Alan Bersten

Summary

Pod Meets World – "Alan Bersten"

Host: Danielle Fishel
Guest: Alan Bersten
Release Date: July 22, 2026
Podcast Theme: Danielle, Will, and Rider revisit Boy Meets World and chat with fellow stars and guests. In this "Teen Beat" episode, Danielle interviews professional dancer Alan Bersten, delving into his childhood, rise on Dancing with the Stars, and navigating fame, family, and social media.

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Danielle Fishel welcomes Dancing with the Stars champion Alan Bersten for a candid and lively conversation. Together, they unpack Alan’s unconventional Minnesota upbringing in a family of dancers, his journey from So You Think You Can Dance to DWTS icon status, and how family, culture, and the evolving world of social media have shaped his career. The tone is warm, self-deprecating, and full of nostalgia and insight for dance, performance, and personal authenticity.

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Key Topics & Discussion Points

1. Childhood & Family Dancing Roots

Timestamps: 04:46–09:44

• Partridge Family Meets the Midwest:
  Danielle jokes that Alan’s upbringing was like the Partridge Family, imagining "everyone on a bus, traveling state to state, dancing for crowds." (05:14)
• Family-Driven Passion:
  Alan grew up as the youngest of three, following his siblings into ballroom ("My parents just kind of put us in a studio one day, and we're like, hey, you guys are ballroom dancing now?" – 05:51).
• Parental Support:
  His parents created a nurturing environment, supporting his siblings' and his artistic interests ("My parents just saw the passion we had, and they... gave them everything that we can." – 06:32)
• Extended Family Bonding:
  Dance as family bonding—cousins and siblings staging impromptu living room performances ("We would always hang out every weekend... we'd be like, oh, gonna put on a dance show for you guys." – 07:03)
• Sister Took a Different Path:
  While his sister danced, she became a doctor of pharmacy—"She was the only one that was smart enough to go to school." (08:15)

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2. Growing Up Unconventional

Timestamps: 09:44–13:28

• Minnesota Life Outside Dance:
  Danielle asks how Alan managed extracurricular options in the sports-mad Midwest. He replies, "I feel like my parents were like, you can't get hurt in ballroom dancing." (10:21)
• Injuries and Limits:
  His brother’s injury playing football ended sports aspirations—"No one's ever playing sports again... we're just dancing." (10:46)
• Language & Identity:
  Alan speaks both English and Russian, shaped by his Russian heritage ("Remember, I'm Russian. I did not eat a lot of fast food or restaurants." – 17:59).
• School Experience:
  He wasn’t a popular kid, partly because of ballroom dancing and switching from a private Jewish school to a large public high school. "I was definitely a fish out of water." (12:31)
• Community in Dance:
  His main friendships and relationships revolved around the dance world.

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3. Minnesota Nostalgia and Local Culture

Timestamps: 13:28–18:38**

• Mall of America Memories:
  Alan competed in dance at the mall and loved rides at Camp Snoopy ("There was a ride that was an ax, and it would hold you upside down. It was cool." – 15:08)
• State Fair & Food Traditions:
  He raves about the Minnesota State Fair: "They have the best cookies. There's, like, a bucket of cookies you get. Unlimited milk." (16:04)
• Juicy Lucy Debate:
  Alan had never heard of the iconic cheese-stuffed burger, showing his immigrant upbringing.

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4. Breaking Into TV & Dance Competitions

Timestamps: 22:04–27:53

• So You Think You Can Dance (SYTYCD):
  Alan made it to the top 12 in Season 10 at age 19 ("I just want to dance. I want to perform. I don't know what it is." – 22:59)
• Competitive Grit:
  Alan recounts clawing his way through auditions—even flying standby to Boston to make it ("I barely made it in," 23:32). He had to perform solo and compete against his own brother for the show’s "Green Mile" cut ("They like brought us in together and they're like, only one of you can make it... they took me." – 24:53)
• Retrospective Wisdom:
  On SYTYCD he says, "I was very tough on myself, so I didn't enjoy it... I wish I would have enjoyed that a little bit more." (25:39)
• Lessons for DWTS:
  Now, he tries to "enjoy it" on DWTS and avoids being too result-focused. ("If you are just looking for the result of things, you miss the beauty of it, you know." – 27:14)

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5. Dancing with the Stars Journey

Timestamps: 27:53–35:12

• From Troupe to Pro:
  Alan details his transition from being a Glee dancer to joining the DWTS troupe, then stepping in during pro injuries ("I danced with Paige [for Mark], and with Heather Morris for Max when they were injured." – 29:29)
• Learning the Ropes:
  Rehearsing and helping choreograph for the pros greatly enhanced his skillset and prepared him for being a full pro ("The troupe helps build you as a pro." – 29:59)
• The Demands of Being a Pro:
  Alan emphasizes the heavy teaching responsibility—"You have to be incredible dancers, choreographers, and teachers, and therapists." (31:03)
• First Partner as a Pro:
  Paired first with Debbie Gibson, he realized, "it's not about me... it's my celebrity's season." (32:18)
• Winning with Hannah Brown:
  Alan attributes their victory to Hannah’s authenticity and work ethic (33:04), stating, "People loved her being real. You have to care, you have to show up and do it right." (33:31)
• Notable Quote:
  "When people are genuine in themselves, it resonates a lot more." – Alan Bersten (34:38)

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6. Social Media & Modern Dancing Stardom

Timestamps: 40:47–45:15

• The TikTok Era:
  Danielle observes, "The show is a TikTok phenomenon," and asks how important social media has become to the competition. Alan admits, "With Ilona, we did, like, three videos a day. And I was like, what the heck is going on?" (41:45)
• Authenticity Online:
  He learned to "just post whatever you want... if it doesn't do well, who cares? Just post and be a good person, you know?" (42:08)
• Fame & Fan Encounters:
  Alan recounts being increasingly recognized in LA due to the show’s resurgence ("I was walking down Larchmont and... construction workers were like, yo, Alan, you're so good." – 40:00)
• Partner Dynamics:
  A supportive, joyful partnership makes the experience easier: "When it goes well, it's not hard work... the hard part is learning dances, but in the studio, when time flies, it's fun." (43:17)
• Emma Slater Influence:
  Alan credits his girlfriend and fellow pro Emma Slater for social media tips, "She's so eloquent with her words, and I'm not." (43:52)
• Favorite Social Post:
  A spontaneous gym TikTok with Ilona went viral and was even featured on the show ("For weeks, people were just copying it, and it was just so... quick video." – 45:15)

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7. Vulnerability, Strategy, and Season 34’s Renaissance

Timestamps: 45:23–50:41

• Dealing with Setbacks:
  On the stress of elimination weeks—"It doesn't get any easier... that's the worst part." (47:00)
  Alan’s guidance to celebs: "Don't stress about it. The more you stress about it, it's inevitable." (47:05)
• Choosing a Good Partner:
  On new contestants, "The best thing in a partner is somebody who wants to be there, who is passionate about it. You can't teach passion." (48:01)
• Reality TV Mindset:
  Danielle and Alan discuss authenticity versus branding on reality TV. "If you are a reality TV star who's very brand-focused, that would be difficult. But if you are an authentic person who's willing to show up as yourself, warts and all, you're gonna probably have a fan base." (50:17)
• Show Resurgence:
  Season 34’s Emmy nod and mainstream appeal comes from this authentic energy. Alan jokes the Emmy nomination is because of Danielle:
  "I have to say this is the first year... that it's Emmy nominated and it's the first year you've been on it." (38:47)

