Pod Meets Twirl'd: Survivor 5011

Summary

Pod Meets World: Pod Meets Twirl'd – Survivor 5011 (May 8, 2026)

Hosts: Will Friedle & Rider Strong
Podcast: iHeartPodcasts

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Episode Overview

This episode of "Pod Meets Twirl'd" dives deep into Season 50 of Survivor, with Will and Rider breaking down the latest week's drama, gameplay, and emotional moments. With one host a long-time Survivor fan and the other relatively new to the show, their perspectives bring both expert insight and fresh naiveté. The duo analyzes blindsides, crucial strategic blunders, emerging narratives, and Survivor’s evolving format, sharing laughs, exasperation, and the occasional tangent into show production and reality TV tropes.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Survivor 50's Changing Game (02:58–03:57)

• Reversal of Roles: Will has only seen the first season; Rider is the longtime fan, but both are deeply invested now.
  Rider: “Will has seen exactly one season, the very first one. Meanwhile, I’ve watched for years, but I don’t remember anything.”

• Emotional Engagement: Both admit to yelling at their TVs this episode, frustrated with player decisions.

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The Ozzy Debacle: A Masterclass in Survivor Self-Destruction (04:18–05:27)

• Ozzy’s Blunders:

  • "If you go to a gun battle and you keep your gun in your holster, you’re gonna get shot." (Will, 04:25)
  • Ozzy once again fails to play his idol, a repeated mistake in his Survivor career.
  • His tendency to reveal his plans echoes the trope: "What are you, a James Bond villain waiting for Bond to escape?" (Will, 04:49)
  • Both hosts are stunned by his inability to keep the idol secret and manage trust within alliances.

• Cirie’s Unstoppable Social Game:

  • Will is baffled why Cirie isn’t targeted, given her social dominance and lack of challenge wins.
  • Rider points out that some strong competitors want Cirie around as a non-physical threat and social ally.

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Social Dynamics & Player Logic (06:10–08:06)

• Targets and Social Struggles:
  • Players like Emily, Aubrey, and Devins, while less threatening on paper, keep becoming targets due to social missteps.
  • Joe’s hypocrisy and mood become grating: "I’m gonna play and I’m gonna lie or steal if I have to, but if somebody else does it, they’re not playing the game." (Will, 07:47)
  • Rider: “Everybody’s playing Survivor. Just relax, bro. Exactly. A firefighter, life or death situation.” (08:06)

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Challenge Formats and Audience Appeal (09:39–11:17)

• Physical vs. Mental Challenges:

  • Challenges becoming less about brute strength, more about concentration and hand-eye coordination to level the playing field—“I could do that!” moments for viewers.

• Challenge Example:

  • Anticipation for "the ping-pong ball maze" style challenge, favoring those with focus over those with pure muscle.
  • Both hosts debate best strategies—e.g., sideways foot placement during the “dog house” challenge.

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The Idol Frenzy, Twists, and Production Choices (11:11–15:53)

• Rick Devins’ Showmanship:

  • Will: “He’s like a Batman villain sometimes. It’s kind of great.” (11:17)
  • There’s a humorous critique of players making self-aggrandizing “metaphors” about how cool they are on TV.

• Emotion Unraveling:

  • Sun, hunger, and high stakes lead to emotional volatility and sometimes questionable judgment.

• Too Many Twists?

  • Hosts critique Season 50’s overcomplication: Mr. Beast-influenced randomness, extra advantages, shifting rules—diluting what makes Survivor unique.
  • Rider: “I think Survivor has kind of lost a little bit of their edge as far as game design… it doesn’t feel fair. It feels like just chaotic.” (19:15)

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Survivor “Doghouse” (Snoopy) Challenge (21:11–22:33)

• Challenge Breakdown:
  • Tiff nearly wins but is disqualified for not following the judge’s directive (confirmed by replay).
  • The challenge's unique structure highlighted as both fun and controversial due to the judge's intervention.

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Alliance Dynamics & Blindsides (29:20–35:50)

• Post-Challenge Beach Dynamics:

  • Tiff, Emily, Cirie, and Devins vs. Joe, Rizzo, Ozzy, Aubrey.
  • Emily, on the bottom, tries an inventive but risky strategy to get Devins to play his idol for her and target Cirie.

• Ozzy’s Fatal Overshare:

  • Tells Aubrey his entire plan and alliance structure, which is quickly relayed to everyone—ultimate game error.

• Cirie’s Extra Vote:

  • Confusion about her advantage and its one-time use sparks discussion about rule clarity.

• Rizzo’s Calculated Betrayal:

  • Rizzo lets Ozzy hang himself, choosing not to save him—the power dynamic shifts.
  • Notable Moment: At Ozzy’s exit, Rizzo says: “You just said too much. I’ll explain later.”—Ozzy: “There’s nothing you can explain to me.” (33:39)

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The Idol Conundrum & Production Curiosity (35:01–37:43)

• What Happens to Unused Idols?
  • Extended speculation about who hides idols, how they’re placed, and if there’s fairness in distribution.
  • “I just wonder if it’s like they just give it to a PA and it’s like, John, just go hide this.” (37:06)
  • “I’m so curious to talk to a producer of this show to talk about the little intricacies that we don’t know.” (37:28)

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Critical Tribals & The Importance of Making Moves (43:09–44:57)

• Tribal Council Showdown:

  • Cirie expertly sniffs out Emily’s plan and uses her extra vote to force a tie—demonstrating why she’s so deadly.
  • Second Tribal: All eyes on Ozzy, who, despite intuitive warning dreams, fails to play his idol and is blindsided out.

• Memorable Quote:

  • “You just told us you had a dream where you were kicked out because you didn’t play your idol and you woke up in a sweat going, oh, thank God I still have my idol.” (Will, 44:24)

• Wayne Gretzky Reference:

  • “You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.” (44:39)

• Moral Lesson:

  • “No decision is usually worse than the wrong decision.” (Will, 44:51)

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Survivor’s Meta & Casting Critique (46:38–48:55)

• Fan Service Over New Blood:

  • Will and Rider both critique the “Greatest Hits” approach—too many returning players, not enough new faces.
  • Desire for a “Back to basics” season focused on new, diverse contestants and core social strategy.

