Pod Save the World: "ISIS Terror in Australia"
Crooked Media | December 17, 2025
Hosts: Tommy Vietor & Ben Rhodes
Guest: Zanny Minton Beddoes (Editor-in-Chief, The Economist)
Episode Overview
This high-stakes episode of Pod Save the World focuses on the recent ISIS-inspired terror attack targeting a Hanukkah celebration in Australia, exploring its causes, aftermath, and implications on global anti-Semitism, gun control, and ISIS's ongoing presence in Southeast Asia. Hosts Tommy Vietor and Ben Rhodes also analyze reactions from leaders including Israeli PM Netanyahu, and discuss related developments in Latin America, Syria, Hong Kong, and global right-wing politics. The episode concludes with Ben’s in-depth interview with Zanny Minton Beddoes, Editor-in-Chief of The Economist, about the threats and trends shaping 2026 and beyond.
Main Topics and Key Insights
1. ISIS Terror Attack in Australia (07:41 – 24:09)
The Attack and Immediate Aftermath
- Location & Event: Menorah lighting at Bondi Beach, Sydney, on Hanukkah, attended by ~1,000.
- Attack Details: Two gunmen (father and son) opened fire for 10 minutes; at least 15 killed, including a child and a Holocaust survivor; dozens wounded.
- Perpetrators: Sajid Navid Akram and his son, known to authorities for possible extremist links.
- Evidence: Two homemade ISIS flags and IEDs found; recent travel to the Philippines for suspected ISIS training.
Acts of Heroism
- Ahmed Al Ahmed: Syrian-born Muslim fruit vendor, tackled and disarmed a shooter before being shot himself.
- Jackson Doolin: Lifeguard who ran 1.5 km to help, iconic image of bravery.
- Anonymous Rescuers: Strangers shielding children, leading to moving stories of survival.
"The two worst people in the world combined with this amazing heroism."
— Tommy Vietor (09:49)
Rising Anti-Semitism in Australia
- Spike since October 7th: Quadrupled anti-Semitic incidents, including arson.
- Gun Control: PM Albanese pledges new measures, referencing Australia's track record since 1996.
Hosts' Reflections
- Both hosts strongly condemn attempts to justify such attacks as retaliation for Israeli policies.
"To target Jewish people on the other side of the planet because you're mad about something that the Israeli government is doing... is the fucking inverse of the thing that you say you don't like about what’s happening in Gaza."
— Ben Rhodes (11:15)
2. Politics & Reactions: Israel, Australia, and Global Responses (14:08 – 19:44)
Netanyahu’s Response
- Links the attack to Australia's recognition of the Palestinian state, blaming “fuel” for anti-Semitism.
- Albanese (Australia’s PM) rejects any such causation.
“I can't overstate how sad I find those comments from Netanyahu... these terrorists were motivated by Australia recognizing a Palestinian state? ...If these guys are ISIS inspired, if they trained with ISIS, I’m pretty sure they’re not ‘two-state solution’ guys.”
— Tommy Vietor (15:15)
- Hosts decry politicians exploiting tragedy for political gain, stressing that support for a Palestinian state is mainstream and not related to terrorism.
3. The Philippines Connection & ISIS Resilience (19:44 – 24:09)
Southeast Asian Extremism
- Recap of extremist history in the Philippines and Indonesia: Jemaah Islamiyah, Moro Islamic Liberation Front, and local ISIS affiliates.
- 2017: Major ISIS-linked siege in the Philippines, government response included military and reintegration efforts.
“What this kind of shows is kind of the resilience of that ideology in that part of the world...”
— Ben Rhodes (22:13)
Concerns Raised
- Return of global attention to ISIS as their ideology proves persistent.
- Calls for vigilance without overreaction or neglect.
4. U.S. Regime Change and Escalation in Latin America (27:01 – 36:20)
Trump Administration’s “War on Venezuela”
- Recent U.S. military strikes on boats (“war on drugs”) and oil tanker seizures are, in reality, about regime change, not narcotics.
- Secretary of State Marco Rubio views toppling Maduro (Venezuela) as the key to "freeing" Cuba, echoing Cold War logic.
“What we're seeing before our eyes is a regime change operation. But they won’t say it... This is just like a policy built on a pyramid of dishonesty.”
— Ben Rhodes (30:11)
- Discussion of the strategic and cynical use of drugs and oil as justifications.
- Emphasis on the potentially disastrous regional consequences, including forced migration and destabilization.
Latin American Politics: Rightward Tilt
- Surging right-wing victories across Latin America, tied to public fears over security and immigration.
- Concern about U.S. influence and encouragement of autocratic tendencies.
“They want regime change in Venezuela and Cuba. Then essentially what they want is all across the Western Hemisphere, they want compliant, right wing, soft autocratic... leaders that provide us with the natural resources we want.”
— Ben Rhodes (34:35)
5. Global Far-Right Trends & European Elections (Intro, 05:46-06:06, Interview 75:30 onward)
- "Pod Save the World" nerd-outs on global elections: UK (Reform’s rise), Germany (AfD surge), France (National Rally).
