Pod Meets Twirl'd: The Traitors 408

Summary

Pod Meets World: "Pod Meets Twirl'd - The Traitors 408"

Podcast: Pod Meets World (iHeartPodcasts)
Hosts: Rider Strong & Will Friedle
Episode Date: February 6, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this special ‘Pod Meets Twirl’d’ episode, Rider Strong and Will Friedle deep-dive into episode 8 of The Traitors season 4, dissecting gameplay, alliances, and betrayals—all with their usual nostalgic and irreverent humor. Though better known for revisiting Boy Meets World, this offshoot finds the hosts embracing reality TV analysis, focusing on manipulations, alliances, and who’s mastering the art of deception. The conversation covers not just strategy but also the social dynamics, wardrobe choices, and some hilarious tangents, including comparisons to their own acting experiences.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Costuming & Setting: Life in the "Castle"

• Will confesses he’s less invested in the dramatic costumes and would just want a holiday in the actual castle.
  • [04:25] Will: “You know, I kinda just want a vacation in the Traitors’ Castle. That’s what I’ve realized.”
• Rider recounts a real-life stay at Ashford Castle, detailing its luxury and falconing experiences.
• Observations about contestants' over-the-top wardrobes, especially Candace’s “cow fur jacket,” and the logistical nightmare of packing all that.
  • [06:44] Will: “Candace is wearing, like, a cow fur jacket… that’s like an entire bag unto itself.”

2. Game Play Analysis—Rob vs. Candace

• Both hosts marvel at Rob’s gameplay: unflappable, unemotional, strategic—a “puppet master.”
  • [08:12] Rider: “He is so good at this game. Not only is he puppet mastering everything, but people are literally walking away going like, ‘I can't believe anybody would put his name down.’”
• Critique of Candace’s emotional responses and how her inability to compartmentalize led to bad decisions.
• Will and Rider note that Candace’s throwaway vote backfires, igniting suspicion.
  • [15:09] Will: “Moira brings up Candace and talks about how the throwaway vote made her suspicious… I just don’t buy it.”
• The duo agree that emotionally driven moves stand out and are usually punished by the group’s vigilance.
  • [15:55] Rider: “Anything that makes you different is not good.”

3. Social Dynamics—Trust, Paranoia, and Acting

• They note that quickly formed “friendships” in the Traitors' house are overly sentimental—more “LA actor” than real.
  • [12:18] Ryder: “When somebody’s your friend or a housewife, it doesn’t mean that they’re not…couldn’t also be a traitor. Like, they all need to just stop thinking like…well, he or she's my friend. It’s like, no, you've met them six days ago!”
  • [12:27] Will: “They’re like saying ‘I love you’ to each other when they go to bed at night.”
• Both share anecdotes about how their own casting backgrounds influence how they’d play—Rider would be pegged as aloof and untrustworthy, Will as friendly and approachable.
• The actors believe lying is the hardest part if enlisted as Traitor; being a Faithful is easier as “radical truth” requires no mental gymnastics.

4. Favorite Moments & Quotes

• Alan Cumming's Line:
  • [09:45] Will: “Alan Cumming walks into the turret and gives the best line of the episode: ‘I’m sensing awkwardness in my turret.’”
• Couch Realization:
  • [17:43] Will: “So then Alan Cumming walks in looking precisely like my grandmother’s couch from 1991.”
  • Followed by a tangent comparing the host’s suit to the Boy Meets World set couch.
• Game Analogy:
  • Rob’s gameplay compared to chess:
    [11:15] Ryder: “He’s like, ‘I don’t have her in check yet, but I just took her queen.’”
• On Rob's Winning Move:
  • [17:03] Will: “The smartest thing that Rob did was not say Colton said your name, right. He kept [that]."

5. Task & Challenge Breakdown

• Recap of the episode’s main mission (recreating pieces of art): hosts brainstorm how the game could be adapted as a fun home activity, comparing it to “Telestrations.”
  • [18:59] Will: “It has this cool telephone element to it… there’s a game that we love to play called Telestrations…”
• Detailed breakdown of how contestants were selected for the guessing gallery, noting Rob’s manipulation to position himself advantageously for immunity.

6. Traitor Enlistment & Game Mechanics

• Thorough discussion on Traitor recruitment, the use of shields, and when/how the game ends if all traitors are banished.
  • [34:11] Will: “If all traitors are banished… the remaining faithful contestants win the entire accumulated prize pot and share equally.”
• Speculate on producer interventions and methods to maintain suspense in editing.
• Rider’s “brilliant” (if illegal) idea: use invisible ink to identify traitors—showing their penchant for overthinking the game.

7. Round Table & Elimination Recap

• Play-by-play of round table discussion where Candace tries to turn group against Rob, but instead is systematically voted out.
  • [45:11] Will: “I was like, oh, it’s over… dominoes fall. Kristen votes for Candace. Dorinda does too… Stephen too.”
• Noting that the group is actually playing well—but only because the traitor (Rob) is manipulating so effectively.
  • [46:12] Will: “They’re playing well because of Rob.”

8. The New Traitor: Eric

• Eric is recruited as the new traitor; both hosts discuss his perfect “deer in headlights” reaction and speculate on what they'd do if given the ultimatum.
  • [47:12] Will: “I also just love when Eric gets invited… He’s just like, ‘This is what I get for being nice.’”
  • [47:53] Ryder: "Anybody would say, murder me. Like, I don’t want to do it. I can’t do it. I can't be a traitor."

9. Traitors in History: “Wheels History”

• Rider debuts a segment on notorious traitors, this time focusing on Pedro Paterno from the Philippines.
  • [51:46] Will: “Whoa… so he, like betrays the Philippines.”
  • Ends segment with a promise to finish Paterno’s story next time, mirroring Traitors-inspired cliffhangers.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Emotional Play:
  • [09:14] Ryder: “He’s playing with no emotion. He was bummed that Colton was gone, but she’s taking things personally and making bad decisions… he’s like, I’m playing a game. It’s chess.”
• On Game Manipulation:
  • [32:02] Ryder: “To be truly successful at this game, you have to rig it so other people are doing all of the heavy lifting. You plant the seeds and walk away.”
• On Lying:
  • [47:30] Will: “…my worst nightmare is… I’d start the game as a Faithful… then get enlisted and have to be a traitor. …I would just be, like, running into walls and stumbling over my words.”
• On Editing the Show:
  • [50:15] Ryder: “Could they have taken exactly the footage that they have from the beginning and recut the entire show where Mark just looks guilty the entire time?”

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Key Timestamps

• [03:30] – Robes, masks, and castle envy discussions
• [05:00] – Ashford Castle and falconry stories
• [07:30] – Travel packing and wardrobe logistics
• [08:10] – Deep dive into Rob’s gameplay superiority
• [09:45] – Alan Cumming’s "awkwardness in my turret" line
• [17:43] – Alan’s suit compared to “Boy Meets World” couch
• [18:59] – Mission/game segment and Telestrations chat
• [32:02] – Seeds of manipulation: “let others do the heavy lifting”
• [41:17] – Round table: Candace goes after Rob
• [46:55] – Eric’s recruitment as traitor and reaction
• [51:00] – “Wheels History” segment—Pedro Paterno

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Final Thoughts & Cliffhangers

• Will and Rider are both entertained and impressed by the “puppet mastery” of Rob, while expressing the difficulties and ironies of playing an honest game in a context designed for deception.
• They’re eager for the new dynamic that Eric will bring as a newly enlisted traitor and debate the mechanics of the endgame.
• The episode closes on a blend of humor (“I’ll just buy my own smoked salmon… deal with hugs and kisses in my own castle!”) and anticipation, with an unfinished tale about historical traitors—keeping true to the episode’s theme of suspense and shifting alliances.