• Notable Quote:

  • “Survivor, pure and simple… Let’s get back to basics. No bells and whistles, no extra tricky things.” (Rider, 47:41)

• Cultural Commentary:

  • Frustration over casting from other fandoms or social media stars instead of everyday viewers.

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Will’s History of Surviving (49:15–51:42)

• Phineas P. Gage Segment:
  • Classic Survivor-history tangent about Gage, the railway worker whose frontal lobe was skewered.
  • “He was a really good looking dude who blew off part of his head and then…survived and survived for like, another 12 years.” (Will, 51:00)
  • Celebrated as a landmark neuroscience case.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Ozzy’s Mistake:

  • "Ozzy just lost this episode. He just lost." (Host 2, 08:13)
  • "If you have any sort of advantage, just keep your mouth shut." (Host 1, 45:44)

• On Survivor's Evolution:

  • "It feels like Survivor has lost a little of their edge as far as game design… It just feels like we’re throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks." (Host 1, 19:15/20:33)
  • "You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take." (Host 2, 44:39)

• On Cirie's Gameplay:

  • "She’s never grandstanding. She’s always having one-on-one conversations. She’s making it seem like it’s other people’s ideas half the time." (Host 1, 15:05)

• On Survivor Philosophy:

  • Jeff Probst: “The game is the lure. The experiencing it in, the adventure you have out here is the prize.” (46:08)

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Important Timestamps

• Ozzy’s Blunder & Cirie Analysis: 04:18–06:10
• Social Dynamics & Joe’s Downside: 07:00–08:06
• Challenge Format & “Doghouse” Challenge: 09:39–22:33
• Production Critique (Mr. Beast, twists): 18:14–20:33
• Alliance Flip, Ozzy’s downfall: 29:20–35:50
• Idol Logistics & TV Production Curiosity: 35:01–37:43
• Critical Tribals & Player Exits: 43:09–44:57
• Casting/Renewal Discussion: 46:38–48:55
• Will’s Survival Segment (Phineas Gage): 49:15–51:42

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Episode Flow & Atmosphere

• The episode is lively, humorous, and occasionally impassioned.
• Will frequently expresses confusion and frustration as a Survivor “newbie,” while Rider tempers analysis with context and empathy for players.
• The chemistry between the two leads to organic, relatable conversation with playful ribbing.
• The hosts’ critique of Survivor’s present state is affectionate but honest, reflecting both loyal fandom and a wish to see the show return to its roots.

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Summary Takeaway

A tension-filled episode of Survivor prompts Will and Rider to dissect the pivotal mistakes and strategic maneuvers of the players, especially focusing on Ozzy’s self-sabotage and Cirie’s quietly dominant gameplay. The hosts wrestle with Survivor’s evolving, sometimes convoluted production and casting, voicing a strong desire for a return to basics. If you missed the broadcast, this recap captures both the stakes on the beach and all the couch-yelling to match.

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Closing Quote:
"The torches may be snuffed, and Ozzy may be gone, but our questionable analysis burns on. We’ll see you next time at tribal trap. You’re smoking." (Host 1, 51:41)

Transcript

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[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Welcome to POD meets twirled, a podcast that once chronicled two who had never seen Dancing with the stars, but they watched a season and walked away. Experts. From there, we ventured into traitors, a show I'd never seen, but will swore he could win. And Now Survivor season 50, the big one. This time the roles are reversed. Will has seen exactly one season, the very first one. Meanwhile, I've watched for years, but I don't remember anything. We are Will Fried l who prefers his wilderness with room service. And rider strong, who will hike any mountain but but hates the beach. Two friends, one devoted to the comforts of civilization. One who would never leave the woods if he could. Both reality competition scholars join us as we dive into alliances. Blindsides, fire making sand related misery and 25 years of television history, culminating in a single massive season. This is POD meets twirld. Seeking immunity. Yes, I'm very emotionally invested in the show, man. I'm hoping you're with me now.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I. I am now. I'm, I'm kind of in it now. I'm. I'm amazed at some of the stuff that's happened, some of the moves that are being made. I don't understand a lot of what's going on still. Just because I don't. I don't get the game. Like, I haven't watched it, so I don't understand the intricacies. I don't understand why certain people aren't instantly voted out. I don't. I don't get a lot of it, but yes, emotionally, completely invested.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, this one, this one was tough watching Ozzy get right, but it's like

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

you bring it on yourself. If you go to a gun battle and you keep your gun in your holster, you're gonna get shot. What do you think's gonna happen? You're walking around with an idol, bro.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

He really screwed up. Yeah, classic. I was. This was me screaming at my tv, play the idol. Play the idol.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Don't do it.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Because he's famously walked home with an idol in his pocket before, so.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, and you're walking around telling people your master plan. What are you, a James Bond villain waiting for Bond to escape?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

The tables turned on him and cere this episode. It's hard to Watch.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But the Cere thing, I don't understand. The SRI thing, I don't. I don't get it. Meaning I think she's great. She's so fun to watch. But can anyone explain to me what I'm missing? Why you don't vote her out when you get the chance to vote her out. She has complete and total power in the game. She is making the move she wants to make when she wants to make it. If she gets to the final three, no one's going to vote against her, so you can't possibly beat her. She's automatically going to win and she's bad in challenges. Why do you not vote her out?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I don't understand it because, like, you know, somebody like Tiff is surprisingly going to turn out to be because she could just keep winning challenges. Cerie's never going to win challenges.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

That's what I'm saying.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

But she's also.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But she's also manipulating everything in the game.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I know, man. But you want to keep that person around because you think you're good at. If you're Jonathan. Right?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Right.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Or Ozzy, you think you're good at challenges, you have a shot just physically to make it to the final three just by pure physical brute strength and capability.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Right.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

You. You don't want. You want to start eliminating people that are going to be competition for you physically and keep somebody who's never going to stand a chance and who will help you socially and that you can trust. And the thing about siree, everybody thinks that they can trust her, but you

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

could have gotten rid of both of them. You could have gotten rid of two power players. One that's mentally manipulating the game and the other that is physically dominant and you could have gotten rid of both of them yesterday. They tried, but nobody else voted for Suri except for Emily. And how is Emily?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I actually had that question. So. So Jonathan didn't vote for Suri.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

