Michael Stephenson Meets World

Summary

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Pod Meets World — “Michael Stephenson Meets World”

Original Air Date: October 20, 2025
Host(s): Danielle Fishel, Ryder Strong, Will Friedle
Guest: Michael Paul Stevenson (actor, documentarian; “Troll 2”, “Best Worst Movie”)

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Episode Overview

This week, the Pod Meets World crew welcomes Michael Paul Stevenson — child star of infamous cult classic “Troll 2,” director of the acclaimed documentary “Best Worst Movie,” and old Oakwood childhood connection to Ryder Strong. The group delves into the weird journeys of childhood stardom, making peace with “bad” art that endures far beyond expectations, the true heart (and embarrassment) behind cult films, and Stevenson’s transition from in-front-of to behind the camera. The episode brims with hilarious memories, thoughtful insights on the meaning of legacy, and the bittersweet joys of creative work you can’t control.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Reconnecting with Old Friends & Oakwood Memories

[17:13–18:45]

• Michael and Ryder discover they were childhood friends, bonding at the Oakwood apartments during pilot seasons.
  • “I remember your family being one of the very few, if not the only sane families that lived in Oakwood.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [17:50]
• Reminiscing about skateboards, rollerblades, and the peculiar culture of young actors in LA.
• Mention of the “Hollywood Complex” documentary about Oakwood’s unique child-actor ecosystem.

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The Troll 2 Origin Story & Early Embarrassment

[19:05–23:42]

• Michael grew up in Utah, discovered acting in local theater, and pushed his parents for an agent — landing “Troll 2” on his very first audition.
  • “And the first movie audition I ever had was Troll 2.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [19:44]
• The cast filmed a movie called “Goblin” with no idea it would be relabeled “Troll 2.” Michael’s parents surprised him with the VHS on Christmas:
  • “It was not even a minute into that, and it was like, oh my God, this is a bad, bad movie.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [21:14]
• Early on, Michael wished no one would ever see the film—relatives would call to say, “Your crappy movie is on again!” [22:23]
• “In the TV Guide… below a half star, it was an icon of a turkey… Yeah, I got a turkey.”
  — Michael Paul Stevenson [23:38]

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Navigating “Best Worst Movie” & Finding Meaning

[23:50–27:13]

• Ryder praises “Best Worst Movie” as universally relatable for actors coping with “cringe” projects that outlive more “serious” work.
• Michael describes reconnecting with “Troll 2” director Claudio Fragasso and seeing beauty in the movie’s sincere, earnest failure.
  • “As I got older… I kept thinking about like, God, this guy somehow made this movie about vegetarian goblins in Utah with actors who couldn't act, couldn't speak the language. And he made it and it will be remembered.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [25:43]
• The cast, especially George Hardy (his movie father), have become lifelong friends [25:04].

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The Cult Phenomenon — Sincerity, Earnestness, and Lasting Impact

[27:13–31:29]

• The group compares “Troll 2” with other cult films, noting that what makes a “bad” movie endure is the sincerity of its creator.
  • “He made exactly the movie he wanted to make… and that is impressive.”
    — Ryder Strong [28:12]
• Michael reflects on how Fragasso eventually came to appreciate the humor and love fans found in his work, staying positive and supportive.

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Making & Releasing “Best Worst Movie” — The Process

[41:26–45:57]

• Michael explains his switch from acting to filmmaking, starting with documentary shorts and skateboard films.
• “Best Worst Movie” was self-financed and pieced together with help from T-shirt sales (“Nilbog” and “Goblin” shirts) and encouragement from his wife Lindsay.
  • “I made these simple green shirts… That’s my plane ticket to the next place… throughout that whole journey… you have moments where you’re like, how am I gonna do this?”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [44:49]
• The emotional toll was greater than anticipated, especially meeting cast/crew dealing with mental health issues, and seeing fans interpret the film anew every year.

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Documentary Filmmaking — Becoming Close with Subjects

[47:20–50:02]

• Michael on documentary work: lasting, almost sacred relationships with his subjects, learning more from them than anticipated.
  • “There’s really no other relationship you can compare it to outside of somebody… you really love.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [48:16]
• Quote from doc legend Al Maysles:
  • “When you make docs, it’s almost as though you have a thousand teachers.” [48:51]

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Post-Doc Work: The American Scream and Scripted Directing

[50:02–55:36]

• “The American Scream” (about home-haunter families in Massachusetts) originated from a TV network’s Halloween request; Michael pivoted from a “top 10” format to heartfelt character stories.
• First scripted film “Girlfriend’s Day,” starring Bob Odenkirk, came about when Odenkirk cited “Best Worst Movie” as a favorite in an interview—Michael had put Bob’s name on his “dream actor” vision board weeks earlier.
  • “He was like, I got this really weird comedy it’s never gonna get made, but I’d love for you to make it with me.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [55:19]

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Lessons from Child Acting for Directing

[55:40–57:04]

• “Acting was my first point into all of it… I understand how hard it is.”
  — Michael Paul Stevenson [56:11]
• Feeling more empathetic and better able to communicate with actors as a director.

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Family Life & Generational Legacy

[57:08–61:04]

• Michael is a father of three daughters (ages 9–18); two are interested in the arts, and the oldest is making her own films.
• Shares parental ambivalence about pushing kids into showbiz, given the difficulties and inevitable disappointments:
  • “It’s hard when you see inside the kitchen of this business. Right?... I want to encourage art and creativity, but I’m also a little more cynical now.”
    — Michael Paul Stevenson [60:45]

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The Enduring Mystery of Taste and Legacy

[63:37–64:44]

• Danielle, Will, and Ryder discuss the unpredictable life of artistic work: sometimes your “good” work is forgotten, “bad” work lasts forever (“The Room,” “Troll 2”).
  • “You do your best, you put it out there… it fails, and then 10 years later it’s everybody’s talking about it… and vice versa.”
    — Ryder Strong [63:38]
  • “If your goal as an artist is to make something that lasts, you’ve done it.”
    — Will Friedle [64:30]
• The importance, and powerlessness, of letting go of legacy and control.
  • “Is it one of the great lessons of life that we just don’t have control over anything?”
    — Danielle Fishel [64:44]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “I went on and I acted in other things that I thought would be more remembered… but those things didn’t, and so Troll 2 just continued.”
  — Michael Paul Stevenson [22:44]
• “Dog fighting!” — Will’s wild idea for a celebrity reality competition [07:00]
• “You become friends for a reason probably at the age of 10 or 11 and it’s probably a good reason to stay.”
  — Ryder Strong [66:13]
• “When you do feel like you have a story, part of it is just trying to listen to what that wants to be, as opposed to maybe what you want it to be.”
  — Michael Paul Stevenson [53:09]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [17:13] – Michael & Ryder uncover childhood Oakwood connection
• [19:05] – Michael’s journey to landing “Troll 2”
• [21:14] – First viewing of Troll 2 and reactions
• [25:04] – Relationships with cast/crew, including director Fragasso
• [28:12] – Cult sincerity, what makes “bad” movies memorable
• [41:46] – Transition from actor to documentary filmmaker
• [44:49] – DIY documentary production and emotional struggle
• [47:48] – Building relationships with documentary subjects
• [50:02] – Making “The American Scream”
• [55:19] – Origin of “Girlfriend’s Day” and working with Bob Odenkirk
• [57:08] – Raising kids and thoughts on showbiz legacy
• [63:37] – The unpredictable afterlife of pop culture projects

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Final Thoughts

This episode weaves together humor, nostalgia, and surprisingly profound commentary on fame, creation, and the legacy of art that persists—whether you want it to or not. Michael Paul Stevenson proves a warm, thoughtful guest, leaving both hosts and listeners smiling and reflecting, not just on “bad” movies, but on the strange forces that shape what endures.

