TACO Tuesday in Tehran

Summary

Pod Save America: "TACO Tuesday in Tehran"

Date: March 24, 2026
Hosts: Jon Favreau, Jon Lovett, Tommy Vietor (Dan Pfeiffer out)
Guest: Leah Littman (Strict Scrutiny)
Main Theme:
An unfiltered breakdown of the week’s chaotic political news, centered on Trump’s Iran war crisis, its global and domestic fallout, escalating authoritarian tactics at home, Democratic strategy, corruption scandals, and the evolving 2026 election landscape.

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1. Episode Overview

The episode dives into:

• Trump's erratic Iran policy, sudden pivot on war escalation, and economic fallout.
• The administration's controversial domestic maneuvers: airport security chaos, ICE agent deployment, and voter suppression.
• Democratic leadership tensions and the 2026 midterm outlook, including the “hot candidate” meme.
• Brazen administration corruption, notably with Corey Lewandowski.
• The politics and morality of public statements celebrating political deaths.
• A deep-dive interview with Leah Littman on the Supreme Court’s looming decision on mail-in voting and ongoing voter suppression battles.

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2. Key Discussion Points & Insights

A. Trump's Iran Escalation & "Tehran Taco"

[03:26–15:49]

• Trump’s Threats & Backpedaling:
  Trump threatened to "obliterate" Iran’s power infrastructure unless the Strait of Hormuz was reopened, causing a global oil panic. After the market crash, he claimed (falsely, per Iran) that negotiations were underway — a transparent play to stabilize markets.

  • Notable quote:
    Tommy Vietor [08:22]:
    "We went from zero enrichment regime change to joint custody of the Strait of Hormuz."

  • Jon Favreau [13:18]:
    "He doesn't just get to cancel the war like he canceled some of his tariffs. The Iranians and Israelis can do whatever they want and keep this thing going."

• The "Tehran Taco":
  Trump refers to a potential "deal" as the “Tehran Taco,” prompting the team to ridicule the chaos and unseriousness of the administration’s approach.

• Negotiation Absurdity & Assassination Fears:
  The team points out the dangerous optics of U.S. negotiation partners being potential Israeli targets, highlighting why Iran would lack trust.

  • Tommy Vietor [11:45]:
    "Every time the Iranians have negotiated, we have bombed them or attacked... if you’re the Iranians, why do you try to Go negotiate at all?"

B. Domestic Political Fallout: Markets, Oil, and Congressional Dysfunction

[15:49–29:51]

• Market & Oil Turmoil:
  As Trump lifts sanctions on stranded Iranian oil, giving Iran $14B, Lovett jokes about the administration’s "jiu jitsu" logic (i.e., unintendedly funding the other side of the war).

  • Tommy Vietor [17:45]:
    "He’s suggesting that giving Iran $14 billion that they can use to fund a war against us ... is jiu jitsu, which I would disagree with."

• $200 Billion War Funding:
  Trump asks Congress for an unpopular $200B war supplemental. Even some Republicans like Lauren Boebert break ranks, denouncing further spending (see quote below).

  • Jon Lovett [25:42], quoting Boebert (26:07):
    "I am so tired of spending money elsewhere. I am tired of the industrial war complex getting all of our hard earned tax dollars. I have folks in Colorado who can’t afford to live..."

• Democratic Caution:
  The hosts urge Democrats to loudly oppose the spending and avoid repeating 2003 Iraq War mistakes.

  • Tommy Vietor [29:21]:
    "This funding request vote is de facto congressional authorization of the war. … You will be seen as voting for the war and for the funding. Fucking vote against it."

C. Domestic Chaos: ICE at Airports, TSA Crisis, and Voter Suppression

[33:08–41:52]

• Trump Ties TSA Funding to Voter ID Laws:
  Trump refuses to fund TSA unless Congress passes the restrictive SAVE Act (requiring passport/birth certificate to register to vote).

• ICE Agents in Airports:
  Trump, on a radio suggestion, deploys ICE agents to airports in full gear, creating intimidating optics but not solving labor shortages.

  • Tommy Vietor [36:00]:
    "Apparently it was literally a random woman … called in to a radio show. … Trump must have seen that because he announced his plan the next day. That’s inventing the paperclip."

• Host Reaction:
  The team ridicules the move as performative and ineffective, designed to "own the libs" but deeply damaging to airport operations and civil liberties.

  • Jon Lovett [37:22]:
    "They're just there, preventing the floors from flying up and hitting the ceilings."

  • Jon Favreau [37:54]:
    "It’s like dude, we’re getting Starbucks at LaGuardia now."

• Political Backlash:
  Surprisingly, some GOP Senators and House members break with Trump’s tactics, while Democrats still struggle to seize the political moment.

D. Administration Corruption: Corey Lewandowski Exposé

[44:48–49:22]

• Lewandowski Bribery & Impunity:
  The hosts discuss reports of Lewandowski demanding kickbacks from private prison companies and receiving a Presidential Daily Brief.

  • Jon Lovett [47:13]:
    "It’s a shocking, brazen corruption scheme where people are either obliquely or directly suggesting that if you want a government contract, Corey Lewandowski has to get his bequet."

• Dem Advice:
  Hosts urge pursuing investigations regardless of Trump’s threat of pardons, to set a deterrent precedent.

  • Tommy Vietor [49:33]:
    "Let’s not assume he’s going to pardon everybody. … Make him do it."

E. Democratic Strategy: Schumer & the Search for Hotter Candidates

[53:20–66:48]

• Senate Dem Leadership Rumblings:
  A Wall Street Journal story highlights a potential Schumer revolt ("Fight Club" group chat) over centrist candidate recruitment, poor messaging, and generational change.

  • Tommy Vietor [56:17]:
    "Like, is Chuck Schumer really the guy that you want to be leader between the midterms and the presidential?"

• Debate Over ‘Hot’ Candidates:
  The team reacts to the memeified push for “hotter” Democratic candidates, joking about Jon Ossoff and AOC’s glow-ups.

  • Notable exchange:
    Tommy Vietor [60:48]:
    "He’s a piece of ass … got a jawline you could use as a ruler. Great hair, great demeanor."
    Jon Favreau [62:06]:
    "Clearly you can win the presidency without being hot. Donald Trump."

• Electability and Recruitment Nuance:
  Hosts caution against overconfidence in elite-backed candidates, and argue for letting primary voters, not party leaders, choose.

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3. Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• Iran Pivot:
  Tommy Vietor [08:22]: "We went from zero enrichment regime change to joint custody of the Strait of Hormuz."
• War Funding Skepticism:
  Jon Lovett [25:42], quoting Boebert (26:07): "I am a no on any war supplementals. … I am so tired of spending money elsewhere. I am tired of the industrial war complex..."
• Reality Check on Airport ICE:
  Tommy Vietor [36:00]: "It was literally a random woman … Trump must have seen that because he then announced his plan the next day."
• Lewandowski Scandal:
  Jon Lovett [47:13]: "It’s a shocking, brazen corruption scheme... if you want a government contract, Corey Lewandowski has to get his bequet."
• On Objectifying Politicians:
  Tommy Vietor [60:48]:
  "He’s a piece of ass... He’s got a jawline you could use as a ruler."
• Reflections on Celebrating Political Deaths:
  Jon Lovett [69:05]:
  "To celebrate someone you don’t like dying is to act as if dying is a kind of justice. But that can’t be true because everybody dies."

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4. Leah Littman Interview: Supreme Court & Voter Suppression

[79:09–97:46]

Topic: Supreme Court Oral Arguments on Mail-In Ballot Restrictions (Watson v. RNC)

Summary:

• Case Summary:
  The RNC challenges a Mississippi law allowing absentee ballots postmarked by Election Day to be counted if received within five days. If the RNC wins, it could nullify similar laws in 29+ states, risking mass disenfranchisement.

  • Leah Littman [80:53]:
    "That theory would destabilize election laws in more than half the states… sweeping implications."

• Divided Conservative Justices:
  Alito/Thomas/Gorsuch embrace Fox News logic, while Barrett and perhaps Roberts question the sensibility of upending longstanding practices. Kavanaugh’s stance is ambiguous but leaning right.

  • Leah Littman [81:53]:
    "Alito, Thomas, and Gorsuch seemed to be totally 'MAGA-pilled'... Kavanaugh sounded more in that camp."

• Purcell Principle Hypocrisy:
  The majority has exploited "Purcell" (don’t change election laws close to elections) only to block pro-voter changes, not anti-voter ones.

  • Leah Littman [83:54]:
    "It's always too close to an election to do something that protects voting rights. But it's never too close to do something that would help Republicans."

• SAVE Act & Women’s Disenfranchisement:
  Biden (and soon Congress) pushes a draconian voter ID law (SAVE Act) that could block many married women, LGBTQ+ people, and those who've changed names from voting due to document mismatches.

  • Leah Littman [90:00]:
    "This law just threatens to disenfranchise large swaths of the population... and that seems to be the goal."

• Legal Madness in New Jersey:
  The hosts marvel at the Trump administration’s illegal circumvention of federal prosecutor appointments, only resolved after judges forced compliance.

  • Leah Littman [92:04]:
    "Imagine GTL [Jersey Shore] but like, on ketamine... It's the legal version of that."

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5. Reflections on Celebrating Death (Mueller & Trump’s Statements)

[67:20–76:11]

• Trump’s shockingly cruel celebration of Robert Mueller’s death sparks a nuanced discussion on the morality and futility of rejoicing in the death of one’s enemies.

  • Jon Lovett [69:12]:
    "To celebrate someone you don’t like dying is to act as if dying is a kind of justice, that they're getting justice. But that can't be true because everybody dies."

  • Tommy Vietor [73:23]:
    "The same thing in Trump that makes him post that about Bob Mueller ... is the thing that makes him talk about war... Someone who devalues human life ... who has his finger on the fucking button—it's all connected."

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6. Timestamps & Segments Guide

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 03:26–15:49 | Trump/Iran escalation, "Tehran Taco" coverage | | 15:49–29:51 | Oil crisis, war funding, market panic | | 33:08–41:52 | ICE at airports, TSA crisis, voter suppression | | 44:48–49:22 | Lewandowski corruption scandal | | 53:20–66:48 | Democratic leadership drama, candidate "hotness", | | | midterm mobilization and Project 218 plug | | 67:20–76:11 | On celebrating political deaths | | 79:09–97:46 | Leah Littman: SCOTUS, mail-in voting, voter suppression|

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7. Tone & Takeaway

The hosts wield their signature blend of irreverence, sharp policy critique, and dark humor—peppered with running jokes about corruption, candidate attractiveness, and Trumpworld’s circus-like governance—to both comfort and mobilize listeners for a fraught, consequential moment in American politics. The episode underscores that, despite near-daily shocks, democracy’s future hinges on vigilance, clarity, and informed action.

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8. Action Items/Resources

• Project 218: voteSaveAmerica.com – Get involved for the 2026 midterms
• Strict Scrutiny Podcast: For SCOTUS coverage
• No Kings Day (March 28): nokings.org – Attend events to stand up for democracy

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This thorough summary provides key insights, context, quotations, and time-based navigation for listeners and non-listeners alike, maintaining Pod Save America’s candid, activist tone.

Transcript

[Jon Favreau]

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[Jon Lovett]

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[Jon Favreau]

No.

[Jon Lovett]

These days?

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[Erin Ryan]

The country feels like it's falling apart right before our eyes and the people inside it are being silenced. So we're going to East 26th street and Nicollet Avenue, which is where Alex Preddy was executed by ICE and Border patrol. That is not a headline. That is a human life and it is all happening right now. Do you worry about your own safety being involved in all this?

[Leah Littman]

Yes.

[Jon Lovett]

But it doesn't really feel like there's another option, you know.

[Alyssa Mastromonaco]

And of course they use a 5 year old child as bait. And of course they're doing all these horrible bad things because they don't know what they're doing. They've been told that they're going to get rid of the worst of the worst, then they have absolute immunity. And they've been told that nothing they do will they ever be held accountable for.

[Erin Ryan]

On my show, Runaway country, we go where the headlines hit home from communities under threat to the people fighting to be heard. New episodes of Runaway country drop every Thursday. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts or watch on YouTube.

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[Jon Favreau]

Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.

[Jon Lovett]

I'm Jon Levitt.

[Tommy Vietor]

I'm Tommy Detour.