No, siree. Only Emily and Devins voted for Suri.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So then who did Jonathan vote for?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Jonathan voted for Emily. They all voted for Emily other than. Other than Devins and. And Emily. And it's like, why, what did Emily was know? Everyone was even like, she's not playing very well. So then why is she a threat when you've got a chance to take out sere and ozzy in one clip? Why would you not do that? Like I was sitting there just going. And this was me going, okay, I just don't know how to play this game because I don't understand the logic of keeping siree around at all.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Well, you know, the thing is it's different. This is what makes it different than traitors. You actually are out there living with these people on a beach, you know. Right. So there's purely just who you like. Do you know what I mean? Like a lot of this comes down to, you can tell just liking people or not, you know, because like Coach got voted out and mostly for being annoying. You know, it wasn't really like he was a strategic threat. They were just annoyed by him at that point.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Ozzy was a strategic threat?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yes. Everyone likes azie he gets along with. And it was just a bummer because they, you know, and I think. But I think that that's part of it is like, you know, you've seen Emily, Aubrey and Devin struggle socially and.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Right.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

They keep getting targets and it's like actually they shouldn't be targeted. They. They're. They're probably the least threatening in some ways. And yet time and time again Jonathan is like, we gotta. And Joe.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And it's like, well, Joe just hates him. Joe just hates the way. And Joe's getting a little much for me now. A little much of the mopey Joe. Yeah. And it's also not just mopey Joe, but it's also just like the. I'm gonna play and I'm gonna lie or steal if I have to, but if somebody else does it, they're not playing the game game.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

They're disgusting.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah. And it's like, dude, everybody's playing Survivor.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It's like, come on, just relax, bro. Exactly. A firefighter life or death situation.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I want to like them, but I just, I didn't. There's several times I was. And I felt like I. I felt like this episode almost more than I've seen before. Maybe one or two other times. But this episode, watching a player specifically lose it on their own. Ozzy just lost this episode. He just lost.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Just opened his big mouth and then

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

didn't play his idol. It's like you, one bad move after another. I mean, what do you think's going to happen? So, yeah. Weird. And I liked him, man. I was rooting for him to win. I was rooting for him to win all the way.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, well, this episode opens up coming off of the Mr. Beast coin toss craziness. They're now playing for $2 million. Lots of talk about how insane that was and.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Insane.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It's insane. It's insane. And then Aubrey talks about how Rick Devins did the dirty work for her and she calls them devious cockroaches. Again, these guys are just like, you know, they're just cartoon villains. Yeah. Mustache.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

The mustache.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yes. And Jonathan admits that he got away with murder because he's lucky that everyone thought that Steph is the one who brought up aie, even though he was the one who did. So.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Lee. Yep.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yep. He. I cannot believe he's skating by. I. He's.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I don't think he will much longer.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Think he will either. Too much.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Too much of a now too much of a. A target on his back.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

The problem is he might keep winning challenges. You know, I mean, that's the problem. He is so physically capable, and that's why you want to get rid of someone like him earlier, I think.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Do they keep. Do the challenges usually get more physical the more the, the game goes on, or is it still just kind of a hot.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It's this kind of stuff. It's like, it's more like, you know, focus. And I kind of like that.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I like, I like. And I get what they're doing. It's not just to make it equal for all the players, but for players at home, you. It's so much better to sit there and watch something going, oh, I could do that.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, I could tell whether you can or not, you're going, oh, I could do that. As opposed to like, oh, I've got to lift that thing. God, I could never lift that up. But if you're like, oh, dude, I could totally do that. You're more invested in the game.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Could you just hold this position for as long as. I totally agree, man. It's, it's, it's really smart. One of the best is, I'm hoping they'll bring it back this season. I know we talked about it with Miles, but. And I forget what he called it, but basically, it's like you drop a ping pong ball in a maze and it's. Or like one of those, like, right. And then you have to catch it and another one, Put another one in. So it's like a, it's like a concentration game. You just have to stay focused and you watch people, like, and then you're like three balls going at once, and you got to keep track of them and, oh, my God. It's. But it's not. That's so fun because it's like, it's not really a physical challenge. It's more just like a mental, you know, hand eye coordination thing. It's so cool. Yeah, I love that. Yeah. I, I, I wonder how I do stuff like this, like, because I'm just looking at going like, it looks like it hurts your feet.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But I was also thinking about, like, what the. And we'll talk about it when we get there. But what's the best strategy? Because some people were going sideways. If you go sideways, you can kind of with the toes.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Oh, that's a goal. Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Right. So I wonder.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, well, then we get Rick. Devins very happy with his idol. Lots of dancing around.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Wow. He's like a Batman villain sometimes. It's kind of great. He is.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

He is. But, you know, and it's just like, all right, cool. Yeah, I like it. He does this weird thing, though, where he creates a hypothetical and he says, if I was watching TV and I saw myself doing what I'm doing, I'd be cool with how cool I am. I'd be so, like, what is this hypothetical? Yes. You like yourself. Like, that's all you describe. You are happy with yourself. Okay. But I love the way he, like, does this, like, metaphor or this weird analogy. Like, if I was watching it all and I saw Devin's played, I'd be like, way to go, bro. Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I wonder. 21 days in in the sun Desert is desert Island Fever seems to kind of be a real thing where you've got to be losing it a little bit right now.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And I think his way of losing it, you know, because with the next cut is to Joe all depressed. That's not the way you want to lose it. I mean, he is just. Yeah. And the way this is where he starts calling it inappropriate or disgusting, and it's like, no, man. Like, I love the story. He's just like, okay, so I have to babysit his emotions now. And he's moping around and it's like, yeah, yeah. It's not fun, man. I mean, and I get it. Like, it's $2 million. It's a big freaking deal. Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But we all have to play this liar cheating game with honor. What? It's like, what?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Come on, dude.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

This is what it is. Apparently I've watched a grand total of like, 14 episodes in my entire life, and even I know that's what you're going to do. You're going to lie and you're going to cheat. That's what you're going to do.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

So, yeah, this. Yeah, the kind of. It was starting to get to me. The, like, he's despicable.

