339: The Taylor Frankie Paul of It All 🚨 Bachelorette Cancelled, DV Footage 💔 Full Debrief

Summary

Pop Apologists – Episode 339: The Taylor Frankie Paul of It All 🚨 Bachelorette Cancelled, DV Footage 💔 Full Debrief

Release Date: March 25, 2026
Hosts: Lauren & Chandler
Producer: PodcastOne

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Episode Overview

This charged and wide-ranging episode of Pop Apologists dives deep into the ongoing controversy surrounding influencer Taylor Frankie Paul after domestic violence allegations, shocking bodycam footage leaks, and the subsequent cancellation of her season as The Bachelorette. Sisters Lauren and Chandler offer a full debrief, supplementing their analysis with input from their father, an experienced family law attorney. The episode also covers recent drama involving Chapel Roan, Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, and reality TV trends.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Catching Up: Life Updates and Housekeeping

• Lauren is Sick but Present: Lauren is “fully sick,” but shows up to record, emphasizing her commitment and vanity about appearing on video—even describing how she would want “curled beach waves” if ever cremated.
  • “If I have to go on camera, I'm going to be on literally as they're shoving morphine into my veins.” —Lauren [04:17]
• Video Podcast Announcement: Pop Apologists is now available in video format on the Apple Podcast app for users with updated iOS—something the hosts are genuinely excited about.
  • “Apple did not have video available up until this point and we have been so, like, wanting this day to come. And they've been so generous as to feature us on the homepage right now.” —Lauren [07:47]

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2. The Taylor Frankie Paul Crisis: DV Allegations, Bodycam Footage, and the Demise of Her Bachelorette Season

Background and Timeline

• Initial Reports: News of a new domestic violence (DV) incident between Taylor Frankie Paul and Dakota Mortensen emerged in February, leading to halted production on Secret Lives of Mormon Wives and The Bachelorette.
  • “This all began with news coming out that there was a new domestic violence incident, right?” —Lauren [11:53]
• Escalation: Lauren and Chandler initially question if the drama is a publicity stunt, but as more details and bodycam footage emerge, they recognize the gravity of the situation.
  • “I thought this was a total publicity stunt…imagine my surprise when it turns into, like, a mushroom cloud.” —Chandler [12:30]

The Footage and its Impact

• Shocking Video Released (TMZ): The leaked video shows Taylor drunkenly throwing multiple metal stools in the presence of her daughter, who is audibly distressed.
  • “I was horrified by this video because…I thought, we’re gonna have this one chair throwing moment…[but] we had three chairs thrown.” —Chandler [19:30]
  • “Seeing it on video is extremely different than reading about it. I just had, like, this moment where I felt I need to be aware of the privilege of never having witnessed domestic violence.” —Lauren [21:13]
• Reaction: The hosts agree they cannot support Taylor’s continued presence or platforming on reality TV after witnessing the severity and rawness of the incident.
  • “To me, I don't want to see her on my TV ever again.” —Chandler [21:10]
  • “We can't have Taylor Frankie Paul, A, on the cast of Secret Lives, and B, on the show the Bachelorette, especially as the Bachelorette.” —Lauren [22:17]

Legal Analysis: Family Law Expert Weighs In

• Phone Interview with John Bledsoe (Family Law Attorney) [27:33–35:39]:
  • Details the temporary restraining order process, emphasizing that restraining orders can be issued quickly, often on one party’s written statement.
  • “It’s like a timeout. We give our kids…give the parent a timeout.” —John Bledsoe [30:19]
  • Discusses how video evidence from past incidents (like Taylor’s 2023 footage) can support new restraining order applications, even if not directly related to the latest incident.
  • Raises the complexity that orders can sometimes be granted on false statements, as judges often err on the side of caution.
  • “The judge will say…‘I’ll give the woman or the victim the benefit of the doubt against the alleged perpetrator. So then I’m kicking the perpetrator out of the house…’” —John Bledsoe [33:41]

Consequences and Broader Impact

• Bachelorette Season Cancelled: ABC cancels Taylor Frankie Paul’s Bachelorette season days before scheduled premiere.
  • “Once the video came out, everyone was like, will they still air this season…it’s supposed to come out, you know, on Sunday.” —Chandler [39:50]
  • “Thankfully, they did the right thing by canceling the season. Just doesn’t make any sense to air that.” —Lauren [39:58]
• Speculation Around Franchise Future: The hosts debate whether the franchise is “over,” critiquing newer seasons’ lack of compelling leads and supporting a casting overhaul.
  • “The Bachelor and the Bachelorette need to be both extremely, extremely hot and…very, very rich. That’s how you get a good season.” —Lauren [42:19]
  • “I saw something today about how they think ABC might just be canceling the whole franchise…and I would be very happy about that.” —Chandler [43:21]

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3. Secret Lives of Mormon Wives & Relationship Drama

• Dad Talk vs. Mom Talk: The hosts express frustration at the increased airtime for the men ('Dad Talk') in ‘Secret Lives of Mormon Wives,’ calling it “junk” and cringe.

  • “They’re trying to make Fetch happen, and it ain’t happening. Diane.” —Lauren [10:34]

• Jesse and Jordan Divorce: News breaks that Jesse and Jordan from the show are divorcing, with speculation about their relationship issues and the symbolic removal of a rifle bag, sparking further online debate.

  • “I think it's best to get a divorce while your kids are still super young…It's a relief to see this happening…their marriage is a dumpster fire.” —Lauren [51:03]
  • “Somebody, some subset of that group is going to start a podcast…good luck making money at a podcast.” —Chandler and Lauren [49:20]

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4. Chapel Roan Controversy: The Fan Encounter in Brazil

• Incident: A viral social media post from a famous Brazilian soccer player recounts his 11-year-old daughter’s negative experience trying to spot (but not approach) pop star Chapel Roan at a hotel breakfast, which led to their being aggressively confronted by a security guard.
  • “Honestly, I don't know at what point simply walking past a table and looking to see if someone is there can be considered harassment…she does not deserve your affection.” —Translated soccer player post [61:15+]
• Chapel Roan’s Response: Denies any involvement, claims she neither saw the child nor instructed security, and expresses dismay over the incident.
  • “I did not ask the security guard to go up and talk to this mother and child…No one came up to me, no one bothered me.” —Chapel Roan (paraphrased by Lauren) [63:53]
• Hosts’ Take: Sceptical of Roan’s denial, relating it to her reputation, and expressing empathy for the young fan.
  • “She’s not cut out for being famous…she’s just not right for this life at all.” —Lauren [64:59]
  • “Any child you see who is delighted by your presence—you only want to delight them more. This is a true personality flaw.” —Lauren [66:28]
• Wider Reactions: The mayor of Rio de Janeiro bans Roan from performing at a major local venue, declaring, “As long as I’m in charge of the city, this young lady…will never perform…”
• Notable Cameos: Amy Robach & TJ Holmes (famed GMA scandal couple) surprisingly defend Roan in a podcast clip.
  • “We don’t investigate, we don’t give people an opportunity to respond…we put it out there for everybody to see.” —TJ Holmes [68:28]

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5. Brief News Blips & Cultural Commentary

• Savannah Guthrie’s Missing Mother: The hosts remark on how quickly media coverage has fallen off regarding the missing mother of the TV anchor, with Lauren calling it “the weirdest thing that has ever happened.” [71:28]
• Spring Fashion Chat: A light interlude on pastel fashion trends and Macy’s “Pastel Dream” curation, including their preferences for layering and accessorizing.

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Memorable Quotes

• Lauren (On Taylor Frankie Paul):
  “It was already a little bit silly to me to start with, and now it’s especially ridiculous.” [22:17]

• Chandler (On Reality TV casting):
  “Any season of the Bachelor that looks like a guy I’ve seen on Hinge a million times…not gonna work.” [42:54]

• John Bledsoe (On restraining orders):
  “A lot of times, it's a timeout. We give our kids—give the parent a timeout.” [30:16]

• Lauren (On children and fame):
  “Any child you see who is delighted by your presence—you only want to make them feel more happy…this is a true personality flaw.” [66:28]

• Chandler (On ‘Dad Talk’):
  “Just junk in the middle of my show. Get it off.” [11:33]

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Important Timestamps (Content Only)

| Time | Segment / Topic | |--------|-------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:41 | Lauren’s illness, sister banter, and video podcast news | | 06:56 | Why the “emergency episode” on Taylor Frankie Paul was delayed | | 11:53 | Introduction to Taylor Frankie Paul domestic violence scandal | | 18:42 | Leaked bodycam footage & hosts’ reactions | | 27:33 | Interview: John Bledsoe (family law attorney) on restraining orders | | 39:50 | Bachelorette season cancellation discussed; franchise future debate | | 49:55 | Jesse and Jordan’s divorce, weapon / bag speculation | | 61:15 | Chapel Roan’s Brazil fan controversy detailed | | 67:58 | Rio mayor’s ban on Chapel Roan recounted | | 71:19 | Savannah Guthrie’s mother disappearance, media dropping the story |

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Episode Tone & Style

• The tone is irreverent, personal, and deeply pop-culture savvy—marked by fast-paced banter, sarcastic asides (“It’s not happening, Diane”), and insider references to both recent and classic reality TV.
• The sisters invite listeners into their familial dynamic, freely teasing each other and using “armchair psychologist” language about celebrities’ choices and behavior.
• Despite the levity, they address the Taylor Frankie Paul DV allegations with appropriate seriousness and compassion for victims, balancing gossip with reflection.

