Are We In A Media Literacy Crisis?

Summary

Pop Culture Happy Hour: Are We In A Media Literacy Crisis?

Release Date: May 29, 2025

In the episode titled "Are We In A Media Literacy Crisis?" from NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour, hosts Linda Holmes, Glen Weldon, Stephen Thompson, and Aisha Harris delve deep into the growing concerns surrounding media literacy in today's pop culture landscape. Joined by guest Brittney Luce from It's Been a Minute and B.A. Parker from Code Switch, the discussion navigates through the challenges audiences face in critically consuming media amidst an overwhelming influx of information and polarized online discourse.

---

Introduction to the Media Literacy Crisis

Aisha Harris opens the conversation by highlighting a pressing issue observed in contemporary pop culture consumption. She references her appearance on It's Been a Minute, where Brittney Luce discussed the dissonance between creators' intentions and audience interpretations.

Aisha Harris (00:20): "We’ve all gotten really, really, really bad at watching movies and TV shows."

Brittney Luce provides a concrete example by discussing the reactions to Ryan Coogler's Sinners:

Brittney Luce (00:38): "There’s a Chinese character in the film named Grace, played by Li Jun Lee... some viewers thought it was a representation of a lack of PoC solidarity from Asian folks in black communities."

This misinterpretation underscores the fundamental issue: audiences are struggling to decode and critically analyze the underlying messages in media.

---

Defining Media Literacy and Its Current State

The conversation shifts to the definition and importance of media literacy. According to the National Association of Media Literacy Education, media literacy encompasses the ability to encode and decode symbols in consumed content, enabling a deeper critical analysis.

Brittney Luce (01:20): "...most importantly, being able to critically analyze those symbols for a richer takeaway."

Aisha expresses her concern:

Aisha Harris (01:58): "Seeing some of this commentary has me concerned that we’re struggling with the necessary tools to even critically approach some of the things we’re watching for entertainment."

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Impact of Personal Biases and Internet Culture

Aisha delves into how personal biases and the rise of internet culture exacerbate the media literacy crisis. She highlights how individuals bring their own experiences and group identities into their media consumption, often projecting interpretations that may not align with creators' intentions.

Aisha Harris (07:31): "Everything becomes super personal. And you often think about things from your perspective and then you project your perspective onto film, TV, whatever..."

This phenomenon is further illustrated through the discussion of Wicked. While the musical's production notes describe it as a commentary on the rise of fascism, some critics, like Michael R. Jackson, dismiss its political undertones as "progressive, magical thinking."

Aisha Harris (04:32): "Whether or not you believe that it’s actually resistant is one thing, but I think it is, like, inherently a political piece of movie and show..."

---

Moralizing Entertainment and Its Consequences

The hosts explore the trend of moralizing entertainment, where audiences evaluate media primarily based on whether it aligns with their personal values rather than its artistic merit.

Brittney Luce (12:46): "There’s almost like this entertainment moralizing process... It becomes less about whether you actually think something is well done or entertaining and more about whether it makes you seem or feel like a good person."

B.A. Parker adds to this by arguing that using personal morality to judge art diminishes the richness of media analysis:

B.A. Parker (13:25): "We can’t use our morality to gauge the validity of art."

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Connection Between Media Literacy in Entertainment and News Consumption

Linda Luce draws a parallel between media literacy in entertainment and news consumption. She posits that if audiences struggle to interpret complex narratives and subtle cues in fictional media, their ability to navigate real-world news may be equally compromised.

Brittney Luce (14:20): "How might they understand or misunderstand complex news stories with huge real life implications."

This concern is validated by anecdotes of misinformation spreading rapidly on social media platforms, such as the fabricated "Spitgate" incident involving Harry Styles.

B.A. Parker (18:12): "Someone made that up on Twitter and people just ran with it."

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The Role of Algorithms in Shaping Worldviews

The discussion also touches upon the influence of algorithms in creating echo chambers, thereby reinforcing existing beliefs and limiting exposure to diverse perspectives.

Brittney Luce (16:12): "Where do we go as a society? Where are we going, y'all?"

Aisha reflects on how algorithms tailor content to individual preferences, often deepening societal divides:

Aisha Harris (16:47): "Depending on your algorithm, you might be fed a bunch of stuff that’s very pro Luigi or, like, gushing over how hot you think he might be."

