Pod Save the World – "Trump Flirts With Nuclear Annihilation"

Date: November 5, 2025
Hosts: Tommy Vietor & Ben Rhodes

Episode Overview

This week’s episode dives into a whirlwind of recent global and US foreign policy developments, led by Tommy Vietor and Ben Rhodes. The pair scrutinize Trump’s alarming foreign policy decisions—from threatening military action in Nigeria to signaling a return to nuclear testing. They also discuss atrocities unfolding in Sudan, controversial happenings inside the Israeli justice system, and curbs on US refugee admissions, before closing with a slate of international election highlights. The show features a rich, in-depth interview with former Finnish Prime Minister Sanna Marin about authoritarian threats, the current state of European security, and the obstacles facing young and especially female leaders.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Remembering Dick Cheney: Legacy, Irony, and Hypocrisy

[01:56 – 06:51]

• The episode opens with dark humor about Dick Cheney’s recent death, reflecting on the former VP's legacy intertwined with foreign policy disasters, his notorious lack of remorse, and his last-minute pivot away from Trump.
• Both hosts express frustration at the political normalization of Cheney’s record:
  Ben: "He plowed the ground for Trump. His rampant dishonesty … helped create this monster and then he saw it and he's like, oh, I don't like that." [03:07]
• They critique performative public statements after controversial figures’ deaths, suggesting silence is sometimes more appropriate. Tommy: "You don't have to glorify these people. … Saying nothing is available." [06:36]

2. Trump’s Nigeria Comments—Fox News Drives Foreign Policy Panic

[09:51 – 16:47]

• Trump threatens military invasion of Nigeria after seeing a Fox News segment about Christian persecution.
• The hosts explain the actual sectarian complexity in Nigeria—most Boko Haram victims are Muslims, and land/resource conflicts don’t equate to genocide.
• US Africa Command staff reportedly scrambled to draft military options in response to his social media post. Tommy: "Can you just imagine how freaked out, like, your average Nigerian was? … This is just going to pour gas on [sectarian tensions]." [13:23] Ben: "It's so obvious that he will occasionally just see some segment on Fox ... and then all of a sudden, we're on the cusp of war." [13:32]
• They flag the racialized undertones of US concern only for Christian lives and highlight the geopolitical costs with Africa: Ben: "Nigeria is a massively important country. … What a great way to signal: get as far away from the Americans as possible." [15:10]

3. Catastrophe in Sudan—Genocide in Darfur Ignored

[16:47 – 27:29]

• The Rapid Support Forces (RSF) have taken over Al Fasher; satellite images show the carnage and blood visible from space.
• The humanitarian disaster is described in detail, including forced executions, famine, and ethnic cleansing.
• Tommy notes the world's indifference—evangelicals now ignore Darfur, US pressure on the UAE for arming the RSF is absent, and aid agencies are hamstrung.
• The collapse of international order is highlighted: Ben: "This is what it's like to not have an international system that works. These are the kinds of things that can happen. And all people seem to be able to do about it is comment on how people aren't commenting on it enough." [21:54]
• The hosts debunk accusations of selective outrage or "whataboutism" regarding Sudan vs. Gaza, and explain who is really benefitting and fueling the violence.

4. Trump Flirts with Nuclear Annihilation—Calls for US Nuclear Testing

[27:29 – 38:20]

• Trump posts online about resuming US nuclear tests, apparently misunderstanding Russia’s recent military activities.
• The distinction is made between testing nuclear weapons (not done by the US since 1992) and testing delivery systems.
• Both hosts stress how reckless and destabilizing actual nuclear testing would be: Ben: "If you start breaking again the norm of nuclear testing ... we're back at peak Cold War. ... You start bringing back nuclear weapons with this current crowd … we're fucked." [33:33]
• They point out that restarting nuclear tests would benefit China, be environmentally disastrous, and make the world far more dangerous.

5. FBI Director Cash Patel – Outrage over Grift and Hypocrisy

[40:41 – 47:00]

• The hosts mock FBI Director Cash Patel for misusing agency jets for personal trips to his girlfriend’s events, calling out his hypocrisy after he'd previously criticized such perks under his predecessor.
• They highlight how far-right infighting (not left-wing critics) fueled the backlash.
• Patel tries to cut off plane-tracking services amid the scandal, but continues posting publicly. Tommy: "All he's doing is … sitting on his fucking phone at the FBI headquarters between private jet rides to see his girlfriend, shitty country singer ..." [44:13]

6. Israel—Detainee Abuse, Leaks, and Political Fallout

[47:00 – 53:43]

• They discuss the exposure of a brutal assault on a Palestinian detainee at an IDF facility, the leaking of video evidence, and the subsequent targeting of the whistleblower rather than the perpetrators.
• Israeli political leaders, rather than condemning the abuse, rail against the harm to Israel’s reputation. Ben: "There's just something deeply sick about government and society where the crime is leaking the evidence of the criminal activity and not the absolute dehumanization of somebody in your custody." [50:34]

7. International Elections—Glimmers of Progressive Hope

[56:31 – 60:38]

• Ireland and the Netherlands buck right-wing trends: Catherine Connolly, a progressive, wins the Irish presidency, and centrist Rob Yetton (first openly gay Dutch PM) defeats far-right Geert Wilders.
• The hosts are cautiously optimistic, noting how running youthful, authentic candidates and taking on the far right directly can work.

