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- [00:00]
A
What it is. Welcome to Planet Tyrus. And as I'm pulling you into my gravitation today, we're going to talk about, well, me. Well, actually one of my favorite authors, which is ironically, well, me. So right around the corner, literally days away, depending on when this drops, my new book, what It Is America, is going to be out and very. It's been a crazy, crazy, crazy trip to even describe myself as an author with my first book, just Tyrus. As it says, this is not the original copy because they had to put the New York Time bestseller label on there. But writing this was one of the most difficult challenges in my life. And even at one point, and I'll tell you when I bring my writing coach on, this almost did not happen. Literally tried to stop it from happening. And then. Then it got good to me. And then we came out with enough said, which was kind of not really a continuation. The only thing I wish we would have done differently is the color schemes. I think people got confused because these sales stayed the same, because I think they were buying the same book. Yes, there are a lot of similarities. I'm topless in both, but this one was more of a memoir, and this one was more of kind of like a memoir with how my mind works and my thought process. And then I kind of put it all together for what it is. America, we're a little more straightforward and calling a lot of telling, calling it like it is not how you want it to be. So. And I figured the way to do this and talk about my new book and what my thought process is would bring on my esteemed writing coach. He's the Alfred to my Batman. And Chris Epting, he's an accomplished writer of his own. We've been working together on all my books. So he's. He's weathered a few storms with the creative process. And just to say the least, because I was originally rejected as an author. So it's always nice to look back when someone says no. And then you're here now, where you're on your third project. You know, it's kind of. But before we get into just a little bit of background on you, Chris, like, what is your. Like, how did you get it so into writing? Was that always a lifetime passion?
- [02:39]
B
Yeah, I was a. I was a kid. I literally was in, like, fourth grade, and a teacher called my parents and said he likes writing. You should encourage this and that. I love this teacher so much. I said that night, I want to be a writer. That's what I'm going to Be. And there was a very well known writer in our neighborhood in Westchester county in New York named John Cheever. My father said, you need to write him, ask his advice. I did. He became a mentor. And from that point on, that was. That's been my path. I mean, there's always little barriers in the way things you and I have talked about. I wrote and directed commercials for years, but then eventually got around to becoming an author like I wanted to, and a storyteller, and then began writing. I write about history and all kinds of travel, baseball things I love. But then I write memoir with people and I coach people and like a writing coach and teacher. And that's how you and I connected about five. It's hard. I was thinking about five years or so ago.
- [03:32]
A
Yeah, Time flies with Tyrus, apparently.
- [03:35]
B
And, and that first book, you know, you referenced earlier, what we went through was. Was really comp. I mean, for me, as somebody who likes to coach and help people, I learned a lot working with you because you had a lot to get through and at first you didn't want to do it, and then you said, you know what? If I'm going to do this, I'm going to do it right. And you bought into this process.
- [03:57]
A
Yeah.
- [03:57]
B
And the results were there.
- [04:00]
A
I had a complete meltdown. What A week before the book was.
- [04:03]
B
Called me and said, how can we stop this? And I said, well, the books are made like they're in warehouse.
- [04:09]
A
Too late, bro.
- [04:09]
B
There's no way to get out of this. And I remember saying to you, no, but this is a good thing because you were feeling anxiety, like, what have I done? What are people going to learn about me now? And I remember saying to you, this is actually a really good sign because if you weren't feeling that, it would mean that we didn't go far enough that you should be sweating. Anybody who writes their story, watching this, listening right now, if they're writing their story, it should give you anxiety or you haven't shared enough. That's a good feeling.
- [04:35]
A
Right? Because if you're, if. Or if you're writing to make yourself look a certain perspective, like I'm the hero or I'm the victim in how I write. When you just put it out there, people are going to make their own decision.
- [04:48]
B
People not writing letters to yourself is a whole other kind of writing thing. And when you're vulnerable and you show people that not just that you've been through stuff, but that you got through it. I think with your first book, a lot of people realized if he can get through his stuff, I can get through mine. That was a big. You look at all those tens of thousands of comments on Amazon. A lot of people really felt their own story come out. Out, I think, when they read yours. And that's what I gave you so much credit for, was. Was going deep. And I'll add that here. Now, third book. I mean, technically fourth with the children's book.
- [05:21]
A
Yeah, that's coming around the corner. Yeah. But I gotta drag you in for a different podcast.
- [05:25]
B
I've never worked with anybody on more than one project, so I've had the benefit each time now watching you go deeper and deeper. And our, you know, our collaborative energy, I think is really good, where, you know, I can kind of hear you in a certain way and maybe make suggestions about things. And you're open to it because we've been through these wars.
- [05:44]
A
Yeah, I'm coachable.
