Bill Maher on Hating Donald Trump, the Far Left and 69ing

Summary

Pod Save America: Bill Maher on Hating Donald Trump, the Far Left, and 69ing

Episode Overview

In this engaging and unfiltered episode of Pod Save America, hosted by John Lovett of Crooked Media, former Obama aides Jon Lovett, Dan Pfeiffer, and Tommy Vietor welcome renowned television host, political commentator, and stand-up comedian Bill Maher. The conversation delves deep into the current political climate, media polarization, cancel culture, and societal issues surrounding transgender rights, all peppered with Maher's characteristic humor and candid opinions.

Key Discussions and Insights

1. Reflecting on "Politically Incorrect"

   The episode kicks off with a nostalgic look back at Bill Maher's earlier show, Politically Incorrect. They reminisce about its impact and formative role in political discourse.

   • John Lovett (04:00): "I remember watching it... It was very formative for me."
   • Bill Maher (07:10): "What was great about that show was that when it was good, there were moments that were really good, but even when it was bad, it was kind of good."

   Discussion Points:

   • The dynamic between comedians, celebrities, and politicians on the show.
   • The evolution of political debates on television from the 90s to today.
   • The challenges of maintaining meaningful discourse in a polarized media landscape.

2. Media Polarization and the Changing Nature of Debates

   Maher and Lovett explore how media and political debates have shifted, emphasizing the decline of substantive discussions and the rise of performative conflicts.

   • Bill Maher (13:04): "I love having an actual debate... You have to stop engaging with or yanking your chain..."
   • John Lovett (15:06): "You have Democrats who often avoid engaging with Republicans unless it suits them, which is very dangerous."

   Discussion Points:

   • The absence of genuine debate in modern cable news.
   • The impact of partisan media on public perception and political accountability.
   • The difficulty Democrats face in countering misinformation and extremist narratives within their ranks.

3. Cancel Culture and Free Speech

   The duo delves into the contentious topic of cancel culture, its implications for free speech, and its uneven application across the political spectrum.

   • Bill Maher (21:45): "I think some people get away with shit that other people don't. It's very uneven."
   • John Lovett (43:40): "Republicans are casting Democrats as antagonists, making it harder to hold Republicans accountable."

   Discussion Points:

   • The role of cancel culture in suppressing dissenting opinions.
   • How mainstream media portrays Democrats and Republicans, fostering resentment.
   • The challenges Democrats face in maintaining unity and countering internal extremism.

4. Transgender Rights and Gender-Affirming Care

   A heated segment addresses the debate over transgender rights, particularly focusing on gender-affirming care for minors and the philosophical differences in policy approaches.

   • Bill Maher (67:12): "They put the idea in people's heads that maybe you're not in the right body... That's entrapment."
   • John Lovett (72:18): "Gender-affirming care saves a lot of lives... The war on that group of people is going too far."

   Discussion Points:

   • The ethical and medical considerations surrounding gender-affirming treatments for minors.
   • The impact of legislative measures on the transgender community.
   • The balance between parental rights and children's autonomy in medical decisions.

5. Donald Trump’s Influence and Political Strategy

   The conversation turns to Donald Trump's presidency, his approach to governance, and his lasting impact on American politics.

   • Bill Maher (35:12): "Trump does not care about how the American system works... He just does it by executive order."
   • John Lovett (43:14): "Trump hasn’t stood up to the far, far fringe of his party from day one."

   Discussion Points:

   • Trump's disregard for traditional political processes and the use of executive orders.
   • The fragmentation within the Republican Party and the rise of extremist voices.
   • The long-term implications of Trump's strategy on democracy and governance.

6. Political Polarization and the Role of Leadership

   Maher and Lovett discuss the increasing polarization in politics, the responsibility of leaders to bridge divides, and the challenges in fostering bipartisan cooperation.

   • Bill Maher (62:23): "The Democrats have never stood up to the far, far fringe. They were too feeble, too old."
   • John Lovett (58:03): "Republicans are treated as antagonists while Democrats are the protagonists, fostering deeper resentment."

   Discussion Points:

   • The necessity of strong, principled leadership in combating extremism.
   • Strategies for Democrats to effectively counteract misinformation and maintain ideological integrity.
   • The importance of bipartisan efforts in addressing national challenges.

Concluding Remarks and Departure

As the discussion intensifies, Maher becomes increasingly critical of certain Democratic strategies and the handling of sensitive issues like transgender rights. The debate reaches a peak, leading to Maher abruptly leaving the conversation in the middle of a heated exchange.

• Bill Maher (75:02): "I'm just leaving. Thank you."
• John Lovett (75:05): "We could do it all day."

This unexpected departure underscores the deep-seated tensions and differing perspectives on crucial political and social issues.

Notable Quotes

• Bill Maher at [07:10]: "The idea was everyone in America votes... It's a democracy, and let's pair the least likely people to ever be in the same room together."
• John Lovett at [13:03]: "Democrats have an obligation to squawk back at those people and they don't do it enough."
• Bill Maher at [67:12]: "We put an idea in people's heads that maybe you're not in the right body... That's entrapment."

Final Thoughts

This episode of Pod Save America offers a raw and honest exploration of the current state of American politics, media influence, and societal debates. Bill Maher's candid insights and willingness to challenge mainstream narratives provide listeners with a thought-provoking perspective on the complexities of modern governance and cultural shifts.

For those who haven't tuned in, this episode serves as a compelling reflection on the intersection of politics, media, and personal beliefs, highlighting the ongoing struggle to maintain meaningful dialogue in an increasingly polarized world.

Transcript

[John Lovett]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. What are some relationship green flags? Those are positive actions or traits in your partner and loved ones. We hear about red flags often that we should avoid. What do we focus more on? Looking for green flags and friends and partners. If you're not sure what they look like, therapy is there to help you identify green flags. Actively practice them in your relationships and embody the green flag energy in yourself. Whether you're dating, married, building a friendship or just working on yourself, it's time to form relationships that love you back. Hey, Tommy, what are some of my green flags to you?

[Tommy Vietor]

Boundless enthusiasm.

[John Lovett]

Sure.

[Tommy Vietor]

Hilarious.

[John Lovett]

Wow.

[Tommy Vietor]

Whip smart.

[John Lovett]

This sucks.

[Tommy Vietor]

Sick body.

[John Lovett]

I hate. Oh, wow. Great hair. Great hair. But the hair I bought. There is a doctor that gets a green flag for the hair. Well, Tommy, I just really like the cut of your jib. BetterHelp. It's fully online. It's helpful for learning positive coping skills, how to set boundaries. It empowers you to be the best version of yourself. It isn't just for those who've experienced trauma. It's true. Better Help is fully online, making therapy affordable and convenient. Serving over 5 million people worldwide, you can easily switch therapists anytime at no extra cost. You can access a diverse Network, more than 30, 000 credentialed therapists with a wide range of specialties. Everybody needs therapy, especially you. Discover your relationship green flags with Better help. Visit betterhelp.com PSA to get 10 off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E-L-P.com PSA welcome to Pont Save America. I'm John Levitt. We're up and running with our Sunday shows. These episodes are going to be coming out every other weekend. We'll give John, Tommy, Dan and me a chance to have deeper conversations with a range of interesting people. My guest this week is television host, political commentator and stand up comedian. It's Bill Maher. Welcome, Bill.

[Bill Maher]

That's the audience cheering.

[John Lovett]

Oh, yeah. That's a huge. Yeah.

[Bill Maher]

What do you do if you have a guest who has no arms?

[John Lovett]

Well, we have. We do have.

[Bill Maher]

Oh, then you just.

[John Lovett]

We'd go to a boom mic.

[Bill Maher]

Could I get that?

[John Lovett]

You want the boom mic?

[Bill Maher]

No, I'm kidding. I'm just fucking with you.

[John Lovett]

No, it's an important. Honestly, that's why you're here. No one's ever asked us that question before.

[Bill Maher]

After an hour, doesn't your arm get tired of holding the mic? I shouldn't say that. I've been a stand up comedian my whole life. All I do is stand on stage.

[John Lovett]

Hold the mic, you can switch hands, but it's different when you'd hold the microphone.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, I do. So I'm sorry. You're okay.

[John Lovett]

You got this.

[Bill Maher]

Go ahead, ask me your hard hitting questions. I'll stop interrupting.

[John Lovett]

I started. All right, welcome to you. Okay, that's done. We like to start each episode with a land acknowledgement. We are on the land once occupied by Jeffrey Katzenberg and Quibi.

[Bill Maher]

That's funny. I just did a special on HBO and I did a whole thing about land acknowledgement. And I mean, it is just the epitome of. And I see that at the recent DNC meeting, they still did it. Like, talk about not getting it after the election laws.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, I thought you might not like a land acknowledgment.