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8. Future of DWTS & The "Next Pro" Show

Timestamps: 50:41–53:33

• DWTS Expanding Universe:
  Danielle and Alan talk about the show's spinoffs and new pro competition. Alan says, "I think it's beautiful to see how the show is expanding... expanding the universe of Dancing with the Stars is the right way." (50:56)
• Can Fast-Tracking Harm New Pros?
  "The only way you get better as a pro is through experience. No one can tell you a secret thing to make you better." (53:00)
• Advice for Newcomers:
  Alan’s core advice: "Make sure it's not about you. As a pro, it's our job to make our celebrities feel safe." (53:06)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Family Support for the Arts:
  "My parents just saw the passion we had, and they were like, we don’t know how else to do it than give them everything that we can." – Alan Bersten (06:32)

• On Self-Acceptance and Enjoying the Ride:
  "If you are just looking for the result of things, you miss the beauty of it." – Alan Bersten (27:14)

• On Winning the Mirrorball Trophy with Hannah Brown:
  "You have to care. You have to show up and you have to do it right... and if you're lucky enough and it clicks, then it’s magic." – Alan Bersten (33:31)

• On Embracing Social Media:
  "Just post whatever you want. If it doesn’t do well, who cares? Just post and be a good person." – Alan Bersten (42:08)

• On Partnership Chemistry:
  "When it goes well, it’s not hard work... in the studio, when time flies, it’s fun." – Alan Bersten (43:17)

• Advice for Rising Pros:
  "Make sure it's not about you. As a pro, it is our job to make our celebrities feel safe." – Alan Bersten (53:06)

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Episode Structure & Listening Guide

| Segment | Topic | Highlights | |---------|-------|-----------| | 04:46–09:44 | Family origins in dance | Parental push, sibling rivalry, formative experiences | | 09:44–13:28 | High school, popularity | Being the "weird ballroom kid," communal dance roots | | 13:28–18:38 | Minnesota-specific memories | State fair, Mall of America, local traditions | | 22:04–27:53 | Early TV career | SYTYCD experience, competitiveness, personal growth | | 27:53–35:12 | DWTS rise | Transition from troupe, new pressures, winning strategies | | 40:47–45:15 | Social media era of DWTS | Fan recognition, TikTok impact, Emma Slater’s guidance | | 45:23–50:41 | Authenticity and vulnerability | Navigating elimination, relating to an audience | | 50:41–53:33 | Future of DWTS and new pro advice | Insights on franchise expansion, mentorship for incoming pros |

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The Takeaway

The episode is a vibrant look at Alan Bersten’s journey from a "not so cool" Minnesota kid to a household name in American dance television. Alan’s humor, humility, and gratitude for his journey—alongside Danielle’s nostalgic, fan-friendly approach—make for a conversation packed with breezy wisdom about family, performance, and being your truest self, on and off the stage.

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For additional fan interaction, Danielle invites listener stories for an upcoming bonus episode and plugs their upcoming DWTS fan convention in Palm Springs.

Transcript

[Danielle Fishel]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Alan Bersten]

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[Alan Bersten]

Mm, yeah, but I'm not itching to

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[Alan Bersten]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Alan Bersten]

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[Alan Bersten]

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[Danielle Fishel]

Welcome all my fanielle dishels. Just go with it okay? I think people will dig it. It's time for another Teen Beat. I am your host Danielle Fishel, a podcaster, former sitcom star, a TV director and the unforgettable 8th place celebrity on season 34 of Dancing with the Stars. More on that soon. This here podcast has me sitting with interesting people who have done interesting things in in hopes of diving into their origin story. Even the awkward years of childhood. Because we all know where we've been will tell us where we're at and maybe even where we're going. I see it like this. I gave you my childhood. It's time we hear yours. And this week I get to have a conversation with a peer of mine, a fellow professional dancer. We share a passion for the craft. He began professionally dancing at just seven years old, part of a now legendary Minnesota ballroom family, and debuted on TV as part of so youo Think youk can dance in 2013. But his real journey began as part of the Dancing with the Stars troupe in season 20. Then as a fan favorite pro in season 25. With a past lineup of celebrities that includes Debbie Gibson, Amanda Kloots, Jamie Lynn Spears, Alana Mar, and Elaine Hendricks. He's always one half of a couple guaranteed to bring the heat, most notably in season 28 when he won it all alongside Hannah Brown. And now with the show in an all time fever pitch amongst new spinoffs and fan conventions like July 31st through August 2nd in Palm Springs. Limited tickets still available at DWTScon.com, the world is my guest's oyster. We share a love for three things. Masterful dancing, Emma Slater. And watches. He is my favorite Jewish dancer since Paula Abdul. Welcome to Teen Beat. Alan Burstyn.

[Alan Bersten]

What an intro. I'm so impressed. I love it.

[Danielle Fishel]

You love it?

[Alan Bersten]

I love it.

[Commercial Announcer]

Okay, good.

[Alan Bersten]

I think that's the whole episode. We can actually cut there.

[Commercial Announcer]

Wrap it up.

[Danielle Fishel]

He's ready to go home.

[Cal Penn]

How you doing?

[Alan Bersten]

I'm great.

[Danielle Fishel]

So good to see you.

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, it's so good to see you.

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, we got to spend quite a bit of time together on tour, which was amazing. But it now it feels like that was a whole lifetime ago.

[Alan Bersten]

I know. I feel like every year it's just like three different lifetimes happen.

[Cal Penn]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

The season, the tour, and then in between.

[Danielle Fishel]

And then the in between time. Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. No, I feel like our time was so valued.

[Danielle Fishel]

It was.

[Commercial Announcer]

It was.

[Alan Bersten]

You're the best.

[Danielle Fishel]

So valued. Thank you so much for sitting down with me. This is long overdue and any chance I get to hang out with you, I will take. So we are going to cover a lot today, but I'm always very interested in how our childhoods shaped who we are today and I have always imagined you grew up in, like, a real Partridge Family situation. Everyone on a bus, traveling state to state, dancing for crowds.

[Commercial Announcer]

Am I right?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. You know, I was the youngest of three siblings, and I kind of just followed in the footsteps of my older brother, you know, dancing. I don't. My parents just kind of put us in a studio one day, and we're like, hey, you guys are ballroom dancing now?

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, that's it.

[Alan Bersten]

And it wasn't very cool in Minnesota.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

But it turned out pretty cool.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, it worked out pretty well.

[Alan Bersten]

But, yeah. No, we would travel, like, in the Midwest a lot, like, in a van, and go to competitions. How do you know that? This is weird. How do you know? I never told anyone.

[Danielle Fishel]

I do my research, baby. So you started dancing at 7. Your older brother was already immersed, kind of.

[Alan Bersten]

No, I think we all started together. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Same thing.

[Commercial Announcer]

Okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

And your parents helped create it by seeking instructors throughout the state and encouraging teachers to come and visit.

[Alan Bersten]

Yes. Why, you are.

[Danielle Fishel]

What was it like growing up in a house where everyone shared this artistic goal?

[Alan Bersten]

Honestly, I think my parents just saw the passion we had, and they were like, we don't know how else to do it than give them everything that we can.

[Cal Penn]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And so they were very, you know, just driven to help us follow our passions.

[Danielle Fishel]

How did they see the passion you had? Were you guys just dancing around the house all the time? Were you watching?