- [05:46]
B
Well, you. But you're an athlete, so you get the coaching relationship. One of my favorite. I have to tell you this. This one, to me, the new book is so much different than the other two because a lot of current events in it, but one of my favorite stories, and it's 50 stories. It's a lot of great content. But near the end, you and I were talking one day about the Bad News Bears, modern sports, modern coaching. You'd been. I think you and I were talking. You just watched your son play a baseball game. We were reflecting back on Bad News Bear as one of our favorite movies. And there's a chapter in here about how things have changed and why. That movie was actually a great example of coaching, of team chemistry, of believing in people even when they're failing. I mean, there's great learning in that. And I love the depth to which you went on that story, because for any of us that grew up in the 70s, and that was like, one of our favorite movies.
- [06:41]
A
Yeah.
- [06:42]
B
I was in Little League when that movie came out, so it was like we all went to see it. We thought, this is our life. This. I was on a team like that. And I think that's one of my favorite stories in the book because it's reflective and it's you watching your son. That's what inspired it, which is a nice family tie. You know, this book is for the first time as well. You're talking about being a father in ways you haven't before. It's another.
- [07:04]
A
Yeah, I was. I would describe it as brutally honest. You know, you. You talked about writing a love letter to yourself. Right. But sometimes when you're writing a Dear John letter to yourself, you know, where you're just telling it like it is. I think that was the point where, because a lot of times people will say, oh, you're such a great dad, you know, but you don't necessarily feel like a great dad because you're working in another state. Most of the time.
- [07:30]
B
I was going to say, forget love letters. You were writing hate letters to yourself, in some cases putting a self critical mirror on yourself, which then pushed you to get to the other side of how to be better, how to be stronger. And I think that's another great theme in the book too is overcoming things about yourself that you want to fix. That we're all works in progress and you get into that, you know, again, there's a lot of current events, but there's also a lot of self reflection. And I think those, again, those moments for me, we'll talk about, I mean the way the book opens for I'm sure a lot of people watching. Remember last year's election cycle when Donald Trump was on gut fel and you gave him a belt, you had a specially prepared wrestling belt for him, which became one of those moments. It's funny, I watch it again and I can't think about, I think of the first book that, you know, just Tyrus and this vulnerable kid, you know, coming out of some real nitty gritty upbringing situations. And now there you sit with the.
- [08:28]
A
Breaking bread with the President. Yeah.
- [08:30]
B
Mixing it up, you know, like that, giving him this gift and having this moment and like that, that arc right there is so crazy. I don't know how that feels for you, but when this stuff, I think, my God, there's really nothing else like this story.
- [08:43]
A
I also thought it was important because I did talk about interacting and meeting the President and I thought it was important to emphasize how undifficult it was to block out the noise, how genuine of a person that, that he is. That it's one of those things where you've heard it's like first impressions are everything. And I think the one thing about the President is he has an amazing first impression where you will learn a lot about him. And I'm not talking about seeing him on TV shaking his hand and like just meeting him, you kind of get a feeling. And when I, the first time I met him, just shaking his hand in the way he said hello, I'm like, this doesn't feel like Hitler, you know, this doesn't feel like a guy who's like immediately telling his age to Wash his hand because a brother just touched it. You know what I'm saying? Because he was this race, you know, it didn't feel that way, you know, and then just being around him, I thought it was important to normalize. What is something that's very unnormal is meeting a president. You know, that's something that you never in your lifetime think will happen. And not just meeting him, but seeing like, man, how they got it so wrong, or it was such a deliberate campaign to go against somebody that they. Because he never really fights. And I talk about that a lot. Like, I'm confused by why he doesn't put up more of a fight. But then once you get to know him, you understand why he doesn't. And so. And I think we. I express that a lot in the book to where I kind of pull myself back a lot when. When talking about meeting him and understanding how different. Because we got. So can I figured the 10 things that they said about him, what four got to be right? You know what I mean? Like, you just. Law of averages. When. When someone's describing someone, you know, if someone's like, hey, this dude's this, he's this, he's this. And you meet him like, well, he wasn't as bad as that guy, but he definitely does talk a lot or whatever the. Whatever the rumor is. Of course, with the president, they were all social deviant qualities to where, like, if he had even a quarter of what he's accused of having, I think he'd be in a straitjacket somewhere. But it's just.
- [10:55]
B
Well, the other thing too, when you write about in this beginning of the book, is how he was with your family. And that, I thought was a revelation too, because he watched him relate to your daughter in a way that was like a grandfather, I think you write in the book.
- [11:08]
A
Yeah.
- [11:09]
B
And that element that you don't see a lot, but the other thing too. And again, it's a great way to kick the book off, but you're around a lot of people, a lot of politicians. They all come. They pass through on the show, wherever you happen to be. You also make a point that he was no different behind the scenes than he was. Camera, Right?