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A must-listen for fans of both reality TV strategy and 90s nostalgia, this episode blends pop culture critique, personal anecdotes, and insightful banter, all with the familiarity of two friends who’ve grown up together in the public eye.

Transcript

[Ryder Strong]

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[Will]

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[Will]

Welcome to Pot meets Twirled, a podcast from two guys who had never seen an episode of Dancing with the Stars but took it on and walked away. Experts. So now we turn to Traitors. Another show I've never seen. While Will is convinced that he could win it, we are Wilfred Ellen Rider Strong. Two best friends. One's a TV expert, one's a TV skeptic. Both dance scholars join us as we step into a castle full of lies, alliances, and over the top wardrobe choices. This is POD meets twirld Trading Places. How you feeling?

[Ryder Strong]

I feel like I don't understand why I wear the robe anymore. I'll be honest. I went to go grab. It's like I forgot my robe and I'm like, no one is ever gonna see this. What am I doing?

[Will]

I'm just hot. It's like your superhero underwear though. Doesn't it make you feel better?

[Ryder Strong]

The superhero underwear is an actual medical thing.

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

That. That truly helps people and makes them. Yeah, that's science. This is just.

[Will]

This is just.

[Ryder Strong]

This is food for all. This is just fun. This is, you know, this is shenanigans. Oh, I'm taking it off now.

[Will]

Okay. Yeah, I feel like you gotta. We gotta up our costume game if we're gonna do it. So like you gotta bust it out halfway through our recording or show up one of those weird traders masks.

[Ryder Strong]

I. Well, I wanna wear a gold mask just. Cause I think it'd be cool. I mean, I. Mask game is not strong. I don't know about yours.

[Will]

What do you mean?

[Ryder Strong]

Do you have. Do you have sev. Like meaning like at your home if you had to pick from them? Do you have several masks because of indie?

[Will]

Like, I don't, otherwise I wouldn't own masks.

[Ryder Strong]

No, but you've got a strong mask game.

[Will]

Oh my God, we have so many masks. And indie likes the really over the top ones too. Like he has some really ugly ones and creepy ones. And then we've done like a squid games themed birthday party for him. So I got like one of those like golden like squid games guy masks to wear. Squid games could happen. Squid games could happen. To be real. You know, I kind of just want a vacation in the Trader's Castle. That's what I've realized.

[Ryder Strong]

Well, then go to Ashford Castle. Go to Ashford Castle in County Mayo.

[Will]

That's the name of this actual castle.

[Ryder Strong]

No, no, no. That's not this castle. That's just an awesome vacation. It's like one of the best hotels in the world. Sue and I went there for a couple days. That's where we were walking the Irish countryside, falconing.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

We literally had falcons on our arms and walking the Irish countryside. It was the Guinness family's summer, like, getaway. And it's the most insane food, the most insane hotel, the greatest spa.

[Will]

That's what I want.

[Ryder Strong]

It's this times a thousand. Yeah.

[Will]

Watching the show. That's my overwhelming filming nowadays.

[Ryder Strong]

A few hours and smoke salmon and cook that.

[Will]

I just want to be in this castle. I just want to walk around the grounds. It's so beautiful.

[Announcer / Advertiser]

Oh, my.

[Ryder Strong]

I know, I know. And it's. But there's also. I want the pump and the circumstance of the. Of the game.

[Will]

I don't think I can handle it. I'm also just like. As the group gets smaller and like, I can. I can wrap my head around, like, who's who a lot easier now. I'm very clear on who everybody is. So when they're all like, at breakfast now, like, about. I'm like, stop. We get it. I just want everybody. And that would drive me crazy. Like, all the, like, you don't want.

[Ryder Strong]

To be top to be met at breakfast every morning.

[Will]

I would just be listening. The second, like, second Johnny shows up with a veil on in front of his head, I'd be like, dude, what are we doing?

[Ryder Strong]

What are you doing here, bro?

[Will]

We're here just for breakfast.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

And then.

[Will]

And then, you know, we're going to be running around in some mud. So why did you dress up? So I would just.

[Ryder Strong]

I can't do this. You can't. How do you eat your yogurt through a veil, Dude? How does the smoked salmon make it through the veil?

[Will]

I know. Like, I feel like the pomp and circumstance gets more ridiculous when there's. I mean, are they still doing this when there's four of them at the end? I think they must.

[Ryder Strong]

They must.

[Will]

Oh, my God. The amount of, like, their bags. Think about how big their bags would be. Would have to be to fit all this clothing in.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh, I was like, what kind of bags are you talking about? I thought you meant under their eyes from the lack of sleep.

[Will]

Candace is wearing, like, a cow fur jacket.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

Like, you know, that's like an entire bag unto itself. And she has one of those every episode. She. I don't know how you do.

[Ryder Strong]

I think the whole show is shot over, What, a week?

[Will]

10 days probably, right? Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

So that, I mean, for 10 days, she's got to have five suitcases.

[Will]

Oh, my God.

[Ryder Strong]

Six suitcases. Yeah.

[Will]

They have like a whole SUV just for their suitcase. They have, like a moving truck to get to the castle.

[Ryder Strong]

I love it.

[Will]

See, I perfected the art of, like. And you, you, you, you have too. When we do conventions and stuff, we get our bags to that one carry on no matter what, because. Oh, my God.

[Ryder Strong]

And a backpack.

[Will]

Anything more. And that's backpack with, like, my computer and my books and then the one carry on. Anything more than that for any vacation. Oh, yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

It's too much. I agree. Yeah.

[Will]

All right, Robin, Candice, what'd you say? It's a great episode. It's a great episode.

[Ryder Strong]

You're totally in, aren't you?

[Will]

Yeah. You know, here's what I'm, Yeah, I'm not into the, the showiness of it all, like, you know, when they're just, like, hanging out. But I'm, I'm definitely into the people now. And seeing Rob and Candace go at it has been super entertaining.

[Ryder Strong]

Like, they're just great.

[Will]

Isn't it? Isn't it? And I, I feel like, Yeah, I just, I, I kind of like everybody now. Like.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

So even for that playing well, they're playing well. Better at least, you know, at least it feels like they're playing now. So.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

I don't know. This was a good episode. I, I, I feel like I know who everybody is. Like, when it comes to people, it's.

[Ryder Strong]

So good at this game.

[Will]

Yeah, he's really good.

[Ryder Strong]

He is so good at this game. Not only is he puppet mastering everything, but people are literally walking away going like, I can't believe anybody would put his name down. He's like, that guy. You think it's that guy? Oh, God.

[Will]

I know. And it backfired so big on her. Oh, my God, that was magical. So opening up, they're meeting up in the turret, and immediately Candace says, rob's the dangerous type that will stab you in the back. And I was like, that's the game. Literally.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh. Actually, what she said was even better. She said, we'll look you in the eye and stab you in the back.

[Will]

Right? And I'm like, but that's, no, but.

[Ryder Strong]

How do you stab you in the back when you're looking somebody in the eye?

[Will]

Is My. But he said to her, I'm voting for you for this reason. He's clearly stated all of his intentions up front. He's just playing better than her. The only thing he keeps to himself is that Colton's threw her name out, which is super smart.

[Ryder Strong]

Yes, he kept it. But it's also. He's playing with no emotion.

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

He's not attached. He was bummed that Colton was gone, but she's, like, taking things personally and making bad decisions because of that. And he's like, I'm playing a game. It's a game of chess, and this is the next piece I have to move.

[Will]

Yes.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, It's.

[Will]

It's. To me, it's like, yes. This is. This is the fun. That's how you actually win it. If you're a traitor, you know, like, being a faithful. I think you can play emotionally because it is just about convincing people. Like, no, I'm being honest. But, like, when you have to lie when that's part of your job, like, yeah, pull the emotion out of it.

[Ryder Strong]

Just full sociopath.