---

The Abyss of Media Literacy Challenges

Concluding the episode, Aisha metaphorically describes the current state of media literacy as being "in the abyss," questioning how long society will remain in this challenging state before finding a way to improve critical media consumption skills.

Aisha Harris (16:47): "I think we’re already in the abyss. It’s just like, how long are we gonna wait here and when are we gonna pull ourselves out?"

---

Final Thoughts and Takeaways

The hosts collectively emphasize the urgency of addressing the media literacy crisis. They advocate for a more intentional and critical approach to media consumption, urging audiences to move beyond personal biases and seek a deeper understanding of the content they engage with.

Brittney Luce (19:27): "Thank you both so much."

B.A. Parker (18:26): "That is the level of, like, kind of, like, literacy we’re on right now. Yes."

The episode serves as a compelling call to action for both creators and consumers to foster a more informed and discerning media landscape.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Aisha Harris (00:20): "We’ve all gotten really, really, really bad at watching movies and TV shows."
• Brittney Luce (00:38): "...some viewers thought it was a representation of a lack of PoC solidarity from Asian folks in black communities."
• Aisha Harris (04:32): "Whether or not you believe that it’s actually resistant is one thing..."
• Brittney Luce (12:46): "...less about whether you actually think something is well done or entertaining and more about whether it makes you seem or feel like a good person."
• B.A. Parker (13:25): "We can’t use our morality to gauge the validity of art."
• Brittney Luce (14:20): "How might they understand or misunderstand complex news stories with huge real life implications."
• Aisha Harris (16:47): "I think we’re already in the abyss. It’s just like, how long are we gonna wait here and when are we gonna pull ourselves out?"

---

This episode of Pop Culture Happy Hour poignantly captures the multifaceted challenges of media literacy in the digital age, urging listeners to cultivate a more nuanced and critical approach to the media they consume.

Transcript

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[Aisha Harris]

Okay everybody, Aisha here. And the other day I went on NPR's It's Been a Minute to talk about a crisis we've been seeing in pop culture. I won't spoil it, but basically we've all gotten really, really, really bad at watching movies and TV shows. Here's how It's Been a Minute's host Brittney Luce describes it like almost every.

[Brittney Luce]

Other person in the country, I flocked to see Ryan Coogler's Sinners when it hit theaters in April. And while I enjoyed the film, part of the fun was seeing all the excitement online. So when I was finally able to scroll through all the spoiler heavy commentary, I was shocked to to see some of the wildest takes I've seen on a movie in a while. For example, there's a Chinese character in the film named Grace, played by Li Jun Lee. And for those who haven't seen it, this is a light spoiler, but she's responsible for a pretty big moment in the film. But what I and also the director of the film Ryan Coogler, felt was a rash decision made by a mother in distress some viewers thought was a representation of a lack of PoC solidarity from Asian folks in black communities. Even stranger, some audience members thought Annie, played by actress Wumi Mosaku, was one of the main characters, Smoke's mother. Now, for those who don't know, Annie is the estranged wife of Smoke, one of the two smokestack twins played by Michael B. Jordan. Just wild stuff. But this isn't the first time the audience has been out of step with the content itself. The endless rabbit holes and theories around season two of Severance and made me want to swear off the fandom entirely. It made me think about a phrase that gets thrown around a lot online media literacy. According to the national association of Media Literacy Education, media literacy is the ability to encode and decode the symbols communicated in what we consume, and for me, most importantly, being able to critically analyze those symbols for a richer takeaway. And seeing some of this commentary has me concerned that we're struggling with the necessary tools to even critically approach some of the things we're watching for entertainment. So I called up Pop Culture Happy.

[Aisha Harris]

Hours Aisha Harris for better and to some extent, for worse, we come to pop culture with all of our baggage.

[Brittney Luce]

And Code Switch's B.A. parker.

[B.A. Parker]

Oh, we don't have subtext anymore. Like, we have subtext, but we can't.

[Brittney Luce]

Read it to ask them, where else are they seeing this? And what does this media literacy crisis mean for the way that we engage with the world at large?

[Aisha Harris]

The furthest back I can go of a recent example of this is Wicked wasn't even coming from, you know, randos on the Internet or strange on the Internet. I imagine both of you saw a strange loop. The really great Broadway show by Michael R. Jackson.

[Brittney Luce]

I'm familiar with it, but I haven't seen it.