[Alan Bersten]

I will tell you. I think so. We're very close with, like. I call them our cousins, but it's like my mom's. We call her sister, but it's really probably her, like, her first cousin.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

But whatever. We would always hang out every weekend. And my brother. They have two children. My one guy is my brother's age, and one girl is my sister's age, so they were always, like, best friends, and we. And I was always the youngest one.

[Danielle Fishel]

You were the one who was told you got to play the dog when you played house.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly.

[Danielle Fishel]

You could be the dog.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly. No, but we would always, like, try to stay at each other's houses for, like, five extra minutes, and we'd be like, oh, gonna put on a dance show for you guys. And this was before we even danced, so I think it just kind of fell into place.

[Danielle Fishel]

I love that. I remember doing that, by the way, as kids with my cousins who were. I had one cousin who's a year older than me and a cousin who was a year younger than me, and I was right in the middle. So we. The three girls, inseparable, and we Would always do the same thing, Watch our dance, you know, and it's some ridiculous thing. Absolutely terrible. We used I in California. We had a pool in the backyard. And so mine would always end. I'd do them in the backyard, and they'd always end with a dive into the water, which at least you have that.

[Alan Bersten]

And the bisection.

[Danielle Fishel]

Dry off. To dry off. Swimming. Exactly. So that. That's pretty cool. Your sister Melanie danced as a kid, but she had. She had to go become a doctor of pharmacy.

[Cal Penn]

Why?

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, why did she choose to do that? Did you guys make fun of her for being too smart?

[Alan Bersten]

No. I mean, she was the only one that was smart enough to go to school. You know, I think me and my brother tried, but we. I don't know. I can't explain it. I just. I can only speak for myself. I just love performing and connecting, and I was not very motivated in school. Like, I was good at it. I did exactly what I needed to do. So I can go dance.

[Commercial Announcer]

Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

But then when it was over, you were like, I don't need to do that ever again.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. I'm not itching to go back to school.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

My mom wants me to, but.

[Danielle Fishel]

No mom. Does your brother call with notes after your performances? Yes.

[Alan Bersten]

So does my mom, though.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, really?

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Your mom considers herself to be a bit of an expert now.

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, she for sure is. And you know what? It makes sense, though, because she's. Who watches the show.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, and, like, you want to obviously cater to professional dancers, but at the end of the day, you want to connect to the audience.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. So do you call your mom when you find out who your new partner is and then be like, mom, help me. What do you think I should do to appeal to the masses?

[Alan Bersten]

Well, it's really cool when I can call my mom and I'm like, this person's on the show. And she's like, no way. I love this. You know, she's excited, so it is. It is nice. She'll always tell me she's like, she could have pointed her toes a little bit better. I'm like, really?

[Danielle Fishel]

Wow, Mom.

[Alan Bersten]

Okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

Does she get those ideas just from herself watching as a fan, or does she take what the judges say and then go, yeah, yeah, you know, that's right. I think maybe she didn't point her toes.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, I think it's. She just notices things.

[Cal Penn]

She.

[Alan Bersten]

She would watch us compete when we were growing up. She always traveled with us, and so she's got the inside information.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. She really Knows what she's looking at. I know you are also a sports fan, and growing up in Minnesota, you have a plethora of teams to root for. You also have arguably the most robust youth hockey program in the US And I have run into this problem with my oldest son, who wants to do everything. How do you pick your hobby? You focused on dance, but you're also very well rounded. So I'm wondering, how did you navigate that as a kid?

[Alan Bersten]

Honestly, I didn't. You know, I danced. I tried drums for a second. I tried guitar. I feel like my parents were like, you can't get hurt in ballroom dancing.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

My brother did a little bit more. He played football growing up, but I remember he, like, hurt his hip. And then my mom was like, no one's ever playing sports again.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right, right. We're a bubble family.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly. We are just dancing. You can't hurt yourself that bad dancing. You can.

[Danielle Fishel]

You can. Yeah, you can have. You hurt yourself pretty bad dancing?

[Alan Bersten]

Knock on wood. I don't think so.

[Danielle Fishel]

All right, good. I mean, you would know, but if

[Alan Bersten]

I did, I probably blacked it out. It's gone. No, but it's like, I. Like, in my later years, I was like, oh, I wish I played piano. And so I started playing piano, and I'm like, this is way too hard to learn at this age.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, I know.

[Alan Bersten]

So much easier as a kid.

[Danielle Fishel]

As a kid. Do you have long fingers?

[Alan Bersten]

Some say I have long fingers. I've got big hands.

[Danielle Fishel]

You do have big hands.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

You have piano hands.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, except I think they're too big, so they press multiple keys.

[Danielle Fishel]

Got it.

[Alan Bersten]

And you're like, yeah, exactly.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, okay.

[Alan Bersten]

No, I can do it. It's just I'm a memory kind of guy. It's hard for me to read notes. So I wish I did as a kid.

[Cal Penn]

Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know. I also wish I learned multiple languages as a kid. You speak.

[Alan Bersten]

I speak Russian.

[Danielle Fishel]

Russian. You speak Russian and English?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you remember any particularly embarrassing moments from high school, or have you also blacked all of those out?

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, most of those are blacked out, for sure. I was not a popular kid, if you can imagine.

[Commercial Announcer]

Really?

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you think it's because of the ballroom?

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, for sure.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And I was just a weird kid.

[Danielle Fishel]

What were you like as a kid?

[Alan Bersten]

Well, I started by going to it from first or from kindergarten until eighth grade. I went to a Jewish private school.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And so, like me, I was very, like, one of my best friends still. We went to school there together, and then we went to high school together. We went to a public high school.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. So you had been very sheltered in a small, private, Jewish elementary and junior high and then were straight into high school. Right. Plopped into a public high school as a ballroom dancer.

[Alan Bersten]

He was not. I was definitely a fish out of water.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

But it was whatever. Like, I really found my community in dance and my good friends in school.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, but by no means was I cool for dancing.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you go to any high school dances?

[Alan Bersten]

I didn't.

[Danielle Fishel]

Not a single one?

[Alan Bersten]

No. I would have been really cool if I did.

[Commercial Announcer]

Wow.

[Alan Bersten]

Probably not, actually.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you have any high school girlfriends?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, but, like, it was. Again, it was more of, like, I was always in dance, so, like.

[Danielle Fishel]

So your girlfriends were like dance community.

[Alan Bersten]

And we were traveling, like, at least once or twice a month.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And so I was, like, always, you know, gone for these, like, the prom and homecoming. I was always gone.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

So I never got to go. So that's.

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, in some ways, that's really nice because you had a well established community where you shared common interests with these people and you had them consistently. And then school was just kind of the place you went to for education.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly.

[Danielle Fishel]

And you had some good friends there. So you weren't like a lone wolf.

[Alan Bersten]

No, it was close, but I had three good friends.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. I am legally obligated to talk to you about the Mall of America because you are from Minnesota. So were you a frequenter of the Mall of America?

[Alan Bersten]

Mall of America, like, growing up, There was a competition that was actually in the Mall of America. So we would go a few, like, there, and then we would ride rides and go dance. And I was like, 10 years old, so it was, like, really fun.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

Cause I don't know if you know this. In Mall of America, there is, like, an amusement park.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, I know. I've been there. I did an autograph signing there as a teen.

[Commercial Announcer]

It's great.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's the greatest thing ever. I also ate 12 mini cinnabons from the Mall of America.

[Alan Bersten]

You can do that at any mall, though. That's not specific.

[Danielle Fishel]

But I'll always think about it as the Mall of America thing.

