Jonathan Alpert: "Therapy Nation" author on Trump Derangement Syndrome

Summary

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Pod Force One – Jonathan Alpert on “Therapy Nation” and Trump Derangement Syndrome

Host: Lydia Moynihan (New York Post)
Guest: Jonathan Alpert, Psychotherapist and Author of Therapy Nation
Date: June 19, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth conversation between Lydia Moynihan and renowned psychotherapist Jonathan Alpert, who discusses the rise of “therapy culture” in America, the infiltration of politics into mental health professions, and the phenomenon he calls “Trump Derangement Syndrome.” Alpert shares his critique of modern therapy practices, the problematic ubiquity of therapy-speak, and how the culture of grievance and lack of personal accountability is affecting both individuals and society.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Rise and Problems of “Therapy Culture”

• The proliferation of therapy and self-prioritization has, in Alpert’s view, led to an epidemic of self-obsession and lack of real mental health progress.
  • “People are putting themselves way ahead of everyone else. And it’s become so obnoxious. Whether you’re on dating apps or anywhere online, it’s all about themselves. It’s all about therapy.” (Jonathan Alpert, 01:02)
• Alpert’s inspiration for his latest book stems from backlash he received over a 2012 NYT op-ed criticizing the cycle of unproductive, endless therapy.
  • “I talked about how people were in therapy forever… venting, getting stuff off their chest, and then going back in six days or 13 days and doing it all over again. But it really wasn’t helping them to become better people.” (Jonathan Alpert, 01:29-01:53)
  • He faced attacks from colleagues and even attempts to have his license revoked.

Politics and Partisanship in Therapy

• Alpert points out a concerning trend: therapists screening patients based on political beliefs or vaccination status, even for remote sessions.
  • “I know therapists who refuse to treat someone if they voted for Trump… Even during COVID…I knew of therapists who refused to treat someone if they weren’t vaccinated. All sessions were remote.” (03:02-03:18)
• This politicization has invaded many aspects of mental health practice, in Alpert’s view, often creating an unethical environment.

The Ubiquity and Misuse of “Therapy-Speak”

• Terms like “toxic,” “narcissist,” “borderline,” and “bipolar” are misused by both therapists and social media influencers, leading to widespread mislabeling and unhealthy perceptions.
  • “We have therapists who are using terms like narcissist, toxic, borderline, bipolar, inaccurately… And then people go out into the world and they say, well, you know, he’s borderline… It’s just creating a very unhealthy society.” (Jonathan Alpert, 04:12-04:42)

Therapy’s Role in Social and Cultural Division

• Encouragement to “set boundaries” and “protect your peace” has morphed into instructions to cut off family or friends over political disagreements.
  • “We have people instructing people on national TV, mental health professionals telling people, if you don’t like the way someone voted, just cut them out of your life.” (Jonathan Alpert, 05:11-05:24)
• Alpert prefers an apolitical approach, stressing that friends and family should matter more than political disagreements.

The Culture of Victimhood & Grievance

• There is a growing focus on victimhood, lack of personal responsibility, and grievance-mongering—sometimes with violent outcomes.
  • Discusses high-profile cases like Luigi Mangione and everyday acts of minor theft, justified as entitlements (“microluting”).
  • “It creates this environment where people think it’s okay, they can get away with it. And not only that, it’s owed to them…” (Jonathan Alpert, 07:05-07:24)
• Therapy culture, in part, encourages blaming outside forces over personal accountability.

Therapy as a Business Model

• Alpert asserts that the business model of therapy sometimes incentivizes indefinite sessions rather than actual improvement.
  • “People should have very clear goals, work towards them, and then graduate from therapy. That’s the model I’ve always used.” (Jonathan Alpert, 08:32-08:42)
• Many therapists, he claims, perpetuate dependence for financial reasons, preventing true progress.

Therapy’s Contribution to Political Polarization

• Therapists, especially those in liberal-leaning regions and professional groups, sometimes explicitly promote political views and foster division.
  • “I belong to a few network professional networking groups and…I mean the things that I see posted, you would actually think that Trump was Hitler…They had emergency sessions…to cope with the aftermath of the election…” (Jonathan Alpert, 11:50-12:30)
• Tells the story of a patient chastised by a couples therapist for posting an iconic Trump photo and being told to volunteer for Kamala Harris’s campaign (12:40).