- Preview: Ben interviews Zanny Minton Beddoes about the “ceiling” for Europe’s far right, threats to democracy, and links to global populism.
6. Attack on U.S. Troops in Syria: Why Are We Still There? (48:26 – 53:29)
- U.S. soldiers killed in ambush by former ISIS member in Syrian security forces.
- Hosts criticize lack of strategic clarity for U.S. troop presence.
“Why are these guys over there? Why are National Guard troops [in Syria]?”
— Tommy Vietor (51:10)
- Discussion of unsustainable “forever war” logic and misleading rationales for continued deployments.
7. Hong Kong: The End of Press Freedom (56:00 – 60:47)
- Jimmy Lai Verdict: Life sentence for pro-democracy media mogul under China’s imposed security law.
- Trump and Starmer (UK) give lip service but seem ready to deprioritize Lai in dealings with China.
“This is like the death knell... of democracy and civil liberties in Hong Kong.”
— Ben Rhodes (60:15)
8. U.S. Immigration & Surveillance Overreach (61:35 – 65:52)
- State Dept. proposes “social media vetting” for all visa waiver applicants.
- Severe privacy and freedom-of-expression concerns, especially as it could be used to filter out Trump critics.
"We're just closed for business... It's going to harm tourism and just be generally stupid."
— Tommy Vietor (65:52)
9. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “It’s textbook terrorism and it’s indefensible.” — Ben Rhodes (12:53)
- “Netanyahu cannot help but make this tragedy about his own political project.” — Tommy Vietor (16:33)
- "You want to see a moment where we’re just mourning the loss... but Netanyahu cannot help but make this tragedy... about his own political project." — Tommy Vietor (16:33)
- On Philippines: “The ISIS problem has been kind of under the rug for a while... Is this kind of regenerating?” — Ben Rhodes (23:29)
- On Venezuela policy: "It is just going to sort out all the people that I would like to see. I feel this personally, but it's already affecting the ability to have... [global democracy] convenings." — Ben Rhodes (63:35)
Interview: Zanny Minton Beddoes, Editor-in-Chief, The Economist (75:30 – 105:53)
Rise of the Far Right in Europe
- Fragmentation of center-left and center-right parties; populist right in the ascendant.
- By late 2020s, far-right may govern major European countries: France (National Rally), UK (Reform), Germany (AfD, despite stronger firewall).
- Italy’s Meloni cited as an example of populist right governing more moderately than feared.
- 2026 seen as “pivotal year” for Europe’s political trajectory.
Implications for Ukraine
- U.S. no longer a reliable ally; Ukraine must build self-defense, integrate with European security.
- Far-right victories in Europe could further undermine Ukraine’s support.
- Likelihood of a peace deal low; any future arrangement likely temporary and unstable.
The End of the Old World Order
- Free trade, rules-based order “has, I think, definitively gone.”
- Most countries still operate under WTO norms, but the system frays at the edges.
- “Where do the rules-based order people go?” Europe faces an identity crisis, needs to adapt, not cling to nostalgia.
AI, Economic Bubbles, and Social Upheaval
- AI will trigger transformational change, potentially larger than globalization’s impact.
- Anticipation of a destabilizing “AI Three Mile Island” event to spur global guardrails.
- Cautionary note: political economy of rapid change, social dislocation, and the risk of backlash.
The Economist’s Ideology Evolution
“We champion proudly classical liberal values... It’s a set of values, not an ideology, and... we should not be blindly fealty to a set of policies.”
— Zanny Minton Beddoes (102:09)
- Commitment to rigorous analysis, willingness to update views as the facts change.
Additional Segments
- Jared Kushner’s failed Serbia deal: More evidence of international Trump-Kushner corruption (67:12).
- Liz Truss podcast snippets: Satirical look at the U.K.'s embattled right wing (70:07).
LISTEN-AT-A-GLANCE TIMESTAMPS
- 07:41 – Horrific attack in Australia: facts, heroes, context
- 14:08 – Netanyahu blames Australia's Palestinian recognition
- 19:44 – Philippines connection, terrorism in SE Asia
- 27:01 – Trump’s regime change campaign in Venezuela
- 36:20 – Latin America’s rightward tilt
- 48:26 – US troops killed in Syria, “forever war” debate
- 56:00 – Jimmy Lai verdict & Hong Kong’s media death
- 61:35 – US visa waiver, social media surveillance
- 67:12 – Jared Kushner’s failed Serbia deal
- 70:07 – The Liz Truss podcast recapped
- 75:30 – Economist interview: Europe, order, AI, press freedom
Conclusion & Episode Tone
Throughout the episode, Vietor and Rhodes provide sharp, irreverent, and deeply informed commentary, balancing outrage at world events with pockets of dry wit and empathy, especially toward victims of violence and extremism. Their marquee interview with Zanny Minton Beddoes is substantial, providing a timely, “bigger picture” look at global instability as the world heads into a fraught 2026.
Recommended for listeners seeking a global, progressive, forthright assessment of world events—with historical context, policy insight, and a touch of gallows humor.