Pod Force One – Episode Summary
Podcast: Pod Force One
Host: Miranda Devine (New York Post)
Guest: Vivek Ramaswamy
Episode: Vivek Ramaswamy reveals his shocking school bullying story and what he learned from Elon Musk
Date: September 24, 2025
Episode Overview
Miranda Devine sits down with Vivek Ramaswamy, former presidential candidate, entrepreneur, and current Ohio gubernatorial candidate. They discuss his experiences growing up in public schools, his views on education reform, insights from working with Elon Musk and President Trump, and the core beliefs that have fueled his personal and professional journey. The conversation delves into the challenges facing American education, economic renewal, leadership lessons, and the necessity of resilience and risk-taking.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. Vivek's Political Journey and Motivation
- Running for Governor of Ohio:
- Ramaswamy frames his campaign not as a consolation after the presidential run, but as a chance to "lead from the front."
- Quote: "I'm somebody who's best positioned to lead from the front. And I view this as a form of self-criticism. But I don't make for particularly good number two." [00:45]
- Ramaswamy frames his campaign not as a consolation after the presidential run, but as a chance to "lead from the front."
- Contrast with Opponent Amy Acton:
- Critiques Acton as focused only on COVID policy, highlighting differences on education and inequality.
- Points out Ohio's early school closures and their negative, unequal impact.
- Quote: "Those kids in the public schools are never going to get that year and a half of their education back." [01:50]
2. Critique of Education Policies and Inequality
- School Closures and Their Effects:
- Public schools closed for 1.5 years while private ones stayed open, exacerbating inequality.
- Criticism of the Democratic Party's approach:
- Quote: "The people who preach the most about inequality are often the ones who implemented the policies that create that inequality." [02:19]
- Notes a "psychological slavery of a dependence on the government."
- Intentionality and Incentives:
- Ramaswamy believes the sustained existence of problems fosters dependence and political relevance for the left, even if not always overtly deliberate.
- Quote: "If you create the very conditions that allow your relevance to persist, then in that sense it is intentional." [02:56]
- Ramaswamy believes the sustained existence of problems fosters dependence and political relevance for the left, even if not always overtly deliberate.
3. Vision for Ohio and Education Reform
- Economic Ambition:
- Plans to pursue a zero income tax, attract entrepreneurs, and make Ohio "the next frontier."
- Quote: "I want to lead our state to be the state that creates a new frontier for the country." [05:53]
- Plans to pursue a zero income tax, attract entrepreneurs, and make Ohio "the next frontier."
- Education Reform:
- Advocates for strong standards such as "third grade reading guarantee" and algebra proficiency by 8th grade.
- Quote: "If you can't read by the end of third grade in Ohio, on my watch, you won't be going to fourth grade." [09:01]
- Critiques lack of implementation of best practices (e.g., science of reading, Singapore Math).
- Advocates for strong standards such as "third grade reading guarantee" and algebra proficiency by 8th grade.
- Teacher Quality and Pay:
- Calls for competency-based standards and better pay for proficient teachers, especially in math.
- Quote: "If you're competent in math, there's... a whole economy for people who are competent in math to get jobs outside of education. We need to understand that those teachers may need to be paid differentially." [10:09]
- Calls for competency-based standards and better pay for proficient teachers, especially in math.
- International Comparison:
- U.S. students lag behind countries like China and Singapore by years; sees education as a national priority akin to the Apollo Mission.
- Quote: "If we roll this forward 20 years and our students are still four years behind China and five years behind Singapore, that will mark the end of American exceptionalism and greatness unless we turn that ship around." [12:47]
- U.S. students lag behind countries like China and Singapore by years; sees education as a national priority akin to the Apollo Mission.
4. Addressing the Culture of Achievement and Immigration
- H1B Visa Controversy and Cultural Commentary:
- Clarifies his position was misunderstood; his focus is raising achievement across all cultural archetypes.
- Advocates for celebrating all forms of success and addressing America's educational shortcomings at their root.
- Quote: "If you actually really care about the problem and you're not talking about fixing public education in this country, that means you're not serious." [16:25]
- Victimhood vs. Empowerment:
- Emphasizes truth-telling over political comfort.
- Quote: "If you care about somebody, you tell them the truth. If you care about yourself, you can tell them what they want to hear." [17:56]
- Emphasizes truth-telling over political comfort.
5. Personal Story: School Bullying and Resilience
- Challenging Public School Experience:
- Recounts being thrown down the stairs and needing surgery during his time at a majority-black junior high.
- Quote: "I had a French teacher, Mr. Wagner, in eighth grade who came to me and said, listen, you need to get out of here." [23:13]
- His parents made sacrifices to send him to private high school.
- Recounts being thrown down the stairs and needing surgery during his time at a majority-black junior high.
- Choice and Opportunity:
- Wants to make sure that public schools are not places students must escape from, but places where every child can succeed.
- Quote: "Getting out should not be the only option." [24:33]
- Wants to make sure that public schools are not places students must escape from, but places where every child can succeed.
- Parental Example:
- Describes his immigrant parents' drive and the value of hard work and not embracing victimhood.
- Quote: "Hardship is something that happens to you in life. Victimhood is a choice." [27:42]
- "If you're going to stand out, you might as well be outstanding." (His father's mantra) [27:45]
- Describes his immigrant parents' drive and the value of hard work and not embracing victimhood.
