'This is Iran's Berlin Wall moment': Omid Djalili, comedian and actor

Summary

Political Thinking with Nick Robinson
Episode: "This is Iran's Berlin Wall moment": Omid Djalili, comedian and actor
Date: February 27, 2026
Podcast Host: Nick Robinson
Guest: Omid Djalili

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Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth conversation between Nick Robinson and Omid Djalili, the British-Iranian comedian and actor. Djalili reflects on his personal story as the son of Iranian immigrants, his engagement with the Iranian protest movement, and the complex realities facing Iran today. Blending humor with grave political commentary, Djalili forcefully makes the case that Iran is at a historic turning point—a "Berlin Wall moment"—and argues for decisive action against the Islamic Republic’s regime. The discussion is rich with insights into diaspora politics, the power of art and comedy, and the burdens facing those with a public voice in times of historical change.

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Main Themes

• Iran’s Current Crisis and the Call for Change
• The Diaspora Experience and Activism
• Balancing Comedy and Political Responsibility
• Personal History: Immigration, Identity, and Growing Up in London
• Navigating Representation, Typecasting, and Responsibility in the Arts
• Reflection on Political Movements and the Future of Iran
• Complexities of Advocacy Amid Western Responses and Geopolitics

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Iran’s “Berlin Wall Moment” (01:08, 24:40)

• Djalili describes the current upheaval in Iran as akin to the fall of the Berlin Wall:

  “This is Iran’s Berlin Wall moment. With this whole thing of negotiations, we're not talking about lowering the ball, we're talking about getting rid of them. When Ronald Reagan said, 'this wall has to come down,' he meant bring it down. He didn't say, 'let’s lower it a bit.'” (Omid Djalili, 01:08 / 24:40)

• He makes a passionate case that only radical change—not incremental reforms—can bring freedom to the Iranian people.

2. The Experience of the Iranian Diaspora (02:33–04:20)

• Djalili shares the emotional turmoil of watching Iran from abroad, waking up daily to check news and social media, particularly Telegram channels used to bypass regime censorship:

  “This is pretty much the Iranian diaspora experience, which is waking up, acrid mouth, bit of water, bit of coffee, saying, are they gone yet?...All of us with a bit of a platform, we try and be the voice of the people, the voice of the voiceless.” (Omid Djalili, 02:33)

3. Risks, Pressure, and Comedy’s Role (04:47–06:47)

• Djalili explains why he rarely brings up Iranian politics in his stand-up shows, even as others try to pressure him to cancel performances out of solidarity.
• Navigating fears of regime spies attending gigs; stories of suspicious audience members and the anxiety among diaspora Iranians:

  “[Iranians] didn’t show up...because I think they were worried there’d be regime people there. But I told the audience, I doubt very much that IRGC terrorists would get a train down here and a replacement bus service from Crayford to come to this place.” (Omid Djalili, 06:11)

4. On Western Policy, Negotiations, and Military Intervention (06:47–13:51)

• Djalili expresses outrage at Western attempts to negotiate for a new nuclear deal while the regime continues its repression:

  “We feel not just let down, but we're outrageously let down, disappointed and actually offended because the people of Iran who took to the streets...did not protest for a better nuclear deal. They protested to get rid of this regime.” (07:23)

• He distinguishes between direct war and targeted military action against the regime’s core machinery (the IRGC), advocating for “removing the apparatus of repression,” and is sharply aware of the risk of civilian casualties:

  “Let’s put this in context. If you’re living in a community and there’s a bloke you don’t like...then you realize he’s mass murdered all his children. Wouldn’t you think...maybe we should remove him?...If they have done this to their own people, are we not worried they're trying to do it to us?” (Omid Djalili, 13:15)

5. Identity, Upbringing, and Personal Faith (14:01–18:41)

• The intersection of multiple identities: British-Iranian, Baha’i faith, not Muslim yet often typecast or assumed to be, navigating preconceptions from within and outside the Iranian community.
• His London childhood featured a home filled with Iranian refugees, patients, and exiles—a place of “khudemuni,” solidarity, and also tension with regime loyalists:

  “We shared a room and the other rooms were given out to people who lost a leg in the war, were blinded...Some...were regime type people who actually, when they found out where Baha'i, is, would leave in the middle of the night.” (17:30)

6. Humor as Healing and Defiance (18:21–19:40)

• Comedy’s presence even amid trauma:

  “My parents...used humor over breakfast...joy gives you wings and people actually heal quicker. So there was always laughter and comedy to kind of help with the healing process.” (Omid Djalili, 18:21)

7. Multiculturalism, Comedy, & School Days (19:40–22:24)

• Growing up in multicultural London, learning accuracy in accents, and being exposed to diversity at school.
• Early encounters with the British establishment, from Holland Park School to involvement with the Prince’s Trust.

8. Brush with Political Violence & Discovering Comedy (22:11–23:46)

• He tells stories about his time at Ulster University during the Troubles, surviving a shooting, and how these experiences ultimately led to his confidence in comedy.

9. Witnessing Historic Moments: The Berlin Wall and Velvet Revolution (24:27–27:26)

• Standing at the Berlin Wall as it fell, selling fragments, and drawing a parallel to Iran today:

  “It was a moment...we thought, everything is going to be ok...because the good guys have won.” (25:26)

• Lived in then–Czechoslovakia during the “Velvet Revolution”—a lesson in a nonviolent uprising that he sees reflected in the current Iranian movement.

10. Leadership for a Post-Regime Iran and the Pahlavi Question (27:26–31:40)

• Strong support for Reza Pahlavi (son of the deposed Shah) as a “custodian of transition,” not a new monarch—emphasizing that Iranian protesters call for him, per Djalili’s observation via Telegram channels.

  “Students are calling for his name. They're calling for Pahlavi. That is an undeniable fact.” (Omid Djalili, 29:57)

• Skepticism toward Western and regime narratives that frame this as American or Israeli manipulation.

11. Navigating Disinformation and the Role of Social Media (31:03–31:40)

• On verifying authenticity among myriad social media videos:

  “When you’ve been watching thousands of videos...you can tell what is AI...you can have a thing and then you can easily put some sound over it. But...I'm absolutely convinced that majority of what I see is absolutely real.” (Omid Djalili, 31:03)

12. Frustration with Western/Cultural Responses (34:08–37:09)

• Djalili’s visible aggravation at global and especially BBC coverage “falling short”:

  “I cannot believe that the world is not seeing this revolution as one of the most amazing...I cannot believe that people who have been slaughtered are not being championed.” (Omid Djalili, 34:32)

• Analysis of why so few in the West have rallied to the Iranian protest movement—complicated by anti-Israel sentiment, post-Gaza fatigue, Islamophobia concerns, and progressive confusion, as well as silence from many Muslims.