[Will]

Yep. And then Alan Cummings walks into the turret and gives the best line of the episode. I'm sensing awkwardness in my turret. I feel like something I should say to my wife every once in a while. I got awkwardness in my turret. I have awkwardness in my turret.

[Ryder Strong]

Sorry, babe, it's not going to work tonight.

[Will]

I've got a little awkwardness in my turret.

[Ryder Strong]

Awkwardness in my turret.

[Will]

When you. That outfit, it gives me awkwardness.

[Ryder Strong]

Awkwardness in my turret.

[Will]

All right. Rob immediately was like, we should enlist. Which I think is smart, too. Like, why not? Because they're. You know. But no. They decide to murder.

[Ryder Strong]

Yep.

[Will]

Which I just think was a bad idea.

[Ryder Strong]

But I. Yeah. Again, I think. And giving. Giving her the power. Kind of like, I'm gonna give you just enough rope to hang yourself. I was gonna say, go ahead. Yep.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Go ahead. What do you want to do?

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

And it's like, oh, first you're gonna kill Colton. Dumb idea. He was loud and brash and on everybody's list of as a possible traitor. So keep him there.

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

And it was just. Yes. She was.

[Will]

She didn't know. Is that Colton had already thrown out her name. But it's like, Yeah. I can't believe, like, Colton is going. Like, people suspect him. People are over him. You don't worry about somebody like him. Exactly.

[Ryder Strong]

He's already been put in check.

[Will]

They had thrown out Steven, Colton, and Natalie, and I think Stephen or Natalie would have been great. Decisions. Either one of those would have been better than Colton.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, I agree.

[Will]

And then did you notice that Rob then immediately makes the chess comparison? Just like you were saying? Like, you were so right. He's like, he's totally just playing chess, so he's moves ahead.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

He's like, I don't have her in check yet, but I just took her queen, and it's like, oh.

[Will]

I was like, oh, he's operating on this. Yes. It's so good.

[Ryder Strong]

And then he's doing things like, again, never judge a book by its cover. Then he's doing things like quoting Twain and doing. It's like, oh, this guy's a fricking genius. This guy's amazing.

[Will]

Yeah. I wonder how. How much they. They knew that, because it's like they chose two housewives. Him. And then the secret trader is Donna. Right. Like, so how much of the producers, like, foresee this? Do they, like, meet with him and be like, oh, this guy's got a lot more going on than it seems.

[Ryder Strong]

Like, what are your favorite things? So I like chess, or do they.

[Will]

Just look at it?

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, you never know.

[Will]

But he is super great.

[Ryder Strong]

He's killing it.

[Will]

All right. Breakfast. Dorinda comes in saying that she was packing because she didn't think she was like, whatever. But mostly she just never thought that it could be. Lisa is like. Just goes to show how bad she is at the game. It's like, yes. When somebody's your friend or a housewife, it doesn't mean that they're not. Couldn't also be a traitor. Like, they all need to just stop thinking like, yeah, well, he.

[Ryder Strong]

He or she's my friend. It's like, no, you've met them six days ago. To play a game where some of you are lying to each other. I know. That's what it is.

[Will]

They're like, saying I love you to each other when they go to bed at night.

[Ryder Strong]

And I'm like, it's an actor thing. You know that? We're all like that.

[Will]

Of course. We were all.

[Ryder Strong]

It's so my brother. When my brother came out to watch Boy Meets World one time, he came out to the show, and we were. We finished taping, and we were all like, God, I love you, and hugging each other. And he's like, aren't you seeing each other tomorrow morning? We're like, yeah. And he's like, what the hell are you doing?

[Will]

Like, well, like, what's going on?

[Ryder Strong]

And it's that kind of thing where it's like, okay, I'm Going to see you in 12 hours. You know, it's no big deal. But yeah, that's, that's such an entertainer thing. It's like a on camera personality thing.

[Will]

Trying to hug me?

[Ryder Strong]

Well then, yeah, then you push and run. You give me the old push and run.

[Will]

I have no idea. I mean, yes, I definitely was like way much more of a hugger and much more free with like saying I love you and stuff like that when I was on Boy Week's World, but turns out to be mostly correct because I do still love everybody that we worked with. I still have relationships with so many of, of you. So it's like. But yes, I think in general, as I've gotten older, I'm much more comfortable with that sort of LA Hollywood thing of like.

[Ryder Strong]

And it's just LA Hollywood. It's not New York. New York is not the same way. At least it wasn't when I was coming up. New York in the 80s was not. Love you, hug you, see you tomorrow. It's like, yeah, I hope you wake up. So, yeah, it's, sleep well, good night, sleep well. Maybe. Yeah, it was great. So. But it is, they're all just, they're very flowery, actory people.

[Will]

Yeah. See, again, the culture I would not, not really fit into. I would be such an asshole on this show. Dude, you know it too. You know, by day three, I would just be that grumpy guy in the corner. Everybody's like, well, first of all, they would probably suspect me because I would be protesting way too much. I'd just be like, no, I'm a horrible liar.

[Ryder Strong]

I can't lie.

[Will]

I'm sorry. And then they would be like, well, can't trust him.

[Ryder Strong]

I. I voted for you, Ryder. No real reason. I just can't take it anymore. I don't think you're a traitor. I just, just, I can't just don't.

[Will]

Want you in my castle.

[Ryder Strong]

I just don't want you in my castle.

[Will]

Do you remember when we had that conversation about like, what, what our impression is just by looking at us? Do you remember this with McCalla, our tour guide, our tour manager. Oh, we, we were just like. I was like, you know, Will and Danielle really get a pass in life because when you look at them, they're just, they're just so friendly and beautiful. Everybody wants to. And McCall is like, yeah. I'm like, so when you look at Will, what's his zero? Like, what's what? And she's like, just friend, want to get to know him. He likes Me. And I'm like, what about me? And she's like, you think you're smarter than me? You think you're better? You don't remember this car. I know. Oh, my God. Macaulay, you know this isn't true. She's like, no, now I know you, but I'm just saying what you look like basically like, oh, my God. So, yeah, that's my zero. So I'm sure in this world, in traitor's world, they would just be like, that guy thinks he's so, so much better than all of us. Okay, get him out of here. Oh, that's so funny.

[Ryder Strong]

He also doesn't try very hard in the challenges. You could run harder, Ryer.

[Will]

All right, at. At breakfast, Moira brings up Candace and talks about how the throwaway vote made her suspicious, which was brilliant, actually accurate. And of course, is the thing that comes back at the round table. Candice defends her throwaway vote. But I just don't buy it. It's just like, because it's. If she was gonna throw away a vote, why didn't she vote for Natalie? Like, if she really didn't want it to be? It's like. And it just goes to show that she made this move out of a petty impulse right towards Rob. And so that totally backfires, like, exactly what you're saying.

[Ryder Strong]

You can't be emotional.

[Will]

Like, don't be. Because that, like, everybody could see that as a useless move and was like, why would she do that? Yep. Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

And anything. I think it's one of those things that's like, in the. Being in this house is like being a child. Anything that makes you different is not good.

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

So her. Her just pointing something out that's so out of the norm that because everybody.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

You're.

[Ryder Strong]

You're micro concentrating on everybody's little move. Any little thing. He dropped his fork. He did this. You're. You're hyper vigilant to everything going on around you. So something like a big freaking move, like, I'm going to vote for somebody as a throwaway. Of course, you're now on everybody's radar.

[Will]

Yep. That's a target. Yeah. All right. It's revealed that Colton was killed, which at first I was like, bad move.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

But what I realized is it was a bad move for Candace, a brilliant move for Rob because he let her have her her way, like you said. Yeah. I mean, at this point, like, it seems pretty. It seemed pretty obvious to me, which it did turn out to be the case that she's gone like, that's it, man. Because he had already told multiple people. He didn't just tell Rob. He had thrown out her. And they were right about Lisa, which Colton had been gunning for. So the second that Colton's killed, it just. It just looks bad for the Traders, man.