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Summary for New Listeners

If you haven’t been following the Taylor Frankie Paul saga, this episode provides a thorough, candid look at how one social media influencer’s unraveling became a tipping point for two major reality TV franchises. Chandler and Lauren offer fresh insights, legal clarity, and unfiltered opinions—while also unpacking why fans and brands alike are distancing themselves, and how the reality TV world reckons (or fails to) with serious scandals. Drama from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, the Chapel Roan incident, and broader “Bachelor” franchise gripes round out a jam-packed hour.

Recommended for:
Reality TV obsessives, pop culture fans, legal drama lovers, and anyone invested in influencer accountability.

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Next up:
Stay tuned for the upcoming two-part series on celebrity feuds and Friday’s episode covering Love Story and Real Housewives of Beverly Hills.

Transcript

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[Lauren]

I'm not. Well, I am sick. I'm fully sick. And you're not for. You're not forcing me to record. That is correct. But I am sick. She is. Well, I literally was in bed all day yesterday. Yesterday.

[Chandler]

Okay, I was just not trying to, you know, alarm our listeners like, you have a cold. I mean, and don't even get me started on your protocol like what you were. What you were taking yesterday in the way that I just swiftly had to, you know, swoop in and fix things.

[Lauren]

I wouldn't call it a cold. So I woke up yesterday and I went downstairs. Chandler. And I knew I had this important meeting with Kagan for our family and so.

[Chandler]

What do you mean? You needed to just talk to your husband?

[Lauren]

No, no. So, no, I did not have an important meeting with Kagan. When I talked to Kagan, I call it an important meeting without our help. No, no, so basically we closed. Finally. We sold our apartment in Puerto Rico because we moved into a different place in Puerto Rico, but we finally sold it. And so he told me all last week when I was in New York. He's like, you have to be back on Monday for the house closing. Like, you cannot not be here. So anyway, lo and behold, of course I catch like a grave illness and I, I truly, I truly am ailing. And the day of the closing, I wake up and I feel like, like death becomes her. And so I walk downstairs and I'm like, I have to go to this house closing. So I'm going to drink coffee to try to like pep up. Can I take one sip? And my body is like, no, absolutely not. Like, you know you're ill when your body won't allow you to drink caffeination and it's just like, get your, get your ass back in bed.

[Chandler]

You absolutely know you're sick when the coffee is revolting. When the coffee does not hit. I mean, it's really bleak during those times because coffee is really one of the only things that's like an instant 12 out of 10 experience for both of us.

[Lauren]

It was just so wild. So I, I actually came upstairs and I went right back to bed. I slept for two hours and I, I'm not a person who can nap.

[Chandler]

Are we getting a play by play of the sickness?

[Lauren]

I'm not gonna bore everyone to tears, I swear.

[Chandler]

Okay, let's, let's make it in like four to six hour chunks maybe, rather

[Lauren]

than instead of two hour chunks.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

Anyway, but I had to go to the house closing, so I did. I went to the house closing and then I came back and I slept for the rest of the day. I was in bed asleep. So Chandler's like, she's, she's fine, everyone. I'm not fine. I am sick. Sick.

[Chandler]

One question. Why is your hair curled?

[Lauren]

Because I am more vain than you, okay? And if I'm going to have, if I'm going to get on video, I'm going to curl my hair. I don't care if I'm feverish. I don't care if I'm getting chemo, okay? If I have to go on, if I have to, if I have to get on camera, I'm going to be on literally as they're shoving morphine into my veins. I beg of you, please curl my hair so at least it looks good. I would like to be cremated, but I would like to have curled beach waves as I go into the fiery furnace.

[Chandler]

What's the how many inch wand should I be using? I'd be like, I need to write this down.

[Lauren]

This is a hugely important one and a half Chandler. And the. The curls won't stick but one inch and I'll look like Little Bo Peep. So you have to get it right.

[Chandler]

Okay, noted. Well, and once again, I didn't realize what I would be, you know, kicking off by saying, you are. Well, you are doing much better. And you were taking the wrong. Well, actually, I'm gonna say that I don't think you have. You have a cold because you didn't throw up. Like, talk to me when you're thrown up. If you've thrown up, then you maybe have the flu or something else, but you have a cold.

[Lauren]

It's not just a cold. It's. I'm ailed. I'm ailing. Excuse me. And I like to see that you put a lot of effort into your appearance today. Your hair is looking stunning.

[Chandler]

My hair is freshly washed, which to me is like, a huge, huge triumph.

[Lauren]

Yeah. Okay.

[Chandler]

This is the point of these recordings. That they're casual, that they're cute. And, you know, what it means is that when this inevitably comes out and I do see this footage of myself, I will shudder and then immediately swipe up. I'm like, let me look at something else. I don't care. I can't do it. I was literally just looking up hair extension places right before we got on this recording. So I'm definitely vain, but I.

[Lauren]

Not as vain as people.

[Chandler]

I'm, like, more lazy than vain. Like, I wish I was more vain than lazy, but I'm more lazy than vain.

[Lauren]

Let's move forward.

[Chandler]

Yeah, you also, you. When you got on this recording, you look like you were already laughing at me. So were you actually laughing at my Higher.

[Lauren]

How your hair looks. Oh, really? It just looks a little crazy.

[Chandler]

Doesn't look. I think it looks good.

[Lauren]

It looks fine when you put that one side back. But that one side was kind of frizzy and it was just giving, like, a little bit, like, between houses.

[Chandler]

You guys, she was literally laughing at my hair. I'm quite happy with my natural curl.

[Lauren]

It was just that side. That side looks honestly pretty.

[Chandler]

Honestly pretty.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

I am actually quite. Yeah, I'm quite happy with my natural curl.

[Lauren]

And that looks so much better. Thank you for putting that one side back.

[Chandler]

Yeah, I mean, it's like, this is the problem with letting your hair air dry is that, like, the first three hours are a little bit touch and go. And then after it's kind of dried. Then you can, like, you know, judge. But anyway, everybody, yes, I am more lazy than vain and Lauren is more than anything else. So let's move forward.

[Lauren]

Plenty. Plenty. Vain, lazy sometimes. Okay. So anyway, if people are asking, like, why didn't you guys hop on and do an emergency episode? We literally planned to have an emergency episode out about the Taylor Frankie Paul gate situation. And sadly, I just, I fell ill. Death became me. So we couldn't do it. So we are just. We're giving you our takes. Finally. Today we were supposed to do that emergency episode. I apologize, everyone.

[Chandler]

Yes. But we are here now and I am just dying to talk to you about this because last week we were, you know, really, you know, landing the Epstein deep dive plane and just trying to get through that. And so, I mean, fortunately, this isn't the lightest affair, but I am quite relieved to be talking about this and not last week's, you know, subject matter.

[Lauren]

No, absolutely. We're back to our regularly scheduled programming. Thank you so much to everyone who listened and enjoyed that Epstein series. But we are back to our normal fare and we're so happy to be here. One note. We are committed to being back on video, you know, as much as possible, if not all the time. So with that, there's some exciting news. Apple now has updated their iOS, so if you're on the latest iOS and in the Apple podcast app, you can be watching us on video. So this is very exciting. Apple did not have video available up until this point and we have been so, like, wanting this day to come. And they've been so generous as to feature us on the homepage right now, which is super exciting. So if would like to watch this episode on video, just make sure you're on the latest OS and go to your Apple podcast app if you are an Apple viewer. And then hopefully, Chandler, we're going to get our Apple global elites the video experience, which, you know, they have not been able to enjoy up until this point. So it's exciting. It's exciting.

[Chandler]

It's very exciting. Anything else in the housekeeping realm?

[Lauren]

No. That was such a long monologue about that. Sorry, I was like, trying to plane for so long.

[Chandler]

I'm sorry.

[Lauren]

I just want to say one thing too. Your true colors are beautiful. Do you know what I'm referring to?

[Chandler]

I think you could just like, take it down a couple notches.

[Lauren]

Do you know what I'm referring to?

[Chandler]

Yes, of course I know what you're talking about. I don't know if you knew that But I was just quoting Demi's, like, feedback for Brett.

[Lauren]

Oh.

[Chandler]

When she's like. Or she's like, you're a little flat.

[Lauren]

You're a little breathy. I think that you're a little breathy, and that's why you're flat. Oh, my gosh. I'm sorry, you guys, if I was not looking forward to season four. For some reason, I kind of was just, like, feeling like I'd had enough of this show for a minute. But, wow. Season four has actually been so entertaining to watch. A Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.

[Chandler]

Season four has definitely been entertaining. I have broken my marital vow because I am watching it, you know, on the side. I'm not watching it with Ben. I'm not waiting for him to watch every episode.

[Lauren]

He wants you to wait to watch it with him?

[Chandler]

Yes. Yeah. He loves.

[Lauren]

That is so cute.