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Transcript

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Ryder Strong]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Will Friedle]

Okay, so Danielle, I don't know if you're aware of this, but you're on.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Dancing with the Stars.

[Danielle Fishel]

Me?

[Will Friedle]

Yeah, you are. If you had so obviously somebody in a room somewhere at some point, what, you know, be funny or amazing or incredible is taking actors and teaching how to dance and we'll make a show out of it.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, pick.

[Will Friedle]

Make up a reality show right now. What would your reality show be that you would pitch with actors? With anything. With anything. What's your reality show?

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh my gosh. My reality show.

[Ryder Strong]

I think we're gonna have to limit it to like what would we make actors do?

[Danielle Fishel]

Because, yeah, I think you're right. I think we do need. Because honestly, I have a show that I've, I've talked to you guys about that. I think it's so simple and I don't know why I haven't even just made it myself yet. But like it has to be done because it's what I spend all of my time. When I scroll social media, I am obsessed with comments. The comedy that John, Mary, Joseph and you know, whoever out there can come up with when they watch a funny video and the comment they leave blows me away. Yeah, I want to watch a show, a cheap clip style show similar to the soup or the dish that I used to host called the comment section where you play the viral video or the clip, whatever it is that's going around the Internet, several of them. But after you watch the video you say, now let's check in on the comment section. And you just open up the comments and you highlight the people with the best comments. Then you have some sort of voting section and whoever won for comment of the day or comment of the video wins $10,000 or like that's great.

[Will Friedle]

So it's like America's Funniest Home Videos, but America's Funniest comment.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly. Just based on the comments because for one thing, great idea. If I could watch a 22 minute show and manage to see what are all these videos people are talking about because I don't necessarily have time to find them all on my own. Oh, these are all the videos of the day that people were talking about. Great. Oh my gosh. The 10 best comments or the 5 best comments under everyone that's Hysterical. Like, I would love to get my social media. This is the best of the best that happened today in one cheap format way.

[Ryder Strong]

You know what I would recommend, too, is to keep it quiet. Wholly positive. So, like, correct.

[Danielle Fishel]

You do not taking somebody down, say.

[Ryder Strong]

Like, boo to this comment.

[Danielle Fishel]

No, you not yucking somebody's yum. It is. It is in celebration of the comment.

[Ryder Strong]

Section should be celebrated for, you know, positive, funny, whatever. Not.

[Danielle Fishel]

Not.

[Ryder Strong]

Because there might be really funny comments that are ripping apart the video or, you know, talking about someone's appearance or whatever. So you just have to avoid those. But I love that idea. Yeah, I love that idea. Good one. Good one.

[Will Friedle]

You got one, Ryder.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I don't know.

[Ryder Strong]

Just off the top of my head, I mean, I was trying to think of, like, actors in situations. You know, I love school. I love college. I would love to do a show where you take, like, actors and that had never went to college and be like, now let's. Let's follow you. Like, go.

[Will Friedle]

No, they did that with. What's his name? With Tommy Lee. Tommy Lee, the drummer from Motley Crue went to college. Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, I think that'd be great. It'd be great. And, like, just give him, like, a full semester in, like, a subtle. That they always thought they wanted to do. Like, you know, where you used to want to be an archaeologist. Right. Like, I think, like, watching you, like, do that for a semester and, like, you know, really take it seriously as like, a doc of, like, what's this experience like?

[Will Friedle]

Yeah, that's.

[Danielle Fishel]

What's it like for them on campus?

[Will Friedle]

And.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. You know, do they get recognized? Who do they become friends with? What do the teachers think of them? That's a really good idea.

[Will Friedle]

I have a couple. One of them that I've always wanted to do because I love cooking shows, but they're all already chefs. I want to have somebody follow me while I actually go to culinary school.

[Danielle Fishel]

Such a good idea.

[Ryder Strong]

There you go.

[Will Friedle]

Like, it's never been one where it's like, how do you become a chef? Like, I want to do that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Will Friedle]

But the other one, for celebrities, I want to do celebrity aerial dog fighting.

[Danielle Fishel]

What? What?

[Will Friedle]

Like, they learn, like. Like, they learn how to fly the planes, and you learn how to.

[Ryder Strong]

And it's got.

[Will Friedle]

You do, like, dog fighting with. You have to learn how to fly, and then you learn. It's like aerial dog fighting.

[Danielle Fishel]

Gosh, that sounds great. There are so many people with. With fear of heights, though. I think that might be.

[Will Friedle]

You have to try it, though. It would Just be so much fun.

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, I would try it. It's. It's right up my alley.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

I could die doing it. I could do it at high speed.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'm not afraid of heights.

[Will Friedle]

And you're super competitive people down. Like, you know.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah.

[Will Friedle]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

You know, I actually did it.

[Will Friedle]

Aerial dog fighting.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. My parents found this company that did it and surprised me and my brother with it when we were like, 15, 16, where they train you for a whole day. And you get into day.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

Not a whole day.

[Danielle Fishel]

You have to give up a whole day to learn how to fly a plane.

[Ryder Strong]

You're sitting in a classroom. You're sitting in a classroom for like, six, seven hours.

[Danielle Fishel]

Six or seven hours?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

And then they put you like. We have.

[Danielle Fishel]

I trust you.

[Ryder Strong]

You're in a World War II, like, era plane. But they have the. They have a stick behind you. So they're really, like, flying.

[Will Friedle]

They're flying.

[Ryder Strong]

You're. You're giving. You have a stick in the front. You are actually in control of. So once you're up there and they're like.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And.

[Ryder Strong]

And then they. So dangerous. They had rigged. They had rigged the plane so that when you shot at each other once, you got. Because they teach you exactly what they have to do and how you get behind each other. Smoke would come out if you, like, you know, hit the other person. So Shiloh and I. Dog. Yeah. And I've never been more sick because apparently it's. The guy was like, let's do some barrel rolls and let's do some loops. And I was like, oh, God. Like, did you throw up? No. But I was probably the most nauseous I've ever been in my life.

[Will Friedle]

I'm amazed because something like 90% of people that do that throw up. Like Tom Cruise was throwing up with. During the first Top Gun. Like, everybody. Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

So, yeah. Not. Not really my thing. But Shiloh was totally fine. And, like, he ended up taking flying lessons after that because it was so.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Fun and, like, he was so.