[Ryder Strong]

And you're right. You are 100 right. The smartest thing that Rob did was not say Colton said your name right. He kept smartest thing that he did.

[Will]

And he says at the top of the episode, he's like, I have some information I'm going to keep to myself. Which is amazing because I think I would have been like, oh, Colton said your name. Don't pick him. But he just gave up at this point. He's like, no, Candace is gone. I need to let her just make this decision. Empower her so she knows it's just on her.

[Ryder Strong]

And at the end of the day, in one move, he got rid of a very powerful, faithful and the last traitor but him. Yeah.

[Will]

In one.

[Ryder Strong]

One episode.

[Will]

Brilliant.

[Ryder Strong]

Brilliant.

[Will]

So then Alan Cummings walks in looking precisely like my grandmother's couch from 1991. It's the 1991 couch. Yeah. It's like the exact print.

[Ryder Strong]

It almost looked like the Boy Meets World couch. I was. Yes, yes.

[Will]

Oh, my God. It looks like the Boy Meets World couch.

[Ryder Strong]

Hold on.

[Will]

We got to pull up the Boy meets.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

I think it is.

[Will]

I think it is hot. Boy Meets World living room set. I got to see this.

[Ryder Strong]

I got to see. It's the couch. Check it out.

[Will]

No, cuz it does. I'm looking at. It doesn't have flower. Oh, it's flower. It does.

[Ryder Strong]

It does. It's flowers.

[Will]

Same colors.

[Ryder Strong]

Yes. He went. He wore the Boy Meets World.

[Will]

Oh, my God. Alan Cummins is wearing the Boy Meets World couch. I like, knew it looks so familiar. I was like, no, that was my grandmother's couch. But it was our set.

[Ryder Strong]

It's the Boy Meets World couch. I'm amazed it wasn't covered with plastic and didn't have one of Rusty's scripts in the lapel.

[Will]

That's amazing. Oh, my God. I can't wait. All right, if you're listening to this, go look up the Boy Meets World couch. And all you need is a little beret. And you are Alan Cummings. That is insane. I love it.

[Ryder Strong]

He's got two different Morgans on in. In different pockets.

[Will]

Oh, my God. All right. The mission for the day.

[Ryder Strong]

If you choose to understand it.

[Will]

If you choose. I actually, once they started playing this, I really loved this. And I was like a great game this could be a great, like, home game to play, right? Like, it's sort of like a version of charades where you, like, split up into groups. I thought this was really clever. I was like, this could be its own game show. Actually.

[Ryder Strong]

You know, the way you do it too is you can just do it with Polaroids. Like, you have to. You have to mimic the Polaroid that's in the other room. And then you have to come out and have a Polaroid put next to the one like, ah, we did it. We got it exactly what they wanted.

[Will]

Yeah, it has this cool telephone element to it. You know, like, there's a game that we love to play called Telestrations, which is basically Pictionary with telephone. So you, you sit, you know, you all have a drawing pad and you, like, one person will be like Santa Claus, right? So they will write Santa Claus. Then they pass that. Then the next person gets that, has to flip the page, draw Santa Claus, and then pass that. The next person just gets that drawing, flips the page, and guesses what they think that drawing is.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh, by the end of the game.

[Will]

You know, you see like somebody drawing Santa Claus and it becomes like Super Mario Brothers, you know, whatever. Exactly, like by the end. And the fun of the game is not getting it right. It's actually really boring whenever the fun of the game is when you see how ridiculous it got when somebody couldn't draw. Dude, it's such a fun game, especially with kids. You play it with kids because they just either, you know, can't draw very well or just look, it's a drawing and they're honest about it. So they're like fat man with a mustache. And you're like, okay, guess that's what I'm drawing. Exactly. Okay. Fun.

[Ryder Strong]

I gotta play that.

[Will]

That sounds fun.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

This is Sarah Spain from Good Game with Sarah Spain, brought to you in part by Vital Farms. Let's talk eggs. Vital Farms pasture raised eggs, to be exact. My favorites. The only kind I've got in my fridge. No joke. And here's why. These aren't your average eggs. The hens live on open pastures with fresh air and sunshine all year long. They forage on local grasses and stretch their wings. They're living their best life. That care really shows in the taste. I love mine scrambled with a little butter or whipped up into a fancy frittata. And here's something most people don't know. You could trace your eggs back to the farm they came from. Seriously, Side of the carton, you'll find the farm name, Type it [e-mail] farm and you'll get a 360 degree peek at the pasture. Plus, Vital Farms is a certified B corporation, which means they're committed to improving the lives of people, animals and the planet through food eggs you could feel good about. So next time you're in the store, look for the black carton in the egg aisle and visit vitalfarms.com to learn more. Vital Farms Good eggs, no shortcuts.

[Will]

I am from the future and all of this goes horribly wrong. Critics are calling good luck. Have fun, don't die. Absolute chaotic. Perfection.

[Ryder Strong]

AI. Isn't that a thing already?

[Will]

It gets a lot worse. Honey. Sam Rockwell is electric. Who's joining me? Who's ready to save the future? Five stars. This is real. Pretty much, yeah. It's gonna be okay.

[Ryder Strong]

Or it's not.

[Will]

I don't know. Only in theaters February 13th. Tickets on sale now.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Hey there.

[Ryder Strong]

I'm Kat.

[Will]

I'm a college athlete. I was diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis, which caused back pain and stiffness.

[Ryder Strong]

Every day with Cosentyx, I'm able to stay active.

[Announcer / Advertiser]

Cosentyx Secukinumab is prescribed for adults with active psoriatic arthritis, ankylosing spondylitis or non radiographic axial spondyloarthritis. Available in both IV infusion and self injection. Don't use if allergic to Cosentyx. Get checked for TB before starting. Increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur like TB or other serious bacterial, fungal or viral infections. Some were fatal. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms like fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough, had a vaccine or plan to or if IBD symptoms develop or worsen, serious allergic reactions and severe eczema like skin reactions may occur. Learn more at 1-844-cosentix or cosentyx.com Move and feel better.

[Will]

Ask a rheumatologist about Cosentyx, a KFC tale in the pursuit of flavor. The colonel despised the word empty. Empty plates, empty tables, EMP stomachs. That's why he made the KFC five dollar bowls like the famous bowl. Creamy mashed potatoes, crispy chicken, corn gravy and cheese. Because the only empty the Colonel liked was when you reached the bottom of that bowl. The Colonel lived so we could chicken. Five KFC bowls for just $5 each. Prices and participation may vary.

[Ryder Strong]

Taxes, tips and fees extra.

[Will]

All right, so this mission is this cool art game thing where they have to recreate pieces of art based on a description. And then the other team. But now, okay, so there were three people chosen to go to the gallery and be like the guessers. And those are also the three people who could potentially get a shield.

[Ryder Strong]

Correct.

[Will]

I didn't understand how they got selected.

[Ryder Strong]

Well, the thing that Eric said that was really interesting was, look, every. Nobody knows how to do this, so why don't we nominate somebody else? Right.

[Will]

And so it's just the first three people who spoke.

[Ryder Strong]

Well, no, they started saying each other's names like, all right, we'll do this, we'll do that. And then Rob, very smartly again was like, I got a feeling I might be killed. And so Johnny was like, you take my spot then. Don't worry about it. Because people had nominated Johnny. So then next thing you know, the one traitor who know, you know is there with the two faith. It's just, oh, God, he's playing so well. I know.

[Will]

And I can't believe that the other people who know that he has the, the, the dagger situation wouldn't be like, Rob, you're okay. Don't go, you know, because, like, you don't need the shield. You've got the double votes. None of them even said anything.

