341: Amanda & West Confirm Situationship 😭 Unpacking the Summer House Betrayal

Summary

Pop Apologists Ep. 341: Amanda & West Confirm Situationship 😭 Unpacking the Summer House Betrayal

Date: April 1, 2026
Podcast: Pop Apologists
Episode Theme:
This episode dives deep into one of the most jaw-dropping Bravo reality TV betrayals: Amanda and West, of Summer House fame, confirm their situationship just as rumors of betrayal swirl around their supposed best friend, Sierra. The sisters break down the clues, internet reactions, and what this means for fan loyalties, while also weaving in side convos about pop culture, book recs, and their trademark irreverent sister banter.

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1. Overview of Main Theme

The episode primarily focuses on the fallout from Summer House’s latest cast relationship bombshell: Amanda and West confirming they are more than friends, which many view as a major betrayal of Sierra, Amanda’s close friend and West’s recent ex. The hosts unpack the social media clues, cast reactions, and what it means for the friendship circle, Bravo's future casting, and fandom at large.

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2. Key Discussion Points & Insights

A. Strangers by Bell Burden & Parasocial Drama (06:00–11:50)

• Lauren shares finishing Strangers by Bell Burden, her frustration with a lack of closure from the author's ex-husband, and the urge for 'citizen’s arrest' on behalf of wronged women everywhere.
• Parasocial relationships with authors/celebrities are discussed, with reflections on how much fans feel entitled to answers.
• Quote (08:31):
  Lauren: "I want to hold his feet to the fire. This fucker."
  Chandler: "You caught me on an off day today and I'm ready for you to accost him."

B. Summer House Betrayal Breakdown

Initial Set-up & Context (13:18–16:49)

• Amanda and Sierra’s strong friendship is highlighted, with Amanda as Sierra’s main support during heartbreak over West.
• The West-Sierra breakup recap: Sierra, described as "way out of his league" (14:36), is heartbroken when West ends things, making his current involvement with Amanda especially shocking.

The Clues Unpacked (16:50–27:16)

• Internet sleuths track social media interactions, lack of public friendship between Amanda and Sierra, and an aborted Amazon Live.
• Sighting: Amanda and West allegedly caught flirting and 'holding hands under the table' in NYC (25:04).
• Sierra’s cryptic “lack of respect is the closure” posts and reactions from Summer House cast (26:10).
• Austin Kroll's IG story: "Pasta and fucking your friend's exes are apparently back" (26:35).

Official Confirmation & Statement (27:21–28:05)

• Amanda and West release a joint statement confirming their new relationship origins, citing 'care,' 'privacy,' and recognizing "this has had an impact beyond just us."
• Quote (27:22) – Amanda reading their statement:
  “Our connection grew out of genuine, longstanding friendship… which made it especially important for us to approach this with care...”

Hosts’ Analysis & Reaction (28:05–32:53)

• The betrayal stuns both hosts and the online fandom:
  • “Not only is it just shocking on a relational level that she would do this to Sierra... but I just think also kind of give up, in my opinion, the goodwill of the fans for this F boy.” (29:06, Lauren)
  • Chandler feels the friendship was "the biggest betrayal she could have ever done to Sierra" (30:21).
• Exploring whether Amanda was ever a true "girl’s girl," or if this exposes a pick-me mentality.

Implications For the Show & Bravo (32:54–34:28)

• Hosts discuss the impact on Bravo’s spin-off plans and speculate if the show can survive this rift.
• Quote:
  Chandler: “This is the best thing that could ever happen for Summer House... I haven’t watched for a few seasons and I’m back.” (33:08)

C. Secret Lives of Mormon Wives & Cross-Show Betrayals (38:08–42:48)

• They compare Summer House’s drama with the tangled romances of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives:
  • Jesse allegedly hooks up with Chase, ex of castmate Miranda, fueling a Salt Lake City cycle of messy crossovers.
• Chandler theorizes that the insular nature of reality TV makes cast members pair up within their circles (41:22).
• Hosts verify that the drama is real via insider info—Miranda is truly angry, confirming it's not just for show (42:40).

D. Royal & Hollywood Sidenotes (45:38–52:50)

• Insider “tea” about Prince Harry’s failed TV pitch process and Meghan’s out-of-touch approach to content.
• The hosts joke about Meghan Markle needing to go full-reality TV:
  Lauren: “If you want us to tune in to your next Netflix project, why don’t you go have an affair with William and... wear a GoPro?” (47:53)
• Speculation about whether Harry and Meghan could pivot to corporate speaking, the celebrity circuit, or even Cameo.

E. Other Pop Culture Chatter

• Brief mention of Ladies of London rewatch similarities to early RHO.
• Taylor Swift and Travis Kelce at the iHeartRadio Awards—Taylor’s “happy, confident and free” comment on her relationship, and whether they’re enduring or just honeymooning.
  Chandler: “His beard is a little too long for me right now. And that is actually where this is all falling apart.” (65:19)

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3. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On parasocial fandom:
  Lauren (08:39): “I deserve an answer after reading this book.”
• On Amanda & West Betrayal:
  Lauren (29:06): “I just find it to be so shocking on a career level and on a friendship level.” Chandler (30:21): “...the Amanda Sierra friendship was very real...the biggest betrayal she could have ever done to Sierra.”
• On Bravo’s Drama Cycle:
  Chandler (33:07): “This is the best thing that could ever happen for Summer House.”
• On pop culture fatigue:
  Chandler (38:28): “I think you have Mormon fatigue.”
• On Meghan Markle TV future:
  Lauren (47:53): “If you want us to tune in to your next Netflix project, why don’t you go have an affair with William and...wear a GoPro?”
• On Taylor & Travis:
  Chandler (65:19): “His beard is a little too long for me right now. And that is actually where this is all falling apart.”

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4. Timestamps for Important Segments

• [13:18–32:53] — Deep dive into the Amanda/West/Sierra Summer House drama
• [27:21] — Amanda and West’s confirmation statement read aloud
• [38:08–42:48] — Breakdown of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives cross-cast romance drama
• [45:38] — Royal “insider” tea about Harry & Meghan’s failed series
• [63:05] — Taylor Swift & Travis Kelce iHeartRadio discussion

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5. Tone & Style

• Conversational, irreverent, and deeply invested in both the emotional and humorous sides of reality TV and celebrity scandals.
• Sisters call back recurring jokes ("citizen’s arrest," "martial law," the trauma of fandom betrayals), but always circle back to empathizing with the women wronged on screen.

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6. Final Thoughts

Summary Takeaway:
This episode is a must for Bravo fans and pop culture junkies, offering both a granular breakdown of Summer House’s latest betrayal and the broader emotional toll of modern reality TV friendships. The Pop Apologists bring both snark and genuine concern, especially for Sierra, while poking fun at themselves and the larger reality TV ecosystem. For those invested in the ever-spinning carousel of TV friendships and scandals, or just needing validation that “girl code” still matters—even on Bravo—this episode delivers.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Not only is it just shocking on a relational level that she would do this to one of her greatest friends and she would hook up with this guy.

[A]

Not just hook up, right.

[B]

Have a secret relationship. But I just think also kind of give up in my opinion the goodwill of the fans for this F boy. Like truly he's an F boy.

[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

Well, well, well. We are gathered here today two pop apologists with our pop apostles. Hello everyone listening. Hello Chandler.

[A]

Hello listeners and welcome back, welcome, welcome

[B]

back to the program. Can I tell you what I'm sipping on right now? We both cracked a delic fan of clean simple eats clear protein. This is a beverage that Chandler constantly finds empty cans littered around my home because I drink it constantly. I purchase it with my own money because we've run out of the free product.

[A]

We both have purchased it with our own money on various occasions.

[B]

Many for myself monthly. Yeah, I am obsessed with clear protein. I grab one or two cans out of my fridge. It's a little snack. It's 20 grams of clean grass fed whey isolate protein. The highest quality ingredients and it's delicious. It tastes incredible.

[A]

What flavor are you drinking right now?

[B]

This is my favorite flavor, the candied crapp apple.

[A]

Yeah, I also love the cherry lime which is the clear protein soda. My preference are the carbonated ones. And you really like that one? That one is delicious.

[B]

It tastes like a juice in my opinion. Anyway, it's the easiest way to get really high quality protein. Everyone go to cleansimpleads.com use code pop apologist10 for 10% off your order. You will be so grateful we sent you. Okay, well, let's dive in to the program. Chandler, what's going on? What should we get into first? It's a beautiful Tuesday in New York City.

[A]

Oh my gosh, it's so nice today. It's upper 70s. And every year it's like I am just revived, you know, Released from the grave yet again.

[B]

It's crazy. It's like the winter is so long. It's awful. And fine. I don't want you to.

[A]

I don't want to hear you talk about this at all.

[B]

I was honestly just trying to lean in and like. Yes. And because to be honest, it's actually, it's not that novel to me.