[Danielle Fishel]

Now that I know this, I think we should just have, like, let's teach celebrities to be surgeons. Like, you spend a whole day, you get a whole day, six or seven hours.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And then. You know what?

[Will Friedle]

A lot of people don't know about that real surgery. If you touch the sides, the patient buzzes. A lot of people didn't know that that's a real thing. That's a little factoid for you.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

If you touch the side, it's actually.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, I love that game. I love that game. Try to get the bone out.

[Will Friedle]

Exactly. Remove the bone around the knee, collect a thousand dollar fee. Yeah, awesome.

[Danielle Fishel]

What about celebrity lawyers?

[Ryder Strong]

What about taking actors, though?

[Will Friedle]

I know actors that are putting on trial for their.

[Danielle Fishel]

I trust them with a real trial.

[Ryder Strong]

I bet you they'd nail it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, did this person murder?

[Ryan Seacrest]

God?

[Will Friedle]

It's actually. There's some great celebrity, there's some. Some great possible comedy shows we can do.

[Danielle Fishel]

Morals out the window.

[Ryder Strong]

We have got some great.

[Will Friedle]

Haven't we done that already with a lot of the shows that are out there?

[Danielle Fishel]

Listen, guys, I just like ballroom dancing. There's nothing wrong with ballroom dancing.

[Will Friedle]

That is. You're right. That's a good one.

[Danielle Fishel]

Welcome to pod meets world. I'm Danielle Fishel.

[Ryder Strong]

I'm Ryder Strong.

[Will Friedle]

And I'm Will Friedle.

[Danielle Fishel]

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[Will Friedle]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Will Friedle]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Will Friedle]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Listen to High Key, a new weekly podcast. You better listen. That's literally the definition of being an Aries Moon. Just one little spicy off comment that's Everyone loves me at the Cancer and then the Aries comes out and they say, who the is that? No you're gonna come for me being an Aries and you have a sag Moon. Get outta here. But I'm a Capricorn Rising, so that honestly balances it out and makes me more likable. Okay, that is your Capricorn talking. Listen to High key on the iHeartRadio.

[Jacob Goldstein]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Danielle Fishel]

As always, our favorite part of Pod Meets World is how just one small side quest conversation can turn into so much more. Oh, Natanya Ross, you were in a movie called Munchies 2. Let's watch it. What's that background actor's name again? That's right, it's Dusty. Let's find him. And some can even make us cry, like Matthew Foster, the Make a Wish kid we were reminded of from a random email. It has been an incredible ride, never really knowing where the road will take us. So when Ryder mentioned a recent documentary he loved, where much of the premise and heart reminded him of what we've done here on Pod Meets World, Jensen said he knew the director and the rest is, well, this podcast episode. And hilariously, somehow, Ryder knows the director, too. When our guest booked a Horror Film In 1990, his first job as a kid in Hollywood, he had no idea what he was stepping into. Commonly called the best Worst movie ever, Troll 2 may have been an ignored B movie spectacle when it was released, but it's since taken on a life of its own. So much so that the child star, now grown up, made a documentary to fully understand the insanity he experienced. The film became a Top Doc of 2009, but it helped him process and grasp what the experience meant to him even years later. Which, yes, sounds very familiar. And he's since made another documentary, this time about lavish residential haunted houses, which he never acted in, and has found himself back in Hollywood now, behind the camera, directing scripted films. This week we welcome one of our most unique brothers in the fraternity of child actors. He's the star of Troll 2, the director of Best Worst Movie, and one of Ryder's childhood friends. It's Michael Paul Stevenson.

[Will Friedle]

Hi.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

Hi.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Hello. Hey, how are you?

[Ryder Strong]

Fine, how are you?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Good. Drinking an espresso, Trying to wake up. Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Good for you. I've got a coffee right here in my Philly Forever at Ever Mug.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Nice.

[Danielle Fishel]

We put out the troll 2 bat signal and we are so happy you responded.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Wild movie will never go away.

[Danielle Fishel]

No, we don't want it to.

[Ryder Strong]

It's too good.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I have a bit of news that may surprise you as well, Ryder. I don't know if you remember, but we were pals. We lived in Oakwood together. This is so funny.

[Ryder Strong]

Jensen told me this and I was like, what? So. Yes. I don't remember. I don't make this connection. We hung out, like, all the time at the clubhouse.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, it's wild. Your mom and your brother, Shiloh, I think you were. I remember your family being one of the very few, if not the only sane families lived in Oakwood. It was such a crazy.

[Ryder Strong]

Did you have rollerblades? Did we go rollerblading together? I had.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I had a. I had a skateboard. You had rollerblades.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh, you were awake.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

You know, it was a weird.

[Will Friedle]

It was.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

It was a. It was an interesting. That whole place is such a wild. Yeah, Wild, wild world. I don't know if you. I don't know if you've seen. There's a documentary actually called the Hollywood Complex that is all centered on Oakwood and the child actors that grew up there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's. It's in its dark.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's a good documentary, but it's.

[Ryder Strong]

So, wait, how long were you there?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I was there, let's see, from the time I was 12 until about 16, just like every pilot season. So, yeah, I was there.

[Danielle Fishel]

And you're originally from Texas, right? So how did you. How did you decide to make the move to Los Angeles?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Well, I actually was born in Texas, but I didn't live there very long. I was adopted and grew up in Utah, of all places. And in Utah, I started doing stage, doing theater when I was really young. Loved it. And then somebody from one of those productions said, oh, you should do this professionally and talk to my parents. I was probably seven or eight at the time. And my parents were like, no way. This is not anything we're going to do. And I continued to push and push, and this was in Utah, of all places, because I loved. I loved theater, I loved acting and ultimately ended up pushing them into getting an agent when I was nine and a half. And the first movie audition I ever had was Troll two. Oh, my God.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. So when you were at the Oakwoods, you're coming off of Troll 2, right? Like, what did that mean? Did it have any effect? Like backlash or positive? I mean, you did a movie, which is a good sign, but did. Did people think of it as a bad or it didn't even register, I think.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I think it was one of those films that didn't really register at that point. I mean, it registered for me, like it was the sort of thing where I had hoped and prayed that nobody would see that film.

[Ryder Strong]

Back then. You knew. You were immediately like, I'm not gonna talk.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah. So, I mean, I had. I remember the first time that I had watched it, we made the movie. And a lot of times, as you guys know, you make movies and you don't know when they're gonna come out, what they're going to be. You have. You don't have any idea. And after we made the movie as a. As a ten and a half year old, I was like, okay, like, the next time, like, you know, next time that we all come together as a cast will be at the big premiere and we'll watch our movie together. And time went by and kind of was like, oh, where is that movie? And of all things, my parents had. Had. Had tracked it down. And on Christmas morning, I remember unwrapping presents and then actually coming across a strange vhs. And, you know, it says. It said Troll two. Because when we made the movie, it wasn't. It was called Goblin, which makes more sense.

