Pod Save America – Episode 1124: "Trump Loses At Supreme Court, Handles It Well"

Date: February 22, 2026
Host: John Lovett
Guest: Jerusalem Demsas, journalist and founder of "The Argument"

Episode Overview

In this lively and wide-ranging episode, John Lovett sits down with journalist Jerusalem Demsas to unpack the Supreme Court’s recent ruling against Donald Trump’s emergency tariffs, analyze the Argument’s headline-making poll on trans rights backlash, discuss why Democrats are losing ground on the issue, and explore solutions for housing affordability and the not-so-bad nature of political “cringe.” The conversation is candid, policy-focused, and sprinkled with irreverent humor and sharp insight, making it a must-listen for progressives tracking the shifting tides of American politics.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Supreme Court Ruling Against Trump’s Tariffs

[02:51–07:10]

• Summary:
  Lovett and Demsas react to the Supreme Court’s decision to strike down Trump’s emergency tariffs, noting the expected result given legal precedent and the remaining ambiguity about the collected $200B in tariffs.
• Partisan Divide:
  The justices split, with Kavanaugh, Alito, and Thomas siding with Trump. Kavanaugh, in particular, expresses frustration about not having a mechanism to return tariff revenue.
• Legal vs. Policy Roles:
  Demsas highlights the limits of courts as policymaking bodies:

  “I don’t think anyone really thinks an ideal world that the Supreme Court ... should be in charge of legislating. These people aren’t actually policy experts. Hopefully, they’re legal experts, but they’re not like, policy experts.” (Jerusalem Demsas, 04:06)

• Personal Anecdotes:
  Both Demsas and Lovett joke about paying unexpected tariffs on online purchases, questioning if they’ll get refunds.
• Broader Impact:
  Demsas emphasizes that although Trump can’t unilaterally flip tariffs anymore, he can reimpose them via slower, more standard legal channels. The unpredictability he favored is now curtailed, helping global partners plan.

  "That kind of instability is like, I think, a part of how Trump likes to do politics ... we can take that away, because that was really destabil for both businesses, but also various countries." (Demsas, 06:36)

2. The Argument’s Poll: The Trans Rights Backlash

[15:49–30:47]

• Major Findings:
  • Public opinion has shifted towards supporting restrictive policies such as bathroom bills and bans on puberty blockers for minors, a reversal from a few years ago.
  • Broad support remains for banning discrimination against trans people in housing and employment (63% approval).
  • The backlash is observable across all voter groups, not just the right.
• Root Causes:
  Demsas attributes the shift to concerted, well-funded right-wing campaigns focusing on issues that test boundaries (sports, children, education) and less to core anti-discrimination principles.
  • The right learned from their loss over bathroom bills in 2016 to focus on more divisive issues.
  • Progressives may have overestimated public acceptance coming out of earlier high-profile wins.
• Strategy Debate:
  • Lovett raises the importance of message framing, suggesting Democrats do better when focusing on broad freedoms and government overreach.
  • Demsas stresses that wording alone can’t account for real shifts in opinion, and polling panels work hard to remove bias:

    “...there are other polls with different wording that have found very similar trends.” (Demsas, 24:33)

• Where To Go From Here:
  Lovett and Demsas agree Democrats must build a clear, principled stance centering on freedom, equality, and anti-discrimination—both for persuasion and to rebuild trust with both trans people and skeptical voters.

Notable Quotes

• Demsas on core value distinctions:

  “You can be really opposed to people acting differently than the birth they’re assigned at sex and still think they shouldn’t be discriminated against.” (Demsas, 22:50)

• Lovett on Democratic positioning:

  “We are not the ones obsessed with trans people. These freaks on the right are obsessed with trans people. We want to get out of people’s medical decisions ... let people live and be free.” (Lovett, 31:11)

3. The Power of “Cringe” in Modern Political Resistance

[39:01–48:26]

• “Cringe” as Resistance:
  Demsas argues embracing “cringe”—the earnest, sometimes awkward activism often derided online—is necessary for mass movements.
  • Winning requires normies, not just the “cool kids.”

