished businessman, family man. What is. What is you? Because a guy like you just can't be complacent. I don't think that's possible. I just, this is the first time we're talking. You just don't. Retirement, you know, doesn't really seem like it would ever fit you. What is, what is your next challenge? Like, what is the next, I guess the word mountain you're going to climb. But for you, are you looking at another event or is it.
- [47:07]
Ken Rideout
I don't know about any running races. I feel like I've kind of done that, and I don't want to feel like I'm running to be performative. I never set out to be a runner. I was just trying to get sober. And it just so happened that I ended up getting good at that, so. So I have a podcast that's produced by, I don't know if you know Andrew Huberman. His team produces the podcast, and my partners and I also have a management agency where I manage a bunch of doctors and scientists, like thought leaders in the health and wellness space, and represent a bunch of brands and help them find influencers or ambassadors and negotiate those kind of brand partnerships. We also sell ads on podcasts, and that's rewarding. But, yeah, to your point, like, I need another physical challenge. I just don't have one yet. Writing the book was, like, took a lot of effort, and as you know, when the book comes out, that's when the real work starts. I flew over to London, did a bunch of live tv, Virgin Radio. So I've been doing the whole media tour for the last couple of months, and now the podcast really takes a lot of my attention. But it's something that I love the most. I mean, I've had some incredible guests on, like your friend Mark Kerr, the Smashing Machine.
- [48:19]
Tyrus
Yeah, I love Mark.
- [48:20]
Ken Rideout
Connected me with your team. But I had Chris Nyland, former NHL from Boston. You know, played for the Canadians. Tough guy, former opioid addict.
- [48:29]
Tyrus
I was a Ray Borg guy.
- [48:31]
Ken Rideout
Yeah. So get this. I'm speaking because of all the stuff that I've done in the book. I. Couple weeks ago, I get a phone call. Hey, I. I answer a Boston number. He's like, hey, what's up, man? It's Cam Neely. Want to know if you want to come in and speak to the. Our player development camp, our rookies and draft picks in June. So I'm doing that on June 29, which I can't wait. I become friendly with Joe Missoula from the Celtics. I'd love to eventually speak to them, but that stuff keeps me busy and it keeps me motivated.
- [49:00]
Tyrus
And, yeah, Missoula is my coach. He's my favorite professional coach. Like, I wasn't even upset about the first round exit. I really wasn't. We did. We played above our heads all year, and. And Bead showed up. He literally broke himself to get us. Fine, let's trade for him in the off season. Kata can start and we can just rest him like the Sixers did, and then we can take A title. But did you. What has been the most surprising reactions you've received from your book? I'm always curious because when people would stop me to and talk about mine, and when I. When someone says, I read it, I was always kind of like, you did. Like, yeah. There's that moment. Like, yeah. Because you don't. Maybe some people do think, like, when I write something, it's gospel and everyone reads it, and if you don't read it, you're an ass. I'm always shocked when someone's like, I read your book.
- [49:53]
Ken Rideout
100%. No, that happens. I mean, before the book came out. The most shocking thing that's happened since I started, like, getting some attention for running or attention as an athlete. I noticed one day that the Rock was following me on Instagram right after he did a Joe Rogan interview. And I'm friends with. With Joe, and I sent a DM to the Rock thinking, like, what? Guys got 300 million followers? He's not going to respond to this, but I just said, hey, thanks for following, man. Big fan. Loved your interview with Joe Rogan. He sent me a voice memo back, like, hey, brother, it's the Rock here. I love your content. You're inspiring. I'm going to go run through a brick wall now at the gym. Like, you really, like, lit a fire under my ass. And this. You said this, and it resonated. It was. It was incredible. I'm like, this guy gets it. He recognizes his, like, station in life and how much influence he has to take the time to, like, message a random, like, dad and be like, hey, you're inspiring and motivating from a guy who, like most people view as, like, inspiring and motivating was. Was crazy. And then having guys like Cam Neely call me and Joe Missoula send me a text message about my book, because I send them a signed book or through a friend of a friend. It's crazy. It's all crazy to me. It's like. Like you said, like, people, when they recognize me and they're like, do you mind if I get a picture? I'm like, I'd be pissed if you didn't ask for a picture.