[Ryder Strong]

That's the way it's written.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

My God. Yeah. And my dad was like, put it in. Like, let's watch your movie. And I mean, it was not even a minute into that, and it was like, oh, my God, this is a bad, bad movie. And so. And it was kind of a thing where like, okay. And then you become a teenager and continued acting. But I had this one uncle who every. Like, for some reason, Troll 2 was constantly programmed at the, you know, the latest hours of night on hbo, like, over and over and over again. And I had an uncle who would. He would. He would call me every weekend because he'd get the TV Guide and he'd be like, michael, your crappy movie is on again. Oh, my gosh.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, my gosh.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I love it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Now. We laugh about it now, but when you. When you got those phone calls, then what. What was the feeling you had?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I mean, you know, like, you're. You're at an age that's obviously very. You know, you're. You're impressionable. It's formative. You. You're trying to be. I think for me, the biggest thing was, is I. I went on and I. I acted in other things that I thought would be more remembered or were more. What, you know, just, like, deserved more attention. But those things and in hindsight, I. I get it now. Yeah. Those things didn't. And so Troll 2 just continued. And it was very much a. Like, you know, I remember in the TV Guide, because there was a rating system in the old TV Guides, and it was like, you know, one to four star. There was even a half star, and then below a half star, it was an icon of a turkey.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, my gosh.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh, geez.

[Will Friedle]

Oh, no.

[Ryder Strong]

You got the turkey.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I got a turkey, so.

[Ryder Strong]

Wow.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah.

[Will Friedle]

First of all, for the record, we've all done them. We've all have those movies in our past where it's like, oh, man, that's.

[Ryder Strong]

Just part of being an actor, you know? I mean, that's why I found the documentary so fascinating, is because I felt like this is applicable well beyond this. This one film, you know, and in some ways, you're the most fortunate of the cast because you were a kid, you know, you had the biggest. You had the most, like, understandable lack of cultural awareness. Right. Or lack of taste. Right. And so that's why I think it's so fascinating that you really initiated this journey of, like, exploring that question, like, what is. You know, how. How do you evaluate the things you're in as an actor? And then how do you feel about that? And, man, I thought you just did such a good job with the documentary. And it turns out I'm, like, a huge fan because I also love American Screaming. I didn't realize that was you. So then when I looked that up, I was like, oh, my God, I love your work, man. You are so good, and you're so sensitive to your subjects, and I just couldn't believe the way you balance this, you know, where you're. You're understanding where everybody's coming from, but you're also showcasing some pretty strange people and their understanding of their own movie. Have you. Have you stayed in touch with the cast of Troll 2 or. When the documentary came out, did that change the relationship with them?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I. Yeah, I mean, I've stayed. I've stayed in touch with. With some of them. George Hardy, who played my father. We're still. We're so close, and like, having. Having a friendship all these years later, like, he's. He's a remarkable man on a number of levels. Just strange and funny and interesting, and I just. I. I love. I love him to death. So I stayed in touch with him. I actually was in Italy last year, and I hadn't talked to him in a few years, but I've stayed in touch with Claudio Ferragasso, the director of Troll 2. Yeah, I have, because like, I have a real, also a real. I've grown to have a real love and appreciation for this guy who was so impressionable to me as a young kid. And you guys know making anything in this business is hard. And so as I got, as I got older and I got more distance from the movie, I kept thinking about like, God, like this guy somehow made this movie about vegetarian goblins in Utah with actors who couldn't act, couldn't speak the language. And he made it and, and it will be remembered.

[Ryder Strong]

Right?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And there's a part in the documentary that I always love and it's when he's holding his 35 millimeter PR reel for the first time and he's like, I've never held my actual movie. And he talks about how important it is to just, you know, make something that isn't forgotten. And so he, he's the guy that I've gotten close to. And when I was in Italy last summer, I phoned him up and we went and had dinner together. And it was just one of those moments where you're like, this the movie. Strangely Troll 2 and Best Force movie, whatever has given me so much in my life with respect to relationships. But gross as a filmmaker to just experiences I wouldn't trade for anything.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. I mean, part of the reason why the movie is so memorable is that earnestness that he is putting forth. I mean, he made exactly, it seems like he made exactly the movie he wanted to make. And that's what's. So I feel like there's a version of the documentary that you made where you track down the director and he's like, yeah, it was a piece of crap. We, you know, I know we didn't have the money, we didn't have the things I wanted, whatever. But hey, it was fun. And instead he's like, no, this is the movie I wanted to make. Why are they laughing? I don't quite get why they're laughing when I didn't mean it to be funny. And that, that is a big swing. That's like, that's artistry, right? And like, that's however you feel about the movie. Like he made exactly what he wanted to and that is impressive. And I, yeah, it's fascinating to me that he's still doubling down on that. I feel like there's a lot of so called cult films, especially in horror, that sort of take being a cult film as the easy way out because they can't achieve what they were Going to. So they're just like, ah, let's just have bad effects and we'll call it a day, you know, or whatever, and we'll just laugh at it. I mean, in a lot of ways, I feel like even Cabin Fever kind of turned out that way. It was like. I think Eli at first wanted to make more of a straightforward, scary film, realized that's not gonna happen. You know, it's a little ridiculous. And then as a cast, we kept bringing this energy of, like, where's this? And I think while we were filming it, Eli and Brayston was like, you know what? It's all the tones I want this movie to be. And he, to his credit, earnestly invested in a million different directions. So it's became more of a cult horror film. But I don't think it started that way, you know, And I think that. So I love that, that, that the director was just. Yeah. Like, he's still true to it. And he wasn't. He wasn't offended by your documentary. Like, he didn't feel like it.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

No, he. I mean, I think there is, there is, there is, there is a process where he came to understand just what it is. I think he had some feelings right off the bat with, like, trying to understand it all, but he's never been anything but supportive, but just, like, positive around anything that's being made, period. Like, he's just. He's just that kind of guy. So I never, you know, and, and, and, and I had hoped that, like, when I made it, you know, it's. It's sort of like a strange, dysfunctional family of sorts. Right? Like, you make it. You. There, there. There are realities and there are. There are truths that you experience for sure, and some of them are absurd and don'. Intense connection that I have to all the people and this experience that I had, and it is. Writer, you hit it. I mean, you said it so well in, in, in respect to the thing that I identified most with, with him. And what I really came to love is his sincerity and lack of irony and just being genuine and, and, and, and that takes courage, especially when you're. When you're set up to fail, when it's against all odds. Right? So. Yeah.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this fall. Take care of the little ones in the family. With Baby Club Savings now through November 4, spend $25 on select Baby Club products and save $5. Shop for items like Pediasure bottles, Pedialyte powder packs, Huggies, baby wipes, Huggies diapers, Gerber puffs and Gerber pouches, and save $5 when you buy $25 or more on participating products. Offer ends November 4th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Listen to High Key, a new weekly podcast. You better listen. That's literally the definition of being an Aries Moon. Just one little spicy off comment, that's all it takes. Everyone loves me at the Cancer and then the Aries comes out and they said, who the is that? No, you're you're gonna come for me being an Aries and you have a sag Moon, get out of here. But I'm a Capricorn rising, so that honestly balances it out and makes me more likable. Okay, that is your Capricorn talking. Listen to High key on the iHeartRadio.