[Jon Favreau]

On today's show, we got Trump seemingly making up stories about negotiating with Iran to calm the stock market after he threatened to blow up their power plants. Ice agents being deployed to airports because Trump refuses to fund TSA unless Congress passes a law making it harder for people to vote. Democrats fantasizing about a schumerless future and hotter candidates and the President celebrating the death of Bob Mueller. Then Lovett talks to Strict Scrutiny's Leah Lipman about the Supreme Court's latest assault on mail in voting and lots more. But first, some exciting news, guys. Thanks to all of you listeners. We are, as of this recording, just 484 subscribers away from having 50,000 Friend of the Pod subscribers. So if you haven't yet subscribed, please consider doing so not just to help us hit 50,000, but so that you don't miss out on all the crooked content we're putting out for subscribers only. Friend of the Pod subscribers get our new extra episode of Pod Save America called Pod Save America. Only friends, other subscriber only shows like Polar Coaster with Dan Pfeiffer, access to all of our excellent substack newsletters like Pod Save America. Open tabs ad free episodes of all your favorite crooked pods and you get to feel good about supporting one of the few independent pro democracy media outlets left in Trump's America.

[Jon Lovett]

And you're saying that Tommy, at 50,000 you'll show feet? That's right.

[Tommy Vietor]

I do have a wiki feet I could add to it.

[Jon Favreau]

Add to. Okay, Tommy will show feet.

[Tommy Vietor]

I wouldn't say they're my best Feature.

[Jon Favreau]

I was gonna say not an ugly ass feet. We'll give the 50,000 subscriber Trump's phone number.

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, should I go get my phone? Well, should we call him? Yeah, yeah, ask him about his tweet.

[Jon Lovett]

Let's check in.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, that's a good one. Or should we ask him if he thinks the new ayatollah is hot?

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, yeah. This is probably like he's getting to the witching hours.

[Tommy Vietor]

You know, he's sundialing. Probably calling like during his favorite show or something.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, yeah. Is this Hannity?

[Tommy Vietor]

Fuck, you're right. No, his Hannity's eight, right?

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, yeah. Maybe this is 13. I don't know who this is.

[Tommy Vietor]

He likes them all. He hates Newsmax.

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

Please leave your name and number.

[Jon Favreau]

I got a little excited for a second.

[Jon Lovett]

I get a little nervous.

[Jon Favreau]

Me too.

[Jon Lovett]

I get a little nervous.

[Jon Favreau]

I know that I feel comfortable that Tommy has a plan, but I do.

[Tommy Vietor]

I mean, I have to do the Tom Beach Runner recorded line. I was gonna tell him how Pod Save America, we're bigger than Ben Shapiro. And then I wanted to ask him if the new Supreme Leader is Robin Williams from the Birdcage gay or Nathan Lane from the Birdcage gay.

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, wow. Or Scott Bezague or Lindsey Graham gay. He's more Lindsey Graham gay of anything. If Lindsey Graham is gay. Which we can't know for sure.

[Jon Favreau]

Which we can't know for sure. But we could ask Trump.

[Jon Lovett]

Maybe we'll ask Trump. We can ask Trump.

[Jon Favreau]

All right, let's get to the news. Roughly 36 hours after Trump threatened to obliterate Iran's power plants unless they reopen the Strait of Hormuz, which caused oil prices to soar as Iran threatened to retaliate by destroying energy, water and communications infrastructure across the Middle east. The President backed down just in time for markets to open, claiming that negotiations to end the war are underway, which Iran said isn't true at all. Here's Trump talking to reporters about this.

[Donald Trump]

Monday morning, tomorrow morning, sometime their time, we were expected to blow up their largest electric generating plants that cost over $10 billion to build. One shot, it's gone. It collapses. Why would they want that? So they call. I didn't call. They called. They want to make a deal. We're doing a five day period. We'll see how that goes. And if it goes well, we're going to end up with settling this. Otherwise we just keep bombing our little hearts here.

[Jon Favreau]

You said there's many points of agreement

[Chris Murphy]

with Iran right now.

[Donald Trump]

What can you give us many, like 15 points. 15 points. Well, they're not going to have a nuclear weapon. That's number one. That's number one. Two and three, they will never have a nuclear weapon to that. They've agreed to that street of our

[Jon Favreau]

moods, who's going to be in control of that'll?

[Donald Trump]

Be opened very soon.

[Jon Lovett]

If this works, how soon and who's

[Jon Favreau]

in control of it? Will Iran still be able to control

[Leah Littman]

the flow of oil?

[Donald Trump]

Be jointly controlled by who? Maybe me. Maybe me. Me and the ayatollah. Whoever the Ayatollah is. Whoever the next Ayatollah.

[Jon Lovett]

Me and Ayatollah tbd.

[Jon Favreau]

They're calling it the Tehran Taco guys.

[Jon Lovett]

Are they calling it that?

[Jon Favreau]

No. No, I hope not.

[Tommy Vietor]

I bet they are. Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

Somewhat. Somewhere. I realize the simplest answer here is nobody knows because the president has undiagnosed mental disorders. But what do you guys think is going on here? How did we get from Trump threatening an escalation that would likely constitute a war crime just on Saturday night to a seemingly fabricated story about a possible deal to end the war? Tommy?

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah. We went from zero enrichment regime change to joint custody of the Strait of Hormuz.

[Jon Favreau]

Is that where we're at? Maybe Marco will. That's in Marco.

[Tommy Vietor]

Maybe Rubio will be the chairman of the Straight Order.

[Jon Lovett]

He's the bridge. He's the troll that sits and collects the toll at the Strait of Hormuz.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's a good Pete Hexath job.

[Jon Favreau]

He does like a kind of a

[Tommy Vietor]

rhyme scheme speaking style. In between. The price of oil exploded, the stock market fell way off its highs. And I think Trump woke up Monday morning, he saw the Asian and European markets in way down, S and P futures were way down, and decided to set up the old Taco Bat signal. And it's predictable, right? I mean, we know Trump cares about two things. It's TV coverage and bad moves in the stock market. And the only criticism he probably gets in person, at least, is from billionaires and CEOs and bankers who can afford to go to his country clubs who will see him and be like, I'm worth a billion less than I was yesterday, sir. And so I think that's what happens with the move. That's why Besant was out. SCOTT Besant, TREASURY SECRETARY OVER the weekend, like, that's not normally the guy that would. You'd have talking about airstrikes on IRGC targets.

[Jon Favreau]

Right.

[Tommy Vietor]

It's only about market manipulation. And so this will get into the short term, longer term. I don't believe a word he said in that clip. Like, the Iranians know they have leverage. They're going to use it because they don't want to wake up in six months with the Israelis once again bombing them. Bombing, going for regime change, trying to kill off their leaders. Iran has denied they've that there have been substantive talks. And I've also seen a list of demands from Iran that could include a simultaneous cease fire in Iran, Lebanon and Iraq. Iran continuing its missile program, Iran codifying its right to nuclear enrichment. Iran getting payments for damages in the war.

[Jon Favreau]

Reparations.

[Tommy Vietor]

Reparations. And then some sort of de facto recognition of their control of the strait, which Trump kind of preemptively grants there. So I don't know, man.

[Jon Favreau]

J.D.

[Tommy Vietor]

vance maybe is going to lead these talks. I think that'd be a good thing. Like we should get Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner away from these talks because they're morons. But also the US Marine contingent gets there on Friday. So, yeah, see about that.

[Jon Favreau]

I have a question because I read some reports that they're all headed to Islamabad in Pakistan for talks and JD Witkoff and Kushner are going to meet, I guess the speaker of the Iranian parliament there. I saw Pakistani officials said this to Reuters too. But like, question about this. If you're the speaker of parliament in Iran and you're probably next on the Israelis list for targeted assassination, you're just popping your head up now, hopping on a plane and going to Islamabad. Is that something that you think the

[Tommy Vietor]

probably safer out of the country than in?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah. There's a moment when Trump was asked who exactly he is negotiating with. It's actually very similar sort of geometrically to when he was asked which ex president he was talking to and then didn't want to say and then they all denied it. So Iran saying these talks aren't happening. Trump's saying they are. But he won't say with who. Why? Because he suggests if he says who the US Is talking to, Israel might kill them. Which also gives you a little bit of a concern about what the negotiating posture can be about, promising an end to the conflict when you can't promise that your chief ally won't step in and escalate when you choose not to.

[Jon Favreau]

But this is what I mean. I was kind of joking. But like also, they have killed a bunch of top Iranian officials now, assassinated them. Every time the Iranians have negotiated, we have bombed them or attacked during the negotiations. So like, if you're the Iranians, why do you try to Go negotiate at all.

[Tommy Vietor]

At this point, they were complying with the jcpoa, the Iran nuclear agreement, when Trump pulled out of it in 2018. Then the US and Iran were negotiating when the Israelis started the 12 day war. And then we were negotiating and apparently the last round of talks before the most recent war was the most productive yet. Then we bombed them. And then Trump in the press has bragged about how we use talks as subterfuge to trick the Iranians. Right? So now the Iranians are, they're not dumb. They know that there's 7,500 plus Marines heading to the Middle east right now. And look, I mean, the Israelis have killed a lot of people who have been our inter, interlocutors in talks. They can kill the, you know, the speaker of Parliament. The power structure in Iran is the irgc, it's the military. And like, so that's who's going to be calling the shots here. And so I, I just, I don't know. Trump could be like, oh, I have a secret source, like Delsey Rodriguez of Iran. I just don't, I don't buy it.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, I saw that. A bunch of Trump officials just told Politico too, they're doing the Delsey Rodriguez thing again with the speaker of Parliament. They're like, this is what he's looking for. And one official said that this, the speaker of the Iranian Parliament, he's a hot option right now. That's the quote. He's a hot option.

[Tommy Vietor]

What does that mean?

[Jon Favreau]

People are talking about him a lot. They think he's someone that they can deal with. He's a hot option, but they gotta test him out. They got to test him out first. That's what they said.

[Tommy Vietor]

Is he hot?

[Jon Lovett]

Do we look. We're not at that part of the show yet.

[Jon Favreau]

Don't skip ahead to our hot candidate section. Hot Iranians, hot Iranian section.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, I mean, the administration has gotten several Iranian generals up to like 3,000 or 4,000 degrees.

[Jon Favreau]

Jesus.

[Jon Lovett]

Tough. So there's that.

[Jon Favreau]

I do think that the, the trouble for Trump here is that like taco speak aside, like, he doesn't just get to cancel the war, like he canceled some of his tariffs. Like the Iranians and the Israelis kind of can do whatever they want and keep this thing going in a way that really wreaks havoc on the global economy and our own for as long as they want.

[Jon Lovett]

Yes. Look what an extraordinary couple of weeks this has been. First, a war launched without Congress, without clear goals. Goals that evolved over the, basically over the course of that weekend, they didn't really land on if there's one set of goals they've kind of landed on repeatedly, it's the Ruby version, which is no nuclear capabilities to destroy the Navy, et cetera. But they had talked about regime change there, the regime's inability to project power. Then they closed the Strait of Hormuz, at which point Trump began begging our allies to join the fight after the fight had already begun. And they said, no, thank you, we'll continue to not be part of this war. We weren't consulted on and want nothing to do with, especially after you've been bullying us for a year. And then Trump said, actually, we don't need you because it's going so well. And then he saw the March markets tank and is now trying to end it this way. And yeah, he's not in control of events and he wants to be in control of events, but really there's no, I saw a piece of analysis about this, which is it's actually, ironically, a place where there's not much nuance. Either the Strait of Hormuz is open or it's not. If it's not, you have a huge set of knock on consequences that Trump is not able to solve. He has to get it open. Iran has a say in whether or not it's open, and that's what puts him in this position. And you can kill a bunch of leaders over and over and you could create opportunities for promotion, but it doesn't deal with the underlying problem.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah, look, I want this war over today, and if not today, tomorrow. I think that's the best outcome. The sooner the better. But we should just be clear, if the war ends today, it is a failure. We lost like the, the 900 pounds of highly niche uranium still sitting in Iran. The regime is still in place. In fact, their position is hardened because we replaced an 86 year old named Khamenei with a 50 something year old named Khamenei who is apparently much more angry at us because, you know, Trump killed his dad, his wife, his kid and some others.

[Jon Lovett]

And by the way, 86 year olds tend to die their own accord and create power vacuums that are not made by the United States.

[Tommy Vietor]

He was going to regime change himself. And then maybe the protesters who were out in the streets in December and January could have helped exercise a better option. And then Iran has now fully realized its economic leverage through the Strait of Hormuz and it sounds like they intend to continue to exercise that leverage.