Grad Schools and the Social Justice Mentality

• Alpert blames graduate school programs for molding “social justice warriors” rather than clinicians, teaching oppression-based models rather than mental health fundamentals.
  • “They’re actually creating social justice warriors first, not clinicians…They’re learning models of oppressed, oppressor.” (Jonathan Alpert, 13:18-13:53)
• Alpert describes himself as a rare moderate/conservative in the field, often ostracized for his views.

Therapists’ Impact on Escalating Political Violence

• Some therapists, according to Alpert, join in or justify grievance-based violence.
  • “I’ve had multiple conversations with therapists who, well, I don’t think the guy should have been killed, but we have such problems in the health insurance industry, so I can understand why he did that. That’s not what you should be saying as a therapist.” (Jonathan Alpert, 15:03-15:19)
• Alpert sees this as “fueling the fire” for more radicalism and less accountability.

The Role and Risks of AI Therapy

• AI therapy chatbots may sometimes offer more actionable solutions but come with significant drawbacks like cognitive atrophy and tragic outcomes.
  • “That AI therapist might be more effective than a real therapist. They…give very straight plan: This is how you get from point A to point B. And a lot of therapists don’t do that.” (Jonathan Alpert, 17:00-17:13)
  • Warns about overreliance on AI and subsequent loss of problem-solving ability (17:35).

Solutions: A Return to Clinical Basics

• Alpert advocates for refocusing on diagnosing and treating mental health, avoiding endless categorization along identity lines.
  • “We need to really get back to treating mental health disorders and stop the nonsense, or all this woke nonsense. Putting people into categories.” (Jonathan Alpert, 18:17-18:33)
  • Shares patient anecdotes where therapists ignored presenting problems in favor of focusing solely on identity factors like race or sexuality (18:40-19:00).
• Calls for a realignment of therapy goals towards improving anxiety, stress, depression, and personal growth.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Therapy Culture’s Downside:
  “And that’s the problem. People are putting themselves way ahead of everyone else. And it’s become so obnoxious.” (Jonathan Alpert, 01:02)
• On Political Bias in Therapy:
  “Can you imagine going into the ER with a medical emergency and being turned down if you were wearing a MAGA hat? To me it’s unethical and highly, highly unprofessional.” (Jonathan Alpert, 02:53)
• On Therapy Words Permeating Society:
  “They’re labeling people with these real clinical terms...It’s just creating a very unhealthy society.” (Jonathan Alpert, 04:28)
• On Grievance and Victimhood:
  “There’s a complete lack of accountability. And what we have, we've seen over the past few years is this grievance culture.” (Jonathan Alpert, 06:12)
• On The Industry Itself:
  “Whereas these therapists who keep people in therapy forever…they might be making money, but I don’t think they're helping people to be healthier.” (Jonathan Alpert, 08:46)
• On Grad School Influence:
  “They’re actually creating social justice warriors first, not clinicians…They’re learning these models of oppressed, oppressor…they’re not really learning about symptoms and pathology.” (Jonathan Alpert, 13:20-13:45)
• On Solutions:
  “We need to stop focusing on some of these issues and get back to what actually brings someone into therapy. Anxiety, stress management, depression, and people trying to improve their lives.” (Jonathan Alpert, 18:50)

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Segment Timestamps

| Timestamp | Topic | |-----------|-------| | 00:24 | Introduction to Jonathan Alpert and his book | | 01:02 | The problem with modern therapy culture | | 03:02 | Politics infiltrating therapy practice | | 04:12 | Proliferation of therapy language | | 05:11 | Encouragement to sever ties over politics | | 06:12 | Rise of grievance/victimhood culture | | 07:05 | “Microluting” and entitlement mindset | | 08:09 | Business incentives in therapy | | 09:24 | Difference between feeling good and getting better | | 11:30 | Therapy’s role in political polarization | | 13:18 | Social justice-oriented grad school curricula | | 15:03 | Therapy’s role in justifying grievances/violence | | 16:14 | Prevalence of “social justice warrior” therapists | | 17:00 | Role of AI in mental health | | 18:17 | Solutions: return to fundamentals |

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Concluding Thoughts

In this engaging and candid episode, Jonathan Alpert offers a robust critique of where therapy culture has gone off the rails: politicized professionals, a culture of victimhood, and an overemphasis on identity politics over concrete mental health improvement. He calls for a return to clinical basics and personal accountability, warning against both indefinite therapy and the potentially dehumanizing effects of AI-based solutions.

For those concerned about the intersection of mental health, politics, and culture, this episode is a thought-provoking listen that challenges the status quo of the current mental health landscape.

