Trump Targets School JUST Outside Boston

Summary

Episode Summary: "Trump Targets School JUST Outside Boston"

Podcast: Pod Save America
Hosts: Jon Favreau, Jon Lovett, Dan Pfeiffer, Tommy Vietor
Release Date: May 27, 2025

In this episode of Pod Save America, the hosts tackle a series of explosive developments involving former President Donald Trump, delve into the implications for higher education, explore Democratic Party strategies, and engage with listener questions on a variety of pressing topics. Below is a detailed breakdown of the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode.

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1. Trump's Latest Tariff Threats

[02:38 – 09:13]

The episode kicks off with the hosts dissecting recent actions by Donald Trump that have stirred significant buzz in the political landscape.

• 50% Tariff on the EU:
  Trump has threatened to impose a 50% tariff on European Union goods starting June 1 due to unsuccessful trade negotiations. This move targets one of his long-standing opponents in international trade disputes.

  Jon Favreau [03:05]: "I was thinking about it. I'm like, wine and wine and iPhones."

• 25% Tariff on Apple iPhones:
  Following the EU, Trump has also directed a 25% tariff on Apple iPhones not manufactured in the United States. He has specifically instructed Apple CEO Tim Cook to ensure that iPhones sold in the U.S. are domestically produced, threatening hefty tariffs otherwise.

  Jon Favreau [03:09]: "He flawlessly wove those two manners."

The hosts express skepticism about the feasibility of these demands, highlighting the logistical challenges and the unlikely outcome of Apple relocating its manufacturing solely to the U.S.

2. Impact on Harvard's International Students

[04:38 – 06:27]

A major focus of the discussion is Trump's attempt to pressure Harvard University into revoking its international student enrollment privileges. This move is purportedly aimed at combating anti-Semitism but raises numerous constitutional and ethical concerns.

• Harvard's Legal Battle:
  Harvard has filed a lawsuit against Trump's directive, resulting in a temporary injunction that halts the implementation of these restrictive policies. The situation creates uncertainty for both current and prospective international students, including Israeli veterans.

  Jon Lovett [05:10]: "Lord, I need a better one of those."

• Constitutional Concerns:
  The hosts argue that Trump's actions are bracingly unconstitutional, as they misuse governmental power to influence academic policies without legitimate justification.

  Jon Lovett [05:47]: "It's just a brazenly unconstitutional."

3. Market Reactions to Tariff Threats

[06:32 – 09:13]

The hosts analyze how financial markets are responding to Trump's tariff announcements.

• EU Tariffs:
  Markets appear unfazed by the EU tariff threats, likely due to Trump's history of eventually backing down in similar scenarios.

  Dan Pfeiffer [07:42]: "Apple sells like 75 million iPhones in the US... they all cost $300 more."

• Apple Tariffs:
  The threat against Apple is perceived as more impactful. Experts predict that Apple might absorb the costs, leading to higher prices for consumers rather than relocating manufacturing, which the hosts deem logistically impractical.

  Jon Lovett [08:57]: "The most profitable company... do I care that much? Not really... But it speaks to how little Tim Cook has gotten for his obsequious bowing before Donald Trump."

4. Listener Questions and Democratic Strategies

[09:11 – 35:57]

The bulk of the episode involves addressing listener-submitted questions, offering strategic insights into the Democratic Party's current challenges and future directions.

• Electing Younger Democratic Leaders:
  Question: How can Democratic voters push the party to elect younger representatives and move away from the traditional seniority system?

  Response:
  The hosts emphasize the need for primaries and open Senate seats to introduce younger candidates. They advocate for voters to pressure current leaders like Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer to support younger leadership, highlighting the importance of refreshing the party's image to resonate with younger voters.

  Elijah Cohn [10:02]: "If you want younger leadership in the Senate, put pressure on senators... get someone to challenge these leaders."

• Moderate Democrats Voting with Republicans:
  Question: Why are moderate Democrats like Senators Gallego, Slotkin, Warner, and Rosen voting with Republicans on Trump-related issues?

  Response:
  The hosts critique these senators for compromising Democratic values by siding with Republican agendas. They cite specific instances such as Cory Booker's vote for Jared Kushner, viewing these actions as detrimental to party cohesion and policy integrity.

  Elijah Cohn [15:16]: "Cory Booker put out some statement... it's an unbelievable vote."

• Most Disappointing Trump 2.0 Appointees:
  Question: Rank the most disappointing and surprisingly acceptable Trump appointees.

  Response:
  The panel names Marco Rubio and Kristi Noem as especially disappointing due to their actions undermining democratic norms and policies. They also discuss the lack of respect for certain appointees who failed to meet expectations.

  Dan Pfeiffer [17:05]: "Marco Rubio... done more to erode democratic norms than maybe anyone else."

• Interviewing Trump:
  Question: How would the hosts handle an interview with Donald Trump—ask tough questions or use other tactics?

  Response:
  The hosts suggest a strategic approach—asking precise, challenging questions to elicit genuine responses while managing Trump's confrontational nature. They emphasize the importance of holding him accountable without allowing the interview to devolve.

  Dan Pfeiffer [28:24]: "I would goad him into losing his temper... make sure the doors were all locked."

• Stripping Presidential Powers:
  Question: Should a future Democratic president reduce presidential powers accumulated over the past two decades?

  Response:
  The hosts present differing views. While Dan Pfeiffer advocates for using existing powers to effect change without over-relying on executive actions, Jon Lovett argues for demonstrating effective governance within established structures to rebuild trust in the presidency.

  Jon Lovett [25:44]: "We first need to prove that government can work effectively within the bounds of the law."

• Respect for Conservative Commentators:
  Question: Are there any conservative commentators the hosts respect, and who do they dislike?

  Response:
  The hosts generally express little respect for pro-Trump conservative commentators, citing figures like Scott Jennings, Laura Loomer, and Steve Bannon as lacking integrity or honesty. However, they acknowledge occasional nuances where some commentators may critique Trump on specific issues.

  Jon Lovett [31:50]: "I have no respect for... except maybe there's some that are better than others."

• Using AI in Daily Life:
  Question: How can individuals effectively integrate AI tools into their daily routines without falling behind?

  Response:
  The hosts share practical tips on using AI as an enhanced search tool, for idea generation, and data synthesis. They recommend leveraging AI for tasks like writing assistance, recipe creation, and organizing information, while also cautioning about the importance of verifying AI-generated content.

  Elijah Cohn [46:40]: "I use it to synthesize data... to make charts and graphics."

5. Pop Culture and Hypothetical Scenarios

[36:00 – 57:19]

Shifting gears, the hosts engage in lighthearted discussions and hypothetical questions, showcasing their camaraderie and humor.

• NBA Team Performance:
  A brief analysis of the Boston Celtics' struggles, primarily due to key player injuries and salary cap restrictions, leading to discussions about the team's future prospects.

• Humorous Hypotheticals:
  The hosts entertain fun, fictional scenarios such as whether the Crooked Media staff could defeat a gorilla or handle 100 gorilla-sized ducks, mixing humor with playful banter.

  Jon Lovett [55:43]: "We're going to tire that gorilla out... it's going to be an ugly battle, but we're going to tire that gorilla out."

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6. Conclusion and Community Engagement

The episode concludes with the hosts encouraging listeners to subscribe to Friends of the Pod, highlighting exclusive content and community benefits. They also promote upcoming shows and express gratitude towards their production team and listeners.

Jon Favreau [57:19]: "Thank you for your questions, everyone... Pod Save America is a Crooked Media production."

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This episode of Pod Save America provides a comprehensive analysis of Donald Trump's aggressive policy maneuvers, their impact on international relations and higher education, and offers strategic insights for the Democratic Party's future direction. Through engaging discussions and listener interaction, the hosts deliver a rich and informative episode that keeps listeners informed and engaged with the current political climate.

Transcript

[Jon Favreau]

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[Jon Lovett]

Huh? When is Father's Day?

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[Jon Lovett]

Got time. Okay.

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[Jon Favreau]

Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.

[Jon Lovett]

I'm Jon Lovett.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I'm Tommy Vitor.

[Elijah Cohn]

I'm Dan Pfeiffer.

[Jon Favreau]

Got all four of us here today. We are doing a mailbag. We're gonna take some of your questions. Hope everyone had a good Memorial Day weekend, but we woke up. It's Friday. We're recording this, and we woke up and you know, Donald Trump made a bunch of news. So we might talk a little bit about that at the top if you guys want. It's not often I wake up and there's like multiple breaking news, new York Times notifications on your phone about Donald Trump.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Really? Most days.