[Jon Favreau]

Why wouldn't they? Why not? Trump was also asked about his decision to lift sanctions on 140 million barrels of Iranian oil that's already sitting at sea, which could be worth about 14 billion doll to the Iranians. The move was intended to ease what has now become a global crisis that the head of the International Energy Agency said is worse than the 1973 and 1979 oil shocks combined. U.S. and Israeli officials have also started forecasting a battle for Hormuz that will likely involve the 2,500 Marines headed towards the Middle East. Right now, though, there doesn't seem to be much clarity on what that would entail, at least based on what various officials are saying in public. Here's soybean farmer Scott Besant and horny warmonger Lindsey Graham on the Sunday shows. Is the president in the process of

[Erin Ryan]

winding down this war or escalating Again,

[Tommy Vietor]

they're not mutually exclusive. Sometimes you have to escalate to de escalate.

[Chris Murphy]

The sanctions were in place to prevent

[Jon Favreau]

Iran from getting any of the money.

[Erin Ryan]

They will have access to some of them again.

[Tommy Vietor]

Kristen, you're missing the point. In essence, we are jiu jitsuing the Iranians. We're using their home against.

[Jon Lovett]

Here's what I tell President Trump. Keep it up for a few more weeks. Take Cargill and we did Iwo Jima. We can do this.

[Jon Favreau]

They really send in their best. I guess we're funding both sides of this war now. $14 billion for the Iranians.

[Jon Lovett]

I don't totally understand how this brings in the art of jiu jitsu. And who's doing jiu jitsu? I don't even understand what the is

[Jon Favreau]

it or even the type of speech that he was referring. Was it of he was jujitsuing them.

[Tommy Vietor]

They were with their own oil.

[Jon Lovett]

I guess it's that the idea being that if you if you remove the sanctions, you lower the price of oil and therefore lower the amount of money Iran gets. But Iran was currently getting $0.

[Jon Favreau]

That's going to.

[Jon Lovett]

So I think 14 billion is as far as I'm 0. I'm not math.

[Tommy Vietor]

You know treasury in a while.

[Jon Favreau]

Right.

[Tommy Vietor]

But.

[Jon Lovett]

But 14 billion is more than $0.

[Jon Favreau]

And the pellets of cash that Obama gave Iran in the nuclear deal, that was what 1.5 billion altogether. And it was just their own assets unfrozen.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah. The pallets of cash was 400 million as part of a settlement that dated back to. Don't apologize. Yeah, it dated back to 19. The 1970s was the Carter administration. There was an arms deal with the Shah of Iran, that obviously ended when the Iranian revolution happened, and then it wound its way through these various courts, and we had to pay them back, and that's how it ended up doing it. And that became, like, the biggest deal ever. Donald Trump talks about to its day. But, yeah, that. That pissy cadaver they put out on the Sunday shows. Scott Bezin, he had a tough, tough interview. Yeah. Because he's suggesting that giving around 14 billion that they can use to fund a war against us or new nuclear infrastructure or more weapons for Hezbollah or the Houthis is jiu jitsu, which I would disagree with. He gets very angry at Kristen Welker for suggesting we should talk about how to pay for the war, as they're primed to request $200 billion in funding. So, like, everything about his interview there, he was just fucking terrible.

[Jon Favreau]

That just seems like a lot of money. Also, I don't know if you saw that when they were talking about, like, the Iranians want reparations as part of any negotiation, the war. Trump official was like, well, obviously we're not going to give them reparations, but maybe we can just, like, unfreeze some of their assets, and it just depends on what we call it. And I'm like, oh, sanctions relief. So you might. You might unfreeze some of their assets and then. And then say that. That, oh, interesting.

[Tommy Vietor]

For a nuclear deal.

[Jon Favreau]

Nuclear deal.

[Jon Lovett]

But it's different when Trump does it. It's different when Trump does it.

[Jon Favreau]

Trump's giving them even more money.

[Jon Lovett]

What? I don't know who is receiving less genuine feedback, more Donald Trump or Lindsey Graham at this point. He's out there frothing at the mouth, comparing Carg island to fucking Iwo Jima. Are you out of your mind?

[Jon Favreau]

7,000Americans at Iwo Jima, 20,000 wounded.

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, I. Are you saying what your goal is? To have one of the great battles of fucking World War II in the middle east right now? Like, that's your goal. That's what you think we should be. That's the. That's the good analogy here.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. Just going to. Well, we got to give them first. We got to give them the. Let them sell their oil so they can make $14 billion so they can fortify their defenses on Garg island against the invasion that we're about to launch. For what?

[Tommy Vietor]

For oil.

[Jon Favreau]

For more oil to sell. I guess.

[Jon Lovett]

I'm still. Look, I think so.

[Jon Favreau]

Then we can sanction it again. I don't know. Who knows?

[Jon Lovett]

I'm still. You know, I still want to take the over on corruption being the way out of this thing. You got Wyckoff and Kushner. They can make some kind of a deal. Suddenly the straight of Hormuz is open and everybody's making money. And that's the. That, to me is. And that all of the escalation talk is a threat towards some kind of a deal. It's not impossible to imagine. We live in that world.

[Jon Favreau]

Suddenly you can play 18 holes on CARG island, you know?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's beautiful.

[Jon Lovett]

Genuinely. The straight of hormones is beautiful. It actually is. Go look at pictures. Go look. Go look at pictures of straight hormones.

[Tommy Vietor]

You go to the straight of hormones

[Jon Favreau]

in March, reporting over the weekend, you're

[Tommy Vietor]

never going to want to come back. Oh, yeah, and by the way, two weeks ago, Megyn Kelly was saying, Lindsey Graham is a homicidal maniac with a bloodlust that is insatiable. That's before that interview.

[Jon Favreau]

It doesn't seem like it's been satiated at all.

[Tommy Vietor]

Not satiated.

[Jon Lovett]

Shout out to representation, though. Look at this administration. Scott Bessen out there. Lindsey Graham out there.

[Tommy Vietor]

Huh?

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

Marsha P. Johnson threw that brick. And here we are all these years later. It's a beautiful thing.

[Jon Favreau]

Why do you think. Why do you. This brings up a good question. Why do they only have Besant? Like you said, the treasury secretaries out there on the Sunday shows, they got Graham out there. They have Hegseth doing his briefings. They're all selling the war. Like, you know, is the White House really sending their best. Where's. Where's Marco? Where's J.D.

[Tommy Vietor]

no, I mean, I do think Besson is out there purely to talk to the markets because they were freaking out. And it's just like his lack of answers is just a sign of how poorly they plan. Like, I read over the weekend that the Strategic Petroleum reserve was only 60% full at the start of the war. Like, they clearly all thought this was going to be quick and over by now. But I heard from somebody over the weekend that Trump is basically the only one who likes Pete Hegseth anymore, and everyone else thinks he's a clown and an idiot and that he sucks on TV and that he's doing badly at the job. So they're, like, happy to throw him to the wolves.

[Jon Favreau]

That's awesome.

[Tommy Vietor]

And have him just kind of own this policy. And it sounds like Trump's kind of there, too, right? You heard him Monday of the policy. He was like, pete, you're the one who told me to do this war.

[Jon Favreau]

Pete, I think you were the first one to speak up. And you said, let's do it.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's right.

[Jon Favreau]

Because Pete was sitting next to him in Tennessee today at an event.

[Jon Lovett]

I have to say, that's actually, to me, the most revealing and chilling thing I've learned in quite some time about the way this decision was made, because. So they're the first person to chime in to say we should do this is Pete Hegseth. And we were off to the races from there.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, well, I mean, if you're counting, like, U.S. officials, I'm sure. I think we got B.B. well, probably inside the administration is Hegseth. And then you got Lindsey Graham and then you got Netanyahu. It seems like those are the big warmongers.

[Tommy Vietor]

I think over the course of the first four years and then the first hundred days of The Trump administration 2.0, a lot of people try to talk Trump into going to war with Iran. And he waved them off, or he got waved off it. And then he saw the Midnight Hammer operation, and then he saw Venezuela and was like, we're invincible. We can do anything. And here we are. And so look, you know, I've watched all these Hexaf briefings. Like, he's. He's actively harmful, right? He's like, reading war crime limericks. And then poor Dan Kane, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, is like, let me, like, try to be a adult here. Admiral Cooper from the CENTCOM is pretty good. But Rubio and Vance are in, like, witness protection. Like, like, remember Marco Rubio after Venezuela? He did Meet the Press. He was doing press conferences. He was everywhere. Have you guys seen him on tv?

[Jon Lovett]

No.

[Jon Favreau]

He popped up to say. He popped up to say Israel made us do it. And then we haven't heard from him since. And then JD Vance just sort of runs around trying to talk about anything else. And then when anyone asked him about the war, he was like, I'd go to jail if I told you the classified info, the advice that I gave the president about this war. There is one more person I saw reported over the weekend that convinced Trump this was a good idea. Rupert Murdoch, Bloomberg reporter, tracks with all the Fox. Yeah, it totally tracks that. You've got Netanyahu, Murdoch, Lindsey Graham, and Pete Hegseth. That seems like the right crew for this. Speaking of Anson Rubio, this is sort of a non sequitur, but I just thought you guys would like this. You see the St. Anselm poll from New Hampshire that just came out? They started doing 28 primaries on the Republican side, so they did Their last one in October. Since then, vance is at 46, but he's down 11 from October faves. No, no, this is the horse race on the Republican side. 46, 46%. He's down 11 because you know who's at 27? Marco Rubio, up 18 points.

[Tommy Vietor]

That makes me happy.

[Jon Favreau]

And then DeSantis is at five.

[Tommy Vietor]

Fight it out, boys.

[Jon Favreau]

DeSantis down two from the Arctoba poll and everyone else is in single digits, so. But that is interesting that the Vance and Rubio have switched a little bit. Trump also said on Monday he still wants Congress to send him another $200 billion of our tax dollars to. We've talked about why this should be an easy no vote for Democrats. Now it seems like some Republicans are also balking at the price tag. Senator John Kennedy says he won't vote for any amount of funding until Congress holds hearings on the war. Thom Tillis said that a $200 billion request would need to pass the Senate with 60 votes. And over in the House, Lauren Boebert said last week she's already a no on any additional war funding. So Trump and, you know, various pundits keep saying that Republican voters are fully behind this war. You think these Republicans in Congress are finally reading some of the same polling we are?

[Jon Lovett]

I just, I was struck by the Boebert statement because she said, I will not vote for a war supplemental. No. I am a no. I have already told leadership I am a no on any war supplementals. I am so tired of spending money elsewhere. I'm tired of the industrial war complex getting all of our hard earned tax dollars. And I was like, seeing that, I was like, wow, that is better than a lot of Democrats have been able to come out with and say clearly that there are no and any supplements. All these Democrats seem to be playing.

[Jon Favreau]

Gotta hand it to her.

[Jon Lovett]

Got it. But all these Democrats that are talking themselves into believing that this is a nuanced situation or it's complicated or you have to, you're not supporting the troops. Lauren Boebert managed to find her way to a statement that I agree with. I'm wondering why it's so hard for some of these other Democrats to do the same. But I didn't mean to take your question about Republicans and turn it to two Democrats, but it was what was on my mind.

[Tommy Vietor]

It sounded like authentic and emotional and real. It was a good answer. Why don't we just drop it in right here?

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

I will not vote for a war supplemental.

[Jon Lovett]

No. I am a no.

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

I've already Told leadership I am a no on any war supplementals. I am so tired of spending money elsewhere. I am tired of the industrial war complex getting all of our hard earned tax dollars. I have folks in Colorado who can't afford to live we need America first policies right now.

[Jon Lovett]

And that.

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

I'm not doing that.

[Tommy Vietor]

But yeah, I mean, look, this funding request went from like a rumored possibility to Politico had a leak of 50 billion. Now it's up to 200 billion. And I was very worried from the very beginning the Democrats would view this through that kind of like Iraq war lens about supporting the troops. And you heard Jake Tapper literally say that to Chris Murphy. Won't you be accused of not supporting the troops? But now we've gotten to the point where I think the war is going so badly, the number is so high that I think this is a political opportunity for Democrats and that we should not only loudly oppose it, but we should make it a big thing because voters do not want to spend 200 billion to drop bombs on Iran. There was some recent polling about funding. 56% of voters oppose more funding for the war, 41% strongly opposed, versus only 15% who strongly support. 61% of independents oppose more funding. And then CBS in their poll, like, 60% disapprove of the Iran war. 67% of Americans say we should not be willing to pay more for gas during the Iran war. So, like, people are not feeling the time for collective sacrifice message.

[Jon Favreau]

Also, that CBS poll, like, you know, they had recently polled on March 3rd. So just a couple weeks ago, war approval was 4,456 then. Now it's 40, 60. Also it mirrors Trump's approval and disapproval. Now, Trump's job approval in that poll was 40. Disapproval is 60. The argument just also released a poll as well that has very similar numbers to the CBS poll and all the other polls. But they also did a generic ballot test for the midterm and they have Democrats leading 54, 46. And if you do probably definitely vote likely voters 55, 45, that's 10 points that would be larger than the vote in 2018.