[Ryder Strong]

Right. But you could still be kicked out, I guess, if. And you know, the double.

[Will]

But you're looking at who has the potential to get an advantage. Right. And if you know that Rob already has one advantage and you're part of that six person alliance, wouldn't you be like, rob, Rob, Rob. Let me go. Like Natalie or somebody like that.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, yeah.

[Will]

Natalie's playing horribly, by the way. Most people are at least the.

[Ryder Strong]

Kara, this episode was like, I'm bad at this.

[Will]

I'm just.

[Ryder Strong]

I know I'm bad at this game.

[Will]

She's like, I clearly. Well, they all have had that kind of moment. I mean, Kristen has that moment too. She's like, obviously my instincts are way off. I'm just going to do the opposite. That's smart, man. Like, start recognizing your inability to guess.

[Ryder Strong]

The number of conversations that happen this episode of people just going, who do you think it is? I have no idea. Like, that must have happened four times this episode. Just like, I don't know. I don't know anymore who it is. So it's. Oh, it's right.

[Will]

And that's why. But they get better at it when they admit that. So I think the, the better way to come into this game is just be like, I'm just going to listen.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

And be Open and not charge at anybody because it seems like whenever they take a stance, they're pretty much wrong. Like.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. And if there's only one traitor now, if it's just him left, the bullseye.

[Will]

Is so small, it's like.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. Oh, God.

[Will]

It's great, right? All right. This reenacted painting thing with this photo, which is actually really fun, they have to attack. I don't know. They said his face looked more like a horse than, like, it was Johnny's face.

[Ryder Strong]

He's dressed like a cow, and they have udders, and she's there, like, holding onto the thing.

[Will]

It's like, car.

[Ryder Strong]

That's a car. Like, wait, What?

[Will]

Pretty funny, though, how much the one team was pretty, like, got it every time they're killing it.

[Ryder Strong]

No clue. Yep.

[Will]

Yeah. Really bad.

[Ryder Strong]

Very strange.

[Will]

Kind of rightfully so. Like, they have the traitors quarreling, and they. They, like, do a fight scene. I'm like, but it's traitors. You know what traitors look like? You should be, like, in the hoods or, like. Like, you know, I don't know. So that.

[Ryder Strong]

Lot of.

[Will]

Lot of not great choices.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. This is right up your alley, though, this game. This right in your wheelhouse.

[Will]

Loved it. Loved it.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

That's why I was like, I just want to play this game. Kristen finds the shield, which is good. Like, so does that shield last forever, or is it only for this round table?

[Ryder Strong]

I think it's one round table. I think that's it. She's like, I get to sleep tonight. Right.

[Will]

But then does that mean that she couldn't be enlisted? Like, could she get the ultimatum?

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, I think so. Which she's who I would have gone for, frankly.

[Will]

But if she can't be killed, then you can't give her the ultimatum.

[Ryder Strong]

Well, no, I don't think. I don't think it's that you can't be killed. I think it's, oh, no, it is you can't be killed. Or is it. Is it. You can't be killed and you can't be banished. Or is it just killed?

[Will]

I think it's just killed. I thought the shield was just that you won't be murdered that night.

[Ryder Strong]

So then maybe she couldn't get it.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Or maybe. Maybe it. No, no, you're right. No. Because I was gonna say maybe it. It goes away after the roundtable, but, no, the murder hadn't happened yet. So maybe you're right. Maybe she couldn't be.

[Will]

Ultimatum.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. Because everyone then would have known. Yeah. Okay. Interesting.

[Will]

What do they Call it seduced. That's what they keep saying. Or Candace keeps saying. I don't. Seduced.

[Ryder Strong]

Seduced, my friends.

[Will]

All right, after the mission, back at the castle, Eric and Johnny are talking. Candice and Steven gets thrown out there.

[Ryder Strong]

Does the housewives thing. It's throwing me a little bit more because apparently there's all these rules to being a housewife that I didn't. Well, like, they said how it started with Jam Jam this week, who commented on our post, by the way, which is pretty awesome. Did you not see that? No, he just said. He commented on our. Our post this week. Just saying, like, it's been wild or something like that. So he commented on our Instagram. But Jam Jam said, like, housewives don't ever kiss anyone on the cheek. Housewives don't. Blah, blah, blah. So there's. We need an ex. We need a housewives expert is what I'm saying, because we. I've never seen one. I know my wife watches it, but she's not gonna do the show. So we. We. We need to. We need to talk to somebody because. I don't know. I don't get it. I don't get it.

[Will]

Yeah, I mean, when you say rules, you mean just like cultural practices?

[Ryder Strong]

I guess. Yeah, like. Like housewives don't kiss anybody for some reason.

[Will]

I don't know. Housewives only drink two bottles of rose a day. Right. And a bunch of them aren't married.

[Ryder Strong]

So how are they housewives? Like, I don't get the rules. We need to talk to somebody. So we'll put it out into the ether. Cause I don't get it. But she's still a housewife.

[Will]

Who, Dorinda or no?

[Ryder Strong]

Well, Dorinda and Candice. Candice were both still housewives.

[Will]

Are they the only ones left?

[Ryder Strong]

Yes.

[Will]

I mean, Candace is no longer there, but yes.

[Ryder Strong]

There was also something mentioned earlier in this episode that I think we need to touch on a little bit, which is somebody said there's gotta be a man in there.

[Will]

This is right. Right here. I think it was. John and Eric are talking about Candace, and that's why he's like, I feel a male energy. And he throws out Steven.

[Ryder Strong]

Because unless they picked all women, they've got to vote a guy at some point, right? I mean, you think unless. Unless the. They literally think in the house. Wow. Can you imagine if all the traitors are women? Right? It seemed like there'd have to be a guy, Right?

[Will]

Because at this point, they know that they voted out Lisa and Donna. So it's Only been two women, so it does make sense. I don't know why he says, like, a male energy, but I do think that it just. The odds are it's probably a guy, because at this point, they're like, oh, it's probably three.

[Ryder Strong]

Right.

[Will]

And so we've already voted out two women. Probably a guy, I think. Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

Anyway, Dorinda is gunning for Candace and Steven in a conversation with Maura and Tara. Then Dorinda points out this interesting fact that Lisa shared all of her gold with Steven at the last mission, which is. Isn't a good point. Like, that's actually evidence. And I'm like, yeah, that's a good call. And something that, like, I didn't notice that. I don't know if anybody noticed, but it does make sense because, like, you're looking at what the traitor did from the last time. Steven has been flying under the radar, so. Right. And then Stephen and Candace have this moment where Steven tells her that Colton had her name. Rob walks in and asks to talk alone with Candace, which is, like, a ballsy move.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

And interestingly, I don't think Steven picked up enough on that moment. Now, granted, he had just kind of done the same thing by saying he and Candace wanted to have a private moment, but when Rob walks in and says, leave us alone to talk, I was like. And he just walked away. He was like, cool. Yeah, sure.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. Because nobody suspects Rob.

[Will]

That's crazy to me.

[Ryder Strong]

Nobody suspects him. He could literally walk in and be like, hey, dude, can I talk to this person by myself? They're like, you got it, Rob. And that's it.

[Will]

It's great. All right, homie.

[Ryder Strong]

You got it.

[Will]

It's so sweet.

[Ryder Strong]

God, it's so nice to know you're a faithful. Oh, go get you some salmon.

[Will]

So then Rob and Candace have their confrontation, and he lies very well to her. Oh, cuz. She says, when did Colton say my name? And he goes, this morning? Or no, when did you find out that Colton. He said this morning. So cuz just lies right to her face. Yeah, but. And what's great is that he let her choose to kill Colton. So, I mean, this is where it just is revealed. And then she calls him a snake. And he's like, it's a game.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

And he's like, so. Right. He says the game is literally called traitors called traders.

