POLITICO Tech Podcast Summary
Episode: What the German Election Tells Us About Elon Musk’s Influence
Release Date: February 25, 2025
Host: Stephen Overlea
Guest: Emily Schulteis, POLITICO Berlin Correspondent

1. Election Results: A Shift to the Right

Stephen Overlea opened the discussion by highlighting the significant outcome of Germany's recent election. While the center-left party was ousted in favor of the center-right, the most striking development was the surge of the far-right party, Alternative for Germany (AfD).

Overlea [00:31]: "One in five German voters backed the far right party known as Alternative for Germany, or AfD, effectively doubling its representation in the national government."

Emily Schulteis elaborated on this shift, emphasizing the magnitude of AfD's growth and its implications for Germany's political landscape.

Schulteis [02:12]: "The far right Alternative for Germany party doubled its result from four years ago... There is a huge surge in left-leaning versus right-leaning parties."

Despite this political shift, Schulteis noted that significant policy areas such as security, Ukraine, and relations with the U.S. are unlikely to see drastic changes.

Schulteis [02:12]: "In terms of the policy level... you will see less seismic change."

2. AfD’s Rise and Its Political Legitimacy

The conversation drew parallels between the rise of AfD in Germany and the political shifts observed in the United States with figures like Donald Trump.

Overlea [03:26]: "It's fascinating... What a difference eight or nine years makes politically."

Schulteis pointed out that the international environment has become more conducive to far-right movements, using AfD's increased legitimacy as a case study.

Schulteis [04:03]: "There are many more allies for a party like that on the international stage... showing that they are an internationally legitimate political movement."

She also reflected on AfD leaders' long-term goals, indicating that the party aims to be part of the government by the next election in 2029.

Schulteis [06:02]: "AfD leaders... their goal was never to end up in government. This time around. We believe that by then we will be part of government."

3. Elon Musk’s Influence on the AfD

A significant portion of the discussion centered on Elon Musk's role in supporting the AfD and the broader implications of such endorsements.

Overlea [04:24]: "Alternative for Germany, or AfD, is the party that he was very heavily endorsing in the run up to the election."

Schulteis assessed Musk's impact, suggesting that while his support may not have directly swayed many German voters, it enhanced AfD's international legitimacy and expanded their reach through social media.

Schulteis [04:37]: "While it is unlikely that having Musk's backing swayed a large number of votes within Germany, it was useful for the AfD symbolically... gave the party more reach than they might have had otherwise."

When asked about the trajectory suggested by Musk's statements predicting AfD's future dominance, Schulteis provided a measured perspective.

Schulteis [06:02]: "It is unlikely that they will be the biggest party in Germany... Their normalization in politics is remarkable."

4. Sentiment Towards Musk’s Political Involvement in Germany

The episode delved into how Musk's involvement in German politics is perceived domestically, revealing a divided sentiment.

Overlea [07:35]: "What is the sentiment toward him being involved in German politics?"

Schulteis explained that while AfD leadership welcomes Musk's involvement, mainstream German politicians view it negatively. Leaders like Friedrich Merz and Olaf Scholz criticized Musk for meddling in German affairs.

Schulteis [07:35]: "Merz has said that he thinks that there should be consequences for Musk... It is certainly not a universal positive among party leaders."

This division underscores the tensions between emerging global influencers and established national political frameworks.

5. Use of AI in Far-Right Campaigning

A critical topic discussed was the AfD's utilization of AI-generated content to bolster their campaign messages, particularly through nostalgic and manipulative imagery.

Overlea [08:52]: "You've written that AI generated images and content were often used to reinforce their messaging. What examples of AI did you see?"

Schulteis provided an example from a state election where AI was used to create an idealized, nostalgic vision of Germany, contrasting it with a dystopian present influenced by current political decisions.

Schulteis [09:10]: "A video that said... life was great for your grandparents... compared to today’s dystopian vision of left wing politicians."

She further explained how these AI-generated images were employed to evoke emotions and reinforce far-right narratives.

Schulteis [10:34]: "They are amplifying the kinds of things that have actually happened in real life... illustrating them for people in a way that is slightly amplified."

6. Ethical Concerns and Regulatory Responses to AI Manipulation

The discussion touched upon the ethical implications of using AI in political campaigning and the lack of immediate regulatory responses.

Overlea [12:02]: "Was there any pushback you saw to this use of AI? Were there any calls for greater regulation or disclosure or anything like that?"

Schulteis noted that there was minimal immediate backlash or regulatory action against the AfD's use of AI, highlighting that AfD was an outlier in this tactic within German politics.

Schulteis [12:34]: "Nothing that I can think of off the top of my head... The AfD was an outlier in this sense in the German political sphere."

She also mentioned the increasing siloed nature of media consumption, which could exacerbate the effects of such manipulative content.

Schulteis [12:34]: "People's media consumption, social media consumption, getting increasingly siloed here as well."

7. Implications for U.S.-German and EU Relations

Finally, the conversation explored the broader geopolitical implications of Germany's political shift, especially concerning its relations with the U.S. and the EU.

Overlea [13:49]: "What do you see as the implications going forward for U.S. German or even U.S. EU relations of the results of this election?"

Schulteis expressed that while foreign and security policies might not experience drastic changes, there could be shifts towards greater German independence, especially in response to the current U.S. administration's priorities.

Schulteis [14:16]: "There has the US Needing to stand up to the US now that this administration has made it clear that it's got different priorities about Europe being able to take care of itself and its own security."

She also observed that AfD's ideological alignment with the Trump administration could deepen political divides within Germany.

Schulteis [14:16]: "AfD and its kind of ideological closeness to the Trump administration... could drive further divides."

Musk's public congratulations to Germany's conservatives hinted at possible future softening of rhetoric, but Schulteis remained cautious about predicting outcomes.

Schulteis [14:16]: "Trump got on Truth Social last night and congratulated Merz's conservatives. So I do wonder if perhaps that means there's some softer rhetoric in the future."

Conclusion

The episode provided a comprehensive analysis of Germany's recent election results, highlighting the rise of the far-right AfD and the multifaceted influence of Elon Musk. The discussion underscored the innovative yet ethically questionable use of AI in political campaigns and explored the potential long-term implications for both domestic policies and international relations. As political landscapes evolve, the interplay between technology, influential personalities, and voter sentiment continues to shape the future of governance and global alliances.

Notable Quotes:

• Stephen Overlea [00:31]: "One in five German voters backed the far right party known as Alternative for Germany, or AfD, effectively doubling its representation in the national government."

• Emily Schulteis [02:12]: "There is a huge surge in left-leaning versus right-leaning parties."

• Emily Schulteis [04:37]: "He was certainly very active on X and posting things that, at least within that social media ecosystem, gave the party more reach than they might have had otherwise."

• Emily Schulteis [06:02]: "It is unlikely that they will be the biggest party in Germany... but the AfD has become normalized in politics."

• Emily Schulteis [07:35]: "Most of the other parties are speaking out pretty strongly against [Musk’s involvement]."

• Emily Schulteis [09:10]: "It's sort of a visualization of make Germany Great again, if you want to talk about it in American terms."

• Emily Schulteis [12:34]: "Nothing that I can think of off the top of my head... The AfD was an outlier in this sense in the German political sphere."

• Emily Schulteis [14:16]: "AfD and its kind of ideological closeness to the Trump administration... could drive further divides."

This summary encapsulates the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the podcast.