[Chandler]

Yeah. No, he does. He really does love the show because, like, the. Because he didn't watch it originally with me. Well, maybe. I don't know. All the seasons are blowing together, but he, like, wasn't watching it, and then all of a sudden, he started watching it with me, and then, like, I had already seen the whole season, and then he was watching it, and I came home one night, and he was literally, like, mid episode when I got home. So anyway, I am loving it.

[Lauren]

Long story short, I think it's better than season three.

[Chandler]

I will say I am struggling with all of the men getting this much airtime.

[Lauren]

No, it needs to stop. Like, it needs to stop. They're trying to make Fetch happen, and it ain't happening. Diane. I mean, I need dad Talk to

[Chandler]

be over, like, yesterday. I mean, Mom Talk already, as a. As a name, as a nickname, is cringe. And the amount of times, you know, it's referenced in the show, that's already a difficult thing for us viewers. The fact that now dad Talk is a part of the lexicon in such a serious way. Like, you know, dad Talk's coming on the trip.

[Lauren]

We need to show Mom Talk that we can stand on our own two feet. Like, we're not on their coattails. Oh, I actually have a big announcement for you. You are absolutely on their coattails. You will always be on their coattails. And trying to have social media careers and be reality stars is honestly one of the most cringe things I've ever seen. And it's. It's an. It annoys me as a viewer because we are not interested in the men's drama. Like, this is junk. This is junk. In the middle of My show, Get

[Chandler]

it off, it's absolutely junk, and it makes me, like, the entire concept less.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

So, anyway, now we must talk about the matter at hand. I mean, the story that is. That is still, like, unfolding in real time as we speak. Like, there's new body cam footage that was released today.

[Lauren]

Yeah. Okay, so this all began with news coming out that there was a new domestic violence incident, right?

[Chandler]

Yes. In February.

[Lauren]

In February, yeah. So this was reported that they had paused filming. Okay. Because Taylor, Frankie Paul and Dakota Mortenson were involved in a domestic abuse case. Like, a new incident had occurred. A source close to production told people they are not filming Taylor. Frankie Paul has some pretty serious stuff happening regarding her past, and they will see what happens until that resolves their off.

[Chandler]

Can I just say.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

When I first saw this news break, I thought this was a total publicity stunt. I thought this was, like, you know, they halt filming, and it's like this big thing. I just did not really believe that it was something big and real, like, that was happening. Yeah, it wasn't until I heard a little bit more about what. What literally went down with her in Dakota in February that I was like, oh, like something. Something did go down. But I just feel like, you know, publicity stunts happen. People try to drum up buzz so that more people want to tune into the Bachelorette. I was just very skeptical of it being a real scandal. So then imagine my surprise when it turns into, like, a mushroom cloud.

[Lauren]

So basically, sources told TMZ that Dakota called the Utah Division of Child and Family Services, alleging that Taylor had been physically abusive to their son ever. Who turned to just this past week. TMZ sources say Taylor denied the allegation, and Dakota has become frustrated that no action has been taken. So allegations, according to a spokesperson, have been made in both directions about domestic assault. And things, I guess, came to a head late last month when Taylor and Dakota were driving in his car, and it got in a heated argument. Allegedly, a drink was spilled on the seat and on Dakota, and he became enraged. Sources connected to Taylor say he got physical with her, were told to. Dakota called the police and said Taylor was the one who got physical. So then I guess Dakota went MIA for nearly three weeks, and that's why production stopped. He was an important part of the. Of the show. Sources connected to the show tell a different story, that cast members refused to continue filming despite producers wanting to keep filming because of the alleged child and spousal abuse allegations. Honestly, I mean, we'll talk about that, but I actually find that to be very hard to believe that everyone's like, oh, Taylor and Dakota have this horrible thing happening. I won't film at all, period. That, to me, is really unrealistic. So I don't actually know what's going on there, but I just find it hard to believe that none of them would film because they have this happening.

[Chandler]

Well, here's what I will say. I actually could see the rest of the cast being so fed up with this drama with the two of them going back and forth around and around after she's already filmed the Bachelor after. You know, I mean, think about the. The way this show opens season one. It's like her and Dakota, the body cam footage. I mean, these two have been going around and around on this toxic merry go round, if you will.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

For years. And it's in. I don't know how far you are into the new season, but, like, it is still happening. And I can see the fatigue from the other women with having to deal with it and talk about it. So then when the ante gets upped even more and even. And then when the situation becomes, like, truly violent and terrible, like, I can actually see them being like, we want them off the show or we, like, we're not with them. That's. That's my perspective.

[Lauren]

Yeah. Maybe it's something where they're saying, we don't want to film if they're a part of this.

[Chandler]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't think they want their. Their payday to end. They don't want their, you know, their livelihood to go away.

[Lauren]

Right.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

No, that's. That's a really good point. I could see that absolutely being the case because we have been on this toxic merry go round, so. So we all see this news come out, and we're like, what's gonna happen with the Bachelor? But, you know, Bachelorette, ABC on Instagram or whatever it is, keeps uploading their promo reels of Taylor as the Bachelorette with all the rose petals, you know, with all those rose petal graphics. And it's, like, kind of weird. And people are thinking, like, what is gonna happen? Are they actually gonna air this season?

[Chandler]

I feel like a lot of people weren't even worried they were gonna air this season.

[Lauren]

Yeah, you're probably. You're right. It was just weird.

[Chandler]

It was super weird. I thought there was just, you know, bad headlines about her the week that it's supposed to get aired, and I just really was not that, like, mired in it. And then she goes on Good Morning America, and they. The first thing they say is like we want to give you in a moment to address the headlines. You know, at this point we haven't seen anything else but the headlines.

[Lauren]

Right?

[Chandler]

And she's like it's a heavy time and she kind of just word salads her way through that interview. But then this episode is brought to you by booking.com planning a girls trip always sounds fun until you remember you're booking for multiple people with very specific opinions. My sisters and I have non negotiables blackout curtains so we can actually sleep. Good natural light for all those photos and ideally something close to a beach and just go ahead and trust me, we're not very flexible about these things. That's why booking.com is our go to booking.com offers a wide array of hotels and vacation rentals across the US so you can find exactly what you're booking for. Even if the people you're booking for are extremely picky like us. You can filter for the things that actually matter instead of settling for something that's just fine. Whether you're booking for yourself, your partner or a high maintenance group chat, booking.com makes it easy to get it right. If a stay can check all of our boxes, it can check anyone's Find exactly what you're booking for. Booking.com, booking yeah, book today on the site or in the app. Meal planning is one of those things that I want to be good at. But then it's suddenly 8pm and I'm ordering food from a random restaurant that's still open. That's why I trust Marley Spoon. It actually works with how I live instead of having to be a weekly meal prepper, it does the meal prep for me. Some nights I have time to cook and sometimes I do not and Marley Spoon has options for it all. Ready to cook, ready to heat, even ready to eat. Everything is chef designed, made with quality ingredients and it still feels balanced without me having to think all that hard about it. I recently made their lasagna soup. This is a recipe I had been dying to try and I was so impressed with myself. What I love most is how flexible it is. You can switch things up week to week, skip when you need to, and pick meals that actually fit your mood. It just takes the pressure off while still letting you eat well. If you're trying to get out of your what am I eating tonight? Spiral Marley Spoon makes it way easier without over complicating your Life. Go to MarleySpoon.com offer pop for 45 off your first order and free delivery. That's right. 45 off your first order and free Delivery. That's Marley Spoon.com offer/pop.

[Lauren]

But then, so finally, three days before they're supposed to release the show, TMZ releases the actual footage of the 2023 domestic violence incident. This footage is completely shocking. We had always heard she threw, like, a chair. We had always heard that. And we always heard the child was present and got hit by the chair.

[Chandler]

Yeah. Was somehow injured in this.

[Lauren]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. It was always like a passive. Was somehow injured. Not that she obviously threw a chair at her child. And that's not what happened when you watch the video.

[Chandler]

Right.

[Lauren]

Regardless, though, seeing it on video is extremely different than reading about it. And I will say, I mean, what was your first reaction when you saw this video?

[Chandler]

I was horrified by this video because it's. I thought, we're gonna have this one chair throwing moment, and then it's gonna. It's. It's. It's a one chair situation. One chair was thrown and, you know,

[Lauren]

well, a metal stool. It's almost different than a chair. Like those heavy metal ikea. IKEA stools are very. Are very scary. The idea of that being projected.

[Chandler]

Throwing anything. Throwing anything. I thought, we're gonna have this one sort of climactic. One thing being thrown moment and that. And then it's just like, oh, wow, this really escalated. This went way too far. The fact that we had three chairs thrown.

[Lauren]

Yeah. All available stools.

[Chandler]

All available stools were thrown. Like, the situation got so heated and intense. And it continues to play out that way after. After her daughter starts crying after she's been, you know, hit by the chair. Like, the audio is so alarming and scary because the lights are on, but nobody's helping with Taylor. She is so out of it.

[Lauren]

Yeah. I mean, that's the type of thing where you. You do that and you never touch alcohol again. You get serious therapy and you pray to God you can, like, get to a good place in life where you can be a parent and be a healthy person. Like, that's. That's it. Right. And so the idea that this happened in 2023 and then there's a new domestic violence incident. I think we all felt this way. We all just thought, we can't watch a season of this woman as the Bachelorette.