[Jacob Goldstein]

App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

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[Jacob Goldstein]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Hey, everyone.

[Jacob Goldstein]

Ed Helms here.

[Ryan Seacrest]

And hi, I'm Kal Penn, and we're.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

The hosts of Irsay the Audible and.

[Ryan Seacrest]

I Heart Audiobook Club.

[Jacob Goldstein]

This week on the podcast, I am sitting down with Jenny Garth, host of the iHeart podcast. I choose me to discuss the new Audible adaptation of the timeless Jane Austen classic Pride and Prejudice. This is not a trick question.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

There's no wrong answer.

[Jacob Goldstein]

What role would I play?

[Danielle Fishel]

You know what? I can see you as Mr. Darcy. You got a little call in first.

[Jacob Goldstein]

Okay, that's really sweet. I appreciate that, but are you sure I'm not the dad?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I'm not Mr. Bennett here. Listen to Earsay the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

I want to go back to you. Your. Your audition for the movie. You said you, you did the movie when you were ten and a half. Had you ever seen a horror movie? Do you remember your audition?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I mean, I, I, I, I saw ET Was one of my first. The first movies I ever saw. Yeah, I remember my audition really well. And I saw Gremlins also as well, when I was 6 or 5 or so. And actually the very first horror movie I saw, which I think was even younger than that, was, I had sneakily watched it from the stairs of my older sister. She's having a sleepover, was a terrible horror movie called Chud.

[Will Friedle]

Oh, I remember Chud.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Oh, yeah, Jeez. Yeah, terrible. So, but remembering my audition, I remember it very well. You know, it took place in park. It took place in a hotel in Park City. And I remember my agent being like, this is. This is. This is for the lead role. And walking into a room, and it was just full of the smell of European cigarettes. Like, I just remember just being like, oh, my God. You know, we're in Utah, and Claudio just yelling at me, just being, you know, I'd read the lines. He's like, bigger, Louder, Bigger, bigger. And I just remember, like, going crazy and then. And then him saying, you may leave. And I laughed. And, like, weeks later, got a call that said, you know, I got the lead role.

[Danielle Fishel]

You didn't have to do a callback or anything. It was just the one audition.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah. Just one audition. Yeah.

[Will Friedle]

You may leave.

[Ryder Strong]

I love. You may leave.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

You may leave. You may leave.

[Danielle Fishel]

And so during filming, were you starting to be like, huh, I wonder how this is gonna turn out. Like, walk us through a typical day on the set of Troll 2.

[Will Friedle]

And had you seen Troll 1?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

No, it was Goblin.

[Ryder Strong]

It had no relation to Troll 1. It was making Goblin.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

That's right.

[Jacob Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

So. So we got. Yeah. I mean, I still have my original script and it was printed on. It looks like an old, like, dot matrix printer. And, you know, it says Goblin. And for me, like, it was. We actually filmed the movie, obviously, like, out of order. And the first thing that we filmed was the scene where my mother is, you know, her body is on the kitchen table and she's getting eaten. So basically the end of this. Spoiler alert. Yeah, I know. Yeah. And I remember just being like, you know, it's not knowing, again, like a. Facts or any of these sorts of things and thinking, okay, well, there must be some. Some. Some. Some Matt, you know, some magic here that I'm. I'm not seeing. But it wasn't a. It wasn't really a slowdown and. And be critical about it. It was like, like, do your role.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Have fun. This sort of thing. And then I. The other thing I remember, and it's funny, the things you remember when you're young and then the impressions you have is we had. We had cheap pizza for lunch every single day. And I remember sometimes the pizza, it was like, recycled from the previous day. Oh, gee. And just like giant pieces. Yeah. And I just remember as a kid being like, why can't they afford to.

[Danielle Fishel]

Give us good pizza?

[Ryan Seacrest]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

Just.

[Danielle Fishel]

No, it doesn't even need to be good.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah. But, yeah, maybe today, right?

[Ryan Seacrest]

Was this.

[Will Friedle]

Was this like a skeleton crew? I mean, was it. Was it down and dirty, you're running into places like, guerrilla filmmaking style, or what did it seem like a legit production?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

It seemed. That's the thing. I mean, that is the thing about Troll 2 is despite how weird and strange and bad it is, there is still an underlying level of. Of competence. Right. So it's not like. It's not like guerrilla style. Like. Like it felt very formal with respect to, like, film production.

[Ryder Strong]

Right.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And there was a sizable crew and there was order and there was all these sorts of things. So what. It didn't. It never had the feeling of, oh, wow, we're. We're. We're. We're. Yeah. Yeah. In fact. In fact, I think. I think that's also one of the reasons why none of the older cast members ever questioned it, because there was such an authority and such a confidence and such an outward. Like, we've got this figured out. We know exactly what we're doing. Right. Yeah. And, you know, shot on 35 the DP. Like, he was like, full on. He was Like a caricature of a dp. Like everything was so, so serious. Yeah, no, I mean, that's the thing.

[Ryder Strong]

It's like, there's so many bad movies where it's just, like, horrible framing and somebody just up against a white wall and, like, you're just like, well, they don't know what they're doing. But this movie, it's like, you know, a moving down a hallway shot, but then it's just the character motivation is making no sense. So, like, the character's just, like, turning to face the camera for no reason, and you're like, okay, that shot's good, but why is he doing that? Like, it's, that's what makes it so beautiful. It's like, yeah, okay.

[Will Friedle]

But I mean, I guess if your goal is to make a film that.

[Ryder Strong]

Lasts, that's what you did.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yes.

[Will Friedle]

I mean, right.

[Ryder Strong]

It's not being swayed. It is, right? I mean, and he changed vegetarianism forever. This, the message got out. It is.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And like, it's the sort of thing that you can never, you can never plan. And also is. There is a weird magic to it. I mean, it is a, it is a, it is a movie that's despite, you know, what it does or doesn't do and all the things in which it falls short, it has continued to provide people with this strange level of, like, just joy. Right. Humor. And it's so weird because it just, I mean, I, I, it is a sort of thing where I will continually get messages about even younger people now discovering the movie, you know, a few months ago or during the, during the election campaign this last year, Paul Scheer. And how did they get, how did this get made? They did a Troll 2 screening, and in, like, in an hour, they raised, like, $300,000 for the election.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

So there's all sorts of positive, like, and it is like, one of these things where we as. I love movies, and I love the community experience of watching a movie. And to get into a theater that's sold out and to see people enjoy this weird, awful movie that was made almost 30 years ago now, it's still one of those things where you're like, this is pretty remarkable.