13. Artistic Choices, Responsibility, and Typecasting (37:09–39:52)

• On being repeatedly cast as Arabs or Muslims and the effect of representation:

  “You’re the first in comedy from your people, so you’re kind of like the Richard Pryor of Middle Eastern people and brown people. So you need to keep doing comedy so that you have a voice.” (Omid Djalili quoting Paul Mooney, 39:52)

• Conscious responsibility to uplift rather than denigrate his background and “punch up” rather than down.

14. Performing in Controversial Places and Ethics of Engagement (41:08–42:52)

• Grappling with performing at the Riyadh Comedy Festival amid criticism of whitewashing by human rights groups:

  “Saudi was always my red line...they were killing Baha'is...then two years ago I got a message...‘If you get an invite, you should go.’ So I went along.” (Omid Djalili, 41:29)

• Contrasts Saudi’s opening to progress with ongoing theocratic repression in Iran.

15. The Burden of Advocacy and Longing for Return (44:31–46:23)

• Djalili describes compulsively checking social media for updates and sharing information:

  “I'm working on social media things. That's why I come on to speak to you. First of all, you’re great, you’ve got a great platform. And if messages can get out there, I think it's really important.” (Omid Djalili, 44:40)

• Dreams of returning to a free Iran—even if just for the food:

  “If Iran opens up, I’m going to go back, have a massive kebab and come back.” (Omid Djalili, 46:23)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “This is Iran’s Berlin Wall moment.” (Omid Djalili, 01:08 / 24:40)
• On the toll of diaspora activism: “Waking up, acrid mouth...saying, are they gone yet?” (Omid Djalili, 02:33)
• On Western negotiations: “Those people who protested did not protest for a better nuclear deal. They protested to get rid of this regime.” (Omid Djalili, 07:23)
• On war and precision strikes: “Let’s put this in context....If they have done this to their own people, are we not worried they're trying to do it to us?” (Omid Djalili, 13:15)
• On family and faith: “I'm a Baha’i...So they would kill them. I mean, thousands...Everyone thought I was a Muslim.” (Omid Djalili, 16:20)
• On frustration with the BBC: “I cannot believe that the world is not seeing this revolution as one of the most amazing...” (Omid Djalili, 34:32)
• On responsibility in the arts: “You’re the first in comedy from your people...you can actually choose the projects and actually direct those projects.” (Omid Djalili via Paul Mooney, 39:52)
• On hope for Iran: “If Iran opens up, I’m going to go back, have a massive kebab and come back.” (Omid Djalili, 46:23)

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Important Timestamps

• 01:08 – Djalili: “This is Iran’s Berlin Wall moment.”
• 02:33 – Day-to-day experience of the Iranian diaspora
• 04:20 – Comedy, activism, and pressures from the community
• 07:23 – On Western letdown and the protesters’ demands
• 13:12 – On moral questions of collateral damage and war
• 16:20 – Experience as a persecuted Baha’i and complex identity
• 24:40 – Iran’s crisis compared to the Berlin Wall
• 29:57 – Telegram/social media and public support for Reza Pahlavi
• 34:32 – Frustration at Western lack of support for the protests
• 39:52 – Artistic responsibility, typecasting, and the Richard Pryor analogy
• 41:29 – Performing in Saudi Arabia, ethical dilemmas
• 44:40 – Social media advocacy as a daily routine
• 46:23 – The dream of returning to Iran

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Tone & Style

Throughout the episode, Nick Robinson maintains a probing yet empathetic interview style, while Omid Djalili mixes impassioned argument, self-effacing humor, and personal storytelling. The conversation is candid, at times irreverent, but underscores a deep-seated anger and urgency about Iran’s fate and the pressures on public figures in diaspora communities.

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Conclusion

Omid Djalili uses his platform and personal story to illuminate the stakes of the struggle for Iran’s future, the responsibilities and dilemmas of diaspora activism, and the role of comedy and identity in times of crisis. He leaves the unmistakable impression that Iran—and the world—stands at a potential historical turning point, and that advocacy, solidarity, and honest communication are more needed than ever.

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This summary omits advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections, focusing on the core conversation and argument in the episode.

Transcript

[Nick Robinson]

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[Ahmad Djalili]

this is Iran's Berlin Wall moment. With this whole thing of negotiations, we're not talking about lowering the ball, we're talking about getting rid of them. When Ronald Reagan said, this wall has to come down, he meant bring it down. He didn't say, let's lower it a bit.

[Nick Robinson]

That's my guess. This week on Political Thinking, the actor and comic Ahmad Djalili is the son of Iranians who now shares the stories and the images of those who dared to take to the streets to protest against the regime which runs the Islamic Republic. The question many are asking now is whether military action is the only way to curb Iran's nuclear ambitions, to halt its aggression towards its neighbours, to stop the repression of its own people. Many thousands have already been killed in Iran. Djalili believes military action is the only way. Best known for his comedy career, as well as on screen roles in Gladiator, the Mummy, Mamma Mia 2, he is now calling for a rescue mission to aid those living in the country which his parents left back in the 1950s. Omid Juli, welcome to Political Thinking.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Great to be here, Nick. So good to meet you in person because you look so well, you're so thin. You walk into a snooker hall and start chalking your head.

[Nick Robinson]

That's the nicest thing anybody's ever said to me. Yeah. And I've got the right head to chalk, let's be honest. How has watching what's unfolded in Iran changed your life?

[Ahmad Djalili]

Hugely. I think this is something I've been watching for many, many years. Right now, I would. I can tell you this is pretty much the Iranian diaspora experience, which is waking up acrid mouth, bit of water, bit of coffee, saying, are they gone yet? And nothing happening. And then going on social media, going on Telegram, the telegram channel, see what the latest things, things are and talking about it.

[Nick Robinson]

They meaning the mullahs, they meaning the regime, they meaning Ayatollah. Well, ayatollah, yeah.

[Ahmad Djalili]

They meaning are they gone yet? Them, yeah. But what we do, we go on the telegram channels because that seems to be with, with about 5 to 10% connectivity that seems to be through VPN, a way that Iranians can get some videos out. As you know, the Internet was shut while they slaughtered lots of people. And I think it's really important because I've spoken to some Muslim friends of mine saying, why aren't you calling out the Islamic regime? They're going to be causing so much Islamophobia. Because this isn't Islam, surely. And some friends have spoken to me about it and it looks like they're not on the same algorithm. They don't really understand what's going on. And some of the Pakistani Muslim friends I have, they make a very clear differentiation between the Pakistani diaspora in the UK and the Pakistanis inside Iran. And they say, well, the people outside the country don't necessarily see, say what they want inside the country. But you need to be really clear that from the very beginning, whenever these uprisings happen, we know that the regime shuts the Internet down. So what we try and do, all of us with a bit of a platform, we try and be the voice of the people, the voice of the voiceless. So actually whatever I'm saying, from what I've been told, is pretty much what the people of Iran want.

[Nick Robinson]

And does that mean that morning till night, you're either looking at videos, you're talking to people, if you can get through to them, you're processing what you're seeing. I mean, this is in a sense taking taken over your life.