[Chandler]

No. I mean, to me, I don't want to see her on my TV ever again.

[Lauren]

No, absolutely. And I will say, when I watched the video, I kind of had like, a big moment where I just thought, wow, we didn't grow up with any domestic violence. And I just had, like, this, like, moment where I just felt like, wow, I need to really be aware of kind of the privilege of, like, never having seen something like this before. Like, I don't know if you had a moment like that while watching this video, but I just. I had never witnessed domestic violence until watching this video. Really?

[Chandler]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Lauren]

I mean, I guess I saw it ends with us, but a little different. You know, I never really seen it actually play out. And it's like, I can't imagine living in a home where there's just really no boundaries and rules on what's going to happen.

[Chandler]

Yeah, I just.

[Lauren]

I just feel like I want to have a moment of, I don't know, being aware of how. How terrifying that must be for kids that grew up in an environment like that and for spouses who are spouses of. Of abusers and how scary and how horrible. And I just. I. I only have, like, deepest sympathy for people who go through that. And so. And so, yeah, we can't have Taylor, Frankie, Paul, A, on the cast of Secret Lives, and B, on. On the show the Bachelorette, especially as the Bachelorette. It's like, it was kind of already a little bit silly to me to start with, and now it's especially ridiculous.

[Chandler]

Where do I even want to begin responding to that? Because I. Yeah, I completely agree. I was very sobering to watch because it's a very. It's extremely raw.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

Like, and. And I think the fact that she is not hearing her daughter being upset. She's not hearing the severity of the situation of, like, what's happening in front of her, and she's not able to pull back or to, like, there was just no reasoning that was happening. And. And then you watch them. The body cam footage. I don't know if you watched what came out today, but she is extremely drunk. She's, like, blackout drunk.

[Lauren]

Well, I saw that. The body cam footage that came out of Dakota talking to the police officer. Is there more?

[Chandler]

Yeah, there's, like, now it's, like, the full video of, like, the police, like, arriving at the house from the police's perspective and, like, the police kind of starting to separate them and talking to her and talking to him. And she is, like. I actually thought a couple of times, I was like, I wonder if she's gonna throw up because she's, like, heaving, crying, almost like coughing.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

Very upset. Anyway, she is so. She's just so not there. And I think she even has said, I saw something that, like, she said in an interview that she doesn't remember hitting her, that she doesn't remember that it hit her daughter. None of this is an excuse. I just. I want to be very clear. I think it's just. That's what makes it so scary, is that she's literally that inebriated and, like, the fact that. That you're that drunk and this is who you turn into, I mean, this is. Yes. This is a person who should never have another drink, like, again, because they cannot be trusted. And so then that's 2023. And it's like, okay, this horrific thing happens in 2023. The rest of the world, you know, before last week, didn't know how horrific it was. We just, you know, knew that she was working on herself, doing a lot of therapy, whatever.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

And then she's on probation. I mean, I. I heard that her probation was supposed to be up in August. She's. She's still on probation. And then another situation happens, and it just makes me think, like, how. How much more has this gone on that just hasn't been reported or, you know, so. So, yeah, whatever happens in February. And I truly believe that. That what happened in February, like, that there is more to that story that we just do not know about.

[Lauren]

What do you mean? Oh, like this. Like this most recent one. Excuse me.

[Chandler]

Yes, I believe this most recent one. There's more to this story that we do that led to. Led to what? You know, what we're seeing unfold now. I mean, we know that she tried to, like, choke him with his necklace that allegedly. Yeah, we know that she allegedly tried to choke Dakota with his necklace. And I guess, like, I saw something on Reddit about how, like, strangulation is really high on, like, the lethal. Some type of chart. Because it is. It can be very lethal anyway. Just like, this is an ex. This is an extremely dangerous person.

[Lauren]

Yeah. And it's. It's interesting when you hear the police officer talking to Dakota, because you can hear in Dakota's voice that he's, like, really not soaked on her getting arrested.

[Chandler]

No.

[Lauren]

And that she's going to be charged. And he's like, I guess I'll fill this out. Like, because this is what it's come to. And the police officer is like, yeah. You know, she could have easily picked up a knife in that state. Right. Like, you're, you know, you're kind of. You're in a situation where, thankfully, it was a chair that you could, like, fend off, but you don't. You don't know the next time what it's going to be. So we have to press charges. Like, she has to have a wake up call. And I don't know, I guess I just wonder, like, how do some people do this and most people don't. Like, that's. I guess my question, like, what do you mean? Like, is this something that was modeled for her in her childhood?

[Chandler]

You know, as my armchair psychologist. Perspective. Armchair psychiatrist. Perspective is that she is a person who, when she drinks or when she is any, you know, like the. She is not able to. To like, keep her wits about her and that she turns into. Yeah, like a. A violently different person. Not all the time, but that can happen. And like, I just. I don't want to be in a relationship. I don't want to be raised by anybody who, you know, actively drinks while knowing that this, like, side of themselves exists. Mm. No, I. I think we should phone a friend now because I did tell dad that we would call him to ask him about.

[Lauren]

Amazing.

[Chandler]

Perfect. The protective order. And I. I know he has a meeting in like an hour, in a couple of minutes, so I want to call him before his next meeting starts.

[Lauren]

Perfect. Okay, so we're gonna call our dad, attorney John Bledsoe. He's a family law attorney in California, everyone. To get his thoughts on Taylor, Frankie, Paul, and probably the restraining order from Jesse.

[Chandler]

Okay, dad, you're on the podcast. You're being, you know, patched in. This is our phone a friend moment. Phone an expert. We want to talk to you about the protective order and I guess the restraining order. I don't really know if there's a difference between the two. That was granted to Dakota. He currently has, I believe, full custody until, like, they can have a hearing in the. In like early April. Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

What was the grand. When was the. Hi. Hello, girls. When was the order granted?

[Chandler]

I think. I think last week. I think late last week.

[John Bledsoe]

It makes sense. They typically, in California, they last. They're only supposed to last three weeks.

[Chandler]

Okay.

[John Bledsoe]

That's a temporary. That's a temporary restraining order. It's generally done just on somebody's written statement and whether or not the court thinks it's strong enough because they're generally. They can be gone on four hours notice. In other words, somebody goes to court at 9am Goes to the self help center, the courthouse, and then they have some paralegal there help them fill out the forms. They write up their story, and it all goes to the judge in writing. And then the judge will issue a temporary restraining order which will be which, which will last up to, typically up to three weeks. And they will even give a temporary custody order during that time if they think it's appropriate. Like father stay away and mother gets custody of the kids. No visitation to dad for three weeks. Yeah, something like that.

[Chandler]

I think that's what we're seeing here is that she has no visitation now until this April 7th hearing.

[John Bledsoe]

If they call the police, it's, it's pretty easy to get the restraining order. A lot of times the police will. The police can issue their own five day restraining order. They call it emergency protective order. The police themselves will issue an order. They go to the house and they find that there's marks on one. One of the parties from the other party. Then the police will issue their own five day order. I think they have to call the judge for that, but it's pretty, pretty, pretty rubber stamp in nature.

[Chandler]

Okay.

[John Bledsoe]

And then once you get to the hearing three weeks later, then you have to prove your case by a preponderance of the evidence. Like more likely than not, did domestic violence occur and which of the parties was the primary aggressor? Notice they say primary aggressor. It's assumed that both of them might not aggressive with each other, but who was the one who did the most damage or is really the one who initiated it? Okay, so it sounds like she went off on him.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

And. Or at least, at least at this point, he made a convincing written statement that convinced the judge that she was in the wrong, that she was the cause of the violence and therefore she needs to have a timeout. It's like a timeout. We give our kids.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

Give the parent a timeout.

[Chandler]

Three weeks.

[John Bledsoe]

A lot of times it's no visitation. You won't see the kids.

[Chandler]

Yeah, yeah. That's what I saw on TMZ is that, you know, no, no parent time for her. What I'm. What I saw is that apparently she allegedly grabbed him by his like, necklace and then tried to sort of choke him and that their, their son was present at the time, which is why. And, and there it's all a little confusing because he, I think Dakota, her boyfriend, ex boyfriend, whatever, baby daddy, has said that he is claiming that she is abusive, but I don't know if that's just like, because he was in the room or if she's ever directly harmed their, their, their kid.

[John Bledsoe]

If it was in front of the child, it was bad.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

Obviously the child. It's very traumatic for the child to assume that.

[Chandler]

Oh yeah, no, of course. Of Course, yeah.

[Lauren]

I guess my question is, is there any possibility that the judge will grant this restraining order, but it's not actually warranted and the other party is lying. Like could dak lying about all the times?

[John Bledsoe]

Yes.

[Lauren]

Oh, a lot of times, yes.