[Aisha Harris]

So he had some very interesting opinions on Wicked, and he actually wound up writing about this around the time of the Oscars in the New York Times. He wrote an opinion piece titled Is Wicked really a resistance Musical? He's kind of going after people who, when Wicked came out, were claiming that it was very relevant to our times. And Wicked came out, like, maybe a couple weeks after Trump was elected. So people were, you know, tying threads together to call Wicked a musical that is representative of our times. And Michael R. Jackson basically, basically wrote, like, he calls this progressive, magical thinking and that people are trying to reclaim Wicked as, like, this resistance musical when it's not actually. And to me, that's kind of inaccurate. I'm not saying that Wicked is necessarily a super radical piece of theater or as a movie, but the novel that it's based off of is incredibly political. It's very different from the musical, and it is intended to be an allegory. And I will also say the production notes for Wicked, they literally say that it is a show about the quiet, insidious rise of a fascist movement that seeks to demonize the intelligent speaking animals of Oz. End quote.

[Brittney Luce]

Well, dang.

[Aisha Harris]

So whether or not you believe that it's actually resistant is one thing, but I think it is, like, inherently a political piece of movie and show in a way that, like, I'm not sure Jackson is willing to give credit, but.

[Brittney Luce]

That'S a really fascinating read. It's made plain as day by the people who actually created the thing. But I'm curious, Parker, have you had this experience?

[B.A. Parker]

I mean, I had recently. I was watching clips of an interview that Katie Couric had with Noah Wylie, who's the star of the Pit.

[Aisha Harris]

Oh, yes.

[B.A. Parker]

She asked him a question that gave the feeling like she hadn't absorbed anything that was happening on the show. There's, like, a big scene between Noah.

[Brittney Luce]

Wylie's character and, like, another movie, Dr.

[B.A. Parker]

Collins, who's like a black doctor and Katie Couric says, so was something going on between the two of those characters?

[Brittney Luce]

And there's like a big, like, that's a huge. What you're referring to is a huge emotional scene on the show that makes it very clear that they share some type of very serious, like, intimate past.

[B.A. Parker]

Yeah.

[Aisha Harris]

Yes.

[B.A. Parker]

And I was like, oh, we don't have subtext anymore. Like, we have subtext, but we can't read it. Like, someone has to blatantly, hey, remember that thing we did like five years ago? This is how it made me feel.

[Brittney Luce]

But let's get into the meat and potatoes of why I brought you both here today. Because the online discourse around the film centers has broken my brain. They had me concerned about not just how people were misunderstanding story, as each of you have discussed, but also how people were misunderstanding pretty common racial dynamics. And a lot of these reactions were coming from black people. I wanna talk a specific situation. There's a character in the film named Mary played by Hailee Steinfeld. Mary is a character who actually, like the real life actress Steinfeld, has a grandparent who is mixed race. One of the main characteristics of her character is that she is passing for white, but she is aware and at least privately acknowledged, like many white passing black people, that she has black ancestry and she was raised around black people. And I have seen so many people saying that she actually was white, she should be considered white people simply just not understanding how the one drop rule worked back then, how segregation worked back in the Jim Crow South.

[Aisha Harris]

What in the Lena Horn are we doing here? Like.

[Brittney Luce]

It stressed me out. But my concern with this is two pronged because, you know, this seems like people don't know, A, how to understand history and locate a story within a certain historical context, or B, that they also don't understand storytelling or in this case, how to understand cues and clues that a movie will give you to understand what it's trying to tell you. What do you all make of this phenomenon? Aisha will hear from you first.

[Aisha Harris]

This is something that I have written about and thought about a lot, which is that for better and to some extent, for worse, we come to pop culture with all of our baggage, all of ourselves, and especially in the age of the Internet, when we are all kind of identifying amongst groups and demographics, whether it's like I'm a Trekkie or I'm a Harry Potter fan or I'm whatever, it's like, everything becomes super personal. And you often think about things from your perspective and then you project Your perspective onto film, tv, whatever, in ways that maybe, like, aren't always there. Like, they don't actually exist, but you are bringing it to whatever piece of art you're consuming. And there's some good that can come out of that. Queer and people of color, fans who have inserted themselves into pop culture in that way. And I think those things are not disconnected. I think about something like Joker, the first movie, which came out in 2019, and how that movie, like, depending on where you were on the political spectrum or how you viewed things, like, there were some people who viewed the Joaquin Phoenix character as an incel. As like, the worst kind of thing. And then there were other fans who were like, what are you talking about? This movie is like, it's the greatest thing ever. And Todd Phillips, he's the one who directed the film, he had to come out several times and kind of talk about it and how he claimed, like, it's not a political film. And it's like, come on, man, of course it's a political film. Like, you can't. You can't backtrack there.