Transcript

[A]

Hello, it's Miranda. This week I have another bonus episode for you. My terrific New York Post colleague Lydia Moynihan spoke with Jonathan Alpert, a renowned psychotherapist who believes Trump derangement Syndrome has become a real epidemic in the United States. Please take a listen to this special episode of Pod Force One.

[B]

Jonathan Alpert, psychotherapist and author of the new book Therapy Nation. Jonathan, thank you so much for. For joining us today. And this book is coming at such an interesting moment in the culture where I think people are getting sick of this therapy culture. There was this. This post that went viral a couple months ago that everyone was talking about. It's the worst person, you know, is in therapy right now being told they need to put themselves first. And I think it captures a lot of frustration people have in this moment. So what was it about right now that made you think, okay, this is the book that people need. What made you want to write this book at this moment?

[C]

Yeah, and that's the problem. People are putting themselves way ahead of everyone else. And it's become so obnoxious. So whether you're on dating apps or anywhere online, it's all about themselves. It's all about therapy. So it's become so obnoxious. And I think to understand why I wrote the book, we have to go back to 2012, when I wrote an op ed piece for the New York Times called In Therapy Forever. Enough already. And in that piece, I talked about how people were in therapy forever. They were going weekly for a year, 2, 10, 20 years, and they weren't getting better. They were just going in, venting, getting stuff off their chest, and then going back in six days or 13 days and doing it all over again. So in the moment, it feels good. We all need to get stuff off our chest and vent, but it really wasn't helping them to become better people, healthier people, like, mentally healthier. So the article, the backlash from that article was huge. People from around the world attacked me. Therapists, my own colleagues attacked me. How could you possibly have written something like that? I had colleagues who tried to get my license revoked. An NYU commencement speaker talked all about Alpert, how don't let Alpert ruin our profession. And all I really was calling for was to make therapy more effective so people could actually graduate from therapy. So. So that's really the. That was really the inspiration for the book. But then as I got into writing it, I realized that this therapy thing is, like, way beyond therapy. It affects relationships, the politics that has entered the therapy office is absolutely nuts. I know therapists who refuse to treat someone if they voted for Trump. I know therapists who they know is that for the screening, you know, it's just part of the craziness that's in far left leaning therapists. Can you imagine going into the ER with a medical emergency and being turned down if you were wearing a MAGA hat? To me it's unethical and highly, highly unprofessional. Even during COVID I knew of therapists who refused to treat someone if they weren't vaccinated. So keep in mind all sessions were remote. You can't possibly catch COVID through the camera.

[B]

Even though it was remote, they refused to treat people who weren't vaccinated.

[C]

Right, right. So we've seen how politics, what was

[B]

the reasoning for that? They just thought it was, you're a bad person if you don't get the vaccine.

[C]

Absolutely. So we've seen how like politics has just invaded every aspect of American life, especially my profession.

[B]

But I mean it's, it's so interesting, the sort of politicization then of therapy. And I want to get to that in a moment. But I'm also just curious, sort of the language of therapy has become so ubiquitous now. When people describe scenarios they're toxic or narcissistic, there's all these sort of therapy words. What is that coming from? And how has that changed the way that people perceive themselves and others?

[C]

Yeah, and that really comes from my colleagues, my profession. We have therapists who are using terms like narcissist, toxic, borderline, bipolar, inaccurately. They're labeling people with these real clinical terms. And then people go out into the world and they say, well, you know, he's borderline or he's bipolar. My boss is toxic. And it's just creating a very unhealthy society. And we also have people online, so called influencers who will put things out there, you know, five things to look for, to know if you're girlfriend's borderline, or to know if your boyfriend's a narcissist. And none of this is helping us to become healthier people and making our society better. I would argue it's making us much, much worse.

[B]

Yeah. And another trend, sort of on the micro level as well, is therapists pushing people to cut off family members, to cut off friends. Where is that coming from?

[C]

Well, and that's all part of this. Protect your peace, set boundaries. And you know, we have people instructing people on national tv, mental health professionals telling People, if you don't like the way someone voted, just cut them out of your life. There was someone on MSNBC saying just that during the election, just after the election. And that's not the advice that I would give. I always tell people, you need to be above politics. Friends and family should never, never be second or, I'm sorry, should always be more important than politics or President Trump or Biden. But instead, we have people who are staying up at night absolutely obsessed with and consumed by Trump to the point where they want him dead.

[B]

Yeah. And, I mean, it's sort of created this culture, too, of lacking personal responsibility. People see themselves more as victims, and it seems like that's also encouraged in a lot of therapy.