[Alan Bersten]

Did you throw up from the 12 cinnabones? Cause that's a lot.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's a lot. Actually, I had six. My mom and I shared a box of 12, so. Yeah, it's cut that in half. A fan gave them to us and we were hungry.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, no, it's. I think, like, when you're there, it's so big and there's so many people that, like, you don't really want to go there to shop.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know. How could you possibly. Also, if you buy something now, you're lugging it. Miles of mall.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. So I've been many, many times.

[Danielle Fishel]

What would you say is your favorite attraction there?

[Alan Bersten]

So when I was there, it was called Camp Snoopy, the attraction place. And there was. It was like an axe. And I think it was like Paul Blart and Paul Blart. Paul Bunyan.

[Commercial Announcer]

Okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

Paul Bunyan.

[Alan Bersten]

I don't know if you guys know Paul Bunyan.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know who Paul Bunyan is.

[Alan Bersten]

He's a Minnesota folk tale, I think. But he had, like, an ax, I think. Oh, and there was a ride. That was an ax.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, that's.

[Alan Bersten]

And it would, like, hold you upside down. It was cool.

[Danielle Fishel]

What would the Paul Blart ride be? A Segway segue.

[Alan Bersten]

And that would be really fun. Actually.

[Danielle Fishel]

You know what? You're not. You're not wrong, honestly.

[Alan Bersten]

They should do that.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's a good idea.

[Alan Bersten]

I would ride that now.

[Danielle Fishel]

I would, too. It reminds me kind of of like when you can surf in place. Like, you could do that with Segways. That'd be so fun. Did you ever eat at Hulk Hogan's Pasta Mania?

[Alan Bersten]

No, I didn't.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, well, it opened in the food court in 1995, and it featured items like Hulk ewes and Hulkaroni and cheese.

[Alan Bersten]

I must have missed that.

[Danielle Fishel]

But it closed less than a year later.

[Alan Bersten]

I wouldn't be surprised. I. I was born in 94, so.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

It would have been very. I don't think it was.

[Danielle Fishel]

You wouldn't have remembered it anyway.

[Alan Bersten]

You couldn't chew it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Guy born in 94. Get the hell out of here. What did you do for fun in Minnesota as a kid? Did you go to the state fair?

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

The best.

[Alan Bersten]

It was a very good state fair.

[Danielle Fishel]

It was great. It still is.

[Alan Bersten]

I. I mean, I feel like if I went there, I would gain 15

[Danielle Fishel]

pounds in the day just looking at the stuff.

[Alan Bersten]

No, no, it's. They have the best cookies. There's, like, a bucket of cookies. You get.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, I love a bucket of cookies.

[Alan Bersten]

Unlimited milk. And it was delicious. But they have everything on a stick.

[Danielle Fishel]

Unlimited milk. So you sit there and Wait.

[Alan Bersten]

You sit there? Yeah, yeah, you sit there and I

[Danielle Fishel]

feel like if I have a bucket, I want to put it on my arm like a cute bag and just eat as I go about my day.

[Alan Bersten]

I think you do two. You get one for there and one to go.

[Danielle Fishel]

One to Go. Great. It's harder to dip the milk on the to go box.

[Alan Bersten]

It is. Yeah, but you find a way.

[Danielle Fishel]

You find a way. Okay. Sorry, I'm hungry.

[Alan Bersten]

Listen, I've never said no to good cookies.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know. So what did you do for fun other than a state fair moment?

[Alan Bersten]

You know, we would dance a lot. That was fun. Ride my bike. I feel like that was really cool.

[Danielle Fishel]

How old were you when you learned how to ride your bike

[Alan Bersten]

out the womb?

[Danielle Fishel]

Really? You just have no memories where you didn't know how to ride a bike?

[Alan Bersten]

I have no memories not knowing how to ride a bike.

[Commercial Announcer]

Really?

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you remember learning how to ride a bike? No, it was just like instant, obviously coordinated, I think so.

[Alan Bersten]

I genuinely could not tell you. I remember. I remember putting like the baseball card in the back spokes to make it sound.

[Danielle Fishel]

To make the sound.

[Alan Bersten]

But that. I don't. Yeah, I don't remember learning.

[Danielle Fishel]

My 7 year old still doesn't know how to ride a bike. But that's because we also don't ever ride bikes. It's a bit of a problem.

[Alan Bersten]

Like who rides bikes?

[Danielle Fishel]

Who rides bikes anymore? And also we don't have sidewalks. Closed. And. And I'm like, I'm sorry, but we're not going to learn in the middle of the street.

[Alan Bersten]

No. And I feel like in Minnesota there's so much more space.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly. But I do feel like I'm a bad parent. If you don't teach your kid how to ride a bike, you.

[Alan Bersten]

I mean, he will talk about it in his memoir for sure.

[Danielle Fishel]

100%. My mom. My mom Topanga Never Taught Me to Ride a Bike is the name of his memoir. He's already working on it. Do you have an opinion? Back to food. This is my favorite topic. I love food. Do you have an opinion on the best Juicy Lucy in Minneapolis? We have eaten at Matt's and the Nook. I don't know if it's a good one.

[Alan Bersten]

You're not gonna like this. I don't know what a Juicy Lucy is.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, allow me to explain it to you.

[Alan Bersten]

Remember, I'm Russian. I did not eat a lot of fast food or restaurants.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, a Juicy Lucy is a hamburger that has the cheese in the middle of the patty.

[Alan Bersten]

As opposed to what? Oh, like in the pudding.

[Danielle Fishel]

There is a Juicy Lucy. So you cut into it and the cheese oozes out of the middle. And it originated in Minneapolis.

[Alan Bersten]

This should be bigger. I don't know why it's not big enough. It should be bigger.

[Danielle Fishel]

It should be bigger. Well, I'll tell you, I have been to two places, Matt's and the Nook. Both A plus. So next time you're back.

[Alan Bersten]

I don't know how you can go wrong with cheese in a cheeseburger. I know the more cheese the better.

[Danielle Fishel]

Couldn't agree more.

[Alan Bersten]

So the Nook. I'll have to be there. Amazon Pharmacy Presents Painful Thoughts it's been

[Danielle Fishel]

a long bumpy road dealing with yet another bladder infection and driving to the pharmacy to pick up meds. I went over a pothole and a little pee came out so now I get to stand in line with pee pee pants.

[Alan Bersten]

Next time skip the pain and get fast free delivery with Amazon Pharmacy. Healthcare just got less painful.

[Commercial Announcer]

The public breakup no one saw coming has hit the freezer aisle. After decades together, Cherry, Orange and Grape Popsicle Ice Pops are going their separate ways and the drama is heating up. It started with Cherry Popsicle's shocking decision to strike out on her own. But after years of sharing throwing freezer space, Orange and Grape Popsicle weren't about to let Cherry Popsicle steal the spotlight. Now the Flavor Feud is officially on. Cherry Popsicle wants the spotlight all to herself, but Orange and Grape Popsicle aren't giving it up without a fight. All summer long, fans will decide which flavor deserves the crown and the chance to earn a long term solo spot on freezer shelves. Pick a side make your voice heard and let the feud begin. Pick up the Cherry, Orange and Grape Popsicle Ice Pop variety pack to experience all three iconic flavors and decide where your loyalty lies. And then shout out your favorite on Social and don't forget to follow the Flavor Feud drama all summer long on Instagram.

[Alan Bersten]

Opsicle hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile now. I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited premium wireless for $15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made $15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a [e-mail] switch upfront payment

[Danielle Fishel]

of $45 for three months, $90 for six months or $180 for a 12

[Commercial Announcer]

month plan required $15 per month equivalent

[Danielle Fishel]

taxes and fees Extra initial plan term

[Commercial Announcer]

only greater than 50 gigabytes me slow when network is busy.