[Ryder Strong]

And then.

[Will]

Yeah, but then he kind of criticizes her sportsmanship. Right. He's like, that's not very sportsmanlike, which is another way of kind of calling her A snake.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

And I'm just like, both of you guys just like, it's not a. You know, just play the game. Just recognize you're lying to each other's face for the sake of a fun game. Yeah, it's not that big of a deal.

[Ryder Strong]

I think one of the things I'm learning the more and more I watch this is to be truly successful at this game, you have to rig it so other people are doing all of the heavy lifting. Yes. You plant the seeds. You plant the seeds and you walk away. And you walk away and you keep your mouth shut. And then occasionally you throw in something to back up whoever is going against the person you want out. And that's what's so great. I'd also like to point out, does it not seem like it's been five years since Michael Rapoport was on this show?

[Will]

Yes, decades. Decades. Seriously.

[Ryder Strong]

It was the early 90s when Michael Rapoport was on the show.

[Will]

Well, it's crazy how much the culture of the castle changes, you know what I mean? Like, and that's why I'm interested in how it's going to be less Housewife Y now, you know? Cause if we're really down to just Dorinda, it's like we, I mean, everybody we have left, like, they're more like gamers, they're more understated, which could make for more of a cutthroat evidence based game. Maybe less emotional, which I'm here for. It's great. It's great. But I think Steven is really. Steven and Johnny are really setting themselves up to be targeted.

[Ryder Strong]

Oh, hell yeah. I also think in a weird way, so is Mark.

[Will]

But Mark is just completely flying under the radar.

[Ryder Strong]

That's why. And they're all talking about we need to start looking at places we would never look. So people like Mark and people like Kristen, right. Who are just quiet and steadfast are I think the next people that are going to be targeted. Those three with Steven as well, it's.

[Will]

Like, yeah, okay, but here's my question that I started realizing. It's like at a certain point you've voted out all the traitors potentially. And then what happens? Like, does nobody get murdered? Like, what if.

[Ryder Strong]

Well, that's what, that's what they do. They hit. So if memory serves from the last one, they, you get to a certain point and you all agree to stop playing.

[Will]

And that can happen with like six people or eight people. Or does that only happen when they get down?

[Ryder Strong]

I guess it's not going to Be eight. I think there's been different numbers of people each year. I think sometimes there was three. I think once there was three, I think once there was four. So my guess is they'll get to four or five and they'll kind of look around and be like, I think we got them all. If we got them all, then we go to the last big ceremony. We drink the blood of the Rob.

[Will]

But if you're a traitor and you're the only one left, that's a great thing for you to insist on. Of course we got them all, but wouldn't you know you got them all because there would be no more murders.

[Ryder Strong]

But that's the thing is, I think at that point, that's when you get to a small number of people, I think they have to. They stop it in a certain way.

[Will]

So, okay, see, this is my hard time with this whole game, because when you get to the point, like, if you know that they're not going to stop the game, like, let's say you vote out three traders in a row, which, like, they could do next week, right? Like next week they could vote out, you know, that they're just going to keep enlisting. So, like, the idea of thinking about this static group of traders and faithful is kind of ridiculous because it's always going to be there's going to be traders all the way up until there's four of you left, potentially. Or is it really possible that you could vote out three traders and be done and then like 10 of you are left if you were really playing?

[Ryder Strong]

Well, I guess. I mean, I don't know. My guess is you. They break it up in such a way to where you're always going to be recruiting because I don't think you're allowed to have one traitor. So it's like, you got to go get your next one. You got to go. That's why there's only ever 2 Sith Rider. There could be plenty of Jedi, but only two Sith. A master and an apprentice.

[Will]

Okay. If all traitors are banished, on the traitors, the remaining faithful contestants win the entire accumulated prize pot and share equally. The game essentially concludes early as no traitors remain to murder player. Right. So wouldn't you know that you've gotten rid of all the traitors because you wake up the next morning and nobody got murdered?

[Ryder Strong]

So wait, what you're saying is if they pick right in a row, three in a row, or four in a row, game's over. Game's over.

[Will]

Like if they murdered Rob next week, I mean, I guess now he's enlisted Eric. So we know that. But like if he didn't enlist and they just murdered him or banished him like tonight. Yeah, if they.

[Ryder Strong]

She said, I guess you'd have to find out because it's never happened.

[Will]

So I'm just saying the producers are going to make sure that never happens. They're always going to keep enlisting and they keep murdering.

[Ryder Strong]

Right.

[Will]

But actually if you're a faithful. I don't know, it's. This game is just manipulation.

[Ryder Strong]

I thought of, I thought of the most brilliant thing in the world to do and it's such a James Bond kind of thing and would be fully illegal and I love it. So when you first get to the, to the tower, the day that they pick the traitors. Okay. You come up with the lemon water concoction on your hand that nobody can see, the one that can only be seen in certain lights. And you shake Alan Cummings hand. So when he touches everybody on the shoulder, you then put on your glasses to see the marks on each person's shoulder that he hit and you'd know who the traitors were.

[Will]

Wow. That's devious.

[Ryder Strong]

Right?

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

This is Sarah Spain from Good Game with Sarah Spain, brought to you in part by Vital Farms. Let's talk eggs. Vital Farms pasture raised eggs to be exact. My favorites. The only kind I've got in my fridge. No joke. And here's why. These aren't your average eggs. The hens live on open pastures with fresh air and sunshine all year long. They forage on local grasses and stre their wings. They're living their best life. That care really shows in the taste. I love mine scrambled with a little butter or whipped up into a fancy frittata. And here's something most people don't know. You could trace your eggs back to the farm they came from. Seriously. Side of the carton, you'll find the farm name. Type it [e-mail] farm and you'll get a 360 degree peek at the pasture. Plus, Vital Farms is a certified B corporation, which means they're committed to improving the lives of people, animals and the planet through food. Food, eggs you could feel good about. So next time you're in the store, look for the black carton in the egg aisle and visit vitalfarms.com to learn more. Vital Farms good eggs. No shortcuts.

[Will]

I am from the future and all of this goes horribly wrong. Critics are calling good luck. Have fun, don't die. Absolute chaotic. Perfection.

[Ryder Strong]

AI isn't That a thing already?

[Will]

It gets a lot worse.

[Announcer / Advertiser]

Honey.

[Will]

Sam Rockwell is electric. Who's joining me?

[Ryder Strong]

Who's ready to save the future?

[Will]

Five stars.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

This is real?

[Will]

Pretty much, yeah. It's gonna be okay. Or it's not. I don't know. Rated R only in theaters February 13th. Tickets on sale now.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Hey there. I'm Kat.

[Will]

I'm a college athlete. I was diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis, which caused back pain and stiffness.

[Ryder Strong]

Every day with Cosentyx, I'm able to stay active.

[Announcer / Advertiser]

Cosentyx Secukinumab is prescribed for adults with active psoriatic arthritis, ankylosing spondylitis or non radiographic axial spondyloarthritis. Available in both IV infusion and self injection. Don't use if you're allergic to Cosentyx. Get checked for TB before starting. Increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur like TB or other serious bacterial, fungal or viral infections. Some were fatal. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms like fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough, had a vaccine or planned to, or if IBD symptoms develop or worsen serious allergic reactions and severe eczema like skin reactions may occur. Learn more at 1-844-cosentyx or cosentyx.com Move and feel better.