[Jon Favreau]

Well, this one was like a couple right in a row, because first he threatened the eu, Right? Yeah. Which is one of his favorite punching bags with a 50% tariff because apparently the trade negotiations aren't going well with Europe. So starting on June 1, he wants to recommend a straight 50% tariff. So gonna be tough to drink those French wines. Tommy.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

No.

[Jon Favreau]

Zuta.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Lord, I need a better one of those.

[Jon Favreau]

No. And then right after that, he said, I've long ago informed Tim Cook of Apple that I expect their iPhones that will be sold in the United States of America will be manufactured and built in the United States, not India or anyplace else. If that's not the case, a tariff of at least 25% must be paid by Apple to the U.S. i mean, most of the weekend, I'm walking around with an Apple, an iPhone in one hand, and a glass of wine in the other hand. That's like both of my modern man.

[Jon Lovett]

Wow, look at this. Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

What are you doing?

[Elijah Cohn]

Just scrolling and sipping. Scrolling and sipping.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

He flawlessly wove those two manners.

[Jon Favreau]

I was thinking about it. I'm like, wine and wine and iPhones.

[Jon Lovett]

No, I do think the tariffs are happening to you.

[Jon Favreau]

I think you're right.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Also, all of our kids desperately want to work at Foxconn. That's where this is going.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. And then, of course, Dan and I talked a little bit on Friday's episode about the threat to Harvard and trying to revoke their ability to enroll any international students whatsoever. Harvard sued. There was a temporary injunction granted this morning. Friday morning, but it's still chaos. I don't know if you guys have read some of the stories there about these students who. Students who are already there who don't know if they're going to be able to finish school. Students who are incoming students to Harvard, International students who have already, like, turned down other colleges and were ready to go to Harvard and now don't know if they can. Anyways, Trump. Trump versus the world. What do you guys all think it is?

[Jon Lovett]

It is very cruel to those students. Could be a good day for somebody who got waitlisted.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, it is like 6,800 kids. 27% of the last year's class, I think, is international. I just saw a story. I saw a Harvard professor tweeting about how among those at risk of not being able to go to Harvard this year are IDF veterans. So to combat antisemitism, we are telling Israeli combat veterans that they can't go to Harvard. That makes total sense to me.

[Elijah Cohn]

Is that what we're doing? We're combating anti Semitism by kicking these foreign students, including Israeli students, out of Harvard?

[Jon Favreau]

That is the ostensible purpose.

[Elijah Cohn]

It's hard to keep it straight, but yes, that's.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It's also a DEI element to it. They're saying they also employ DEI policy. So it's anti Semitism promoting pro Hamas sympathies on campus and DEI policies and.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, and what the letter from what's Her Face, Kristi Noem said is that they were demanding from Harvard video footage records of all the international students potential disciplinary action. So basically, like, have they ever, you know, participated in a protest that's. That's sort of what they're looking for.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Not just illegal activity, protected speech, protest activity. They're demanding any footage of protests that might involve international students.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, it's just a bra. You know, Harvard responded, it's brazenly unconstitutional. They're not pretending at all that this has anything to do with their international student program or any kind of illicit or, or illegal conduct by Harvard that would justify shutting down the program. They are explicitly saying, for this other reason that we care about, which is anti Semitic protest on campus, we are going to use all the levers of power we have at our disposal to fuck with you. So the judge blocked it because Harvard basically is saying this will do a ton of harm even before we're able to litigate it. But it's also just bracingly unconstitutional.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. And then the, you know, the markets are taking the tariff threats well.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Well, I think, I think the markets, I think they're shrugging off the EU portion of it because, I mean, the problem with Trump making these threats now is they've. The Europe has already watched him cave, like multiple times. He caved to them. He caved to China. Like, were. What's this, like, round, what, two or three of these tariff threats? The new thing waking up and threatening a foreign country or a bloc of them. I think I'm kind of used to by now, waking up and threatening one of like the crown jewels of the US Tech community or like one of the biggest US Companies, period, is insane. And the idea that Apple is going to shift manufacturing from China to the United States is nonsensical. They're trying to shift from China to India in part because of, like, US Government pressure that we want all these major companies to diversify supply chains and not be captive to the Chinese Communist Party. Now the Chinese are making it very difficult to Shift those supply chains and manufacturing out of China through a bunch of restrictions that are too boring to get into. But the idea that Apple wouldn't just, like, eat the 25% tariff and make our iPhones $100, $300 more expensive as opposed to trying to completely redo the company in the United States, is ludicrous.

[Elijah Cohn]

Does Trump think that there's some, like, magic factory in a box button that Tim Cook is not pushing? Like, even if he were to say tomorrow, like, yes, we're going to make more, it would be years upon years before you could start making the iPhones in the United States.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. And it's basically what happened to the Mattel guy, the CEO of Mattel, because he said the same thing. He's like, oh, we're moving out of China. We're gonna try to move more production and manufacturing into India. And Trump's like, no, no, no, no, no. You don't get to move from China to India. You have to move here, and if not, no more Mattel toys. So that's what we're dealing with this Memorial Day weekend.

[Jon Lovett]

I was actually more alarmed by the EU tariffs, because what's he fucking doing? Like, is he. Is he actually go through with this? It's like more of the same chaos that could have, like, far reaching consequences. With Apple, it's like, all right, the most profitable company in the history of planet Earth. They've made an incredible amount of money making iPhones in China and selling them at tremendous profit in the U.S. like, do I think this is the way the U.S. president should behave? No, but, like, do I care that much? Like, I really don't. But I do think it speaks to how little Tim Cook has gotten for his obsequious bowing before Donald Trump. Like, is it working? Is your charm offensive in your donation? Is it working? Doesn't seem like it's working.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It's not working. But, like, the net effect of this is that Apple. Apple sells like 75 million iPhones in the US what's most likely to happen is that they all cost $300 more. So, yeah, that would really suck for like a huge chunk of the country. Well, yeah, Apple political impact. They will make us eat the cost.

[Jon Lovett]

Like, it's Samsung.

[Jon Favreau]

You could definitely drinking water. No, I know, it's just annoying. Okay, so let's get to the questions. These are from Discord from our subscribers. The first one is from CallMeTRL, although I think this one's probably from Elijah. What can Dem voters do to push the party to elect younger Reps to leadership positions cough. AOC Oversight Committee cough to move on from this seniority system they have.

[Jon Lovett]

That was Connolly's last words.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, my God.

[Jon Lovett]

Jesus.

[Elijah Cohn]

Oh, come on.

[Jon Favreau]

No.

[Jon Lovett]

What?

[Jon Favreau]

What?

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, I didn't realize that. Well, I know he died of cancer. I just. That's very specific. But I'm sorry, that was obviously inappropriate and I think we should leave it in.

[Jon Favreau]

All right, Dan, Dan, what's your. What's your answer?

[Jon Lovett]

That's a good joke.

[Elijah Cohn]

I'm still in shock by what just happened there.

[Jon Lovett]

Sorry.

[Elijah Cohn]

It begins with electing more younger Democrats, right? That is the first thing. There are going to be primaries. We're going to have open seats for the Senate coming up in a whole bunch of states. We should be. If you want the younger Democrats, we should elect those. And pressure should be put on leadership to have a different system. There is a value in experience, for sure. If you've been in Congress a while, you know how these things work, you have developed issue expertise and that matters. But we have to think about other things. Politics is also performance, and we have to think about people who can communicate, who can speak to the large part of our core base that we're losing, which is young voters. And. And so we need a system that isn't simply the longer you've been in Congress, you automatically get the spot. And so it's put pressure on Hakeem Jeffries, put pressure on Chuck Schumer. If you think we need younger leadership in the Senate, put pressure on senators. You can do that by calling their office. You can do that through protests to look for younger leadership. And that begins with getting someone to challenge these leaders.

[Jon Lovett]

Right.

[Elijah Cohn]

You actually need that to happen, particularly in the Senate.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

You know who's really good at finding young leaders is Matt Gaetz. Oh, you know, this. This used to be worse. I think before the 70s, it was like just de facto. If you were the most senior member on the committee, you got the job. Then in the 70s, the party granted the caucus the power to vote on these things. In 2020, Dems put in place six year term limits for chairs, so we could do more of that. There could be ranked choice voting for committee chairs. You could reform the steering committee, which is a leadership setup committee that recommends people for these spots. You could put more emphasis on policy expertise or whatever. There is an open question though, like, does this really fucking matter? Like, people care what AOC thinks a lot more than name a random committee chair. I can't. Even though she was passed over, so it's a fair Question.