[Cal Penn]

See Terms hey everyone, it's Cal Penn, host of Irsay The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast I comedian Emily Lynn to talk about the Audible original series Heads will heir apparent the second installment of the gloriously unhinged fantasy comedy she co created with her sister Kate McKinnon. An evil queen has to produce an heir before her 40th birthday. Or a swamp demon comes to collect, and her best friend is a cursed raven who gets turned into a toad.

[Danielle Fishel]

There was only one character that immediately we were like, we need Richard Kind for this. We had written this love addict. This, like, neurotic love addict. And originally we were just calling him General Richard Kind. And he was like, could you change my name? I don't necessarily want to be associated with this freak. And we were happy to do that.

[Cal Penn]

Listen to hearsay on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

So you compete throughout your childhood, and you end up as a contestant on so youo Think youk can dance. Season 13 in 2013.

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, no. So close. Season 10.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, it's season 10. Oh, you know why? Because I got 2013. It's season 10 in 2013.

[Alan Bersten]

You are on it.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'm so on it.

[Alan Bersten]

But no, you're still on it. I'll give it to you.

[Danielle Fishel]

Jenna Johnson was also on that season. You make it to the top 12.

[Alan Bersten]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

But now TV is in the equation. Did you love the addition of being on TV through all this?

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, absolutely. I think I was 19 years old. Maybe I just turned 19. And, you know, my brother was already running the dance studio.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, if you were born in 94 and it's 2010.

[Alan Bersten]

No, 2013. Season 10.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, season 10. Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

I was gonna correct you on your math. I was like, you were 16. Okay, got it.

[Alan Bersten]

No, no, I was 19. And, like, I was like, I know I want to dance. I don't know what it leads to. Obviously, Dancing With Stars is there. So you think he's there? My brother also did the show called Burn the Floor, and I was like, I just want to dance. I want to perform. I don't know what it is. And then last minute, I literally got a standby flight to the audition for so youo Think youk Can Dance. It was in Boston and barely made it in.

[Danielle Fishel]

The door's closing, and you slid your way in.

[Alan Bersten]

So my brother auditioned earlier.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And they kind of brought him back. He auditioned with his wife. I don't know if you remember the show, but, like, if you audition and you're really good, you go straight to Vegas.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, wow.

[Alan Bersten]

And if you're like, oh, we like you, but we want to see you do another round in the audition, there's, like, a big dance. They put you with a partner. I had to do that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. You.

[Alan Bersten]

So I was, like, clawing my way.

[Danielle Fishel]

Clawing your way?

[Cal Penn]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And my brother and his wife obviously

[Danielle Fishel]

went straight to Vegas.

[Alan Bersten]

I had to do a solo. Like, they dance together. I danced by myself. And ballroom's very hard. By yourself.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. I'll say.

[Alan Bersten]

It's also hard. Not by yourself.

[Commercial Announcer]

It's hard.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's just hard. Yeah, ballroom's hard.

[Alan Bersten]

But so I did.

[Danielle Fishel]

What did you do? What dance did you do solo?

[Alan Bersten]

I did a samba, I think.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, so you did your own body roll.

[Alan Bersten]

Oh, multiple body rolls. Multiple body rolls were there. And it was just, you know, again, it was like. I think my mind was like, oh, I'm young. Whatever happens, happens. I'm gonna try. I really want it. But, like, whatever, right?

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, that is obvious by flying standby.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

You're like, let's see if I get on this.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly. Like, I didn't really believe until we got to Vegas. And I was like, okay, I really wanna do this now. Like, I really think this is gonna be something amazing. Me and my brother made it all the way to the end. It was called Green Mile.

[Commercial Announcer]

Ooh.

[Alan Bersten]

And it's like, before they picked the top 20.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And they, like, brought us in together, and they're like, only one of you can make it. You know, the drama, of course.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you think they manufactured that from the beginning?

[Alan Bersten]

I don't know. I mean, it would have been cool to have two brothers on.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, I know.

[Alan Bersten]

But I'm assuming they were like, oh, this is going to be good.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And, you know, they took me. And honestly, probably the right choice just because he already had a kid. Like, he had the studio. Like, he was a little bit older than now. What everyone else was on the show, you know, like, I was 19, and I was the age that everyone was.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly.

[Alan Bersten]

Um, but he's a phenomenal dancer. So it was just more like casting.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Casting situation, you know?

[Alan Bersten]

And then I was like, okay, I don't know what I'm doing now. And it was just. It was. I would say it was an incredible experience. I was very tough on myself, so I didn't enjoy it, you know? And I think a lot of people that go through it are like, I have to do the best, otherwise my career's over. And then you finish and you're like, oh, I wish I would have enjoyed that a little bit more.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And that's what I do a lot more on Dancing with the Stars now is like, enjoy it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

Because it is. It is tough. You've been through it. It's stressful, but it is one of the most remarkable and beautiful and uplifting shows there is. And you learn so much about yourself.

[Danielle Fishel]

And also as just a personality and a person, life is so much more enjoyable when we can just take a deep breath and laugh at our, like, laughter makes everything feel. And like, if we're taking it too seriously and judging ourselves too harshly, that's. Those are not enjoyable days. You know, we're all going to have them and we're all going to have moments where we go, man, I'm bummed with myself. I stayed up too late. I didn't show up as well as I could have. I didn't push myself as hard as I needed to. I'm disappointed in myself. But like, as a whole to like, enjoy the process.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, that's the best thing you can do.

[Danielle Fishel]

Especially like you said, when your entire year ends up feeling like three stages of life. One of them is the season while it's going, which is, you know, four months.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Between all the weeks of the show and then the. The weeks where you start to get to rehearse before, it's really looking at four months and then a four month tour. If you're being hard on yourself through all of that, you're being hard on yourself through 2/3 of your life.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. And you, you know, again, if you are just looking for the result of things, you miss the beauty of it, you know. And I think the season, you know, even last season, for example, everyone that was a part of it, I feel like won.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, everyone left the show either feeling better, doing new opportunities. Even if you didn't win the show, there's so many beautiful outcomes that came from it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Alan Bersten]

That it's like just being a part of it and enjoying it is winning.

[Danielle Fishel]

Couldn't agree with you more. Two years later then after so youo Think youk Can Dance, you joined the troupe of Dancing with the Stars.

[Alan Bersten]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Thrown right into it. Do you remember your first impressions of this insane, beautiful universe?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, I actually remember vividly. So I was doing some little dance tour. They were like, hey, do you want to audition for the show? There'll be like a little interview. And I was like, absolutely, absolutely. I flew back to LA because I was traveling. I don't remember where I was. Did this like audition and I was like, like, this is my dream. Like, I really want to be on Dancing with the Stars. Some time goes by, like maybe a few weeks. I was actually a dancer on Glee at the time.

[Cal Penn]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And I remember being on set for Glee and, like, getting a call, and it was like, hey, you're gonna be on Dancing with the Stars. You're gonna be on troupe. And I was like, oh, my God, this is the best thing in the world.

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, all your dreams coming true on set of Glee.

[Alan Bersten]

Truly, like, dreams come true. And I was like, being on the show is like, the dream come true. You know, I'm just so happy. And then it's like, okay. Then. So I was on Troop, and then it was like, okay, the next dream is to be a pro.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right. I gotta graduate to that next level.