[Martha Stewart]

Like, is he?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Because he. Because he didn't let you vote him out.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I mean, if you Go back to earlier seasons. It was a lot of this, you know, like, it was not. It was life or death. It felt like life or death for people. And it was really personality based. Like, people would, like, really take it personally, talk about honor and justice and. Yeah, I know, but, you know, you figure they are starving. They're out there. It's like, it's gotta feel in a way that, like, traders just can't because they're going to a hotel and dressing up funny and, like, has there ever been a fight?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Like, an actual physical fight?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

No. I mean, you know, Miles talked about how there were. There were those physical challenges where they would just, you know, I don't know if anybody's ever, like, thrown a punch. I don't think so. Because that would be, like, assault, right?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah. Well, my guess is you'd be instantly disqualified, I would imagine. But you wonder if just the hunger and the time and the sun would ever get to somebody and somebody just snaps.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Seems like it would. I bet you. I bet you there's. There's somebody who's more knowledgeable than me who can answer that.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

That's crazy, though.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, then. Serene Tiff are strategizing together. These two are great players, man. And this is where they. They. They start worrying about being advantaged out because all these people have idols that they've been playing with, which is such a good point.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I'd obviously never heard of that. And when they cut to it where it was like, oh, God, that's crazy. So everybody else can't be.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

You're just.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

You're gone because everyone else has something. That's right.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Which happened. Yeah. Crazy. It's what happened to Sari. That one. It was like a crazy. Was like this person, then this person and this person. There's literally nobody else to vote for, so she just walked out. It was like, you're just out of it. But anyway, I just, you know, it's interesting the way that she's, you know, already, like, well, we have to flush Ozzy and Riz, even though they're her partners. Like her, you know, main alliances. She's smart to be thinking, like, if I can get rid of their idols without them knowing that I'm the one getting rid of them. Like, if I tell them to play God, she's just so good. She's totally running. She is.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Which is why, again, you wonder. I mean, obviously, we're sitting at home on our couches watching her run the game. You wonder how much the people sitting on the island understand that she's running the game. You're starting to get it a little bit, though. You're hearing people talk about like, well, sir's in charge.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yep.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And so it's like you eventually, unless you. If she makes it to the final three, she's going to win because no one's going to vote against her. So you got to get her out of there.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

But you see how she. As opposed to, like, Coach or Jonathan or anybody else who seemed like a power player this entire game. She's never grandstanding. She's always having one on one conversations. So she's never, like, in a group telling everybody what to do. She's listening and then responding honestly directly to people. And that's different. That, like, works, you know, so nobody's quite aware, you know? And she's also. She's making it seem like it's other people's ideas half the time.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I'll do you one better. Yeah, I. I'll bet you. And I could be wrong, but I bet you I'm not. I bet you she's this smart. I bet you a bunch of the challenges, including the one today. She's tanking on purpose very quickly to look like she's weak. Yes. Like, oh, my God, look, I'm just a little. I can't even stand up on this thing. You never want to vote for me. Like, I think she's throwing a bunch of these things, which is brilliant. Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I think she knows.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yep.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So then we get Ozzy, who talks about his dad and cries. And this was when my wife was like, oh, Ozzy's getting voted out because she knows storytelling. And she's like, if they're spit. And I started, I was like, oh, no, I think you're right because it was so emotional. It was just this beautiful little speech with a flashback. They just, you know, they told his whole story. And that's when I was like, oh, no.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

My wife and I do it on Top Chef. We're like, wow, they're really focusing on that one now. Hey. They've never showed a call with his kid before. And it's like, that guy's going home this week. And invariably that's what happens. It's just.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Especially in this case because it was like a callback to last week's letters. Like, it didn't. It kind of came out of nowhere, you know, but it was really a sweet moment, you know, between him and Devin's too. I love Devin's, like, crying with him.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

When they cut to him, though, again, this being the first time I've ever seen. Ozzy. He looks like a different human being. So young.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Oh, my God. Isn't it crazy?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Like, crazy looks so different.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I know. And that's why it's. It's. It's so sad that he's grown so much. He. He did try so much more, you know, this season, he. It seemed like he really had a

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

shot, but then, oh, he just fumbled it so bad. I'm literally sitting there going like, what are you doing? What are you doing? Yeah, what are you doing? What do you. Shut up. What are you doing? Oh, my God. I couldn't believe it.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, then tree mail comes in with a riddle, which I had no idea what any of this was about, but they were able to somehow decipher. They're. Oh, it's a dog house floating challenge.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And question, what is tree mail?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

That's how they find out. Like, they get a little.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, there's just a note in a tree.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, there's like a mailbox.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But I figured every morning.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And it gives them a hint. Sometimes it asks them, like, oh, someone's going to go on a journey today or whatever. But, yeah, they usually. They can give them hints. So they get tree mail. And it's. Yeah, they. They know the challenge is going to be the doghouse one.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Cool challenge.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, it is cool, right?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yes. And when it cut to the old one where it's like the ocean was. I mean, just insane waves and white caps, and it's. Now you've got to do it.

[Martha Stewart]

Nuts.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So they show up, and Jeff tells them that it's not only an immunity challenge, but the winner is also going to get some huge advantage, which is not explained. So I don't even know why they. This is like, we're going to have a twist, then. It's not a twist. Cause we know it's coming. We know something. We just don't know what it is.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And later. I'll tell you later.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, man. I don't know. This whole season has this weird. One of our listeners sent me to watch a video about Mr. Beast. Like a critical video about Mr. Beast after our last episode. And it was like an hour long. It wasn't really a takedown. It was just more of an exploration. I'll find the name of the video series, but it was super interesting. And they kind of pointed out this, like, bad game design that Mr. Beast Stuff does, which is a lot of this kind of stuff where you're like, is this really a challenge? Or, like, where they. They'll offer you know, alternatives that nobody would ever take, which has happened consistently in this season. So I feel like Survivor has kind of lost a little bit of their edge as far as, like, game design. Like, the challenges themselves are fine, obviously, but I think that the way that they're, like, trying to plant seeds, like something big is gonna happen or we're gonna change the rules, it hasn't really panned out this season. It's like, I don't know, like, just play the game.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