[Jon Favreau]

I do agree that the committee chair issue is less of an issue than the fact that a number of House Democrats have died in office.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

That seems bad.

[Jon Favreau]

Over the last year or so, three.

[Jon Lovett]

Have died this year. The last eight members of Congress or senators to die while in office have all been Democrats.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, but you know, ultimately like you said, Dan, we gotta run younger candidates. And if you don't see younger candidates running, run yourself.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Right.

[Jon Favreau]

You know. All right, this is from Patrick W. As someone who worked in the Senate during the first Trump term, I don't remember the moderate Dems, aside from Manchin, voting so often with Republicans for Trump nominees or for bad bills like Lake and Riley, the Genius act, et cetera. What is going on with senators like Gallego, Slotkin, Warner, Rosen that they feel like voting with Republicans and Trump so often in this moment. Anyone want to take that?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

So you guys want to hear some Republicans in the first Trump term that got big, big votes? Jim Mattis, you Want to guess?

[Elijah Cohn]

100, nothing unanimous.

[Jon Lovett]

Thanks for.

[Jon Favreau]

Yes.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Anding this way to be a team player now. 98 to 1.

[Jon Lovett]

I mean, no, I won.

[Jon Favreau]

Who was against Jim Mat?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I think it was Senator Gillibrand. I believe there was a question at the time of whether someone who was just in uniform. You're supposed to be statutorily out for five years. I think before you can be sucked up. Elaine Chow got 93 to 6 for dot.

[Jon Lovett]

That's Mitch McConnell. Mick, pressing the flesh.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It is, I think like immigration to specific area where Democrats felt like they were offsides politically. And a lot of them are. These people are in border states. So they voted for terrible bills because they thought that's what their constituents want. The Genius act is in my view an indefensible, weird decision. I mean it's about the regulation of stablecoins. It got 69 votes in the Senate. I think Democrats are scared of crypto money and also they want to be perceived as pro crypto among crypto fans. But you know, Trump is literally selling access to the highest bidder as we speak. Or that was last night. Sorry.

[Jon Favreau]

But yeah, I think the argument that they have because of first the Democrats are a lot of Democrats. I think most of them, even the pro crypto Democrats in the Senate were against the Genius act and then they made some changes. And so the people who are for it are saying, well it's some regulation of stablecoin is better than no regulation at all. And there's all these consumer protections built in and opponents like Elizabeth Warren are saying not enough protections Built in. And also, it's not doing anything about Trump and the Trump problem. I believe the. But the regulations now say that no member of Congress or senior administration official can start a stablecoin while in office.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

But if you already got one going.

[Jon Favreau]

Right. Exactly.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Like, come on, what is this?

[Jon Favreau]

Not a. Not a great bill. But I would take issue with the premise only in that at the beginning of Trump's term, with some of the Cabinet nominees and things like Lake and Riley act, we were in a political environment where I think a lot of Democrats were like, okay, we gotta work with Trump when we can and oppose him when we must. And I think now, with the exception of the Genius Act, I don't think many nominees are getting through the Democratic Senate. Except for some reason, Cory Booker voted for Jared Kushner.

[Elijah Cohn]

Yeah, that's the one I wanted to bring up. Right. Which is. I mean, Charles Kushner is a longtime donor of Cory Booker. Cory Booker put out a statement right before Charles Kushner's conviction, but it's an unbelievable vote. It's just absolutely an insane thing to do. Cory Booker put out some statement about how the reason he did it is because Charles Kushner helped pass the First Step act when Cory Booker was doing that in the first reform, which is an absurd premise, and I think it was. I understand that people thought at the time that we should work with Trump when we can and oppose him when we should. That was idiocy then and it's idiocy now.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah.

[Elijah Cohn]

If they're like, I don't know enough about the. The Genius act and the stablecoins about. And I could buy an argument that some regulation is better than none, but if you're voting, no one who has cast a vote for a single Trump nominee has felt good about that vote afterwards.

[Jon Favreau]

Yes.

[Elijah Cohn]

How's everyone feel about their 99 fucking votes for Marco Rubio?

[Jon Lovett]

We had Van Holland basically saying to Rubio's face this week, like, I regret. I regret that vote. I do. Like.

[Jon Favreau]

And then Rubio's like, that's how I know I'm doing a good job.

[Jon Lovett]

Which doesn't make any sense because. Were you mad he voted for you when he got the vote? You're just. Just. Just coming up with a fucking little retort. Marco Rubio.

[Jon Favreau]

But the. It does.

[Jon Lovett]

It did feel like what they were trying to do is the same reason they got such a. They were getting behind people like Mattis because it was this idea, like, no, you need responsible people there to hold Trump to his feet, to the Fire. Make sure, you know, they're serious adults. If he's not there, who's going to be there in his place? But then that was what Marco Rubio's role. That's what Bessant's supposed to be doing.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Right.

[Jon Lovett]

But they're just not.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Charles Kushner. What are we doing here?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

Not a great guy. All right, this is fun. Who are your rankings of most disappointing and surprisingly not disappointing? Trump 2.0 appointees and characters. And then this person said, burgum's kind of wholesome.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I think we just named a surprisingly disappointing one, which is Marco Rubio, at.

[Jon Favreau]

The top of my list. Right.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

He's throwing people in jail for writing op eds. He's helping and he's proud of it. Lead deportations to El Salvador, like he is. He was the most normie cabinet selection out there, and he's done more to erode democratic norms than maybe anyone else.

[Jon Lovett]

Look, I didn't expect good things from Kristi Noem, but if you would have told me that within weeks of Donald Trump become president, she would do a fascist photo op in front of prisoners at a Salvadoran mega prison to justify illegal extrajudicial kidnappings, that. That would have been, I think, surprising to me.

[Jon Favreau]

Well, it's also very specific.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

So it would have been a polymarket.

[Jon Favreau]

Wow.

[Jon Lovett]

Whoever predicted that was smart.

[Jon Favreau]

Quite a mind up on that prediction. Incessant, too.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, I would say.

[Jon Lovett]

See, I don't know.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Has he been a moderating force? Kind of. Seems like in at times on the tariffs.

[Jon Favreau]

I don't think he's helped too much. Maybe. Yeah. I mean, we don't know what's going on.

[Jon Lovett]

Difference between a pathetic failed moderating force and someone who's going along with what, like a Lutnick wants to be.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Well said. Well said. Tulsi Gabbard. Her entire worldview was defined by Iraq, and now she's firing intelligence analysts who disagree with or who disagree with a political judgment they made about immigration.

[Jon Favreau]

Dan, what about you? Who do you got?

[Elijah Cohn]

I probably would put Marco Rubio as my most disappointing. I didn't have any real hopes for him. I just thought he would be sort of a shuffled off to the side, feckless loser the whole time, as opposed to, like, really leaning into being a giant pro Trump asshole. But that was surprising with four jobs. Yeah. I mean, I think Besant. I don't know what hopes I had for him either. He's mostly failed at what he was doing.

[Jon Lovett]

He, like.

[Elijah Cohn]

He's worse at being Gary Cohn. Than Gary Cohn, which is saying a lot. The role that he had, you know, I would say Doug Burgum. I haven't really thought about him since the day he was confirmed. And this question. So that seems like he's at least not doing something terrible, so I should feel good about that.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, that's on your. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's your surprising question.

[Elijah Cohn]

That's my surprising. Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

I think that I did not expect much from her at all, but Pam Bondi, to me, is, like, almost as bad as I imagined Matt Gaetz being. And when you. Whenever. If you catch her on tv, she's just like a White House spokesperson. Yeah. Like, she's the attorney general.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Empty vessel, but she's just.

[Jon Favreau]

She's so obsequious in the cabinet meetings, and she's just, like, spitting out talking points and just do. She's just a Donald Trump staffer. That's it.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

She calls him president.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Not Mr. Not the.

[Jon Lovett]

Thank you, President. Like, he lives the way a child would.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

You know who's getting a lot of love in surprising places these days?

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, no.

[Jon Favreau]

Keshe Patel.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Roll the clip.

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, wow.

[Elijah Cohn]

Oh, a surprise clip.

[Jon Lovett]

Surprise.