[Alan Bersten]

I mean, I will say being on troupe was the best thing because you learn so much.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

It's really hard to just go in as a pro, not really knowing what you're doing. It's your first time. It's the celebrity's first time. When you're on troupe, you get to see it firsthand. You get to experience it. I stepped in a few times as troupe, so I got that firsthand experience.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And it was just stepping in.

[Danielle Fishel]

You mean to replace a pro who's.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. So I think first it happened with Mark.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. He got an injury.

[Alan Bersten]

He got injured, and I danced with Paige.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And then in season 24, Max got injured, and I stepped in with Heather Morris for, like, three weeks, maybe.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And, like, I had to choreograph my own dances and everything.

[Danielle Fishel]

Such a good experience.

[Alan Bersten]

So great. And Heather was unbelievable.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

So it was like, just go out and do it, and you don't have to worry about, like, her freaking out because she's such a.

[Danielle Fishel]

She was such a pro.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

So I got so lucky. And again, I think the troupe helps build you as a pro.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know. I really also think that it would really benefit the troupe to be able to let them sit in on some of the rehearsals more because they. I mean, obviously, they're so busy, too. They're doing dances all throughout the week and everything, but they usually just get to see the day of the camera blocking.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. And in the past, like, when I was troupe, I was helping a lot of the celeb, a lot of the pros.

[Danielle Fishel]

Great.

[Alan Bersten]

Like, choreographing and being in the room. So back then, it was more like that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

I think because of COVID they, like, really made sure no one was in the room, and then it kind of just stuck like that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. Because that would be so helpful to see the way the pros talk to their celebrities, to see the way they teach. I mean, that's yeah. Teaching is a. A whole skill set on its own. You could be the best dancer in the entire world and not know the first thing about teaching.

[Alan Bersten]

And that's. I think, what is so special about the pros on the show. They're all so talented. They have to be incredible dancers, they have to be incredible choreographers, and they have to be incredible teachers.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And therapists. So you can read my mind. I know, but it's. You know, it is. It's so much. It's multifaceted.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes, it is.

[Alan Bersten]

And so, yeah, you can get the best dancer, but if they don't know how to teach, then. Then the celebrity's out of luck.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. You're also forgetting personalities themselves.

[Alan Bersten]

It's like. It's a lot.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's. Yeah. You guys are. I mean, talk about. We say triple threat, but talk about. You guys have to have, like, a bajillion.

[Alan Bersten]

Keep going, Danielle.

[Danielle Fishel]

Keep going. Well, good news. You were promoted in season 25 with Debbie Gibson as your first celebrity. What was the biggest lesson you took away from your first season?

[Alan Bersten]

I think the biggest thing I realized was, like, the pressure. So in season 24, when I was with Heather, there wasn't really any pressure because I wasn't her main partner.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

And then when it was like, okay, now you have a main partner. You are basically. It's not. As a pro. It's not my season.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, at most, it's our season, but mainly it's. It's my celebrity season. You know, I want to make sure my celebrity has the absolute best season.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And so that is something that I learned right away.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

I was like, this is not about me.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, and Debbie was the sweetest person ever.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

She's wonderful.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, she's the best.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And so that was a great first season, but the pressure of, like, oh, this is fully on me now.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

That's what I realized. And I was like, all right, now I know how to really, you know, not let the pressure get to me and trust myself more.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right. Well, just a few years later, you win a Len Goodman mirrorball trophy with Bachelorette star Hannah Brown.

[Alan Bersten]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, what a rapid rise to the very top. Why do you think that partnership worked so well? And what was it about that season that you think got you guys to the end?

[Alan Bersten]

Honestly, so many things. It's not one thing. You know, she just came off the Bachelorette. She was the most popular thing on television. She's incredible, and she worked really, really hard, and she was very Real. And I think people saw that and people loved her being real. I think at the end of the day, in order for anyone to make it to the end, they just have to care.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, no matter what. Like, whether you care for yourself or for. For your mom or for. You just have to care. You have to show up and you have to do it right. And then if you're lucky enough and it clicks, then it's, you know, it just. It's magic.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, it is. It does feel like the kind of thing that is a perfect recipe that it's really like there's so many elements that have to fall into the right place at the right time in order for the magic to happen that gets you to the end and then to eventually win.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. And I think everyone's journey is different. And like every season. Yeah, there might be, like, a. Oh, I think this person might win, but that changes every time. I will say, right before I did, when I won with Hannah first, we did something called Dancing with Stars Juniors.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And I had the sweetest girl, Sky Brown, and we won there. So it was like I started to, like, realize more that you do well

[Danielle Fishel]

with people who have the last name Brown.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly. Two wins. Two wins with the name Brown.

[Danielle Fishel]

Two wins with the name Brown. That works for you, no.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. 100%. Okay. But also, it's just like, when people are genuine in themselves, it resonates a lot more.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. People can pick up on that. They can smell in authenticity.

[Alan Bersten]

And it's not just with the celebrities. It's with the partnership. It's with the pros. Like, people can see us more than I think people realize. Yeah. And so, like, when people are there just to enjoy it and have passion and purpose, it goes a long way.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

Amazon Health AI presents painful thoughts.

[Danielle Fishel]

Why did I search the Internet for answers to my cold sore problem? Now I'm stuck down a rabbit hole filled with images of alarmingly graphic source in various stages of ooze. I can clear my search history, but I can never unsee that.

[Alan Bersten]

Don't go down the rabbit hole. Amazon Health AI gets you the right care fast. Healthcare just got less painful.

[Commercial Announcer]

The public breakup no one saw coming has hit the freezer aisle. After decades together, Cherry, orange and grape Popsicle ice pops are going their separate ways. And the Dre drama's heating up. It started with Cherry Popsicle's shocking decision to strike out on her own. But after years of sharing freezer space, Orange and Grape Popsicle weren't about to let Cherry Popsicle Steal the spotlight now the Flavor Feud is officially on. Cherry Popsicle wants the spotlight all to herself, but Orange and Gray Popsicle aren't giving it up without a fight. All summer long, fans will decide which flavor deserves the crown and the chance to earn a longer term solo spot on freezer shelves. Pick a side make your voice heard and let the feud begin. Pick up the Cherry, Orange and Grape Popsicle Ice Pop Variety pack to experience all three iconic flavors and decide where your loyalty lies. And then shout out your favorite on Social. And don't forget to follow the Flavor Feud drama all summer long on Instagram.

[Alan Bersten]

Opsicle this summer there are 250 reasons to join T Mobile Girls.

[Danielle Fishel]

Trip booked and switching to T Mobile help make it happen with Experience beyond

[Alan Bersten]

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[Commercial Announcer]

And honestly, that hundred dollars back, I'm putting it towards the zipline now.

[Alan Bersten]

That's how you do summer.

[Commercial Announcer]

Exactly. Best switch I ever made.

[Alan Bersten]

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[Cal Penn]

hey everyone, it's Cal Penn, host of Irsay The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast I'm sitting down with Wil Wheaton, who played Gordie Lachance in Stand by Me 40 years ago and now narrates Stephen King's the Body, the novella that inspired it all. We talk about what it's like to return to a story that shaped his life, channeling his memories of River Phoenix in the recording booth and and why the friendships you have at 12 might be the most important ones you'll ever have. I know Gordie Lachance. I am Gordy Lachance.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, I mean, even when I was

[Alan Bersten]

a little kid, I was Gordy Lachance

[Cal Penn]

when I didn't know it. Listen to Earsay the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, here we are in a complete renaissance for the show, the Now Emmy nominated season 34 Danielle.