[Ahmad Djalili]

It has. If any of you, if I'm on zooms and people have been on zooms with me and you see my eyes down, I am checking the telegram channels, I'm thinking about what to tweet. I'm thinking about how I can help the people of Iran liberate themselves. Because what they've been trying to do, uprising after uprising, there's no level playing field. You've got bare hands and stones versus military grade weapons and it always ends up in thousands killed and the regime still staying in power.

[Nick Robinson]

Real life has to go on and your real life is being a stand up.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I'm still doing gigs yeah, you're on tour.

[Nick Robinson]

But those audiences get to hear some of what we're about to hear. What do you think about Iran?

[Ahmad Djalili]

I don't talk about it. I don't. Because it seems inappropriate to, like, do tweets and then say, oh, by the way, come and see me in Exmouth and Plymouth this weekend. I. I don't feel it's appropriate to do that. If people want to come and they find out that I'm playing, great. Because it's a show which was called Namaste, which is about putting my anger of the last few years geopolitically, what's been going on in the world. Namaste is the Catholic convict converter I put my. My thoughts into, and then what comes out of it is comedy, insights and sometimes some beautiful things. So I'm still on tour. I've got to get on with it. I've had some Iranian. Can I just tell you this, Nick? I've had Iranians actually try and get the shows cancelled. An English bloke said, I've got a mate here, he wants to talk to you. He goes, hello, Omi. John. You're sure tonight, I think you should cancel it. I said, why? Because you should not be working while terrible things are happening in Iran. I said, who's this? He goes, my name is Bijan. I said, where are you calling me from? He goes, I'm at work. I said, so, right, okay, so you can work, but I can't. And that's why I make the decision to work, because it's a good time for people to come together and actually hear what's going on.

[Nick Robinson]

And there may be Iranians who just. Out of sympathy, out of empathy. Wish you weren't making jokes at the time. Yeah, the people from the other side. I mean, do you ever think I'm told on, are there some spies in the audience? Here are the people from the Iranian regime who. Just keeping an eye on what you're saying and who you're saying it to.

[Ahmad Djalili]

When I was in Dartford, there were a few Iranians didn't show up. The front row were bought, tickets were bought, and they didn't show up because I think they were worried there'd be regime people there. But I told the audience, I doubt very much that IRGC terrorists would get a train down here and a replacement bus service from Crayford to come to this place. I doubt they're going to do that. So I think we're pretty okay right now. I've had people. I did a show, actually, at Cadogan hall. And some people said they were sat behind some very heavyset people who didn't laugh at all. One of them laughed and the other one nudged him to stop. So I'm thinking there might be some regime people have already seen it and think, yeah, he seems to be all right. I kind of like him.

[Nick Robinson]

But we know the punchline. Now, look, we're talking on Thursday morning as we've just seen images of those negotiators in Geneva. Now, it's not very long, six weeks by my count, since Donald Trump told Iranians help is on its way. Help did not come for those protesters, did it? And now his people are sitting down, not in the same room as the Iranians, but the same hotel and people are shuttling between the two of them to try and do a deal. It seems only about Iran's nuclear ambitions. Do you feel let down?

[Ahmad Djalili]

We feel not just let down, but we're outrageously let down, disappointed and actually offended because the people of Iran who took to the streets of which the number of people have been killed, which by the way, are we put at 36,000. Donald Trump said 32,000. Those people who protested did not protest for a better nuclear deal. They protested to get rid of this regime. And the fact that even negotiating with them, we would like to think it's all a sham. We'd like to think that when you look at the United nations norm R2P responsibility to protect. It's something that came in 2005 where if a country is killing its own people, and by the way, what's happening in Iran is not a genocide because they're attacking the majority of the people. This is an extermination of human beings who are protesting because it goes against their own Islamic laws that to kill someone is bad. Even worse is sedition. Sedition is protest. And so you have to kill those people, which maybe would have been an Islamic edict that would have worked 1,400 years ago in brutal times, but does not work now with 16 year old people, girls are walking back from a demonstration and IRGC members on motorcycles going, shooting them in the back of the head. So what we're trying to say, say is that basically we cannot allow people to. We're so amazed that even negotiating with these people, we'd like to think, we'd like to think it's all a sham and they're going to go in anyway. That's what we would like to think.

[Nick Robinson]

Well, particularly as Donald Trump used to mock attack Joe Biden for talking to The Iranians for having done a deal that he said was the worst deal in the world with the Iranians. I mean, is he, Donald Trump, just become a kind of orange Joe Biden with a funny hairdo?

[Ahmad Djalili]

That would be. That would be a huge fear that his own people are saying? I think what's happening is that he's also aware of narratives going on. There's. There's a big narrative within America they're pushing that this is like Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction. And he has to go through the diplomatic route because that responsibility to protect was about first. You have to deal with it diplomatically. And then when that falls down, there has to be an intervention, a military intervention, which is what the Iranians are saying, we do not want war. The people inside Iran saying we do not want war. What happened with Iraq in 2003, war meant just carpet bombing the place and innocent people dying. What the people of Iran are asking for is for the apparatus and machinery of repression to be removed and neutralized, which is the irgc. If you remove that, then there's a level playing field. Then we can see what the people of Iran want. Let them make their voices known.

[Nick Robinson]

This is the Revolutionary Guard. These are, as you see it, the

[Ahmad Djalili]

Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps are not the Iranian army. The Iranian army is a very different thing. This is the militia that keeps the regime in power.

[Nick Robinson]

Now, I hear you make the distinction between war Iraq style, if you like, and targeting the bits that hold up the regime. Yes, not in inverted commas, the mullers, but the people who keep them in power.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

There'll be plenty of people say, look, that's not how war works. Once you stop, start dropping missiles, dropping bombs from the sky, it's civilians that die. Inevitably it's civilians that die if they did that.

[Ahmad Djalili]

But that's what I'm saying. They did that in Iraq. And that's something you should know. Also, I produced a movie called We Are Many, which is about the 800 city global demonstrations against the war where majority of people did not feel Saddam Hussein had anything to do with 9 11. Remember, we dealt with Iraq and Al Qaeda just before that and they believe that he had weapons of mass destruction. I can tell you right now, John Prescott, who I did adverts with back in 2010, he saw the film in 2015, we are many. And he rang me up because Ahmed Omit. I've just, just seen We, We Are Many. Tell you what. Our House of Commons with Tony. I was with Tony. I said, tony, there's a Million people out there. He goes, no, because you sent me off to the White House. I was taught. I was talking to George Bush, and that bloke or Dick Cheney don't like him at all. Dick Cheney. They weren't even at the White House. They went, they're in bunker. They're in bunker. They goes, are you coming in with us, John? And then Bush goes, he tried to kill my daddy. He goes, tony, it's got now to do with us. This is a Texan thing. This is all about revenge. It's got now to do with us.

[Nick Robinson]

Yeah. George Bush Jr. Thinking that they tried to kill his father.

[Ahmad Djalili]

He tried to kill my daddy. And John Prescott. Tommy, your film was absolutely spot on. We should never have gone to war.