[Bill Maher]

No, I mean, they still actually did it for real.

[John Lovett]

Well, you know, teach your own.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, I mean, keep going down that road and see where it leads you. But it's just people are not politically savvy. I don't feel in America. But they know when you're full of shit. And it's like land acknowledgement, either give it back or shut the fuck up. I think is what most people are thinking.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, I thought I might set you off. Seems like it worked. All right, so now I want to start with this because I just realized that Politically Incorrect is about to be 30 years old.

[Bill Maher]

More. Because it started in 93 and I think we're in 25 starting.

[John Lovett]

93.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah.

[John Lovett]

Well, I remember watching was on Comedy Central. Then it moved to abc.

[Bill Maher]

Correct.

[John Lovett]

But I could only watch it because Comedy Central re aired it in the afternoons.

[Bill Maher]

I didn't know that.

[John Lovett]

And so I would. It has to be true. But I would come home from school.

[Bill Maher]

Wow.

[John Lovett]

And I would watch it every day when I got home from school.

[Bill Maher]

Well, I did it for the kids.

[John Lovett]

That felt like that. It felt like that.

[Bill Maher]

I mean, some nights it did. Some nights it was just so ridiculous.

[John Lovett]

Well, it was very. I actually was thinking about it. It was very formative for me. And I went back and I watched the first episode of Politically Incorrect.

[Bill Maher]

The very first episode.

[John Lovett]

The very first episode.

[Bill Maher]

Who was on?

[John Lovett]

Jerry Seinfeld.

[Bill Maher]

Right.

[John Lovett]

And Jerry Seinfeld. You asked Jerry Seinfeld about a question about whether or not pedophiles should have to have signs on their lawns. And it gives you this look like, I'm here as a fucking favor. I do jokes about cornflakes. What are you doing to me?

[Bill Maher]

That's hysterical. I don't remember. I remember Jerry, of course, such a great friend. Forever. Great guy. Never changed. Absolutely. And he was at. You know, his show was doing great. So it was. It was a great favor. And I don't remember the question about the. But we didn't ask questions. We. We presented topics on that old show. Every question. I wrote the. That first season I had. I wrote them all myself, word for word. Did we even have writers? I think we had a couple. But we had, like, this is before the people look shit up on the Internet. Like we had researchers who had to go to the stacks or something. I don't know. It seems like it was from the Middle Ages, but I would present a provocative not saying things that I didn't believe or think should be discussed. I wasn't just doing it for the sake. And it would always end with, does anybody have a problem with that? And when we put out a book from the show, it was called the Best of Politically Incorrect. Does anybody have a problem with that? So pedophile stand on. What was it they should say?

[John Lovett]

Put a sign in their lawn, Something to that effect?

[Bill Maher]

I mean, don't they kind of do that anyway now? I mean, don't you have to register?

[John Lovett]

I think that's what this was about. It was about registering and people being. It was about public shaming and who should be shamed and who shouldn't be shamed. It was very 90s, John.

[Bill Maher]

Isn't it so fucking quaint that we lived in an era where that was the kind of problem, as opposed to the things. The shit show that's going on now. Things that are so much more existential, shall we say? Not that it isn't an issue, but come on.

[John Lovett]

No, there was something about it, and that's why I wanted to get to it. And we'll get to it. Because Seinfeld is like, what the fuck am I doing here? And then Ed Rollins, who was Perot's campaign.

[Bill Maher]

Ed Rollins.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, it was very. Yes. And it really put me back into a different time. But there is one moment where Seinfeld lights up because it was about polling and focus grouping and how whether it was valuable or not valuable. And suddenly there really was an interesting moment between.

[Bill Maher]

There was many interesting moments. What sort of backhanded uncompliment is that?

[John Lovett]

Just so unbelievable. Take a compliment. I'm saying, I'm watching the episode and all of a sudden, the pilot, you suddenly see the magic that you were trying to get in this show. I wouldn't say it was the only moment. I'm saying there Was a moment amongst several. Okay. Are you okay?

[Bill Maher]

Not really, but okay, fine.

[John Lovett]

I don't care. Where all of a sudden you have Ed Rawlins and you have Jerry Seinfeld talking about what they both know about, which is polling and focus grouping and where it works and where it doesn't work. And what I was wondering is what you were trying to get out of having comedians and celebrities sitting across from politicians and experts.

[Bill Maher]

I always described it as a designed train wreck. That's why it was funny. And as you say, sometimes there was great enlightenment from that. The idea was everyone in America votes. We all get to vote, whether we're Harvard educated, although few people are that stupid, or, you know, the lowliest mechanic who's only finished eighth grade or something. We all get to vote. We don't all know the same thing or come from the same background, but this is a democracy, and let's pair the least likely people to ever be in the same room together at the same cocktail party and have them talk. And. Yeah, what was great about that show was that when it was good, like you say, there were moments that were really good, but even when it was bad, it was like the bad was kind of good.

[John Lovett]

It's uncomfortable. It was interesting. I really did watch it every day when I got home from school.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah. I mean, some nights it was so awful. It was like you had to. You reveled in the awfulness.

[John Lovett]

But there was. You know, you talk about how things have changed, and I want to talk about how the media has changed and also how the parties have changed. But in terms of the media, there was an episode where it's really interesting. You brought on Sarah Silverman and you brought on this. What?

[Bill Maher]

No, I'm just the. I mean, I love Sarah and she's still a friend, but, I mean, it's just funny to hear these names from the past. And I don't remember her on. On that show. I remember her on Real Time, but she was on.

[John Lovett]

She was on. Well, what was really interesting.

[Bill Maher]

She must have been really young.

[John Lovett]

She was. And you brought her on. And an activist. He was an Asian American activist who was angry about a joke she told that used the word chink.

[Bill Maher]

I think that was Real Time. I don't think that was.

[John Lovett]

No, it's politically incorrect, I'm sure of it. And it was really important to you. They'd both been criticizing each other in public and gone back and forth.

[Bill Maher]

Well, can I give you a little of the history? Sarah made a joke. You know, look, it was a different era. I Think she has. Since Mia culpaled about that, she's gone back on a lot of stuff. You know, she says she went more toward like, oh, no, I shouldn't have said that. As opposed to some comics who were like, we've gotten too sensitive. That would be me.

[John Lovett]

Right? Yeah, clearly. Yeah, No, I get that.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah. And we have. And I'm right about that. Okay, sure.

[John Lovett]

Okay. That's easy.

[Bill Maher]

But you know, but you know, everybody has their truth.

[John Lovett]

Well, surprised she have thought about it. Just take it in the most generous sense. She thought about it and evolved.

[Bill Maher]

Even if we wouldn't do it today, do we have to go back and dig up the past and yell at ourselves when. Here's the thing. Whatever it was back then, most people were okay with it. It wasn't mean spirited. She got in trouble also once for a sketch she did which was an anti racist sketch. Okay. But we sort of glossed over nuance at a certain point. And so I don't know if it was necessary to be like, I'm history's greatest monster because I did this. No, I thought I was doing the right thing. And at the time, usually nobody else said anything. So it was obvious that's where the country was. Anyway, she did a joke with some sort of Asian reference. I don't remember what it was. And the person from the Asian media.

[John Lovett]

Organization that was critical of the way Asian people were portrayed.

[Bill Maher]

Right, Correct. He objected. And so I guess I had them on to hash it out.

[John Lovett]

Yes. And look, I think people evolve. They went back and stopped airing certain episodes of the Golden Girls and cut things out of certain shows. And I think that's ridiculous. Right. Cause let's just. This was the past and it was different. Even though shows look modern and we should be able to see those things. That's obvious. But I wanted to.

[Bill Maher]

The Golden Girls.

[John Lovett]

There was a pretty racist episode of the Golden Girls. But let's just. There was. But, but I think. Let people see it. Who cares? But I'm not, I'm not talking about. I want to talk about this specific episode for sure. And like when they're like putting warnings on, on Gone with the Wind, it's like Gone with the Wind sucks, but not because it's racist. It is racist, but that's not why it sucks.

[Bill Maher]

Awesome. It doesn't suck.

[John Lovett]

Okay. But we'll get back to it. We'll get back to Gone with the Wind. We'll talk about movies at the end. Just let's, let's challenge our assumptions. But the, the, the Reason I bring up the Sarah Silverman moment, who I love and think is an incredible comedian and she's sharp in that debate as well, is it was really important in that moment where you said, you know what? Let's have the debate right here and have it in front of everybody and let people hash it out and you talk about how things are different. And what's striking is like, you think about that moment, and there wasn't public forums for people to have debates. There was television. There was radio and television. Some, you know, newspaper op eds, people could write a letter to the editor. But for the most part, political conversations on television weren't about or next to the political culture. They were the political culture. And if you got people together and had the debate, the 1,000 people that got to have an opinion on television would see it and it would impact them. Right. And you could really feel the impact of debate. And we don't live in that world anymore. It's a very different world.