- [11:25]
A
No, that's the thing. The camera was off. He was the same guy. And people who aren't in entertainment or aren't even around that, but you still see it. You still. If you see your friends portrayal of their life on social media, it's very different than their life at home. You know, like, you know, they. Everything's great and they have filters and everything's wonderful. But they could have a broken marriage at home. You don't know. You just know what's presented in front of the thing. Well, the entertainment world or the political world, it's the same thing. It's just magnified hundreds of thousands. So when you are on camera, you have to be a certain way. And usually those who are the ones who are full of. That's a hard thing to maintain is that presence of that the Persona that they're putting that I care about every man and, you know, whatever. As soon as that camera's off, it's a release. And that's when you always see the personalities come out. Where. That's where the guy who's on TV saying he loves orphans, the camera goes off. He's like, get those kids away from me. They're disgusting. That's what you were. I was expecting to see with the President. I was expecting to see that he has this amazing ability to put it on in front of the camera and then as soon as the camera goes off, then we'll see the real President Trump. And there was no difference. And that for me, as a guy who carries himself the same way, that spoke volumes to me because I was like, he is. There is no release when people are full of shit on tv. There is a release when that camera's off. It's just a thing.
- [13:01]
B
Well, I was thinking about that too, when you first were telling me about this, that it was gonna kick the book off. And it's like I was trying to think of somebody who's been on camera more than him just in modern life. And I don't, I don't think there is anybody who is constantly, whether it's.
- [13:16]
A
Television shows, he's on a 24 hour cycle. You could not. I would. That'd be an actually interesting game to play, is if you could start from zero in your remote, change the channel, and you have to give it 20 seconds and go through every channel and see if you could make it without hearing President Trump's name. I don't think you could.
- [13:34]
B
And it's been that way for those of us that grew up in New York, like in the 70s and 80s. He was always out there, always doing something that was present where there were cameras is present. And he seems to have adopted sort of this thing where it is seamless. He's just himself because it's probably easier.
- [13:51]
A
When can he not be? Yeah, that would. And that's what we. That's what I try to show in the book is that he doesn't have the ability to camouflage anymore because there is no downtime. I mean, absolutely none. There's no place for him to let his hair down, so to speak.
- [14:07]
B
Because then he, I mean, how does it happen that he writes the forward? I mean, he doesn't do that a lot.
- [14:13]
A
And yet no. And blowing forward.
- [14:16]
B
I mean, how did that happen?
- [14:18]
A
Well, that's the crazy. I always thought, again, I'm not a journalist, but I try to have integrity. And I discussed it with you and you thought it was a good idea that we send a copy to the President's team because we reference him so much, just out of respect. That's what you're supposed to do. But I've never bashed anyone. I don't believe in cheap shots and talking about shit that's none of my business. But you want them to know that you're mentioning them. I just think it's a common courtesy. Then it was like, great, thanks. We'll let him know. We'll get it to him. And then it was literally, hey, the President loves it and he wants to write the forward to your book. And, and you're just, you're, you're like, yeah, okay, sure, sure, yeah, great. And then you're like, holy, holy shit. The President United States is writing the forward to my book. And you, because of the way today is that used to, that would normally would have been a front page news thing. Like that would have been the President. United States takes time out of his busy schedule. Like it would be something. They're like, wow, you know, and he was doing it for a black man. Again, very non Hitler esque of him to do this for a guy who doesn't even have his own show. So, you know, I'm saying there was no, there was no upside. It's not like he was going to get a big push on the Tyrus Tonight show.
- [15:43]
B
And you read the forward and it's very much in his voice. I mean, it's, you know, it's caps.
- [15:48]
A
I would not let them touch one thing on that. Do not let it at all. Because it's, it's like a letter from the President. Like, yes, I, and I shared that with the book. But that's something that, that original note will be in a frame. And then one day my grandkids will say like, why? What is that? You know, And I'm like, I interviewed the President and he wrote a forward to my book. Like they won't understand all the BS and, and the Media crap, because that will all die away. You'll just see this historic moment where, you know, I can stick my chest down, be like, yes, I. I once, you know, impressed the president. You know, you. Like you. It's. It's a thing where it's on your resume. I think over time, it becomes more valuable and more precious. It's a rose that you don't smell right away. You got to kind of. It's got to sink in. You know, there's got to be some. Some time between.
- [16:45]
B
I think, look, whatever anybody thinks of the president, I think you. They've got to give you those. That tip of the hat where it's. It's the president, the United States. And I mean, look, another thing. The book opens up as we were working on it. It was when there was a sad news about Joe Biden's health and the cancer diagnosis. And the book actually begins, look, you go at the Biden administration fairly hard, I think, objectively. But there's a note up front that says this tragic news came down and that everybody should keep him and his family.
- [17:18]
A
Right. Yeah, but that doesn't excuse. Having said that, basically, that I'm still. Because.
- [17:26]
B
But more so, we live in today where there's. And both sides do it to some degree. I think one does it more than the other, where when there's bad news about somebody, there's like this grave dancing. This. We, I mean, obviously started a lot with Charlie Kirk, which was awful, in my opinion. Where people celebrate things. You know, there used to be a time where that never existed on any level.