What are the chances, you think that they saw how well Mr. Beast show was doing and they went, well, we gotta do that?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I think that's what they're doing. They're trying to, like, you know, just gamify everything or, like, but it's actually, like adding more chance. It's, it's feeling more random. It feels like. It doesn't feel like this, this whole advantage that ends up happening where they split into two tribes and it ends up being a random draw and it just screws everybody. So. I don't know, man. Like, I don't. It doesn't seem like anything you could strategize for. It doesn't seem to help the game. It just kind of inserts chaos and makes everybody stressed out.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And again, as somebody who doesn't know the game, who's coming into the game, it does seem like, and this is the only way I could put it, it seems like they're trying very hard.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yes, that's it. I think they're just like, I'm really looking forward to next season when they kind of calm down and maybe get back to some of the social engineering stuff in terms of, like, who they select and the tribes and get away from this meta Survivor for Survivors fans, you know, it just feels, it feels like a lot. It feels like they're really torturing these people needlessly, like, and, and, and it doesn't seem like it's helping the social game or the challenge game. Like, it, it just doesn't feel fair. It feels like, just chaotic and a little like, okay, now so and so's out. Now no one stands a chance. I, I just don't know. It does.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

It just feels like we're throwing everything at the wall and so seeing what's kind of like, do they ever put, like, pit tribe against tribe? Like, I mean, do they ever do things like capture the flag or things where it's like one tribe has to attack another tribe, quote, unquote, attack another tribe and stuff like that?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Well, yeah, remember, I mean, Miles talked about how they used to do those kinds of things. But they. They kind of pulled them out because they got too physical, and they got

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

too, like, jumping in the thing. That's what.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, it was a little too, like, oh, this is intelligence.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah. Like pulling. Trying to pull somebody off the pole thing.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, I think it doesn't. It doesn't really work that well. So. Yeah. Anyway, we're on this challenge on the doghouse. Let's see who.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I'm calling it the Snoopy challenge.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Snoopy challenge, right?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Just siree. Devin's aubry are quickly out. Emily go sideways, like you already mentioned, which I was like, that seems like the cool move. But then when they have to lift their final foot, everybody's out except Tiffany.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But then I thought it was like, two in a row. Tiff, she's killing it.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

She was doing amazing, but turns out one of the judges comes up. There's five judges watching every challenge, and she didn't raise her foot when everybody else did. So technically, she was eliminated at that point in which.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And I thought this was fake.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

What do you mean?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Because the meaning. Meaning the way when he came in, he's like. And either they reshot it, or Jeff is just. Is just how Jeff comes off because he turned around and he saw the boat come in. He's like, issue, issue. And the way he said it was like, okay, this is a bit like they're planning this, where he's gonna go on the boat and then come back with something, or this is the twist or something. So when it actually turned out to be a thing, I was like, wow, that beat didn't read real. So either they reshot it or, I don't know it.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Just go back and watch it again. Yeah, it was like. It's just always. Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Maybe that's what it is. But it read to me. I was like, this is.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Something's gonna be weird.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

This is gonna be a bit. Or something like that. And then it was.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

That's interesting.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Totally normal.

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[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

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[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And by the way, when you look at the replay, they're 100% right. 100%. It's not even close.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

She.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

She really should have been disqualified. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So bummer. I was really rooting for Tiff.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Me too.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Because I love her now. And I'm like, man, if she gets to my crush, she's on her way. Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yep. Still my crush.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So then Jonathan is now the power broker because this is insane. They're splitting the tribe again. This is the thing. They keep. They keep making it really hard to play the individual game this season because they keep basically making multiple tribals. Like, you know, the blood moon, we gotta eliminate three people. So there's all these, like, ways in which they're actually making it more like tribal.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It's a weird. I just don't know how anybody's playing this correctly. Like, there's no good way to play it. Right. So they have to just draw randomly, get split into two groups, and Jonathan gets to vote twice and really just gets to run this game, which is now, to me. Do you.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

It's weird, but do you think one of the reasons that they do it is. And again, it's random, so they can't judge how they're gonna do it, but do you think they're hoping that they're splitting up alliance alliances? So it's like. Like Ceri said, where it's like, I can't get the secret code word. Yep. To Ozzy. So it's like, you know, what are we gonna. What am I gonna do about that? So do you think that's the point?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Is that is the point. But to just destabilize the game. But at a certain point, you destabilize it. So, like, how do you know how to play Survivor? You know what I mean? Like, at a certain point, you're just, like, riding the waves of chaos and you're, like, trying to stay afloat and you're not actually rewarding players. I mean, obviously you're rewarding Jonathan for winning the challenge. Right. He's got the benefit. That makes sense. Like, he did the thing, but everybody else. There's no reason that, like, Ozzy should be punished by the fact that they drew lots and he didn't get his alliance. You know, like, that sucks. That's not anybody's fault. That's. And that's not him playing poorly at point. I mean, I guess we can say he did play pretty poorly.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

He did later. He did later. But it is. It's one of those things where it's like, oh, halfway through a chess game, now we're gonna roll the dice, and if you get a six, you've got to remove three of your pieces. It's like, well, wait, what about figure out Jess?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Perfect. Perfect analogy, man. You said it better than I. Yeah, I've just been trying to talk around it, but that's exactly the way I'm thinking about it. It's like, what about the game of Survivor, which is, you know, these people especially are seasoned Survivor players, so they are making choices and picking alliances based on how the game is always played, which is that you go to tribal and one person is going to be voted out. And we're at a point with eight player or nine players. They know what that means. You could tell them. They like Rizzo talks about it. He's like, oh, since we're breaking into two tribes, we're basically at the five player mark twice early. Yes.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Which is like that changes the way

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

you play the game. Up until now, if you know that that's coming. So to me it's like it's really screw, you know, it screws the people who got it. Screws Emily. It screws everybody except Jonathan. He's the only one who seems okay.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

It did seem to give him an inordinate amount of power.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Inordinate power. Like everyone just has to play to him.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

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[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, so yeah, the teams are Tiff, Emily, Sere and Devins on one beach, Joe, Rizzo, Ozzy and Aubrey on the other beach. So Rhea is immediately worried. But you know she's in good hands because she talks to Jonathan. She has a good relationship, seemingly with everybody.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And they start turning on Devins and Emily immediately. Emily knows that she's on the bottom. She just simply doesn't have a relationship with Jonathan. And then she comes up with this whole Strategy, which I think was pretty brilliant, which is like a bad idea.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