[John Bledsoe]

All they do is write up their statement and if it's a total lie, the judge may still believe it. And, and based on four hours notice, for instance, let's say that she calls in California, the woman goes to the, the victim goes to the courthouse in the morning, 9am to go to the self help center and then they write up a big story with some paralegal who works for the courthouse, for the courthouse. You know, let's say that they're just, you know, and most of the, let's just say most of the reported, most of the reported domestic violence is against men. All right, we can agree on that.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

Now there's probably just as much domestic violence going on women, on men, but a lot of times the men don't report it. Interesting, because they don't, you know, they're, they just don't, they can walk out, they walk away or whatever. It's just a fact. So then they go to the courthouse, they, they, they write up this big story and a lot of it is maybe fictitious and, and the guy may be at work, he may not have time to deal with it. He may be, he could be anywhere. And so he may not. And so then by one, by 1:30 in the afternoon, that written statement is in front of the, is in front of the judge theoretically. And the woman, the, the victim, let's just say the victim calls the, the man at nine o' clock in the morning says, I'm giving you notice. I'm going to be in courtroom 24 at 1:30. I'm seeking a restraining order against your temporary restraining order. And then the guy, he asked, he's got to find a way to respond. Sometimes, you know, women, I'm just saying the victims, and typically it's the female, but they will, they could cook up a big story and then they're a tourniquet of two or three days to put it together and then they have a great, really convincing declaration with pictures of bruises or things like pictures of scratches or bruises, injuries. And then they, they have this, with color pictures, you have this declaration that's being submitted to court and the person who's the alleged perpetrator, they, they're at a disadvantage. They don't really have, they may not be able to write up their story that quickly. And that effectively. So a lot of times.

[Chandler]

And then it all just comes down to like, whatever they. They say against the other statement.

[John Bledsoe]

And the judge will say. The judge will say, I'm going to keep the peace. I wanted these two needed timeout. I'll give the woman or the victim, the Bennett, the alleged victim, the benefit of the doubt against the alleged perpetrator. So then I'm kicking the perpetrator out of the house and he's going to. He cannot. Then we'll see everybody in court in three weeks.

[Chandler]

So what I.

[John Bledsoe]

And then he's out.

[Chandler]

What I understand from this case is that this horrific video that we all saw last week was actually submitted as part of his evidence for why he should be granted this new restraining order. I think, you know, maybe he didn't have video evidence of what. What happened last month, but he's, you know, he's showing. Trying to show. There's a history here.

[John Bledsoe]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

So that's. That's why we're.

[John Bledsoe]

You could show videos of past things that have happened. Like sometimes people have ring cameras.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

And they're recording everything. And so you can show the videos or whatever. At. Particularly at the hearing. I don't know that a video would typically get through on the initial paperwork because it's generally just paperwork that the court's reading.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[John Bledsoe]

But at the hearing, you could be bringing back all the history of show the whole history of the abuse.

[Lauren]

So really, after the next hearing, we'll learn what's. Or most likely what's kind of going on once the evidence is actually presented.

[John Bledsoe]

And then the party has to be. The victim has to show up and put their case on, and they better have their exhibits and they better be ready to go. Sometimes what the alleged perpetrator will do is they will show up with the last minute with an attorney fully ready to go. And they don't really have to file any. Any major paperwork on it. They can just file paperwork saying I'm good to go. In other words, they can say that was mistaken. So they can file paperwork saying I'm. I'm not going to make any comments. I'll just testify in court.

[Chandler]

Yeah. Okay.

[Lauren]

Thank you so much, dad.

[Chandler]

Dad, I think we got what we needed. Thank you so much.

[Lauren]

Thank you. I love you girls. Love you so much.

[Chandler]

Bye.

[Lauren]

Talk to you later. Bye.

[Chandler]

I feel like spring fashion always tricks me. One day I'm in a long coat, and the next day everyone's like. It's all about pastels and light layers, and I'm still putting on the Same jeans I've worn since October.

[Lauren]

No, I completely get it. I feel like spring can be very deceptive. You're layering for the weather, and it may seem easy, but it actually takes careful planning. This spring, I'm taking a page out of the Pastel Dream Lookbook. You know, soft colors, light layers and expressive details. Like a floral dress with a layered diamond necklace. That is very me.

[Chandler]

Okay, but here's the thing. I don't actually love how every spring fashion girlies are like, it's pastel dream season. I don't want to look like a Peeps marshmallow.

[Lauren]

Okay, well, Chandler, that's because Pastel Dream isn't about going full cotton candy from head to toe.

[Chandler]

It's more like soft, enchanting, elegant pieces

[Lauren]

styled in a way that feels personal. Macy's fashion experts are literally calling this trend the trend of the season.

[Chandler]

Okay, that's the part that I need help with. I want to participate in, you know, these trends. I just don't want the trend to wear me. I don't want it to look like I am in the trend, if you know what I'm saying.

[Lauren]

Yeah, that makes so much sense. And I think the important thing is making it feel personal. For me, that's jewelry and accessories. I'll always keep an outfit simple. Maybe a soft pastel top or a light blazer. But then I'll stack necklaces, add a statement earring or throw on a bag.

[Chandler]

I feel like a bag can really add so much. And for me, I guess the Pastel Dream in my personal style would probably look like my usual jeans with a soft color top and maybe a light cardigan or sweater. Then maybe I'd throw on a little pearl necklace or maybe, you know, a little mixed metals. I love that.

[Lauren]

I love being grounded in basics, but just adding a casual pastel moment.

[Chandler]

I really would lean into accessories too, just in a different way. You know, you keep the outfits in simple and then you do like a pastel bag or a fun shoe. I love a little butter yellow. Also, let's not forget about, you know, a little spring scarf moment if I'm feeling brave. Okay.

[Lauren]

Scarf styling. I'm loving your versatility.

[Chandler]

I'm trying here. Okay. Honestly, that's what I like about Macy's curated Pastel dream. It's not just one look. You can find delicate florals that work with denim flowy dresses if you're wanting to feel more dressed up. And even tailored pastel sets. Sets for people, unlike me, who want to dress in one color. Head to Toe Tran. They have you.

[Lauren]

They have lightweight fabrics and textures like lace ruffles and shears that make an outfit feel elevated without being too much,

[Chandler]

which I deeply appreciate, because sometimes a trend feels like a lot of pressure, but this feels more like you pick one or two elements and then just call it a day. Like a collage on your body. Absolutely.

[Lauren]

Pastel dream is about soft color, light layers, and expressive details, but style to your taste, so you don't look like everyone else.

[Chandler]

I can already see myself wearing this to all my upcoming events. Easter with our family, brunch with my girlfriends, or Saturdays in Central Park.

[Lauren]

Those are the perfect Pastel dream environments.

[Chandler]

And who knows, maybe I can incorporate this vibe into my new apartment. You know me, once I start to sort of romanticize an outfit, I start to romanticize my home. As you should, Chandler.

[Lauren]

Macy's has pastel accents for your table settings if you're hosting, and textured bedding that makes your space feel lighter and more spring ready.

[Chandler]

So basically, whether you're going full soft girl spring or just flirting with the trend like me, you can find pastel dream styles and silhouettes at Macy's right now. Shop in store or online@macy's.com.

[Lauren]

okay. Thank you for bringing dad on. Chan. That was excellent. I feel like we will learn a lot more after this hearing. I believe it's April 4th, 7th.

[Chandler]

I can't remember.

[Lauren]

Yeah, one of the two. So we'll know more then. But in the meantime, Taylor, Frankie Paul has been canceled at. Well, her entire season of the Bachelorette has been canceled as supposed to premiere on Sunday.

[Chandler]

I mean, I mean, I think once the video came out, everyone was like, will they still air this? This season? It's supposed to come out, you know, on Sunday. Yeah.

[Lauren]

And they. Thankfully, they did the right thing by canceling the season. Just doesn't make any sense to. To air that. I. I will say we've never been in a situation like this before, and it is absolutely. It is such a disaster. Like, I can tell you, even just our little podcast and our ad commitments, if we have an episode that doesn't go out with the right ad in it, or maybe we miss say something on an ad. Oh, we're gonna hear about it. There's gonna be problems. Like, people take their commitments to their advertisers very seriously. And I saw a theory that Dumois posted, which was basically that the season was boring, that no one really bought her as the Bachelorette that she was. You know, that she went back to Dakota right after and so the reunion was bad because no one was invested at all. And essentially ABC was looking for a reason to scrap the season. Not correct. So incorrect. So absolutely incorrect. There's just no way they would do that.

[Chandler]

Also, can I just say, I mean, most of the seasons are pretty boring. At the Bachelorette, there's like, I can't remember the last season that wasn't boring. So the idea that they were like, this one was a little. A little too boring. We're gonna cancel it. Nope. That's not. Nope.

[Lauren]

Even the fact that it was kind of boring would have made headlines. But you're right. You're. You're absolutely correct. And regardless, they would have just put it out, no matter what, to have gotten the views that they could. To have made the money that they could.

[Chandler]

Yes, because there are some people who watch it no matter what. We are not those people. We're going to tune in just because it was, you know, a person we were, like, kind of interested in. And I do think they did the right thing. And I am glad that they chose to take the high road. Even though, you know, some people are like, just release it. And, you know, I still kind of want to see it. I just. This person does not deserve to be platformed right now.

[Lauren]

No. Well, also, I just have to say, I never bought her as the Bachelorette to begin with. And I know it's not necessarily the nicest thing to say, but give me a break. Like, the girl has multiple baby daddies and a domestic violence felony. Why is she the Bachelorette? The ABC knew this to begin with. This is not a sterling woman. You know, of great. Of great report.

[Chandler]

Are you quoting the article of Faith right now?