[Jon Favreau]

If it makes you feel better, I mean, Gorka is not taken seriously by anyone who knows him, I think, including his wife. And he's a very nice person, for whatever's worth. And I. I think his job, literally, is just to sit on the Internet and, like, send, you know, fiery replies to people on X. I mean, I don't think he actually has a job.

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, well, then I guess he's the perfect guy for the job.

[Jon Favreau]

There's someone else working on counterterrorism. That was you for making me like Tucker Carlson there.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I know. That was Tucker talking to a guy named Sean Ryan who's, like, kind of a military podcaster guy.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, yeah, I always see him, really?

[Jon Lovett]

On Zeb. So is there some sort of Zeb Tucker beef?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

There was. So apparently there was a backstory that was too long to include, but Gorka went after Sean Ryan over something and was a real dick about it. They also just think he's a clown and he's, like, cosplaying.

[Jon Favreau]

They're correct.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Sean Ryan's a former Navy SEAL turned CIA kind of contractor dude.

[Jon Favreau]

Any other pleasant surprises? Surprisingly not disappointed. Anyone other. Anyone else? I know we kind of talked about Cash Patel a little bit. I don't want to jinx anything.

[Jon Lovett]

I don't either, you know? Yeah. Dan Bongino and Cash Patel going out there and basically saying that Epstein killed himself I mean, it's just sort of a strange way to be. Like, way to go, fellas. But there's a kind of an odd moment of them kind of trying to speak the truth to the base. Not clear why they. I mean, clearly they felt so compelled by all the pressure they're under. It tells you something about what their day to day priorities are, but those guys could be worse.

[Jon Favreau]

It's just weird to me, like right now after the shoot, the terrible shooting in D.C. of those two staffers at the Israeli embassy, like Dan Bongino's Twitter feed is just giving out like good, credible information and very calm. And I'm like, what? It's weird to me, only because Cash Patel and Dan Bongino seem less crazy than their boss.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

It's not like they're taking a cue from Pam Bondi. Like she's much. It's true. She's much more of like just a Trump staffer than the. Than the two of them. And I thought it would have been reversed.

[Elijah Cohn]

Maybe it just raises the question about what the deep state has on both of them.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Oh, there we go, Dan.

[Jon Lovett]

Exactly.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Dan, you joke, but I listened to two hours of Tucker Carlson talking to that guy Sean Ryan last night and this was a big chunk of it.

[Jon Favreau]

Let's talk about that.

[Elijah Cohn]

Where do you find the time?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Two hours I did on 2X was.

[Elijah Cohn]

This one hour, a four hour podcast you did at 2X. Okay. But you still did an hour of Tucker Carlson and Sean Ryan at night with two children who are quite young.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I listened to half of it this morning.

[Jon Favreau]

It would look.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It was compelling, it was good, some good audio.

[Jon Favreau]

I'm going to step in to save you, Tommy. At 9:30 last night, I started the conversation between J.D. vance and Ross Douthitz.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

That was the annoying conversation.

[Jon Favreau]

And I listened to that to go to sleep. It was so bad.

[Elijah Cohn]

What is wrong with you?

[Jon Favreau]

But did not. It did not help me go to sleep because it got me extremely angry at James.

[Elijah Cohn]

No fucking shit. Like, what did you think of? Just Roth's soothing dulcet tones was gonna rock you to sleep. Like a lullaby supposed to a guy you try. You're trying to get in a Twitter fight with every three days.

[Jon Lovett]

I don't know what the last straw was for Martin Luther to kick off the Reformation. But like, has to be a. Some. A Catholic conversation. More irritating than that, I suppose.

[Jon Favreau]

Anyway, we won't break that down. We won't break that down. All right, new question from Kev. When a Democratic president gets back in office, do you think it is their responsibility to strip back some of the presidential powers that have been taken over the past two decades? Or is that not possible with an ever paralyzed and ineffective legislative branch? I had Tommy and Dan both say they wanted to take this one.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Oh, my answer is nope. Use the power you have to do stuff that makes people happy. I'm not saying that President Pete should, you know, crush his enemies with doj, but we're not going back to normal. Let's do some shit.

[Jon Favreau]

I thought that you were going to say for war powers.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

What do you mean? Like, like have Congress. Actually, yeah, like the fact that we're.

[Jon Favreau]

Still, you know, that the presidents are still using the authorization for Afghanistan, Iraq to just like launch whatever.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It would be great if Congress would repeal the aumf. I'm absolutely for that. But I think just in terms of the leaning on executive action, not waiting for Congress. No, I'm not. We're not going to let Republicans obstruct us to death ever again.

[Elijah Cohn]

I have a different take on this.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Let's hear it.

[Elijah Cohn]

I'm not. I'm fine with continuing to have a broad based definition of executive power because Congress is paralyzed. I think it's 2020. Democrats should run on an agenda that makes the president more accountable for their actions. You should. We should support making the Hatch act apply to the President. We should have a legal solution for where it sets out where presidents can be prosecuted to sort of hem in the immunity decision. We should pass laws that say presidents can't have meme coins. Stablecoins. There's like a whole set of things that we should hem that Trump has found all these loophole systems. He has exploited them mightily. It is in our interest to be. We're not going to ever take advantage of those things, hopefully. So we should run to close all those loopholes. I think it should be a big part of our agenda and I think a president why should not do it? I think, I think you should do them and not do the meme coin. I think it's not going to be that hard.

[Jon Lovett]

Look, we're in this sort of vicious circle where it's like, heads we tails they win, heads we lose. Which is, you know, we abide by all these structures that slow down government, restrict the president's ability to operate. Then Republicans come in, they can do whatever the fuck they want. Like we can't. We can't prove to people that government can work effectively and like serve their interests. If we're so hemmed in when we finally have power but at the same time, I do think the presidency has been, is now this sort of symbol of total government failure. And the only antidote to that is not reforms that make Congress more effective or make the agencies move more quickly, but just to accrue more power to the president. And it's a kind of, it's a tough spot for Democrats to be in. But I think Tommy is right. Like, we first and foremost need to prove to people that government can work within the bounds of the law, within the structures provided by Congress, but that it can be dynamic and effective and fast moving. And I think for a long time, Democrats weren't willing to kind of ruffle feathers, break through walls in a way that proved that to people. And I think that's like the first order priority.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, I'm being a little bit glib, but I do think like, and obviously like, I would love to, I would do like common sense ethics reforms, but I do think like Trump with like Doge, for example, it was ineffective and stupid, but it made him look like he was active in doing things and actually cutting spending. And I think we have to figure out our version of something like that that makes us look like we're not just going to get obstructed.

[Jon Lovett]

Like there needs to be like a little bit of that kind of like fast moving energy with like, you know, a moral and like ethical and ideological goal we support.

[Elijah Cohn]

There's somewhere between the lawyers stopping everything from happening and having the judges stop everything you tried to do. And Trump. Yeah, we Democrats have erred on the former and Trump has fallen into the latter.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, I would probably pass legislation or try to pass legislation to Trump proof the bureaucracy and independent agencies just give a little more protection just based on what the courts have ruled so far. You know, the courts have sort of stood up to Trump on some of the deportation stuff, but they are not standing up to Trump on like firing, except for the Fed, I guess, firing, you know, heads of independent agencies, knowing that some of these independent agencies are going to be, you know, like Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. Right. We want to protect that beyond the next Democratic president next time there's Republicans. So I would put, I would try to push for reforms there and then maybe clean up the, the Insurrection act, the Alien Enemies Act. So make sure that if we get another Republican president, those aren't on the table.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Get rid of that one. You're overlooking our big win on the P Club.

[Jon Lovett]

What's the peacock on the P Club?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

The president, The Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board. Oh, Federal judge Trump fired two Dems on that board. Federal judge said, no, no, no.

[Elijah Cohn]

Who are the Dems? Were they friends of yours?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I don't know, man. Couple clubs. You know, big win on the.

[Jon Lovett]

Let's do. We do a rapid response, Travis, on our big wins on the peak.

[Jon Favreau]

I think Tommy just did Travis LeBlanc and Edward Felton. I think that's gonna go viral.

[Elijah Cohn]

Oh, good, Eddie.

[Jon Favreau]

All right, from Dan Levy. Suppose you somehow had the opportunity to interview Trump. How would you approach it? Would you ask tough questions and criticize his record, or would you try to butter him up and trick him into saying something harmful? That is the quiet part out loud.