[A]

I mean, have you ever layered in your life?

[B]

I'm basically, when I, when I am here during the winter, it's such a brief in and out. I don't feel like I really. I don't earn my New York City like winter stripes at all.

[A]

Yeah, that, that was not actually unclear to people. But you are usually like. You don't even really dress for it when you're here necessarily.

[B]

I'm just going from an Uber into my apartment.

[A]

Exactly. But yeah, everybody, I've earned it and I am relishing it. Relishing in it or relishing it?

[B]

I think you're, you're reveling in it and you're relishing the experience.

[A]

I'm reveling in it and I am relishing the experience of this 78 degree day.

[B]

Is it 78 today?

[A]

Yes. No. She hasn't left her apartment? No. Can you tell?

[B]

I just like things to come to me.

[A]

I know.

[B]

You know?

[A]

Can I tell You.

[B]

Something that has to do with New York City.

[A]

Please.

[B]

I finally finished Strangers by Bell Burden. New York City. Manhattanite. Yes. Author.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Okay. We've discussed it on the. The show. How Gwyneth Paltrow is going to play her in the Netflix adaptation of her memoir.

[A]

You were reluctant to read the book in the first place.

[B]

No, I wasn't. I was never reluctant.

[A]

I think that's.

[B]

I think you.

[A]

Is that. Did I make that up?

[B]

That was a fiction you're reluctant to

[A]

read, I think, in general, in the first place.

[B]

No.

[A]

Did you listen to this?

[B]

Okay, so basically, long story short, I wanted to read it when I knew I would be in a headspace ready to receive it, and.

[A]

Sounds like reluctance.

[B]

I just knew it would make me hate Kagan.

[A]

Like, no, see, I. And I, we had. This is. I am not wrong. We had this conversation, and I told you it would not, but.

[B]

Well, Courtney said that she read it and, like, bristled at Wyatt for a week, basically. Okay. And I was just. I wasn't. I wasn't sure when I was going to be in a mental headspace to hate my husband.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But I knew it'd be worth it.

[A]

It always is.

[B]

It always is. And, you guys, this book is so phenomenal. However, I want to talk to you, debrief about one aspect of it.

[A]

The. The osprey.

[B]

No, I would. I would breeze past the Osprey passages. I understood, you know, the literary device that was happening before me, but I wanted to get to, like, was he really going to fuck her over or not?

[A]

That was, like, the part that I

[B]

was trying to get to.

[A]

In the memoir, Morgan Stewart went on a podcast, and she was talking about how. Everyone's talking about this book and how she started, but there was just, like, a lot of chatter about the birds in the chapter.

[B]

You have to get through the Osprey paragraphs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

We are trying to get Bell Burden on the program. Everyone on the show. So we were not going to talk about how we didn't necessarily relish and revel in Osprey passages.

[A]

I liked the Osprey metaphor. Whatever, you know, it was. It was a theme throughout.

[B]

I didn't mind it. Yeah. Okay.

[A]

But I'm, you know, I'm a more learned person than you, for sure.

[B]

You're more restful. You just like to knit and listen, you know, to passages about birds.

[A]

I mean, I like. I hear birds chirp all the time,

[B]

and I don't think you do not. Not on. Not on my floor. There's no birds around here. Anyway, anyway. Okay. So, however, I just want to discuss one thing. So her husband ups and leaves. She's 50 years old. Her husband, who basically seemed completely fine. The marriage seemed great. No problems, ups and leaves. Okay. And he doesn't really give her an explanation. And he never does throughout the entire book. He never gives her an explanation. And this is where I think I just. When. If she ever comes on the show, I really want to ask her about this because I just feel like I wouldn't have. I wouldn't be able to not, like, hold my husband's feet to the fire and demand. Like, demand an excuse. Demand. Well, demand the information.

[A]

I mean, I don't want to spoil things for people. It's not really a spoiler, but, like, there is another woman in the picture. Yeah.

[B]

But it's. That's not really the reason, you know,

[A]

and the sad thing that. The sad takeaway for me was that it might, like. It might not have been that deep

[B]

of a reason, but I. I almost need to be told that. Yeah, like, I'm just actually not that deep of a person. I don't take you that seriously or my life that seriously. I'm just not that introspective. I just want to. Around. Like, that would at least be helpful.

[A]

Or that this. This ran its course. The, you know, like, the relationship that we had ran its course. We had our children, and that is, you know, that.

[B]

That.

[A]

That is fine by me. And now we are moving forward, and you should be moving forward. That was, like, the impression I got from.

[B]

That's basically all he said.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Anyway, it just has been driving me crazy. So I had this. A little bit of a fever dream, I will say, because I was like, I know she lives in New York, and she says he lives two blocks from her. So I was like, what if I could figure out where they live and, like, accosting on the street.

[A]

Oh, you want it on her behalf?

[B]

Well, yeah, it was just like, I want to hold his feet to the fire. This fucker.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But then all of a sudden, like, the lens shifted into focus, and I pictured myself, you know, accosting stranger.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Literally. No pun intended. And I realized that that's, you know, I guess the problem with the Internet these days in these parasocial relationships. Cause I was like, I. I deserve an answer after reading this book.

[A]

Here's what I'm gonna say. You caught me on an off day today, and I'm ready for you to accost him. I've got a few people I. Okay.

[B]

Who.

[A]

I mean, let's. We're going to wait to talk about Summer House. But I am very much so ready to cost.

[B]

I'm just ready for answers. And I'm sick of not accosting.

[A]

I'd like to accost some of the men on Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. Yeah, I'd like to accost some of the men on Bravo.

[B]

It's kind of like how I've always wanted to participate in. Sorry, not guerrilla warfare. Not called. It's not called Vigilante justice. Martial law. I've always wanted to.

[A]

Those three expressions. Warf, Citizens justice.

[B]

No, vigilante.

[A]

Vigilante justice.

[B]

And then.

[A]

Wait, what? You want to participate in martial law?

[B]

I just would love to arrest someone.

[A]

No, no, wait, you're getting it confused. Do you mean a citizen's arrest?

[B]

A citizen's arrest is something that can happen once martial law has been enacted.

[A]

I want to participate in more. Martial law is like when the military takes over.

[B]

Martial law is when all of civilization

[A]

not going to be wrong about this.

[B]

And when all of civilization and our rules have basically like gone to hell in a handbasket, all of a sudden there's mart.

[A]

We go. I've got, I've got a definition. Martial law is the temporary substitution of military authority for civilian rule, usually invoked during war. I actually have great news for you. I think you can perform a citizen's arrest all the time.

[B]

I don't need martial law.

[A]

You don't need martial law. You don't need like some type of Armageddon apocalyptic situation. I think you could literally, you could. Citizens arrest me right now on this podcast.

[B]

I could literally. My dreams could come true. At this moment, I wanted to fact

[A]

check myself about the performing a citizen's arrest. A private person can perform a citizen's arrest in most US states, but the laws conditions of risk very significantly by location.

[B]

So you are at risk when you perform a citizen.

[A]

Yeah. So for misdemeanors or minor offenses, you must have witnessed the act occur in your presence for felonies. Some states allow an arrest if you have a reasonable belief that the person committed the crime, even if you weren't present.

[B]

Okay, so we, we don't need martial law for this. Thank goodness. I do stand. Corrected. Thank you. Which is great. We don't need the military to actually take over law enforcement in order to conduct citizens arrests. And I feel like I have lived through what this man has done to Bell Burden. So I, I'm ready.

[A]

I want to check in here. We went from accosting him, which to me I Feel like is just yelling at someone on the street, which feels very right in our wheelhouse. Yeah. Not gonna be, like, you know, long term damaging to our careers, maybe, or to our families. But you want to perform a citizen's arrest.

[B]

I think I do. At this point, I think I would find widespread support, probably so. Henry, watch out. Watch your back.

[A]

Okay, well, did you enjoy the book?

[B]

I mean, the book is incredible. The book is so good, and I just. I highly recommend it. Everyone, we are going to try to get Belle on the show. I do think that we could get her on the show because she's basically doing every podcast. We also are trying to get Lena Dunham on the show because she has a memoir coming out.

[A]

I tried to. I tried to get Karen Reid. Yeah, we didn't hear back.

[B]

We did not hear back. Lena Dunham is definitely a. More of a long shot.

[A]

Yeah, certainly.

[B]

I feel like anything's possible. Like, after we interviewed Mary Fitzgerald, when we had basically three listeners from Selling Sunset, you know, it's like, just the

[A]

right stress of that interview for me. You were like, you've got this one. This one's. You're gonna lead this one. And I was so. I'm so new in the podcast. You really are a very talented interviewer

[B]

that it's not accurate.

[A]

No, it's true. And so anyway, it was the very first one that I ever had to lead. And I, like. I don't know, when you say her name, it, like, stirs up all these feelings of stress.