[Lauren]

Good nature and good report or whatever. Like, it never made sense to me. The Bachelor and the Bachelorette need to be a. Both extremely, extremely hot and especially the Bachelor. I'm just going to be real. He needs to be very, very rich. That's how you get a good season because you get people actually obsessed with the lead.

[Chandler]

Like, you know, super committed season.

[Lauren]

Nick Vile as the Bachelor. Okay, we're not buying it that people are fighting for this guy.

[Chandler]

Any season of the Bachelor that looks like a guy I've seen on Hinge a million times, like some just mid guy.

[Lauren]

You're not even sure if you're gonna swipe right on him, let alone vie for his love on national television against 30 other girls.

[Chandler]

It's like the type of guys where you're like, I just gotta go on a lot of first dates till I meet the One like, you're just like. It's just a numbers game.

[Lauren]

Yes, exactly. You're like, I gotta kiss a lot of frogs, so I gotta at least go on this date. That's Nick Vile.

[Chandler]

Honestly, the Bachelor has. It's been years since it was actually that fun to watch. And I saw something today about how they think ABC might just be canceling the whole franchise. Like the whole Bachelor Bachelorette franchise. And I would be very happy about that.

[Lauren]

I could easily bring it back, though, because guess what? You know when the. The best seasons were, Andrew Firestone, when it was like the heir to the Firestone tire fortune.

[Chandler]

Oh, I don't remember that.

[Lauren]

I was like, you're probably in like the fourth grade. And then Emily Maynard, if you get him hot enough or rich enough or both. Especially both, people will freak the fuck out and they will genuinely be so obsessed and it'll be so fun to watch. I don't need a job, but I could take this job of casting this show.

[Chandler]

Please hire Lauren and I by the hour. We have, you know, high hourly rate,

[Lauren]

but we will, we will Bachelor franchise.

[Chandler]

We'll come in there and we will fix this production. We know exactly what to look for. We have, you know, in Lauren's words, a high tolerance for male beauty.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

And we can, we can, we can find the right people, find the right ship. Why do you think the casting has been so bad with it?

[Lauren]

I think that they. They felt like if you cast someone that people were already invested in, that you would more likely get viewers for the next season.

[Chandler]

I'm not talking about Taylor. I'm talking about, like, before Taylor. Yeah. Like, because they're always casting from the rejects, like.

[Lauren]

Yeah, exactly. From past seasons. Taylor was supposed to be like a departure from that. You know, she's supposed to save it.

[Chandler]

I just feel like, though it has. It's been like 10 seasons since there's been like somebody fresh and new that I've been, like, excited about watching.

[Lauren]

Yeah. And I think it's probably over for all of it. I mean, even the Golden Bachelor has. Has been a disaster. We really tried with that. The Golden Bachelorette. We tried. So rip the Bachelor.

[Chandler]

My other piece of free advice for the ABC execs is that the episodes need to be a lot shorter. They need to be tight, 50, 45 to 50 minute episode only with the best stuff. Everything else gets totally cut. But a three or two 90 minute to three hour episode, it ain't happening. Diane.

[Lauren]

No, no.

[Chandler]

What do you think about all of the contestants from her season that Might sue abc. What do you think about the, like, the lawsuit of it all? The. I hate that expression, I need to stop saying it. But what do you think about the lawsuits of it all?

[Lauren]

I mean, they have no, they have no stand. What are they gonna sue for? Oh, I was supposed to launch my, my influencing career. Like my, yeah, my bodybuilding tick tock now is not gonna like, get on fire. I have a workout app. I was supposed to launch. Like, that's the thing. They're supposed to go to find love. What are they going to sue for? Like, I lost my potential shot at love.

[Chandler]

I mean, here's what I'm gonna say, because some people are like, oh, I feel so bad for all the men who, like, you know, sacrifice to win on the show. This isn't even really a male thing. But it's just like, you know, just consider yourself lucky now. You have dodged the bullet. That is having a short stint on reality TV that would make you a D lister forever and ever, really. Probably going to like, launch your career in any meaningful way. You're going to have like a couple of years of, you know, of people knowing who you are, but just like, literally. Consider this God's rejection.

[Lauren]

Yeah, God's rejection is. Or no, life's rejection is God's protection. Don't consider it God's rejection channel. That's just a lazy way. Life's rejection is God's protection. Not, not just consider this God's rejection.

[Chandler]

But maybe, though, maybe it's like God, like, it's like, it's holy rejection in a good way. Divine rejection.

[Lauren]

We're using a lot of our own shorthand on this episode. So if anyone doesn't understand some of the things we're saying, like when we say it's not happening, Diane, that is a throwback to when Caitlyn Jenner did her interview with Diane Sawyer about coming out as transgender. And she said basically, like, would, would this ever be a plot line or a storyline on the show? And he and Caitlin said, it's not happening, Diane. She said that a few times.

[Chandler]

I've tried to find that clip just to like, validate the fact that we use it all the time, but I can't. We need to go back and re watch it and, you know, find that we do, because it was, it was incredible.

[Lauren]

We absolutely do.

[Chandler]

We are not done talking about secret lives of Mormon wives because we have what?

[Lauren]

Oh, well, I also want to say really quick, that was actually something we talked about when we first started the show in 2016 because that was with Megan, remember? That was like. That's such a throwback.

[Chandler]

It's like. I mean. Yeah. I don't even know if anyone who listens now would even remember that. Yeah, probably not.

[Lauren]

Wait, I just want to say something else, too.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

I think that these men should also count themselves lucky, because I feel like if you get a taste for, like, if people get a taste for a life of being, like, a mini celebrity, like these bachelor stars do, and then they have to go back to normal life, right? Where they have to, like, work normal jobs and people aren't, like, fawning over them. I think it's a hard. Like, it's a really hard crash back to reality. And I think a little bit like these Mormon husbands, like, on Mom Talk. Dad Talk. Excuse me. I feel like we're. What we're seeing is, like, them kind of come to grips with this. Like, they see their wives who probably make in a brand deal, like, six figures is my guess is that they're making six figures, a brand deal. And I think that they are seeing the money and, like, they. They look at their career prospects and they, like. I think it'd be very difficult to be a member of dad Talk because whatever earning potential they thought was great before now is just completely laughable compared to their spouse. And so what are they going to do? Like, especially I think about Jesse and Jordan, and like, whatever Jordan's next step is or next move is, it's. It's going to feel laughable in comparison to Jesse, and that's going to be tough.

[Chandler]

Somebody, some subset of that group is going to start a podcast.

[Lauren]

Yeah, I mean, but good luck making money at a podcast. Good luck takes you a really long time. Gfl and even really long time. And it probably won't happen. Just, like, how hard it is serious.

[Chandler]

And, you know, if that doesn't happen for you, consider it God's rejection.

[Lauren]

Yeah, perfect. So not only is the world rejecting you by not liking your podcast, but God hates you, too. God's rejection. Thanks, Chandler.

[Chandler]

Okay. Speaking of Jordan and Jesse, the next crazy bit of news that we heard that we saw was on Friday, which was, I think, the day after the video was released. They are divorcing. He has filed for divorce. Yeah, I'm gonna do the Hosanna shout. I mean, let me just say we did. Jesse obviously came on our podcast. He was there with her. He was very, very nice. He enjoyed him. It was really lovely. I have not enjoyed him as, like, an audience member. I think. I think I just find all of dad talk to be really odious. And he is kind of like the leader of it now. So I might be placing a little bit too much, you know, blaming his feet. But yeah, these two are not meant to be together. We can tell from their interactions. I, I think it is. This has been a long time coming.

[Lauren]

Yeah, I think that, you know, I don't know, I kind of look at them and I think get a divorce while your kids are still super young. Like, the best time to get a divorce is I feel like when your kids, like when they're four and three and they like, they won't even have many memories of you being together, which

[Chandler]

is like now, which is now versus

[Lauren]

like sticking it out. And also when you're still so young, you can have, you can still have like a 40 year marriage, your future, if you want it, like just cut, you know, cut your losses. And it's, it's a relief to see this happening because on this most recent season, their marriage is a dumpster fire. She's frequently staying at a hotel and you see them like fighting, actually, actually fighting in their house. And it's. It is not pretty.

[Chandler]

No, I mean, I want to talk about a moment that just came up on my feed this morning that was just a replay of something that happened last season, not this season.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[Chandler]

Do you know what I'm talking about?

[Lauren]

No.

[Chandler]

So this is a little crazy, but. And I didn't catch this last season, but do you remember when her sisters are like waiting downstairs for her when she's like fighting with him and then they all leave? There's like a moment where like Jesse and Jordan are upstairs talking, they're filming. And then the sisters and the mom, I think are downstairs waiting to like leave with her to go, you know, take her and go, you know, have them separate. And she comes down the stairs and she's carrying a rifle bag, like a large rifle bag. Did you see this?

[Lauren]

I did, I did see. I did see this video. Yeah.

[Chandler]

Anyway, I just thought it was crazy because I think I. Some people are like, that could have just been used to pack like. And I'm not saying he is violent, but it sounds like things were really terrible. And she maybe thought I need to remove this weapon from our house because things were in a. We're in a really dark place together or. And separately.