[Alan Bersten]

I have to say this is the first year in many years that it's Emmy nominated and it's the first year you've been on it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, oh, okay. It's me. You think it's me?

[Commercial Announcer]

It's you.

[Cal Penn]

It's gotta be me.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's gotta be. I'm the missing link.

[Alan Bersten]

Well, now we know.

[Danielle Fishel]

Listen, I'll take it. I mean, it was. Season 34 was above and beyond. I think what anybody could have imagined. For the show, you were paired with the great Elaine Hendricks in the sixth most watched TV show of the year.

[Alan Bersten]

Wow.

[Danielle Fishel]

Now is life different for Allen Burstyn? Now what is your visibility? Like, are you getting stopped everywhere? Because I hear from friends, it's how I knew you were in my neighborhood not that long ago. Because I was at a basketball game for my son this past Saturday and a girlfriend of mine said to me, oh, I saw Alan. Alan was walking into polo check this past weekend. I said, well, gonna have to ask him what he was picking up.

[Alan Bersten]

You know what? It's. It's so funny. I feel like right when I won.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Alan Bersten]

I went like on a run like a few, like a week later. And like somebody, oh, congrats, Alan. Just on the street. And I was like, that's. That's pretty cool. But, you know, it's been like, whatever, nothing crazy. I feel like the last two years, okay. When I was partnered with Ilona Martin.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yes.

[Alan Bersten]

I was walking down Larchmont and everyone, like construction workers were like, yo, Alan, you're so good.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'm like, that's so cute.

[Alan Bersten]

Heck is going on over here, you know? But it was really just like the show did have this resurgence, and whether it's social media or whatever it is, it is just so awesome to be a part of. That's not the focus, but it's definitely cool to see that recognition. And like, if anyone stops me, I will gladly take a photo with them.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know you're always so kind.

[Alan Bersten]

I literally went for a run yesterday and I run on Melrose a lot.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

And like a group of girls were like, alan.

[Danielle Fishel]

And I'm like, yeah. Did you stop your run?

[Alan Bersten]

I didn't. I was sorry.

[Cal Penn]

Okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You're like, if I stop, I'm not finishing.

[Danielle Fishel]

My watch is going.

[Alan Bersten]

But I definitely said hi and then they messaged me.

[Danielle Fishel]

As you mentioned, a lot of the popularity has to be thanks to social media. The show is a TikTok phenomenon. And for the pros, it is like you take on a second full time job during the season. Your season with Alana. You two were incredible online. How important is the social media game now? Do you think to going far in the competition?

[Alan Bersten]

Let me start with this. I felt when I was with Amanda Kloots, I think it was season 30, we made a big effort of, like, social media, and I looked back, and we posted one TikTok a week.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, my God.

[Alan Bersten]

And I was like, that's a big effort.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, right.

[Cal Penn]

You.

[Danielle Fishel]

You felt like you were like, wow, we're really focused on this.

[Alan Bersten]

I think we went live on instagram and TikTok every camera blocking day, and then we posted, like, one TikTok a week, and I was like, we're doing so much, like, more than everyone else.

[Danielle Fishel]

Flooding the season.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. And then I'm like, oh, with Ilona, we did, like, three videos a day.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, my gosh.

[Alan Bersten]

And I was like, what the heck is going?

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you have time?

[Alan Bersten]

You know, I think it was also very easy.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

So, like, with Ilona, we didn't do a lot of dance trends. We kind of just did quick personalities videos, funny things. I really learned that season of, like, just post whatever you want.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right. Can't be too precious about it.

[Alan Bersten]

Don't be precious. If it doesn't do well, who cares? Just post and be a good person, you know? And I think what really resonated was especially with Ilona, it showed our partnership, and it gave an avenue outside of just the show.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, you get your minute and a half dance, your minute and a half package, and whatever questions are in the skybox with Julianne all week. You know, that's five minutes maximum.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

And social media now gives you a platform to talk about your partnership, talk about struggles, talk about what's going good, you know, having fun and just showing that partnership even more. And to me, I think that's the most important thing.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

It's not your celebrity and you trying to get the most vote. It's like, how can you showcase your partnership?

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And it's a lot easier when you actually like each other.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, yeah. I can't even imagine what a season would have been like if Pasha and I did not get along. I really like what a you. I mean, to wake up every day and be so excited to see your partner and work with your partner.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Is such a blessing to wake up and, like, dread it.

[Alan Bersten]

That's why it's not, like, when it goes well. It's not hard. It's not hard work. The hard part is obviously learning dances and choreographing and all that, but being in the studio, when time flies, it's fun.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, exactly. When you're like, how have we already been here for four hours?

[Alan Bersten]

So even though it is four hours a day, when it's fun, it's like, give me four more.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, now you have added pressure because your girlfriend also my love, Emma Slater, is the world's greatest social media guru. Do you bounce ideas off of her?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, you know, always. I'm always. First of all, I'm. She's so eloquent with her words, and I'm not. So, like, hey, does this caption make sense? Like, do I sound like an idiot? And she helps because I'm not. I'm so just like, blah.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

Like, almost like a caveman. Like, I'll just say things, and they're like, what I read about. What did I write?

[Danielle Fishel]

What did I even say?

[Alan Bersten]

This doesn't make any sense. But I'm just like. I'm the type that I'm like, I'm excited to post something. I'm just gonna post it. And I think she's very. Just so. She's so smart.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, she really is. Do you have. If you think about your. Any of your seasons, do you have, like, one post that you think of as being like, oh, that's my favorite post I've done?

[Alan Bersten]

Yes, actually.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

It's with Ilona. We did, like, a package before one of our dances. It was the jive.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Alan Bersten]

It was rock and roll night, and we did, like. We were in the gym, and we did a whole package for the show, and then afterwards, we filmed a TikTok of, like, partners doing everything together, and we just did a bunch of workouts together.

[Danielle Fishel]

Cute.

[Alan Bersten]

And it went so viral that they put that in the package.

[Danielle Fishel]

Really?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. And it was like. I mean, for weeks, people were just copying it, and it was just so, like, we didn't even think about it. It was just like. So just like, hey, let's do this quick video.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do this real fast.

[Alan Bersten]

And it was so fun. And it was just like, partners doing everything together.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's so cute.

[Alan Bersten]

And so, like, that was a really fun video.

[Danielle Fishel]

So talking about last season, we all remember Elaine's injury on Halloween night. I remember seeing your sad face up there on the.

[Alan Bersten]

Why would they do that to me?

[Danielle Fishel]

And I felt so bad for you. Were you sure you were going home?

[Alan Bersten]

I mean, there was. It was twofold. I was like, wow, they're really gonna send me home by myself. Elaine doesn't get eliminated. Only I get. Only you.

[Cal Penn]

Get out of here. What is this?

[Alan Bersten]

No. But part of me was like, elaine's journey is not done.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

So part of me was very hopeful and wishful of, like, this is not the end.

[Danielle Fishel]

This can't be the end.

[Alan Bersten]

She has so much more. She loves it so much. And so I was very hopeful. But then when they put me in the bottom three, I was like, jeez, what's going on here? And it was. Oh, that was very memeable of me just standing there hugging myself. Also, everyone's safe and they hug people and I'm just like, lovely. Just wanted to hug someone, but, you know, that was definitely scary.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, I know. I'll never forget that feeling of those bottom three and how much it catches you off guard. You know it's coming, but you don't think about it throughout the week. And then all of a sudden, everybody dance. You're enjoying everyone's dance. You're like, oh, my gosh, that was so incredible. And then it's like, oh, it's time. Shit, I forgot this part happens.