[Bill Maher]

We do on my show.

[John Lovett]

Well, that's.

[Bill Maher]

I love doing that. I mean, and you're right, most shows don't do that. I mean, you don't see much debate on cable news. I mean, CNN has a panel. But you know that guy who I. What did I call him? Lonely Scott. The one Lonely Scott. What is his name?

[John Lovett]

Yeah. Anyway, Lonely Scott Jennings. Yes, yes, Scott Jennings.

[Bill Maher]

It's like six people. And then after, like, they all do whatever they're going to say, and usually I agree with those people, then Lonely Scott gets to talk. But, you know, I do like having an actual debate. I mean, this idea that they have some people that you shouldn't platform. You know, I mean, I've lost fans, certainly, and even like people who were friends kind of because they were so mad at me that I had on real time people like Ted Cruz and Bill Barr. Okay. He was the attorney general. You know, I'm not going to talk to this man.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, we've talked about that here. And I think in the early years of this company, we were much more reluctant in part because we were trying to, I think, be it just a platform for progressive voices. But as we've grown, we've realized that we want to have more conservative voices on to challenge them because we want to be at the center of a debate, maybe be challenged and of course be challenged, and of course be challenged. But the reason, and I'm not one.

[Bill Maher]

Of them, you know, they think the far left thinks I am. I put out a book and a standup special in the last six Months, both to make the point and in great detail. You've changed, not me.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, I want to come back to that in a second. I want to stay on debate only because what I felt when I was watching those old episodes is a kind of nostalgia for a culture where debate mattered. Like you still do. The kinds of debates you did back down, though. You do it with more kind of serious people. There's fewer Christine O'Donnell popping up.

[Bill Maher]

Right. It's not Carrot Top with Bob Dole.

[John Lovett]

Well, there was another on that episode where Sarah Silverman and this activist are talking. At what point I forgot he was even there. David Spade was sitting there in fucking silence. And you turn to David Spade and you're like, so, David Spade, what do you think? And he's like, fuck you, Bill. How about that? I don't want to be here. What am I doing here? I'm in Tommy boy. Why are you asking me this really hard question?

[Bill Maher]

That's always what was so. I mean, you said Seinfeld basically had the same reaction, like, what am I doing here? Yeah. But when you drag people out of their comfort zone, it does produce a kind of real television that unfortunately. Yeah. You don't get a lot. And, of course, it's not everybody's cup of tea.

[John Lovett]

Yeah. It used to exist more in, like, the old. Before they went live to tape when, like, Carson was truly live and there were just. Things would go wrong. Right. There'd be.

[Bill Maher]

No, Carson was not live.

[John Lovett]

When there would be, like, moments early on in the early years, and you have, like, just, like, drunks on the stage, and he's like, I gotta get out of here.

[Bill Maher]

Drunks.

[John Lovett]

There was an episode where, like, I wanna say, like, Peter. What's his name?

[Bill Maher]

Peter Lawford.

[John Lovett]

Peter Lawford and two other people in a movie that we've all forgotten are on their promotional tour and they're just drunk. They're just drunk.

[Bill Maher]

I just don't think they thought it was that awful. And by the way, it's happened since then. I don't know if you remember the Cheers finale. I'm not sure what year that would be.

[John Lovett]

Cheers, but I remember that when they were all just blitzed.

[Bill Maher]

Blitzed to the Guild.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, it was good stuff.

[Bill Maher]

This is Leno hosting, and they were, you know, just falling over each other on the couch, drooling and laughing. And, I mean, poor Jay was like. He was not in on the private joke between this cast who were in an emotional state after doing this groundbreaking show for 10 years or whatever it was. And now they had their finale, and then they had their party, and now they're on with Jay. And they were drunk, so I don't think.

[John Lovett]

I think they talk later about how the mistake was there wasn't a meal. There needed to be food.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah. I mean, they were young and drunk, and it's funny. Drunk is funny.

[John Lovett]

Drunk is funny. Yeah. Drunk is funny. But nobody.

[Bill Maher]

But it's not just. Of course it can be sad, but we don't have to always just dwell on the sadness. Dean Martin was funny.

[John Lovett]

Yeah.

[Bill Maher]

And he wasn't even really drunk a.

[John Lovett]

Lot of the times. He was really drunk.

[Bill Maher]

There was a. No, I don't think he was. I think he. I think that was a big myth. You think? Yes, he. Yes, I think that was an act. He. Dean was like. He played golf, and then he was in bed at nine. He was that guy. Maybe when he was younger. I don't know. Frank was a big drinker.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, there was a. I sometimes think that, like, the reason there's such a focus on Cancel Culture is because it used to be more fun to be a celebrity. Like, you could drive your car through a plate glass window and, like, tip somebody 500 bucks and nobody heard about it.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah. Frank and Ava shot up Palm Springs once, and it was just, like.

[John Lovett]

Just under the rug.

[Bill Maher]

Well, I mean, there's. People do things today. I mean, Kanye. Come on.

[John Lovett]

Well, he's not exactly. We know about it.

[Bill Maher]

I know, but, like, he wasn't canceled for it. He said Hitler was. I love Hitler. And nobody pulled his super bowl ad, like, three days later.

[John Lovett]

So it seems like you think Cancel Culture is needed.

[Bill Maher]

I'm just saying, some people get away with shit that other people don't. It's very uneven.

[Tommy Vietor]

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[John Lovett]

Savings from the government. I had that too and it felt.

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[John Lovett]

Where'S your head on social media right now?

[Bill Maher]

What do you mean?

[John Lovett]

Like is it. Are you using it? I feel conflicted about it. I think it's a corrupt force destroying the human soul. But I also get good recipes from it.

[Bill Maher]

Good recipes?

[John Lovett]

Yeah. TikTok you get good recipes. There's a viral Turkish pasta I made. Have you heard about the viral Turkish pasta?

[Bill Maher]

Yeah. No. I'm from a different generation and I got a shit ton of money. I got cooks and chefs. I don't need social media guys assistance. I'm so glad that I'm. That yeah, sounds good. It's awesome. It is. And it just seems like a bunch of hatred and vitriol and yes, of course, can you learn things. I don't have enough time in the day to read and absorb the things I do want to read and absorb. I want to read the New York Times even though it's not the paper I grew up with and it's crazy slanted. But I also want to read Andrew Sullivan and I want to read the Free Press and I want. I'd rather be in that world of smart people. I want to listen to your podcast and Sam Harris's podcast. You know, smart, engaging conversation mostly from people who are not ideologically captured. That's what I want to immerse myself in. I don't want to immerse myself in that world. And I'm just very bad at technology. It's not native to me because of when I grew up. I'm 70, basically.

[John Lovett]

You're 70?

[Bill Maher]

Not really, but I'm saying that because it's next year and I can't. 69. There's a funny bit in my special about that when you're 69, it's just. Everybody just puts their elbow on your ribs. Like it's funny and it's just a terrible number. So.

[John Lovett]

Oh. Cause of the sexual position.

[Bill Maher]

That's my bit.

[John Lovett]

Is it because of putting. Because you flip around and then it's head to genitals.

[Bill Maher]

Everyone talks about it as if anyone has ever done it or enjoyed it or can do it. It's a multitasking thing that you can't do. We've all tried. I've tried. It doesn't work if someone. You can't go down on a girl while she's sucking your dick. I just can't think of both. Just too hard. Anyway, that's the point about that.

[John Lovett]

I was gonna get to 69ing later, but we've just covered it, so I think we can move on.

[Bill Maher]

Yes. The point is, I'm not native to a lot of this stuff. And the more. I mean, how many books does Jonathan Haidt have to put out about it? How many times do I have to have guests who talk about how awful and vitriolic it is and what it's doing to young kids? Why would I jump into this pool? I mean, if there's one turd in the pool, bad enough this just seems like a pool of turds.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, I think that's right. I think you don't need to go there, especially with the chef, because then you don't need the recipes. Because I go for it.

[Bill Maher]

Definitely don't need the recipes.

[John Lovett]

You should tell your chef about the viral Turkish pasta.

[Bill Maher]

I don't eat pasta.

[John Lovett]

You don't eat pasta? No. Is that a keto thing? What are we eating?

[Bill Maher]

Well, we're not eating carbs. Like, not bread, not pasta, not rice.

[John Lovett]

Wow.