[B]

Well, my favorite memory of the Mary Fitzgerald interview is when we were just like, how, you know, how did we get you on the show today? And she was like, my publicist told me to do this. Like, you could see all of a sudden, her realize that she was wasting her time.

[A]

Right, right. Yeah.

[B]

And it wasn't a funny joke to her.

[A]

No, certainly not. Anyway, if you're listening, which she's probably not.

[B]

Yeah, Mary's not listening. She's probably. Is she still with Romaine? Romaine?

[A]

Romaine.

[B]

I don't know. His name is Romaine, like the.

[A]

Or maybe it's Ramon. No, it's. I think it's Romaine. I feel like. I feel like she said it with, like, you know, Romaine.

[B]

Well, after a don gate. I'm not gonna comment on the name Romaine. I'm gonna keep it moving. I actually, you know what? I've heard the name Romaine constantly. I have many friends named Romaine, and it's a great name. Okay.

[A]

We love that name.

[B]

We do. We love Romaines far and wide. What should we get into first?

[A]

I need to unburden myself.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

With this Summer House drama, let's go

[B]

from bellburden to unburdening. So are you okay?

[A]

No, I'm not okay. Because 30 minutes ago they released a statement like, we're getting real time updates here.

[B]

Yeah. So it has been rumored that Amanda and West were cavorting.

[A]

Yeah. And the Internet sleuths were doing the work. They were watching back all of these clips and episodes from the last season, from this season, trying to look for clues. And I will say there were clues.

[B]

There were great clues. Should we go through some of the clues?

[A]

Let's go through the clues. And do you feel sufficiently invested in this story even though you're not current with the show?

[B]

No. I appreciate you bringing that up because when I last watched Summer House, I've not been keeping up with it. When I last watched it, it was the season where Sierra and West, they had been dating, but then all of a sudden at the reunion, he was kind of over it. So it was a season where their relationship kind of took form.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And there was flirtations. And then at the reunion, he basically had broken up with her and she was devastated. It was a very difficult thing to watch because Sierra, I mean, I'll just be a little shallow for a second. I thought she was way out of his league.

[A]

Yeah. Sierra is like out of everybody's lane.

[B]

She's like a Victoria's Secret model. And she was crying about this like mid level bro on the show. It felt like the law. It felt like someone was going to. I don't know. Also tell me, like gravity wasn't. Wasn't real anymore.

[A]

Like it's martial law time.

[B]

It was time for a citizen's arrest. No, exactly. All the laws of the universe were crumbling before me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It didn't make any sense, but she was hung up on west and she

[A]

is like deeply, deeply sad. Visibly upset there. It's a very raw moment from her, I will say, on that reunion.

[B]

Well, and can I also say though that not only she's stunning, but she's also just great. She's funny. She's.

[A]

She's a nurse.

[B]

She's an. She's an amazing person. She's an incredible catch. And he basically broke it off to. It seemed like fuck around.

[A]

Yeah. It was like his first like little taste of fame. And it was like, oh, I gotta see what else is out there.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

I can't like, you know, get wifed up.

[B]

He wanted to be single for the fans? Yes, during. When they weren't filming. So it was very disappointing.

[A]

I think what really upset her is he gave an interview and kind of downplayed their whole relationship. I mean, they dated for about like eight to nine months. They said, I love him. She met his family. She was like his date to a wedding.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, it was a real relationship.

[B]

So what has gone down since? What have I missed?

[A]

So what you've missed is. So that season happened and then like, basically the season after that. And I hope I'm not getting confused. Like, she just kind of ices him out. Like they're. They are done. They are not friends, and she does not talk to him.

[B]

Okay. But if you ice someone out, that's because you're pretty hurt. It's not because, you know, I'm just saying she's obviously still invested.

[A]

Totally. And I think it was just like, super painful. And the other thing about west, everybody, the men on this show really disappoint me most of the time. I found Wes to be an incredible addition to the cast. He is fun, he is funny. He is just kind of a delight. Yeah. And so I think when this guy comes on the show who's totally cute, cute enough, but then he has like a 15 out of 10 personality, it really makes him a lot cuter.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And. And you could just see that he just vibed really well with all the girls and not in like a creepy Jesse Solomon way, you know, where he's just like, always wants to like, lay on their boobs and make out, you know, or at least attempt to make out. Like, he. He's just fun.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

He's just like a good hang. So I think what we see is that, like, you know, it's really hard for Ciara to just like, completely ignore him and stay out of his way and him to stay out of her way because, like, they all want to have fun together. And they're all kind of part of this, like, OG crew. They all like, I feel like the Kyle, Amanda, Sierra, Jesse, Lindsay, Carl, like, those are like the OG people. And then they've just had people kind of cycle in.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And like, I feel like the OG crowd, you know, I guess not Lindsay and Carl, but they really do like hanging out together.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's not Kyle and Amanda anymore, but, like, they're. They're pals. They're good pals. So anyway, we see her really, like, ice him out. Obviously, though, like you said, it's coming from a place of, you know, he broke her heart.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I Think that's the other really shitty thing. I'm gonna try to not, you know, wax on about this for too long, but he really did break her heart. And I think she was really left standing there like, wow, I really was a lot more invested in you than you were in me. And we didn't even break up for, like, a good reason other than that, like, you wanted to just, like, see what else is out there.

[B]

And. And he is kind of ambivalent. Like, he doesn't have. He's not stressed being around her?

[A]

No, not super stressed. I mean, I think he wants her to like him and be friends with him and. And not like, I'm just. They had bad vibes.

[B]

He's clearly not caught up and she is.

[A]

No. Yeah. I mean, so then that makes, like this season complicated. And I'm sure there. There are better summer house scholars out there. I am. I'm new to the summer house train, but I am invested and I am.

[B]

I'm up.

[A]

I'm as up to speed as I think, you know, I could be. So. But forgive me if I get something wrong this season. West and Sierra are just more friendly. It's like water under the bridge. They are like he says, you know, that was the best night I've ever had with Sierra. Like, they're friends. And the other thing is they have a really funny banter back and forth. Like, you can just tell when they are bantering back and forth that like these two people, there's an energy there.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So for the first several episodes, you catch these little moments and you're like,

[B]

wait a second, are they getting back together?

[A]

Are they getting back together? Is this vibe happening?

[B]

And.

[A]

And people were playing it up online and they weren't really saying no. And I was like, wait, maybe we get like surprised at the end of this whole season by seeing that they get back together. This episode is brought to you by booking.com planning a girls trip always sounds fun until you remember you're booking for multiple people with very specific opinions. My sisters and I have non negotiables blackout curtains so we can actually sleep. Good natural light for all those photos and ideally something close to a beach. And just go ahead and trust me, we're not very flexible about these things. That's why Booking.com is our go to. Booking.com offers a wide array of hotels and vacation rentals across the US So you can find exactly what you're booking for. Even if the people that you're booking for are extremely picky like us. You can Filter for the things that actually matter instead of settling for something that's just fine. Whether you're booking for yourself, your partner, or a high maintenance group chat, booking.com makes it easy to get it right. If a stay can check all of our boxes, it can check anyone's. Find exactly what you're booking for. Booking.com, booking. Yeah. Book today on the site or in the app. Okay.

[B]

I don't know if it's just that I'm an adult now and I notice these things, but I feel like it really is so impressive to me how much work our mom goes to to make her and my dad's house a really inviting, warm, lovely space for our family to return to year after year. That is why I think going to Cozy Earth this Mother's Day is such a good idea for a gift for your moms. Their robes are the perfect luxurious gift for the mom who does it all. They're incredibly soft with thoughtful details like spacious pockets, adjustable ties and a really beautiful drape. And Cozy Earth slippers are the perfect finishing touch. Their puffy sheep slippers have that soft spa like feel. And if you're giving a gift, it's nice knowing it comes with a hundred night sleep trial and a 10 year warranty. So it's something that your mom can actually keep reaching for. Let this Mother's Day be a reminder that she deserves care too. Discover how Cozy Earth turns everyday routines into moments of softness and ease. Head to cozyearth.com and use my code POP for an exclusive exclusive 20 off. And if you see a post purchase survey, be sure to mention you heard about Cozy Earth right here on Pop Apologists. Because home starts with mom.

[A]

Also, while all of this is happening. Sorry, I mean, let me even go back. While Sierra is so heartbroken over West, Amanda is right there like beside her. Amanda is like her girl that is like you know, writing for her on the show. Her person explain. Trying to explain to west how he hurt her so, so badly. Whatever. And yeah, so like Amanda is there throughout all of this.

[B]

Well, and Amanda has her own drama with Kyle that Sierra is absolutely there for her for. Correct.