[Alan Bersten]

And it kind of happens really fast.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Alan Bersten]

Like, maybe not. And I don't know how it happens on tv, but when you're in the audience or when you're in the skybox watching, they're like, okay, last dance. Everyone down. You're like, oh, shit.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, that's exactly it. It's like out of nowhere, like, oh, my gosh, I forgot this and it's already here. Here it is.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, it's. Honestly, it doesn't get any easier. I've been a pro so many years and I'm still like, that's the worst part.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's the worst part.

[Alan Bersten]

It's out of your control. I think for me, the best thing and what I tell my partners is like, don't stress about it. Cause the more you stress about it during the week, then it's inevitable.

[Danielle Fishel]

No, I know. There's a part of me that is so grateful that it seems like it comes out of nowhere because it means I wasn't. I'm not focused on it at all. I'm just focused on, you know, what I'm doing and working hard and having fun. We are just a few months away, I know, from season 35. We know a few contestants already on the female side. We know Maura Higgins and Ciara Miller.

[Alan Bersten]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do either of these possibilities excite you?

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah, honestly, both. I also feel like anyone who does the show now is gonna want to do the show.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, exactly.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, they're not doing it just cause their agent made them.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

They're doing it cause they love. They're either fans of the show, they See how, like, fun it can be. But they want to do it. And to me, that's, like, the best thing in a partner.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly.

[Alan Bersten]

Somebody who wants to be there, who is passionate about it. Cause you can't teach passion. So both Maura and Sierra are great. I feel like they're both very popular on social media, which is a help. They both did traders.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, I know.

[Alan Bersten]

So I feel like they know how to play a game.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yep.

[Alan Bersten]

But when Dylan did this season, he was. Not that he was calculated. That sometimes has a bad connotation. But, like, he is.

[Danielle Fishel]

He played strategy.

[Alan Bersten]

He's very strategic.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, absolutely. Oh, I know. I was involved in.

[Alan Bersten]

I was looped into his strategery strategically, and it's great. You know, I think to a certain extent, you know, I think you don't want to come into the season and plan every little thing.

[Danielle Fishel]

No.

[Alan Bersten]

I think the beautiful part about Dancing with the Stars is the spontaneity, of

[Danielle Fishel]

course, and the unknown and the spirit.

[Alan Bersten]

The unknown, exactly.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. Letting that unfold.

[Alan Bersten]

And I think every week, that's actually what resonates more than anything else.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, when somebody has a surprisingly good week and you're like, where did that come from?

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

And that's what is special from that episode, you know? So I think the spontaneity of the show is. Is great. I think they were both on reality tv, so they understand the sharing aspect.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And I think that's very important as a celebrity.

[Danielle Fishel]

Closed off.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. And I'm curious how you were like, because was this your first stint in reality?

[Danielle Fishel]

It was, yeah. I mean, now, granted, I had hosted, so I. I was comfortable being myself, but I had never done a reality TV show, so it was my. My first go at it. And I do remember thinking a couple of times, it's very annoying to be mic'd all the time.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, there's. There's a vulnerability to it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And I think if you embrace that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

It's amazing if you try to, like, hide your feelings and America can't connect to you.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And at the end of the day, yes, it's a dance show, but it's about connecting and connecting with the audience and showing your true self and letting them learn something about you, because that's what's intriguing, whether you're learning the dance or learning something about yourself. People don't just want to see good dancing from the start, and that's it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Totally. And so it helps to be an authentic person, because if you are a reality TV star who is Very brand focused. And maybe who you are is not necessarily who your brand is, that would be difficult. But if you are an authentic person who's willing to show up as yourself, warts and all.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

You're gonna. You're gonna probably have a fan base that's gonna relate to you.

[Alan Bersten]

Exactly.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And I think that's the key of the show totally.

[Danielle Fishel]

People need. People need to be able to relate to you. If they can't relate to you, what are they voting for? What are they rooting for? How do they see themselves in you? Well, we're guaranteed to get a new pro this season thanks to the competition show, the Next Pro. Are you watching?

[Alan Bersten]

No, I'll definitely be watching. I think it's beautiful to see how the show is expanding. You know, I think the show had such success in season 34, and there's a right way to capitalize on that. And I think, you know, expanding the universe of Dancing with the Stars is the right way.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, I think the fans want more. It's really hard to do two seasons a year. I will not say no to two seasons a year, obviously, but I feel like it's hard to do that. And so this is a nice way to, like, ease into the new show, into the new season.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, I think you're right. Well, this will be another instance where a pro is going to burst right into the big show. With no troupe experience, you were able to soak in the show and learn the process. Do you think being on kind of this fast track to being a pro can hurt the dancer?

[Alan Bersten]

So I think this is the best way to do it without putting somebody on Troop.

[Cal Penn]

It's.

[Alan Bersten]

You test them out.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, they're gonna have to go through these challenges. You know, it is. You're being judged by Mark and Shirley, who are both unbelievable.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, plus a third rotating. Rotating judge.

[Danielle Fishel]

Professional dancer.

[Cal Penn]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

Which, you know, to me, Mark and Shirley are incredible choices.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, Mark is a phenomenal judge. So creative. Shirley is on Strictly. Who is this? She is like the goddess of ballroom.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yes. Yes.

[Alan Bersten]

You know, so it couldn't have been two better judges.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Alan Bersten]

And so now you're putting these contestants through a series of these challenges, which I imagine would only help set them up. You know, I think it's only gonna benefit them in the long run. And, you know, it adds that pressure which comes with the show, which on Troop, there isn't that pressure, you know, so that's something that you do have to learn. And the only way you get better as a pro is through experience. You know, no one can tell you a secret thing to make you better.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Alan Bersten]

It's just experiencing it for yourself and, and learning what works and hopefully having

[Danielle Fishel]

a good connection with your celeb.

[Alan Bersten]

Yeah. I would say to anyone, the biggest thing is make sure it's not about you. It's not about the pro. As a pro, it is our job to make our celebrities feel safe.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Alan Bersten]

And so that's like whenever I go into any season, that's my first, which

[Danielle Fishel]

might be hard in this case. They've had an entire show about them getting cast on the show and then they have to come in and be like, and it's not about me at all. Even though it was just all about me for 10 episodes.

[Alan Bersten]

But I think I feel like the, the people they have on the show are gonna.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, they know what they're getting into. I'm not letting Alan off that easy. We're dropping a bonus episode this Friday where I get to talk to my ballroom buddy some more and we listen to your embarrassing childhood stories. Which reminds me, I want listeners to send me their awkward tales. Just email a voice memo somewhere between one to two minutes to teenbeatpodmail.com and we just might play it on the show. And you can come see me and Alan at the ultimate DWTS fan convention and live show at the end of this month, July 31 to August 2 in Palm Springs. There are limited tickets still [e-mail] Teen Beat is an iHeart podcast produced and hosted by Danielle Fishel, executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman, executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor Tara Sudbaksh. The theme song is by Mark Hoppus. Yes, that Mark Hoppus. Follow us on Instagram teenbeatpod.

[Alan Bersten]

I'm U.S. transportation Secretary Sean Duffy. The sound of a seatbelt. It's one of the most important sounds in our car. It means everyone is ready and everyone is safe. The more our kids see us put on our seatbelts, the more natural it is for them to put theirs on too. Make it a priority. Buckle up every time. Hear the sound. Make it a habit. Paid for by nhtsa.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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