[Bill Maher]

I mean, occasionally, you know, I'm not a crazy person, but no, just. I wouldn't want to keep that around the house or have them. If someone's going to cook for me, they're going to cook good. You know, I've said to her, look, I'll never get mad at you if I don't like, if it's not an appealing dish, I'll only get mad at you if it's not healthy.

[John Lovett]

And do you worry about losing touch?

[Bill Maher]

Nope. Not at all. No.

[John Lovett]

Really?

[Bill Maher]

Like, what, should I be going to Ralph's? And that would elucidate me somehow, maybe.

[John Lovett]

Well, here's what I actually think.

[Bill Maher]

I do go to the supermarket once in a while. I do like to purposely see what's out there and see if there's food out there. Especially that I'm not aware of, that they, you know, because, you know, I don't, I don't know. Yes, you do have to do that. But I am not out of touch. No.

[John Lovett]

Well, the. There's a lot of new kinds of Oreos. They're doing new flavors all the time.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, Oreos I wouldn't eat. I already made that decision about Oreos decades ago.

[John Lovett]

Oh, no.

[Bill Maher]

Oreos.

[John Lovett]

That's too bad.

[Bill Maher]

Well, you know What? When you're 70, first of all, you're on a much shorter leash health wise. You got to be very. You can stay exactly and live exactly as you always did. It's funny, when I was your age, I would have never thought I'd be like this at 70. I thought life would be completely different because that's how Americans present it. Like you're completely decrepit and you're like one foot in the grave. And my father was, you know, he would go out to the basketball court, the court, the driveway, and shoot one basket and be like, oh, and he was 53 or something. It just doesn't have to be that way. I found out when I got there, you know, of course, I never got married, so that's a big difference, you know, you become like something different and as opposed to just always staying the same.

[John Lovett]

You got to get out there.

[Bill Maher]

Why?

[John Lovett]

Well, just. You got to be out there. You got to be single. You got to be.

[Bill Maher]

Yes, I had the tiger.

[John Lovett]

Yeah. You got to stay fit. You got to stay hot. You got to stay hot. You don't want to be out.

[Bill Maher]

You gotta do the best you can.

[John Lovett]

You gotta.

[Bill Maher]

That's all you could do.

[John Lovett]

Because here's the thing. When you fall in love with somebody, you stop caring what they look like. But you gotta, you gotta, gotta get through that first step.

[Bill Maher]

Did that happen to you?

[John Lovett]

Not yet. Not yet. Thanks for asking. Obviously not. Look how good I look. Not something I have to really worry about yet.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, you look great.

[John Lovett]

Oh, thanks for saying that.

[Bill Maher]

How old are you?

[John Lovett]

I am 42.

[Bill Maher]

You look great for 42.

[John Lovett]

I look great. For 42. Well, I'll be gay for 42.

[Bill Maher]

You have a youthful look about you.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, I don't think that what I do works if I get older.

[Bill Maher]

I don't think that's a good attitude to go into.

[John Lovett]

Probably not.

[Bill Maher]

No. I really don't.

[John Lovett]

I agree.

[Bill Maher]

No, no. And by the way, AI is going to fix all this.

[John Lovett]

Oh, I hope so.

[Bill Maher]

Totally. I mean, there is a chance that even me at 70, wink, wink, not quite. Will not die. Like say, because you could live to 100 in 30 years. I can't imagine AI which is working exponentially. What was that thing that Google just came up with that I just read this, that it figured out something, that supercomputers before this would have taken something like 10, septillion million years or whatever. It was older than the time of the universe to figure out what now it did in five minutes.

[John Lovett]

Right. They had that new quantum computer that I find intimidating.

[Bill Maher]

That's what I'm talking about.

[John Lovett]

Yes, the quantum computer. Yeah. Maybe that'll fix it. Well, there's that guy that's trying to seem young. You know that guy?

[Bill Maher]

I had him on my podcast.

[John Lovett]

He seems out of his fucking gourd. I'd rather live to a hundred. I would rather die at 70, living the way I live, then live to 250 the way he lives.

[Bill Maher]

You won't say that when you're 69, first of all.

[John Lovett]

Nice.

[Bill Maher]

And also, and also, he's not crazy. Although he is a little crazy. And I said the same thing. I said, brian. And he's a sweet guy. I like them a lot. I said, Brian, like, okay, so he's 46, but he's like, chronologically he's 37. I said, so you go to bed at 8:30, you never eat anything except like these fucking pebbles or whatever the fuck you're eating.

[John Lovett]

He's eating kind of. Kind of human chow, right? I mean, kibble.

[Bill Maher]

I eat pretty strictly, but I still enjoy eating. And you can do that and goes to bed at 8:30. And all this. I said all this to shave nine years off. I said, you know, people think I look a little younger than my age. So, like, I apparently shaved six or seven years off by smoking pot and not getting married and drinking too much when I was younger. So, like, what's the point?

[John Lovett]

Well, also, you know, all the studies also show that, like, the mo. What's. What's the key to longevity? It's happy, close relationships. It's a bunch of, like, social things. And I gotta say, who wants to Hang out with the guy that's like, I gotta go to bed, it's 8:30, gotta get up in the morning and eat my kibble. You know, it's not like a friend. It's not like a great friend situation. You know what I'm saying?

[Bill Maher]

Let me say this in his defense. First of all, I'm glad he's my new best friend. Because this guy is working more than anybody else to find out where the cutting edge is on keeping us healthy. He gave me some of the stuff that he uses and sells, and much of it I've been doing my own self for quite a while. I don't think most people take glutathione, but I get it and I had it and he uses it. But he's gonna tell me he's gonna hit me to everything I need to know that I can do. Not in the levels that he does it, but. And also listen to this. I said, you know, we're leaving and I have my podcast where I party and it's a different house. I wouldn't party in my own house. Knowing me.

[John Lovett]

What a life.

[Bill Maher]

And he's in touch, and I am in touch. And I said, you know, it's too bad, Brian. You know, I have parties here sometimes the cameras are off and we just enjoy it. I had this for 20 years and I partied here. We made it into a podcast studio. It's too bad you go to bed at 8:30. It doesn't usually get going until 10 or 11. And he said, here's what I'll do. I'll go to bed, I'll get my REM sleep. See, you need REM sleep and deep sleep. And then I'll wake up from my REM sleep. I'll come here for an hour and a half and party with you. And I'll go back and I'll get my deep sleep. And I thought, that's a guy who's willing to kind of bend a little.

[John Lovett]

Sure, yeah, yeah.

[Bill Maher]

To get up from your REM sleep, party with me and go back to your deep sleep.

[John Lovett]

And he's having a tea or something. I assume as soon as no alcohol.

[Bill Maher]

I'm definitely not going to be drinking and smoking with him.

[John Lovett]

Sounds like a great hang.

[Bill Maher]

Said the same thing.

[John Lovett]

But in his defense, you know, you're all gonna die.

[Bill Maher]

But in his defense, he talks about his amazing erection.

[John Lovett]

Yeah. Yes.

[Bill Maher]

A lot.

[John Lovett]

Yes. That's first of all, good to hear that that's happening in person as well. Cause he also talks about his son's erections yeah, right.

[Bill Maher]

I know, I know this got weird.

[John Lovett]

I'm sorry, I gotta go. So now you talked about you not really changing and that actually was.

[Bill Maher]

Well, politically.

[John Lovett]

Politically, no, I'm not. No, politically. Well, that's what I took away. Going back and watching some of the original shows, which is that like you say that your politics hasn't changed, that the right went where it went and the left went super woke and that you're the same. And it's like, how often are using. It's not you, it's me when you're breaking up with somebody.

[Bill Maher]

That's a good question. That's funny. Are you serious about that or.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, I'll take a political answer or a human answer.

[Bill Maher]

Well, I'm not going to get very specific about this because this is like personal life stuff and I like to keep that opaque. But you know, look, if somebody is my age and we remember what that is because it keeps coming up and they've never been married and you've never been married. Right. It's either for one or two main reasons. Either they don't like girls or they like them a lot. Okay, I'm just going to keep it vague like that.

[John Lovett]

So let's talk about politics. Happy to leave that vague. We got a lot of 69 talk.

[Bill Maher]

There's nothing wrong with that. Why can't everybody? You know, it's so funny. If I came out as gay, tomorrow the whole town here in Hollywood be like, oh my God, that's the greatest thing in the world. Because we all should just be who we are. I was born that way. Remember when that was a. Yeah. This is how I was born. This is how I was drawn. This is what I want. I never wanted to get married. I never thought it worked. And what I mostly see is that when it does, even when it works, it works at what I consider a tremendous price. I mean, you said longevity. What did you say before?

[John Lovett]

It was that having healthy relationships contributes to longevity.