[A]

I mean so the Kyle and Amanda continue to, you know, just be in a downward spiral over these last few seasons. Their marriage just gets worse and worse and this season it's really like it completely breaking down.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, and they basically hate each other. Kyle at one point, you know, a couple episodes ago, he says that, you know, he gets mad at her because she doesn't ever want to hang around him. He says at one point, like she spent more time with Wes than with me. Like, you know, in the last six months or something like that because, you know, he's traveling a lot, he's being a dj. That she just has literally no light in her eyes for him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I think he's kind of like there's like a scene where they're playing spin the bottle and what? Or an Amanda has to kiss Kyle and Kyle literally like she kisses him and he gets like aroused.

[B]

Wait, what?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Like he like you can see him.

[A]

You can't see anybody. Like puts a pillow on his lap. What? And people are all laughing because it's like, you know, they never. There's never any affection between the two of them.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Also during this, okay, there's this crazy scene. So Amanda kisses Kyle and it's like, haha, these two, you know, who are always fighting, they have like a sweet kiss, whatever. Yeah, we don't know that. Like obviously in the show they're not separated by this point. West then scoots his chair close to Sierra and starts like touching her leg and starts like fully putting the moves on her.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Do you want me to show this to you?

[B]

Sure.

[A]

Okay. I would love to show it to you.

[B]

Please show it to me. We're going to play it on the screen for everyone.

[A]

Like, I. I need this, guys.

[B]

You smell like cheese.

[A]

I love kissing. So Wes is super drunk.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

So he like, after this kiss happens between Kyle and Amanda, he like starts to kind of like put the moves on Sierra a little bit.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And this like he has not like touched her. Like, this is not. This was like the first time we've seen them like have a. Anything that's even flirty really on camera. And this is the most intense flirting we've ever seen from him to her in recent times. I don't know what's happening here, but I saw this and I'm like, oh my gosh. I'm like something has fully happened. Like, I'm sure they hooked up over this season or whatever. Like maybe they got back together. I'm. I am like so hopeful watching this. Also keep in mind at another point during the season, but prior to this, Jesse makes a joke about like, would you be mad if I wanted to like hook up with. With Sierra? And west is like not down with it.

[B]

Oh, it doesn't want him.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Anyway, so.

[B]

So everyone thinks they're going to get back together.

[A]

Yeah. And everyone's just kind of like rooting them on so fast. Forward to our present drama.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

People had noticed that Amanda and Sierra are no longer friendly on socials. Like, there's the show that is business is normal. Like, they are super close and their friendship looks great. I mean, Sarah is literally helping her through this terrible time with. With Kyle and. But like, they on social media are not friendly, interacting.

[B]

And they also. They had an Amazon live that they were supposed to do together, but then they both did it separately.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And it seemed like there were. There's a bunch of little clues. Like, should we get into more of the clues?

[A]

Yes, let's get into more of the clues.

[B]

Okay. So. So one of the major clues is that there's a sighting of Amanda and West. Now, there's no photo, which is interesting, but fans reported that to De Moi that they saw Amanda and West in New York City openly flirting, allegedly even holding hands under the table. One fan commented on the post, I don't think Amanda would do that to Sierra. At least I hope not.

[A]

They're also, like, denying these rumors online and just saying, like, we're just besties. Like, somebody commented and said, Wes is just like a really safe guy friend who. And you know, Amanda's single now, so he's just showing her around and then I'll watch what happens live.

[B]

That's what he says.

[A]

That's what he says.

[B]

Like, I just. I'm showing my friend around the city.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So in addition to all of that, Sierra is liking cryptic posts on Instagram. So there's a Jay Shetty quote that she liked that says, if you're looking for closure, let me tell you this. The lack of respect was the closure. The lack of an apology was the closure. The lack of care, accountability, and honesty was the closure. And then also there is a tweet by two judgy girls and it says, okay, but the funniest thing about this rumor is how much we care about Sierra's wellbeing. But none for Kyle. I don't think I've ever seen a single comment wondering how he is. And Kyle comments with a hand up emoji and a sad face. Yeah. And then Lindsay, she posts a reaction photo. Carl posts a reaction photo.

[A]

She posts a photo with her and Sierra and then she posts her reaction photo. So it's very clear, like the context. Carl. They all like kind of post different stills of them from the show where they're looking shocked. So KJ does it, Carl does it, Lindsay does it.

[B]

Austin Kroll posts on his Instagram and he. It's a story of pasta and he says, pasta and fucking your friend's exes are apparently back. So that also, I think is one of the big things that makes this rumor just go crazy online.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so as of three hours ago, it was all just swirling rumors.

[A]

Swirling rumors. But they were. There was a lot of confirmation coming from everybody but west and Amanda. But people were saying, we saw them in California. They were spotted fully, you know, canoodling fully together. They're, you know, everyone is like sending in anonymous DM saying, I just heard from this person. It's fully happening. And then we get a statement from

[B]

west an hour ago and Amanda, they both posted the exact same thing to their stories.

[A]

Right. So I'll read that.

[B]

Please do.

[A]

We've seen the growing online speculation. So while this is still very new, we wanted to provide some clarity. It was never our intention to purposefully hide anything. Given the complicated relationship dynamics involved and the scrutiny that comes with being on a reality show, we needed a little space to process things privately before speaking on it. We've shown up for each other as friends over the years through the highs and the lows, and what's developed recently was the last thing either of us expected. Our connection grew out of genuine, long standing friendship, which made it especially important for us to approach this with care. As our feelings evolved, we wanted to take time to understand exactly what we were feeling. We also recognize that this has had an impact beyond just us and never wanted our actions to cause any hurt or. Or be perceived as careless. We truly appreciate the understanding and respect as we navigate this.

[B]

So they have confirmed that they are dating. And it's especially shocking to everyone because

[A]

let me say really quick, yeah. People were also like, okay, well maybe there was like a one time makeout and this is like, you know, devastating to Sierra. She's just found this out.

[B]

Right.

[A]

What this statement confirms to me is that it is on.

[B]

It's on and they're not stopping. Yeah. I think it's all just especially shocking because Amanda had everyone on her side. Right. Like during this breakup with Kyle, it

[A]

was like, hallelujah, they're done, you know, and they should not be together. They are a terrible couple.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But everyone was just like, we're so grateful that Amanda's out like of this

[B]

relationship and she was getting the r onomatics light treatment.

[A]

Absolutely, absolutely.

[B]

I just think that. So not only is it just shocking on a relational level that she would do this to Sierra, who was like one of her greatest friends, and she would hook up with this guy who Sierra obviously has all these complicated feelings.

[A]

Have a secret relationship with him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Not just took up. Right.

[B]

Have a secret relationship. But I just think also kind of give up, in my opinion, the goodwill of the fans for this F boy. Like, truly, he's an F boy. And so I just find it to be. I find it to be so shocking on a career level and on a friendship level.

[A]

I honestly kind of. I swap those in level of importance because I'm not.

[B]

I'm not saying that. I'm not saying that career is more important. I'm just saying those are both the things that are shocking.

[A]

Well. And I just. I think the most, like, the west feels very temporary to me. It's like west is fun. He's like a. You know, I understand the attraction there. I don't think they're endgame. I don't think the two of them are endgame. And it's like I saw a comment, I was like, they better be shopping for engagement rings. Like, I hope this was worth it. But I think to lose. And this is what I've been sending many, many voice memos about because I. The women on this show like the. Some of the friendships, not all of them, because they're not always the nicest to, like, new girls are not always super, you know, welcoming. But, like, the Amanda Sierra friendship was very real, at least to me as an, you know, an audience member. And it was like one of my favorite parts of the show was like, these girls who are like, in this weird situation where they're on reality tv, they're like best friends, and they just, like, they're just ride or dies. So the fact that she is throwing that all away in the most. I think in, like, this is the biggest betrayal she could have ever done to Sierra.

[B]

Right. Right.

[A]

I mean, granted, you know, there's a lot of people that are like, it's not that big of a deal. Everyone is single in this equation, but it's like, it's kind of like your best friend's ex. That they're the most caught up with you.

[B]

You just don't go there.

[A]

You just don't go there. How can you. I said this earlier. How can you physically, in your body and soul, like, enjoy those physical experiences? I don't know. Maybe people. Maybe you enjoy it more. I don't know.

[B]

I just think it's one thing if you're 21 and maybe just don't have the perspective. But especially, man, I think it's like 34.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Especially in your mid-30s. I think you have perspective. On how precious friendships are. Honestly, they're more precious than all your dating relationships, which again will end and you'll never talk to those people again. So kind of sacrificing a true, great, best friendship on the altar of an fboy is really, it's just disturbing for everyone.

[A]

It's incredibly disturbing. That is exactly right. And I think that's why the Internet is having this reckoning, because it's like Amanda is coming off of this horrible marriage and she's just making another bad decision and losing the support of. Of one of her greatest friends who she. And she talks about literally how she couldn't have gotten through like, this past summer without Sierra.