She's gonna say that she can get Devin's to play the idol on her and meanwhile, you know, I actually. She's double crossing everybody.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, that's great.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And her and Devins are gonna vote for Surrey, which I think is pretty.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Pretty. That was the play. I'm sorry. That's how you get siree out. And I do not get why people, why you keep around at this point. I don't get it other than I like her. But if you're saying you like her, then what you're really saying is I'm just taking her through to the end so she can win and I won't. Because if you're, if you're trying to win for yourself, there's no reason to have Surrey around. None. I don't get him.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I mean, I think you're just trying to blindside her. I mean, I'm trying to think from Jonathan's perspective because he's really the one in this scenario that could have turned on her in this moment. And, and I think he's just, you know, he's got, he's got an alliance with Joe that I think he holds more important than anything.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Right. Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I don't know what he's thinking, man.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I don't either. I truly, I don't. I think he also holds grudges, which I think a lot of the players do.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And when he gets somebody in, I mean, you've heard him say like I've been trying to get him out for three Tribal Councils. It's like I'm focused on one person. When you focus on one person, you're forgetting all the other chaos going on around you.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

That you can really change the game by weight. If I just shift my focus. Oh, I could have gotten out the power player of the, of the match right now and he could have walked. With both Ozzy and Serie being gone, which would have just been the most insane. I mean, it would have been insane.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

That's kind of where I thought it was going.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Me too.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I thought. But luckily Cere is smart enough to know what was coming, man. She didn't, she didn't trust Emily and she shouldn't. It was. She's called it. So anyway, then Tiff talks to Jonathan and they both agree that they want Ozzy out on the other beach, which is interesting. They're. They're both thinking the same thing. On the other tribe. Ozzy thinks that this is easy. We're just gonna all vote for Aubrey. So then he walks to Aubrey and tells her everything.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

What.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Which are you thinking? I think he's trying to be a straight shooter. He's trying to be up front. But yeah, I cannot believe he just unloads his entire strategy which completely bites him in the ass for the rest of the episode. This is just too bad. I think he thought he was doing the right thing and being like, hey, Aubrey, I'm voting for you. Everyone's going to be voting for you. But in the meantime, he admits that he has this really hardcore alliance with Sari. He tells her that Sari has an advantage. So when she tell her turns around and tells everybody everything that he said, they no longer trust him because he's basically admitted that he's not even playing with the people in this small tribe. Yes. It's crazy. I know.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And. And now I. I take it you get. Because. Because I believe she did. And we'll get into it. But the cerise double vote, you can only do that once, right?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Okay, so she did that. It's done. She can't.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

She played that advantage.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Gotcha.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

But then when I was slightly confused by is that she got to use it twice in one night.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Did she or did it only count the first time?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I don't know because they didn't count all the votes.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

The second they knew they were going to vote, they were just going to vote her out the second time. So they probably didn't need it. She knew. She knew she was going at that.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Sorry. Is, you know, full of anxiety because she knows that they're going to go for Ozzy and she's not able to give her code word to tell him to play as idol. Her only hope really is that Rizzo will do it, which I thought maybe there would be a chance that Rizzo would, you know, so he didn't, Right? No.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah. So he could have.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

He could have really. I mean, and that was kind of what I was thinking might happen to save Ozzy, that Rizzo would, you know, the. What is it? The wizard of.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

The wizard of.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Wizard of Ozzy, whatever. The wizard of Surrey, whatever. Yeah, they're. They're little alliance, you know, But I think he just knew that it actually was, you know, not going to work like he. Even if he told Ozzy to. I mean, I don't know, man.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But you hear what he said to him at the end when Ozzy, when Ozzy was leaving, when he hugged him. What do you say he says to him at the end, he goes, you just you just said too much. I'll explain later. And he goes, there's nothing you can explain to me. Yeah. Oh, I personally think so. He's going to be pissed at Rizzo, too. Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Because what. Because what Rizzo did there is basically throw Ozzy under the bus.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Because he felt that Suri was Ozzy's number one more than him, I guess.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, you think so?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I mean, that's the only way if he. Because if he had heard, you know, because it's not a surprise to him that Ozzy is in an alliance with Suri. That's not news.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Right.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So because he's part of that alliance, it seems like, you know, so the fact that he stood down and just let Ozzy. He could have.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

He did. He just stepped. He stepped back and. And let Michael fall into the. Fall into the koi pond. Yeah. I mean, it. It really did. And again, might not be a bad play at the end of the day. You got one of the biggest players out. You got an idol out. Does that come back or. No?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It should be. Actually, no, because it's a. It was a Billie Eilish. Right.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But doesn't that mean if you walk out with it in your pocket, it goes back to the original person who's gave it to you?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

So who gave it to Ozzy? That's.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I don't know. I mean, isn't that what it is? Yes. I don't know if that was a Billy Idol. If that was a Billy Idol, then it should go back to whoever gave him the idol. Unless. What do you do if the person who gave him the idol has already been voted out?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah. Then I think it just goes back on the beach. Who did give Ozzy the idol? Do you remember?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I don't. I honestly don't. Oh, because he didn't find.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

We're such bad podcasters. Like, we really just. Like, we have one job. We just have to watch a reality show, keep track of what's happened within this very season.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I know. I still have no idea. I can't remember, but.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, I'm going to have to Google it because this seems too important for us.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Who gave.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Who gave Ozzy the Billy Eilish Idol? Jesus.