[Ryder Strong]

So I want to ask about your transition to behind. Well, transition to making the documentary, I guess. But also when you stopped acting, if you officially stopped acting, like, were those two things happening simultaneously, or did you take a break from acting, know that you wanted to be a director, and then decide to make the doc?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, I, I, I mean, from the time I was a teenager, I, I, I was making my own skateboarding movies. I loved, I, I loved the process of making something I loved. I love photography, I love shooting and acting. I also loved, I, I loved it more when I was doing theater. And, and I think, you know, as I got older, I mean, I had a lot of friends, I'm sure you're the same writer, a lot of friends that, like, I look at where they're at now and I'm like, oh, Jesus, like, like, it's terrible. And I also, as I got older, you know, you get scripts and you're like, this is terrible. And so it became harder and harder to sort of like. And I officially stopped acting. I think the last thing that I did was I did an episode of Touched by an angel when I was 22 or 23, and that was the last thing that I did. And soon after that, I always wanted to make films. And soon after that, I met my wife and we moved to Los Angeles, which has always sort of felt like a second home. And I was writing a thing that I had no business making, but I was very much, like, in love with, but I would never get a maid, given where I was at in my career and had the dream of being a filmmaker. And it wasn't long after that, this was the whole MySpace era, that out of the blue, I started getting messages from kids all over the world not knowing about each other, saying, here's a photo of our Troll 2 party we had in our basement. And we dressed up and we, and we pretended to piss on food. And I just remember being like, what in the world? And thinking about that movie and being like, how? And I had a moment where I woke up and I remember, just think I said to my wife, Lindsay, I said, I am this child star of the worst movie ever made. This is a great doc opportunity. And it felt like I could make it. It felt like I could just start making it. And in a couple of months, Upright Citizens of Brigade Theater in New York, they planned the first Troll 2 screening. And it became like, okay, this the first thing I got to film for the doc, naturally. And then I started on a three plus year journey of, of making the film.

[Ryder Strong]

Wow.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, so, and you were just doing.

[Ryder Strong]

It completely on your own. You're just grabbing your camera, getting your crew together and oh, good for you.

[Will Friedle]

You'Re making skateboard films. So were you a Stacy Peralta and Bones Brigade fan?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I sure was. That's what I figured. Yeah, same, same.

[Will Friedle]

I figured those, just watching those videos are the coolest Things in the world.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Back in the day, it was the best.

[Will Friedle]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And when I was making the doc, I remember, like, I made. You know, I was like, okay, I gotta figure out ways to get from city to city. And so I would. I made these simple green shirts that said nail Bog on the front and Goblin on the back. And every screening, I would take hundreds of those, and they'd sell out. And I was like, okay, that's. That's my plane ticket to the next place. But, you know, like, I make it sound all. And you guys know how this is. But, like, throughout that whole journey of making that doc, you have moments where you're like, how am I gonna do this? Where am I gonna go next?

[Ryan Seacrest]

All these.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And. And really, to the credit, my partner, my wife. I remember many times, because we were having our first child soon, right around that time, walking Runyon and being like, I can't keep working on this doc, And. And. And Lindsay being like, no, no, you. You gotta. You gotta finish it. You gotta finish it. And so we just took it one. We just. Just did what I could and just stayed consistent on it until it was. Until it was over.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, similarly to Pod Meets World, you really allowed this project to help you process a childhood experience. Was it a bigger undertaking, emotionally than you expected?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, for sure. And both, like, you know, I mean, meeting. Meeting the. The store owner and interviewing him and hearing him tell me that he. He wanted to. He wanted to kill me. My gosh. And then also, like, coming into contact, you know, the. The. The. The woman who played my mother in the film, she's. She is, you know, mentally ill now and really suffers. And so I hadn't seen her in years and years and years. And so trying to process that. And aside from that, also just the feeling of trying to get something. Just trying to get my first doc made. Anytime you make something, I think for me at least, it's always a more emotional thing that you imagine. I think some. Sometimes that naivete in the beginning is what helps you because you're like, okay, I'm just gonna do this. And. And, you know, so I'm curious about.

[Ryder Strong]

That because, like, you know, when I watch a doc like that, I'm always like, I could never. I don't think I could do this. Like, I don't think I could sit in a room and draw these people out, you know, and you do it so well. You do it in American Scream, too. Like, you have a way of, like, sitting with a character and, like, were you always that way or Is that something that you discovered that you had to do because you're sitting across from, like, the woman who played your mom, and you're just like, I have to just sort of let this happen and not make this person feel uncomfortable.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I don't think it's something that necessarily I discovered. Like, I've always been really interested in just people and curious about individuals and trying to understand them. I think the more you do it, the more that has only taken hold. And I think it's a documentary filmmaker. I'll actually never, I'll never forget because I had actually Best first movie, was invited to the screen at Al Maisel's little theater in Brooklyn. And I'm a massive fan of Gray Gardens. And, and Al, actually, he, he had me producer. We stayed with them in Brooklyn, and so we had the recap. We just hung out with him. And it was one of these moments where, like, God, this is the guy, like an idol of mine. But he had said, he had told me something. He said, you know, when you make docs, it's, it's almost as though you have a thousand teachers. And it's true in that respect, in that, like, you don't. There's a very, almost sacred relationship you have with a subject, and you get very close to them, if, at least for me, to where the, the level you understand each other. Like, there's really no other relationship you can compare it to outside of somebody, you know, a partner or, or somebody you really love. And so you get a look into someone's life and who they are, warts and all. And there's a real vulnerability. There's a real sort of like, trust, all these sorts of things. But I always feel like for me, it, it's, I'm being taught right. Like, I always feel like I'm getting the better of it. Like, I will see American Scream any of these characters that I, I'm still close with them. And I always feel like there's something that I take that's very positive. And I'm like, wow, I want to be more like that. And I've learned that from this person. And so, yeah, and I think the more and more you do it, the more you're like, wow, I, I, you just get such an interesting look into perspective and the lives that others live. When you're a documentary filmmaker and you have a relationship where you can really share and, you know, and grow close.

[Danielle Fishel]

In case any of our listeners don't know, I do want to let People know your. Your next documentary was the American Scream, a movie about three families who turn their houses into extravagant Halloween attractions in Massachusetts. What do you think drew you to scares.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Chuck? Yeah, that was an interesting. Like, I, you know, I like horror films, but I. That specific American Scream. There was. There was a network part of NBC Universal called Chiller that was all horror programming. And after best first movie came out, they came and they said, we. Do you want to do something around Halloween? And they were like, we want to do something on Halloween. Haunted houses. And it was basically that brought in. And in their minds, they were like, top 10, you know, something you would see on TV. Top 10 haunted houses sort of thing. And I have a very, very fond memory of a woman in my neighborhood who was considered the weird woman growing up that every Halloween, her whole. She would transform her whole house into the den of terror, and the whole neighborhood would. Would descend on this woman's house for that one night. And I remember being magical and. And then the rest of the year, nobo talk to her. And so when they came to me with that, I sort of secretly was like, I don't want to make a commercial haunted house film. I want to make a we. I want to. I want to find these families. And fortunately for me, I got so far into making it that by the time they really looked at it closely.

[Ryder Strong]

What I was making, it was too far.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

It was too late. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

The sunk cost fallacy worked to your advantage.