[Will]

Ask a rheumatologist about Cosentyx.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Today's episode is brought to you by Simple Mills. From their crackers to their cookies to even more of their delicious feel good snacks, Simple Mills packs nutrient dense ingredients into snacks that taste amazing. Like their cheesy, light and airy pop ems or their five different delicious flavors of almond flour crackers. Because snacks should do more than taste good, they should make you feel good too. Simple Mills does that with purposefully chosen real ingredients like almonds, sunflower seeds and butternut squash. Creating snacks that help you feel bright and energized, lifting you up, never weighing you down so you can keep shining through the day. You could say Simple Mills is the feeling of the sun in a snack. Find Simple Mills at your grocery store.

[Will]

What is this lemon thing that you're talking about?

[Ryder Strong]

There's a like, did you ever watch what was the one he did in National Treasure where it's like this kind of soluble, it's like liquid, where there's some lemon juice and some stuff in that that you can't see it on anything, but under a black light it pops up.

[Will]

Wow.

[Ryder Strong]

So you do you shake his hand and then the hand he touches everybody with. They. He literally mark them with this invisible ink. And then you pop on your glasses. Your specialty glasses, and wow.

[Will]

Yeah, that's. That's. That's going to the next level. And I'm sure the producers would. Would have a problem with that. Well, you don't tell them. Now we're back. We're into the round table. Candace and Rob said they're going after another. They're just doing. Which is just dumb. Like, on her part. Really dumb on her part.

[Ryder Strong]

Yes, 100%.

[Will]

And Rob says he's just going to stay calm, let Candace scream and yell and be emotional, because the more you protest, the more guilty you look. Which is exactly right. And what happened then? Johnny jumps in, starts off by saying Colton had mentioned Stephen, which was like, yeah, well, Colton mentioned so many people.

[Ryder Strong]

He mentioned everybody.

[Will]

I feel like Stephen's really screwed now.

[Ryder Strong]

Like, oh, yeah. No, he's.

[Will]

People are just not trusting Steven or Johnny. Like, those two, for whatever reason. I just feel like they're. They're going down.

[Ryder Strong]

I think Johnny might be next. I think Johnny might be next.

[Will]

I think so, too.

[Ryder Strong]

Yep.

[Will]

Dorindo brings up that Lisa gave her gold to Steven, which is a great argument.

[Ryder Strong]

Legit.

[Will]

And he. His defense is, I wouldn't have given. Like, Like, I asked for it. Like, I just went up to her and asked.

[Ryder Strong]

Which he did.

[Will]

Which he did. And was like, you know, he's like, I don't have an alliance with her. It wasn't like, she just offered it to me. Like, I. You know. Which was a good defense and is true.

[Ryder Strong]

It's also. I was thinking about this as he was making his. His. His appeal e. That he was not a traitor. The thing that I was thinking about was how easy it is to not have to lie. It's like, you don't have to keep anything straight in your head. You don't have to do anything. Yes, you have to fight for your life. But at the same time, it's not like, oh, what did I say two tables ago? It's just like I just walked. Talked up and I asked her for her gold. Like, that's what happened. You're not making anything up.

[Will]

That seems to be the best policy as a faithful is to just. Just play it completely straight. Never lie about anything and. Right. Right.

[Ryder Strong]

It's just. It's be. You don't have anything to keep straight in your head. You don't have to do anything. Just. This is what happened. Yeah, I could see how that'd be weird, but I walked up and asked her. And so she gave me her gold.

[Will]

Right, right. All right. Well, then Eric brings up Candace, which is obviously accurate and great. And then Candace just goes for Rob, points out his nervousness with his, like, dropping his fork at breakfast, which, you know, isn't a. Is an okay attempt at an argument, but he's just not. He's pretty unflappable, so.

[Ryder Strong]

And had a great excuse. Which is what exactly? Because I always think about what would I say, what would I say if that same thing happened? And before he even said it, I'd be like, no, I was just upset. I just lost, like, my best friend in the game.

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

Exactly what he said.

[Will]

Right. Yeah. And I think it's just a really bad look for Candace to go after.

[Ryder Strong]

Rob so much, especially the night after you made it a throwaway. I know. And now all of a sudden, you're really going.

[Will]

Inconsistency in her argument.

[Ryder Strong]

Yes.

[Will]

She should have pulled back from Rob. I mean, she should have just decided to stay a traitor joining Rob. Like, the idea. Like, she should have have. The second Lisa was voted out and they had the beginning of this episode, their turret meeting. She should have been like, cool, man. You won. Now I'm. I'm. In order to stay in this game, I'm going to listen to you and be a traitor partner with you.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

Like, why she gets so emotional and makes it about, like, Rob being a bad trader. Like, no, he did the smartest thing. And if she were smart, she would join him at the beginning of this episode and say, what do you think we should do? And he probably would have said, let's enlist somebody. Let's, you know, expand this and then keep murdering.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. And she's so.

[Will]

It's just so dumb to go against him because she, he holds all the cards.

[Ryder Strong]

Like, she just let all her. And she. He. He even holds cards she doesn't know about. She doesn't know he has the dagger or any of that.

[Will]

She doesn't. He didn't tell. No. He didn't tell all the traders about that?

[Ryder Strong]

No. Remember, he does. Nobody has been told that he has the dagger. The five people that he was with, but it was. No other traders know that he has the dagger. So. Yeah, I mean, I would have said to her, her. She had like six votes the night before. She was dead weight. I'm telling you, they were going to vote her out anyway. The smartest thing for us to do is back that vote so we don't look like traitors now. You look like a traitor. I Mean, you just. You put yourself on the radar. This is just bad playing.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah. And then pointing to him is just. It's so bad.

[Ryder Strong]

Don't do it.

[Will]

So Moira and Eric vote for Candace. And that's when I was like, oh, it's. It's happening. Because there was a moment after the discussion, I was like, did they. They rally enough votes for Candace? Like, it didn't seem like it necessarily, but then when Johnny voted Candace.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

All right.

[Will]

Candace votes for Rob. And then Johnny says Candace. And I was like, oh, it's over.

[Ryder Strong]

She's got the same thing.

[Will]

It was like, now it's just let the dominoes fall. And sure enough, Kristen votes for Candace. Dorinda does, too. Natalie votes for Tara.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

Which is like, there's still, like, this personal vendetta because she had thrown her out the night before or whatever. But this is where I'm like, natalie, what are you doing? Like, like, she's just not playing very well, man.

[Ryder Strong]

No, no. And neither is Tara, but at least Tara knows she's not playing. I think she's like, I'm terrible at this.

[Will]

I'm really bad. Don't know anything.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah.

[Will]

Rob obviously votes for Candace. And Mark. Tara, who, like, cries while she's doing it, votes for Candace. And then Stephen, too.

[Ryder Strong]

Was this the most votes for one person?

[Will]

It seems like it, yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah, I think so, too.

[Will]

Pretty, pretty. Yeah. I mean, it's only Natalie and Candace didn't vote for. Yeah. So. And they were right.

[Ryder Strong]

Yep.

[Will]

So second round table in a row. Like, they're actually playing well. They should actually, like, again, though, they're.

[Ryder Strong]

Playing well because of Rob.

[Will]

They're playing well because of the traitor. I know that's.

[Ryder Strong]

He's just. He's manipulating everything. He's playing them like a fiddle. It's unbelievable to watch this. It is a virtuoso performance. It really is. Well.

[Will]

And then in the turret afterwards, Rob discussing who he's going to invite to be a traitor.

[Ryder Strong]

I think he's got to do it. I think he's going to do it.

[Will]

The first thing he says is Johnny, which is. He's like. Is a pure evil plan. Because he's like, he would just get voted out because he's already suspected so. Which I was like, dude, Rob, that's brilliant. Like, he could pick Johnny knowing that Johnny was. Would get banished the next night, basically, and then he wouldn't have to murder. I mean, like, that's devious. But then he doesn't end up doing that. He ends up picking Eric.