[B]

Well, and Sierra was also someone who would go to bat for a man.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Kyle would like, would literally yell at Kyle. Yes. For Amanda. So the, the loyalty on one side and the extreme disloyalty on the other side. I think it's also just surprising for people because Amanda seems so level headed.

[A]

Yeah. But I think, I mean, what people are saying is people, you know, people love to say this, but it's like a pick me thing where it's like she's actually maybe never been that much of a girl's girl.

[B]

Interesting. I want to say something about the scene you showed me earlier that we showed the audience clearly this was going on during Summer House, because I just don't think there's any. Any way west would have reacted that way and started kind of like canoodling with Sierra if he wasn't trying to make Amanda jealous.

[A]

Oh, here's another really annoying part. Completely agree. West will comment on Sierra's like, hot photos of herself, like, really nice things.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

So it's like they have just been trying to pull the wool over everyone's eyes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And just acting. I mean, don't you think he was

[B]

trying to make Amanda jealous?

[A]

Yes. No, Absolutely.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But. And so on during filming, he's, you know, like, masquerading around as somebody who's, you know, is kind of interested in her. And. And then also, like on social media is also trying to be like, I don't know, number one bestie straight guy who, you know. Yeah. It's just, I, I'm. See, I'm seething and I have sent, like, I've sent at least 30 minutes worth of voice memos crashing out about this.

[B]

Yeah, you are crashing out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I need you to take some deep breaths. Do you think that this is the end of Summer House? Because I did see someone say that, like, there's just no way everyone's going to be able to go back to another season.

[A]

Oh, no, no, no. I was having a conversation with a friend on my way here about this very topic.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Please, no, of course not. This is the best thing that could ever happen for Summer House. Like, you don't think people are going

[B]

to be tuning in? Well, exactly. It's like all of a sudden, I haven't watched for a few seasons and I'm. I'm back. I. Not only am I going to watch next season, but I'm going to catch up.

[A]

So I also think this really complicates things for Bravo. So I wouldn't be. I wouldn't be surprised if Bravo is upset. And what I've heard is that because west fully lies on Watch what happens live, you know, when he says no, you know, he fully denies the rumor because Andy Cohen asked him like last week.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The week before. You know, the audience wants to know, like, you know.

[B]

Right.

[A]

The audience voted on. Well, you would you ship west and Amanda. But because there is this, like, spin off that's supposed to be happening, like the in the city spinoff. And then I don't know if that's what it's called, but it's like a city based spin off. And then there's Summer House. And I believe that the city based one was supposed to be Lindsay, Kyle and Amanda. And then Summer House was going to remain with Sierra, west and Jesse.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

But now it's like, if I was Sierra, I wouldn't want to film on a show with just west and Jesse and then new people like I.

[B]

And so it does compromise, I guess, that new iteration.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Without. And it wasn't gonna have Amanda on it.

[A]

And I don't know if Amanda was gonna.

[B]

I don't know. You literally need Amanda and Sierra on the same show to make it juicy.

[A]

Or at least I don't know. Or you need Amanda and West on the same show. You need like two people in this love triangle on the same show in order for people to want to watch it.

[B]

Oh, well, fans are crashing out. Bravo execs are crashing out. It's a bad day.

[A]

It's just like between this and the, you know, secret lives of Mormon wives.

[B]

Get into it.

[A]

Let's get into it. Okay.

[B]

Be honest, Chandler. Are you a spring new wardrobe, new me person, or are you like me and just emotionally attached to the same three outfits?

[A]

You and me are the same. I'm absolutely the second one. I don't need a whole new closet. I just need one good accessory to convince people I tried. Exactly.

[B]

Sometimes the accessory is the outfit. And that's why spring accents are my

[A]

favorite way to refresh your look.

[B]

Low effort, high impact. Macy's makes it way too easy to

[A]

complete your outfit with the trendiest chicest accessories of the season. I have a question for the jewelry girl here. Okay. Lauren, Is spring a gold season or is it a silver season? Or are you mixing metals now? I feel like spring. Thank you for this question. I feel like spring is very much

[B]

a mixture metals and don't overthink it Season. Okay. We are exiting the gold and over. You know, we're overthinking it.

[A]

Winter and we're entering.

[B]

Mix things up and don't think about it too much. Spring. Okay. I decide based on the outfit and my mood. If I'm wearing softer colors, I might lean gold.

[A]

If the look is more clean and

[B]

minimal, I might go platinum or silver. And also rules. They're meant to be broken. Layer necklaces are my go to because they even make a basic tee feel.

[A]

Styled jewelry is really such a low stakes way to try trends without fully committing. You're not changing your whole personality, you're just adding a new necklace. Exactly. And you can't forget about a good handbag when accessorizing.

[B]

Macy's has spring bags from Coach guest Ralph Lauren that feel lighter and softer and more playful.

[A]

Think seasonal textures, new shapes and colors that actually feel like spring. I'm obsessed with the soft leather boho bags. They're cute with denim, they work with flowy dresses. It's giving the effortlessly put together even if you were late vibe. And the slouchy suede bags at Macy's,

[B]

so good for adding texture to simple outfits. Plus, east west style bags are having a big moment. They're fresh, modern, and an easy way to transition into spring without doing too much.

[A]

Okay, but can we also talk about rebag at Macy's for a moment? Because secondhand designer bags at Macy's for a fraction of the price. I mean, that's just dangerous for my financial goals.

[B]

Same.

[A]

You can find so many designer bags,

[B]

even Birkins secondhand on reback at Macy's. It's also better for the planet. So even if it's not great for your wallet, it can help you feel better while shopping.

[A]

What is like the dream find for you on rebag?

[B]

Probably a classic designer shoulder bag I

[A]

can wear with everything.

[B]

What about you?

[A]

You know, I lean a little bit more iconic in this department and so I just want something that really packs a punch. It makes My whole outfit look expensive? I'll be honest.

[B]

That makes sense coming from an icon like yourself, Chandler. And let's not forget the most underrated accessory of all, fragrance.

[A]

It speaks for you when you barely entered a room. What's your spring scent vibe? Floral, fruity, clean. I like something fresh but interesting. Macy's carries so many good spring scents.

[B]

They have YSL's Libre Berry Crush, Carolina Herrera's Jasmine, Jo Malone's Peach Blossom, Miu Miu, Fleur de la Byredo's Gypsy Water. A good fragrance is the finishing touch that makes you feel put together.

[A]

Even if your outfit is just fine. It's like invisible styling. No one can see it, but everyone notices it. Exactly.

[B]

So if you're ready to refresh your spring look without redoing your entire closet,

[A]

start with the accessories.

[B]

From bags and jewelry to fragrance, Macy's makes it easy to update your vibe

[A]

with small, intentional pieces that make everything feel new again. Shop now in stores or Macy's dot com. Let's. Let's just turn the page, I guess, to another shitty story.

[B]

I am very curious. It seems like everyone is obsessed with Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. Is there anyone out there who has fatigue, who just, like, didn't necessarily buy in to the. The constant news cycles about these people, about mom talk? Are you feeling good? You're feeling energized?

[A]

I feel fine. I think you have Mormon fatigue.

[B]

I do.

[A]

I think. And I understand that.

[B]

Yeah. Okay. But anyway, so it has come out that Jesse from Secret Lives of Mormon Lives, she made out with Chase, the ex husband of Miranda. Yes. So it's a very similar situation. Kind of a similar situation. Ex husband of Miranda, ex husband of

[A]

Miranda, ex boyfriend of Layla, brother to Layla's other ex boyfriend.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Messy. You know what I. I said? Actually, I haven't said this yet, but I'm. You know what I'm gonna say. Please share. Salt Lake City is really carrying its weight in terms of just, like, cultural messiness, like Instagram messiness. Like, we are. They are just.

[B]

It's just, it's the city itself, not the Bravo franchise.

[A]

I guess the Bravo franchise within Salt Lake City, like, there's just. I don't know, there's just like so much coming from. From that region.

[B]

Yeah. From.

[A]

Because two, like, there was, like, reports, I guess Indie Blue and Chase, like, had a moment at a club or something.

[B]

Maybe.

[A]

This is where I get.

[B]

I'm curious if people agree with me on, you know, that are listening, but I just, I don't see the appeal. Like, I know you see the west appeal, it's harder for me to see. I don't see the Chase appeal. And so the idea that these women who are all successful in their own right, who seem like great quality people are fighting over to me what seemed like Vivint sales Bros.

[A]

I don't think we should conflate Chase and West because wow. I, I think west is the worst and I would like to accost him on the street.

[B]

Yeah. Citizens arrest Chase.

[A]

Chase is just slimy and gross. Correct. And west is like. I actually find west to be charming.