[Ryder Strong]

That is great.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, also, I want to talk about your first scripted film, Girlfriend's Day, which is written by and stars Bob Odenkirk and Amber Tamblyn, Natasha Lyonne and my new friend, Andy Richter.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh, that's right.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

You know, Andy Richter makes the best banana bread I've ever had in my entire life.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I had no idea.

[Danielle Fishel]

It is delicious. The other day, I get to work and I see Andy. I go, andy, how you doing? He goes. He goes, I'm okay. I go, what's wrong, Andy? He goes, well, I thought my rehearsal was at nine, but it was at one. And I said, oh, my gosh, it's, you know, one o'. Clock. I'm just arriving there. I go, have you been here all morning? He goes, no, I made banana bread. I said, you made banana bread in this little kitchen? He goes, no, I went home and I made banana bread. It's in this little kitchen, though, if you want to try it. I was like, hell, yeah, I want to try it. I go, I take a bite. I'm like, this is the Best banana.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Bread I've ever had. He goes, thank you.

[Danielle Fishel]

I really tried a lot of recipes. It was the greatest thing ever.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

That's amazing.

[Danielle Fishel]

Congratulations on this movie. Did you ever think when you were running around the oak woods, is this the career and life you envisioned for yourself? Did you ever picture being this kind of documentary slash movie director?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I mean, I always imagined like film and just has always felt like it was just going to be a thing that I did. I didn't know what shape or form and I still don't like stories come. Come new thing. You just don't. Don't really see everything that's coming. And I think that when you do feel like you have a story, part of it is just trying to listen to what that wants to be and as opposed to maybe what you wanted want it to be. So. And girlfriends say also just a weird, I mean, wild, wild thing where we had. We had finished making the American. Well, we were editing the American Scream in my garage and Lindsay, my wife and I, my producing partner and I, we were. I was doing the dumb thing on. On a whiteboard where I was writing down the names of. Of my favorite comedians that I felt like had really strong dramatic sensibilities but hadn't been seen dramatically as much as they had in world of comedy. And we were huge fans of Mr. Show. Yeah.

[Will Friedle]

Such a good show.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

So fun. And this was like season two of maybe Breaking Bad. So.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

So Bob was just in the background of it. We were really excited. We're like, oh, it's Bob and I. And I wrote. I did the thing where I was like, right, act dream actors you would want to work with. And I wrote his name down on this, this. On this whiteboard in my office. And it wasn't four or five weeks after that that there was an interview that I think the Onion or the AV Club did with him, and they were asking him about his favorite films and he named best first movie.

[Ryder Strong]

Wow.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And yeah. Yeah. And so then we connected and we were coming up on the premiere of American Scream and completely just. I was like, hey, turns out Bob's. Bob's son was also going through a difficult time in this period in his life. And he was a huge Troll Tooth fan and loved the movie and yada, yada, yada. So we make. We make the American Scream. We premiere it. I invited Bob and his family thinking there's no way he's gonna come. And he came and he was like an hour early and he's like, I got this really weird comedy it's never gonna get made, but I'd love to. For you to make it with me or let's talk about it. And then that started that process. Wow.

[Will Friedle]

So cool.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, it's wild.

[Danielle Fishel]

How do you think your experience as a child actor helps you behind the camera?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Oh, that's a good question. I think really having an understanding and a respect and a love and appreciation for how hard it is in front of a camera and understanding just the language of acting thing. Right. Like I, I am reminded sometimes when I've worked on other projects that a lot of people have don't understand what it is like to actually be an actor.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And it's hard for me to not understand that because it's been part of me forever. And so it is a thing now where I'm like, wow, it's a real gift in that I, I get it and I understand it. I understand how hard it is. I know how to. You know, I've had that, I've had that experience and, and I know what it is to do it very badly, poorly. Yeah, I think it's, I think, I think it's, you know, you hear sometimes, I mean, this is more anecdotally, but you hear that sort of relationship like directors and actors and directors not understanding actors and they're sometime being tension. I've never really experienced that personally because I have nothing but like acting was my first point into all of it. So it's, you know, it doesn't feel foreign to me or counter. It feels, it feels like the enabler of all really.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. You mentioned that you have kids. How many kids do you have?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I have three daughters.

[Will Friedle]

Wow.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah. So, yeah, my, my oldest actually turns 18 in a few weeks, which is insane. Geez. I know, I know, it's crazy. She learned to drive this last, well, summer and a half ago and it's a weird moment to be sitting. I know you, Daniel. You have, you, you have children as well, right?

[Danielle Fishel]

Has a son and I have two boys. Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Okay, so you, you. Yeah, you know, and it is. They, you know, so I have a. Almost 18 year old, 15 year old and then a 9 year old, 9 year old. I'm taking the movie night tonight. It's, it's. It's amazing to be sitting shotgun as your daughter is driving you throughout LA and is controlling the radio and like putting on Stevie Nicks or something. Okay. Life is okay. Like it's pretty good. Pretty good.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do any of your children, have they ever expressed any interest in acting or being in the entertainment Industry.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah. So here's the thing that's. And this is a thing where I have. I have to talk to my therapist more about this and get over this thing, because my. My oldest and my youngest, really, every. All of. All three of my kids were really. We're really in the theater. Like, we love theater. And I'll never forget actually the first time that my old. So my youngest had never seen Troll 2 or Best first movie. My middle child, my middle and my oldest half. And they've actually. The first screen, they went to a screening. I didn't even tell them what it was about because I don't. You don't really talk about a lot of this sort of stuff at home. You're. You're busy, you know, with life. And my oldest and my middle, they went to a screening of Troll 2 in Montreal for the first time. They had no idea what they were for of Troll 2, Ambassador's movie, and their minds were blown afterwards. And outside of that, I've never been somebody. I mean, we watch movies, we watch docs. Like, took him to see American Movie at the New Beverly over Thanksgiving. This. You know, so. So it's been part of their thing. But they. They are naturally, like. My oldest is. She's. She just, you know, she has a film that's. That's playing as part of the high school film festival in New York next month that got selected. I didn't. I didn't. I didn't. I didn't, like, encourage her. I didn't.

[Danielle Fishel]

She's acting in it or directing it. What did she do?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Directed, acted and put our youngest in it. And she didn't. She didn't tell me. I kid you not. We didn't talk about it. She just said, I'm working on this thing. And then we went and we saw it, and she is very much drawn to it, more than my other two. I mean, my youngest is. She just got so weird. She just got the lead role of Annie at a local production. And that was. You know, I remember before she was going into audition, she's like, dad, like, do you think I could really get this role? And I was like, I. And I asked her, I said, do you think you can get this role? And she's like, yeah, I do. And I was like, well, why do you think that? And she said, well, I practiced. I said, okay, well done your best. And she got. She got the role. But it is the thing. And I was talking about this with Lindsay. It's like, I. I don't. It's hard when you see inside the kitchen of this business. Right?