- [17:48]
A
The addiction of attention is maybe a whole book within itself, but it was.
- [17:53]
B
Classy to acknowledge that, look, he's still a man with a family, and you've got to have good thoughts for that, but you still have to hold people accountable for, you know.
- [18:01]
A
Right. Because I think also I was probably the first to go after the administration. I kept saying that he was not fit, that he would, you know, and I. And at one point, I even said, it's no longer. I no longer want to make jokes about the president because I feel like it's unfair in the sense that he's afflicted. It's his family that's putting him out there.
- [18:26]
B
Well, you go into that pretty hard, too. And I was gonna say, now we're in the season of books about last year's election. It started basically with Jake Tapper's book. You've had Kamala Harris book and a number of others. I think Jonathan Carle just has one out so everyone, this is the season and you've got a lot in the book about that. But yours, I was thinking about. This is the only one from outside a bubble. Those other books, it's within a political bubble, it's within a media bubble. Yours is really from the standpoint, as you're traveling the country doing your, you know, your big sold out one man shows, you're meeting a lot of people, a lot of Americans in pockets around the country that don't normally get a lot of attention. People look at your routing. It's small town America in most cases. And so you're coming at it from a standpoint, not being in a bubble, but just being out amongst the people, which is a way different point of view. And that's, I think, in this, with all these books out right now, talking about all the hand wringing about the election. Yours is unique, I think, because it's based on real on the ground sort of reporting.
- [19:29]
A
Right. Because I even talk about calling the election early. There was just big viral moment. Yeah. No. I don't know what TV was telling you, but nowhere that I had been in the country anywhere, had I seen anyone all in on Kamala, if anything it was. They would still complain about President Trump. And their argument was, well, I won't vote. That I don't think. Like, I just never was in a situation where I was traveling all over the country. And I mean, I, you know, I'm a Holiday Inn guy and Waffle House guy, get my egg whites or whatever. So it's like, I'm not. We're not out there, you know, doing five star dinners across the country. You know, we're just rolling in and out of our towns, doing our making towns, we like to say, in wrestling. But the. Everywhere I went, there was not one area where I was like, wow, this is really pro Kamala, or this is really pro. You know, it was just kind of. It was either pro Trump or I don't like Trump. There was just. She was almost an afterthought. And I was like this. The media is pushing it. And then, you know, the media also, you know, and again, this is probably closest you'll ever get me into conspiracy theories is this book. But I. I feel like they're common sense questions, not conspiracy theories. It's not, you know, it's not like wild thing about how many guys are on the grassy knoll because it looks like it was the driver, but, you know, which is crazy. How do we not see that? He just turned over. Like, no one saw that. Like what, man? Optical illusions. But to that point, you know, we're just. We're trying to keep it as, as. As real as possible, but at the same time, tell the story from a perspective that we're not going to get a job at the end of the book. Like, it's just. You might not, because it's not a. Oh, President Trump. Everything he does is wonderful. That's. That's not. It's not that kind of a book, you know, And I've been. When I do don't like something or I don't agree with something, I. I never saw a situation where I needed to just go with the flow. And I would argue after spending some time with the President, that he's not a big fan of the go to the flow guy either. He'd rather have a guy, you know, someone who has challenging ideas or bring something to the table than someone going, oh, yeah, yes, sir. Yes, sir. I mean, after a while, what's the point of having somebody around who just backs up what you say? They're not really bringing anything to the table.
- [21:55]
B
And again, I think your book is really objective, and I think that's what makes it interesting, given all the other books that are out there right now, is that you're coming at it from an experience that has not been represented. And that really is kind of, you know, in Latin, they call it vox populi, the voice of the people, you know, really being out there. And for people that have seen your shows, you mix it up with people. You get to know people in those moments, and you blow into town and meet a bunch of people, and you soak up, you know, those attitudes and opinions and a lot of that. And the book ends, actually, I love. It's like a bookend. The book opens with giving the belt to the president, but it ends with the. This sort of poetic view of the belts that make up America. You know, the Rust Belt and, you know, the Pretzel Belt, all these different belts. When you fly and you look over middle America, all the planes and those great. You see the squares and the circles just out there when you're flying. And it ties up this idea that we are a country of belts of different people in different regions that all kind of need to work together, you know, And I think that's the redemptive part of it. But get out of the book for a second. For all the political stuff in it. For me, me, it's the human stories that. That resonate. And every book you've done has got a Couple of those that are super personal. And you called one night. People that know, you know that you tend to an incredible array of aquatic creatures.
- [23:19]
A
Right.
- [23:20]
B
Of turtles and fish and eels and all these things. And one night you called, and I feel, I'm sure, you know, in a ton of pain because one of your favorite fish was going into death throws. He was? He called.