[Jon Lovett]

All right, you know what? Honestly, we're gonna have a little ceremony. We're gonna bury that phrase in the ground. There's no more. How is anyone hearing any quiet parts? It's all loud, all the time.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Didn't have that on my bingo card. And bury that one with it.

[Jon Favreau]

Louder. For the people in the back, I.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Would go with some simple questions. I think the Christie gnome. What is habeas corpus? Example is some kind of how I would go with Trump. Like, what is. What is the emoluments clause? Say, sir, and then when he inevitably flips out, I just want one journalist to be like, you're the most powerful man in the world. Your party controls the entire government. Do you ever get bored of bitching and whining so much and just see what he says?

[Jon Favreau]

That's good. Yeah. I would goad him into losing his temper, but I would also make sure that, like, the, you know, he couldn't leave the interview. He could try, but the doors were all locked.

[Elijah Cohn]

I think. You want him to storm off, right?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Beijing Secret Service.

[Jon Favreau]

No, we're just hanging out. He's just abiding by the rules. Yeah. But I think that goading him into losing his temper, especially around the jet, the corruption stuff, that's what really gets him. Like, he really flipped out at Peter Alexander.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

That's great.

[Jon Lovett]

Well, he was. That was very. That was a really sort of an interesting moment of him just being kind of like he had just shown his little videos, and he was. He wanted questions about the videos, and Peter went right to the plane. He's like. I just. It was like a. It was like a show and tell kind of thing.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, it was a. Yeah, it was a presentation. Dan, what would you do?

[Elijah Cohn]

I would pick one subject and stick to it. I think one of the problems with this is these reporters go in, they feel like they have to ask him every. About everything. Like just in the example with the tamer interview where Donald Trump is seeming like a complete lunatic, lying or being completely misled about a picture with fake tattoos that he tweeted out of the Oval Office. And Terry Brand's like, I hear you, I hear you. I hear your lies, but I got to get to Ukraine. I got to get to Ukraine. I hear the clock ticking. So just pick one. One issue. Right? It could be corruption. It could be what's actually in the budget bill. It could be his illegal deportation or something. Just pick one thing and stick to it so that you can actually drill down as opposed to trying to cover the waterfront in your allotted 17 minutes or whatever it is.

[Jon Lovett]

I also want one just thing I think has been effective with him, too, is sometimes be like, I never said that. Or, I didn't. That's not what I said. If you just have the printout of the. You know, just have the Post. He fucking hates that. He hates being confronted by his words. And if you just have, like, it's right here. This is what he said. It's right here.

[Jon Favreau]

Dan, is the new media section of the press room actually damaging, or is it just kind of a weird sideshow?

[Elijah Cohn]

It's a weird sideshow. It's serving the purpose that Trump wants, which is to grant access to his biggest fans so that they will cover him even more positively. Right. It's. It's not changing the world. It's not upending what journalism is or anything like that. It just. It. It's access for sycophants with large media platforms, and it's working in the way it's intended.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, it's smart.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Elijah Cohn]

Democrats should do the same thing. They absolutely they. You. You should.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. I look forward to the next Democratic president having a new media section with a whole bunch of people except us.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Four more years, probably.

[Jon Lovett]

The way that goes, I was like, dming Midas. Touch that so we can borrow their badge.

[Jon Favreau]

We do know Brian Tyler Cohen.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, I'm all done fast, plus one. Please let me in.

[Jon Favreau]

All right, here's a tough one. Are there any conservative commentators that you respect? And who is your least favorite conservative commentator so far in Trump 2.0? And then this person gives us a leading Scott Jennings.

[Jon Lovett]

I suppose this means conservative commentators who are still pro Trump.

[Jon Favreau]

I think you have. Yeah, I don't think we can be like Bill Kristol.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Oh, yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

Honestly, I really don't. I don't. That's not where I'm at. Like, I really have a great deal of respect for the Conservatives that said no. I think it's. It's just been. It's just been interesting. I think people's revealed themselves in the last decade about what. What they really believed. And I really, genuinely admire the conservatives that walked away, but the ones that are inside defending this, I just have no respect for it. There's no. I don't know, unless maybe there's some that are better than others, but it's hard for me to judge.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I mean, we have Fox on all day long, and it's just sort of whatever the talking points of the day are, whichever host is on, we'll repeat them. Like in 2018, the claims that there was a white genocide in South Africa and white farmers were being exterminated was cabined off to the Tucker Carlson Hour of Fox News.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Now that Trump is talking about it, it's on every single show. That doofus sports guy, Will Kane, like, everybody's just repeating that talking point.

[Elijah Cohn]

Right.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

So I have the least respect for those useful idiots. I don't respect them. But I find it interesting that Laura Loomer, Tucker Carlson, Steve Bannon are all willing to be critical of Trump on certain issues and at certain points. Again, I don't like them. I think they're bad people who do and say terrible things and are dishonest, but they speak truth to power more than like the bozos, you know, Laura Ingram.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, it's the. It is interesting where there's a lot of people who are for whatever Trump is for because they didn't really have that strong of an ideology. They really want power and money, success, whatever it is. So they just go along with what Trump wants. And then there are the people that really did have an ideological agenda they cared about to whom they view Trump as useful. And it's where that pops up. Like, you know, you have these House Freedom Caucus members. A lot of them went along with this bill. But like someone like Thomas Massie is willing to go on the floor and say this is still a bad bill and you can't convince me otherwise. Like there is, you know, that speaks to a genuine belief that that person has. I think it's wrong.

[Jon Favreau]

But then he voted for it.

[Jon Lovett]

No. Didn't Massie vote?

[Jon Favreau]

Did Thomas.

[Elijah Cohn]

I think Massey voted no.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, I thought they got all who's.

[Jon Lovett]

Now it was two of them, Massey and somebody else. Anyway, sorry.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I think Massie was trying to raise money off of.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, that's right.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Trump went after him.

[Jon Favreau]

Dan, you said that you respect Scott Jennings. That's who you're.

[Elijah Cohn]

No No, I think you misheard me. Yeah, I agree with Lovett. There's none of them that I respect in any way, shape or form. It is interesting, but the people I respect less are the Fox News people and Brett Baer in particular. Like, the fact that we're in a world where Laura Loomer has more journalistic integrity than Brett Baer is something that I would hope would keep Brett Baer up at night in his very, very large mansion in Palm Beach. But I suspect it doesn't.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Bret Bear, like, he really has become like kind of the lead Pravda guy at Fox News. He is the house organ. And it's not just that he interviews Trump. He interviews a cabinet official every other night for some sort of gauzy one hour thing. And Trump went to the UAE and Qatar. He interviewed the Prime Minister and gave them both kind of like softball, hour long, whatever, like specials.

[Jon Lovett]

Do you think that the reason the Palm beach houses of these Fox News anchors keep getting bigger is because they're like the Winchester widow and they need to sleep in a different bed each night to evade the ghosts that haunt them for what they've done and from which they've reaped their great rewards?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I was thinking that.

[Elijah Cohn]

Yes, it was my first thought this morning.

[Jon Lovett]

Yes, you're thinking that.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

What's the Winchester Widow?

[Jon Lovett]

The Winchester widow, she inherited the fortune from the Winchester gun company from her husband. And she built this elaborate mansion, but never stopped constructing it because she would like to sleep in a different room because she felt she was haunted by the ghosts of the people killed by the weapons. And so it's this maze like structure, dark.

[Elijah Cohn]

What's the origin of the story?

[Jon Lovett]

The Winchester widow. But that's it. What do you mean?

[Elijah Cohn]

I mean, did someone write it?

[Jon Lovett]

Like, oh, I don't know.

[Elijah Cohn]

Okay.

[Jon Lovett]

You mean, like, where did I hear from it. I don't know. I don't know what fucking rattles around. I saw. I read a book or I saw a TikTok. The latter.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

No, I.

[Jon Favreau]

The content people come here for.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I'm googling it for you.

[Jon Favreau]

Maybe it's just because I listened to the interview last night. I thought Ross Davitt did a good job with J.D. vance.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Did he? The daily part. He didn't push back at all.

[Jon Favreau]

That's the problem, Tony. It's like, first of all, it was a good lesson doing the interview about the interview you just did.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Lame.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah. We've thought a couple times about should we talk about the interview after listening to five minutes of the Daily doing That I was like, absolutely not. Why am I listening to this? I should listen to the actual interview between Ross and J.D.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Vince and Ross is famously against masturbation too, so.