[Jon Lovett]

The Pentagon budget's already over a trillion dollars. Stories recently about at the end of the last fiscal year, they were racing to spend what money they had because there was more than they knew what to do with, including buying grand pianos and Herman Miller chairs for people. You also have Sean Duffy out there. We're gonna talk about what's happening at security at the airports. He had a collision at LaGuardia. You have FAA problems all across the country. Got Sean Duffy walking around begging for another 20 billion to fix the FAA to modernize air traffic control, recruit enough air traffic controls. We can't get that money through Congress, but Trump's gonna get $200 billion to pay for his war, basically to legalize it and authorize it after the fact. What are we doing?

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, they're already. I was thinking they would do this last week, and I think Besson started it over the weekend. And then Trump today was talking about it too, which is like, oh, you know, we need the 200 billion to sort of backfill for all the munitions that we've already used and for future threats, and we always need the money for our defense. And they're going to try to decouple this $200 billion war funding request from the war that they're asking.

[Jon Lovett]

The idea that this several weeks requires basically upping the pentagon budget by 20%. Outrageous. It's outrageous.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah. The thing you mentioned a minute ago, that the administration will try to argue that this funding request vote is de facto congressional authorization of the war. And everyone should just know that that is how your vote will be viewed by history. You will be like all these Democrats after 2004, 2003, trying to explain how, oh, actually we just voted to authorize George W. Bush to go to the UN to put more pressure on the Iraqis. No, you will be seen as voting for the war and for the funding. Fucking vote against it.

[Jon Favreau]

I will say hearing Lauren Boebert say that, knowing that there are other Republicans who are gonna be no's on this, like, I now feel more confident that Democrats are gonna vote the right way, even if some of them, at the very beginning of this process were thinking of maybe supporting it. Like, I don't know, I mean, explaining your vote is tough enough for, like, a $200 billion war funding request for a war that's not going well, that no one asked for. But, like, supporting that when Lauren Boebert voted no and a couple other Republicans, like, you know, I just don't see it.

[Tommy Vietor]

I hope so.

[Jon Favreau]

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[Jon Favreau]

if you're traveling in America anytime soon, here are a few fun developments you should probably be aware of. One, flights are much more expensive because the war in Iran has spiked fuel prices to obscene levels. So your, your, your ticket's gonna cost a lot more. Number two, you might end up waiting in the airport security line for more than four hours because Trump is now refusing to pay TSA agents unless Congress passes a bill that would require showing a passport or birth certificate to register to vote. And three, while waiting in that security line, you may see armed ICE agents in full tactical gear milling about the airport looking for something to do or someone to arrest. This last stroke of genius came from the President himself, who couldn't stop bragging about it to reporters on Monday.

[Donald Trump]

Mine. That was mine. That was like the paperclip. You know the story of the paperclip. 182 years ago, a man discovered the paperclip. It was so simple. And everybody that looked at it say, why didn't I think of that? ICE was my idea. They're able to now arrest illegals as they come into the country. That's very fertile territory. Now, you know, I'm a big believer that they should be able to wear masks when they go and hunt down, you know, murderous criminals and others. But for purposes of the airport, I've requested that they take off the mask. I don't like it for the airport, wear masks.

[Jon Favreau]

Not at the airport. But they need to do it when

[Jon Lovett]

they're out in the country.

[Donald Trump]

The people coming into the airport, typically speaking, aren't murderers, killers, drug dealers, etc. There may be a few of them, but there are many.

[Jon Favreau]

But they are coming in illegally because that is, that is the, the easiest way for people to come in illegally to the country is to just book a plane ticket, show up at the airport.

[Jon Lovett]

Well, I think he is in his, in his brain, in. There is some sort of a fact about how this one criticism of his border policies that a lot of people who come in through the country illegally are people who overstay their visas after coming through flying illegally.

[Jon Favreau]

Right.

[Jon Lovett]

You have to stay a while.

[Jon Favreau]

Skipping the overstaying part for sure.

[Jon Lovett]

No, I'm not saying it's a smart point that he's making.

[Jon Favreau]

So backstory here is that Democrats have been trying to fully fund TSA and all non immigration parts of DHS for a week now, Over a week now. Senate Republicans initially said no, they were blocking these bills, but then over the weekend, John Thune Reportedly called Trump and said that, you know, Republicans are ready to join Democrats in, like, funding everything except for ice. And then Thune said maybe that just Republicans would try to fund ICE with like, a party line reconciliation vote or something. You know, let's end this crisis. The airport lines are getting long. Whatever Trump says no to John Thune, he says that he will keep TSA and all of DHS closed unless Democrats pass the SAVE act and that he's deploying ICE agents to the airports. This seems like both a terrible idea and terrible politics. What do you guys think?

[Tommy Vietor]

Did you guys hear the, the backstory, the CNN report on the backstory of the ICE agents thing? Apparently it was. It was literally a random woman. A radio caller named Linda from Arizona pitched the idea to Clay Travis on his radio show Friday. Then Clay went on Fox News to talk about it. Trump must have seen that because he then announced his plan the next day. So that's inventing the paperclip.

[Jon Favreau]

And now. And now we have ICE agents just milling about the airport, the lot. The lines today are still just as long as they were. Why? Because they're not trained to be TSA agents. And so they're just walking. There's. You see these AP photos of them just, like, sitting there looking with, like, nothing to do.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah. They're just there. Preventing the floors from flying up and hitting the ceilings. The, The. This is sort of like we're at this place where. Oh, no, no, no, don't do that. It's too stupid. That's too stupid of a thing to think would help. They're not trained. They're not going to be able to do anything at the airport. They don't know how to use the machines. They're not. They haven't taken the training to scan what's in the documents. They don't even know how to read. Do the ID machine. Those machines seem complicated to me. They probably have to learn something for a while. They're just going to end up standing there. So we shouldn't do that. That's too stupid. But nobody is going to tell this guy. No, no. It's like, oh, great idea, Sir. Great idea. Mr. President, they're on their way. You say it's Sunday, we'll have them out. We'll have them out there at, at the airports by Monday. Doing what? It doesn't matter. It's what you wanted. And it's an image of the ICE agents there. And that's cool. You're doing something.

[Jon Favreau]

It's to, it's to own the Libs. Basically, Trump said. Trump said it drives Democrats crazy. That's what Jim Comer said. Republican in the House on the Sunday shows too. This is like a line that we're hearing now that it's driving the Democrats crazy having the ICE agents there. It's like rather they be in airports

[Tommy Vietor]

than like terrorizing communities. It's like, there's not gonna be no harm, but like, yeah, no, it's so.

[Jon Favreau]

So it's like let's get them doing

[Jon Lovett]

all kinds of tasks unre their duties, road cleanup, whatever you want.

[Jon Favreau]

So Democrats have been demanding to take ICE agents off the streets and to take their masks off. That's what you did.

[Tommy Vietor]

It's like, dude, we're getting Starbucks at LaGuardia now.

[Jon Lovett]

Like, okay, do a donut run for the TSA guys. Like, great. Like, stand there fudgeing. What are we doing here? The other, like, we're in this like purely symbolic fight too. Because what was before Trump added on top of it and we got to do save act and the trans people can't do sports if I'm not going to reopen the government. What was happening?

[Jon Favreau]

Utilization.

[Jon Lovett]

What was actually happening? The DHS was shut down. Right. But the reason Trump can deploy ICE is because ICE has this other pool of funding, a 75-80 billion dollars pool of funding that they're just gonna run off of. Right. So this is a symbolic effort to say we're not sending any more money to ice. That's why the government's shutting down. Then the negotiations are we'll open everything up but ice, Right. Even that will have no impact actually on ice. Democrats came out in favor of that. Republicans favor that. Trump doesn't want to do that. He wants to add all these things on top of it. It ironically. Right. Like any resolution that would have a positive impact on what ICE is able to do or not to would be the result of even more concessions on both sides over a negotiation of actually funding ice. The only way to actually limit what ICE will do in the next few years is through a negotiation that's not about not funding ice, that's actually about getting to funding ice. But just so far from where we're at right now, because we're having this sort of purely symbolic conversation about ICE in the airports and whether or not we'll let TSA agents get paid.

[Jon Favreau]

Well, now it's just, I mean, now Trump has just decided to own the whole thing. He's just decided to torpedo any chance of blaming anything on Democrats. Cuz he's like, you Know, John Thune, Ted Cruz was out there saying he would just fund tsa.

[Jon Lovett]

Like, I love to travel.

[Jon Favreau]

Exactly. Ted Cruz out there. And then, and then Trump's like, no, you gotta pass the SAVE Act. Which the Republicans. John Thune, in response, told a reporter, it's just not real. He's like, look, we all like the SAVE Act. Cause they're all supposed to say that, even though some of them probably don't wanna pass the SAVE act, because again, it would probably prevent a lot of Repub voters from registering to vote. But he said it's not realistic to tie the SAVE act to this funding battle. And you're actually seeing a couple, like, I saw one of the Ohio senators say this. Ted Cruz is saying it. So, like, I'm actually surprised, pleasantly. So that some Republicans are like, okay, this idea from Trump, little crazy, but I don't know. I don't know if it goes anywhere.

[Tommy Vietor]

I just keep thinking back to the Politico story from January about how Donald Trump's gonna travel the country weekly ahead of the midterms touting message. Now we're debating whether or not, like, we're going to co own the Strait of Hormuz with the Iranians and have ICE agents in the airport.

[Jon Lovett]

Like, they're.

[Jon Favreau]

So 500 extra dollars to fly to Cincinnati and you're going to wait for three hours at the airport. Welcome to the golden age.

[Tommy Vietor]

Did you guys watch the Tennessee thing today? The Tennessee event? He did.

[Jon Favreau]

Just the beginning.

[Tommy Vietor]

It was like a cabinet meeting in that, like there are all these staffers just kind of doing their ritualistic dick sucking. And like, at one point, I forget who it was. It was, it was Stephen Miller, like really went to town and Trump was like, well, I don't know if you can top that, Cash. And then Cash Patel was up and he did his little, you know, glazing session. It was, it's just terrible.

[Jon Lovett]

Trump said that Tommy Fur is an ad hoc blowjob as opposed to the more ritualistic and official time. I mean, he likes it off the books. Blowjob.

[Tommy Vietor]

It's a ritual. That's the whole deal.

[Jon Favreau]

The Trump also said that the Senate should kill the filibuster to pass the SAVE Act. They should cancel their Easter recess if necessary because this one's for Jesus to pass the SAVE Act.

[Jon Lovett]

Have you heard the good news?

[Tommy Vietor]

This one's for Jesus.

[Jon Lovett]

Pass the SAVE Act. Did he actually say this one's for Jesus?

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, he said, do it for Jesus. Do it for Jesus. Jesus would want you to present your passport or birth certificate to your local election office in order to register to vote by these midterms, which, again, is something that would probably disenfranchise not just Democratic voters, but plenty of Republican voters, which is probably why most Republicans in Congress don't really care that much about passing it. So that's where we are. I don't know how. I don't. Trump's just going to have to back down in this one because there's going to be pressure at the airports. There's going to be. The lines are going to be crazy. He doesn't have this Senate with him.

[Jon Lovett]

I think he caves. Like, he'll find a way to, like,

[Tommy Vietor]

look like IRGC guys are doing TSA security work.

[Jon Favreau]

Look, I was talking to the ayatollah.

[Jon Lovett]

They got some great ideas for what we can do to get these airports running more smoothly.

[Jon Favreau]

There's some security guys they can look us unfucking believable. Well,

[Jon Lovett]

raining revolutionary guy. And honestly, I think we'd all make sure there's no liquids in our backpacks. Yes.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah, I would do what they say.