- [23:31]
A
Yeah, he was. Yeah. Well, he's 13 years old, so he was. He is one of my very first.
- [23:36]
B
Yeah, yeah. And you called and it's like, I'm listening to you and I'm like, this is one of your best friends. Obviously, you've watched this fish because you connect with these fish and these creatures and. And you've watched and do all these things that were relatable to you because of what he had been through as a male fish.
- [23:54]
A
Right, Right. Yeah. Set up his territory.
- [23:56]
B
And I'm like, we have to capture this because we know the end is near here and the loss is going to be profound. Let's, you know, let's write a bit. This is a good thing to write about. And you do. And it's like, it's a really powerful story of the relationship with a female. I don't give too much away.
- [24:14]
A
Yeah.
- [24:14]
B
But this moment at the end is. Most people I know that have read it already are in tears at the end of it because they all relate. Everyone's got one of these relationships, right. Where a dog or person or whatever.
- [24:27]
A
You feel that connection because of some of the observations broke the rules of typically what fish who pair up. Fish pair up for life in some cases, seasons in others. Or they pair up until the bird comes along. But when a pair has been together for a really long time, and in this case, he had been paired up with his mate for like, they had been. They came in together, so they'd been 13 years, basically.
- [24:54]
B
I mean, that's crazy.
- [24:56]
A
And, yeah. And so they. And I showed you videos of, I don't know how many fry. They probably had a hundred thousand babies in their lifetime that are, you know, all over the country. But.
- [25:07]
B
Well, you were docked. That was the other part, too, visually. You'd send me a little video of what was happening and what she was doing to help him and be there for him. And I was watching this thinking, this is one of those stories that we have to capture. We really do. Because in a book like this, that's about. About things that deeply affect you. You know, it's not like this is the political stuff, which is fine and interesting, and people will chew that over?
- [25:29]
A
Yeah. I just said a whole book about politics is boring to me. Like I think, I think politics affect more of our life than we probably should let it. But I think talking about, we have to talk about it as it is part of our life now like it is. It's no longer an asterisk where it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, I don't talk politics. 6. It's, it's a lot of cases. It unfortunately it ident. It's an identity now.
- [25:52]
B
It's like the playoffs are going on all the time.
- [25:54]
A
Yeah. Yeah. And I have my, my patriot pain on, you know, the entire. And there's no, there's no halftime. So just, just revved up and you're losing yourself because you're, you're taking up a fight that really doesn't need to be taken up. And I talk about in the book is like most of us who aren't in front of the camera or trying to be in front of the camera don't live our lives that way. You know, they don't stick their head out when they meet a neighbor. How'd you vote? Before we shake hands? You know, like they don't. It didn't know those were things that you just didn't care about. That was. You cared about the character of the person. I don't care how you vote. Are you a good person? You know, can, are you, can you barbecue? You know, like there's important things that you get to know people like you're, you're gonna have possibly not have a great lifetime relationship with a neighbor because every four years they vote a little different than you do.
- [26:47]
B
I know, it's this litmus test. The litmus test thing is weird. And it was never like that 20, 30 years ago. It's definitely changed.
- [26:54]
A
It's like a hyper sense of stupidity. And I'm not, and that's not party specific. It's just this, you know, where this all die hard. And it's more magnified on the, on the extreme left because they're in such a low power position that they're desperate and you know, on. But you also see it on the right with the extremism or the absolutism or someone who's different than them.
- [27:19]
B
You know, I mean the thing we mentioned with Charlie Kirk, I was like a lot of people very appalled at the glee some people felt. But like the other day, in terms of timing, whenever people watched us when former Vice president Dick Cheney passed away and I saw comments about Liz Cheney and it's like come on, really. I mean, mean, it's just somebody passes away. Just respect that. If you have nothing positive to just shut up. You know, it's. This is ridiculous.
- [27:44]
A
It's that comet, that thrill or whatever it is that they think they've shocked the world. The stock market dropped two points because you threw shade on a man who, who lived various whether you liked him or not, a powerful successful life. He had a powerful successful family. You don't have to. To agree with their political stances to say, you know, sorry for your loss and rest in peace.
- [28:06]
B
Yeah.
- [28:08]
A
This idea that somehow calling. I always said it always says more about them.
- [28:12]
B
Absolutely.
- [28:13]
A
To where the, the only time you could muster the courage to talk about somebody is when they're gone. You can't be any more bigger coward than that. A man has passed and now you have, now you have the microphone. You know. And so that's why I always kind of. I always say the same thing and know you, you've heard me say this. I know what you cheer for. You know, your booze give me self esteem. And so people say things and they go after you. And the worst thing is when you, you turn it back around them. And that's one of the things. And this was actually your brainstorm was because I was like tired of the Hitler stuff and like let's just define what Hitler was. Let's just have a whole chapter, two chapters to actually explain in case those who missed the memoir on what he was and, and how far miles upon miles atmospheres that President Trump or the Republican Party or anyone is remotely close to this dude. Like it's, it's really. The tragedy is watering down one of the most destructive, dangerous periods of our history.