[Martha Stewart]

We're.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

We're a respectable podcast for Survivor.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Genevieve.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, okay. And she's been gone for a while. You don't even remember Genevieve, do you?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

No. Don't remember who Genevieve is, do you?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Vaguely, Yes, I do. Yeah. Okay, so it's probably just gone, then.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah. So. I don't know, man. I I'm surprised that people aren't looking for more idols because I feel like there have been some. Although I guess Devin's gotten his idol from the Mr. Beast thing, right? No. Like, usually if somebody uses an idol, it goes right back onto the beach, and I'm surprised that they haven't. No one's been looking.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

So an idol doesn't. Unless you leave with it like that and isn't used. An idol doesn't die if it is used. It goes right back into play normally.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yep.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Who do you think's job it is to guide the idols?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It's a fun job, though, right?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I know. And it's like, do you think. Do you also sub question. Do you think that they all discuss it or is it like, go hide this somewhere in the woods or is it like. No, no, no. I want this in quadrant four. I want this in the tree. I want an eye level in a tree.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Blah, blah, blah. I love that discussion.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I'm curious.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

They tend to be in the, like, nooks and crooks of trees. That's where they tend to be. Like, there's always, like, somewhere where you kind of feel like a spider might bite you.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Like, it's like where you don't want to put your hand.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, exactly. Right where you don't want to reach. It's so.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

But it's also. It's not usually, like, buried unless you get a clue to tell you where it's buried. So. Yeah, it's usually just hidden in trees and, like, in branches. Like, right in those little, like.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I just wonder if it's like they just give it to a PA and it's like, you know, john, just go hide this.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

No, I think they have to. They have to be somewhat, like, strategic.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Because if I would. Too obvious. It's like. Or if it's like, right in the same area where somebody else already found one. You know, I bet you have to, like.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I also imagine they have to hide. If they hide one for one tribe, they have to hide one for another tribe. Like, they have to be some kind of equality as it goes into.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I'm.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I'm so curious to talk to a producer of this show to talk about the little intric. The intricacies that we don't know.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

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[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, so back at Jonathan and Cerise Tribal tribe, you know, she encourages Jonathan to tell Joe to talk to Rizzo in some sort of hope that Rizzo Will then tell Ozzy to play his idol. That's her only play, really, because she can't. And so she's hoping. And so when Joe goes and talks to Rizzo and Rizzo reacts the exact opposite. Feels like he's gonna have to blindside Ozzy, too. So in a weird way, Rizzo ends up with all of the power right here.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah, he can keep Ozzy.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

He kind of knows that Sari would want him to tell Ozzy. He admits that. He kind of knows that. Yeah. But he feels like Ozzy screwed up. So. Yeah, this is where I was like, oh, it's not looking good.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Again, though, Rizzo is right in that. It's like, wait, the guy who's my partner, who I'm supposed to go to the end with with sree in this triumvirate, just not only walked out and told everybody, hey, I'm in this longtime relationship with Suri. We're going to go to the end. I can win this one. We're voting you off tonight. Here's all the idols and stuff we have in our. It's like, how do you keep that guy around? I mean, I get Rizzo's point where it's like, dude, you can't. What do you think is going to happen?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I mean, the only thing I will say in Ozzy's defense is he didn't say anything about Rizzo. You know what I mean?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Like, well, don't people know that Rizzo has the idol?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

But. But he didn't say that he's in an alliance with Rizzo.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, no, no, no. Yeah. He didn't say it was the three.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And I'm, you know, and in some ways, I wonder if that was strategic in the sense that he was just thinking, like, well, I'm not going to rat out my alliance within the mini tribe that I'm in right now. I can talk about my alliance with Siri because she's not part of this situation. Maybe dumb, but. But not, you know. Or is the fact that he didn't blab about his alliance with Rizzo exactly why Rizzo blind signs? Because he's like, you obviously don't care about me because you didn't even tell anybody about it.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I mean, unless. Do you think Ozzy could have been playing the long game where he was like, look, if it gets down to the two final two of us, I can beat Rizzo. The jury will vote for me over Rizzo. They won't vote for me over Surrey. So maybe by him saying, like, I'm in A thing with cere and I just want to be honest with you about everything going on. If it did come down to her and siree and Aubrey's on the jury, in his mind, he's like, hey, I told you all about this alliance and I played it straight with you the entire time. Aubrey. That's why I.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Well, that's what he called it. He called it, like jury maintenance or what did he. You know, he talks about how that was like his whole point. Point of telling her he just did it too early.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Man, such a weird choice. It's just such a weird choice. Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

All right, so at the tribal, Emily makes a speech that she's not going to be passive. Devin tells everybody he is using his idol tonight, but we still don't know if that means he's going to play it for Emily or himself. Jonathan and Devin have this funny moment where Jonathan is like, I think we've realized we're just never going to work together. And Devin is like, I'm not. I'm not willing to say that we might need each other down the road.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Which I just feel is like, yeah, dude. Like, Jonathan, you can't be this sort of like, straight shooter player. It's just not the way to play the game.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

No.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

But at this point, I had no idea how it was going to go. And what we end up with is siree using her extra vote for Emily, which makes it a tie. So now they have to revote, which, you know, I guess just indicates that serene knew not to trust Emily, which makes her the greatest player in the game. Second tribal starts, and I just couldn't tell based on what people were saying. I thought maybe because RZA was like, saying things like leap of faith. And then Ozzy picked up this, like, leap of faith. I was like, was that a code word telling Ozzy to play the idol? I'm just sitting there screaming, play the idol. It's in your pocket.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

You literally just told us you had a dream where you were kicked out because you didn't play your idol and you woke up in a sweat going, oh, thank God I still have my idol.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I know.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

What are you thinking? Play your idol.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

His dream, his intuition.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I just kept hearing the Wayne Gretzky quote, the you miss 100% of the shots you don't take. Going off in my head where it's just like, once again, you just sat there like, no decision is usually worse than the wrong decision.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Right.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

And so it's like, dude, you got do something, do something. And, oh, God, it Was driving me crazy.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, that's really bummer.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

He was so shocked.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

He was so sad. You just feel it. It just like he couldn't. But he didn't want to walk away. It was like he literally want to leave because he was like, this couldn't really have just happened.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yep. Oh, poor guy was really sad. I thought he had a real shot at winning this one. But then this episode, he just, this is where I really saw the game and how, how fast you can lose it because. No, he lost. He fair and square lost himself on several moves he made today. Yeah. He essentially got himself voted out of the show. And, and, and it sucks that that happened. But when he goes back and thinks about it, it's not going to be like, oh my God, I got screwed over. And Bob, it's going to be, no, I screwed up. I should have kept my mouth shut and I should have played my idol.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