[Jon Favreau]

The welcome message goes from Kristi Noem at the airports to the new the speaker of the Iranian Parliament. Yeah, Hot option. Fund it or not. Speaking of dhs, appears that they're gonna have a new secretary in place shortly. Rand Paul is the only Republican voting against Mark Wayne Mullen, and two Democrats are voting for him. We talked about John Federman voting yes, and as of Sunday, Martin Hinrich of New Mexico said he's voting yes. He said Mullen is a friend and will stand up to bullying by Stephen Miller. Hinrich also noted that in Mullen's confirmation hearing, he, quote, recognized the necessity of judicial warrants, which also supports. Reporting from the New York Times over the weekend that before his nomination, Mullen had been working behind the scenes with Democratic Congressman Josh Gottheimer to hash out a compromise on reopening DHS that included requiring judicial warrants in most cases. Wondering what you guys make of Mullen's relatively easy path to confirmation. Not just the yes votes from Fetterman and Heinrich, but just not a lot of intense opposition from the Democrats. Seems to be based partly on a belief that DHS will be slightly less chaotic and more humane under Mullen's leadership than it was under Noem and Lewandowski. What do you guys think?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, the Heinrich statement has a real kind of bros before hoes energy to it. So you gotta assume right, Mullen's getting through with Republican votes because Rand Paul was the Only, no, his vote mattered on the committee. Fetterman helped him get out of the committee, but he would have had the votes to get through. So I suppose the argument would be giving him a yes creates a relationship in which you have kind of a better opportunity to put pressure on and have real conversations with someone you worked with closely. But that also, I think, works so well with Rubio. I was about to say it depends on sort of ignoring what the actual reality is of the Trump administration and what happens once people are in there and the pressure they're under, because whatever relationship you had before, they become, no matter what they're saying behind the scenes, beholden to Stephen Miller and Donald Trump, the inability to be publicly critical of them, the inability to defy them, and all the consequences after that. And so you have people that have expressed their regrets about voting for Noem, and you have people that have expressed their regrets about voting for Rubio, yet not learning that lesson from their colleagues when they decide they're vote for this guy. So I think not holding the line against these people is always something people regret. Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

The consensus is that Kristi Noem was a disaster, and I think there's kind of been anybody but her vibe, even with Republicans. Also, senators tend to kind of coast through in these settings, so we'll see. I mean, I do think it's part policy, part personal, like he does. Mark Wayne Mullen does sound like he was genuinely willing to be more moderate than the Trump administration on judicial warrants. And also, it sounds like he has some genuinely good relationships, which is surprising because he did try to beat up a guy from the Teamsters at a hearing one time, but now that guy from the Teamsters is sitting behind him at his confirmation hearing because they're boys. Also, you know who else was there? Josh Gothammer. Yeah. Democrat from New Jersey. And so, like, this sounds ridiculous, but he runs a popular workout group.

[Jon Favreau]

He does.

[Tommy Vietor]

For members of Congress and senators.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, he's teaching a Pilates class.

[Tommy Vietor]

I've heard members talk about this and that. It's really good.

[Jon Lovett]

Exhale through the dry. Through the dry phase. That's a reference. That's a. That's.

[Tommy Vietor]

Don't even worry about it.

[Jon Favreau]

Just for the three of us. Literally no one else for us.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's right, Christy. Wow.

[Jon Favreau]

And so I just.

[Tommy Vietor]

There's some personal politics here.

[Jon Lovett]

He's right, though.

[Tommy Vietor]

He's gonna be a disaster.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, he's gonna be a disaster. But he spotted them. He's helped them really kind of crush their lats and their delts it's not even like.

[Jon Favreau]

It's not even a personality thing. Why he could be like. When he's a dhs, there's one way to lose his job, and it's by pissing off Stephen Miller and Donald Trump and the senators can't hurt him anymore once he's at dhs. Right now, they can. They can cost him the nomination. Right. But once he gets there, it doesn't really matter. So. So. But look, I think if you wanted to make the better argument for why you don't put up a fight is you can only fight so many things. He has the Republican votes anyway. And so, like, what are you gonna do? You're gonna do. You know, it seemed impossible to strike down this nomination. I do think what you can do. The more important thing is in these negotiations to reopen DHS and Esmond's getting confirmed, you try to codify the rules about a judicial warrant or all this other stuff, which is. Was the reason that the Democrats tried to use DHS funding as leverage in the first place, as you mentioned. And now we've come so far afield that we've got ICE agents running around the airports. Speaking of Lewandowski, Dan and I briefly mentioned the NBC story about him openly demanding bribes from a private prison company. On Saturday, the Times also published a big investigation into Lewandowski's time at the department that is just full of enraging details. On Monday, Democrats on the House Oversight Committee launched an investigation into the bribery allegations. What do you guys think? Good use of time and energy if Dems get the House back.

[Jon Lovett]

Yes, it's a shocking, brazen corruption scheme where people are either obliquely or directly suggesting that if you want a government contract, Corey Lewandowski has to get his bequet. They all deny it, but they have a lot of lot of sources, including sources at the White House, that are validating this story. I don't remember if it was NBC or in the Times, but I thought one telling point was people inside the White House or inside the administration considering whether or not to do an investigation or take some kind of action, are worried that if they do, Trump will publicly come out in defense of Lewandowski.

[Jon Favreau]

This was my concern that I expressed on Friday's pod.

[Jon Lovett]

It's crazy.

[Jon Favreau]

You know, I was like, let's not maybe. Let's not talk about it until after Trump leaves office. If we're gonna go after Lewandowski, maybe everyone should just quiet down until he can't pardon him anymore.

[Jon Lovett]

Right? The pardons loom over the Whole thing. And then there's the fact that, that Lewandowski seems to be getting the Presidential Daily Brief. That is absolutely nuts.

[Tommy Vietor]

That blew my mind.

[Jon Lovett]

He's basically a volunteer government employee getting the pdb.

[Tommy Vietor]

He's not a full time employee. And he's getting the pdb and he's holding meetings in Kristi Noem's office when she's not around. Doing a lot of things in her office when she's around. I think go after him. Whether or not we're able to prosecute this guy, I don't know. Maybe there'll be a state charge we can go after. But put a fucking head on a pike, man. Like do some oversight. Try to scare some other people out of doing this. Because like we've talked about a lot of newfangle corruption here. There's the Emiratis buying your barely existing, you know, crypto company. Or like selling some Melania coin to somebody.

[Jon Favreau]

Forgets the Qatari's giving you a jet. The jet didn't. Didn't get the return on that investment.

[Tommy Vietor]

No, no, they did not. They could have used that jet.

[Jon Favreau]

Here's the jet. Make sure, make sure everything goes our way.

[Alyssa Mastromonaco]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

Heads up by. Heads up, by the way.

[Donald Trump]

Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

Hope it's bulletproof.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, we'll send up. We'll send you. So we'll send some over to fix the fucking Rosewood Qatar.

[Jon Favreau]

Can they get a fucking refund on that?

[Jon Lovett]

I got some. I got some good guys for countertops to fix the Fairmont.

[Tommy Vietor]

Unbelievable. The Lewandowski stuff is. It's such old school corruption. Like I need a kickback. I need to be a special advisor on the contract for this. Like, fuck that.

[Jon Favreau]

You know, when Trump White House officials are going on background to NBC and being like, this was brazen and crazy. We didn't like this for sure. And even Trump is apparent, apparently annoyed with Lewandowski, which maybe he won't give him the part.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's why it's like, let's not assume he's going to pardon everybody. Like, maybe he will, maybe he won't. But like make him do it.

[Jon Lovett]

Oh yeah, I don't. I think you're right. Like if he does pardon him, he pardons him.

[Tommy Vietor]

But we gotta just.

[Jon Lovett]

We have to live. That's a concession to him before we've even begun.

[Tommy Vietor]

You gotta go into it, get the documents.

[Jon Lovett]

This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Whether you're dealing with anxiety, depression, conflict in relationships, or simply need an impartial third party to help you deal with daily stress, betterhelp is there to connect you with the support you need. I want my third parties partial. That's what I prefer.

[Jon Favreau]

I don't want them just judging me.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

I actually think objective standard, I think

[Jon Lovett]

the ideal therapist is partial. That's part of what it is. They're. They're partial to you. Yeah. They're. Yeah, they're on your side.

[Jon Favreau]

That's what you're paying them for.

[Jon Lovett]

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[Erin Ryan]

the country feels like it's falling apart right before our eyes and the people inside it are being silenced. So we're going to East 26th street and Nicollet Avenue, which is way where Alex Preddy was executed by ICE and Border Patrol. That is not a headline. That is a human life and it is all happening right now. Do you worry about your own safety being involved in all this?

[Leah Littman]

Yes.

[Jon Lovett]

But it doesn't really feel like there's another option, you know.

[Alyssa Mastromonaco]

And of course they use a 5 year old child as bait. And of course they're doing all these horrible bad things because they don't know what they're doing. They've been told that they're going to get rid of the worst of the worst, then they have absolute immunity. And they've been told that nothing they do will they ever be held accountable for.

[Erin Ryan]

On my show, Runaway country, we go where the headlines hit home. From communities under threat to the people fighting to be heard. New episodes of Runaway country drop every Thursday. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts or watch on YouTube.

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

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[Jon Favreau]

on the topic of Democratic strategy, Wall Street Journal has a big story about a possible revolt brewing against Chuck Schumer from within the Senate Democratic Caucus. It leads with an anecdote about Chris Murphy musing over a dinner about the number of senators who want new leadership. Goes on to say that Murphy, Tina Smith and Elizabeth Warren are part of a group known as Fight Club, who complain about Schumer on a signal group chat, particularly his strategy of favoring more centrist candidates in the midterm primaries. What do you guys think of this piece?

[Jon Lovett]

So Murphy then says, actually, that's misremembering what the conversation was. In fact, what I was simply saying is while there are people that are frustrated, Schumer has supported the caucus and I support support Schumer.

[Jon Favreau]

There's something Elizabeth Warren was less so.

[Tommy Vietor]

Less so? No, for sure.

[Jon Favreau]

She was like, I'm not going to say whether I support him or not.

[Jon Lovett]

Here's what I got to the end of it, right? And I think, like, the idea that he's supporting more centrist candidates I do think is like a new line of criticism or newer than some of the others. But the rest go back to the shutdown and his ability to communicate. And what I can tell is, according to people that have a problem with Chuck Schumer, would a different leader produce different outcomes, or would a different leader be a better communicator about the same outcomes? And I think the inability to like, kind of clearly answer that question is why whatever friction there is or desire for a new leader culminates in just people bitching in a signal group chat.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah, there's like the inside game and the outside game, right? Like the inside stuff we don't really see. It's like how he keeps members on sides and organizes things and deals with the caucus. Like, there are Democrats, there are senators who we like and respect will call you after this episode probably, and say, chuck's really good at that stuff. The outside stuff. Like, we see the media, the candidate recruitment, the fundraising, the. Clearly, Chuck Schumer is not the best messenger. And I think he would concede that. And he's tried to put forward other younger leaders, but that kind of meets leads to the question, well, why not just have one of them be the leader? Right. The fundraising is clearly off. I think that the candidate recruitment is a thing that's bothered a lot of people because it feels like. Like he's thumbing the scale in ways in states that is unnecessary if not antagonistic to voters. Like, let those voters in those states decide. And it makes you wonder if this is about who can really win in these states or who will endorse Chuck Schumer as leader in these states if they win. Because a lot of the new members are not doing that. And so there's also the basic, like, gerontocracy issues. Like, the guy's really old. And like, he was able to recognize that with Joe Biden. Chuck Schumer famously, right, drove to Delaware, told Joe Biden to drop out. H was the reason behind that. But he's not willing to look in the mirror there. And like, I do think you're right, though. The counter argument is people are really mad about Donald Trump. They want someone to blame. So you blame the leaders we have, but that doesn't necessarily take into account their actual capacity to stop Donald Trump when he has a trifecta. Could someone do more with the same cards? I don't know.

[Jon Favreau]

To me, they this boils down to one question, which is like, I do not expect anyone to oust Chuck Schumer between now and November, nor do I think ousting Chuck Schumer between now and November would lead to any kind of appreciable difference in any of the outcomes for Democrats. I do think, and I remember having this conversation with Dan on some pod probably many times, like, if, you know, if the Democrats don't take back the Senate Senate, then you'd almost expect Democrats to have a new leader right between 26 and 28. But he was like Dan said, oh, but if we win, if Democrats somehow win the Senate, then maybe Schumer stays on and his majority leader one last time until he potentially retires in 28. Or something else that I think is worth a serious conversation about. Even if tenant Democrats, even if Democrats win the Senate is Chuck Schumer really the guy that you want to be leader between the midterms and the presidential. Because like, I think that is a perfect time for a new leader. And you don't have to, and you don't have to go back and, you know, debate whether you could have had this outcome or that outcome based on the various shutdown things and all that. All you have to say is like, look, we are heading towards 28 is the most important thing to elect a Democratic president. We need our best messengers out there as leaders and Chuck Schumer is getting up there. And do we really need two more years, let alone six more years of Chuck Schumer as Democratic leader at that point?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, I think it's like a no brainer. We do not want to go into the most important presidential election since the last one with a leader that represents like, we need to be representing change. He will not represent change. Ironically though, I think it's Senate, Democratic Senate candidates In at least 13 states have either come out against Chuck Schumer or refuse to endorse Schumer. The more successful we are in these midterms, the more people that will be in the Senate that have either explicitly said they will not support him or even under pressure knowing that they want Schumer's support. People like Talrico have refused to say they would endorse him. Now, I think at a certain point you want people that are willing to just say, no, I'm not gonna be for Chuck Schumer. We need somebody different. Just because that's the kind of like, I don't know, want people that are already worrying about how to kind of keep everybody on side. But at the very least, he has a huge problem in success or failure.