[B]

Okay. So we will not strike that from the record. We will, we will absolutely not make the false equivalence. But I do think that it's the, specifically the dad talk. Men, most of them are just so not worth anyone's time. And so the idea that Jesse is like so tempted by hooking up with Chase, it's shocking. It's actually shocking to me because especially like these girls have got a taste of success right now. All of a sudden. They're making a lot of money. They're. They're not just like, they're not small town girls anymore. I would think that they would think I want a real man. I don't want one of these like Vivint sales guys.

[A]

I have a theory on this.

[B]

Please share.

[A]

I think that when it comes to Summer house, when it comes to, you know, Secret Lives of Mormon wives, I think that all these people who film together.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like kind of only want to hang out with each other because they all understand the weird world that they all exist in. The brand deals and the, the, the production. And just like I feel like, like Chase is fully in, in the show. Yeah. And I just like they all end up hanging out a lot together. And I don't think they're like, you know, now that I'm on Secret Lives of Mormon wives, I'm gonna start dating, you know, men from the tech scene in the silicon slopes. Like, I don't think they're stepping out of the of or stepping up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

From maybe these like petty circles.

[B]

That's their mistake. That's.

[A]

It is.

[B]

That's absolutely their first mistake.

[A]

I think what was hard for me about the Chase and Jesse thing is that we like, we heard that it happened and then they kind of instantly confirmed it because then Miranda posted that like note with. From note with flowers that Jesse had sent her. And that made me feel like it was more fake because like, I think with the Amanda and West stuff, they were radio silent and we were all just like spinning out about It. And so I think like the, the. The slo moi, which is what I've heard some people. You can say slo mo or you can say slo moi.

[B]

I like sloanwa.

[A]

Yeah, Sloan was really funny. So the sloanwa girls. Yeah, sloanwa girls instantly were like jumping on the PR of it all and, you know, confirming it. Yeah.

[B]

It's because it does seem like those girls are really hustling.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

You know, they want to keep our attention. They want the drama to keep coming. Which again, I think a little bit plays into my fatigue.

[A]

Totally agree, Totally agree. It's like, oh, wow, am I just like there's a new chill.

[B]

There's a new season every six months.

[A]

It's a lot. There's a new drama. It is a lot. And I. It does make the whole thing feel a bit more contrived.

[B]

Like, however, yeah, Chandler and I, we do have some insider information and it's, I guess completely real.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Miranda is pissed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

She did hook up with him. Made out or whatever. But still, like, this is not actually bs. These girls are that messy.

[A]

Yeah. So I guess we'll see it on the next season.

[B]

I mean, if they pick up cameras again.

[A]

I know they have to.

[B]

They absolutely will pick up cameras again. And I also want to share with you a theory, an idea. I think we will see the Bachelorette. I think the problem was that it was just too hot when that video came out about Taylor. And I think that they are more shelfing it than scrapping it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

It's kind of too big of a thing to just fully, you know, put in the incinerator.

[B]

Yeah. So I think everyone should watch for Taylor, Frankie Paul's image to get rehabilitated over the next couple months and see if we actually see the Bachelorette come out.

[A]

Did you see that piano thing she posted?

[B]

I honestly, I. I'm not trying to learn an instrument. And I applaud that.

[A]

It's very just like girl, log off, Log off.

[B]

She's going to be watercoloring. She's going to be learning French. You know, just really taking to the fine arts.

[A]

Gaso.

[B]

And to. You know what? It's giving to me. It was giving. I know why. I don't know why I'm extrapolating so much from just one little still of her playing the piano. I'm ready. But it's giving Camilla, you know, all just like the feminine arts she was educated in.

[A]

Camilla, like the Queen consort.

[B]

Yeah. Queen consort Camilla.

[A]

You. You need help.

[B]

I have a one track mind.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so Basically everyone in the palace papers by Tina Brown. She talked. I'm trying to explain. She talked about how Camilla was born, like in their aristocracy. And she went to. She didn't get a formal education. She basically got an education in like the feminine art. So flower arranging, watercolor, like playing the piano. French.

[A]

Wait, Megan literally should have had the queen consort on with love Megan, because she's an expert in all those things.

[B]

All the arts. That's such a good point. I'm shocked that. That Camilla didn't, you know, accept the invitation wasn't accepted. Extended.

[A]

Speaking of which, let's read the tea we got.

[B]

Well, I'm gonna finish this.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

It's quick aside. Okay. Anyway, I guess Camilla was kind of pissed about that and was always insecure about her lack of education. I was kind of jealous though, because it seemed like a very fine way to be, you know, fine experience as a young woman to have.

[A]

Honestly, though, it's crazy because, like, do you. What. What feminine arts do you honestly do in your life?

[B]

I think that if I like.

[A]

You don't even arrange flowers. I arrange flowers. Not arrange flowers. I put flowers in a vase.

[B]

I do. I do have this delusional thought about myself, which is that if I didn't need to make money. If I didn't need to make money, I would just throw myself into the world of feminism.

[A]

You would hate that.

[B]

I would. I would learn to play the harp. Okay. I would watercolor, maybe. I would do children's book illustrations. I'd just be a very, like, just a very sweet.

[A]

You would scroll 100 times farther than you already scroll. You would do none of this.

[B]

No, because I wouldn't need to scroll because I don't need to be kept abreast. I can become wildly out of touch. There's no problem with that. And that to me sounds like an incredible life.

[A]

Okay, well, dream on.

[B]

I am.

[A]

So, everyone, we got a comment on one of our recent episodes with a little bit of insider tea. Okay. Okay. So this comment says, I'm a TV producer and my production company was approached by Archwell to make a TV series featuring Harry. We sent them ideas for an entire year and he turned down every single one before the CEO of my company and ended the contract with them. Harry wanted to do something that made a difference a lot, Diana with the landmines in the 90s. But every idea we suggested, he was worried it would upset the powers in the country. They made everyone sign strict NDAs but forgot to send one to me.

[B]

Haha. I love it.

[A]

Also, this person to this person. We deeply appreciate you. You sharing your little bit of insider tea with us. Truly.

[B]

And doesn't it all track?

[A]

It completely tracks. I mean, we've, we. This is not new. This is not a new type of story. I mean, we heard them. You know, I feel like this was in the Spotify or Netflix. There was some article, I can't remember what, which publication it was in, but it was talking about how like they went around and around like on different ideas with Harry about what his show was going to be.

[B]

Well, and I think it's the exact information we got about Megan too. Yes. She would always get afraid that she would second guess everything. And again, they want this like, very, very kind of. Honestly, it sounds like me if I didn't have to work. They want this just kind of very sanitized.

[A]

You don't even want to watch that tv. Like, you don't even want to watch that content as your tv.

[B]

This idea, Chandler, it is completely delusional.

[A]

It's not accurate.

[B]

Okay, But I'm not my fantasy just

[A]

going to let you continue anyway.

[B]

I feel like when it comes to Meghan and Harry, I just feel like their Achilles heel is the whole like, do good aspect.

[A]

You know, I mean, we gave that up long ago.

[B]

I would like to take. Take it up again or I would like more delusions. I would like to take it up at all. But no, I think that it's like the, the insistence on, on things being for charity and philanthropy, it's just. It doesn't make good television.

[A]

Take a page out of the slum while girls books. Yes, we know what sells papers.

[B]

We know.

[A]

Lack of a better expression. Yeah, okay, we know what, what you know, gets an audience to tune in. And it is not a charity type work.

[B]

No, correct. It is hooking up with your friend's ex. Okay?

[A]

Literally being as messy as possible.

[B]

You know why we're gonna alternate to Summer House? Because Amanda is fucking West. Megan, if you want us all to tune into your next Netflix project, why don't you go have an affair with William and why don't you wear a GoPro? Is that too much to ask here?

[A]

You know, you don't even have to go that far. Why don't you just pull up in your phone and find the meanest text you've ever sent about, about William or

[B]

Kate and read it to their face.

[A]

You don't even have to go that far.

[B]

No, honestly. And we will all tune in like,

[A]

I like her business plan.

[B]

One foot on a. Marry a guy With. With one foot on a banana and

[A]

one foot in the grave or something. Anyway, so good.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Thank you, Salt Lake City, yet again for the messiness.

[B]

Pulling their weight. No. So I just. I don't have high hopes for Harry and Meghan. This is something I also consider Chandler. And no one has ever brought this up. So just wait. You know how Megan said that, you know, they said, what, TV is your favorite? And she says that Harry. They basically, after a long day, you know, she. She's with the kids. They're, you know, probably collecting the eggs.

[A]

Then she sends the email to the kids email account.

[B]

Archie's Chicken Coop. Exactly. Once everything is done, the jam is off the stove. Okay. The kids are asleep. Then she sends the emails to both of her children.

[A]

I barely want to respond to text messages, like, with my best friends because I'm so lazy.

[B]

She sends the emails. She sends the love letters.

[A]

Then I'm so tired. I'm exhausted from the speech. Yes.