8. US Refugee Policy—Explicit Racism

[60:38 – 64:26]

• Trump slashes US refugee admissions to a new low of 7,500, with priority for white South Africans (“Africars”). It’s the lowest cap in history and even lower than Trump’s last term.
• The hosts stress the open racism and the collapse of legal, orderly, and moral immigration policy: Ben: "If you peel back all the layers of Trumpism, there is just like a core of racism that is fundamental to the whole project." [62:02]

9. Prince Andrew is “Cancelled”—Royal Titles and Epstein Fallout

[64:26 – 71:03]

• Prince Andrew is stripped of his titles and privileges amid revived Epstein scandal revelations.
• The hosts both laugh at the royal fallout and note the relative seriousness with which the British are (belatedly) treating such misconduct compared to other elites.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Dick Cheney's Legacy
  Ben: "He plowed the ground for Trump. ... He kind of helped create this monster and then he saw it and he's like, oh, I don't like that." [03:07]

• On Trump’s Policy Impulses
  Ben: "It's so obvious that he will occasionally just see some segment on Fox ... and then all of a sudden, we're on the cusp of war." [13:32]

• On Sudan and International Disorder
  Ben: "This is what it's like to not have an international system that works. ... And all people seem to be able to do about it is comment on how people aren't commenting on it enough." [21:54]

• On Nuclear Testing
  Ben: "You start bringing back nuclear weapons with this current crowd that's running this collection of countries, and it just ... you're just suddenly starting to play, like, much higher stakes." [33:33]

• On US Racist Refugee Policy
  Ben: "If you peel back all the layers of Trumpism, there is just like a core of racism that is fundamental to the whole project." [62:02]

Interview Highlight: Sanna Marin, Former Finnish Prime Minister

(Full interview begins ~ [74:10] — 1:14:10)

Main Topics:

• The personal and political challenges as a young female leader
  • The effect of constant scrutiny, social media hate, and societal double standards on who enters politics.
  • Marin: “We need people from all genders, different backgrounds, different age groups to participate in our democratic systems, or otherwise our democracies will fall and collapse.” [77:24]
• Finland’s decision to join NATO
  • Historical context: Finland’s long-standing concern with Russian aggression and the shock of the 2022 invasion of Ukraine.
  • Marin: “The most important thing for Finnish citizens has been always to stay independent ... At that moment it became real that only way to secure ourselves was to apply for NATO membership.” [86:11]
• Supporting Ukraine and the risk of Western hesitation
  • Marin argues for more robust military and financial support, stresses the urgency of using frozen Russian assets, and warns about sluggish Western response prolonging the war.
  • Marin: “We all could have done more and we should have done more. The little we give, and the slower that we are giving it… the longer this war will continue.” [91:54]
• Combatting the far right, authoritarianism, and political disinformation in Europe
  • Marin: “I see that there's actually two wars going on in the world ... one is the challenging of the rules-based international order ... The other is within our democracies ... with Russian influence ... pushing those pro-Russian forces into power and gain that kind of far right extremist way of thinking.” [96:26]
• Marin reflects on her future: for now, working outside politics, dedicating time to family, but doesn’t rule out returning "never say never".

Timestamps for Important Segments

| Topic | Start Time | End Time | |--------------------------------------|-------------|-------------| | Cheney legacy discussion | 01:56 | 06:51 | | Trump/Nigeria/Christian persecution | 09:51 | 16:47 | | Sudan/RSF/atrocities | 16:47 | 27:29 | | Nuclear testing/Cold War nostalgia | 27:29 | 38:20 | | Cash Patel/FBI jet scandal | 40:41 | 47:00 | | Israeli detention scandal | 47:00 | 53:43 | | Ireland & Netherlands elections | 56:31 | 60:38 | | US racist refugee policy | 60:38 | 64:26 | | Prince Andrew/royal repercussions | 64:26 | 71:03 | | Sanna Marin interview | 74:10 | 102:51 |

Episode Tone & Style

The tone is signature Crooked Media: sharp, irreverent, conversational, and accessible—but anchored by deep knowledge of global affairs. The hosts blend gallows humor ("nuclear annihilation") with earnest, often urgent analysis, openly lamenting present political trends while spotlighting glimmers of hope and activism abroad.

For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In

This episode delivers a comprehensive, cynical-yet-informed look at a global order in crisis—highlighting reckless US leadership under Trump, atrocities overlooked abroad, the undermining of international norms, and the consequences of politicized justice. The Sanna Marin interview offers a rare hopeful note on youth, gender, and resilience in contemporary politics.

Skip the ads, focus on the banter and brains—this episode is an unfiltered window into the chaos and comedy of today’s world politics.