- [29:24]
B
Yeah.
- [29:26]
A
That should be an asterisk to where we should all understand that history to a T to ensure it doesn't happen again. Not use it because you can't win an election. Like to me that's.
- [29:38]
B
You can hate the president, you can be hypercritical. But to take the Hitler model and drop that grid on. Yeah. I think most people in history know that's preposterous. But it's become a thing. You know, it's become a deeply embraced thing. And you write again. There's not one but two chapters. It's like needed to be hit twice in this book.
- [29:58]
A
Yeah. You know, out of control.
- [29:59]
B
It's gone.
- [30:00]
A
Because what it is is the accountability of, of your words and actions are not present anymore because you do it in a little camera and you post it that you can't you're not going to walk up to a group of people who disagree with you and fire off that stuff that they do because there's, there might be real life consequences. You might get your ass kicked or you might lose the argument. They might be like, oh, is that it? It. So they do it. They post it. That's the thrill. Ha. I told you. And then when they get the comments back, if they don't like it, what do they do? They block it. So it's, it's literally, it's the most cowardly thing a person can do. Somebody passes and then all of a sudden you got all this to say, you know, like, oh, yeah, how convenient. How, how convenient. Yeah, now you can talk about him because you can't rebut. And most of you. When I do. And it was situations when a person of merit or fame or accomplishment dies, it's always the ones who aren't doing that have so much to say. You never hear, you know, like, it's always people who have accomplished little or nothing because they spend so much time watching everybody else. But I guess that's why they have so much to say because they're an observer. And, and we, and I do talk about. It's. I, I think it's better to know less of what's on TV and more what's going on in your world.
- [31:25]
B
Yeah.
- [31:26]
A
You know, like it's in the book.
- [31:27]
B
There's another thing in the book that, that we talked about a lot that with the first two books, you didn't want to do specifically, but something changed this time. And that's writing about fatherhood.
- [31:38]
A
Yeah.
- [31:40]
B
What made you. Because I still wonder, like, why did you, you finally decide that this was worth writing about in a way that's really personal, you know, because you take, you know, we talk about kind of owning your behavior. You go into that in this chapter.
- [31:54]
A
Yeah, I'm not, I'm definitely not writing a love letter to myself. And I think a lot of times, because you, when you do things the non traditional. That wasn't the plan. You know, you know, the, the plan is for most of us is you married one person and you have a family, you know, and then, you know, then the kids leave the nest and you grow old together. And then hopefully she goes, you go before she does because, you know, you won't be able to do anything without her when she's gone. And I mean, that's the plan. Like, that's the American plan. You retire, you raise your. When you, when things in life happen, that are not the plan. Like getting three women pregnant in a year. You have. You. You one. You have to accept it, which is not an easy thing to do. Then you have to. Now, accepting and owning are two different things, and you got to own it. And you have to. You have to be able to not talk about it in shame format because the result of that is you have three beautiful children. So you have to now change what is a bar joke basically, into a meaningful, mentally meaningful part in your life to where you can convey to your children, you know, that they were not a mistake or. Or whatever. There's a. There's a way to. You have to show that they matter. Originally, when I wrote the other books, my children were too young. I think was my. I didn't want to discuss it. The other thing, too, is privacy. You know, I don't. You know, it's not. It's not something that I wanted my. My kids picked and poked at by people who connect us. That's why, you know, people don't have a connection to where my kids live and things like that and names and last names and. Because it's. That's personal. And not all my kids like tv. The fact that, you know, their dad's on TV and they want to have normal lives and they don't want people in their business and they don't want people coming up to them saying, hey, did your dad do this? And did you that, you know, or I heard this or that. So that was always my concern, was that I didn't want a stranger on the street discussing my children's lives with them, because that's very. That's. I always said it'll be up to them when I tell the story, because it's their story, and if they don't want me to tell that story, I'm not going to. I also understand and I talk about there is. There will be consequences, there will be anger, you know, And I think one of the things I talk about as a dad is nobody said it came with smiles and bells and awards. It's a responsibility. It's a duty. It's not the accoutrement of. The other stuff is irrelevant. Doesn't matter if you like the mom, you know, it doesn't matter if she's unreasonable. You got to eat it, you know, because that's what a father does. So. So I'm highly critical in the sense. But it's also like a pep talk. I think I felt in a lot of ways, you know, like, it's not going to be easy, you're gonna have to make tough decisions. You know, there are things that you have to sacrifice.