[Nick Robinson]

But what's so interesting about this, and controversial, frankly, is the claim that there's a sort of nice wars and nasty wars, right?

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah, yeah.

[Nick Robinson]

And there'll be plenty of people saying, no, that's not how it works. If you attack those people who are propping up the Iranian regime, first of all, you'll hit civilians. Inevitably, that's what happens. And secondly, you will trigger a regional, if not a global conflict in which lots of civilians will die. You know, and you've been quite critical of ISRA bombing of Gaza. Very critical. And you said at one point, if we're using the word collateral damage for innocent people dying, we've lost our moral compass.

[Ahmad Djalili]

We have.

[Nick Robinson]

There will be collateral damage. There weren't there?

[Ahmad Djalili]

Well, there's collateral damage in this sense that if. And I said this to a reporter once, I said, look, if you want to take out. If someone said to me, we want to take out the Islamic regime, they're all at Nando's. They're all at Nando's in Richmond, okay? But there's 100 people there, and two of your children are there too. Should we press the button and bomb them? I would say, no, I don't want my kids being killed. I don't want anyone being killed. But what the. What Israel did in the 12 Day War is that they were targeting specific. I mean, with real strike, you know, I mean, even a block of flat, in a block of flats, they hit one flat and killed the IRGC members in there.

[Nick Robinson]

So precision war is possible.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Look, as I said, I'm as anti war as anyone. But let's put this in context. If you're living in a community and there's a bloke you don't like, all right, there's a bloke you don't like, he's got kids. You don't really talk to him. You kind of say, let him do what he wants. Then you realize he's mass murdered all his children. Wouldn't you think, do you know what? I don't really want him enough because he could do that to us. Maybe we should remove him. Would you not think that? I think most normal people would think that. And the question is, if they have done this to their own people, are we not worried they're trying to do it to us? That. I think that's the main question.

[Nick Robinson]

I want to talk more about what conflict might lead to, who might take over in a little while. But first of all, I want to examine where this passion comes from.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes. Let me make it really clear.

[Nick Robinson]

You were not born in Iran.

[Ahmad Djalili]

No, but. No, I'm not. I was not born in Iran. I was born and raised here. And I'm telling you all this not as an Iranian diaspora person who seems to know what he's talking about because he's so immersed in everything. I'm speaking to you as a concerned human being, as a member of the global community. I have watched these people operate. I have seen that they are the biggest international sponsors of terrorism. And I cannot believe that we have appeased these people. That's what I can't believe.

[Nick Robinson]

Well, let's talk about that background.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Sure.

[Nick Robinson]

So your parents have come from Iran. Your dad not from there originally, he'd fled from Turkmenistan. Because you're not. And we'll talk about your acting career in a while. You're not, in fact, an Arab, which you're often portrayed at on screen. You are Persian, you are not Muslim. And you're often portrayed as if you are. You're Baha'. I. We'll talk about that, too. But to what extent was that upbringing just down the road from the Iranian embassy in Kensington, here in London?

[Ahmad Djalili]

It was.

[Nick Robinson]

To what extent was that a life in which you're surrounded by fellow Iranians? By the language, by the culture.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah. But at that time, my father was the liaison officer at the Iranian consulate, which means Iranians had come over looking for medical help. He would locate them, find them doctors in Harley Street. And it seemed, I seemed to be very proud. There was another Iranian kid at school. I would speak Persian very loudly with him. And we were very proud of our Persian heritage. And then when the Islamic regime happened and we saw these terrible Islamic fundamentalism and even my parents thinking, well, you know, they're in power, but, you know, it's what the people decided that's Fine. But then within a few months, within a few months, my mother saying, oh my God, the women have protested about. There were some judges, there were some people in big, high level positions and they've been thrown out because they're women. So they, they demonstrated. Some of them were killed and they had acid thrown on them. And my mother said, these people are animals. These people are. I wouldn't even call them a name of an animal because that's not right. So we all thought, okay, there's something very chilling happening here.

[Nick Robinson]

You're what, 14? Then we're talking 1979. This is.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Right.

[Nick Robinson]

A revolution that few saw coming.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah.

[Nick Robinson]

Days before the Shah, who your father had served when he was working in the Iranian embassy, still appeared to have total power. And yet it was gone like that, wasn't it?

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes. And I think affected me because I'm. I'm a Baha'. I. The Baha' Is were being persecuted. The Baha' I faith grew out of Islam in the same way Christianity grew out of Judaism. So there's a connection, but they're totally separate faiths. And, and because people in Islam, they think Muhammad is a seal of the prophets, no one should come after him. The Baha' Is believe their prophet Bahaullah is the latest but not the last prophet. But because he came after Muhammad, Baha' is are often persecuted. So they would kill them. I mean, thousands. We're talking about loads and loads of Baha'. Is. I even felt it in Britain. Muslim friends kind of think, well, you're a Baha'.

[Alan Davis]

I.

[Ahmad Djalili]

There was a. People thought the Baha' Is were kind of some kind of powerful cult. And so I was affected by this and it changed my life completely because everyone thought I was a Muslim.

[Nick Robinson]

You're a minority within a minority in a sense.

[Ahmad Djalili]

And even within that minority, they all think I'm weird. So I'm a minority within a minority within a minority. Yeah.

[Nick Robinson]

And take me to this house. Because these people who your dad helps bring over to get private medical treatment, he's not just, you know, acting like a travel agent. They're living in the house. I mean, they're sitting around your front room, aren't they? You're spending time as a child with a house filled with people.

[Ahmad Djalili]

There's a Persian word which is called khudemuni, which means being all of us together. So my parents had this amazing seven bedroom flat in Kensington. So we, me, my brother, my sister, we shared a room and the other rooms were given out to people who lost a leg in the war, were blinded and we'd have to go and translate for them as well. So. And some people were nice. Some people liked the fact that we were Baha'. Is. Baha' Is are pretty much trusted people, but some of them were regime type people who actually, when they found out where Baha', is, would leave in the middle of the night. So it was a very strange thing, but it really gave me an idea. It was. It was little Iran within a little tiny flat. Well, not tiny, a flat in Kensington.

[Nick Robinson]

And it seems an unlikely place to discover comedy. You know, there you are in the midst of this deeply traumatic political situation. People are very ill, they've come to get medical treatment. But you discover humor in all this.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Well, because my parents are funny because they used humor over breakfast. They used humor to make people laugh. And I said, why? Why are you always telling jokes? It's quite weird. And they said, no, because, you know, joy gives you wings and people actually heal quicker. So there was always laughter and comedy to kind of help with the healing process.

[Nick Robinson]

Go back to that time rather than now. Would you thought of yourself as Iranian, Persian or British?