[Jon Lovett]

Well, yeah.

[Elijah Cohn]

Did that come up in the interview, John?

[Jon Favreau]

Can't agree with him on everything. You know.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

You'Re jerk yourself off on the Daily.

[Jon Favreau]

But he did, you know, he pushed J.D. vance on immigration and some other like. Oh, so you're a Catholic Christian and you believe this? And JD Vance was fucking smug and awful as ever.

[Jon Lovett]

I do want to. I want to. I want to modulate my joke earlier, which was really just about J.D. vance being irritating. Not. I actually want to listen to the conversation. I don't. I think there's a lot of like knee jerk Ross Douthat hate in the world that I'm not a participant in.

[Jon Favreau]

No, I like him. Yeah. And I don't even know if he's like a. Like, he's a conservative. That's interesting because I don't think he's anti Trump, but I don't think he's pro Trump either. He's.

[Jon Lovett]

No, I don't put him in. I think he's. Yeah, no, I think he's an interesting. I actually don't put him in that category.

[Jon Favreau]

But Scott Jennings is definitely my least favorite. Or maybe tied with Batya Ungar. Sargon.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Oh, yeah, Tough one.

[Jon Favreau]

Because she's sort of a new character. This.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Well, they're all coming off that Abby Phillips evening panel and she's like, poor Abby, stop booking them.

[Jon Favreau]

She's doing a good job trying to deal with it. But what's your take on Blue Sky? Can it be good or will it discourse itself to death?

[Elijah Cohn]

This seems so far up your alley, John. Let us know.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, boy.

[Jon Lovett]

Are you on there.

[Jon Favreau]

I check in once a week. Once a couple times a week.

[Elijah Cohn]

Just like a wellness check. Like, what's up?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, like a po. What are you talking about?

[Jon Lovett]

So I. Yeah, otherwise his ankle starts beating. He's gotta blow into the tube and make sure. Otherwise he gets in trouble.

[Jon Favreau]

Well, here's the thing, guys. Some of the people that we like and follow a lot on Twitter are now, like, mostly posting on Blue Sky. Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow, like, they're mostly there. And so I wanna, like, see what's going on. And then every time I go in my mentions, there's a lot of people being like, you guys gotta come over to Blue Sky. Tell John and Tommy to come over and Dan and what's going on? You know, So I go over and like, I'm always trying it out. I went yesterday and people are very mad Lovett that you and I are hosting a Jake Tepper elixir.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I've been meaning to bring that up.

[Jon Favreau]

Book event. Little do they know that Jake might actually come on the pod. But, like, so I sort of tweeted something or posted or skeeted. Skee did something about it. And then my mentions flooded with just. Someone told me to throw myself down a mineshaft.

[Jon Lovett]

That seems more like Twitter energy.

[Jon Favreau]

But it is Twitter. Yeah, totally. Twitter energy. And then they're like, fuck, go back to the Nazi site. You know, so there's a lot of that, and then there's a lot of nice people that are like, here's what you need to do. And then someone told me that there is a way to filter out all the mentions from people that you don't follow on there, which you can do on Twitter and improve my Twitter experience.

[Jon Lovett]

Delete it from your phone.

[Jon Favreau]

They didn't have it at first in Blue sky, but now I did that and I think, man, maybe I'll give it another whirl.

[Jon Lovett]

I am. Sarah Longwell was talking. They did. I was listening to Sarah and Tim and JBL talking on the Bulwark, and she was saying how she's been trying to avoid consuming, trying to, like, not consume as much opinion and more straight facts so that she can know that she's forming her own opinions. And I've just been. I've been feeling just like, I don't know, just the. The relentlessness of Trump, the kind of onslaught of it. Like, I've been feeling my inability to focus getting worse in the last couple of weeks. And so I took Twitter off my phone again because I am trying to just, like, let me just read the stories and show up. And, you know, what if I'm like, you know, like, I just. I don't want to, like, run my opinions through the machine as much as I've been doing. So I, like, took it off my phone for a while, see how that goes.

[Jon Favreau]

Okay. And Tommy, you're not skeeting anytime soon.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Never signed up for it. Everything I hear about it makes me feel like that was the right decision.

[Elijah Cohn]

Can I defend Blue sky for a sec?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, I just, like, I would love an alternative to Twitter, but I just don't want to deal with, like, lib on leftist violence all day long. And it sounds like that's what it is.

[Elijah Cohn]

Here's where Bluesky, I think, can be most useful, is all of our Twitter feeds. Everyone we followed over the 10 or so years we've been on Twitter is such a disaster now that you can kind of start fresh in bluesky. I don't post there very often, but I do look at it and I basically just only follow reporters and it is actually a much better way when something happens to just go to your following tab on bluesky, which is just all reporters that I followed in the last couple of years here. And you just get people telling you what's happening in the news. That is the closest thing to the Twitter 20112012 experience of it as a in real time news site. Just as a general rule, whether it is Twitter Blue sky, don't read your mentions, John. It's like I see, I see your mention sometimes because I see your tweets and they'll tell you you're not getting a better experience on X. I'll tell.

[Jon Lovett]

You that right now.

[Jon Favreau]

Well, that's what I'm saying. That's why, oddly enough, my experience on X has been better for the last several months than Blue Sky.

[Elijah Cohn]

Because you have your blinders on.

[Jon Favreau]

I hid the mentions on X. Yeah.

[Elijah Cohn]

You need your blue sky blinders too, for sure.

[Jon Favreau]

But I also, to that point about the news and Sarah's point, I made a list on Twitter that's called just news and it's just following reporters because I have the same thing. It's like sometimes you just want the latest news and you don't want people's opinion.

[Elijah Cohn]

Do you have a feed on your whatever they call tweetdeck now site that's just like people you want to fight with. It's like Stephen Miller, J.D. vance, Mark Nieuw.

[Jon Favreau]

No, I don't have that. Then please don't give me that idea. But Pod Save America is brought to you by Fast Growing Trees. We got three fast growing trees in our office right now. They look spectacular.

[Jon Lovett]

So great.

[Jon Favreau]

And you know what? We've had fake trees in the office. There's just no substitute for the real thing yesterday. And I know that now that I've seen the fast growing trees in the office.

[Jon Lovett]

Yesterday they were waist high. Today through the roof. These things are growing fast. It's crazy.

[Jon Favreau]

We got a forever goalie tree, a Thuha Green giant tree, and a Mosera Deliciosa Swiss cheese plant. Lovett's been trying to eat it.

[Jon Lovett]

Nice. It got me.

[Jon Favreau]

Did you know Fast Growing Trees is the biggest online nursery in the US with thousands of different plants and over 2 million happy customers. They get all the plants your yard needs, like fruit trees, privacy trees, flowering trees, shrubs, and so much more. Whatever plants you're interested in, fast Growing Trees has you covered. Find the perfect fit for your climate and space. Fast Growing Trees makes it easy to get your dream yard order online. Get your plants delivered directly to your door in just a few days without ever leaving home. Their alive and thrive guarantee ensures your plants arrive happy and healthy. Plus, get support from trained plant experts on call to help you plan your landscape, choose the right plants and learn how to care for them. We love fast growing trees. Have them in the office. I got some at home too, so it's always nice to have a plant expert telling you which plants to get and where they should go. This spring they have the best deals for your yard, up to half off on select plants and other deals and listeners to our show get 15% off their first purchase when using the code Cricut at checkout. That's an additional 15% off at fastgrowingtrees.com using the code Cricut at checkout fastgrowingtrees.com code crooked now's the perfect time to plant. Use Crooked to save today. Offer is valid for a limited time. Terms and conditions may apply. Pod Save America is brought to you by Rocket Money Tariffs are trending, but what does that actually mean for your wallet? Probably nothing good. With all the tariff headlines lately, you might be wondering how does this affect my day to day? Higher tariffs can mean higher prices on goods from groceries to gadgets. Let Rocket Money help you stay one step ahead and keep more money in your pocket. Uh oh. Rocket Money's gonna end up in a truth social post if it keeps talking about how tariffs are gonna lead to higher prices. Big problems. Big problems. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your sa. Rocket Money's dashboard gives you a clear view of your expenses across all of your accounts. Easily create a personalized budget with custom categories to help keep your spending on track. See your monthly spending trends in each category to know exactly where your money is going. Get alerts if bills increase in price, there's unusual spending activity, or if you're close to going over budget. Rocket Money will even try to negotiate lower bills for you. The new Goals feature automatically saves money for you so you don't have to think about it. Help pay off bills, put away money for a house, or just build your savings. Rocket Money makes it easy. Rocket Money has over 5 million users and has saved a total of $500 million in canceled subscriptions, saving members up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features. We've all used Rocket Money here to cancel some subscriptions. Sometimes you gotta use it a couple times just to make sure that you're not letting those subscriptions piled up without knowing it. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter our show name Pod Save America in the survey so they know we sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from our show. All right. Another question. I can't figure out how to use AI in my day to day. I don't want to fall behind, but I just can't find a good use for it. Do you guys use it? Any tips on how it's useful or how I can get started?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It's just a much better Google search. Google's terrible now it's been ruined and I don't know whether it's perplexity or chat GPT or whatever. Pick your poison, Claude Llama.