[B]

Then she does duolingo. Okay. And then she says if all that's concluded, then she will flip through the channels. But basically by that point, they, like, go to sleep. That's what she said. Why are these people trying to create TV series and they don't even watch tv. No.

[A]

They're so out of touch. They don't know what sells. They're not. They're not turning into slum wall.

[B]

Megan's problem is she's living the life I aspire to and fantasize about, but she actually still needs to work like me.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

So, you know what, girl?

[A]

It's a complete circle Venn diagram of you two.

[B]

You need to, you know, you need to accept your fate and just slum it a little with the rest of us.

[A]

Heather McDonald's prediction is that she will be on some type of ensemble cast,

[B]

like some sort of reality show.

[A]

What do you think about that?

[B]

I mean, I think that their desire, her desire specifically for fame and for money, completely outstrips her desire for just being, like, a private citizen living amongst, I don't know, the hydrangeas in Montecito. So I definitely think that's true.

[A]

Okay. Speaking of which, we. I did start watching Ladies of London.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

Yeah. I'm not very far into it. I'm only on the first episode, but really liking it. Yeah. There's. There's characters we need to talk about.

[B]

People are saying people are loving it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And they're saying they're comparing it to first season of Roni. They're just saying it's a very Authentic.

[A]

Like I said, there's some very distinct characters.

[B]

Okay. So I'm gonna watch it. We'll talk about it on premium. Really quick for Move on. Do you think that that will happen with Megan?

[A]

I mean, crazier things have happened.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, I think the only reason why I hold out a little bit is just because it's kind of like the only thing she has left is, like, the fact that she hasn't done something like that. So I don't know. Yeah, you know, I think it will be, like.

[B]

It will really.

[A]

It feels like it'll be a slightly cool day in hell.

[B]

The day she does that. It will just prove everyone. Like, it'll prove everyone in Kensington Palace. Correct.

[A]

Could she make enough money to afford their Montecito life? Could the two of them make enough money with their Montesuito life by just going around the country and, like, doing middle school talks or something about, like, bullying, Online bullying.

[B]

I mean, maybe private middle schools, but I don't. I don't think there's a huge budget at middle schools for public schools. Speakers, you're.

[A]

That's. That's an excellent point. I don't know. Maybe middle school is the wrong place.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like corporate events.

[B]

But who wants a talk at their corporation by two people who fail at all business?

[A]

Well, I think they just want to talk from a famous person. Could they just go do events? You know, like, do they get on the celebrity circuit of, like, go to this person's 50th birthday and.

[B]

Yeah, you might be unlocking something there.

[A]

It's like, you know, like, there's like, there's cameo and then there's like, there's

[B]

like, what, like, Frankel will do.

[A]

Yeah, but like, I feel like, like, what. What did Brianna do for that billionaire's wedding? I mean, they're not performers, but they're like, you know, it'd be sick to say Harry and Meghan were at my wedding.

[B]

Well, you know what I'm thinking? Like, it's good enough for Obama and Clinton. Hillary Clinton, like, go talk a Goldman Sachs. Like, maybe if they just want to

[A]

have very different, like.

[B]

I know what I'm just saying. Yeah, like private events.

[A]

No, totally corporate, private things.

[B]

That is going to be if. I'm sorry. If at the Deutsche bank, you know, holiday party, they can get Harry and Meghan giving a little toast in speech. That's going to be a draw.

[A]

It's so funny because. Just trying to think, like, what they could possibly have to say. Yeah, but that's fine. That's like not their job. Like, they have a team to figure out, you know, what their three sentences are going to be about. Like, the connection of Archewell and Deutsche Bank.

[B]

One thing I will say, and I know we need to get off this topic because I'm sure people have Harry and Megan fatigue, but I do think that seeing that she's doing that, like Summit for Women and the ticket price was under $3,000. I think the ticket price was literally $1,800. Was a little scary to me.

[A]

We're getting close to cameos. I think they'll be on cameo maybe before they're on an ensemble cast or, like, I think they have to be able to control the edit.

[B]

So they're gonna basically be doing the same work as Drinda Medley And Avery Singer, 100%.

[A]

And Jordan, Jesse's ex husband, he's on cameo.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'm gonna get you a cameo from Jordan for your birthday.

[A]

I don't want one. I don't want one.

[B]

Okay, well, Mother's Day's coming up. Maybe I'll get one for Mom. Okay, let's move on. I mean, there are so many things to get into on this fine day. I don't know about you, but once it starts getting warmer, I suddenly want to get my life together. I want to eat better, I want to feel better, but I also want to eat the things I enjoy. I'm not going to give up pasta or a good sandwich to feel better in my jeans. It's just not happening. That's why I love Herobred. It lets me keep all those comfort meals just with a better balance. They're both bread, tortillas, bagels, even noodles. Everything tastes like the real thing. Soft, fluffy, and actually satisfying. And you would never guess. It has 0 to 5 grams of net carbs, 0 grams of sugar, and up to 11 to 32 grams of fiber. Their tortillas are perfect for a quick wrap. And the Hero noodles, they have 12 grams of protein and only 80 calories per serving, which is kind of incredible. It just makes meals feel easier without overthinking them. No weird swaps and no sacrificing taste. Herobrite is offering 10 off your order. Go to Hero Co and use code pop at checkout. That's Pophero Co. I feel like underwear is one of those things that you don't think about that much until you're wearing a bad pair. Like that moment when underwear is digging into your skin or when you get a really beautiful bra, but it has no support or looks Terrible with a T shirt. It can ruin an entire entire outfit. That's why I reach for skims. The fabrics are soft, they're stretchy, they hold their shape and they actually feel supportive. My favorite right now is the Fits everybody plunge bra because it gives you a very smooth, easy lift without feeling stiff or overbuilt. And the Fits Everybody thong is one of the things you put on then completely forget about, which is such a dream. It just makes getting dressed feel easier because everything lays better when you're baking. Base layer is perfect. There's truly no competition for skims. No one is even in the game anymore because skims has conquered the entire first layer landscape. And I could not be more obsessed with every product that I buy from them. Shop my favorite bras and [e-mail] after you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you select pub apologists in the survey and be sure to select our show in the drop down menu that follows. Can I talk to you about Love Story? Let's get into American royalty.

[A]

Okay, great.

[B]

So I finally finished.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And I just. I have another citizen's arrest I would like to make of Ryan Murphy.

[A]

Why?

[B]

I just feel like he made both of them in the last two episodes. Very annoying to me and self indulgent and kind of self absorbed and just such impotent characters. Especially her.

[A]

Oh.

[B]

Like the way that she became such a shut in in his version of events. Had didn't have the kind of spine to even go out in public. Was just so incredibly overwhelmed by their life together and was such a shrinking violet. I thought. I just thought it was a real disservice to the woman Carolyn Bessette was. I just cannot imagine that was accurate.

[A]

I don't know who's to say what is exactly accurate.

[B]

But she had a different wedding dress than almost every other like any girl her. Her era. That is a brave woman.

[A]

I. But I. But I think that's actually the whole arc of it is that she's a completely different woman when they get married

[B]

and when they're dating versus Ryan Murphy. I just don't know if it's true. I can understand that she struggled with it, but the idea that she struggled with it to the degree that it like. Yeah, completely. I just. I found it to be into such a selfish extent.

[A]

What do you feel like was selfish?

[B]

Just like how she like basically didn't want to go with him anywhere. And then he was so self absorbed too.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I felt like he literally took two American icons and Tore them down.

[A]

I think after those episodes, I was just sort of like, yeah, maybe these two aren't really goals.

[B]

Well. And I don't want to feel that.

[A]

I know. I think that's. That's what's happening here. Like, I was okay to see the nuance and the complexity and you weren't. And you prefer one dimensional story.

[B]

Not with people that hot. With people that hot and well. And well dressed. I would also like to think that they just have great personalities and senses of self.

[A]

I will say I thought the ending scene where they show them in the plane was really hard to watch.

[B]

It was very hard to watch and also very unrealistic, which I didn't particularly love.

[A]

Why do you feel like it was unrealistic?

[B]

Because they're like supposed to be. They're plummeting towards their deaths essentially, and she's like basically leading them through breath work. I just thought it was a little unrealistic.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, it's just like so horrific. Like that whole.

[B]

It was.

[A]

The plane crash scenario is really her. That specific one is very horrific.

[B]

It was 17 seconds from when their plane went off course to them hitting the water.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I just. It's hard for me to imagine that that entire 17 seconds, they had no idea that something was deeply.

[A]

Well, yeah, yeah. It was definitely a dramatization.

[B]

All or it was like lack of drama on some level. Sure. I also think, though, basically with the way that those plane was configured and I guess it's fine. It's not true to history, but how it was configured was. So Carolyn and Lauren were seated not facing the front, facing the back. And we're basically not really like in contact with John. So that part is.