[Brittney Luce]

To me, that seems like straight up denial.

[Aisha Harris]

It's straight up denial. But so it's like these things can get out of hand, and you have to acknowledge that and acknowledge that people are going to interpret it in different ways. First of all, everything is political in some way. It's just some are more overtly so. So I think we're. Everyone's just bringing something different to these movies. And with social media, people are able to share that more readily than they were 30 years ago.

[B.A. Parker]

I mean, there is, like, this frustrating aspect of it, like the online discourse we've heard, like, the bean soup problem. No, there's a thing on TikTok.

[Brittney Luce]

Please. I've heard about this. Please.

[B.A. Parker]

There was like a TikTok video of a lady was like, here's how I make my bean soup. And someone in the comments was like, but I don't like beans. How do I make this soup? And the creator was like, you just don't make the soup. Like, the soup's not. There's other soups. And that I feel has infiltrated our media absorption. So there's a lot of. Very selfishly, like, how does this pertain to me? Or it's like, this makes me uncomfortable, therefore I don't like it. Or, oh, it has all these guys that I really like in it. So this, like, yeah, this movie's problematic. And I. And, like, it's not very good, but, like, I love it, therefore, it makes it a good movie. And I mean, okay, sure.

[Brittney Luce]

Coming up, how our digital lives may have changed the way we interpret media.

[Aisha Harris]

There are clues, but if you are half watching on your phone, you're gonna miss it. And so is it media literacy in the sense of like people are watching and just not picking up what is being put down? Or is it also just like they are literally not even seeing it half the time?

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[Brittney Luce]

I feel like a crucial aspect of this media illiteracy is moralizing and Alexis, our producer, she brought this up and I'm like, you're so right. There's almost like this entertainment moralizing process where you watch a piece of entertainment and then spend time researching or processing whether the film matches your values or the values of those around you in some cases. And then you decide how you feel about what you watched and whether you think it's good or bad. It kind of becomes less about, like whether you actually think something is well done or entertaining and like, more about whether or not this piece of media makes you seem or feel like a good person or confirms what you already believe about the world.

[Aisha Harris]

Mm.

[B.A. Parker]

Okay, listen. Being a 14 year old girl watching Todd Solin's films for the first time, listen, that'll like, ooh, I feel uncomfort. Well, this is weird. But also, I respect the craft. My moral compass doesn't make the whole movie bad. It's like saying, oh, Hannibal Lecter's cannibal, how dare he? I would never be a cannibal. Therefore, Silence of the Lambs is a terrible movie, which is patently untrue. We can't use our morality to gauge the validity of art.

[Brittney Luce]

I mean, it kind of feels like there's like a newer self awareness for many people around. Whether it's around feeling like a good person or at least having your choices confirmed that like, kind of gets, I feel like audiences further away from actually sitting with art.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Brittney Luce]

Another thing I think about in all this, we're talking about media literacy and entertainment, right? But there's other ways to be media literate that I think we've seen plenty of examples of. I mean, you know, more people than ever are getting their news through social media as opposed to through traditional news outlets. But this makes me wonder, like, if audiences can't accurately read a film or TV show where the writer and director are giving them clues and directing their attention to what they need to be focused on. How might they understand or misunderstand complex news stories with huge real life implications.

[Aisha Harris]

In the same way, right? Like, I think about that story about Katie Couric and the Pit, right? It's like there are clues, but if you are half watching on your phone, you're gonna miss it. And so is it media literacy in the sense of like, people are watching and just not picking up what is being put down? Or is it also just like they are literally not even seeing it half the time? And the Pit is the type of show that you, like, kind of need to give all your attention to, because it's not giving you everything. It's not. It's not Grey's Anatomy. It's not broad. It's not.

[B.A. Parker]

But that's also like very direct of like, Choose Love Me.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, exactly. You do not have these big grand pronouncements of Love or lust or whatever, it's all taking place in a single day.