[Ahmad Djalili]

I've always seen myself as a citizen of the world because that's the way the Baha' I faith is. The Baha' I faith believes that the Earth is one country, mankind, its citizens. All religions are different chapters of the same book. I've always had this kind of global way of seeing myself. But, yeah, but the. Because we spoke Persian at home and I was taught some things about Persian culture, I thought Iranians were funny. I liked them, I always felt warm towards them. So, yeah, I'm, I would say, a British Iranian. Now. I joke about it. People say, what does that mean? I said, being a British Iranian means half of me has a natural dislike and hatred for America and the other side exactly the same. So it was. It's something that I could, I can joke about, but I am, you know, a British Iranian. I, I feel, in fact, my wife often used to say to me, I thought I'd married this exotic Persian man. But you watch for super, you know, Super Sunday, they're going, carolyn shelves, you're just a football hooligan, you know. So she was very disappointed.

[Nick Robinson]

This is because you're brought up in posh Kensington, but you take the route down to Stamford Hill to the relatively posh Chelsea, let's be honest. But it's got some supporters who are not quite like. And you go to school in what they used to call the socialist Eastern.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah. Holland Park School.

[Nick Robinson]

Yeah. Where Tony Ben sent his kids.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Tony Ben's kids were there.

[Nick Robinson]

No. Nadim Zawi former Tory Johnson the emblem

[Ahmad Djalili]

was a black hand and a white hand shaking hands. So, yeah, it was. It was a very multicultural, very diverse school. People say, how come you can do all these accents? And it doesn't seem racist? It's because they're accurate. Because I was raised with Nigerians, I was raised with people from all around. Jamaicans. That kind of speak was part of the way we all connected with each other.

[Nick Robinson]

So it was quite a lot of posh Brits as well. The Royals are in the Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes. And I think that was something I was asked to do, a big do around 2006. They made me a Princess Trust ambassador and I. I became very close to Prince. Well, as he was Prince Charles. Michael Fawcett was his butler. He kept saying, faucet here, we need you to come along and do some comedy. Prince likes you. Come along and do some shows. And then I think I did a couple of jokes which didn't go down too well.

[Nick Robinson]

And then it was over.

[Ahmad Djalili]

It wasn't over. It was like Prince Harry. I said. I said to the. I said, you must be very, very proud of Prince Harry going out to Afghanistan. And. And Prince Charles said, it's marvelous to see him wearing a British uniform for a change. Which was a joke about that.

[Nick Robinson]

Yes.

[Ahmad Djalili]

And he didn't like that joke because I joke in his mouth.

[Nick Robinson]

Interesting, because you'd first seen on the streets at.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I mean, you still remember the streets. Yeah, I lived in Kensington and I never forget. He was. Was a dashing young man, about 30, 31. He was in a big American convertible car. There was traffic, high street. Ken bikes at Mary Abbott's Church and Barker's, and he was stuck in traffic and he was in a convertible car with three. With three security officers around him. And people were like, honking their horns and he was waving everyone. And within seconds, this. I think some cab drivers started singing. There's only one Charlie Windsor. One Charlie wins. And he's like waving at the crowd. And I was waving at him. I could have cycled over and just said, hello. He was that close.

[Nick Robinson]

And you seem to have an appetite for exploring, not just in your comedy, not just on screen, but in your real life. Kind of moments of tension. I mean, I can't think of anybody else who chose to go to Ulster. Ulster University during the Troubles. I had the Troubles. Lovely place, don't get me wrong. Nice people and all that. But it's an interesting choice. It's an Interesting choice.

[Ahmad Djalili]

No, it wasn't a conscious choice. It was the only place that took me. So I went along and it was. It was tough. It was a really, really. You know, the troubles. You know, when you go into university, there's army checkpoints and things, so it was a scary time.

[Nick Robinson]

But I think that you got shot at.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I got shot at, yeah. Just by. By accident, you know, one night throwing stones on Port Roche beach. And someone shouted something at me and they said, do you want your kneecaps blown off? And I said, come on in. And his friend said, you better go. He's serious. He came back with an A rifle. And I got chased and they took two shots at me. And then on the Monday, I reported it to my professor, who just said, look, you've survived. I think it's best you don't make a report because then they'll know who it is. They'll come after you. So just be happy that you. You're alive.

[Nick Robinson]

But in a sense, they were targeting you. What, because you're an outsider, too. I mean, they even called you a name.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah, they could. They could. I think that. I think the word was Euphenian. Turk was the word, which was a bit bizarre because I was dark and. And also. But I had a posh English accent, so that kind of confused them. But I think it did. I mean, that's where I found comedy at university. And it gave me the confidence to do jokes, like at the Raw variety performance after 9 11, when I was essentially cancelled. I was cancelled as nobody really wanted anything to do with a Middle Eastern comedian. But the one show I had left was the Royal Variety Performance, and it made Prince Charles laugh when he was sat literally on my left in the Royal Box. And I said, suicide bombing. Yeah, it's pretty bad, but it's gonna get worse. We're gonna have suicide bomber schools. How does that even work? Where's your bag? I left it on the bus. Well done, House Point. You know, that's the kind of joke

[Nick Robinson]

that was just too much for people.

[Ahmad Djalili]

It was. They just were absolutely shocked and couldn't believe what I'd said.

[Nick Robinson]

And by the way, now, I mean, do you have to think about that? Do you think what I'm passionate about, my life might mean that people say, well, let's not cast him or let's not go to his show?

[Ahmad Djalili]

I think at the end of that, we all have to be authentic. And if I. If I say anything that I think is funny, I'll say it. But if. If it's if it's unnecessarily risky and it's just going to make people go, oh, I'm not like Jimmy Carr. Jimmy Carr says he love. He loves a laugh, but he likes it when people go. He prefers that disgust. I don't particularly like that. I'm about the joy and about people coming and having a laugh and. And leaving uplifted.

[Nick Robinson]

Now you go to Ulster University.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

Then you head to the Berlin Wall when it's coming down now. We could have bumped into each other. I was in Berlin. Were you there? Yeah. Amazing moment of day. I will never forget. Do you stand on the Wall?

[Ahmad Djalili]

I stood next to it and was knocking bits down.

[Nick Robinson]

Right.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Because if you knock. But someone gave me a hammer and I knocked bits down, you could sell it for about five marks. So I sold three or four bits. I took. I kept one piece which had some paint on it. I've still got that at home because it was such a huge thing. And now what we're talking about, why it's so relevant now, is this is Iran's Berlin Wall moment. And we keep saying when. When Ronald Reagan said, this wall has to come down, he. He meant bring it down. He didn't say, let's lower it a bit. So with this whole thing of negotiations, we're not talking about lowering the ball, we're talking about getting rid of them.

[Nick Robinson]

But was that the appeal then, of going? I mean, did you want to be there? At the moment? I knew not rising against Communism. Succeed.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I knew it was a big moment in history, totally ruined by David Hasselhoff, who started singing songs on the Wall and all of us thinking, what is he doing?

[Nick Robinson]

Enough.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah. But it was. It was a moment and I'll never forget, it was New Year's Eve and looking up at the sky, there was nothing but fireworks and people were coming from the west to the east and people going from east to the West. I walked into East Berlin. It was an incredible experience. A real moment of global unity. It was a moment of celebration. It was a moment that we thought, everything is going to be ok. Okay, in the world because the good guys have won.