[Ryder Strong]

And his. I watched three times. Eric. It just shows how good Rob is at this game. Cause he pulls off his hood, and it is the best reaction watching Eric see who the traitor is. Like, you've got to be kidding me. It's you. Oh, God. It's just. It's delicious to watch.

[Will]

I also just love when Eric gets invited to be, you know, to do the thing. And he's just like, I know who it is. It's Johnny. No, it's not. But then also, I just love. He's like, this is what I get for being nice. Yeah. And he's like, that would be me, man.

[Ryder Strong]

That would.

[Will]

I thought the same thing.

[Ryder Strong]

I was like, that's Ryder's response. Like, I don't want to do this. I don't want to be.

[Will]

I don't want to be a traitor. Like, I don't have to lie to people's faces now. I would. Yeah, that would be. My worst nightmare is I would. I would start the game as a faithful. Just know, okay? No pressure. Just like you said. Just be honest. Don't have to lie, never lie. And then get enlisted and have to be a traitor. Y. I'd be so bad. Talk about, like, dropping forks. I would just be, like, running into walls and stumbling over my words.

[Ryder Strong]

Anybody would say, murder me. Like, I don't want to do it. I can't do it. I can't be a traitor. I don't want to do it. It's not for me.

[Will]

I probably would.

[Ryder Strong]

I'll be dead.

[Will]

I probably would.

[Ryder Strong]

But then I wonder what happens? Do they have to. You have to go pick somebody else. I guess because it's an ultimatum.

[Will]

You can choose to not be, but.

[Ryder Strong]

I mean, for a traitor, if there's. You can't just have one, then that he has to go to somebody else. Probably has to keep going down the line.

[Will]

But you would just get murdered. So Eric would just get murdered and get off and no one would know that he got murdered with the option of being enlisted.

[Ryder Strong]

Exactly.

[Will]

I mean, I think. I mean, that's the real definition of a faith. You go to the grave faithful. Yeah, I mean, that's. I don't think he's gonna do that. No, I don't think so.

[Ryder Strong]

I don't think he's gonna.

[Will]

No. You gotta play the game. I mean, I don't. Yeah. Although if I was in this situation, I'd probably like, please get me out of here. I can't.

[Ryder Strong]

I can't.

[Will]

I'm gonna go buy my own smoked salmon. I don't need to deal with the hugs and the kisses and the own.

[Ryder Strong]

Castle down the street.

[Will]

I'm just gonna.

[Ryder Strong]

I've got masks and robes. I'm gonna do it on my own. Thank you very much.

[Will]

Well, I was actually surprised that they ended with revealing that it was Eric that he had chosen to give the to because usually we end on more of a cliffhanger where we don't know what they chose. So. Interesting. Interesting.

[Ryder Strong]

I'm glad they did. I'm glad I know. But it's still. I. I agreed with you 100%. I'm like, they're going to. I figured the last shot was going to be the envelope on the chair.

[Will]

Right.

[Ryder Strong]

It was the perfect ending shot. Exactly. That was going to be. Or maybe a hand coming that. But that would have been it. And then that was it. Of course, if it was a. A fur lined gloved hand, you'd be like. Oh yeah. They.

[Will]

So I think Rob's thinking was Johnny would be the person you enlist who ever suspicious.

[Ryder Strong]

Right.

[Will]

Eric is somebody who. Because he's a gamer, because, you know, like he would be kind of in between. And then the other option he throws out is Mark, who nobody has suspected of anything. So it's interesting. I feel like he chose the sort of middle ground. Do you know what I mean? Because Eric could go either way. Like Eric could be just the nice guy that nobody ever thinks. Or they're gonna go for him because he's been too under the radar. Whereas Mark truly hasn't given him pass by everybody like Rob.

[Ryder Strong]

Yeah. I'm always. I'm so. So we've. We've heard little snippets through the grapevine of how much is on the cutting room floor.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

And you wonder, I mean you. We both know this industry well enough. Could they have taken exactly the footage that they have from the beginning and recut the entire show where Mark just looks guilty the entire time?

[Will]

Mm.

[Ryder Strong]

Or he's playing brilliantly or something like that. Cause it doesn't seem like they're focusing on him at all.

[Will]

No, he's mostly just been cut around. It's like. Like you don't even get to see him like socializing or being in our.

[Ryder Strong]

You know, it also just shows you what they're doing. I read an interview the other day. I forget it might have been with Jam. Jam. I forget who it was with. Or Kristen. But they talk about how that banquet was six hours long.

[Will]

Oh my God.

[Ryder Strong]

They shot that for six hours. So I mean, crazy, crazy what we're seeing and what we're not. Yeah.

[Will]

No, thanks. Yeah, yeah.

[Ryder Strong]

As you know, I am not only an expert on dance, but I'm also expert on the famous traitors throughout history in a segment that I call it Wheels History.

[Will]

Wow. What? What?

[Ryder Strong]

Kind of almost like a like a rock metal kind of, but like Broadway vibe. Does that work? I'm still working on it. Anyway, today's installment is Pedro Paterno. From 1857 to 1911, Pedro Paterno is considered the most infamous traitor in the history of the Philippines. He's a well regarded writer and lawyer who never missed an opportunity. To gain opportunity, he negotiated an agreement with the Spanish Empire in 1897 in which Filipino revolutionaries would end their fight with Spanish and cooperate with them. He urged the Philippines to fight against the United States during the Spanish American War and to continue to resist American occupation after Spain lost the war. After he was captured by the Americans, though, he swore allegiance to the US and became president of the Consultive Assembly.

[Will]

Whoa. Consultive consultant. So he, like betrays the Philippines.

[Ryder Strong]

He was like a triple. Triple, yeah.

[Will]

Spain then goes to the U.S. so wait, did he get away with it? Like, did he live a good life?

[Ryder Strong]

Life that. I am going to tell you later.

[Will]

Why you have all this information.

[Ryder Strong]

I do. It's at the. It's in my head. But I like to leave on a cliffhanger just like you do, Ryder.

[Will]

Okay, well, that'll do it for this episode of Pod Meats. World alliances were tested, trust misplaced, and once again, we're left with somewhat of a cliffhanger. Join us next time as we continue our journey through season four of Traitors, a show in which, as Shakespeare said in his Scottish play, fair is foul and foul is fair.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

There's a lot of noise in the business world today. Leaders like you need clear insights from professionals you can trust. Navigating beyond the Expected is a new podcast from Truist securities featuring conversations with investment banks, experts at the center of financing deals in manufacturing, healthcare, entertainment, and more. It's practical advice for leaders who need to know what's coming next. [e-mail] BeyondPodcast Copyright Truist securities Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC at CVS. It matters that we're not just in your community, but that we're part of it. It matters that we're here for you when you need us, day or night. And we want everyone to feel welcome, welcomed and rewarded. It matters that CVS is here to fill your prescriptions and here to fill your craving for a tasty and, yeah, healthy snack. At cvs, we're proud to serve your community because we believe where you get your medicine matters. So Visit [e-mail] or just come by our store. We can't wait to meet you. Store hours vary by location.

[Ryder Strong]

Janice Torres here and I'm Austin Hankwitz. We host the podcast Mind the Small Business Success Stories, produced by Ruby Studio in partnership with Intuit QuickBooks.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

We're back for season four to talk to some incredible small business owners.

[Will]

The big thing about working at tech is that it's ever evolving, ever changing. Everyone's a rookie. That's how fast the industry is changing. So what I'm really excited about is.

[Ryder Strong]

To be part of that change. So listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Looking to transform your business through better HR and payroll? Meet paycor, a Paychex company. The powerhouse solution that empowers leaders to drive results. From recruiting and development to payroll and analytics, paycor connects you with the people, data and expertise you need to succeed. Their innovative platform helps you make smarter decisions about your most valuable asset. Your people ready to become a better leader? Visit paycor.com leaders to learn more. That's paycor.com leadership.