[Bill Maher]

So does sex, which is sometimes in confrontation with a healthy relationship, with a long term relationship where the love is deep. It's very hard to keep that going with the sex part going, not with that attitude. I mean, I wish that it was just attitude that could solve it. But every marriage in the world will tell you that it's not just attitude.

[John Lovett]

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[Bill Maher]

You brought it up.

[John Lovett]

I did bring it up and I know that. And everyone's hearing. They know that. They know that I brought it up.

[Bill Maher]

People like this. They like people. They're like politicsmolitics.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, we're keeping it loose.

[Bill Maher]

We're keeping it loose. It's bill. We don't have to like fucking always be. And we can go right to the politics because that's what I love about podcasting.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, we can do whatever we want. There's no we.

[Bill Maher]

Can we look at all the cards you have there? Yeah, there's like. Do we have to get all through.

[John Lovett]

All those before I can do that. No, I'll skip. I'll skip. Don't. Hey, don't worry. We'll skip through some because these are.

[Bill Maher]

That's a lot of cards.

[John Lovett]

Let's see, let's see. There's one later that's just trans.

[Bill Maher]

Your staff makes these for you?

[John Lovett]

Yes, they do. They do a great job. They're right over there. It's a great team. It's a great team. So let's talk about. Other Republicans have changed. You said in your special, Trump got the White House again, but he's not gonna get your mind. How's that resolution holding up?

[Bill Maher]

Not that well. I gotta say it. I also said I wouldn't pre hate anything, which is true. I didn't pre hate, but boy, does the hate come around quickly. I mean, has it been only a month?

[John Lovett]

Yeah, it's been one month.

[Bill Maher]

One month.

[John Lovett]

One month.

[Bill Maher]

I mean, I didn't think he could. Some of the thing. And there are things that. Other things. I made a list like, here's what I already hate. Here's things I don't hate yet. I mean, there are things that. Like the idea that Gaza could be Dubai instead of this hellhole that it's been. Other people have suggested that by way of us taking it over. No. Starting a new American empire. No. This insanity of Zelensky as the dictator.

[John Lovett]

Outrageous.

[Bill Maher]

I mean, opposite day kind of shit with the Western Alliance. I mean, there's a whole. It's just. Yeah. So that resolution is being battered already.

[John Lovett]

It's. Well, it is. I mean, look, there are some people that claim that they're not surprised by how bad it's been so far. I find that hard to believe because in all the, you know, if we knew in October that the planes were gonna start bumping, we would have maybe said something. Right. Like, nobody was like, hey, and then we might invade Panama. Like, that wasn't anything that. And Kamala Harris wasn't out there being like, and don't forget, we might invade Panama.

[Bill Maher]

No, that and Canada. Canada. That shit all came up. Yeah. I think after the election was won, I don't think it was even strategic. I think you give Trump sometimes too much credit for like playing four dimensional chess and it's. No, he just happened to think of it then. I really, I don't think he planned, I'm gonna spring this after the election. It's no, like, the last guy he talked to said some shit and he was like, let's take it over.

[John Lovett]

But a lot of this does seem to fucking. I think there's not just a lack of knowledge where there's a disdain for knowledge that leads. Whether it's Elon wandering around Government bureaucracies. He knows nothing about cutting at random and then discovering that, oh, that person was working on bird flu, we should probably get him back. Or Trump sprouting off about the Middle East. There's a lack of appreciation, reason for expertise and nuance, which is very, very fascist, very authoritarian, which is to say, you know what? Yeah, democracy is sometimes slow and complicated, but there's a reason and there are good reasons. There's a good reason that this is not how we've done things in the past. There is value to stability. There's value to the slow and sometimes frustrating work of compromise and changing the government.

[Bill Maher]

That is my biggest complaint about Trump, is that he does not care about how the American system works or even care to learn how it works, in his view. It's just like, they elected me. I'm the leader. I talk to other leaders. I'm the leader. Everything else is sort of just background noise, Congress or whatever. I mean, some of these things he's done, he has the Congress. He has a Republican Congress. He could do it through Congress. No, he just does it by executive order. But there's always, like, you know, a seed of truth in the other side. Yes, government should be slow. But the frog in the pot analogy that we use with global warming, which I still think is true, it's the slow. I'm not sure that that isn't also the case with a government that ever grows bigger. Nothing is ever canceled. The debt. I mean, we've been talking about it since Ross Perot at some point, and it seems like, well, we keep talking about it, but nothing ever happens. I feel like at some point, just like with global warming, something catastrophic is going to happen. But this is the biggest thing now. And so, again, do I hate the idea of someone going through the government. I mean, Al Gore wanted to do it, and they didn't do it. Well, but of course, the way he does it, first of all, just like you said, with a sledgehammer instead of a scalpel, you can picture a way they could have done it. He could have just shut up for three months while he audited it and then come out with findings. That's not the way these people work. That's the bad part of them. The instinct to do it. The instinct to, like, have Gaza not be what it always has been. And by the way, some of this kind of works because now you see that five different countries, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, United Arab Emirates, Egypt, they all said, okay, you know what? Trump's gonna jump in and turn it into a Golf course. Okay. We're working on a plan. Yeah. Somebody has to have a plan for Gaza. And the idea that in the past, these Arab countries that surround Palestine or the Syrian civil war and wouldn't take any refugees and just wouldn't seem to be wanting to get involved at all. To the people who they claim are their brethren and who are the. Did a million Syrians really fit better in Germany than they would have in Saudi Arabia?

[John Lovett]

There was a congressman, Tom Malinowski, I think, and he said this on the bulwark, and it stuck with me. And he said that Trump understands our power, but not our values, and Joe Biden understands our values but not our power. And it really stuck with me because there are moments where, yeah, Nixon playing crazy. Donald Trump says things that change the contours of a debate, but he does it by proposing ethnic cleansing and some of those ghastly policies that any American president has ever talked about. True. You talk about like, yeah, we need to reform the government. Yeah. Barack Obama wanted to reform the government. Stupidly tried to do it through Congress. Big mistake that was. But, but you talk about, oh, we need to do some of these things. We're worried about the deficit. We know what the source of the deficit is. We know it's actually not the debt. The debt. We know the source of the debt. We know the source of the deficit. The number of federal workers has not increased as a share of the population. That's static. So it's not some big behemoth of federal workers. It's lower than it was in the 90s as a share.

[Bill Maher]

No, I don't think workers is the main problem. The main problem is, as the budget Office put out, there's. They said between 236 and 521 billion. Billion.

[John Lovett]

Right. And what is the source of that?

[Bill Maher]

There's four drivers of fraud.

[John Lovett]

Well, no, it's not fraud.

[Bill Maher]

Well, just stuff that's money's that's stolen.

[John Lovett]

Basically, the source of our deficit and debt are the tax cuts, the Bush tax cuts, the Trump tax cuts, the cost of Medicare, the cost of Medicaid, the cost of Social Security and the cost of the military. That's what drives the cost. Then there's cuts to be made and fraud to be found, for sure.

[Bill Maher]

And I say this was the number one issue of our time. But do I think that 236 billion at the low end each year just going out the door to fraudsters and thieves is something we should live with and just accept? I don't. Of course not. So the instinct to do something about it. And again, it's all nullified when they do it horribly, which he did.

[John Lovett]

But the part of this too is it's not. Obviously they have. They don't really respect debate. Right. Like Donald Trump doesn't. Isn't interested or respectful of debate, nor.

[Bill Maher]

Does he need it anymore because he won. And I mean in the past, I mean, he did have to like show up to debate. He debated Harris, he debated Joe Biden. He debated, tried to kill him with.

[John Lovett]

COVID Remember, like three days later, like, yeah, I had a positive tips. Whoops. It's like you tried to fucking kill Joe Biden again.

[Bill Maher]

I think you're giving him too much credit. I just think he didn't think about it. I think he wanted to run against Joe Biden anyway. He shouldn't have. He lost and he won't admit that, which is my biggest problem with him.

[John Lovett]

But you host a show that's about the value of debate and one of the two sides no longer. They'll use a debate when it's useful. They'll use politics, normal politics when it's useful. But they'll cast it aside. Right? They'll go through Congress when they can. They'll ignore it when they can't. They'll come on your show and make a case when they can. But they'll say you're an evil Marxist and all should be ignored when it's not useful. That's really dangerous.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, I agree. The speech that Vance made to the Germans, not the part about the semi Nazi party, but the part about free speech, was very valid in my view. They have gone to places in Germany and in England now with free speech that I don't want to live in that country. I mean, did you see the 60 Minutes piece on Germany last week?

[John Lovett]

I didn't really.

[Bill Maher]

It's 60 minutes. Like too old hot for you.