[Nick Robinson]

And after that, you make your life for a while where the next revolution is going to take place. You go to checkers. An unlikely friendship.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes. You.

[Nick Robinson]

You become friends with the great dissident playwright, the symbol of resistance.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah.

[Nick Robinson]

Great man who talked about. I asked the team to check out a good Vatslav Harvel quote. The power of the powerless. Were you inspired by him because he came to see you, when you were acting?

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes. He came to see a show of us and said, hello Shakans and, and basically said that that velvet was a velvet revolution. I think only one person died in that and it was, people were protesting and he was very clear there should be no violence. That was the thing. And it was, it was a beautiful revolution. And the people of Czechoslovakia are really wonderful. I don't know, back in 1989 when I met them and went over there and lived there, I lived there for four and a half years and did theater there and it was a beautiful experience. The people there are very peace loving and they're very proud of their revolution. They're very proud that only one person died. And it's something they've really built on because they're intellectual. And it's very interesting with the people of Iran because the Czechs and Slovaks said, we have agency, we are educated, we know what we want. And this is why when everyone says, yeah, but what's going to happen after Iran? Who's going to come in? Isn't there going to be a power vacuum? Isn't it going to bring you ISIS and all that? We said, no, we're educated, we know, we've already, we've chosen someone. Reza Pahlavi is not as a leader but as a custodian of transition. So what you're seeing is a beautiful revolution with some kind of intellectual teeth behind it as well. Very similar to Czechoslovakia.

[Nick Robinson]

Let's talk about him. Because you bat the son of the Shah basically to take over in the event of an uprising, in the event of the fall of the Islamic Republic. You don't know him though, do you've? Not met him and I've not met him. You've not been to Iran since you

[Ahmad Djalili]

were six years old. I was six years old last time. All I can tell you, and you know, and why I, I back the movement he represents a movement which basically says he will go in there and oversee a transition. Now the people, the leaders are actually in Iran in prison right now. So he's talking about releasing them from prison, getting everyone together and then maybe having democratic elections for a secular government. And if there is going to be a monarchy, it'll be a constitutional monarchy, a bit like Great Britain where it runs along. But it, but it has nothing to do with religion. And I think that's the movement that everyone's backing.

[Nick Robinson]

And yet of course, it's got everything to do with the Shah. It was brutal. I mean, until he fell in that revolution. We know that The Shah was put in place, effectively by a coup organized by the CIA, backed by Britain's MI6, which is why to this day, I'm not sure America is condemned as the Great Satan and Britain is condemned as the Little Satan.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I'm sure you're 100 correct, because I think that there was a Shah at the time, and I think Mossadegh, who was the Prime Minister, I don't believe he was totally removed and replaced. I believe there was some kind of dynasty going on. I'm not 100% sure about it. So I never buy all those, what would. What were trendy kind of, you know, narratives that the Shah was evil. From what I've seen, I didn't see him as an evil person. I saw him as somebody who really loved his country. And I see the same in his son. People who love. Why would someone who's living a wonderful life in America, if you just think intellectually for a second, why would he give up that life? He plays drums. He's. He's very loved. He gives speeches. Why would he. If you look at his work rate, why would he give every. His whole life over to try and be of service to his people? So if that is what he's doing, that. If he's creating a movement to go and create secular democracy in Iran, I think that's why they're calling his name inside Iran. I don't hear anybody else being called so. So in that.

[Nick Robinson]

But are you sure you're hearing what's taking place? Because there are people who say, look, this guy's got an amazing social media campaign. Why? Because the Americans wanted to try and build somebody up?

[Ahmad Djalili]

No, no, I don't.

[Nick Robinson]

Israelis want to build them up as well.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I reject all.

[Nick Robinson]

Maybe social media gives a disturbance, distorted view.

[Ahmad Djalili]

There are some people who are pushing that particular narrative. But I listen to the people inside Iran. I'm going go on the telegram channels and listen to what the students are calling. Students are calling for his name. They're calling for Pahlavi. That is an undeniable fact. I'm not even being political by saying. I'm not even throwing in my political hat. I'm just saying what I'm observing. They are constantly. Even now, the students who are showing unbelievable bravery, going toe to toe with the same security forces who. Who massacred tens of thousands of people. They're facing them. They're even fistfights. But they're calling for him. That is an undeniable fact.

[Nick Robinson]

And Omid, how do you assess. Cause there you are. Look at these telegram channels. This form of social media which is the hardest to crack really along with signal, that's why people in repressive regimes tend to use it, isn't it? How do you assess whether what you're seeing is real rather than being used as propaganda? Because they know you're influential. You can, you've got hundreds of thousands of followers on social media media in this country. They know that what they convince you of, you will try and convince other people of. How do you go about assessing whether you're getting a proper picture?

[Ahmad Djalili]

It's, it's very, you know, you know when you've been watching thousands of videos across all platforms, you can tell what is AI and some AI things are out there. You can tell what is what has been doctored. So you can have a thing and then you can easily put some sound over it. But I'm telling when there's people on the streets and you see and you seeing video after video after video, I can't believe for a second all of these and you see people chanting, you see people close up, far away. I'm absolutely convinced that majority of what I see is absolutely real. It's fresh and it's quickly uploaded.

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[Nick Robinson]

There are plenty of people who argue, look, this guy isn't the answer. He is not the equivalent of the ayatollah who was waiting in Paris for the Charterfall in 1979, came in and was hailed and instantly took over. He's not that is what they say.

[Ahmad Djalili]

But you think they're wrongdee in one sense. First of all, who's saying that? There are a lot of regime lobbyists out there who are saying that. But second of all, there is a case that just the fact that he wears a suit and a tie and he looks different from these people is what convinces people. And I. I often joke about who would have thought to lead a revolution. All you've got to do is go down to TK Maxx and get yourself a suit. People of Iran would have taken Sooty and Sweep if it was what the people want. People would have taken Bungle from Rainbow if he was a choice. And as a British person, I know that Bungle goes to bed wearing pajamas, but he walks around, walks around during the day and start bollock naked. So I would say. I would say, excuse me, why you

[Nick Robinson]

can't say I've ever seen Bungle in that statement.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I believe Bungalow is always naked. That's the thing. But he goes to bed.

[Nick Robinson]

We're making a reference to an old children's television program, Bungle from Rainbow.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Look it up. But the thing is. But this is my thing. Who are the people saying he's not? And they're often regime lobbyists, and they're often people who are. Who are paid to actually push this narrative of the regime.

[Nick Robinson]

Glimpse of your frustration here, and I'm gonna pull back the curtain and say that when you arrived here in the studio, you were going crazy, pumped up. Do you feel that? Real frustration? And let's be honest, you've had a go at the BBC as well. You don't think we've covered it quite right. Do you just feel, why aren't you seeing what I'm seeing? Why aren't you as angry as me? Why aren't you doing something? Do you feel that all the time?