[Jon Favreau]

It's hard to keep. It's really hard to keep them all straight.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah. Porcupine. Like whatever the. These things are like, they're all just better.

[Jon Favreau]

Hedgehog.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Hedgehog. Hog Wild.

[Elijah Cohn]

Yeah, that's a different site.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

You can draw funny pictures. I tried to make an only Dan's logo. I'll see if I can pull it up here. It wasn't that good. So the visual part is not there yet.

[Jon Lovett]

Only dance. I like it.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I'll show you.

[Jon Favreau]

I use it as Google as a better Google.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, I'm like really kind of viewing it as more like of a novelty that I'm experimenting with and throwing things in there to see what comes out. I don't use it as a Google that often. I find it useful to me in moments where I'm stuck. Like if you're just stuck trying to figure something out, it'll break out of it. Wow, that is a. That is a.

[Jon Favreau]

Why is that Dan? That's like Dan crossed with Scott Jennings.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It's A.I.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, no, we. Yeah, no, no, we. We got that. It was AI for sure. The conversation we're having. But the.

[Jon Favreau]

Well, that's why it doesn't look like.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, it doesn't look like him yet, but it will. I. And so like there was a couple days ago I was like trying to write a description of something and it was a tough thing to hit the tone, right. And I was just like, struggling. And so I just said like, hey, help me, help me come up with a sentence or two to help describe this. And it's for. It's for an upcoming series we're going to do. And I didn't use basically any of it, but it gave me like, one sentence that was like, smarter than what I had come up with myself, to be honest. And I was like, oh, that works. Let me take that. And then I can write something to it to figure it out. I think it's like a. It's a block obliterator. You know, it'll just, like throw. It'll. It's relentless. So you can just get a bunch of ideas and maybe you grab one and then you can keep working, keep writing, think of something. But. But other than that, I haven't yet really cracked why it's. I mean, I don't know, maybe it's helping people move faster, but I use.

[Elijah Cohn]

It all day, every day.

[Jon Lovett]

Really? What's your preference?

[Elijah Cohn]

I use it as, like, for Google. I never Google anything anymore. I ask it, like, very specific questions to find answers to. I will use it to synthesize data. Like, I will upload a large poll and ask it for a set of findings to answer certain questions or test the premise. I will use it. I never use it for writing per se, but I will use it the same way you do. Love it. Which is like, I am stuck. I'm trying to write something and it's like you've used the same descriptive word like three times and you're trying to. What's another way to say this? I use that. I will upload a full message box and I will ask for 10 title suggestions and almost never do I end up using the ones they actually have. But it always helps me figure out. Figure it out. I use it for a lot of research and really synthesize large data sets into easily understandable things. And you can use it to make. I'm not very good at this, but to use it to make charts and graphics.

[Jon Lovett]

The part that I find troubling about it still is, let's say, ask it a question about the news. And most of the time it's giving you a useful synthesis of various articles. And that's great. But it's trained on certain data sets. And one of them is that Joe Biden was a lot of what it was trained on was a time when Joe Biden was president. And so you'll ask it a question and you'll be like, wait a second, this answer still thinks Joe Biden is president, and so, like, oh, wow. It's really. If you were working with someone day to day, it was Mike Donnellan and it was Mike Donilon. It was. Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm using Mike Donilon 4.7. But if you were working with somebody and they were really, really smart, but every once in a while thought it was 1997, you'd be like, oh, you. I can't trust you.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

You know, so that's makes. Makes me nervous.

[Elijah Cohn]

I make it double check it's worth. I make it double check it's worse all the time. Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Are you sure this is correct?

[Elijah Cohn]

Yeah.

[Jon Favreau]

Oh, it's so.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It's so obnoxious. It's going to hate me.

[Jon Favreau]

Hey, I'm about to say this on a podcast. Are you sure?

[Elijah Cohn]

What.

[Jon Lovett]

I saw something that really kind of like, was. I tried it and it was. It was interesting. I got. Again, this is just like, just coming up with questions to ask to kind of learn about it. But it said you don't just ask it a question. You say, assemble a group of experts to help me answer this question. Assemble a marketing person, a political person, a strategist, an expert on YouTube. Have them meet and discuss this question and decide on an answer together. And then. And show me what they did. And like, they have a meeting and then you, like, reply and you say.

[Jon Favreau]

Do you give them a lunch break?

[Jon Lovett]

What? Usually you reply and you say, all right, this is a great first draft, but remember, this whole team gets fired if it's not perfect. And they're like, all right, back to the drawing board, everybody. Here we go. We got to really pull off a great meeting.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Wow, you're really.

[Jon Favreau]

You're into it.

[Jon Lovett]

I'm learning.

[Elijah Cohn]

I also use it for recipes all the time. Like, I want to make this because it's very, like, what it allows you to do is like, well, I don't have this. And then I'll give you a new version with the thing.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Smart.

[Jon Favreau]

That's good.

[Elijah Cohn]

You can.

[Jon Lovett]

I've.

[Elijah Cohn]

I've read you can do. So I've never done it. You can take a picture of your fridge, upload the chatgpt, and it'll offer things based on what's in your fridge, what you can cook. I've never done it, but I've read that that's something you can do.

[Jon Favreau]

Cool.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Creepy, though.

[Jon Favreau]

All right, next question. Tommy and John, any comments on the Celtics demise? Dan, any Comments on the 76ers? Whatever is going on with them, I only caught. Let's see the. The first game where we blew a 20 point lead and then I tuned in right before Jason Tatum got hurt. That was it. That's all I had for the Celtics.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah. So our best player is out for at least a year. I mean, it's an Achilles. So, like, why you wouldn't bring him back at this point? Our two best players both got supermax contracts. We're about. Dan, do you understand the NBA salary cap? I don't. There's something called the second apron.

[Elijah Cohn]

It is.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

We're apparently above that and there's a bunch of restrictions.

[Elijah Cohn]

Yes. So we're at the. Unravel the two. You have to get below the second apron because if you're on the second apron two years in a row, in addition to having a giant half billion dollar tax payment, you also have real restrictions about what players you can sign, how you can use your various cap slots. And so they have to get below it because they have to trade some of the members on the team. Most likely True Holiday or Kristaps Porzingis, who's at the.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, he's at the. He also had a weird health thing.

[Elijah Cohn]

So we're fucked.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

We're at the end of this little run.

[Elijah Cohn]

I don't think DraftKings or FanDuel, whoever like me, make this bet right now, but I would put $100 down right now that the Celtics will win the 2026 NBA Draft Lottery.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Oh, because you think it's rigged?

[Elijah Cohn]

Yeah, for sure.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Okay.

[Elijah Cohn]

Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Like Dallas.

[Elijah Cohn]

Maybe it's. Maybe it's rigged. By God. That's possible. It's not. But every time that something like this happens, this is how the spurs got Tim Duncan. It's how the Mavs got Cooper Flagg. It's how miraculously, six weeks after Anthony Davis left New Orleans, they got Zion Williamson. So this is a bet I would be willing to make.

[Jon Lovett]

It's interesting because it would make sense to me that the same God rigging a draft for the Celtics would be the one that made Donald Trump president.

[Elijah Cohn]

That's a good point.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It's a solid, tough, tough affair.

[Jon Favreau]

Sorry, Boston from Catsy and Catsy and Cats. Anyway, Cats and Cats. Cats and Cats. Catsy and Cats. Is there anyone in the cricket office who beats favs for screen time? Is there a dark horse we're unaware of?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Probably.

[Jon Favreau]

I got some.

[Elijah Cohn]

It's Elijah, right?

[Jon Favreau]

It's Elijah. It's Austin. I believe it is. Two of the other hosts of this podcast. The only one who gets off here is Lovett.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, that's Right. Thank you. I got off here in all kinds of places.