6. Working with Elon Musk, the ‘Doge’ Initiative, and Lessons Learned
- Role in Trump Admin & With Musk:
- Turned down a Cabinet post to work on dismantling the federal bureaucratic state (code-named Doge project).
- Discusses challenge of regulatory reform and how his experience with Musk informed his future focus.
- Quote (on Musk): "We share a passion for fixing some of these foundational issues in the country. There's different ways to do it and... I had my vision of how to do it." [40:27]
- Government vs. Business Leadership:
- Notes frustration with federal bureaucracy versus efficiency in business; but recognizes even incremental change at the federal level can have massive national impact.
- Quote: "The good news is if you can move that Titanic even by 2 degrees, the magnitude of effect that you have... is huge." [43:12]
- Values the lessons from short executive experience before returning to focus on Ohio.
- Notes frustration with federal bureaucracy versus efficiency in business; but recognizes even incremental change at the federal level can have massive national impact.
7. Economic Philosophy: Widening Wealth Creation
- Propagating Capitalism For All:
- Advocates for financial literacy education, asset ownership (via stock market) from an early age.
- Quote: "One of the most patriotic things you could do for your country as a parent... is put $10,000 away in the S&P 500 and set them up to be a millionaire." [37:27]
- Envisions a society where everyone benefits from economic growth, moving past "us versus them" politics.
- Advocates for financial literacy education, asset ownership (via stock market) from an early age.
8. Parenting, Values Transfer, and Wealth
- Maintaining Values with Wealth:
- Describes conscious effort to instill resilience and values in his children rather than outsourcing to nannies or succumbing to privilege.
- Quote: "Work a little harder means put in the extra effort to make sure that you're there for every bedtime." [47:25]
- Cites importance of modeling hard work and family involvement.
- Describes conscious effort to instill resilience and values in his children rather than outsourcing to nannies or succumbing to privilege.
9. Secrets of Success and Leadership
- Taking Risks and Embracing Failure:
- Advocates risk-taking, learning from adversity, and surrounding oneself with people who challenge you to avoid "yes men" culture.
- Quote: "Be willing to take a risk and fail. And it turns out the failure may actually teach you more things than you thought." [49:25]
- On leadership: "Make sure you're surrounding yourself by people who actually challenge you." [50:42]
- Advocates risk-taking, learning from adversity, and surrounding oneself with people who challenge you to avoid "yes men" culture.
Notable Quotes & Timestamps
-
On his leadership style:
"I'm somebody who's best positioned to lead from the front. I don't make for particularly good number two." [00:45] -
On educational inequality:
"Those kids in the public schools are never going to get that year and a half of their education back." [01:50] -
On dependency and politics:
"If you create the very conditions that allow your relevance to persist, then in that sense it is intentional." [02:56] -
On standards in education:
"If you can't read by the end of third grade in Ohio, on my watch, you won't be going to fourth grade." [09:01] -
On global educational comparisons:
"A seventh grader here is performing at the same standard as a third-grade student in China, which is totally unacceptable." [10:19] -
On the need for a cultural shift:
"If you actually really care about the problem and you're not talking about fixing public education in this country, that means you're not serious." [16:25] -
On hardship and victimhood:
"Hardship is something that happens to you in life. Victimhood is a choice." [27:42] -
On risk and success:
"Be willing to take a risk and fail. And it turns out the failure may actually teach you more things than you thought." [49:25]
Timestamps for Important Segments
- [00:42] – Vivek’s motivation for running for governor
- [01:44] – Ohio’s public school COVID shutdown impact
- [02:56] – Sustained inequality and political incentives
- [05:53] – Vision for Ohio as economic and innovative frontier
- [09:01] – Third grade reading guarantee and standards
- [10:19] – Math achievement gap with China and Singapore
- [12:47] – Educational standards as national imperative
- [16:25] – On the meaning behind controversial tweets and cultural priorities
- [21:25] – Story of bullying and school experience
- [23:13] – "Get out" advice from teacher and shift to private school
- [27:42] – On not embracing victimhood, parental values
- [37:27] – Everyone as asset owners, financial literacy as patriotism
- [43:12] – Lessons from government vs. business leadership
- [47:25] – Parenting approach to wealth and values
- [49:25] – Risk-taking and cultivating challengers in leadership
Memorable Moments
- Vivek recounts being thrown down the stairs at school:
"That kid probably... came from tough background of their own. We think about what a lot of students go through that put themselves in a tough position. That's what we're in this to change." [24:05] - His father’s saying:
"If you're going to stand out, you might as well be outstanding." [27:45] - On his relationship with Elon Musk:
"We share a passion for fixing some of these foundational issues in the country. There's different ways to do it and... I had my vision of how to do it." [40:27]
Conclusion
This episode presents Vivek Ramaswamy as candid, driven, and fiercely dedicated to reforming Ohio and American society more broadly. Through personal anecdotes—ranging from his tough schooling to his experiences in business and politics—he underscores the roles of resilience, hard truths, high expectations in education, and bold leadership. The conversation covers systemic policy critiques but is continually grounded in personal experience and a forward-looking ambition for both Ohio and the country as a whole.