  "Cringe is just normie behavior. And if you don't win the normies, you've just lost ... If the moms aren't with you, if the grandpas aren't with you, it's not going well." (Demsas, 39:39)

• Cultural Shifts:
  The discussion ties the rise of cringe policing to politics as a source of identity, generational divides, and social media amplifying younger voices.
• Gender, Age, & Class:
  Lovett and Demsas parse out whether “cringe” policing is more about age or class—a mix maybe, but age and generational change may predominate.
  • Demsas:

    “Young people always think people who are older than them are cringe ... now they have the ability to go online and by the thousands and go 'ew, what is this?'"

4. Housing Affordability: Trump's Populist Pivot and Real Solutions

[49:07–55:46]

• Trump’s Executive Order and Media Responsibility:
  • Trump attempts to seize the housing issue by targeting “Wall Street” in home purchases. Demsas says this is mostly smoke and mirrors:

    “Institutional investors ... are like, definitionally, a tiny percentage of the housing market ... this is a tiny, tiny amount.” (Demsas, 49:40)

  • Public anger over housing is valid but focusing blame on institutional investors distracts from the real causes: restrictive local policies and development bottlenecks.
• The True Obstacles to Affordable Housing:
  • Local policies (“veto points”) and endless hearings regularly derail new construction, including affordable housing projects.
  • Even bipartisan consensus for more housing often gets stuck at the implementation level.

    “Housing delayed is housing denied.” (Demsas, 52:56)

  • Case study: LA’s struggle to spend earmarked housing funds due to bureaucratic inertia and local resistance (Prop Triple H).

5. Building “The Argument”: Lessons in Independent Media

[56:11–58:44]

• Demsas on Management & Mission:
  • Starting "The Argument" required learning to manage a growing team and take responsibility for both content and operations.
  • The mission: revitalize political liberalism through spirited debate and engagement with a broad range of ideas instead of tribalism or echo chambers.

    “If you don’t figure out ways to talk to them, then you’re either consigning yourself to ... live in my safe haven and, you know, fuck everyone who can’t make it here, or you’re consigning yourself to losing forever. And that’s something I’m not willing to [do].” (Demsas, 58:24)

  • The importance of disagreement and argumentation for a healthy liberal society.

Memorable Episode Wrap-Up

[58:48–59:20] Lovett gives a classic rapid-fire summary:

1. Tariffs bad, but Trump will probably find a way anyway.
2. Cringe good.
3. Progressives must openly discuss trans rights if we want to win.
4. Build houses.
5. Argue.

Jerusalem responds enthusiastically:

“Good arguments good. Argument’s great. Argue with people.” (Demsas, 59:16)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Supreme Court Tariff Ruling – 02:51–07:10
• Trans Rights Poll & Backlash – 15:49–30:47
• How Democrats Should Frame Trans Policy – 26:14–33:40
• “Cringe” in Political Activism – 39:01–48:26
• Housing Affordability & Local Barriers – 49:07–55:46
• Building an Independent Media Outlet – 56:11–58:44
• Episode Summary & Farewell – 58:48–59:27

Final Thoughts

This episode delivers a fast-paced, thoughtful analysis of the intersection between policy, public opinion, and political identity. The hosts grapple honestly with setbacks, highlight paths forward on crucial issues, and remind listeners that only open argument, mass participation—including “cringe”—and an unflinching look at data will drive progress.

Notable Quotes Recap

• “Cringe is just normie behavior. And if you don’t win the normies, you’ve just lost.” (Demsas, 39:39)
• “You can be really opposed to people acting differently than the birth they’re assigned at sex and still think they shouldn’t be discriminated against.” (Demsas, 22:50)
• “We are not the ones obsessed with trans people. These freaks on the right are obsessed with trans people. We want to get out of people’s medical decisions ... let people live and be free.” (Lovett, 31:11)
• “Housing delayed is housing denied.” (Demsas, 52:56)
• “Good arguments good. Argument’s great. Argue with people.” (Demsas, 59:16)

For listeners looking for actionable insight and clarity on today's most contentious political battles, this episode stands out as both candid and full of hope for honest engagement and coalition-building.