[C]

Yeah, absolutely. So there's a complete lack of accountability. And what we have, we've seen over the past few years is this grievance culture. And I think Luigi Mangione is probably the best example of this. He's the poster boy for this. You know, he had issues with the insurance company like most of us do, but for him, he felt it was his. His right, his duty to take matters into his own hands and gun down the CEO of United Healthcare. But we see it in smaller ways. Just the other day, I was at Duane Reed and I witnessed someone go in, take a huge fan off the shelf in a box and steal it. He felt he's entitled to do that. We have politicians who think it's okay to steal. We have celebrities, we have politicians.

[B]

Called microluting. That's the new phrase, microluding.

[C]

That's what they call it. So what happens is it creates this environment where people think it's okay they can get away with it. And not only that, it's owed to them. Like, it's their right to steal from Whole Foods or Duane Reade or wherever. So then it just escalates into bigger crimes like we've seen play out. And, yeah, plenty of therapists support this. They think it's okay this shifts to

[B]

away from personal responsibility. Do you think therapy culture is what's leading that?

[C]

In part, yeah, absolutely. I think therapists are very quick to blame everyone but the person sitting in front of them. So, of course, it's not your fault that you're not performing well at work. Of course it's not your fault that you're not reaching your goals. It's everyone else's fault. And, you know, we see this accommodation culture start early, where people get awards and medals for finishing last. And that just follows us as we, you know, advance and grow Older.

[B]

And I mean, in a way, is this just sort of by nature of the business model? Because obviously you want your client to keep coming back to you. That's how you make your money. And I would imagine if you're discharging clients regularly, it's tough to find new people. Is that just sort of by nature of how people are incentivized in this industry, or is there something else?

[C]

Well, you raise a very good point. And in that op ed piece that I wrote, I talked about how people should have very clear goals, work towards them, and then graduate from therapy. And that's the model that I've always used. And I've relied on word of mouth and doing a good job and hopefully people wanting to see me. Whereas these therapists who keep people in therapy forever, like lifelong patients, you know, they might be making money, but I don't think they're helping people to be healthier.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, there is a balance. I mean, I know people who've probably spent half a million dollars on therapy. There is a balance. Some people like having that sounding board. But what you're getting at is something pernicious. It's something sort of in the ideology of refusing to take personal responsibility. Do you separate those two things?

[C]

Yeah, absolutely. If a patient comes to me and they're, they're having complaints, they're not reaching career goals or personal goals, I'm not going to look at everyone around them and say, well, it's their fault. I'm going to look very closely at what they're doing and how they might actually make some changes to improve. But it's also important to make note, there's a big difference between feeling good and actually getting better. And a lot of these therapists, they'll just listen, nod their head, aha. How does that make you feel? Bs and it might feel good in the moment, but it's not making the, or helping the person to actually get better. And I think when you look at old school analysis, you know, Woody Allen is probably the perfect example of someone who's been in therapy forever. And we all know he's probably not the healthiest person. Hey, Bill O'Reilly here. Please check out my new interview series. We'll do it live. Each Thursday, I sit down with the most influential people in America. We're a no spin chat, no script. Anything could happen you can find. We'll do it live on BillOriley.com, youTube or wherever you download your podcast.

[A]

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[B]

I want to talk about some of the societal impact you know you were alluding to Ms. Now hosts telling people cut off your family. How do you think the therapy speak and therapists, what kind of role do you think they're playing in the political divisions that we see today?

[C]

I think therapists are fueling the division. They're very quick to judge people based on how they vote. I belong to a few network professional networking groups and I mean the things that I see posted, you would actually think that Trump was Hitler and killing people. They had emergency sessions. They were offering free sessions to people on how to cope with the aftermath of the election or how they're going to face the next four years. You would actually think there a national crisis unfolding in our country. I mean, God, I had a patient, he gave me permission to tell the story. He posted a picture up of the iconic photo of Trump getting up after Butler girlfriend saw was not happy. They ended up going to their couple's therapist and the couple's therapist made him feel like there was something wrong with him, like he was sick. And she said you need to go out there, volunteer for the Kamala Harris campaign. You need to do something to make up for this. And this guy's not a very political person. He just thought it was a iconic photo and was a cool photo worth posting online. So that's a good example of how sick therapists have become.

[B]

I'm curious what gave rise to this because this obviously isn't happening in a vacuum. How do we get to this place where therapists are sort of universally liberal?