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

And so there is this thing where it's like, I want to encourage art and creativity and making things, but I'm also a little more cynical now, like, truly on. On a number of levels. And so it's this sort of tension of like. Yeah, like. Like chase your dreams, but also, like, oh, like, right.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Have a plan.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

I totally get that.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, I'm sure. How's Dancing with the Stars?

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, my gosh. The most fun.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

The most fun.

[Ryder Strong]

Most fun for her. It's my worst nightmare.

[Will Friedle]

We're having a blast with it.

[Ryder Strong]

Watching from afar.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly. It's really been great. And Andy getting to know. Andy has been getting to know everybody, honestly, has been really, really great. And we're all super bonded. And, you know, it's. It's hard. It's hard.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's so much work.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

I can only imagine. Yeah. Yeah. My. My family, I was out of town this last week, but my family had told me they had watched, they'd start watching the season and my year, you know, Boy Meets World and. And Girl Meets World. I mean, you guys probably get this, but, like, my teenagers, like, like, watched and loved that show. Like, it's a. They, they. They were. So when I was like, oh, I, you know, do you. Do you guys know about this? And they're like, of course we know. And they, you know, they. They really, like. So your show. Both shows have. Are still continuing to connect with young people, which is pretty awesome.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. Yesterday I had the weirdest experience. So Alex Earl, who's like, you know, a massive social media star, she's an influencer. She's very big on TikTok. And she is. Is very young, but, like, in her 20s young, not, you know, teenager young. And for TikTok week, she had these two very young teenagers in the studio with her, teaching her choreography. That's going to be a part of her dance because they. They were the originators of this choreography on TikTok. And so she brought them in. And so I'm talking to Alex. I'm like, alex, I want to do a TikTok with you. I'm explaining to her what the TikTok is. And the two girls are standing there, and I said, hi, I'm Danielle, by the way. And I'm thinking, alex Earl has no idea who I am. Like, Alex Earl has never heard of Boy Meets World. She's like, I mean, I've seen it on TikTok. I've seen clips of it, but like she's never seen the show. She doesn't know who I am. She's not a fan. I mean, she's a fan. Like, you know, she likes me, but she's not like she had no idea. And I turned to the teenagers and both of them are just wide eyed. They're like, we are such big fans.

[Ryder Strong]

And I was like, really?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

They were like, yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Girl Meets World was my, my favorite show.

[Will Friedle]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

And I'm like, sure enough, you know, I mean, for, for a 17 year old kid who was probably 7 when we were doing Girl Meets World on the Disney Channel. That was our demo.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

To, to bring the conversation full circle. I mean that's like, I think that's why your doc spoke to me is like you don't have control over how these things live, where your art ends up, especially as an actor. But I would say even as a director, as, you know, it's like you do your best, you put it out there and you know, it fails. And then 10 years later it's everybody's talking about it or something is the biggest movie ever and everybody's talking about it. And then, you know, 10 years later. Does anybody really remember it? Like that happens all the time.

[Danielle Fishel]

That doesn't hold up anymore.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

It's true.

[Ryder Strong]

And it doesn't. Sometimes, you know, it's like the reality of like we were we. It's just getting older. Right. It's like realizing the trends and realizing that you can't always predict. And you know, you have to, you have to engage with those trends. You have to look at it as a conversation you're having. But there's no right or wrong answer. You know, there's no, like that's the.

[Will Friedle]

Thing that's so beautiful about it is things like the room and troll 2. These are things that are gonna last forever and ever and ever. And if that's your goal as an artist is to make something that lasts, you've done it. I mean, it's amazing.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Also, is it one of the great lessons of life that we just don't have control over anything?

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

So true. Right?

[Danielle Fishel]

The sooner we get comfortable. I know. Listen, if you sign on to do Dancing with the Stars with the goal of making it to the finals and then snap your hamstring tendon in week two, let me tell you what, you get used to things that are out of your control. So you know, you just like, you just have to go with it.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Gotta roll with it.

[Jacob Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Gotta roll with it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Thank you so much. For being here with us. I'm so happy we were able to unite you and reunite you and Ryder. I have a feeling you gu guys are going to have a friendship.

[Ryder Strong]

I'm reaching out.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'm reaching out to Michael.

[Ryder Strong]

We're going to hang because we, we got. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

I can tell you guys speak the same language. I can tell you guys are going to be best buds.

[Will Friedle]

I'm excited for your podcast.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes. So thank you so much for spending your time with us. Really means a lot to us and best of luck on girlfriend's day and everything else you have. We will be watching everything you do in the future.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Hey, I really appreciate it and it's been a pleasure and all the best to the three of you as well.

[Danielle Fishel]

Thank you. Make sure your family sets a timer to vote for me every Tuesday at 5:00pm Text Danielle to 21523.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Bye, guys. Bye.

[Will Friedle]

Man, he's great. Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

So great.

[Will Friedle]

Writer. He's a writer.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

He's right.

[Danielle Fishel]

He's writer. He's.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Isn't it funny?

[Ryder Strong]

Like, you know, it's funny that you know, know you've. You. You become friends for a reason probably at the age of 10 or 11 and it's probably a good reason to stay. Totally. Yeah. We just whatever reason our lives went the separate ways, but I'm like, oh yeah, I totally like, I honestly don't remember him but I know that if I met him, we were probably spending days together running around.

[Danielle Fishel]

Absolutely. You were probably loving conversation with him then. Conversation with him now.

[Will Friedle]

I want to see that Oakwood stuff.

[Jacob Goldstein]

Yeesh.

[Danielle Fishel]

No, yeah, I know.

[Ryder Strong]

I know that there's been a couple. Actually I've heard about a couple different like profiles of Oakwood.

[Danielle Fishel]

But yeah, Jensen said it's really dark, but it's great. Thank you all for listening to this episode of Pod Meets World. As always, you can follow us on Instagram Pod Meets World show. You can send us your emails. Podmeetsworldshowmail.com and we've got merch.

[Will Friedle]

In a world where trolls are goblins and vegetarians too, apparently for some reason we don't know troll2merch.

[Danielle Fishel]

Podmeetsworldshow.com will send us out.

[Will Friedle]

We love you all. Pod dismissed. Pod meets World is an I heart podcast produced and hosted by Danielle Fishel, Will Friedle and Ryder Strong, executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman, executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor Tara Sudbaksh, producer Matty Moore, engineer and Boy Meets World superfan Easton Allen. Our theme theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon, and you can follow us on Instagram at Podmeats World show or email [e-mail] hey, it's Ryan Seacrest.

[Ryan Seacrest]

For Albertsons and Safeway now through November 4th. Shop the annual beauty event and save $5 when you spend $25 on select beauty products. Shop in store or online for items like Dove Body Wash, Native Body Wash, Cetaphil gentle skin cleanser, Dr. Squatch body wash, Neutrogena Hydro Boost Water Gel, Dial Liquid Hand Soap and Olay Body wash. And save $5 when you spend $25 or more. Offer ends November 4th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Ryder Strong]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Ryder Strong]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Ryder Strong]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

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[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Michael Paul Stevenson]

Grainger for the ones who get it done, this is an iHeart podcast.