[Ahmad Djalili]

First of all, I cannot believe that the world is not seeing this revolution as one of the most amazing. We love revolution. We love the underdog, this country. And I cannot believe that people who have been slaughtered are not being championed. That's the thing. And their cause is pos. Before you speak, Nick, I can see your mouth is about to move. And I'm just here to help. I know, I know. But we cannot believe that the world is not backing these people. It is the most incredible revolution I think we have ever seen against the most evil, repressive forces the world has ever seen.

[Nick Robinson]

Why is that, do you think? I mean, one possibility is that post Gaza.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

That people have come To a very crude calculation.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

Many. We're in inverted commas. They are against Israel.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

Iran opposes Israel. There are some Israeli flags, demonstrations against the Iranian regime here in London. Oh, right. We don't want to be on the same side as the Israelis are on. Therefore.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah. What do you think's going on then? Why didn't we. If we had a problem with Russia during the Second World War, we should have backed Hitler. We go, well, you know, we don't like the Russians, so at least Hitler has a problem with Russia. So we like Hitler. The enemy of my enemies, my friend, is something that we think is one of the most appalling narratives that are. That are out there. And I've heard people, I've had some friends of mine, liberal progressives who were very much when. When there was a re. An uprising in 2022, the woman, life, freedom, they were all for that. Now suddenly, because Iran was attacking Israel, they were going, go, go Iran. I said, are you kidding me? You are now supporting Iran because. Yeah, because the enemy, my enemy is my friend. So that's the first thing. Because they have an anti Israel as a policy, anti America, anti Israel, anti imperialistic narrative was the regime in Iran is one of the most imperialistic things you've ever seen. But anyway, that's by the. By. The other thing is a lot of Muslims are not standing up and that is giving a, I suppose, a card for other people to say, oh, is it Islamophobic? Just because they've got the name Islamic Republic in their name. So people also feel it is Islamophobic. Whereas Masi Ali Nejjad, who was a female activist, was at the UN and she grabbed a photograph of the Supreme Leader and ripped it in two. Because it is not Islamophobic to do this. And many Muslims online who are speaking up, saying it is Muslims moral duty to call out this regime who are killing in the name of Islam. It's our moral duty to call them out and then not doing it.

[Nick Robinson]

What's so fascinating about the other part of your life, your career, is that you are often cast in roles related to all these very, very complicated military things.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Sometimes the voice is up here, sometimes it's down here.

[Nick Robinson]

You've just done an IRGC Boss Avenue in an ITV thriller called Betrayal.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah, Betrayal. I played head of IRGC Narcotics, Qasem Asadi and me.

[Nick Robinson]

His accent, though, he.

[Ahmad Djalili]

He was very educated. He's a little bit. I. I based him on Javad Zarif, who was very. Who was raised in England. And America was spoke in a very relaxed. Would use words like homogeny, would use words that were very, very well. He was very eloquent and erudite. So he was someone who was educated.

[Nick Robinson]

Was it hard to do? I mean you can Debbie this ratio.

[Ahmad Djalili]

It was hard to do, but I felt for him because he's based on a couple of real characters who are double agents. And double agents go crazy. Not because they have to appease both sides, they get involved because they feel they have a moral humanitarian duty to work for one side, but when they're trying to bomb the other side and they like the other side, they're trying to avert disaster. And that moral dichotomy drives them crazy.

[Nick Robinson]

As I said earlier, Albert Dalili, more often you're actually playing an Arab and a Muslim. And you said your phrase. Let me stress, you joked about being typecast and said you were an A list film actor, Arab scumbag, how it

[Ahmad Djalili]

feels sometimes scumbag specialist. Although in the Bond film I was the second Azerbaijani oil pipe attendant, which is a major departure in my career. So, yes, I have been given those roles. And when you're a young actor, you take them and you do them, you do them to the best of your ability. But right now, which is very interesting, we're going to be working on a Channel 4 series about the Iran Embassy siege, about the inside, the hostages, what happened with them and what.

[Nick Robinson]

Based on the book.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Based on the book by Ben McIntyre. So that's going to be really. Yeah, it's a great book. And I just a zoom with with Ben McIntyre yesterday. So. So that's very complex. So all the people involved in that. It's not just some second terrorists. Even, even the people who were terrorists are way more complex than you think. And you kind of see that side of as well.

[Nick Robinson]

But you played people on the kind of junction of these complicated arguments. You played an Arab who turned out really to be Jewish.

[Ahmad Djalili]

In the Infidel. Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

Yeah, in the Infidel. As you play these parts, I mean, you're playing them for laughs a lot of the time. Sometimes it's straight dramas you're obviously doing in this betrayal thing. But are you conscious of the way in which that art reflects and plays into real life conversations about what people do think about Arabs or do think about Muslims or do think about Iranians?

[Ahmad Djalili]

I have to be. Yeah. I'm very careful about every role that I take because I've got to make sure that the project itself is going to be something that doesn't. Doesn't portray, I would like to say my people in a certain way. You know, in 2003, I was very lucky to work with Whoopi Goldberg on a sitcom called Whoopi. And she had a great writer who was called Paul Mooney, who was the original writer for Richard Pryor. And they took me to one side and they said, look, you're the first in comedy from your people, so you're kind of like the Richard Pryor of Middle Eastern people and brown people. So you need to keep doing comedy so that you have a voice. And then once you have a bit more power and a voice, you can actually choose the projects and actually direct those projects. Because sometimes, because they saw I wasn't comfortable saying things about my people, that was denigrating to them, because I always had that with those American writers in 2003. And there'd be stand up arguments and they totally backed me on it. They said, because there are jokes that denigrate and there are jokes that uplift, you can punch up, punch down. And they said the more you do comedy, the more you get a standing in comedy, then you can have more of a say. So they made me promise to keep doing comedy. This is well into your. I'm 60 years old now, so comedy keeps your brain sharp and your heart young, so you have to be very conscious. But I'm very, very clear about the projects I do and how I play

[Nick Robinson]

those characters you played the other day at the Riyadh Comedy Festival got a lot of flack for it, didn't you? Like quite a lot of other people like Jimmy Carr and Dave Chapel and others. Got an awful lot of money from the sound of Saudi regime. And there were critics, human rights watchers, that said it's whitewashing the abuses of that regime. Did you have to think hard about taking that on or, you know, is it just a job?

[Ahmad Djalili]

No, I thought very hard. That's one of the big one. Saudi was always my red line. I. I never did Saudi. In fact, there's a documentary about a group of us doing the Middle east. And I dropped out for the Saudi leg because I didn't. Because they were killing Baha'. Is, they were putting Baha' is in prison. And then two years ago I got a message saying, look, this country is speed running towards progress and they're being very good with Baha' Is now. So if you get an invite, you should go. So I went along.