[C]

Yeah. And I think we have to go back to grad schools and if you look at the training programs and curriculum, they're actually creating social justice warriors first, not clinicians. When I went to school, I learned how to diagnose mental health disorders, whether it's depression, anxiety and the like. Now when people go to school they, they learn these models of oppressed oppressor. Rich are bad, poor, need to be elevated and helped. So they're not really learning about symptoms and pathology. They're learning about all sorts of social justice nonsense. The same things that we see play out on the streets on any given weekend in New York City, in any one of the riots that seem to be happening. So grad schools I think are largely responsible for this. But also my field just attracts left leaning people. I'm probably one of the very few that's more moderate or conservative therapist out there. And in many ways I've been ostracized from my profession. I mentioned the networking groups that I belong to. At one point I posted up an article that I wrote and I got absolutely attacked by the people on the group. Well, what do you know? You're a white guy. How can you possibly know anything about this? So you can see how quickly they attack someone's color, skin color, instead of looking at what I was actually saying.

[B]

Yeah. Wow. And, and I mean the political violence that we're seeing. You mentioned Luigi Mangione, some of these protests, the riots. Do you think that therapy has played a role in all of that?

[C]

I do. And I do think that's part of the grievance culture where therapists will join the fight. I've had multiple conversations with therapists who, well, I don't think the guy should have been killed, but we have such problems in the health insurance industry, so I can understand why he did that. That's not what you should be saying as a therapist. There's absolutely no scenario where you should be supporting that act. So therapists join the fight. I mean, they're out there creating part of the problem here.

[B]

So I mean, creating permission structures for, for violence.

[C]

Oh, absolutely, yeah, yeah, they're, they're fueling this fire. They're creating little mans. When you, you know, when you start to blame the world for your patients problems instead of talking about accountability and how to be autonomous, then you're just, you're creating monsters. And you know, I am afraid of where we're going as a country if, if no one's taking responsibility.

[B]

What percent of therapists do you think are social justice warriors?

[C]

That's a great question. You know, if I had to guess, probably at least half, you know, they're using their office as a way to promote their, their craziness and judge people based on their political beliefs or who they voted for. So I'd say probably at least half. I practice in New York and D.C. and you know, just bash of liberal voters. So I see a lot of it.

[B]

Yeah. And I'm curious. I mean, AI is sort of changing the game now. A lot of people are choosing to have these conversations with chat bots rather than humans, which, what, a lot of cons there. And yet maybe there's some pros too. What, what role do you think AI is going to be playing in this?

[C]

Well, in some ways, that AI therapist might be more effective than a real therapist. They, they, you know, AI tends to give like, very str

[B]

plan.

[C]

This is how you get from point A to point B. And a lot of therapists don't do that. That said, I think AI can be a huge problem. I think it's misguiding people. We've all seen stories of tragic stories of people who have taken their own life because of AI. They've sought therapy through AI. But I think the other issue is AI is creating what I would call almost like a cognitive atrophy, where people aren't thinking, they're not using their brains, and they're just relying on this machine to give them answers. So we're losing like that ability to be analytical and really formulate a plan to solve problems.

[B]

Yeah. Well, I, I want to end, though, on a hopeful note. You're. You're a doctor, can prescribe solutions, right?

[C]

A psychotherapist.

[B]

Psychotherapist, Sorry, I mean, that's, I a medical professional. That was, that was a more inclusive term that I should have used. What, what can be done to remedy this issue? What, what do you think you'd like to see happen and what are the solutions here?

[C]

Yeah, that's a great question. I do think we need to really get back to treating mental health disorders and stop the nonsense, or all this woke nonsense. Putting people into categories. Therapists love to put people into categories. Black, white, trans, gay, straight. In my book, I tell a few stories, one of which was a patient who sought help for some workplace stress. He happened to be black, and the therapist just harped on him being black. You must have issues because you're black. Society must treat you one way because you're black. In another story, a gay man similar just wanted some help with anxiety and stress. The therapist would not move away from him being gay. So we need to stop focusing on some of these issues and get back to what actually brings someone into therapy. Anxiety, stress management, depression, and people trying to improve their lives. And I'm afraid until we do, we're going to have much more of the same where people become really almost like tribal and divided and we've seen this division play out in our country and it's not pretty.

[B]

Yeah. Actually solve the issues instead of naming more problems that people may have. Well, this has been such an interesting conversation. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for taking the time and yeah, thank you Lydia. It's a great read.

[C]

Thank you. I appreciate it.

[B]

Wonderful. See you soon. Thanks Jonathan. Thanks so much for joining me. Miranda will be back on Monday with another minisode

[C]

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