[Lauren]

Yeah, I don't know. I haven't. I just have no idea what's inside that bag. And so I saw the video. I think it easily that I could have used that bag. She could have used that bag to. To be holding all sorts of things. So I just don't actually know. I saw comments where people said, you know, if that's her registered weapon and she's leaving the home, it's the responsible thing to bring it with her. I. I really just have no idea. And so I don't. I don't think I would necessarily want to speculate that we don't even know what's in the bag, let alone that it's a. A weapon that she's removing because he's becoming. So I feel like that's like, painting a little bit of a n narrative that we just don't really know.

[Chandler]

I mean, yes, of course, this is all alleged. We don't really know. I just thought. I think it's unlikely that she was packing her things in a rifle case. I think that, you know, that girl has plenty of Bae's luggage. So I, I thought. And, like, her sister, when she, like, comes down the stairs, her sister kind of immediately grabs it and takes it. Anyway, I just, I thought, you know, their lives are on camera. We didn't see this moment on camera. So I, you know, I, I do have thoughts about it, but, yeah, I mean, I, I think think this is the right decision for them. I really like her. I've struggled with watching him on screen as much, but I. I think it's. It's high time for these two to, you know, forge new paths.

[Lauren]

I could not agree more. I believe that he. So he did. He filed for a restraining order against. Was rejected and it was rejected. Yeah. So that, to me, just shows that he's probably going to be, like, a histrionic spouse, and he's going to be, like, really difficult, just like she said, to get a divorce from. So I. Oh, gosh.

[Chandler]

Did you say there. The Dumois?

[Lauren]

No, I didn't.

[Chandler]

So there was a Dumois about this. And I think I'm just, like, skeptical of Dumas always. Like, I kind of just believe that people send their own things into Dumois.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

But it said regarding Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, Jesse told Jordan last Friday that she was done and already had a lawyer on board. She also pre booked booked call her daddy to tell her side of everything. Then Jordan rushed to file today, clearly trying to get ahead of it, and added some loser clause about her not being able to talk about him on podcast. The problem for Jordan is that Jesse didn't sign anything yet, and she's way too savvy for that. She basically laughed it off. Like, nice try, podcast films tomorrow. Jordan's been involved in some pretty shady behavior for years, including allegedly spending money on escorts and parties with her money.

[Lauren]

Well, I guess we'll find out if you know, when this Call Her Daddy episode debuts.

[Chandler]

Yeah. Which I think will be this week.

[Lauren]

Yeah. I mean, I gotta say, there's a part of me that's fatigued by all the. All the secret lives of Mormon wives drama. And I feel for anyone who's literally not caught up or not doesn't, you know, participate, because you must feel so out of the loop. But, man, they kind of do keep it coming. Like, this season is interesting to watch, and all this drama is really crazy. I mean, the Taylor Frankie Paul of it. Of it all, which I also need to stop saying that. But the Taylor Frankie Paul part of it is getting a little Maori Maury adjacent for my taste. Like, I would. I. I think that's getting a little too real.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

But I don't know. It's hard to look away from all of this.

[Chandler]

Oh, there's a lot happening, and I am, like, invested in these characters, in their lives. So. Yeah, I mean, we'll see. I. I think it's interesting that filming has paused. Like, I wonder if they will pick back up cameras without Taylor and Dakota, and I'm sure they will. For John, do you think that he.

[Lauren]

Do you think that Dakota released the video to tmz?

[Chandler]

No, I think. I think that he included it in his, like, statement, you know, about getting a new protective order, new restraining order, and then it was public record because of that. So then tmz, Interesting, like, obtained it. But actually, I did see that it was sent to TMZ by an individual, or maybe it wasn't. I can't. I don't know. There's a lot of people defending her on TikTok, I guess I haven't seen it.

[Lauren]

Oh, yeah, There's a lot of people say, like, it's reactive abuse that, you know, he pushed her to that point and then started filming her.

[Chandler]

She threw multiple chairs. Like, he was not actively attacking. Like.

[Lauren]

Yeah, he comes off really well. Yeah.

[Chandler]

And he was trying to actively wake her up to the fact that, hey, your daughter's in the room. I'm leaving. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, I don't know. I think his. I think his roommate is, like, leaking stuff, I guess.

[Lauren]

Interesting.

[Chandler]

I mean, and then Taylor is commenting back on. On social media. Like, people are saying, well, somebody will post a video saying, you need to, like, now just be off social media. And she was like, what do you expect me to do sit and stare at a wall like I have commitments? It's like, girl, I bet all your brand deals are kind of like, you know, are done.

[Lauren]

That's why I just think that if he released the video despite her, it's gonna kind of ruin both of them on some level. Because most likely both of them are going to be off the show. And no, no brand will want anything to do with, with either of them. They need to do a Dr. Drew intervention style, you know, YouTube series or program, some sort of like documentary or maybe they could go on couples therapy. But they need to have some sort of redemption arc if they ever want a chance back in back. I don't know, in the spotlight. They probably just. It's probably over though, realistically.

[Chandler]

I mean, the darkest part to me is that I could see them literally getting back together romantically.

[Lauren]

Oh, for sure.

[Chandler]

Are you into the part of the season where they've like, you know, they hook up in la?

[Lauren]

No, where I'm, I'm at the part of the season where she's upset with him for hooking up with someone in the villa and she literally like yells into the phone like, did you finish? I'm just like, what kind of garbage am I watching?

[Chandler]

No, I had a similar moment. Right.

[Lauren]

So embarrassing.

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

Also, my mother in law is staying with us right now, so I really hope that she's not. She can't hear me.

[Chandler]

I hope so. I hope so too. Yeah. Everybody, I'm garbage.

[Lauren]

Does my daughter in law do okay?

[Chandler]

I. I feel like we have said all that needs to be said on this matter. Yeah.

[Lauren]

What's so funny is I was talking to Chandler before this episode. I'm like, how much time do you think we're gonna spend on Taylor Freaky Paul? Okay, well, basically an hour.

[Chandler]

An hour?

[Lauren]

Yeah. What should we get into now, Chandler? Should we talk about Chapel Roan?

[Chandler]

Yeah, let's talk about Chapel Roan. I've been trying to get my closet together for way too long and I'm finally doing, doing something about it. Wayfair is my go to with anything home related. They have everything I could possibly conceive of. I just search for what I need and boom, it's right there. Wayfair has everything from full closet systems to simple organizers. So it always works in whatever space you're dealing with. Whether you're trying to just clean things or fully redesign your closet, they've got options for whatever level you're ready for. Recently, Ben and I were looking for a little credenza that we could put underneath our tv. We needed it to be kind of skinny but also have storage and we found the perfect one on Wayfair area. It's so beautiful. It came in this gorgeous tortoise wood and it's just perfect. We get so many compliments on it and it literally came in like two days. The Wayfair site is also super easy to use. You can filter exactly what you want, read reviews, and feel confident you're picking the right thing. They even have assembly options. Find furniture, decor and essentials that fit your unique style and budget. Head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's W A Y F A I R.com Wayfair Every style, every home popapologist is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart Choice. Progressive loves to help people make smart choices. That's why they offer a tool called Auto Quote Explorer that helps you compare your Progressive car insurance quote with rates from other companies so you save time on the research and can enjoy savings when you choose the best rate for you. Give it a try after this [e-mail] Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy okay everybody, There is trouble yet again with Tropical Roan and her fans. It all started when this Brazilian soccer player posted on his story and he said, I went through a very upsetting situation with my family earlier today. My wife, Kat Cavelli, is in Sao Paulo for Lollapalooza Brazil. This morning my daughter woke up incredibly excited. She even made a sign because she was happy to see an artist she really admires or used to admire at Chapel Roan. By coincidence, they're staying at the same hotel as this artist. During breakfast, the artist walked past their table. My daughter, like any child, recognized her, got excited and just wanted to make sure it was really her. And the worst part is, she didn't even approach her. So she simply walked past the singer's table, looked to confirm it was her, smiled, and went back to sit with her mom. She didn't say anything, didn't ask for anything. What happened next was completely disproportionate. It A large security guard came over to their table while they were still having breakfast and began speaking in an extremely aggressive manner to both my wife and my daughter, saying that she shouldn't allow my daughter to disrespect or harass other people. Honestly, I don't know at what point simply walking past a table and looking to see if someone is there can be considered harassment. He even said he would file a complaint against him with the hotel. While my 11 year old daughter was sitting there in tears, my daughter was extremely shaken and cried a lot. I've lived with football, public exposure and well known people for many years and I understand very well what respect and boundaries are. What happened there was not that. It was just a child admiring someone. It's sad to see this kind of treatment coming from those who should understand the importance of fans. At the end of the day, they are the ones who build all of this. I sincerely hope this serves as a moment of reflection. No one should have to go through this, especially not a child at Chapel. Roan. So this is in all caps, his, you know, closing line. Without your fans, you would be nothing. And to the fans, she does not deserve your affection. So that was, that's part one.

[Lauren]

Yeah, this is a saga.

[Chandler]

So he's a famous soccer player. He has football, soccer. He has like 5 million followers. What makes this also very interesting is that the girl, the little girly, little 11 year old girl is Jude Law's daughter actually. And Kat Cavelli is her name on Instagram. I am not super familiar with her, but she is like a model. So this is like the stepdad who posted this on Instagram.

[Lauren]

Right.

