Pod Save America: "Department of War (Crimes)"

Date: December 2, 2025
Hosts: Jon Favreau, Jon Lovett, Tommy Vietor
Guest: Rob Sand, Democratic candidate for Governor of Iowa

Episode Overview

This episode dives into a whirlwind week of news centered on the Trump administration’s crackdown on immigration after a DC shooting, escalating reports of war crimes under the new Secretary of War Pete Hegseth, Trump’s controversial pardons—including of a Honduran ex-president convicted for trafficking cocaine—and the wider implications of corruption, foreign policy, and internal GOP dissent. The episode closes with an in-depth interview: Tommy Vietor talks with Iowa’s statewide Democratic officeholder Rob Sand about flipping the state, rural politics, trade wars, and what real leadership looks like in 2026.

Main Topics & Key Insights

1. White House Reaction: DC Shooting and Immigration Crackdown

[02:09–15:52]

• The hosts break down the administration's reaction to a DC shooting by an Afghan national (a former US ally) that resulted in the death and injury of two National Guard members.
• Trump’s response: a sweeping new policy to halt all migration from "Third world countries," review green cards from a list of 19 countries, and denaturalize migrants who "undermine domestic tranquility".
• Tommy Vietor notes the move is collective punishment and steeped in racism:

  “Now the only refugees allowed in the US are white South Africans. Am I wrong about that?” (05:02)

• Jon Lovett calls out the ploy as a pretext, quoting Afghan Evac leader Sean Van Diver:

  “They are using a single violent individual as cover for a policy they have long planned. Turning their own intelligence failures into an excuse to punish an entire community...” (06:35)

• The group argues the shooting had nothing to do with the vetting process or the immigration system.
• The rhetoric is increasingly alt-right and extreme, with the term "remigration" appearing in DHS tweets and Stephen Miller stating that “migrants and their descendants recreate the conditions and terrors of their broken homelands” (09:20).

Memorable moment:

• Jon Favreau:

  “You look up remigration—Wikipedia says it’s a European far-right concept of ethnic cleansing... and that’s what the Department of Homeland Security is tweeting.” (09:44)

2. War Crimes in the Caribbean: Pete Hegseth’s Orders

[16:59–24:03]

• Reports surfaced that Secretary Pete Hegseth ordered SEAL Team 6 to “kill everybody” on a suspected drug trafficking boat, leading to a second strike on defenseless survivors.
• Republicans in Congress (including Don Bacon, Mike Turner, and Roger Wicker) signal serious concern, with Bacon calling it “a violation of the law of war. When people want to surrender, you don’t kill them.” (18:30)
• Tommy Vietor:

  “It’s not. It’s a war crime—and it’s on video. That’s why they can’t really lie about it.” (19:26)

• Administration’s self-defense argument is widely mocked—“Two dudes clinging to burning wreckage... like they're shooting at a US military aircraft?” (Tommy, 19:26)

Notable reference:

• Jon Lovett:

  “It is just lawless. The shipwreck thing—it’s the example: it’s not just that we’re not allowed to murder people who’ve been shipwrecked, we’re supposed to rescue them. That’s the law of the Navy, the Marines, everybody.” (21:16)

• The hosts compare to historic war crimes (e.g., U-boat attacks on shipwrecked survivors) as precedent.

3. Pardons and Corruption: The Honduras Scandal and Beyond

[33:26–45:45]

• Trump announces his plans to pardon Juan Orlando Hernández, ex-president of Honduras convicted of conspiring with drug cartels.
• Despite Trump DOJ and Biden DOJ involvement in the prosecution, Trump calls it a “Biden setup.”
• The episode links the pardon to influence from MAGA cronies (Roger Stone, crypto investors), “prospera” libertarian zones in Honduras, and a wider pattern of pardoning the administration's friends.
• Tommy Vietor:

  “...all of it confirms this widely held belief in Latin America that the US is full of shit. We do not care about the rule of law. We don’t care about justice. We don’t care about stopping drug smuggling. It’s all politics and money and defending your friends and killing your enemies…” (35:55)

• The corruption extends to domestic fraudsters—Trump pardons David Gentile, a Ponzi schemer, just days into his sentence; reason unknown.