[Jon Favreau]

And look, I think that the complaints about the recruitment, it goes both ways. I think Chuck Schumer getting Roy Cooper to run in North Carolina, when maybe he didn't want to at first was a big win. Getting Mary Piltola in Alaska to run, great. Now if he wanted to recruit Haley Stevens in Michigan and Janet Mills in Maine, that's fine. It's not the recruitment necessarily. It's the putting your thumb on the scales, which he may not be explicitly, but he couldn't be. Certainly for Mills.

[Tommy Vietor]

He is Janet Mills. Like, yeah, I think actually recruiting Janet Mills is great and a coup for him and credit to him. But yeah, they formed a joint fundraising committee with the DSCC and Haley Stevens is similar. Like, I think there's a lot of good candidates in that field. It is not clear to me that she is the strongest candidate by any means, but I'm almost positive that there have been, like, DSCC or party events and fundraisers that have included her or her campaign. And you just have to wonder why.

[Jon Favreau]

And I will say that this is not. I mean, Chuck Schumer gets a lot of the blame for this, but, you know, you wade into the online wars, and there's a lot of Democratic strategists out there who just. Who are just assuming. Assuming that Mills and Stevens are the most electable candidates and the strongest candidates in those races. And it's like, not even a question to them. And I'm like, really? Are you that sure? Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

And that's my take. Like, everyone's gonna be like, oh, you guys are, you know, endorsing Grand Platter. No, like, we're saying, let the voters of Maine vote. Let people in Michigan vote. That will help us determine who the strongest candidate is. If you can't win the primary, you're probably not the strongest candidate.

[Jon Favreau]

Have a. Just. Have a. Just a. Just a dose of humility. After you've worked on several of the presidential campaigns over the last decade that have come up a little short is what I would say. Speaking of giving Democratic leadership a glow up, Lauren Egan at the Bulwark is out with a piece headlined Thirst Traps over Think Tanks. Dems want hotter candidates on the ballot. She has a bunch of Democrats musing to her about how we need more lookers. We need hotter candidates like Jon Ossoff and AOC on the ballot. Tommy, you recently referred to Ossoff as a piece of ass on the show. Agree with Lauren.

[Tommy Vietor]

I stand by that. I'll say it again. He's a piece of ass. Look, the man's way taller in person than I expected. He's got a jawline that you could use as a ruler. Great hair, great demeanor, great hair. Look.

[Jon Lovett]

Legs that go all the way up.

[Tommy Vietor]

Legs that go all the way up is the key to winning. Run more hot people, like the article says. Maybe counterpart point Donald Trump.

[Jon Favreau]

I know, I know.

[Tommy Vietor]

Not hot.

[Jon Favreau]

Not hot.

[Jon Lovett]

I think we look. I think there's a big space between someone between, say, a Hollywood 10 and a Delaware 86. You know what I'm saying? And the problem, right?

[Jon Favreau]

Like, there's, like, talk about Dan, like that there's a strange.

[Jon Lovett]

There's a strange, like, the way, like, hotness and ideology. Like, there are, like, the. Like Bernie beloved figure, right? I'd say he's look, you know, I don't think you would Call him traditionally hot. You know, right now, where he's at now, maybe he's a young man, still handsome. He's handsome, yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

He's seen some of those pictures.

[Jon Lovett]

He's handsome, he's handsome. But Pete Hegseth would be traditionally considered to be good looking. One would say. I don't find him particularly. He's not hot. To me.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. I think it's like one asset out of many. Right. Like you can clearly, clearly you can win the presidency without being hot. Donald Trump. Trump. But I do think because.

[Jon Lovett]

Because he's so charming, you know, And

[Jon Favreau]

I think Lauren cites in her piece, there's like political science around this. That attractiveness does help candidates. Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

You know who was hot? Saddam Hussein. Look at Google. Young Saddam. He could get it. Castro, famously hot.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, you could.

[Tommy Vietor]

It can help you guys.

[Jon Lovett]

Is his son in Canada elected?

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, yeah. Or now with Katy Perry.

[Tommy Vietor]

Take the couple. But maybe you're a bad leader. There is some truth to this, right? I mean, like, how many times have you had friends in your life who are just normies who would be like, oh yeah, Gavin Newsom, he's the good looking one. Or whatever.

[Jon Favreau]

Many have said Barack Obama clearly benefited

[Tommy Vietor]

from being perceived as young and good looking and cool. And that was part of the appeal. Bill Clinton as well.

[Jon Favreau]

John Ossoff has clearly has had a glow up, no doubt, over the last several years.

[Tommy Vietor]

It is funny that no one in the story would go on the record saying that AOC is hot. There's like sort of a reverse gender thing.

[Jon Favreau]

People are so clear.

[Tommy Vietor]

She is beautiful.

[Jon Favreau]

Yes.

[Tommy Vietor]

And I don't know why, like weird for people to say that. It's just a compliment.

[Jon Favreau]

I get, I get that people don't want to like objectify her and there's gender, but like she's. Yeah, she's beautiful.

[Tommy Vietor]

Objectify John Ossoff and I have no problem. What does that say?

[Jon Lovett]

I think. Right. I think it's sort of in the context of our conversation. But I think if you don't know what the article is and someone's like, talk about it.

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

Hey. Hi.

[Jon Lovett]

I'm a journalist from the Bulwark. Talk about AOC's appearance. No, thank you. Let me know how the goes.

[Tommy Vietor]

Really funny.

[Jon Lovett]

We could talk about it here because we're giving ourselves the context of saying all the guys are hot until it gets clipped.

[Tommy Vietor]

The guys are hot.

[Jon Lovett]

All the guys are just look at all these eminently fuckable guys.

[Tommy Vietor]

Bernie's best asset is.

[Jon Favreau]

How did you feel sitting across from Josh Shapiro?

[Jon Lovett]

What? Look, I'LL just say I asked him about this. I think there's a lot of Jewish mothers that would love to have their daughters bring home a guy like Josh. Handsome knows how to dribble a basketball.

[Jon Favreau]

Does he?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah. Okay.

[Tommy Vietor]

Do you guys play hoops? Play a quick game on hoops. Obviously it came up in the book.

[Jon Lovett]

Did not come up in the actual experience.

[Tommy Vietor]

Okay.

[Jon Favreau]

It would have been the interview, though.

[Jon Lovett]

When I was on the fourth grade basketball team, I didn't have the arm strength. I could get the ball high enough to hit the hoop, and I can obviously pitch it forward, but I couldn't get that parabola going.

[Jon Favreau]

Right. Probably because you were thinking you needed to get a parabola going.

[Tommy Vietor]

And that's our March Madness coverage.

[Jon Favreau]

Did you guys see that? JB Pritzker spoke at the gridiron dinner,

[Jon Lovett]

and he's on the shot.

[Jon Favreau]

Do you hear his joke that he

[Jon Lovett]

puts the gov in wegovy?

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, he puts the gov in wegovy.

[Tommy Vietor]

Good for him.

[Jon Favreau]

Good joke.

[Tommy Vietor]

Good for him. Here's the thing. Every time I read an article about the gridiron, and it's like. And then the journalist did something. Something set to the Something from Chicago.

[Jon Lovett]

I'm like, how is this a thing

[Tommy Vietor]

that still exists in the world?

[Jon Lovett]

The sketches part of that event is insane.

[Jon Favreau]

It's crazy.

[Tommy Vietor]

A bunch of journalists get together with. With politicians, and they make up skits and songs and they perform them. It's like, what the Is happening?

[Jon Favreau]

It's white tie.

[Jon Lovett]

White.

[Tommy Vietor]

What is white tie even?

[Jon Favreau]

It just means tails, I guess, Right? It's.

[Jon Lovett]

It's the most. It's a long, longer coat with tails. Supposed to. Technically, you're supposed to have a different kind of shoe. You can't have a hat. It's not a tux.

[Jon Favreau]

You would have to.

[Jon Lovett]

That's. That's a dinner jacket.

[Jon Favreau]

You would have to drug me to go to that event. You'd have to. You'd have to maduro me to go there.

[Jon Lovett]

You just. Yeah, you just. You just wake up in.

[Jon Favreau]

In white tails at a tux. Like, what's going on?

[Tommy Vietor]

That's a maternal me do. How did I get force? Guys kick down your door, and all of a sudden you're gridiron.

[Jon Favreau]

Here, put this on.

[Alyssa Mastromonaco]

Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

Watching. You're John's hog guide.

[Jon Favreau]

You're gonna watch Lynn Sweet sing.

[Tommy Vietor]

Worst of all, we're the. We're a pro Lynn Sweet podcast.

[Jon Favreau]

For sure. For sure. Sweet. The first person who came to mind the gridiron.

[Jon Lovett]

A lot of these traditions began before television.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

And it used to be at night, it just got dark in your house and maybe you'd read a book and so people went out more. Yeah, you know, gridiron.

[Jon Favreau]

Okay, I'm gonna get yelled at this. My segue to this next section was ruined by our conversation. So I'm just gonna say on the subject of the midterms.

[Jon Lovett]

Great, perfect.

[Jon Favreau]

If, hey, if we can't. If we can't find hot candidates, this is not to say that we don't have plenty of hot candidates running in the midterms. It's a good time to remind everyone about Project 218, which is Vote Save America's big push to help take the House back again with candidates who are hot, not hot, anywhere in between. To recap, we're asking you to get five people, you know to sign up for VSA so that they can get the best info about how to make the biggest difference. We've had more than 3,000 signups so far, but we need more. Head to votesaveamerica.com to learn more. And while you're at it, one more plug here. Do you know the next? No. Kings Day is this Saturday, March 28th. There are thousands of events to attend, and as we've seen, it's. It's very, very important to show up and be counted and be heard. So head to nokings.org to find an event near you. Make a plan to go, bring friends, post some pictures, send you.

[Jon Lovett]

So that'll be a sign. We'll see some of that.

[Jon Favreau]

I told you.

[Jon Lovett]

Regime change begins at home.

[Jon Favreau]

If you've kept Your sign from 2004 about Bush and the Iraq war, you can dust it off and bring. Regime change begins at home. I think. Think I've. I still think it's like a bumper sticker. I think that my in laws have it.

[Tommy Vietor]

It's a sad but very true statement.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, it's been around for a long time. All right, one last thing before we get to Levitt's conversation with Leah. We gotta talk about Donald Trump dancing on Robert Robert Mueller's grave.

[Jon Lovett]

We do.

[Jon Favreau]

After the news on Saturday that the former FBI director and special counsel died at 81 after a fight with Parkinson's disease, Trump and his White House posted the following statement. Good. I'm glad he's dead. He can no longer hurt innocent people. Incredibly, that wasn't the only depraved comment Trump made involving death and one of his perceived enemies. When he was asked Monday morning about the resignation of his former counterterrorism chief, Joe Kent, the President said, quote, I'm not a fan of the guy. His wife was killed, he remarried fairly quickly. I feel like Trump might not be a good person. What do you think? Have we all just grown numb to this now?

[Tommy Vietor]

Just, just real quick. Joe Kent's wife was killed while serving the US Military in Syria by a suicide bomber. So that's the context y in which he made that comment.

[Jon Favreau]

Got married too quickly, just like he said that about Thomas Massie. This is from a guy who would bring a date to Melania's funeral. Yeah, for sure, 100%.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah. Walker by the golf course grave of his previous wife. That's where I put that one. One.

[Jon Favreau]

I saw Trump's comment and I was like, my first reaction was, you know, Bob Mueller died and now like, all of the stories about his death have to include the President of the United States issuing this jackass fucking comment. So here, family and friends have to all deal with that. Number two. And now everyone's gonna do like the Charlie. Of course, we all lived through the Charlie Kirk thing. And JD Vance just told people to fire, you know, people who worked for them and who, you know, celebrated Charlie Kirk's death. And, you know, there was a whole government wide effort to hunt down people and cost them their jobs over potentially celebrating or not grieving properly for Charlie Kirk. And now we're doing this again.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah. Can I. And I, I feel like it's actually very. Been quite helpful to be consistent through all of this, which is not celebrating any deaths.

[Jon Favreau]

Right.