- [35:16]
B
It's a brutally honest chapter. It really is. It's, again, it's one of those things where you could. I don't imagine you could have done that in one of the first two books. And it's this evidence that the more you do this, the deeper you're going. And on that note, I mean, when you. Your first book, I would argue now several years later, you're a lot more well known. You know, you've been out there in the public. And there's a chapter in there about the waning effect of celebrity on politics. Talk about that a little, because that was, you know, the election cycle. There were a lot of celebrities stepping up that didn't really appear. There was a time where that would have made a big difference. I think it would have, but it doesn't anymore. What do you happen where celebrities don't connect on that level anymore?
- [35:55]
A
Well, because there's no. They're not celebrities anymore. Like, it's not the same thing. It's. It was movie stars that spoke when John Wayne spoke, because there was only one John Wayne. Celebrities, they overplayed their hand. Once they got political, they got normal. You're not, you know, if. If back in the day, if Dean Martin came out and said, I support Ronald Reagan, people would be like, wow. You know, because it was unheard of.
- [36:24]
B
It was Frank Sinatra and jfk.
- [36:26]
A
Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was. It was just these big, bigger than life Personas. Social media has watered down the celebrity status. People will know who an influencer is more than necessarily who their favorite actress is in a Harry Potter flick or, you know, like, the allure has gone now. The older generation of celebrities, they seem to think they still have that, where they can come out and say, vote this way. The problem is, is that everyday Americans see how you live your life. They see all the things you have have. You know, it's not like before where it was like, very protected. You know, you just knew they lived in Hollywood Hills. You had. You had fantasies about their lives. I mean, they were able to look, Rock Hudson, Liberace. They were able to live these completely different lives than what you saw in front of the camera because there was a level of protection and mystery. That's all gone. So when a celebrity comes out and makes these, these, oh, we got to do this. And the average person looks at them like, wait a minute, you have. Have a security force. You live in a gated Name. You have a mansion, two of them. You know, like, you have FU money. And you're telling me how to vote. And it's not just. It's not even a. With a reason. It's. It's almost an attack. If you don't vote, you know, don't watch my movies. You know, when I think. When I. And I talk, I think there's a lot of. A lot of actors that overplayed their hand. They.
- [37:56]
B
They, you know, and musicians and other celebrities and.
- [37:58]
A
But once they cross that line and once you pick the team, you got nowhere to go when it's over.
- [38:04]
B
You split your audience for one thing, too.
- [38:07]
A
I mean, and then eventually it's going to change and then you can't go back. I think we're seeing a lot of that now that people are trying to go back. Celebs that. Who picked a side and now they're trying to go back. And it's not an easy. It's not because you're a hypocrite.
- [38:23]
B
There's a chapter in here called Silver Foxes and the Wisdom of Experience. I spoke to a group yesterday about a few things and your name came up talking about this new book. And it was an older group of. It was a women's group. And, you know, you write in the book about when you're on the road, you do have this kind of core audience. It's a little bit older, wiser, mature. And there's a really nice chapter in the book about what you learn, the advice you get from sort of the older set when you go out. Has that been an unusual connection for you?
- [38:53]
A
Yeah, that's.
- [38:54]
B
That would be like a spot audience, no. Would you see elderly people wearing the gold chains at the shows?
- [39:01]
A
Well, the thing. But here's the thing. The more I think about it, they're not that much elderly. The older I get, you know, they're just. They're more peers. I think not everyone ages as graciously as I have, but the older. I call them silver foxes as a term of affection, because they are very affectionate and positive. When they see me, it's always, hey, Tyrus, I love you. I love you. Doing the show last for a hug or a picture. So. And they're very, like, cheerful and positive. So it's like. It's like they're almost like. Like you're a rock star and they're still cheering for you. It's a weird. It's a very different thing. It's a very positive thing and it's cute. It was Weird to me, but it.
- [39:47]
B
But five years old and she was saying to me, I've never heard common sense from anybody. I love Tyrus. I would give Tyrus a big hug if he was here right now.
- [39:57]
A
Yeah, that's it. So I get that a lot. And it just, it cracks me up because it's never, they never say like, hey man, you're brilliant. Like you, what you said the other day, wow, mind blown. It's like you just make sense. You're talking away, you make sense. It's like, like it's the greatest C compliment ever. But it's like, but it's something that we like. You say something and it makes sense to me. So it, it, it's, it's not sexy. You know, I'm not like they're not going to say I'm giving Peterson a run for his money with profound statements, but they're like, if, if he does say something, I'll turn to Tyrus and say, what does it mean? So like that's kind of what I've become, an interpreter, so to speak, of just plain.
- [40:41]
B
But I was going to say the cliche though, of common sense not being common anymore with you, it becomes a big deal. That becomes like your currency because people crave common sense, you know, at the end of it all in the world that is really kind of off the rails right now. A little common sense goes a long way. And I think that's why in this book, getting back to the new book, it's like it's every page, there's common sense. Whether you agree or not. It's still sensible thinking. It's fair minded. It's do your job, be accountable. I mean, again, there's a thing in there on term limits, I think one of my favorite chapters, it's not about right or left. It's about old and young and what people need to start thinking about in terms of anybody's capacity in their late 70s or 80s or whatever. And it's just something as a nation we should really think about, about where's, you know, where's the young blood? You know, it's like the old athlete that refuses to retire and give up that slot for, for the next generation. I know you get used to this stuff. You like the perks, you like all that. But at a certain point, if you don't start thinking about what's behind.