4. Corrupt Foreign & Domestic Deals

[47:10–56:10]

• Jared Kushner and Steve Witkoff, Trump’s golf buddy, are reportedly holding meetings with Russian oligarchs to negotiate economic “partnerships” and discuss carving up Ukraine.
• Tommy Vietor:

  “...they are sketching out how to carve up Ukraine. And it doesn’t matter if you like funding for Ukraine or oppose it—like, that is a terrible process that is destined to be corrupted.” (47:34)

• Discussion shifts to Silicon Valley, highlighting a major NYT piece about David Sacks and AI conflicts of interest.

5. Interview: Rob Sand, Democratic Candidate for Iowa Governor

[64:39–100:29] Segments:

• Why Iowa Could Flip ([65:52]) — Sand describes Iowa as a state ready for change, not as red as national narrative suggests, and one that responds to authenticity, not party label.

  “There are many people in Iowa... who actually look at politics... and instead they're all the same. They're asking: who's real? Who is willing to go against party orthodoxy? Who is willing to challenge the status quo?” (65:55)

• Town Hall Listening Tour & Rural Voters ([68:00]) — Sand recounts his 100-county town hall effort, building community by singing “America the Beautiful” together, and reaching Republicans, independents, and Democrats.
• Countering the Trade War’s Damage ([79:58]) — On Trump’s trade war and soybean exports:

  “China has never affirmed—yes, we're going to buy 12 million metric tons. They have bought 300,000, allegedly... Those numbers are very, very different.” (80:49)

• Cancer Crisis in Iowa ([84:31]) — Iowa leads the nation for cancer growth; Sand pushes for state funding for research, criticizing lack of sufficient action.
• Cross-Partisan Cooperation ([94:30]) — Sand shares stories of surprise bipartisan support in the Iowa legislature and insists progress is possible by engaging in good faith:

  “When we engage in good faith... a whole new world opens up in terms of what’s possible to accomplish.” (96:55)

• Quirky Iowa Moment ([98:17]) — The show ends with a light chat about bowhunting and Iowa wildlife, showing Sand’s local roots and culture-savvy appeal.

Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• Favreau: “Just think about what it means for the US government to say, hey, you know what, we can murder people in the water who are just on boats. And ... our explanation is gonna be it's legal because we say it is.” (29:09)
• Lovett: “If you do what they say and it's illegal, suddenly you are beholden to Trump. Like you are the mobster that took the bribe.” (46:09)
• Tommy Vietor (on pardons): “He always, like, pleads ignorance — 'I don't know.' ... Shouldn't you know a little something about the individual you just pardoned, sir?” (34:36)
• Rob Sand: “Not bluer or redder, but truer and better. Our political system is broken.” (73:22)
• Sand: “I love finding places of agreement and a sense of community where you expect to find none.” (95:07)

Notable & Memorable Moments

• The group mocks the administration’s explanation for a second strike on a burning boat: “And do what? Launch a satellite?... We're going to need a B2 maybe.” (19:26–20:08)
• Pete Hegseth posts a meme of Franklin the Turtle bombing narco boats as his response to war crimes reports. (26:45)
• Satirical back-and-forth about right-wing crypto-experiment zones in Honduras: “It’s like the opening crawl for a dystopian... In the future, you will live in one of a dozen corporal anarchist crypto states.” (38:42)
• Rob Sand’s unique campaign touch: leading town halls by getting everyone to sing “America the Beautiful” together. (72:08)
• Bowhunting finale: Tommy and Rob compare notes on hunting and fishing, highlighting Sand’s Iowa bona fides and sense of authenticity. (98:04–100:17)

Episode Timestamps: Key Segments

• Opening & Immigration Crackdown: 02:09–15:52
• War Crimes & Pete Hegseth: 16:59–24:03
• Honduras Pardon & Corruption: 33:26–45:45
• Kushner, Russia, & AI Conflicts: 47:10–56:10
• Rob Sand Interview: 64:39–100:29

Summary

This episode paints a clear picture of a White House taking extreme, punitive immigration action in the wake of a shooting with little policy connection; an administration giving illegal “kill them all” orders abroad; and a president dispensing justice by favor. Throughout, the hosts highlight the dangerous normalization of corruption, racism, authoritarianism, and impunity. The interview with Rob Sand offers an antidote: an embrace of small-d democracy, public service, and cross-partisan decency, offering hope that local politics might yet surprise us.