[Jon Lovett]

And, and by the way, like, not. Not celebrating death is not an act of civility. I'm not saying I feel happy when my enemies die, but I pretend not to as a means of projecting the morals I think we should have. I'm not judging people for what they're actually feeling. My feeling what I see when people kind of celebrate someone's death is actually like when someone dies and they did bad things. I'm not talking about people that are actively in the midst of doing horrible things. Their death relieves people of pain and abuse and tyrants, what, whatever. But like, to celebrate someone you don't like dying is to act as if dying is a kind of justice, that they're getting justice. But that can't be true because everybody dies. And what you're really doing, when you celebrate the death of your enemies, you're actually just avoiding facing the injustice that happened when they were alive. You're coping with the fact that you don't believe they faced what they deserved when they walked among the living and so I think about what happens when Donald Trump will inevitably die. And there will be a. A crazy debate befitting Donald Trump in which our whole country is sort of caught up in this very kind of notion of is it okay that people are happy that he's dead? And celebrating in the streets feel like that.

[Jon Favreau]

That Bob Mueller tweet from Trump will be back in the rotation when this happens.

[Jon Lovett]

But. But the truth is, I think a lot of what will. People will be feeling that kind of, like, will be a kind of a. A grief about all the damage that was done and our failure to stop it and to get justice when somebody was walking around. And so, like, to celebrate death is to act as if it won't come for all of us. And. And that's just bad for the soul and it's bad for the world. And so I. I just want no part of it. Whoever dies. That's my. That was my take on this.

[Jon Favreau]

And they might. They might express that feeling with, like, a party hat and one of those, like, you know, but, like, that's what they're thinking.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, I'm not. Look, I'm not gonna say I'm gonna go out.

[Leah Littman]

Look, I.

[Jon Favreau]

Look, you've been consistent on this. Like, you took a day off when the ayatollah was killed. You didn't come in that day. And I think that's, you know, that's command.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, look, I.

[Jon Favreau]

You were grieving.

[Jon Lovett]

I laid. Yeah. Stop myself.

[Tommy Vietor]

I'm stopping. You see those tweets go through, and you're just like, we. You just know the cycle we're all gonna go through.

[Jon Favreau]

I know.

[Tommy Vietor]

It's so. It's like, so exhausting. It's, like, exhausting.

[Jon Lovett]

He.

[Tommy Vietor]

You know what? I'm at the. I'm at this point where I'm like, say what you want to say. I guess, like, he's the biggest. He's the worst person in the world. He happens to be our president. He's dancing on the grave of, like, a Purple Heart winning, you know, American citizen who served as FBI director. That's self evidently terrible. You know, the hypocrisy is exhausting. Like, you know, Fox News did a month of coverage of Charlie Kirk insults, and yet Fox, as far as I can tell, like, did not air a single story about Donald Trump's tweet. And then, you know, the Daily Wire today unironically had up a story with the headline, redhead deja vu. Sarah Sanders kicked out of Arkansas Restaurant flipped off by staff. For those who were. Who aren't as terminally online as we are. In 2018, a restaurant called the Red Hen asked Sarah Huckabee Sanders to leave the restaurant because there were a bunch of, I think, LGBT employees who didn't want to serve her. And this became a huge thing.

[Jon Favreau]

Right?

[Tommy Vietor]

So, like, the civility. Please come out whenever Democrats do anything to Republicans, and they're silent when Republicans do things to Democrats. And it's just like, it's so exhausting and frustrating to even have to call out hypocrisy. And I just. I don't know.

[Jon Lovett]

The thing that I thought was interesting about this one, and this is similar to one about Rob Reiner, is it is so indefensible. So what you end up with is a lot of anger and outrage at Trump's direction and all these people deflecting. But I saw, like, Brit Hume said something which was like, this is what makes people not just oppose Trump, but hate Trump. And I think that's true.

[Tommy Vietor]

It is true.

[Jon Lovett]

But even that is kind of like, this is bad strategy. This is bad politics. And actually, what this also does is prove all the people that oppose him and hate him that they're right and that really, you've done something terrible by embracing someone so obviously morally unfit, so kind of broken in his soul, forgotten

[Tommy Vietor]

about the Rob Reiner thing. Jesus, there's so many examples like this.

[Jon Favreau]

And it's also like, it is. I think it is tempting for those people to be like, oh, he says things and he's an asshole. But, like, no, no, no. The same thing in Trump that makes him post that about Bob Mueller or about Rob Reiner is the thing that makes him talk about war right now in Iran as, like, we like sinking the ships the Navy loves. It's fun to sink the ships and we'll bomb the moor, and it's funny, and we're gonna kill another one. And like, when you. Someone who devalues human life, like Trump obviously does, who has the power that Trump has? Who has his finger on the fucking button? Yeah, that's it all. It's all connected, guys. Can't separate it.

[Jon Lovett]

How many of you have quoted Margaret Thatcher saying, character is destiny? I stupidly internalize that, that. I've come to believe that there's truth in that. That character is destiny. That over time, your character reveals something important about you and becomes what your life amounts to. I actually stupidly thought you agreed, quoting

[Tommy Vietor]

the Iron lady for some reason.

[Jon Favreau]

The thing that got me even angrier was, do you see Scott Besant getting asked about it? On Meet the Press.

[Jon Lovett]

Incredible.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, my God. Oh, he'll get. So he's. She, you know, Welker asks him about it, and he's like, well, I think people have to understand what Bob Mueller put Donald Trump through.

[Tommy Vietor]

Through. I mean.

[Jon Favreau]

And she's like, I'm sorry, but what do you agree with the statement? She's like, I think that people just need. All he could say is he put through Trump a lot. Like the fact that you're like a fucking grown man who had a real like. And this is what you're reduced to sitting on Meet the Press and, like, just. Just dismissing this.

[Tommy Vietor]

The Trump administration made Bob Mueller the special counsel, too. You guys selected him. It's just, you know, look, what. What Trump said about Bob Mueller, what he said about Joe Kent, it's sort of like, equally despicable. And the common thread is those were people who opposed Donald Trump in some way, and Joe Kent, as of, like, five days ago, was Donald Trump's employee. And just like, you know, it doesn't matter what Bob Mueller did to Donald Trump over the course of several years of an investigation. It's binary. It's like, you're with me or you're against me.

[Jon Favreau]

I got a little excited. Maybe I shouldn't. Thinking about someone, some journalist sitting down with J.D. vance and starting the question by reminding him of what he said after Charlie Kirk died and what he said about people who were celebrating and then asking him about Trump and Bob Mueller and seeing what JD Van says, see how he gets out of peace.

[Tommy Vietor]

Slippery prick.

[Jon Favreau]

He'll start scolding and be, yeah, this

[Jon Lovett]

is what you want to talk about. With everything else that's going on, it

[Jon Favreau]

can't just be a shouted question because he'll just, you know, I want, like, a good. A good sit down with someone where he's, like, stuck for 20 minutes with you.

[Jon Lovett]

I like. I. It's just like, you're right that it kind of needs to. Almost like you maybe it does at this point, need to be actually explained why rooting for people's death is bad. Maybe we do need collectively to actually talk about it more.

[Tommy Vietor]

No, I like that I'm with you. I think it's bad, too.

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

Do.

[Jon Lovett]

No, I know you do.

[Jon Favreau]

That's what. Yeah, we were. We were all there for Charlie Kirk and we got pleasure.

[Jon Lovett]

But it's almost like I actually want the con. I want someone to talk to J.D. vance about, like, the worth of a human soul and, like, what happens after we die and what we root. Like, what is the purpose of being alive and like who gets to be celebrated and what lives are worthy. It's just that we're at like a kind of first principles thing because the President United States is a moral monster.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. And a whole bunch of people are working for him. Alright, when we come back from the break, strict scrutinies. Leah Littman. Pod Save America is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. What's the latest trend in hiring? Skills based hiring which emphasizes capabilities over education and direct experience. Who needs education anymore? According to experts, this leads to faster hiring and better job performance. If you're an employer who's adopted skills based hiring, the best way to ensure that your applicants have the right skills skills is ZipRecruiter. ZipRecruiter recommends smart screening questions to help you hone in on that perfect match for your role. And right now you can try it for [e-mail] Crooked ZipRecruiter's powerful matching technology finds qualified candidates fast. You can easily add ZipRecruiter screening questions to your job post so you get the highest quality applicants. Want to see who's recently active? ZipRecruiter's filters can show you. No wonder ZipRecruiter is the number one rated hiring site based on G2. Let ZipRecruiter help you find amazing candidates with the skills you see. Four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. And now you can try it for free at ziprecruiter.com crooked that's ziprecruiter.com crooked meet your match on ZipRecruiter. Quick question.

[Leah Littman]

Are you politically engaged and spiritually exhausted if you said yes to both? Welcome home. I'm Erin Ryan. And I'm Alyssa Mastromonaco. And we're the hosts of Hysteria, the podcast for women who care about democracy, culture and not losing their minds in the process. We break down the news, call out the nonsense, and spotlight the women actually

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fighting back on Capitol Hill, in classrooms and everywhere. The stakes are high.

[Leah Littman]

It's sharp, honest analysis featuring women's voices with humor and zero hand holding.

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[Leah Littman]

podcasts and watch full full episodes on YouTube.

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[Jon Lovett]

joining me now to discuss today's Supreme Court hearing on mail in voting is strict Scrutiny's Leah Littman. Leah, welcome back to the pod.

[Leah Littman]

Thanks for having me.

[Jon Lovett]

So the Supreme Court heard oral arguments today for Watson v. Rnc. It's an elections case where the Republican National Committee is arguing that federal law prohibits ballots received after Election Day from being counted even if they're postmarked before or on Election Day. Can you tell us a bit about how this case reached the court and what the RNC is arguing?

[Leah Littman]

Sure. So the RNC brought this case challenging a Mississippi statute that allows the state to count ballots that are cast that is postmarked on or by Election Day, so long as they're received within five days of Election Day. A lower court trial judge said, get the fuck out of here. Right. That argument is ludicrous. It would literally call into question early voting, election law practices for the last 200 years, et cetera. And then the geniuses on the US Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit, three of Donald Trump's Court of Appeals appointees said, you know what? Actually, federal law does make it illegal to count absentee ballots that are received after Election Day. That theory would destabilize election laws in more than half the states, I think 29 some states. And so because their ruling had such sweeping implications, the Supreme Court basically had to take this case. And that's how it got up here. The argument is federal law that just says the Tuesday next after the first Monday in November is established as the day for the election. Their theory is that federal law makes it illegal for states to count ballots that are cast by Election Day but not received until a few days after.

[Jon Lovett]

And part of this is grappling with whether or not that would also mean votes cast before Election Day would be counted. Also, it's not clear if Election Day is the day. If you can count votes, say after midnight. If you turn into a gremlin. If you count votes after midnight, I

[Leah Littman]

mean they are gremlins. So I think that's kind of non unique, but sure.

[Jon Lovett]

Now are the officials in Mississippi defending this case not also Republicans?

[Leah Littman]

They are. And part of what is so striking is that you have the prospect that both the federal government and I think at least three justices, three Republican appointees, if not more, are more anti voting rights than the state of Mississippi, that is the state of our union.

[Jon Lovett]

So there was some desensus between the conservatives justices. What was the kind of arguments you were hearing from say Alito and Thomas versus what you were hearing from, say Kavanaugh and Barrett?

[Leah Littman]

So Alito, Thomas and Gorsuch seemed to be totally moga pilled, like their brains had just been marinating in Fox News and were regurgitating anti absentee ballot talking points. So Justice Alito referred to, you know, the confidence you can have once you turn your ballot over to the postal service and whatnot. Honestly, Justice Kavanaugh sounded like he was more in that camp than in the middle. So he was throwing out concerns about if the apparent winner the morning after the election ends up losing due to late arriving ballots, won't that undermine confidence? And shouldn't we fashion a rule based on that? Again eating up the kind of talking points from the 2020 presidential election. And then you had Justices Barrett and the chief saying some of that, but then also saying, well, federal government rnc. Wouldn't your theory also call into question the ability of people to cast early ballots early in person voting? Wouldn't it also call into question why states can even continue to count ballots after election day even if they were received on or before election day? Like why does it have to be that receipt happens on or before election day, but nothing else has to happen then? Like that's just nonsensical. So they seem to be the ones that are going to dictate the outcome in that case. And I will breathe a sigh of relief if they end up rejecting the federal government and the RNC's theory. But it is just so scary that we are living in a world where it is possible that the Supreme Court at the end of June is going to announce this decision that could again nullify voting laws and practices just a few months before the midterms in over half of the election and craft a rule that would have disenfranchised almost a million voters in the 2024 election.