[Chandler]

Okay.

[Lauren]

So then Chapel responded. Chan, why don't you play the response months. I'm just gonna tell my half of the story of what happened today with a mother and child who were involved with a security guard who is not my personal security. I didn't even see, I didn't even see a woman and a child. Like I did not. No one came up to me, no one bothered me. Like I was just, just sitting at breakfast in my hotel. I think these people were staying at the hotel as well. So the fact that like a security guard who was. I did not ask the security guard to go up and talk to this mother and child. I did not. They did not come up to me. I just called total BS on this. First of all, you, you just, I think that you are aware, I mean, I guess I'm not in a position where I've had security, so I don't really know what it would be like, but I can imagine that you'd be pretty aware of your security chastising someone. And I just think given her reputation, it's really hard to believe that this was not done at her, you know, at her request.

[Chandler]

Yeah, her reputation unfortunately precedes her in this way.

[Lauren]

They weren't doing anything. It's unfair for security to just assume someone doesn't have good intentions when they have no reason to believe because there's no action even taken. Like, I do not hate people who are fans of my music. I do not hate children. Like that is crazy. I'm sorry to the mother and child that someone was assuming something, that you would do something and that if you felt uncomfortable, comfortable, that makes me really sad. You did not deserve that.

[Chandler]

Also, I just want to talk about, I mean how many times does she have to rehearse saying I do not hate people who are fans of my music. It's so do not hate children.

[Lauren]

She's not cut out for being famous. She's just straight up not. And the video of her chastising the people in Paris taking pictures of her and videos of her is so mortifying. If you guys have not seen it, there's this video of her where basically she's like in Paris, she's going out to dinner with a friend and there are people taking videos of her and she acts like she's catching them doing this horrible thing and she's just like acts so mortally offended and wounded when she's out and about in Paris. What do you expect? You're super famous and you've chased this like super famous career. She acts like they're literally like have chased her down in her own like backyard like on her property to get footage of her. Like she's just, she's just not, she's not right for this life at all.

[Chandler]

Also, let me just say she's only been famous for like less than five years. Like super famous. So it's not like this is just. She's finally fed up. It's not like she's Britney Spears years who's just been hounded by these people forever.

[Lauren]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chandler]

This is another reason why I will never go up to like a true celebrity or like pop star in per if I ever see anybody like that that's super famous, I will never approach them. Like the idea of having your favorite singer be rude to you or like that's so awful. And then I like think about our niece is 11. Think about an 11 year old. How honestly how non threatening one a single 11 year old is.

[Lauren]

Well, well I just think like any child you, you see and you can tell is like delighted by your presence. You only want to like make them feel more like happy and like you only want to delight them more. So this is, this is a true personality flaw.

[Chandler]

Yeah, I mean, and then she kind of throws her security under the bus and says like, you know, I don't even know who this person this was not part of my personal security. I, I kind of doubt the hotel security just like, like, you know, stepped in. Can I also tell you one thing? As I was doing research on this topic, who else has weighed in? Thank God.

[Lauren]

Frankel.

[Chandler]

No, yeah, I'm sure she's weighed in. I'm talking about our favorite duo of all time.

[Lauren]

Who?

[Chandler]

Amy and tj.

[Lauren]

Of course they have. What do Amy and TJ have to say about this?

[Chandler]

I'm gonna play it for you.

[Lauren]

I'm already deep dived their romance. Yes, we deep dived the romance of amy Robach and T.J. holmes is so cringy and embarrass. That's our, that's our job. Oh, my God.

[Chandler]

But you know what's funny? I, I'm happy they're still going strong. Even though I had my, my issues. I'm like, okay, they're, they're work, they're, they're making it work.

[Lauren]

I am perversely as well.

[Chandler]

I'm just gonna learn. I'm gonna skip ahead a little bit. I'm gonna get to the 29 minute mark. Because this is kind of their whole episode for today was talking about Chapel Roan.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[Chandler]

So they're, they're analyzing whether the dad did the right thing. And so also everybody, to close the loop on the story. Story. The mom then responded to Chapel Roan and you know, basically said, that's bs. Did we need to do this in response? I mean, the girl felt, I mean, attacked.

[Lauren]

If they felt the child was attacked,

[Chandler]

I guess emotionally attacked, I suppose at the time. Where was the complaint that could have been? I don't know, it just, it seemed like a, a coordinated return assault. And we don't know actually who's responsible for the initial attack. Attack kind of a thing. It seemed premature maybe is what I'm going for. Yeah. You know, it just feels like now

[Lauren]

these days, we don't investigate, we don't

[Chandler]

give people an opportunity to respond or at least to fully understand a situation where you react emotionally.

[Lauren]

We put it out there for everybody to see.

[Chandler]

We want people on our side. We have an us versus them mentality. And that is exactly what happened. Because I guarantee you this soccer star from Brazil has people and his people could have gotten in touch with Chapel

[Lauren]

Ron's people and they could have let

[Chandler]

them know what happened and say, this isn't right. I need you to understand that how unfair this was, was.

[Lauren]

And, and Handle it privately. And maybe Chapel Ron would have been

[Chandler]

able to learn something without being publicly humiliated at the same time.

[Lauren]

And maybe real change could have happened.

[Chandler]

And now she has to defend herself. She's in that position.

[Lauren]

Wow. They're. Chapel stands. So they're coming to Chapel's defense.

[Chandler]

This is after 30 minutes of talking about this.

[Lauren]

Stop. How did you even land on this show? Slow Day at the Manning House.

[Chandler]

I was literally just looking like, I was. I was looking on this topic and I was like, you've got to be kidding me. That. At first I was like, wait, these two are still in business?

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

And then I was like. And. And then an episode from today. So I. I wanted to hear their thoughts on it. I mean, I just. I thought it was. It was funny. I had to. Had to play a little Amy and dj.

[Lauren]

Wow. I did not. I was not expecting them to be her defense attorney.

[Chandler]

We live in an us versus them, you know, a reactionary world.

[Lauren]

We do. Wow. Thank you. Thank you, TJ and Amy for that. Oh, wait, sorry.

[Chandler]

I have one more thing to say about this. Did you see what the mayor said?

[Lauren]

No.

[Chandler]

I spent a lot of time on this topic this morning.

[Lauren]

Clearly.

[Chandler]

Okay, Lauren, so the Eduardo Cavallari. Sorry, I'm totally mispronouncing that. But Mayor Eduardo, who's the mayor of Rio de Janeiro, he has jumped in on the topic and he posted on X and he said, Chapel Roan will never perform at Toto Mundo Norio while he is in office. He said, I mean that as long as I'm in charge of our city, this young lady at Chapel Roan will never perform at Toto Mondo no Rio. And then I think he said, like, Shakira would never or something.

[Lauren]

Okay, but. Okay, Mr. Mayor, don't you want her to come? Like, it's good for the city's economy?

[Chandler]

No, because, I mean, I think that the soccer player is, like, beloved.

[Lauren]

Oh, gotcha. Okay, well, I like that he's taking a stand. Wow.

[Chandler]

I just, like. It's just so funny to me.

[Lauren]

I think we should move on.

[Chandler]

You think? I do. I could go back and start TJ and Amy's episode from the beginning. I'm not super personally invested in Chapel Roan, so this is all just kind of funny to me.

[Lauren]

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see if she. If her career has. Has true longevity. Okay, finally, Chandler, I think we should just note that Savannah Guthrie's mother is still missing. And it seems like this case is now just going cold of this missing 80 year old.

[Chandler]

I know.

[Lauren]

Just want to throw that out there.

[Chandler]

It's just like the new cycle has moved on.

[Lauren]

She's just gone now. She's just gone.

[Chandler]

And it seems like we will never know.

[Lauren]

Know this is the weirdest thing that has ever happened.

[Chandler]

I know. I mean, have they even like called in Dog the Bounty Hunter?

[Lauren]

Not that I'm aware of. They really should. Yeah, they really should.

[Chandler]

I had no hope when he started searching for Gabby Petito, but sadly, you know. Yeah, we know how that story ended.

[Lauren]

We do. Yeah, we sadly do. Well, you guys, so sorry about my voice today. Thank you for bearing with us. Thank you for bringing Pop Apost. We will be back on Friday discussing Love Story, discussing Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. We're going to be, you know, we're going to be back just in a couple days. So if you would like to be global elites, please do us a favor and sign up. Also exciting, we have a series coming in April. It's a two part series on celebrity feuds. So we're going to be getting into famous, famous feuds and that is going to be fun. The first part is going to be regular. The second part is going to be premium. So you can look forward to that if you're a global elite. We thank you all so much for listening and we will be back on Friday. Love you. Bye bye. Hey guys, it's your friend Michelle Collins and I'm here to invite you to listen to the Michelle Collins Show. Yes, that's my show, Unfiltered, unscripted, unhinged.

[Chandler]

And covers pretty much everything you're going to want to care about.

[Lauren]

It's funny, it's fearless. It could go off the rails at

[Chandler]

any moment and often does.

[Lauren]

So follow rate and review the Michelle

[Chandler]

Collins show wherever you get your podcasts

[Lauren]

and let's spiral together. Pluto TV has thousands of free movies and TV shows.

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[Chandler]

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[Chandler]

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