[Jon Favreau]

I'm guessing Dan, because I am on text chains with Dan so often that I know he must be looking at screens. And Tommy is just, just as bad as me.

[Jon Lovett]

I think I just described about his Tucker Carlson interview in the evening.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

It was deep research.

[Jon Lovett]

It was deep research. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But chatgpt.

[Jon Favreau]

Do you want to defend yourself, Dan? Are you.

[Elijah Cohn]

I'm online way too much. There's no question about that. The difference is you're just now become such a poster. That's like, we always know when you're online. You're always posting.

[Jon Favreau]

Always be posting. Always be posting. This is from Lovett. Always. Cracks me up. What a surprise that Lovett chose this question.

[Jon Lovett]

I like the question. I like the question.

[Jon Favreau]

I don't know. What are your favorite RPGs of all time?

[Jon Lovett]

Thank you. Love it. Cracks me up. All right, here's my list. This is the only notes I took for this whole soul record.

[Jon Favreau]

You hung. You hung. You hung back for the rest.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah.

[Jon Lovett]

Bloodborne. Bloodborne.

[Jon Favreau]

I did.

[Jon Lovett]

Demon souls, Dark Souls 3, Elden Ring. Those are all part of the kind of fromsoftware universe. I love Skyrim. I love Fallout, some of those games. Dishonored is not technically an rpg. I think it's RPG adjacent. But I really like the world building. Deus Ex Human Revolution was a Great game. Diablo 3, Diablo 4 are on the list. But I do think those games are basically a kind of drug and are dangerous. They're dangerous. They grab you. They don't let you go. They're kind of. They hook you with the serotonin loop. Not an rpg. But Subnautica is a great game that's about building up your abilities. It has some RPG vibes, even though it's obviously not an rpg. And then I am very excited to play Baldur's Gate 3 and Disco Elysium.

[Jon Favreau]

Wow. I used to like RPGs when I was a Nintendo kid. And then I liked your final fantasies. Chrono triggers. Old school.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, that's. That was.

[Jon Favreau]

Then I stopped. Then I stopped. In college.

[Elijah Cohn]

I played. I played Skyrim and Fallout in an earlier period of my life.

[Jon Lovett]

That's great, Dan. I like those games. I really got into Skyrim.

[Jon Favreau]

Last question. Based on the Internet debate of could 100 men kill a gorilla without weapons? Crooked has about 100 employees. Could the Crooked staff kill a gorilla?

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Not in a million years.

[Jon Lovett]

Oh, here's the thing.

[Elijah Cohn]

Nor would they.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Look around this fucking place.

[Jon Lovett]

Nor would they. Here's the thing. Look, I love our. Here's the thing. Crooked. What I'm about to say is gonna just. You're gonna have to bear with what I'm gonna say.

[Jon Favreau]

This is the one you didn't prepare for.

[Jon Lovett]

But we're. I love how many different parts of the pride flag are represented at this company. Oh, my gosh. But I do think it puts us at a disadvantage against the gorilla. I'm sorry. You know, that. You know, I just think that, like, we gotta put a lot of our he hims at the front and some of our. And a lot of just gotta get those he hims up ahead. Sorry. We're sending in the he hims and the. And the she hers and the they thems we're hanging back. And then.

[Jon Favreau]

You know what? I wouldn't put too much stock in the he hims as one of them. I don't think I would.

[Jon Lovett]

My actual view on the defeating of the gorilla is it's actually not about whether the gorilla loses. The gorilla will lose. It's about whether you are one of the first five to ten humans to go into that fight. Because a couple people are going down and they're going down hard. A gorilla can lift like £2,000. Gorillas are strong. But a hundred of us, we're going to beat the gorilla, but we're just going to take some pretty heavy losses early on. That's the problem. That's what's going to happen, I'm sorry to say. Arms are going to be ripped off, faces torn apart. It's going to be a ugly battle, but we're going to tire that gorilla out. All right. We're going to be able to coordinate using what language?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

If I had 100 Aaron Donalds and the first 50 were ready to die, maybe, but like, you would need 100.

[Elijah Cohn]

Aaron Donalds to beat one gorilla.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I think you have to send waves of 10 to gang up on it.

[Elijah Cohn]

Why wouldn't you send all 100 at a time?

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Because you can't. There's not that much surface area.

[Jon Lovett]

Yeah, well, yeah, I think you definitely need at least 10 to move in at once. But I just think then the gorilla's going down. It's luck of the drop.

[Jon Favreau]

Who are we sending first to the gorilla?

[Jon Lovett]

What?

[Jon Favreau]

Who are we sending first? Yeah, Carol's good.

[Jon Lovett]

Get some.

[Jon Favreau]

I think Ben Hefco could up there.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Yeah, well, he does an impression.

[Jon Lovett]

Is he here? Who's not here? We'll send them.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I gotta follow up from Love it.

[Jon Lovett]

Actually.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

No, sorry. This is from the Love it show on Earth. What if it was 100 gorilla sized ducks?

[Jon Lovett]

100 gorilla sized ducks? Well, I think is 100. Oh my God.

[Elijah Cohn]

That's duck.

[Jon Favreau]

That's a big. That's a scary lot of them too. Yeah, we're in that.

[Elijah Cohn]

I think you could beat the ducks. I don't think you could beat a hundred duck sized gorillas though.

[Jon Lovett]

100 ducks.

[Elijah Cohn]

It's like Ant man, sort of.

[Jon Favreau]

I think so would they have. They have.

[Jon Lovett]

Is it one person versus 100 gorilla.

[Jon Favreau]

Ducks or is it the whole. Is it each staff got a duck sized gorilla?

[Elijah Cohn]

I don't know.

[Jon Favreau]

That's actually the Christmas present. That's the holiday present this year.

[Jon Lovett]

I'll tell you. Either way we're going to hear about it from the union. It's going to be a tough one. It's not in the job description. That would be a tough ask.

[Jon Favreau]

The CBA specifies that they are not supposed to go first.

[Elijah Cohn]

There's no anti combat.

[Jon Favreau]

Yeah, senior staff going after the grill.

[Jon Lovett]

No one from senior staff was in the first wave going at the gorilla. Lot of no senior producers going in first.

[Jon Favreau]

All right, thank you for your questions, everyone. Scabbard. Big thanks to all of our friends at the POD subscribers for sending in questions. We'll be back with a regular episode on Friday. Don't forget, you can [e-mail] friends to unlock a ton of great perks including subscription only shows like Polar Coaster with Dan Pfeiffer. Add free episodes of Pod Save America. Pod Save the World. Love it or leave it and offline. To get started and learn more, head to cricket.com friends if you want to listen to Pod Save America ad free or get access to our subscriber discord and exclusive podcasts. Consider joining our friends of the pod [e-mail] friends or subscribe on Apple Podcasts directly from the Pod Save America feed. Also, be sure to follow Pod Save America on TikTok, Instagram, Twitter and YouTube for full episodes, bonus content and more. And before you hit that next button, you can help boost this episode by leaving us a review and by sharing it with friends and family. Pod Save America is a crooked media production. Our producers are David Toledo and Saul Rubin. Our associate producer is Farah Safari. Reid Churlin is our executive editor and Adrienne Hill is our executive producer. Producer. The show is mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Jordan Kanter is our sound engineer with audio support from Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis. Madelyn Herringer is our head of news and programming. Matt De Groat is our head of production. Naomi Sengel is our executive assistant. Thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Hayley Jones, Ben Hethcoat, Mia Kelman, Molly Lobel, Kiril Pelaviev, and David Toles, our production staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.

[Jon Lovett]

In the red corner, the undisputed, undefeated weed whacker guy, champion of hurling grass and pollen everywhere.

[Jon Favreau]

And in the blue corner, the challenger, Extra strength Hanaday.

[Jon Lovett]

I dropped that work all day to prevent the release of histamines that cause itchy allergy eyes.

[Jon Favreau]

And the winner by knockout is Pataday.

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Pataday.

[Jon Lovett]

Bring it on.

[Tommy Vitor]

Work management platforms. Ugh. Endless onboarding. It bottlenecks admin requests. But what if things were different? We found love in an open Monday.com is different different no lengthy onboarding, beautiful reports in minutes, custom workflows you can build on your own. Easy to use prompt free AI. Turns out you can love a work management platform. Monday. Com. The first work platform you'll love to use.