[Jon Lovett]

Didn't Kavanaugh, though question whether doing that would be feasible. Didn't he raise some concerns about that? Or am I being too optimistic? Tell me.

[Leah Littman]

I think your interpretation is very generous. I think what Kavanaugh was doing was a tell me why I'm right, tell me why this isn't a concern question. Because what he asked, asked the lawyer for the rnc, was, would there be a problem under the so called Purcell Principle if we announced this decision for the upcoming midterms? The Purcell principle is this idea that the court has selectively invoked that suggests courts shouldn't change the rules too close to an election lest they risk voter confusion and whatnot. But the advocate for the RNC said, nope, no problem. Right, Just like hand out this bad boy at the end of June and upend election rules for an election that's gonna happen in November, no big deal. And Justice Kavanaugh didn't push back on that. And the reality is this court has really selectively invoked that principle. So it has invoked Purcell. When courts try to protect voting rights, basically it's always too close to an election to do something that protects voting rights. But it's never too close to an election to do something that would help Republicans. You know, they allowed the 11th Circuit to change the voting rules in Florida almost a week, you know, before that state's primary. They have allowed, you know, other, you know, decisions to go into effect that again were likely to benefit Republicans, but not decisions that actually improve multiracial democracy or made it easier to cast a ballot. So it's hard for me to think that he's actually going to apply that principle in a more even handed way.

[Jon Lovett]

So I agree that when California takes forever to count ballots and during that process, suddenly you go from a Republican winning to a Democrat winning, that. That creates an impression that leads people to question whether things are fair, even if they are entirely fair. And there is no evidence suggests they aren't fair. But presumably it's a bad policy. It's a bad policy, but presumably the Supreme Court doesn't believe federal law should be made to assuage false concerns. They're trying to interpret what the law says. Are they suggesting that we've, that the elections we've been running have all been afoul of federal election law or are they just boring?

[Leah Littman]

Sweet, sweet summer child.

[Jon Lovett]

I am a summer child. I'm spring out in LA here.

[Leah Littman]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

Nice.

[Leah Littman]

So, yes, I mean, this theory would suggest that many elections over the last 200 years have been conducted in illegal ways. And you express surprise at the idea that they would indulge the suggestion that these false claims or false notions of voter fraud could actually alter the election rule, when the reality is they've actually embraced that idea before. You know, in a decision from seven years ago about the Voting Rights Act, Justice Alito, writing for all of the Republican appointees, said states have an interest in protecting the appearance of legitimacy in an election, even if there's zero actual evidence of fraud. And that was the same idea that you had Justices Kavanaugh and Alito reverting back to a bunch during this argument about absentee ballots. Well, isn't it fair for the state to basically adopt rules or the federal government to adopt rules in order to combat the appearance of impropriety? Even again, if that's not rooted in reality. But that's not how you usually interpret federal statutes. Under our constitutional system, states are supposed to be able to be the primary rule setters on elections. And. And they seemed willing to kind of abandon federalism, to abandon textualism, you know, in favor of something like whataboutism.

[Jon Lovett]

Right. Well, because if the state has an interest in making their elections fair, the state would be the one trying to protect their electoral interest. Perhaps one way they're trying to make sure the elections are fair is by

[Leah Littman]

counting, allowing people to vote.

[Jon Lovett]

Right. You know, and that would be their. That would be. Right. This is. This is about usurping the state's prerogative to oversee the elections. But, but you. Basically what you saw today leads you to think that this is right now on the edge. But there could be five votes to protect the counting of absentee ballots. And the fact that it's close is incredibly terrifying.

[Leah Littman]

Basically, that's what I heard. I think that's what other Supreme Court watchers also heard. And just to pick up on one thing you said, you know, of course, the fact that states take so long to count back ballots, that's not a good thing. But the reality is, invalidating these state rules that allow the counting of absentee ballots, that's not gonna fix the problem because it still takes states a lot of time to count ballots that are received on or before election day. You know, we need to be able to invest more resources in order to give states the ability to process the counting of ballots. You know, some states don't even allow officials to begin counting ballots until a certain point. And so this decision is not going to address all of the bogeyman and the fe they're trotting out. It is just straight up voter suppression.

[Jon Lovett]

Speaking of straight up voter suppression, President's on a tear Here he's trying to get the Congress to pass the SAVE Act, a restrictive voter ID bill to require Americans to provide proof of citizenship. At the moment, it seems unlikely that the bill can pass Congress. Even as of today, Trump was trying to get some of the funding measures tied to the SAVE act, trying to get everything all together. The Senate leaders are thinking, throwing cold water on that because there aren't the votes to pass this one. Part of the contention has been around what this would do to, I believe it's pronounced women, women who are married. Now, on one side they say, well, there are. Democrats are spreading misinformation about this. On the other, it's truly not clear what happens to women whose birth certificates and legal name are not the same because they got married. What actually happens if this becomes law and what would. What would be the odds that it would face a lot of legal hurdles to actually going into effect?

[Leah Littman]

Yeah, I mean, happy Women's History Month, ladies. You might not be able to vote very soon, but yes. So, you know, various provisions of the law require you to be able to present an identification, you know, that matches your name when you go to vote. And so, and so married women who change their names, you know, when they get married might have an identification where their birth certificate or their passport, you know, doesn't align with their married name. And so they would be prevented from voting under the SAVE Act. But it's not just married women. You know, a lot of people change their names for a variety of reasons. Same sex couples, you know, they change their names when they get married. Individuals, you know, change their names for family, personal reasons. And this law just threatens to disenfranchise large swaths of the population. And that seems to be the goal. You know, I'm glad you put the SAVE act together with this case because I think we should understand this as really all a coordinated effort to suppress voter turnout, make it more difficult to vote. You know, this is part of their mid cycle redistricting. Write a set of rules that allows them to retain power. The SAVE act is part of that. Suing for voter data and potentially deploying agents. Right. Those are also voter suppression tactics. The pending case about the future of the Voting Rights act, that's another voter suppression measure. And so they are trying to throw everything they can at the wall in order to hold onto power because they recognize that nobody fucking likes them.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, yeah. Speaking of people who are not being liked, I wanted to talk to you about this story. So. So last week, and you talked about this a bit on Strict scrutiny. A federal judge, Biden appointee absolutely tore into some DOJ attorneys in New Jersey in a courtroom, basically had a Trump lawyer removed from court, threatened to have him dragged out of the court, then gave that lawyer a second opportunity to leave on his own volition, an opportunity he took. What happened and is it now resolved because of what took place today?

[Leah Littman]

I cannot begin to convey the insanity of what has been happening in the U.S. attorney's office for New Jersey. Imagine GTL, but like, on ketamine. And it's like the legal version of that. So, you know, they appointed Jim Tan lawyer. You know, exactly. Yeah. Jim Tan lawyer. They appointed Alina Haba, U.S. attorney. Federal judges said, no, that's illegal. Then they created this new leadership structure that they referred to as the trifecta, or the triumvirate, where three individuals were supposedly running the office. Another federal judge said, no, no, no, no, that's illegal. And the problem with making all of these illegal appointments is if you have an illegally appointed prosecutor, then the cases that they bring have to be thrown out. And so it was jeopardizing public safety, law enforcement, law and order. And so all of these judges were like, guys, just fucking get your act together and accept the lawfully appointed U.S. attorney. Because under federal law, the judges basically had the power to select a U.S. attorney for a district after a certain period of time. And that was what the Trump administration was resisting. So in this particular case, it involved a defendant who had been indicted for a child pornography offense. And because the US Attorney's office is just not functioning, apparently the US Attorney's office entered into a plea deal with this defendant without actually searching the defendant's phone. They agreed to a sentence before actually looking at all of the defendant's phone. And once they looked, it had even more child sexual abuse material on it. But because they had entered this plea agreement, they were kind of stuck to it. And this judge was pissed off. He was like, what are you doing? And also, why are you insisting on imposing a sentence when you are running a U.S. attorney's office that might not even be lawfully structured? So this transcript was basically my asmr. I would strongly recommend to people reading it for themselves. You know, at the end of the transcript, the judge basically says, in a single year, you have squandered all of the credibility that the Department of Justice has built up over. Over decades. And it does seem to have been resolved in the sense that the U.S. attorney's office in New Jersey is now being run by the individual that was selected according to the statutory procedures by these federal judges. And so what that would mean is now there's a lawful appointment structure in place. And so all of these plea agreements, all these criminal cases aren't going to be called into question. As to whether the individuals who, who stayed at the U.S. attorney's office, including some individuals who came in under Trump, can dot their I's and cross their T's and do law remains to be seen. But this does actually solve some of the problems, at least. Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

Just so people understand, basically, if the role of U.S. attorney is vacant because it's a confirmable Senate, confirmable position, the law says that if it's open, there can only be a temporary appointment by the administration for so long before the judges appoint someone in their stead, because there are real powers that are associated with job and they have to go somewhere and you have to know who that person is. And Trump was trying to get around this by kind of continuously appointing temporary people. And the fear would be that those prosecutions, not only was this usurping Congress and the role of the courts and what Congress has assigned to the courts, but it would mean that these prosecutions could ultimately be enjoyed. Jeopardy. They were fighting and fighting and fighting. It seems like they've, as of today, as of this recording, basically given up the fight. It's a. It does seem like a genuine victory for the federal courts over the Trump administration.

[Leah Littman]

It really does. And this is an area where the federal courts held the line and basically refused to back down. And, you know, in a game of chicken, the chicken always loses. And the Trump administration lost, as they should have. And so hopefully they actually stick to this and are willing to accept the statutory procedures in other US Attorneys offices as well.

[Jon Lovett]

Leah, before we go, one last question. Donald Trump over the weekend said that he was happy that Robert Mueller had died. He said good, cuz he didn't like him. Do you ever allow yourself to root for the death of people that you don't like? Or do you know how bad that is for the human soul? Where are you?

[Leah Littman]

You know, I have some sense that that is bad for the human soul, because basically when I saw that tweet, I forced myself to think about, okay, when Donald Trump inevitably dies, like, what will you say and what will you think? And nothing remotely like the truth he posted about Robert Mueller remotely entered into my lexicon. Even though this is someone whose policies and behavior have affected vast suffering. Right. Untold deaths, human consequences, and still, like, I just don't think that is a normal human reaction. It's sociopathic.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Death is injustice. We all die. You know, that's how I feel about comes for everybody. So how do you celebrate it? You just. Delightful note, you know, but. But while we walk among the living, subscribe to strict Scrutiny because these cases are coming down. They are huge cases that will affect the elections, that will affect all of us. And if you want to know what's happening, if you want to be prepared, if you want to understand and do it in a way that is entertaining, even joyful at times, even in these dark moments, please, please, please subscribe to strict scrutiny. Leah Lippman, thank you so much. Good you see to see ya.

[Leah Littman]

Thank you for having me.

[Jon Favreau]

That's our show for today. Thanks to Leah for coming on. Dan and I will be back with a new show on Friday. If you want to listen to Pod Save America ad free and get access to exclusive podcasts, go to cricket.com friends to subscribe on Supercast, Substack, YouTube or Apple Podcasts. Also, please consider leaving us a review that helps boost this episode and everything we do here at Crooked. Pod Save America is a crooked media production. Our producer is Saul Rubin. Our associate producer is Farah Safari. Austin Fisher is our senior producer. Reed Churlin is our executive editor. Adrian Hill is our head of news and politics. The show is mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Jordan Kanter is our sound engineer with audio support from Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis. Matt de Groat is our head of production. Naomi Sengel is our executive assistant. Thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Hayley Jones, Ben Hefcoat, Mia Kelman, Kiril Pelavie, David Toles and Ryan Young. Our production staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.

[Erin Ryan]

The country feels like it's falling apart right before our eyes and the people inside are being silenced. So we're going to East 26th street and Nicollet Avenue, which is where Alex Preddy was executed by ICE and Border Patrol. That is not a headline. That is a human life and it is all happening right now. Do you worry about your own safety being involved in all this?

[Leah Littman]

Yes.

[Jon Lovett]

But it doesn't really feel like there's

[Leah Littman]

another option, you know?

[Podcast Advertiser Voice]

Know.

[Alyssa Mastromonaco]

And of course they use a 5 year old child as bait. And of course they're doing all these horrible bad things because they don't know what they're doing. They've been told that they're going to get rid of the worst of the worst. Then they have absolute immunity and they've been told that nothing they do will they ever be held accountable for.

[Erin Ryan]

On my show, Runaway country, we go where the headlines hit home from community under threat to the people fighting to be heard. New episodes of Runaway country drop every Thursday. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts or watch on YouTube.

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[Chris Murphy]

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