[John Lovett]

You know, I catch it now and again, but I'm not like. And I'm not like, click, click, click. I'm not like waiting for the sound every Sunday like I used to when.

[Bill Maher]

I was a kid.

[John Lovett]

When I was a kid, I watched it every Sunday.

[Bill Maher]

Really?

[John Lovett]

I wasn't a cool kid. It was a lot of Bill Maher in 60 Minutes and wondering if I was gonna get invited to prom. The answer? I was not.

[Bill Maher]

Okay, let's get on to your sex life. Okay, so, but. And they did a piece and I found it chilling. Now, of course, Vance's thing about free speech is he has no grounding to stand on because Trump is suing 60 Minutes.

[John Lovett]

60 Minutes for the crime of editing interview.

[Bill Maher]

Right. And he's suing an Iowa newspaper for putting out a poll he didn't like. You know how many presidents had lawsuits before him? None. Presidents don't sue people. You don't have to. He's doing it so they don't have a leg to stand on there. And as far as, like, canceling elections, I mean, that was the first I heard about Romania canceled the election. I'd have to do more research on that. But, yeah, I don't think it's a great idea to cancel elections. But of course, that's what they tried to do. And he still has admitted he lost the one in 2020. Okay, but the idea that in Germany, they can knock on your door because you insulted somebody, and they use the example of pimmel. Yes, I said it.

[John Lovett]

What'd you say? Pimmel.

[Bill Maher]

Pimmel. Apparently, it's the German word for calling somebody a dick. Oh. And you can get arrested for that, or they'll take your phone. And the UK also has arrested, I think, people for just insulting, basically. Or like Islamophobia. Well, you know, one person's Islamophobia is another person's just talking plainly and honestly about Islam. Can I not do that if I have any critique of Islam? I saw you roll your eyes. Really? There's no.

[John Lovett]

I didn't roll my eyes.

[Bill Maher]

Oh, okay.

[John Lovett]

I'm more thinking. I'm. Well, just like, we're not in Germany, we're here. I know they have their problems famously.

[Bill Maher]

Right. But we don't care about other people's problems. And sometimes those problems don't come here and we shouldn't comment on them. No, but.

[John Lovett]

No, no, of course. But I guess I just, like, you know, we have a lot of problems in America. We got the vice president going to Europe to complain about sort of German social dynamics, and it's like, okay. I mean, this is about a larger project to the right.

[Bill Maher]

Free speech is kind of a big thing. And it should be to you, especially if you make your living doing it.

[John Lovett]

Of course, of course. But as you said, these are people that are right now in our own country attacking free speech every day. So I take it disingenuously when JD Vance is in Germany.

[Bill Maher]

I just said that.

[John Lovett]

I know. I agree with you. That's why I'm rolling my eyes. I'm rolling my eyes at the situation, Bill.

[Bill Maher]

Okay. But, hey, look, I'm not trying to be a pimmel.

[John Lovett]

It's fucking pimmel over here. Huh?

[Bill Maher]

But, I mean, that is chilling. That is very chilling. And it's funny because some of these places are, you know, Canada, New Zealand, they have a woke quotient that exceeded ours.

[John Lovett]

We're gonna take a quick break, but before we do that, a reminder that during Black History Month, Vote Save America is supporting black led organizations and candidates of color through our anxiety relief program. One candidate is Kimberly Pope Adams, who's running for a Virginia state House seat this year. A critical opportunity to expand the Democrats slim one seat majority. Your recurring donation in any amount helps build Progressive Power for 20, 25 and beyond. Join us and make an impact at votesaveamerica.com Donate paid for by Vote Save America votesave america.com not authorized by any candidate or candidates committee. Votes save america.com.

[Tommy Vietor]

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[John Lovett]

So let's talk about our woke question a little bit. Let's talk about the woke mob. You say that, you know, the Republicans went the way they went and the Democrats went the way they went and you're still right where you were. Is it just. And I don't mean this in a. I'm like genuinely asking, is it really just the social questions? I mean, it's not about like the inflation reduction act and like monetary policy. When you say the democracy, it's just about.

[Bill Maher]

I mean it's like if you name so many, I can name so many issues where I will give you what the old school liberal, which is what I mostly align with position was. Although even I can show you from back in the politically incorrect days, places where I was with somebody who you think more conservatively on certain things. I was always hard to pin down and that's the way I like it. Everything is. I don't want to be captured ideologically, but mostly that's what I was. Let's take. We're talking about Israel. What has been the old school liberal position forever on Israel? Two state solution, right? That is not the position of the woke. Their position is from the river to the sea.

[John Lovett]

It's not position to the far left.

[Bill Maher]

Excuse me, right from the river to the sea. That's their position. That's what they're chanting on campus. That's the woke position. And it goes a lot further than just the kids on campus. That is not the two state solution. That is. I don't know, the Jews moved to Greenland. I'm not sure what it is. And I don't think they think it through because they're living in this world, as many people have pointed out of oppressor and oppressed. They don't really think past that. The Jews in Israel, I mean, they talk about them like they have no standing in that country when actually they're the Indians. Okay, but they've been always from 1947 on. Now, of course, you leave a deal on the table for 75 years. People do get a little tired of having the deal not taken. But traditionally Israel has tried to make that happen for a very long time. It accepted the idea of a partition and a two state solution and the other side never did. And somehow the woke found themselves. They do this all the time. They're so progressive that they do things that are completely anti progressive. Yes. Let's align with the people who give women no rights because we're the liberal people. Let's align with the river to the sea. No particular. So again, and I'm where it always was two state solutions. Other people have gone to a different place.

[John Lovett]

Well, there's always been a center, a center left and a left. That's always been the case. There were things that the Vietnam protesters said that was anathema to what was mainstream for Democrats at the time. But put aside the specific of the issue. Joe Biden was for a two state solution. Kamala Harris was for a two state solution. Most mainstream Democrats are for a two state solution. Donald Trump has embraced Benjamin Netanyahu and no two state solution. No deal on the table.

[Bill Maher]

I agree, but that's not what we were talking about.

[John Lovett]

But what I'm trying to understand is.

[Bill Maher]

To always bring in Trump.

[John Lovett]

Well, I'm not trying to bring in Trump.

[Bill Maher]

Let's we're agree that we don't like Trump. I didn't vote for it.

[John Lovett]

Asked and answered. Asked and answered. But my question is.

[Bill Maher]

But you're not addressing the question that you find more difficult to answer, which is what I put to you. It's like the WOKE position and it's again, not just kids on campus. I could quote you things from like do you know who Penn is? The organization Penn.

[John Lovett]

They had to withdraw an invitation. Right? That's the.

[Bill Maher]

It's a free speech organization. Organization that doesn't understand free speech. Same with the ACLU in some cases.

[John Lovett]

But the reason I so pod save America. I've taken a lot of shit from for what I've said about Israel. My belief in a two state solution, my horror at what Benjamin Netanyahu has done, but my belief that we ought to be critical of Israel not just because of what it has done in Gaza and not just what it has done to the Palestinians, but because it is not in the interest of Israel to create the conditions that they're creating in Gaza. I am not what you would call WOKE on this topic, but not what elected Democrats are saying, which I think represent the people that would ultimately be wielding power. So are there issues where you see the mainstream Democrats elected figures, not people on college campuses or organizations, politicians that have moved left because they're captured by whatever lefty part of their staff or whatever.

[Bill Maher]

I know where you're going and I agree mostly which is that the Democratic politician is generally not a crazy person. The crazy, if you're talking about crazies, I used to say the difference between the parties is that the Republicans have found a place for their crazies. Unfortunately, that place is elected government. And it's kind of true, like there's no equivalent quite of Marjorie Taylor Greene on the left. Although there are people like Elon Omar and AOC who I don't agree with on a lot of stuff and I think are crazy on a lot of stuff and say things that are real eye rolls.

[John Lovett]

Fair enough. I Don't agree with that, but I just don't. But the.

[Bill Maher]

I'm not saying they're. I just said they're not as bad, but they are eye rolling. Absolutely.

[John Lovett]

There are things you disagree with and.

[Bill Maher]

I disagree with and also just, you know, I mean it's one thing to have interest in another country. It's another thing to sort of be the Palestinian representative in the Congress as opposed to representing Michigan.

[John Lovett]

Yeah. Well, maybe she feels an obligation, a moral obligation that the best way that she can represent her values is to be this one voice.

[Bill Maher]

But she's in the American government.

[John Lovett]

Right. There's 430, there's 434 other members of that House.

[Bill Maher]

So one should be from Palestine.