[A]

I think, I think they were trying to do that just to kind of

[B]

like to celebrate the story, round up

[A]

the story and put a bow on their relationship and say like, you know, they did like love each other and she was, you know, just to have a nice last moment with the two of them. It was just super devastating to watch and really haunting. Also very haunting was the. The conversation west in Sierra West. West. It's a moment in Summer House west and Amanda continuing a tweet that west liked west, commenting on this photo of Sierra also. Also haunting the scene between Anne Freeman and Caroline Kennedy.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I. I found. Is it Ann Freeman is her name. So her name is an ambassad.

[A]

I don't know. I don't know. But when I looked up her name in preparation for this episode. Episode, I saw Anne.

[B]

Well, you know, Freeman, who. Named. Who plays her is named Constance. Something.

[A]

Some simmers. Constant simmer. Zimmer, maybe. Zimmer, yeah.

[B]

Constant simmer.

[A]

She's amazing.

[B]

Constance.

[A]

I know.

[B]

She's an incredible actor. And it definitely.

[A]

There's.

[B]

There's varying degrees of acting chops display on this program, but, yeah, I found that to be really arresting. And I did find the idea of, like, who was Carolyn going to be once she kind of got past the difficulty of her marriage with John.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

She never got to become that person. She basically just got consumed, ostensibly, according to Ryan Murphy, with the. The John of it all.

[A]

Well, and just like her, I don't know. We don't even know because her portrayal was so backwards and the way, like, you know, the fact that she was even blamed for the crash. Right. And I. I just think the hugest part for me, that was new. It was a really new, deeply disturbing feeling and realization was just the fact that her sister was in the plane.

[B]

Like, I knew you didn't know that.

[A]

I knew that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It dawned on me in a new way where she's. You know, where she says to Caroline Kennedy, she says, you know, everyone keeps talking about how, like, sad it is with John and Carolyn, but I had two daughters on that plane. It's. It's honestly, like, unfathomable.

[B]

I mean, is she still alive? No, no, she's not.

[A]

She's not. The other sister, I believe, is still alive.

[B]

Oh, really?

[A]

Yeah. And they're. For what it's worth. And this did make me feel better, they received $15 million in, like, a wrongful death. Oh, the suit from the Kennedy family did. Yeah. From the Kennedys.

[B]

I mean, on some level, it's like. It's something.

[A]

Oh, it's something. It's like, you know what? Your life has basically been ruined by this family.

[B]

Right.

[A]

At least you don't have to worry about money.

[B]

Yeah. And I just. I mean, I just. I feel like the idea that not only one of your daughters, but two of them, it's un. It's truly unfathomable.

[A]

And then it's like the press is making one of your daughter's fault, and then your other daughter is barely. Is barely a footnote.

[B]

Yeah. She said no. I mean, it was. It was a hard ending of the series to watch.

[A]

So on a lighter note.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I did have a moment where I was really grateful to mom for raising us on Dido.

[B]

What's Dido?

[A]

You know, like, I'll just play it. I'm not gonna sing it. I've seen Plenty. On this podcast.

[B]

I thought it was an acronym.

[A]

There's an incredible scene where you'll remember it. Yeah. When. When she shows up to the party.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, thank.

[B]

Thank you. Let's get to the chorus.

[A]

It's so good. Thank you, Mom. I won't. I actually won't make us get to the chorus, but.

[B]

Yeah. Well, thank you for bringing up the diet. That's a fantastic artist.

[A]

The scene with. Well, you know what I'm talking about why I'm bringing this up, don't you?

[B]

Yes, I do, but I. I saw it, but, you know, I just.

[A]

I was like, oh, this is the perfect song for this moment.

[B]

Thank goodness mom played that.

[A]

Well.

[B]

I was just.

[A]

I'm glad that I had a. Wow. I can't believe I'm literally. You're not joining and joining me in this moment. I was just so glad that, like, I had a previous connection to that song. So that when that song was playing during that incredible scene where she shows up at the party, it just made it, like, wash over me in a new way.

[B]

Okay, again, I'm so grateful that Dido exists, is a great artist, and is washing over you in new ways. It's great. I'm agreeing.

[A]

Just, like, don't care about music.

[B]

I am agreeing. Okay, we're moving on, everyone. Taylor Swift says she feels happy, confident, and free because of fiance Travis kelsey at the iHeartRadio Music Awards. Chandler, do you want to discuss her outfit?

[A]

I want to talk about the most important thing of the night, which is her outfit and her look.

[B]

Yeah, it was beautiful. It was beautiful. I liked it too. I saw some people giving it hate, and I just thought it was really pretty people.

[A]

You don't know how good we have it with this outfit. It's stunning. It was a great color on her. I thought it looked good with her hair color. Glam was perfect. Loved it.

[B]

Hair could have been a little bit better, but that was the only tweak we'd make. We love Taylor. So she did give a. Give. Give an acceptance speech. And part of it, she basically said, you know, well, why don't I just read the quote one more time?

[A]

I think it was already kind of in the headline.

[B]

She says, I think that this album probably also feels very happy and confident and free because that is the way I get to feel every single day of my life because of my fiance who's here too. So thanks for all of the vibes, Chandler. Lauren, I am ready for the honeymoon phase of this relationship to be over. Candidly, I just Feel like it's been a lot of.

[A]

They're not even married yet and you're like, I'm ready for the honeymoon phase to be over. Let's end it.

[B]

I'm thrilled for them. Do you think they're gonna be in the next, like, Sting and Trudy just kind of like, fucking forever? Like, and just kind of hot for each other forever?

[A]

Earlier you, like, didn't want to say the Lord's name in vain, but now you're using like the full F word when talking about Sting and Trudy.

[B]

Well, the full F word is less bad to me for I think our parents and some of our listeners than the Lord's name in vain.

[A]

Well, I don't know. I just. Mom does not like the F word.

[B]

We're not talking about mom here. We're talking about Taylor and Travis never

[A]

use the F word.

[B]

And are they going to be hot for each other and in the honeymoon phase forever?

[A]

I. I don't know. Because I don't feel like he's her perfect muse. So I don't know if I can say they're a Sting and a Trudy. I actually have nothing. I have no information about Trudy.

[B]

I think Sting and Trudy were a particular obsession for me and not for you.

[A]

Yeah. And I'm glad that that could wash over you. Yeah, I mean, she's had more like, she's had more deeply meaningful comments about other relationships than this speech, but whatever, I think. Thanks, Travis, for the vibes. His beard is a little too long for me right now. And that is actually where this is all falling apart.

[B]

The Travis centering of the Taylor universe is just. I think we've had plenty of it.

[A]

We've had a lot.

[B]

And again, yeah, you're right. When he doesn't have the right haircut, it cuts extra deep for the Swifty community.

[A]

It's tough.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, you're right.

[A]

But we're happy for them.

[B]

No, we're happy for them. We love them.

[A]

We want her to be happy and free and. And to avoid words. What were the words?

[B]

Happy and confident.

[A]

We want her to be happy, free and confident and joy. I feel like Joy was in there.

[B]

Yeah, we. We're just not sure how good it is for the music.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

I mean, I'm gonna. Kind of, kind of a self absorbed thing to say. You all.

[A]

Thank you for bearing with us as I explain martial law to Lauren as we talk about the men we want to accost. Yeah, we love you all. Thank you for listening. We'll be back on Friday with an episode for our global elites.

[B]

Yes. We'll be back on Friday with an episode just for our global elites, everyone. So please, if you would like to, you know what? Secret, secret. Our free trial is still up and I don't know, I. You know, I'm very anti the free trial.

[A]

You are.

[B]

But I haven't gotten around to taking it down. So there's still time. If you would like to try out band Global Elite for one week for free, you can do that.

[A]

We'll also probably discuss Beverly Hills and get into the Q A on Global Elites episode, which I guess we didn't

[B]

have time for today. Also, we do have this month we're doing celebrity feuds, like friendship feuds in Hollywood. Part one is going to be regular. Part two is going to be premium. So you can listen for that. Should be a great month for global elites. A great month for apostles.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So we love you guys. Thank you for listening and we'll be back on Friday. Bye Bye. Pluto TV has thousands of free movies and TV shows. You swear if I'm lying, I'm dying.

[A]

This is the mindset. Free.

[B]

This is the mantra.

[A]

Free.

[B]

This is the. With movies like Titanic, Dream Girls and Gladiator playing out A D and TV shows like Survivor, SpongeBob SquarePants, the fairly odd Parents and Ghosts, Pluto TV is always free. Pluto TV Stream now pay never. Hi, I'm Stassi Schroeder.

[A]

On my podcast, I share candid updates from my personal life, chat with some of my best friends about what's going on in our lives, give commentary on the latest pop culture headlines, and sometimes deep dive into random topics. I'm obsessed with, like, human design.

[B]

It's a bit all over the place,

[A]

but that's how I like it.

[B]

And you will too.

[A]

Listen to my podcast, Stassi, wherever you get your podcasts,