You just don't tell anybody anything. Like if you have any advantage, if you have any sort of thing, just keep your mouth shut. Your mouth shut. Seems really straightforward to me.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But again, if you've never seen a movie, the James Bond villain who tells Bond his entire plan never wins. It's like, come on, evil plan to yourself, bro.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Right before they vote, Jeff Probst gives this incredible quote. He says the game is the lure. The experiencing it in, the adventure you have out here is the prize. Yeah, I thought that was really cool. I was like, wow. And I think that that's, you know, I think that's what makes Survivor special, is that it really, it is true. Like it seems like everybody has a life changing experience whether they win the game or not and feels so positive about it even when they get blindsided or, you know, it's, it's a really beautiful game.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

This is another, but this is another weird combination I've been seeing in the game. It's a weird, it's, it's a paradox of, of this season where again it seems like they're maybe trying with stuff like Billie eilish and, and Mr. Beast and Zach Brown. They're trying to bring in other fandoms.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

To Survivor and yet they're rehashing only older players that have there. And so it's like, okay, well if you want to open up the world then, you know, when you, you, I hear people going like, this is the sixth time I've played Survivor. Okay, maybe it's time to let other people play Survivor. Cast all new people for the next 15 seasons. Stop brain. It's like hey, it's Coach's 37th time on the show. Okay, I get why then your fandom is going to watch that, the Coach fandom, but most people aren't going to care. So it's like just go and start having. Because again, from what I'm gathering from people, the idea that siree was somebody who watched the show from her couch and then said, I want to do that, and then got out there and got out of her comfort zone, that's the story that people want. Yes.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And we could have 10 of those.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Exactly.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I agree, man. I think, like, my pitch for all the Survivor producers out there listening, I think next season should be, like, Survivor, pure and simple, you know, like, let's get back to, like, basics. Back to basics.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Back to basics. Great.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

A complete. Like, there's no bells and whistles, no extra special tricky things. It's like pure survival. There's idols, you know, hidden, the most basic rules. No, like, because I just feel like now we have journeys, we have advantages, we have Blood Moon. It's just, like, so complicated. I'm like, I just want to get back to the simple, like the social experiment and new people. Like, all new. Like, it should just be all new people. Anger.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Angry.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

A lot of young people. If you want to get some new fans in there, get young people. You know, people that are played the Beast games maybe, or done other shows,

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

you know, they won't, though. They're going to get. It's. It's going to be season 51 TikTok stars.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I know.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I mean, that's what it's going to be. YouTubers versus TikTok stars. And it's.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Well, that wouldn't be that bad. As long as they haven't. As long as they're not, like, already established within the world of Survivor. I feel like that's the big issue.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I know, but it's just. It's like everything now is you already have to have a following to do something and it's like, that's ridiculous.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

I know, man. Well, it's like that in every industry.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

That's what I'm saying.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

In every publishing.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

It's ridiculous.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Podcast hosting, whatever it is, stupid.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I have no followers and that's fine with me.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Well, you've been listening to POD meets Twirled.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Excuse me.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Oh, I'm sorry.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Get one segment. I get one segment of show and a song that goes with it. That's it. That's all I got.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Let's hear it.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Whale's history of people surviving things that you're like, wait, what? That guy survived that thing? Yeah. Okay, so this week we got a special one for you. We've got Phineas P. Gage.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Oh, I know this one. Do you? Oh, yeah, the spike through the head.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Oh, yeah. This is the famous. Oh, yeah, dude. We studied him in college in a neuroscience class. Dude, in neuroscience, he's insane. Because it went through his head, came out the other side.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And then he, like, got all irritable because he had no frontal lobe control.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yes. So, as Ryder just said, Phineas P. Gage was an American railroad construction foreman remembered for his improbable survival of an accident in which a large iron rod was driven completely through his head, destroying much of his brain's left frontal lobe. And for that, injuries reported effects on his personality and behavior over the remaining 12 years of his life, effects sufficiently profound that friends saw him for at least a time as, quote, unquote, no longer Gage.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, dude. It's like a famous. Because. Because really, before they could do brain surgeries, you had to look to cases like his to see, like, what happens if you lose parts of your brain. So he was like. I think what happened is his frontal lobe was, like, severed from. It was basically a lobotomy, but, like a frontal lobe lobotomy.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

But it was still there.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

It was just not connected. So he couldn't have, like, emotional control. It's a crazy story. And it was like one of the first cases where they were like, I guess if you disconnect that part of the brain, this works. Yeah, yeah.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

So, yeah, we can. It's incredible, this story. Just go read it. I won't get too much into it because Ryder told you so much, but he was a really good looking dude who blew off part of his head and then was. It was a different guy afterwards. Survived and survived for like, another 12 years. It went so rocketed from the hole.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

That.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Rocketed from the hole. Sounds weird. It entered the left side of Gage's face in an upward direction, just forward of the angle of the lower jaw, continuing upward outside the upper jaw and fracturing the cheekbone. It passed behind the left eye, through the left side of the brain, then completely out the top of his skull through the. The frontal bone.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

My God.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yikes. I love that you knew exactly what I was talking about.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

You're like Phineas B. Gage.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

I know, I know.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Gage. Yeah. No, we spent, like, a whole week on him in a neuroscience class because it was so fascinating.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

It talks about that. It talks about how he's like, the study in neuroscience.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Yeah, yeah. It's like that. And then, like the guy who is the real life memento, there's a guy who is.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Oh, yeah.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

And we only know him by his initials. I think it's like CB or something, because his name was never public. But, yeah, he was the first guy to have that retrograde amnesia issue. So fascinating. All right, you've been listening to Pod Meat's twirled. The torches may be snuffed, and Ozzy may be gone, but our questionable analysis burns on. We'll see you next time at tribal Trap. You're smoking.

[Martha Stewart]

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[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

M&M's Popped Caramel do sound different. Oh, no.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

People are gonna be obsessed. What do you mean?

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

People hate the sound of chewing. Maybe they won't like the crunch.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Maybe we're saved.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Wait a minute. Yellow. Have you been eating them this whole time?

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

Mmm. So tasty.

[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Hands off us.

[Host 1 (Survivor Fan/Analyst)]

M&M's popped caramel. It's more fun together.

[Jana Kramer]

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[Host 2 (Survivor Newcomer)]

Yep.

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