[John Lovett]

I'm not saying one should be from Palestine. I'm saying she can in an important debate. Well, it's what it seems like and what it is. She's obviously representing her constituents. She has a lot of Palestinian constituents. But also feeling like that is a role that she can play in an important debate, that she is not just a member of Congress for one district, but she's representing a point of view that she doesn't feel like is often represented. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Even when, by the way, I have been extremely critical of what she has said. But back to elected Democrats, I think the reason I'm bringing this up is sometimes I feel like you have Democrats, there is an entire Republican apparatus that exists to lift up the dumbest, most extreme campus professors, organizations, also mainstream politicians who say something stupid that comes off terribly and have that representation Democrats and that it actually has an impact and then we end up in a. Yeah, I'm just. Do you think that's true?

[Bill Maher]

I think it's true, but I also think it's their obligation to squawk back at those people and they don't do it enough. To your point, which I think is correct about the mainstream Democratic politician, take something like defund the police. The Republicans thought they could catch the Democrats on that and they put it up to a vote. I don't remember what the exact vote was or what the bill was. They didn't get any. I think they got one. Like the Democratic politician did not take the bait on defund the police. And yet the public, if you just ask the man on the street, probably thinks that a lot of Democratic politicians did sign on to that. So that's a good example of something that was put out there by like you say, organizations and the fringe and college professors and people in the media. But did the Democratic congressman from your district sign on to that? No, they did not. At least not in a bill. So. But, you know, they'll put up a quote from Kamala Harris at the time in 2020 that makes it look that. And people did go overboard in 2020.

[John Lovett]

Yeah.

[Bill Maher]

Okay, so that's the problem, is that the Democratic politician did not make it clear to the voter. Yeah, we're not for defunding the police. We think that's stupid. The police are important, and they're especially important in neighborhoods with a lot of people of color who did not want to defund the police.

[John Lovett]

So I largely agree with that. But I think sometimes we lay the blame at the feet of Democrats for two reasons. One, there's bias in the media. But one of the ways the media is biased is that it treats Democrats as the protagonist and Republicans as the antagonist. So Democrats have agency. They're people you can reach. They're people you can persuade. They're people you believe will try to do the right thing, and they're people that'll actually respond to you.

[Bill Maher]

Wait, you're saying they are, or that's how they're portrayed?

[John Lovett]

I think when people feel that there's a liberal bias and a lot of mainstream coverage, one of the manifestations of it is that they are treated like the protagonist. Republicans are, if not villains, they're kind of other and removed.

[Bill Maher]

Correct.

[John Lovett]

And Democrats are meant to be the people that respond.

[Bill Maher]

In the New York Times, it's like, assumed we are the good people. We are the good people who know the right answers to everything, and they are the people who are not good. Yes. That assumption and that attitude is something that very much fosters resentment. And I don't blame the people. Like I always say, you could hate Trump. You can't hate everybody who voted for him. It's half the country.

[John Lovett]

But one of the things that's a.

[Bill Maher]

Lot of the reason why they do.

[John Lovett]

Well, one of the other things it does, though, is it means Republicans aren't held as much accountable for their own decisions.

[Bill Maher]

Not at all.

[John Lovett]

And I think part of it, too, the other piece of it is that people are just uncomfortable with saying, hold on a second. Yeah, Democrats should do a better job of tamping down misinformation and lies. But we're drowning in it. We're drowning in it. Yeah. I wish Democrats were better at pushing back against this bullshit, but we're kind of asking them to solve for a society problem. Like, you got, like Gerry Connolly as the minority leader in this House Committee, raising his hand to beg Nancy Mace to stop saying a slur. And it's like, we can't win a fight that way. We're not gonna be able to. Like, we're. These people don't care what you have to say. They don't. They want the fight. They want you to yell at them for saying the wrong thing. They don't care what you have to say about any of.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah. And don't take the bait. I mean, that's what a lot of Democrats are coming around to. I think I was talking about this on my show last Friday about. Wasn't it, you know, people you've probably worked with thinking David Axelrod and somebody else like that said on usa. Oh, I know we had on Congressman Tim Ryan. And I was quoting Axelrod and somebody else who said on USA Aid, that's not a hell I'm gonna die on. I think that was his exact. And I just read a list of things to Congressman Ryan, who I think is gonna run for governor of Ohio, saying, tell me, what else is a Hill you will or won't die on? That's what the Democrats, I think, should be talking about with each other. What are the hills we're gonna die on? And what are the hills we're not. And it was kind of interesting to hear his response to this list.

[John Lovett]

Yeah. And I think there are, like, those are the political questions, the strategic questions we have to ask. But I think it's also worth saying, hold on a second. The Trump administration is illegally shutting down a government agency that is our counterweight to China around the world.

[Bill Maher]

True.

[John Lovett]

And we all kind of understand that it's hard to tell people why it's important, and nobody's gonna understand is you gotta let that one go.

[Bill Maher]

I made that point. I said, what's about leadership? What about saying the people aren't here and it's our duty to. As politics. That's what we're supposed to do, is lead them to a place. Because the Republicans never shrink from leading people to a place where the people aren't. That never intimidates them. The people were for a public option for a very long time with the healthcare debate. And they were like, yeah, we had 20 points in the polls. We could flip that. So there is that argument. But, you know, what, do you want to win another election? Is there even gonna be another election? I mean, that was my original thing about Trump when everyone was saying I was crazy. He doesn't. I said, he's never gonna concede in an election. I just feel like that we probably have already crossed the Rubicon on this. I just don't see this crowd ever really giving up power because they really believe in their bones. And again, I could go through a lot of things that make me understand why they think that way, although I'm not with them. But they think that the left is so crazy and so dangerous and some of their ideas are so aggressively anti common sense and they are, they think that it is their duty to preserve power, to just not ever let those people near the levers of power because it's just too crazy.

[John Lovett]

Yeah, it's so dangerous to say they believe. But come on, Joe Biden and Chuck Schumer and Nancy Pelosi and Akeem Jeffries and Kamala Harris, these are mainstream figures that are not dangerous at all. They either are lying to themselves or persuading themselves to believe that Democrats pose a threat because it is part of the project of denying the legitimacy of democratic politics in Florida.

[Bill Maher]

Well, we could argue about a lot of issues there, but I'm sorry. Joe Biden, I think never stood up to the far, far fringe of his party. From day one. He was just like too feeble, too old. These people are too mean, too powerful. I don't wanna even have the fight.

[John Lovett]

What was something he did, but like I'm not what he did.

[Bill Maher]

An outlier in the trans. So let's talk about with other countries. I mean the uk, the Nordic countries all pulled back on that as far as like puberty blockers and operations for kids under 18. Letting kids, children self diagnose, keeping it from parents. All this stuff has gone on and still goes on in America. If it's something like that and you're a parent, which I am not. Not and I'm glad I'm not. That issue is a lot closer to home to you than Ukraine.

[John Lovett]

So let's talk about.

[Bill Maher]

I didn't even know where it was five years ago and now I care more about that than this issue.

[John Lovett]

I want to talk about the transition. Let's talk about it. But before we do, are there other. That's the one people come to. Is there another example in your mind of Joe Biden that somehow was super woke race?

[Bill Maher]

I mean they, they put that in every department immediately. Like day one that was the most important thing. And now you see a lot of corporations pulling back from it. I mean like everything does go too far. I mean a university having 200 DEI officers, a university which is already one of the most liberal places in the world. And you know it's one of those jobs where you'd have to admit there was progress or else the answer is, well, maybe I shouldn't have this job anymore. And whoever does that.

[John Lovett]

So let's talk about, let's talk about. I got to my card that says trans. Let's talk about it. The position like, look, other countries have national health services. The democratic position is leave it up to parents, doctors, just leave. It's not the government's decision. That's the democratic position. What's wrong with that position?

[Bill Maher]

Wait, say that again.

[John Lovett]

The Democratic position, right? Joe Biden.

[Bill Maher]

Well, the democratic position in this state has been that you can, the kid can. The school has the right to hide it from the parents. That is something that is not going to go well with the average voter. And again, I'm not even a parent. And I get it, okay? I mean, I think the governor here used the word snitch. Now if I'm wrong, I didn't say it. So I think I read that.

[John Lovett]

So there are del. So look, there are delicate problems here. But wait, wait, there's delicate problems here and there's delicate problem where you have a kid, all right, who has, is either non binary or trans, who feels scared at home, feels unsafe at home. Those things do happen in the world. There are things that happen, but for the most part, that's not what we're talking about. For the most part, what we're talking about is a teenager who has felt that they have a gender dysmorphia. So what they feel like is that they don't. They feel deeply unhappy, depression, all really rampant. And they go to their parents, they.