[Brittney Luce]

So, like, only so much can happen.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah. Even the way it doles out information is a way that, like, I think a lot of modern audiences are perhaps not attuned to or used to getting information, which is usually, like, those big, grand pronouncements. And instead, it's like, it comes out in the way it would if you were actually there on that first day. Like, you wouldn't learn everything about this one doctor in two seconds. Like, that's not how it works.

[Brittney Luce]

Also, I would not want people working in the hospital that I'm being served at, like, giving a speech an hour.

[B.A. Parker]

No, thank you.

[Brittney Luce]

I don't need to speak. I'm like, please pay attention to me. But that's a really good point. People's attention is very split. And I see those things pop up in the way that people consume news. I see that pop up in the way that people are engaging with our rapidly changing political landscape. And also I think that makes me think about algorithms. Like, people's individual worldviews are now also deeply affected by their algorithms. I wonder, like, where does that take us as a society? Like, where does that leave us? Where are we going, y' all?

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, I think. I think we're already in the abyss. It's just like, how long are we gonna wait here and when are we gonna pull ourselves out? I mean, I even just think about sort of this. The same idea of how we all project our different ideas and beliefs onto our pop culture. I think about Luigi Mangione and how there have been such differing reactions to what he is accused of having done. He's currently on trial for the killing of the UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson, and how, depending on your algorithm, you might be fed a bunch of stuff that's very pro Luigi and in support of him or, like, gushing over how hot you think he might be, and you could be on the other end of things. And I think that, like, it's the same side of the same coin.

[Brittney Luce]

Right?

[Aisha Harris]

Same thing allegedly happened, and everyone has a different opinion to it and ascribes a different meaning to it. And I do think that this is. It's not that dissimilar from the way we consume our pop culture, which is that, like, you know, deciding whether or not a character was right or wrong to do what they did. Even something like, the Last of Us, like, all the sort of, like, hand wringing over Joel and played by Pedro Pascal and, like, what he did. There are Two sides to every story. And I'm all for debate, but also, sometimes what's right in front of us is what's right in front of us.

[B.A. Parker]

I like that.

[Aisha Harris]

That's how I feel.

[Brittney Luce]

I'm loving this analysis.

[B.A. Parker]

The best I can compare it to is, you ever watch, like, the traitors? It's like, a group of people who are using their beh to figure out if someone is, like, a traitor.

[Brittney Luce]

Yeah.

[B.A. Parker]

And everyone all of a sudden thinks they're Dr. Phil and, like, even. And they're like. Or they'll be like, oh, he twitched. That means he's lying. Or like. Or like, oh, they went into this hallway. Clearly, they are a traitor. But that's all of us. That is the level of, like, kind of, like, literacy we're on right now. Yes.

[Aisha Harris]

Wait, remember Spitgate? Remember Spitgate?

[B.A. Parker]

Oh, my God. When people were like, oh, Harry Styles.

[Aisha Harris]

Might have spit on Chris Pine.

[Brittney Luce]

And it's like, I just don't think that happened. I saw that, and I was like, I don't think he did that. I don't know.

[B.A. Parker]

Someone made that up on Twitter and people just ran with it. We're at the point where I have to, like, explain to a relative, like, no, this is a. Like, this is AI. Rihanna is not showing her sonogram to her grandmother and posting it on Facebook. Like, that's, like, legit thing that happened to me this weekend. No, I had to be like, that's not real.

[Brittney Luce]

I'm glad I was able to come and commiserate with the two of you, because I have been trying to make sense of this, and you all actually at least gave me some good ways to think about and understand what's going on. So, Parker, Aisha, thank you both so much.

[B.A. Parker]

You're welcome.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you.

[Brittney Luce]

That was Pop Culture Happy Hours Aisha Harris, and Code Switch's BA Parker. And I'm gonna put on my influencer hat for a second and ask you to please subscribe to this show on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you're listening. Click follow so you know the latest in culture while it's still hot. This episode of It's Been a Minute.

[B.A. Parker]

Was produced by Alexis Williams.

[Brittney Luce]

This episode was edited by Nina Pathak. Our supervising producer is Barton Girdwood. Our executive producer is Verilyn Williams. Our VP of programming is Yolanda Sanguini. All right, that's all for this episode of It's Been a Minute. From npr, I'm Brittany Luce. Talk soon.

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