- [51:07]
Tyrus
Right.
- [51:08]
Ken Rideout
Of course you can have a picture. So that's been rewarding.
- [51:12]
Tyrus
So now that the book and we can get the. Where can people get this book? Obviously on Amazon or Barnes and Nobles, wherever books are sold.
- [51:20]
Ken Rideout
Yep. I have a website called the Other side of Hard, where there's. I think there's some signed copies for sale. It links to everything the podcast.
- [51:30]
Tyrus
I got my signed copy, so I'm pretty excited about it. And I just started breezing through the front of it, and it looks like a really. And I love the fact that you're just so brutally honest, man. There's this one. I was. I'm on page 38 right now, and you're talking with Sully, and I always came up to him on the driver's side. Right out. Move over. What? Why? Give me the keys, bro. You ain't driving. That's as real as. And that's how I know it's you. You know, that's not a Ghost Rider.
- [51:58]
Ken Rideout
That was. That was his dad's giant limited. And his dad was crazy. He would beat the shit out of him if he thought we were driving that car aggressively. If he thought that I was fishtailing his car down the street, he would have killed us both. So that's what's funny about that story is wasn't even his car. It was his dad's.
- [52:15]
Tyrus
Wow. But that's. I always. You know, because in this day and age, it's so much easier to just put your name on something and let some stranger record you for half an hour or whatever it is. And then they write some book. And. And like you, I've. I've talked to some people who wrote their book and I'll ask them about a specific chapter and they'll be like, I said that. I'm like, never mind. You know. But this is. You're the real thing. You're is legit. And I. Like I said, you got a who's who on here. Reggie Miller, Cameron Hayes, Gabby Reese, Cell boom. I mean, you just people. But I think the reason why. Success, greatness, but authenticity and just being a real thing. It doesn't matter whether you're a king or. Or you're a custodian, those things. The reason why you would get a guy like Rock, and Rock's pretty much never really changed. He's kind of been one of those guys that has not let it gone to his head, which it could easily could.
- [53:17]
Ken Rideout
Oh, yeah.
- [53:18]
Tyrus
To where that resonates with everybody.
- [53:21]
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
- [53:21]
Tyrus
And I always say, I'd rather be a people's champ than the champ, because that's all encompassing. And you've. You've definitely. Just talking to you. You definitely are a people's champ. And that's why you'll have people from all walks of life, because everybody can get a little something from this. You don't have to be training to run in one of those Craziest deserts of all time. Just so you know, that desert was the difference between being conquered, not conquered. I mean, it was. It was. It was part of the barrier that Genghis Khan was so great or was so dominant. So it's just a really. Like I said, I'm on page 38. I. I usually read pretty quick. And it's funny because I just finished God Assad's book, God Sad's book, and then I finished Brett's book on America. And then now I'll knock this one out, so. And it's cool. You even got pictures and stuff right here. This is awesome. This is awesome. And I see your daughter and your sons, your two dog. Wow. Don't let Dana Perino find out your dog. She's gonna be really jealous. But, man, my wife's dogs. Yeah. Thanks so much for coming on today, and please come back soon. And I'm gonna finish this and I'm gonna follow you on all that stuff and just keep in touch, man, because this is really. There's all. I. I know there's going to be some helpful things that are gonna help me because you always want to improve and be better. So I really appreciate your time. And hopefully, like I said, the Red Sox won yesterday. Hopefully we can get it going. But I appreciate you, man. Thank you so much for coming on.
- [54:47]
Ken Rideout
Thank you for having me on, man. And I would love to chat with you about your story on my podcast.
- [54:51]
Tyrus
Oh, I'd. Come on anytime. You just let my guys know. I'll give them my number and we'll knock it out because it'd be a lot of fun. I really appreciate the opportunity.
- [54:58]
Ken Rideout
Thank you for setting it all up. Appreciate you guys. You guys.
- [55:01]
Tyrus
Yes, sir.