[Bill Maher]

Feel that and then they blame it on the thing that has been put in their mind way too much, that it may be because of you're in the wrong body to put it probably wrongly, but that we understand what that means. Okay? Now, it could be that case when Trump said there's only two sexes. Again, again, pendulum swinging way too far to stupidity. Okay, Obviously sex is more complicated than just two sexes. There are people who absolutely are, quote unquote, in the wrong body. But when you're a kid, even a teenager, and you're that confused about everything and you have no idea and you're upset for many other reasons. The idea that they put it. Let me just finish. I'm not saying any. I could see you are ready. I could see you pulling back the bow. And, and the fact that they put this in their head too much, that's my thing. Should you tell a kid, look, There's a default setting for humans, male and female, but there are variations. That's absolutely true. Some people are attracted. People of their own sex. And some people are actually in the wrong body. And that does happen. But the amount that they emphasize this. I compared it once on my show to entrapment. See, there you go.

[John Lovett]

I'm sorry, Is that not the end? Is it entrapment at a period?

[Bill Maher]

Can I explain it, though?

[John Lovett]

Yes, explain. I think we all get it, but. Yeah, explain it. Entrapment.

[Bill Maher]

I don't think everybody does get it.

[John Lovett]

Okay, explain it.

[Bill Maher]

Okay, well, what is entrapment? Entrapment is when you suggest something to people that they weren't ordinarily going to do. I used the example of after 9, 11, the FBI got caught basically entrapping some people, which is what they went to. People who were. Excuse me, I'm not done.

[John Lovett]

Right, I'm sorry. You're right. You're right. Honestly, that was rude. That was rude. That was rude. Bill, finish. You're explaining how being trans is like being recruited into Al Qaeda.

[Bill Maher]

Well, that's glib and absolutely 100% glib.

[John Lovett]

Stupid and glib.

[Bill Maher]

It is.

[John Lovett]

Yes.

[Bill Maher]

Because it's not true. You didn't even let me get through the thing.

[John Lovett]

You're right.

[Bill Maher]

And now I gotta go.

[John Lovett]

You're just gonna leave? We're out in the middle of a debate.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, no, okay, I'll finish this. Entrapment like, okay, so they go to somebody. They go to a group of guys. They did this in a group of poor black guys in Miami and were unhappy with America. And, hey, wouldn't it be great if we blew up the Sears Tower in Chicago and these guys didn't even have a gun? And it's like, yeah, I hate America, or I got problems with America. That does sound kind of cool. And, hey, well, we can get you the explosives. That's entrapment. You put an idea in people's heads that wouldn't have been there otherwise. Do I think in most of America they did that in schools? I don't, but I think in enough of them, in enough far left places, they did constantly have this idea in the minds of children that maybe you're not in the right body. I mean, the New England Journal of Medicine advocated for taking sex off of a birth certificate. I believe it was like, you're assigned sex. Assigned. You're assigned.

[John Lovett]

I think that's right.

[Bill Maher]

I was assigned it by my dick. Okay. When I was born. Yes. And again, to tell kids, it doesn't always have to Be and isn't always the default setting, but that's a different mentality than they put in the minds of kids. And that's why this debate goes on. And the fact that you think, or a lot of people on the left think, that even if you just have this debate, it makes you a bigot. You just have to roll over. That was you asked about the Biden administration. That was their position. If you even question this, you're some sort of a bigot. And this is new science, and it has to do with children. And it's not gonna look good in the future, that position.

[John Lovett]

Can I just respond to something? Now? You can. Now I can respond. All right, can you just. All right, let's just say you definitely said your face.

[Bill Maher]

Just say your bullshit while I'm in the bathroom.

[John Lovett]

Just stay for one second.

[Bill Maher]

Okay.

[John Lovett]

I'm unbelievable.

[Bill Maher]

I'm kidding.

[John Lovett]

All right. No, I know. Okay. A lot of things there. First of all, this is going to sound confrontational. For a long time, people said, oh, older gay people are recruiting kids to be gay and they wouldn't really be gay. It was. They were being recruited, they were being groomed, that. That they were being drawn. That was their conservative position. The Christian right position for a long time was the reason you didn't want to have gay teachers is they're going to recruit that the gay lifestyle is going to look so enticing and so exciting that it's going to bring these poor, defenseless boys, mostly boys, into the gay lifestyle and destroy their lives. But of course, that wasn't true. Really. All gay teachers were an example. Right. Look, there are. Are a few examples of people getting older and realizing that they shouldn't have transitioned. That happens. It's real. That's real.

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, more than a few.

[John Lovett]

But there are also really important surgeries that people get for their heart, and they go wrong and somebody dies. And nobody says, we must stop the cardiologists. No one says, we must stop the surgeons. We say, let's.

[Bill Maher]

That's your analogy.

[John Lovett]

Well, my analogy is only that. Wait, let me finish. Can I finish?

[Bill Maher]

Yes.

[John Lovett]

Is it my turn to talk?

[Bill Maher]

No, no, you're right.

[John Lovett]

And what you say is, let's make sure that this version of it is being practiced. Well, we don't get rid of the specific surgery. We don't throw out a whole field of medicine. We say, let's make sure we're doing it in a way that's healthy. The science, the research. All right. Makes clear that, yes, there are exceptions. Yes, there are people Practicing it in ways that maybe go too far. But for the most part, study after study shows that gender affirming care saves. Wait, let me. I'm talking. It's my turn. I was so quiet for so long after I interrupted two times, but once I stopped talking, boy, I was good at it. And that gender affirming care saves a lot of lives. And the truth is we talk about these edge cases, talk about athletes, talk about locker rooms, but for the most part, what we're talking about is a very small group of people that just want the opportunity to live and express themselves. And there is a war on that group of people from the right to make salient, extreme cases, edge cases, not for the purposes of stopping those, but for doing what the Trump administration is doing entirely, which is stopping all gender affirming care altogether and making trans people fucking nervous when they have to pee at the airport. Right? Which is the end result of all this.

[Bill Maher]

And of course that's awful. And I agree with all that, except the part about the studies. There was a very big story this year. It was in the front page of the New York Times. A woman, I forget her name, and she had done like it was a 10 year study, did not release it on purpose because she said it would weaponize the argument from the other side. So in other words, it came out not the way you wanted the study to come out. Not what you said, that it's. Oh, all the studies show that. No, it is a mixed bag. That's true. Some people, yes, it's the right thing, but to take that risk at that age before you know shit about anything. Yes, sometimes it's pretty obvious that this should. It's a very hard call to make. And again, this was a very long study, very thorough, and they wouldn't release it because it came out with the.

[John Lovett]

Wrong conclusions, but because it is a hard question, because it is a serious question.

[Bill Maher]

Right.

[John Lovett]

It is a personal question. I don't want Donald Trump deciding, I want parents and doctors.

[Bill Maher]

Well, you just said parents can get. Shut up.

[John Lovett]

Well, I don't think parents should get shut out. There are rare exceptions to that. Look, we all believe that parents should have decisions over their children, but we also recognize that some parents do such a bad fucking job that the kids are in danger. That happens in outside of trans issues. That happens all the time. It's terrible. Some parents are fucking terrible. But somehow that the fact that there are terrible parents in the world gets erased. On these questions, do I think that schools should, but as a baseline, be keeping A secret from parents? Of fucking course not. No one thinks that. No one thinks that.

[Bill Maher]

Well, apparently that's not true. People do think that. And there is no perfect answer to this. It's as many nutty questions. The least bad answer and the least.

[John Lovett]

Bad answer is to not have the government decide from above. It's just to leave it up to people and parents and the kids and the doctors. Right? You want the government to ban gender affirming care for kids?

[Bill Maher]

You wanna lose every election? Just keep coming down on the side of parents coming in second and eighth. Who gets to decide what goes on with my kid contest?

[John Lovett]

First of all, I'm not talking about winning or losing elections. I agree that there's a salience to this issue. I agree that this has been weaponized. I agree with all that. But I'm just talking about the issue itself. What did that card say?

[Bill Maher]

Can I take this one home as a souvenir? I'm gonna put it in my scrapbook.

[John Lovett]

Let me see if I hit all my points that I wanted to make about this.

[Bill Maher]

Okay. Boy, they don't even see. Couldn't they have started it? Says my guest this week is tuffing house political content sitting here and Bill Maher. Bill, couldn't they have started this on the next card? Don't you think that word bill should have been started on the next card? No, I'm not trying to get anybody in trouble.

[John Lovett]

Let's not. You gotta go. That's it? You're just leaving?

[Bill Maher]

Yeah, I'm just leaving.

[John Lovett]

Bill Maher, everybody.

[Bill Maher]

Thank you.

[John Lovett]

I had questions. More. I had other questions.

[Bill Maher]

Oh, we could do it all day.

[John Lovett]

Well, I guess not. We could. All right, good. Bill Maher, everybody. Get out of here.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

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