[Nick Robinson]

Someone in the country, from.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Someone in the. From. From. From people inside the country, they said you should go. So I I went along and, you know, and people. I was criticized. I had other comedians saying, what are you doing? And you should say something. And I said, look, I know what I'm doing. If, if. Because they say you're, you're, you're appeasing this regime in Saudi Arabia whilst at the same time having a go. And Iran, which is also a theocracy. And I said, well, look, there are four theocracies in the world. One is Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Iran and Vatican City. Now, The Pope met 103 comedians at the end of 2024, at the end of 2023. And the Saudis are saying, he met them, we platformed them. And I think when there's a country speed running towards progress, you have to buy into that thing. And I often said, if there was a comedy festival in Tehran and pigs were flying, I'd be on the first pig out there. I really would be. But you haven't done that.

[Nick Robinson]

Presumably you had to sign up to rules. I mean, you couldn't do what you did with Prince Charles.

[Ahmad Djalili]

There was a rule you had to

[Nick Robinson]

say, I'm not criticizing the regime.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Well, let me tell you what happened. You can't criticize the royal family, you can't criticize the government. But they also said, if you want to make fun of the crowd, if they're not sitting still, you can do that. So this bloke and dish dashes, you know, the whole thing. Front row just got up and started walking to the door. And I said, anyone who has criticized the Saudi regime in the last week, please leave the room now. We got to the door, he went and sat back down again, and all the Arabs said, ya, Allah. Allah. That is the funniest, the funniest art. It's very funny. So they. So I was criticizing them and their government, but it still got a laugh.

[Nick Robinson]

Yeah. What I couldn't believe when I read up about you is of all these parts you've done, which is the biggest TV show on the planet, and you turned it down.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yes.

[Nick Robinson]

Sorry to remind you. I'm sorry to intrude in private grief. I'm not Game of Thrones.

[Ahmad Djalili]

You turned it down Because I didn't understand it. I had a deal. I had a deal with hbo. I had a deal with NBC first, then, then HBO gave me a deal to do a sitcom with them and I did an HBO special. It was Caroline Strauss, who was the head. She goes, hey, Ahmed, I'm going to send you look at the script. I'm producing this. I said, sure. And she Sent me another email week because have you read it yet? I said, give me another week. And she goes, look, do you want to do this or not? And I said, caroline, I have a thing where I don't do anything. If I don't understand, I don't understand it. He goes, it's going to be a big series. I said, I don't get it. I don't. I have to say no. She goes, okay, fine breasts. I didn't realize it was only a few years later. I thought, hang on, isn't that the series? I went back. Oh, my God. I just didn't understand the first pilot episode. I didn't understand it.

[Nick Robinson]

When you leave this studio, this world,

[Ahmad Djalili]

I thought you're gonna say no.

[Nick Robinson]

Is it straight back on Telegram. Do you find yourself whenever you've got a moment back of a cab, moments at home? Yes, because moments in the dressing room, working.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I'm working on social media things. I'm working. That's why I'm come. I come on to speak to you. First of all, you're great. You've got a great platform. And if, if messages can get out there, I think it's really important. And then. And I try and do that on my social media as well, we'll send a message.

[Nick Robinson]

Now we're speaking when these talks have begun.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Yeah.

[Nick Robinson]

And there'll be plenty of people listening and watching going, if. If they succeed or if it's still happening, few, they'll say, we've dodged another war. Wars in the Middle east never turn out well. Conflicts in which the Americans just bomb, they don't turn out well. Speak to those people. Why are they wrong? Because you obviously do think they're wrong.

[Ahmad Djalili]

While this regime is in power, you will not see an end to any war because they want. It's in their constitution to destroy Israel. Now, before the Islamic regime came in, there was the raid on Entebbe. Do you remember Entebbe? Some Jews were held hostage and Israel came and bombed everywhere and grabbed them. Okay? That was even before the Islamic regime existed. So what I'm trying to say, whatever happens with Israel while Israel is still being bombed and attacked, and still they want to destroy Israel, America will always be drawn into conflict. And the source of that. The source of that is the Islamic regime. And by the way, whatever negotiation they do, they're not going to keep to it. We've got videos of them saying, yeah, we were not supposed to have nuclear, but we used cement and we put different tubes and we continued our uranium enrichment anyway. They lie and they lie and they lie. So my message to everyone is if there is a negotiation and everyone think that's it, it ain't done at all.

[Nick Robinson]

And you dream of going back. You haven't been since you were six.

[Ahmad Djalili]

I would love Iran is an amazing country. It's one of the and there are so many things people say about Iran, but it's center of the Middle East. It is so influential and it's actually one of the most beautiful countries. And I do remember eating the food there and the produce was outrageous. So if Iran opens up, I'm going to go back, have a massive kebab and come back.

[Nick Robinson]

Omid Djalili, thanks very much for joining me on Political Thinking.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Thank you.

[Nick Robinson]

I'm all too conscious that as we end this recording, we have no idea whether the talks will go on, whether they'll break down and there'll be speculation about what happens next, or indeed whether, as you listen to this, the United States has deployed that massive military force amassed in the Middle east to carry out strikes against the Iranian regime. What is clear is that for Ahmad Jalili, what matters is whether the people themselves are freed. Thanks for listening to this episode of Political Thinking. The producers were Daniel Kramer and Flora Murray. The editor, Giles Edwards. There are hundreds of previous conversations like this on BBC Sound, so do go back and have a listen. If you tap subscribe, each new episode will drop into your feed as soon as they're released. Also on BBC Sounds, you'll find my colleague Amal Rajan's podcast Radical. This week on Radical, Amal explores how to tackle ultra processed food and to improve what you eat. With the Master Chef winner, author and restaurateur Thomasina Myers. To listen, search for Radikal with amal Rajan on BBC Sounds.

[Alan Davis]

Hello, I'm Alan Davis and on BBC Radio 4, we're off into alternate realities mapped out by science. This is Life without, where I pull one thread from the magnificent fabric of life and watch what unravels.

[Ahmad Djalili]

Scientists around the world would be crying themselves to sleep. A bunch of mammals would be worrying about where their favorite snack was and

[Alan Davis]

we'd bring it down to earth.

[Nick Robinson]

David Beckham I can imagine him putting

[Ahmad Djalili]

that on the socials. My bees of my girls have all disappeared.

[Alan Davis]

Sometimes we patch it up and crack on. We will survive.

[Ahmad Djalili]

We will survive. Humans are ingenious.

[Nick Robinson]

That is our hallmark.

[Alan Davis]

We should prize above everything else. But sometimes it's bigger than us. Join me to find out just how far the unraveling can go. Subscribe welcome to Life without on BBC Sounds.

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What they are ultimately trying to create is going to replace humans.

[Nick Robinson]

What it's doing is parboiling the inside of your brain.

[Interface Podcast Host]

This could be a turning point in the history of social media.

[Weight Watchers Advertiser]

Welcome to the Interface, the show that explores how tech is rewiring your week and your world.

[Interface Podcast Host]

Coming up next. In our latest episode, we look at the secret meetings at the world's biggest AI summit, the truth about the mystery of a brain melting weapon and the lawsuit that could shift the future of social Media. Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.