- [41:47]
A
Yeah, it should. Someone should be able to say, hey, you know, it happens in sports. Manager puts his hand on your shoulder, says, I need the ball, kid. Like, yeah, you Know, this is it. And we need that desperately in politics. I think it would clean it up too. I think if you couldn't have a career there, I, I don't think we'd see the level of corruption because it would be. You don't have time. And it would attract people there to do a service, not serve themselves, I think. And we, and we discussed that a lot in the book.
- [42:15]
B
I know favor to ask you before we wrap up is I teach a lot of memo writing classes to people watching right now. You've been through this probably three times now, and I think there's still more to come. And you dig deeper and deeper and deeper. What advice do you give to somebody, somebody watching right now, thinking about writing their story, thinking about maybe putting pen to paper to document their life and make sense of it. Given what you've been through now with me these last five years, what do you say to people about what the experience is like and hopefully why they. You think they should do it?
- [42:46]
A
Well, the first thing, if you can get a writing coach, take a writing class. No, no, I'm serious. It, it. It's.
- [42:55]
B
Kindred spirits are good.
- [42:57]
A
Yeah, yeah. Surround yourself with, with people who are. Or thinking that way, or open thinkers. Because writing a book is not something that you just start writing chapter one and you kind of go from there. So you have to, I think, write down whatever your thoughts are. Like, just if I'm gonna write a book, write 10 things down a day that you're gonna do, even if you don't do any of them. But just the process of just writing down your thoughts. And then don't try to chronologically tell your story. Tell your story in the moment. If it hits you, a memory hits you, you smell a blueberry muffin, reminds you of something, and you write it down. You had a fight or whatever it is. Just be in the moment with your pencil and doesn't matter if you write it down, you type it just all your thoughts together and then organize your thoughts once they're down. Because there's nothing worse than having an epiphany or an idea and be like, well, wait, hold on, on, I gotta get there first. And then you lose. You lose it in the moment. So it's a lot of times if I have something hit me profound, I would write it down immediately and I would send it. And then Chris would be like, all right, well, we'll find to put this somewhere. Like, we'll figure out a way to meld this. It's like you're taking Giant pieces of gold. And you're trying to mold into this. This belt. Okay. But you're. When you get a piece, you. You gotta mold it. You can't hold on to it because.
- [44:21]
B
You'Ll even know where it goes yet.
- [44:23]
A
Yeah. And sometimes it might not fit, you know, but it's just the process.
- [44:26]
B
At least you'll. You'll try and figure it out later.
- [44:28]
A
You can figure it out later, but you gotta. You definitely need to just write. Just write. It doesn't matter. Just get it off your. Your chest. Memoir or. Or diary or whatever. Just get ideas off. Use your little notes on your phone. You have a funny thought or something crosses your mind, write it down. Down. Put it down there. Because if you do that enough, you'll be in a situation one day where you're like, I've got six chapters of thoughts here. And it just. And all of a sudden, it was just like a puzzle just kind of molds into a story.
- [44:58]
B
Look at you, man. You're going to be teaching and coaching yourself.
- [45:00]
A
Yeah. Good luck. Last thing I need is another job. But hey, man, I appreciate our time today. Hey, and if. And if someone is looking to take. And I'm telling you, I'm not. Just. I'm not an easy guy to work with, and this dude has enough patience to. To keep working with me. But I have attended his classes. They are very fun, different. If anything else, you hear some really cool ideas and expressions, and it's a lot of fun. So if someone was looking to take one of your classes or get more information, we're going to find you, Chris.
- [45:31]
B
They can go to chrisepting.com and they can write me directly off of that. I do online things and in person things in Southern California, where I live. And also there's lots of ways to get to it. And it's always good to hear from people that are ready to embark on these kinds of journeys, these storytelling journeys, which, whether you get published or not, it almost doesn't matter. It's just the. The exercise of doing it. I think it's healthy.
- [45:55]
A
I think it's good for your soul. I think it's your mental health, too. A lot of times when you can put experiences down on a piece of paper, it's a good way to close a chapter or understand it better.
- [46:03]
B
Absolutely.
- [46:04]
A
All right, man.
- [46:05]
B
We did it.
- [46:06]
A
Oh, yeah. Thank you. Yeah. That's right. November 11th. If it's already passed November 11th, you better have had it already. But yeah. Thank you, man. Again, forward by the president. And I'm very excited. And this time I'm in color, which is always. Which is always nice.
- [46:19]
B
But I'm looking forward to the next one, man.
- [46:20]
A
Yes, sir. Till next time.